Petition to Increase Canadian Duty Free Allowances

[spass]

http://www.crossbordershopping.ca/petition-increase-canadian-duty-free-allowance

No need to explain what this is about. Sign up, spread the word to as many folks as you
can. Help the Canadian consumer gain more freedom. No allowance for day trips is
pathetic. Let's fight this!

[FunSave22]

http://www.crossbordershopping.ca/petition-increase-canadian-duty-free-allowance

No need to explain what this is about. Sign up, spread the word to as many folks as you
can. Help the Canadian consumer gain more freedom. No allowance for day trips is
pathetic. Let's fight this!
Have you written a polite letter (real, not email) to your MP, the Prime Minister, the Cabinet Minister(s) in charge of this area and the leader of the opposition?

Have you called your MP and asked for a meeting so you can discuss this issue with them?


If not, you haven't done much to fight this. Online petitions are incredibly close to useless.

[myapple]

Online petitions are incredibly close to useless.

An Uproar on the Web Over $2 Fee by Verizon
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/30/business/media/an-uproar-on-the-web-over-2-fee-by-verizon.html

Verizon ditches $2 fee after customer uproar
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/30/us-verizon-fcc-idUSTRE7BT13I20111230

[FunSave22]

An Uproar on the Web Over $2 Fee by Verizon
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/30/business/media/an-uproar-on-the-web-over-2-fee-by-verizon.html

Verizon ditches $2 fee after customer uproar
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/30/us-verizon-fcc-idUSTRE7BT13I20111230
And what do you think mattered more:


People who are verifiable customers of Verizon calling into Verizon customer service complaining about the fee.
An online petition which Verizon knows was signed by many people more than once. And which many of the people who signed aren't likely even customers of Verizon.



Verizon knows that people who made the effort to call in are much more likely to take action if the fee is implemented.

Verizon also knows that people who perform the minimum amount of effort possible (sign an online petition) are much more likely to do nothing (the minimum amount of effort possible) if the fee is implemented than the people who had made an effort.

[apn64]

Requesting a $200 allowance for day trips is pretty lame, since I've found that the border patrol will rarely pull an individual over if the tax haul is <$20, which amounts to an unofficial exemption ~$150 for ON residents. More passengers in the car often pushes this higher, especially if they all have individual receipts ;)

The US recently proposed a $1,000 exemption for all day trips (both ways) as a means to reduce congestion. I thought that was a fantastic idea and it would cause greedy SOB Cdn retailers to adjust their prices inline with a parity dollar faster than you can blink.

Of course Harpo and gang rejected the proposal on the basis of reduced tax revenues. In which case, $200 is i) comparable with current US limits, ii) better than nothing and iii) a start in the right direction...

[Mark77]

I find that going through the airports allows for far more of an unnofficial exemption than the land crossings.

Also, I think it is patently unfair that the governments charge customs and immigration inspection fees for air travellers, while charging nothing for those who enter Canada on land.

[TrevorK]

I don't think I'm in the minority; I think that it would only harm Canadian business to increase the duty free allowances. It seems like a short-sighted solution that only benefits a small group of people while harming Canadian businesses (which employ Canadians).

[Vasyl]

I don't think I'm in the minority; I think that it would only harm Canadian business to increase the duty free allowances. It seems like a short-sighted solution that only benefits a small group of people while harming Canadian businesses (which employ Canadians).

If this group is small, as you claim, how the small group could harm greedy and inefficient Canadian business? Canadian border is now stinks more than former Soviet border where you were not a citizen coming home but a terrorist hiding an extra bottle of buzz. No, extra allowance of $10,000 for a week of absence would start Canadian business working and stop gauging Canadian customers.

[zoro69]

I don't think I'm in the minority; I think that it would only harm Canadian business to increase the duty free allowances. It seems like a short-sighted solution that only benefits a small group of people while harming Canadian businesses (which employ Canadians).

exactly, it doesnt make any sense. I suspect most asking for this really want tax free allowance, not duty which is rarely an issue. how are Can located, Can employing, can taxpaying business supposed to compete with a competitor who doesn't have to collect sales tax or pay the import duty they already did. And why would we want to advantage american retailers over our own?

