$1200 for electrical box?

[MrFrugal1]

[QUOTE=eednapes;
So correct me if I'm wrong, but that $1400 (which is not included in the final price at the bottom) is just for getting a new panel and not even upgrading to a higher amp?[/QUOTE]

I'd ask for clarification on the service panel quote. This quote states "includes replacement, where necessary, of the conductors from the meter to the panel". That's usually about +/- 3 metres of wire. There is still wire that needs to be run up inside the mast (that pipe thing that runs up the side of you house), from the meter to the where the Hydro connection is. If you live in a two story home, your mast could be quite a long run, and thus the cost of the wire itself higher. The mast itself would probably also need to be changed to accommodate the larger gauge wire.

As an aside, why the hell do they want to run the new supply for the cooktop outside the house in conduit? I HATE that, and in my opinion, shows bad craftsmanship. Bell and Rogers pull that stunt all the time, and it makes the exterior of your house look like crap. The only time I'd ever do that is if there was absolutely no other option. I'd get a second quote on the work for that reason alone.

[CF77]

Quick question but off topic..

If they put new panel in..do they need to follow new codes? that arc fault breakers be used in other areas?

Does this mean cost extra again.

[MrFrugal1]

Quick question but off topic..

If they put new panel in..do they need to follow new codes? that arc fault breakers be used in other areas?

Does this mean cost extra again.

Yes they need to follow Code, and I'd assume that the cost would include the arc fault breakers, simply because many service panels sold come packaged with them.

[eednapes]

Just so I'm clear on my previous post, the replacement panel cost of $1400 is just to change the panel to a new one so it would have more space.

As an aside, why the hell do they want to run the new supply for the cooktop outside the house in conduit? I HATE that, and in my opinion, shows bad craftsmanship. Bell and Rogers pull that stunt all the time, and it makes the exterior of your house look like crap. The only time I'd ever do that is if there was absolutely no other option. I'd get a second quote on the work for that reason alone.

The electrician suggested running the wire from outside since running it from the inside panel is very hard to do and very expensive due to the layout of the house.

SO, on to the second quote:
I had another electrician looking into it too and he said the same. BUT, he also said that the panel has more than one space; it's the matter of adding additional circuit breakers (so no need to change the panel). He also suggested that he can raise the amp going through the wire for the cooktop and stove, so that it could handle the new cooktop and the stove. The price for this was quoted around $1000 which includes installation of new cooktop with the "raising" scenario and also installing the hood that requires some wiring through cabinets, adding new duct and vents and covering the existing downdraft hole in the wall.

So in sum,
Quote 1 ($1670 + tax) = new wiring to the cooktop with a 6/3 cable and a 50 amp breaker (which will be accommodated by eliminating one circuit breaker from the panel and doubling-up one existing circuit) + Hood installation

Quote 2 ($1000 + tax) = *NO* new wires for the cooktop and instead increasing the power (amperage) of the existing wires that runs through the cooktop to the stove + installing a new hood (which will have to be installed by splitting a wire from somewhere else since it can't run through the same wire that connects to the cooktop and stove anymore).

[mcplar]

that's why we asked for pictures of the panel

As for uping the amps on the current line - depends on what gauge (AWG) the current wire is! - kind of worries me that one quote says you need a new run dedicated for the cooktop and the other one doesn't. You need to start asking questions to the electricians coming in to do the quotes and getting answers you understand from them as to why they are doing the job in the way they are...

[MrFrugal1]

that's why we asked for pictures of the panel

As for uping the amps on the current line - depends on what gauge (AWG) the current wire is! - kind of worries me that one quote says you need a new run dedicated for the cooktop and the other one doesn't. You need to start asking questions to the electricians coming in to do the quotes and getting answers you understand from them as to why they are doing the job in the way they are...

Agreed.
This is very difficult to give you an answer/advice on.
No offense, but, it's too bad we can't get the guys giving you the estimates to chime in here, so we have a better understanding of the situation here.

