Ongoing Deal Discussion

[Epson.ca] 3LCD projectors 40%+ off clearance (refurb) sales.

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toyopl wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2018 10:50 am
Thinking of grabbing 3700 or 3100 for 110'' AT screen with seating distance of 10ft.
If I'll be playing mostly 1080 content, then there's no need to look into 4K projector, right ?
You are talking $1200 refurbished 3700 ? the next 4K 3LCD option is 5040UB (refurbished, 1080x2 eshifter) for $2500, or DLP eshifters are around $2250 for BNIB as well, so is that a 2x the price worthy upgrade given you are will mostly viewing 1080p content ? IMO no, that $1k savings should be able to get you a BNIB 4K unit a year or two down the road and a quality 1080p unit will be more than enough for now.

With that said, I would recommend considering an extra $300 and getting the 5030 currently on sale @ $1500 instead, at 10x the CR it will make a difference especially in a dedicated HT room (it's also equipped with bigger lens shit so will make placement less of a challenge).
Good luck,
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aasoror wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2018 11:51 am
You are talking $1200 refurbished 3700 ? the next 4K 3LCD option is 5040UB (refurbished, 1080x2 eshifter) for $2500, or DLP eshifters are around $2250 for BNIB as well, so is that a 2x the price worthy upgrade given you are will mostly viewing 1080p content ? IMO no, that $1k savings should be able to get you a BNIB 4K unit a year or two down the road and a quality 1080p unit will be more than enough for now.

With that said, I would recommend considering an extra $300 and getting the 5030 currently on sale @ $1500 instead, at 10x the CR it will make a difference especially in a dedicated HT room (it's also equipped with bigger lens shit so will make placement less of a challenge).
Good luck,
Thanks, don't have much room to work with, basement theater room, and probably will watch a lot with lights on or windows open when kids play.
Will look into 5030 but 3700 caught my eye with nice lumen output for brighter room watching.
Here's a quick mock up of my area for theater room.

Image
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4k I think is like 3D, a fad.
For one you'll need 4k AND high bitrate content AND seating close enough (or with a large enough screen) to see the difference.

I'll take that money and upgrade the sound system instead :) Dolby Atmos and/or install some bass shakers!
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Daijoubu wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2018 4:01 pm
4k I think is like 3D, a fad.
IMO 3D is anything but a fad (its just that people have different perception of depth, as for content, granted for every good title there is a dozen post processed for quick cash grab ones but 3D home viewing isn't going anywhere in the near future, esp for projectors), neither is 4K (again people have different perception of image quality but for 10' viewing distance, which is typical for living room set up, you can see 4K difference for sizes as small as 80", for a regular throw projector at that 10' throw you will get roughly > 100' screen).

My point was, for someone who will be doing mostly 1080p for now there is not point in investing in a 4K projector at the moment.
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Oct 5, 2009
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I have an old Epson 6100 that is about 7 yrs old and still going strong in a dedicated HT.

My friend recently picked up at 5040 in the fall for his room and the biggest leap in PQ to me, was the HDR. After dialing in the PJ and source, to me that had a much bigger impact than the '4k' of it.
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1080p has the highest presence if 4k becomes drastically affordable as 1080p did and content is developed in great multitude maybe.
Streaming 4k content brings other things into question.
Last edited by Midknight Storm on Jan 25th, 2018 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Shiftup wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 11:42 am
I have an old Epson 6100 that is about 7 yrs old and still going strong in a dedicated HT.