"The US recently proposed a $1,000 exemption for all day trips (both ways) as a means to reduce congestion."

The us doesnt have a national sales tax to collect...so it meant next to nothing

[TrevorK]

If this group is small, as you claim, how the small group could harm greedy and inefficient Canadian business? Canadian border is now stinks more than former Soviet border where you were not a citizen coming home but a terrorist hiding an extra bottle of buzz. No, extra allowance of $10,000 for a week of absence would start Canadian business working and stop gauging Canadian customers.

Because if you open it up to a small group you risk a larger group of people doing the same thing. In addition you risk people importing goods, tax fee, for business purposes (selling them in a convenience store, etc).

I have never been through a land border crossing, however when flying I have never been treated with anything but respect by the border guards and never once have been questioned / harassed about what I bring back.

[Vasyl]

Because if you open it up to a small group you risk a larger group of people doing the same thing. In addition you risk people importing goods, tax fee, for business purposes (selling them in a convenience store, etc).

I have never been through a land border crossing, however when flying I have never been treated with anything but respect by the border guards and never once have been questioned / harassed about what I bring back.

Millions are already doing it, albeit quietly. Your personal experience has no relevance. It is WORSE than the Soviet border. However, as we all know, artificial walls do not work, no Great Chinese Wall, no Berlin Wall could not stop what is right. The question is only to move law abiding citizens from grey area to the normal regulated environment in order to prevent importing goods tax free for business purposes.

[Vasyl]

And why would we want to advantage american retailers over our own?


Very simple, one wants to advantage any retailer, whether American or Martian, if this retailer is not gauging you like the vast majority of Canadian greedy retailers, and who works hard for its customers. I recently spoke with a B&H Photo manager, 35% of their customers base are Canadians and it is growing exponentially.

[myversa]

I rather keep the way it is now, $50 for 24 hours and not strictly enforced.

Or you rather want an increased allowance but strictly enforced?

[No Frills]

That petition sucks I want a better booze allowance in both quantity and less time visiting....lol

[Vasyl]

I rather keep the way it is now, $50 for 24 hours and not strictly enforced.

Or you rather want an increased allowance but strictly enforced?


It is enforced in this way not because of accommodating Border Services, but because of lack of resources. It could end any time. Yes, I want significantly increased allowances similar to the EU and Russia’s limits and enforce them as strict as the Government likes.

[ccyk]

i'd rather they make a law so canadian retailers have to match US price of same item

[TrevorK]

Millions are already doing it, albeit quietly. Your personal experience has no relevance. It is WORSE than the Soviet border. However, as we all know, artificial walls do not work, no Great Chinese Wall, no Berlin Wall could not stop what is right. The question is only to move law abiding citizens from grey area to the normal regulated environment in order to prevent importing goods tax free for business purposes.

Comparing the Canadian border to the old Soviet border is ridiculous, and gives more reason to not give credit to anything to say. Leading your opinion to being irrelevant.

[TrevorK]

i'd rather they make a law so canadian retailers have to match US price of same item

While I'd love to pay less for everything I buy, I'd have to think this is a bad idea. Canadians have many different costs that their US counterparts do not, such as an increased minimum wage for all people (as in people working with tips and those not), increased shipping cost, etc. This, and many more reasons, makes it impossible to expect everything to cost the same.

[spf1971]

i'd rather they make a law so canadian retailers have to match US price of same item

Then you would have to make the Canadian and American tax, economy, benefits etc all the same.

[No Frills]

While I'd love to pay less for everything I buy, I'd have to think this is a bad idea. Canadians have many different costs that their US counterparts do not, such as an increased minimum wage for all people (as in people working with tips and those not), increased shipping cost, etc. This, and many more reasons, makes it impossible to expect everything to cost the same.

You are correct, but the consensus here in the shopping discussion forum will always be how Canadian retailers are gauging like they have high margins in retail. Thus members will only shop south of the boarder until Canadian retailers 'smarten up'. :confused:

[shwab]

It would decimate border economies, not only would they have to match US prices but take off another 7% to match taxes (against MI for example). Think about the revenue lost for the government as well, where is that going to be made up?

