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[2024 CODE UPDATE] Ask me anything about home electrical requirements, electrical code, wiring, devices

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Jr. Member
Sep 21, 2004
125 posts
79 upvotes
North Vancouver, BC
momtothree wrote: looking at a house where the home owner finished the basement...no permits. I called ESA and they said the best they could do now was send an inspector in now and issue a general inspection for the whole house. My question is the inspection enough to be assured the electrical is safe? On the phone the ESA told me they would pull some outlets out, look at the panel etc. but not knowing anything about electrical i'm not sure that's enough.
That's enough - well - the best you will be able to do without ripping all the walls down. Opening up some boxes, taking a look at the panel etc will tell a LOT about the person that put the trade in in the first place. GENRALLY if someone cares about their work, it will show all the way through, likewise if they don't care - it will also carry all the way through. If they care about their work - there is a higher chance (but not always) that they are following code.
Looking at the panel will identify some of the major concerns (Are cables sized for breakers, are there loose connections, how tidy is it?). The stuff behind the walls - even upon inspection doing it the proper way - may be missing some stuff. Inspections (rough in before drywall) does not mean they look at everything (they never do) they look at the quality of the installation (again it is quite obvious when looking at it). If someone thinks they need to cut a corner somewhere, they can always hide it.

This inspection would be the best peace of mind you would be able to afford at this stage - again withouth ripping down all the walls.
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Oct 19, 2008
7407 posts
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Whitby
momtothree wrote: looking at a house
Since you don't own the home your options are limited-you could put the seller is required to have a general inspection by ESA as a clause in your offer?
Doubt the seller will go for that, making your offer contingent upon inspection and having an electrician in with the home inspector might be your best option.
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Mar 3, 2013
516 posts
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East Gwillimbury
Slavd123 wrote: I have replaced existing pot-light fixtures with new pot-light fixtures.

The old ones had:
Romex cable -> junction box screwed to ceiling -> romex wires screwed with wire caps to "wire leads" -> "wire leads" fed through a metallic flexible conduit into fixture -> MR11 connector in the fixture coming in through the metallic conduit.
Pretty much like this picture:
http://www.repair-home.com/imagesvr_ce/1202/e16_a3.gif

I bought new fixtures, which hold PAR20 bulbs. I connected it like:
Romex cable -> junction box attached to the new fixture -> romex wires screwed with wire caps to "wire leads" -> the PAR20 socket in the fixture is already pre-wired.
The new fixture looks like this:
http://recessedlighting.com/wp-content/ ... 0x3001.jpg

Question 1: the light junction box on the new fixture is not attached to joists or ceiling. Is that OK? The fixture sits pretty snug in the whole, and has those outward expanding brackets when screw is turned.

Question 2: I did not remove the old junction box or the metallic flexible conduit, it won't fit through the hole. However other than non-connected leads inside of it, there is no live wire through it anymore. Is that OK?
This is fine. I do it all the time and the existing housing plate and box can stay. I do this instead of replacing bad transformers from mr16 potlights
A Licensed Electrical Contractor
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Feb 8, 2014
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As i understand it 6 gauge wire is required to ground the breaker box, does this have to be solid wire or can it be braided wire?
In fact in Rand McNally they wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people
Newbie
Sep 20, 2016
6 posts
1 upvote
Hello.
This may be a naive question but I am liking the experience expressed on this thread.

I'm getting ready to have a new boiler installed and am getting conflicting information about products. It's down to a Veissman vs an IBC, and I wonder about the reputation of both.

The guy talking up the IBC is pushing it hard, saying it's far superior, but his pushiness is getting on my nerves. He's otherwise from a big reputable HVAC company. He claims their installation processes are second to none.

The other guy, much more even keeled, is simply quoting me on the Veissman (he also sells Lennox) which he sees as a superior product. He's a small business--plumber and gas fitter--and comes across as cheaper.

But the guy from the bigger company claims they do a higher quality install (and has begun to criticize the plumber's work as seen on the plumber's website.

The price difference in installations is about $3000 ($7K vs $10K) so significant.

Any information you could give me on either of these is really helpful and any insider insight into the competitive nature of boiler sales would be a bonus.
Deal Addict
Sep 11, 2006
1382 posts
360 upvotes
Toronto
Quentin5 wrote: As i understand it 6 gauge wire is required to ground the breaker box, does this have to be solid wire or can it be braided wire?
pretty sure its stranded unless stated otherwise
Deal Addict
Sep 11, 2006
1382 posts
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Toronto
DrDJJM wrote: Hello.
This may be a naive question but I am liking the experience expressed on this thread.

I'm getting ready to have a new boiler installed and am getting conflicting information about products. It's down to a Veissman vs an IBC, and I wonder about the reputation of both.

The guy talking up the IBC is pushing it hard, saying it's far superior, but his pushiness is getting on my nerves. He's otherwise from a big reputable HVAC company. He claims their installation processes are second to none.

The other guy, much more even keeled, is simply quoting me on the Veissman (he also sells Lennox) which he sees as a superior product. He's a small business--plumber and gas fitter--and comes across as cheaper.

But the guy from the bigger company claims they do a higher quality install (and has begun to criticize the plumber's work as seen on the plumber's website.

The price difference in installations is about $3000 ($7K vs $10K) so significant.