My friend recently picked up at 5040 in the fall for his room and the biggest leap in PQ to me, was the HDR. After dialing in the PJ and source, to me that had a much bigger impact than the '4k' of it.
Well the 5040 is not a native 4K proj (even after e-shifting you are seeing roughly half the native resolution of 4K, thus the proj being called "FHD with 4K enhancement"), so yes the oomph you are seeing in picture quality is mostly HDR.
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Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 2:27 pm
1080p has the highest present if 4k becomes drastically affordable as 1080p did and content is developed in great multitude maybe.
Streaming 4k content brings other things into question.
Currently, in NA, 3 4K options are below the 2K USD mark, 2 of them are around 1.5K USD, and this will only go lower as more contenders push into that segment (affordable UHD 3840x2160 e-shifters with "supposedly" HDR10 support).
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aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 4:04 pm
Currently, in NA, 3 4K options are below the 2K USD mark, 2 of them are around 1.5K USD, and this will only go lower as more contenders push into that segment (affordable UHD 3840x2160 e-shifters with "supposedly" HDR10 support).

Does that hold with the current formats? I'd say not really.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_CD

4K and 3D are in the "nice to have" area.
I prefer native over upscaling and hdr.
It can wait, no rush if its here to stay unlike VCD.
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Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 5:25 pm
Does that hold with the current formats?
Not sure what you mean by "that", I didn't get the reference about HD-DVD and Video-CD though but I think these are apples to oranges in a 4K display discussion (HDDVD lost the format war but its not like it took HD video "standard" used in TVs and projectors down with it).
I prefer native over upscaling and hdr.
You can get plenty of native 4K contents no upscaling involved, and HDR is as native as it can get, its just prior displays were not capable of displaying the content at its full glory.
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aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
I didn't get the reference about HD-DVD and Video-CD though but ...
Then why force a response from confusion?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
You can get plenty of native 4K [content] no upscaling involved, and HDR is as native as it can get, its just prior displays were not capable of displaying the content at its full glory.
Native 4k projectors are out there just not within the same breath of the proposition you stated earlier of the three 4k(enhancement) projectors being $2500 CAD or less.
HDR and 4k are not one in the same. https://www.cnet.com/how-to/do-you-need ... v-for-hdr/
https://www.technobuffalo.com/2017/02/0 ... 1080p-tvs/
Current formats... current video formats i.e. 720p and 1080p
Can't redefine or explain "this" or "that" for you. Hard to know what a sole pronoun is referring to without the sentence that may include the noun of interest.

As for plenty of 4k content for you yes, for I no.
I am not you nor you I.

Get back to me when they have a 4k native projector for around the prices of 1080p as of now.
But I dont expect that to happen until 8K becomes a thing.
https://www.eteknix.com/8k-tv-prices-dr ... t-now-55k/
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Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 26th, 2018 11:58 am
Native 4k projectors are out there just not within the same breath of the proposition you stated earlier of the three 4k(enhancement) projectors being $2500 CAD or less.
The three 4K e-shifters are not 4K (enhancements), shifting 1920x1080 panels is certainly not the sames as shifting 2716x1528 ones (and you might want to check reviews about all 3, 1080p eshifters, UHD eshifters and Native 4K proj, being compared side by side).
Thanks for the links, though I am not sure I suggested they are one in the same.
You mentioned you will take native over upscaling and HDR, as if there is no native HDR content out there, thus my comment.
Current formats... current video formats i.e. 720p and 1080p
So 4K isn't a current video format ?

Can't redefine or explain "this" or "that" for you. Hard to know what a sole pronoun is referring to without the sentence that may include the noun of interest.
Well the sentence was yours and I "fully" quoted right above my question about the pronoun, not sure whats the issue but here you are again:
Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 5:25 pm
Does that hold with the current formats?
what does "that" refer to ? and how does the reference to HD-DVD and VCD (deprecated content publishing formats) relate to 4K discussion (unless you were hinting 4K is going to be similarly obliterated) ?!
As for plenty of 4k content for you yes, for I no.
I am not you nor you I.
Understood, but its not about whether there is content for you or me, its whether there is (plenty of) content or not, and "fact" is there is, now whether that content accessible or of interest to you is another thing.
Get back to me when they have a 4k native projector for around the prices of 1080p as of now.
No need, I am not promoting 4K proj on this thread, you seem to have largely missed my point.

Is there plenty of 4K content right now ? yes, and catalog will only get bigger (esp with online streaming services).