[Conquistador]

Millions are already doing it, albeit quietly. Your personal experience has no relevance. It is WORSE than the Soviet border. However, as we all know, artificial walls do not work, no Great Chinese Wall, no Berlin Wall could not stop what is right. The question is only to move law abiding citizens from grey area to the normal regulated environment in order to prevent importing goods tax free for business purposes.

Hyperbole much? :facepalm:


Comparing the Canadian border to the old Soviet border is ridiculous, and gives more reason to not give credit to anything to say. Leading your opinion to being irrelevant.

Precisely.

And for those that complain about the Canadian retailer "gauging" consumers, I think the word you're looking for is "gouging". You're welcome.

[Vasyl]

Hyperbole much? :facepalm:



Precisely.

And for those that complain about the Canadian retailer "gauging" consumers, I think the word you're looking for is "gouging". You're welcome.

Yeah, precisely. I had had this sad experience to compare two borders, the Soviet and Canadian. Thus, I know what I am talking about. The Canadian is the worst. Speaking about millions, check Visa and MasterCard statistics, how many transactions made by Canadian cardholders in the US. You would be surprised. Sometimes is better to start listening and learning than to keep own head in sand. Kids, it is time to mature.:D

[Conquistador]

Yeah, precisely. I had had this sad experience to compare two borders, the Soviet and Canadian. Thus, I know what I am talking about. The Canadian is the worst. Speaking about millions, check Visa and MasterCard statistics, how many transactions made by Canadian cardholders in the US. You would be surprised. Sometimes is better to start listening and learning than to keep own head in sand. Kids, it is time to mature.:D

Millions clearly referred to the number of Canadians that are doing this, not a reference to numbers of transactions.

A "Soviet" border hasn't existed for more than 20 years so references to border crossing experiences in different eras is hardly helpful nor relevant.

Sometimes it's better to say what you mean and dispense with the ridiculous hyperbole.

[Tijuana]

They should increase the allowance for alcohol and cigarettes. if I'm going away for 4+ weeks, I fail to see how me bringing back a case of wine is detrimental to the economy. I mean, the amount of money it would cost to go away for that long, surely I would lose a lot more than any "savings" I would get by brining back excess alcohol. They can keep the limits the same for the earlier tiers, but for being away for more than a week, I don't see the problem in being able to bring back more liquor.

It's bad enough that I can get a 12 pack of Corona in a small town in Poland with a population of less than a thousand for less than at the LCBO....

[slowtyper]

Because if you open it up to a small group you risk a larger group of people doing the same thing. In addition you risk people importing goods, tax fee, for business purposes (selling them in a convenience store, etc).

I have never been through a land border crossing, however when flying I have never been treated with anything but respect by the border guards and never once have been questioned / harassed about what I bring back.
Lucky you....everytime I go through customs I wish I were white. I've never been caught doing anything wrong but I get sent to secondary inspection, questioned on the side, bags searched, etc nearly every time.

[Tijuana]

Lucky you....everytime I go through customs I wish I were white. I've never been caught doing anything wrong but I get sent to secondary inspection, questioned on the side, bags searched, etc nearly every time.

You most likely did something wrong or lied about something at some point. People like to think they do nothing wrong, but there usually is something.

[Vasyl]

Millions clearly referred to the number of Canadians that are doing this, not a reference to numbers of transactions.

A "Soviet" border hasn't existed for more than 20 years so references to border crossing experiences in different eras is hardly helpful nor relevant.

Sometimes it's better to say what you mean and dispense with the ridiculous hyperbole.