[CF77]

Post pictures of your kitchen, stove and electrical panel..and layout of the kitchen relative to the panel.

[eednapes]

Post pictures of your kitchen, stove and electrical panel..and layout of the kitchen relative to the panel.

Will post them today, along with a picture of the panel.

[nepean19]

The price of $750 is just for changing the box. No inspection etc...

[BuildingHomes]

The price of $750 is just for changing the box. No inspection etc...

So it's done illegally then.. probably not what you want when purchasing a resale home.

[eednapes]

So I took a picture of the inside panel.

Also, I got a third quote. I liked this one because everything was fixed price. Again, great reviews from HomeStars (second guy had 9.7 and around 135 reviews, and this one has 10.0 and around 120 reviews). $360 to bring a wire from the panel to the cooktop, $360 to bring wire for the hood fromt the panel or $240 to bring it from somewhere closer (e.g. from the breaker in the kitchen?). This one doesn't install the vent/duct though.

As for the first guy who said he'll bring a wire from the outside panel (and someone here said that's enough for them to consider someone else), he said he can do it from the inside panel but it'll cost a lot because of obstruction. The second guy said the same thing. I'm not sure which panel the third electrician was talking about (I just spoke over the phone).

[CF77]

how come you have an uncap wire - the white and a black wire open ended dangle? this is dangerous.. you have different breakers, someone must have had played with panel before.

Looks like a mid to late 70 house.

[eednapes]

how come you have an uncap wire - the white and a black wire open ended dangle? this is dangerous.. you have different breakers, someone must have had played with panel before.

Looks like a mid to late 70 house.

I have no idea what you're talking about

[eednapes]

how come you have an uncap wire - the white and a black wire open ended dangle? this is dangerous.. you have different breakers, someone must have had played with panel before.

Looks like a mid to late 70 house.

Oh right, I see them now. I have no idea why they're open ended.

[MrFrugal1]

how come you have an uncap wire - the white and a black wire open ended dangle? this is dangerous.. you have different breakers, someone must have had played with panel before.

Looks like a mid to late 70 house.

Yes, those wires should have wire nuts on them. Any competent electrician opening this panel would/should do this; it takes seconds to do so.

It also appears that you have at least one baseboard heater? Is your water heater electric? Dryer? I think you may be approaching or exceeding the load capacity of your service.

It could be a 70's vintage home (my guess is not- doesn't have the typical kraft paper wrapped sheathing). My guess is it's an older home that has had its knob and tube removed and rewired with NMD90. That would explain the 60 amp service. Irrelevant regardless...

I believe that you have a Federal Pioneer panel, and those are StabLok breakers. I'm not a fan of those, since they tend to be sloppy and floppy in the panel. The older ones also have a history of failure (not tripping when overloaded).
I assume this panel is in the basement, and most basements are humid in the summer. I've seen breakers that have been in humid basements that have had the breaker mechanisms rusted so badly, you couldn't flip it on or off.

So, I know you are eager to get your new induction stove and exhaust fan installed; I would be as well. (I hope you have the appropriate pots to cook with ) You need to decide if want to upgrade your service panel, or just do what is needed to get everything installed. If I were you, I just bite the bullet and have the whole panel and service replaced. Your resale value will be better down the road.
Even if you aren't planning to sell in the near future, increasing the capacity would allow things like central air, a hot tub, etc. to be added. Again, this may not be something that you are interested in, but you may also not have been interested in a induction stove initially either. I know it's a big expense, but reshingling your roof, for example, is not cheap either. But if you don't do it, you'll have issues down the road. Think of your new electrical panel as necessary upkeep/upgrade. Changing it to a 200 amp service and panel will allow you to add future loads and circuits. Just bite the bullet and do it.

I'm still not thrilled about the external conduit routing, but I don't know what the situation is. This may indeed be the most 'efficient' solution. Not pretty, but efficient.