Can people enjoy 4K content on affordable projectors that display 4K content with a significant visual upgrade compared to 1080p version of the same content ? Yes, UHD eshifter for $1500 USD (which is less than the price of many 1080p projectors currently available in retail).

Is 4K a short lived craze ? certainly not, catalog can only get bigger and 4K projectors can only get cheaper (Texas Instruments just started with 2 "affordable" UHD chips that are already being adopted by manufacturers like Optoma, BenQ and Dell, these are all DLP based solutions so it won't be long before 3LCD takes a shot at this market segment with more affordable and higher resolution options than the 5040).

Again what I was saying was that for someone "currently" mostly watching 1080p content its not really a good investment to get a 4K projector now (for mere future proofing), simply because 2018 will be the year 4K is pushed everywhere (come Q3 or Q4 there will be more options at even more affordable prices).
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aasoror wrote:
Jan 26th, 2018 6:06 pm
Thanks for the links, though I am not sure I suggested they are one in the same.

Yw, K.
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
You can get plenty of native 4K contents no upscaling involved, and HDR is as native as it can get.
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
You mentioned you will take native over upscaling and HDR, as if there is no native HDR content out there, thus my comment.
4K Native HDR content was in question apart from 4K native content? Are you making statements on my behalf now?
Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 26th, 2018 11:58 am
As for plenty of 4k content for you yes, for I no.
I am not you nor you I.
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
not sure whats the issue but here you are again.
Happens when quoted. Didn't disable the notification bell for quotes. What would your preference be other than a polite response?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
Understood, but its not about whether there is content for you or me
Isn't content the deciding and varying factor for all? Do people not have discriminating tastes?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
the sentence was yours and I "fully" quoted right above my question
Did I not?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 4:04 pm
Currently, in NA, 3 4K options are below the 2K USD mark, 2 of them are around 1.5K USD, and this will only go lower as more contenders push into that segment (affordable UHD 3840x2160 e-shifters with "supposedly" HDR10 support).
Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 5:25 pm
Does that statement hold with the current formats? I'd say not really.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comme ... to_become/
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
So 4K isn't a current video format ?
?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
how does the reference to HD-DVD and VCD relate to 4K discussion
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictio ... they-hatch
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
No need, I am not promoting 4K proj on this thread, you seem to have largely missed my point.
That's one possibility.

The statement you replied to:
Midknight Storm wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 2:27 pm
1080p has the highest presence.
If 4k becomes drastically affordable as 1080p [is now] and content is developed in great multitude maybe it will be more than a niche market.
Streaming 4k content brings other [metrics] into question.
Your original reply to my statement:
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 4:04 pm
Currently, in NA, 3 4K options are below the 2K USD mark, 2 of them are around 1.5K USD, and this will only go lower as more contenders push into that segment (affordable UHD 3840x2160 e-shifters with "supposedly" HDR10 support).

https://www.projectorreviews.com/articl ... nder-2000/
"For clarity, we don’t consider any of these to be true 4K." -- Art Feierman.

I should believe this is your point?
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
For someone "currently" watching 1080p content it's not a good investment to get a 4K projector just for future proofing.
"I speculate" simply 2018 will be the year 4K is pushed everywhere (come Q3 or Q4 there will be more options at even more affordable prices).
aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
Is there plenty of 4K content right now ? yes, and catalog will only get bigger (esp with online streaming services).
Can people enjoy 4K content on affordable projectors that display 4K content with a significant visual upgrade compared to 1080p version of the same content ? Yes, UHD eshifter for $1500 USD (which is less than the price of many 1080p projectors currently available in retail).

aasoror wrote:
Jan 25th, 2018 6:23 pm
Again what I was saying was that for someone "currently" mostly watching 1080p content its not really a good investment to get a 4K projector now (for mere future proofing), simply because 2018 will be the year 4K is pushed everywhere (come Q3 or Q4 there will be more options at even more affordable prices).
Have a nice day.

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