Any information you could give me on either of these is really helpful and any insider insight into the competitive nature of boiler sales would be a bonus.
You may want to ask about boilers in this thread instead
ask-me-anything-about-boilers-chillers- ... ms-817769/
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Feb 8, 2014
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DIrty-D wrote:
Quentin5 wrote: As i understand it 6 gauge wire is required to ground the breaker box, does this have to be solid wire or can it be braided wire?
pretty sure its stranded unless stated otherwise
so this is fine then even though it states 55A?
https://www.lowes.ca/building-wire-elec ... 82975.html
In fact in Rand McNally they wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people
Newbie
Sep 20, 2016
6 posts
1 upvote
Yes, sorry. I noticed the mistake right after I posted it but couldn't cancel it.
Deal Addict
Sep 11, 2006
1382 posts
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Toronto
Quentin5 wrote:
DIrty-D wrote:
Quentin5 wrote: As i understand it 6 gauge wire is required to ground the breaker box, does this have to be solid wire or can it be braided wire?
pretty sure its stranded unless stated otherwise
so this is fine then even though it states 55A?
https://www.lowes.ca/building-wire-elec ... 82975.html
Yes but you can buy bare 6awg copper for less
Deal Addict
Sep 11, 2006
1382 posts
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Toronto
pretty sure HD and Lowes sell by the foot
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Feb 8, 2014
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DIrty-D wrote: pretty sure HD and Lowes sell by the foot
cool, i will check
In fact in Rand McNally they wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people
Member
Oct 11, 2007
347 posts
52 upvotes
Does anyone know if the Electrical Code in ontario requires lights (roughins) to be installed in the garage. I know it requires outlets for garage door openers, but doesn't say anything about lights.
Member
Jul 4, 2012
211 posts
49 upvotes
CAMBRIDGE
condor11 wrote: Does anyone know if the Electrical Code in ontario requires lights (roughins) to be installed in the garage. I know it requires outlets for garage door openers, but doesn't say anything about lights.
Rule 30-510
(1) A luminaire shall be provided for an attached, built-in, or detached garage or carport.
(2) Except as provided in subrule (3), luminaires required in subrule (1) shall be controlled by a wall switch near the doorway

(3) goes on to say that if the luminaire required in 1 is ceiling mounted in an area not meant for a car or is wall mounted you can use a fixture with a built in switch.
Sr. Member
Jul 15, 2003
910 posts
554 upvotes
GTA, Ontario
retrovette wrote: There are lots of web sites where you can learn basic electrical theory and for do it yourself home stuff there is a pretty good book called "Electrical Code Simplified" that you can get from most hardware and lumber stores. The actual code book can be quite daunting and covers so much whereas the simplified book just takes information related to normal home wiring and explains it.
I assume your timer switch is an electronic countdown timer for your fan. I've got one and it's great to run the fan for a while after a shower without having to remember to go back and shut it off. The switch should have come with a wiring diagram. Hot or Line would be the wire feeding the existing switch. Load would be the black wire going out to the fan and neutral will of course be added to the bundle of three you already have in the box. There will probably be a green wire that you just connect to a grounding screw at the back of the box.
If it's a mechanical timer the white neutral is not needed but as you have a neutral available in the box I wouldn't bother with a mechanical timer.
I would just like to say thanks for all the help. I finally got the courage to do it and while the green neutral wire was a bit hard to get into the screw of the box, I finally did it! Thanks a lot for your help and everyone else, much appreciated.
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Apr 29, 2008
8012 posts
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Montreal
Thank you everyone for their help to others here.

I have a 150 amp federal pacific electric (fpe) panel, with 40 circuits. I use electric heating, from Quebec.

All spaces are taken and on some of them, there are junctions made by previous owner.

I am looking to upgrade to 200 amp to have enough space for a pool heater, whole surge protection, 2nd mural A/C, and future upgrades.

My meter supports 200 amp, but electrician would need to change cable between meter and a new panel.

I read existing threads about upgrading to 200A, dis not find all info I would want.

Questions:
1) preference between Square D Vs Siemens panel?

2) the opening for cable from outside is 1 1/2 inch, enough for 200 amp cable? Electrician said it could be tight.

3) what is the biggest residential panel in terms of circuits? I want to be future proof (electric car, tower warmer, central vaccum? Who knows?)

I was suggested 60 circuits, does not seem enough.
Not much space for a future subpanel.

4) anything specific I should want for futureproof/high quality job?

Thank you.
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Feb 8, 2014
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I remember hearing about some type of retrofit electrical box for plaster/lath (light switch and ceiling fixture) , am i remembering correctly and can anyone post some links?
In fact in Rand McNally they wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people
Member
Oct 10, 2006
464 posts
323 upvotes
Toronto
Not sure if this really falls under Electrical code or Building Code. But I haven't been able to get a straight answer from the City on whether you need a vapour barrier boot on the airtight plastic electrical boxes if its being installed on an exterior wall w/ batt insulation? I know for your typical metal boxes you need the VP barrier boot, but what about airtight boxes?
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kevkwan wrote: Not sure if this really falls under Electrical code or Building Code. But I haven't been able to get a straight answer from the City on whether you need a vapour barrier boot on the airtight plastic electrical boxes if its being installed on an exterior wall w/ batt insulation? I know for your typical metal boxes you need the VP barrier boot, but what about airtight boxes?
I don't know for sure but the answer should be that you do not, because airtight and plastic construction suggest low vapour and low air leakage permeance. Now does the building code recognize this, i cannot say.
In fact in Rand McNally they wear hats on their feet and hamburgers eat people

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