Computers & Electronics

Is 4K on a 75" TV a Must or is 1080p okay?

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  • Jul 18th, 2017 9:16 am
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Quick question that is related to this. If you don't have any content that is 4K then will the picture look better after it is upscaled (I think this is the correct term) by the TV? That is, for non-4K content will the picture look better on a 4K TV than on a 1080P TV? Thanks.
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ds2chan wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 10:43 am
Quick question that is related to this. If you don't have any content that is 4K then will the picture look better after it is upscaled (I think this is the correct term) by the TV? That is, for non-4K content will the picture look better on a 4K TV than on a 1080P TV? Thanks.
Depends on the TV. Some TVs do a lousy job of upscaling. For example, for 480p material, the Vizio 4K TV get terrible reviews for upscaling.

Mind you, 480p almost never looks great on 75" TVs.
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EugW wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 10:52 am
Depends on the TV. Some TVs do a lousy job of upscaling. For example, for 480p material, the Vizio 4K TV get terrible reviews for upscaling.

Mind you, 480p almost never looks great on 75" TVs.
Thanks. I was thinking of a 55" or 60" Samsung or Sharp (if they still make TVs) when I finally need to replace mine. I'll look into a 4K TV then when the time comes.
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ds2chan wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 10:43 am
Quick question that is related to this. If you don't have any content that is 4K then will the picture look better after it is upscaled (I think this is the correct term) by the TV? That is, for non-4K content will the picture look better on a 4K TV than on a 1080P TV? Thanks.
No, it can't make the low res picture look better by upscaling. At best it will look the same, but often it will get worse depending on the TV model.
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engineered wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 2:20 pm
No, it can't make the low res picture look better by upscaling. At best it will look the same, but often it will get worse depending on the TV model.
I was thinking when comparing the upscaling on a 4K TV vs the upscaling on a 1080P TV. If both are comparable then maybe a 1080P is fine for me. I was just trying to figure out why everybody in this thread is telling the OP to get a 4K TV if he may not have much 4K content.

I'm not very familiar with TV technology these days.
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engineered wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 2:20 pm
No, it can't make the low res picture look better by upscaling. At best it will look the same, but often it will get worse depending on the TV model.
That is not correct. A good upscaling engine can make a lower rez image look better.

Unfortunately, lower end 4K TVs typically don't have good upscalers.
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EugW wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 3:07 pm
That is not correct. A good upscaling engine can make a lower rez image look better.

Unfortunately, lower end 4K TVs typically don't have good upscalers.
How exactly can it look better? It can't add pixel information that isn't there. For the same size TV, it can interpolate and make it look smoother instead of pixelated, but it's really just blurrier. So you're just trading off one negative for another.
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engineered wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 3:19 pm
How exactly can it look better? It can't add pixel information that isn't there. For the same size TV, it can interpolate and make it look smoother instead of pixelated, but it's really just blurrier. So you're just trading off one negative for another.
It still looks better. If you just blow up 480p without any scaling/interpolation it will look horrible, a jaggy mess.

Back in the old days with Blu-ray players, one of the prime features people looked for was upscaling quality, because it really did improve the quality of 480p material on 1080p displays.

On a smaller TV, if often doesn't matter too much, but it can make a big difference on a projector or a large TV.

---

BTW, I'd rather have a good 1080p TV than a crappy 4K TV. The problem here though is that these days, most large 1080p TVs are lowish end. So the comparison becomes low to mid-end 1080p vs low end 4K.
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EugW wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 3:35 pm
It still looks better. If you just blow up 480p without any scaling/interpolation it will look horrible, a jaggy mess.

Back in the old days with Blu-ray players, one of the prime features people looked for was upscaling quality, because it really did improve the quality of 480p material on 1080p displays.

On a smaller TV, if often doesn't matter too much, but it can make a big difference on a projector or a large TV.

---

BTW, I'd rather have a good 1080p TV than a crappy 4K TV. The problem here though is that these days, most large 1080p TVs are lowish end. So the comparison becomes low to mid-end 1080p vs low end 4K.
Ah, yes, but that's comparing the upscaler in the TV to the BRAY. Playing the 480p content on a good 480p TV would likely look the best.

I agree with you on the quality 1080P. I'd much rather have a good 1080P HDR TV (if they existed) than a 4K TV at the same price. Sadly the marketing push for 4K is too high.
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engineered wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 3:53 pm
Ah, yes, but that's comparing the upscaler in the TV to the BRAY. Playing the 480p content on a good 480p TV would likely look the best.

I agree with you on the quality 1080P. I'd much rather have a good 1080P HDR TV (if they existed) than a 4K TV at the same price. Sadly the marketing push for 4K is too high.
I don't understand the big deal. 4k televisions have pretty much reached price parity with 1080p sets. 4k is a no brainer in the current market. Only HDR is expensive, however you can often get a nice HDR enabled TV on sale for a great price.
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engineered wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 3:19 pm
How exactly can it look better? It can't add pixel information that isn't there. For the same size TV, it can interpolate and make it look smoother instead of pixelated, but it's really just blurrier. So you're just trading off one negative for another.
No this is all wrong.

Information is added by interpolation. Most interpolation is not linear. for example a lanczos windowing function sharpens the image. Further there is hidden information within the pixels. There are entire fractal engines dedicated to looking for specialized hidden information. I don't know if they use them for video but it's used for other imaging technologies.
More information is extracted by the motion smoothing engines. These add extra frames not in the original content, and they serve to enhance the replay as well.

You are confusing scaling with magnification with a lack of understanding of how upscaling works. 480p recorded video will just look mediocre when displayed at 75", regardless of the scaling engine. However an 480i 8-bit video game looks great scaled up to 4k. It retains edge contrast so the image stays nice and sharp and the mid-line interpolation always turns out near perfect.

All content looks better upscaled. In terms of just the pixel count, a 4k 75" will display better than a 1080 75". The question is weather you sit close enough to see it.
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i have a 64" 1080p roughly same viewing distance purchased few years ago
I'm the most OCD pixel-peeper and but its resolution doesn't bother me

but if I'm going to be spending good money in 2017 on a 75" which at that size probably wont be replaced any time soon, I think buying 1080p will offer lots of buyer's remorse.

may be don't put too much weight into those who said they've seen it in-stores...they were probably standing 5 ft away and the floor demo have ridiculous settings on them.
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