Yeah, right, the Soviet border does not exist anymore as the totalitarian USSR. Yet, the Canadian border exists and border policies are worse and stricter than the Soviet ones in the "free and democratic" Canada.
Yeah, right, a number of transactions made by, guess who, Canadian cardholders. It is time to grow up.
I pay enough taxes in Canada and I refuse to be gauged by the greedy and dishonest Canadian corporations. I am not alone, there are millions of Canadians. It is about time for Canada to become truly free and democratic and start guarding the interests of their citizens not a few greedy corporations.
Just one example, a body lotion in Costco, Cleveland, OH is $9,40. Same bottle in Costco, Toronto is $15,80. Guess what, the lotion is made in CANADA. Why Canadian retailers can do that – the answer is simple, only because they are under the Government of Canada protection. For now and let’s hope not for long.

[spf1971]

Yeah, right, the Soviet border does not exist anymore as the totalitarian USSR. Yet, the Canadian border exists and border policies are worse and stricter than the Soviet ones in the "free and democratic" Canada.
Yeah, right, a number of transactions made by, guess who, Canadian cardholders. It is time to grow up.
I pay enough taxes in Canada and I refuse to be gauged by the greedy and dishonest Canadian corporations. I am not alone, there are millions of Canadians. It is about time for Canada to become truly free and democratic and start guarding the interests of their citizens not a few greedy corporations.
Just one example, a body lotion in Costco, Cleveland, OH is $9,40. Same bottle in Costco, Toronto is $15,80. Guess what, the lotion is made in CANADA. Why Canadian retailers can do that – the answer is simple, only because they are under the Government of Canada protection. For now and let’s hope not for long.

The word is gouged not gauged.


gouge   /gaʊdʒ/ Show Spelled [gouj] Show IPA noun, verb, gouged, goug·ing.
noun
1. a chisel having a partly cylindrical blade with the bevel on either the concave or the convex side.
2. an act of gouging.
3. a groove or hole made by gouging.
4. an act of extortion; swindle.
5. Geology .
a. a layer of decomposed rocks or minerals found along the walls of a vein.
b. fragments of rock that have accumulated between or along the walls of a fault.
verb (used with object)
6. to scoop out or turn with or as if with a gouge: to gouge a channel; to gouge holes.
7. to dig or force out with or as if with a gouge: to gouge out an eye.
8. to make a gouge in: to gouge one's leg.
9. to extort from, swindle, or overcharge.




gauge   /geɪdʒ/ Show Spelled [geyj] Show IPA verb, gauged, gaug·ing, noun
verb (used with object)
1. to determine the exact dimensions, capacity, quantity, or force of; measure.
2. to appraise, estimate, or judge.
3. to make conformable to a standard.
4. to mark or measure off; delineate.
5. to prepare or mix (plaster) with a definite proportion of plaster of Paris and mortar.
EXPAND6. to chip or rub (bricks or stones) to a uniform size or shape.
COLLAPSEnoun
7. a standard of measure or measurement.
8. a standard dimension, size, or quantity.
9. any device or instrument for measuring, registering measurements, or testing something, especially for measuring a dimension, quantity, or mechanical accuracy: pressure gauge; marking gauge.
10. a means of estimating or judging; criterion; test.
11. extent; scope; capacity: trying to determine the gauge of his own strength

[Vasyl]

The word is gouged not gauged.

I am sorry. English as sixth language. Please accept my sincere apologies.

[spf1971]

I am sorry. English as sixth language. Please accept my sincere apologies.

It's too bad that in all the time it took you to learn six languages, you never managed to aquire common sense and realism.

[Vasyl]

It's too bad that in all the time it took you to learn six languages, you never managed to aquire common sense and realism.

Says who? If you do not want to accept the reality, maybe it is about time to go and see a specialist. In short, forget you.

[spf1971]

When you are comparing having to declare purchases at the Canadian border and crossing into Communist Russia, you are showing your complete lack of perspective.

[Vasyl]

When you are comparing having to declare purchases at the Canadian border and crossing into Communist Russia, you are showing your complete lack of perspective.

I am (was) citizen of both. I crossed both borders and I can compare two experiences. Crossing the Canadian border is the worst experience comparing crossing into the Communist Russia speaking about the border guards’ behavior and allowances not to mention the civilized European Countries where you are crossing the border without any borders at all.

[Hunter316]

I am (was) citizen of both. I crossed both borders and I can compare two experiences. Crossing the Canadian border is the worst experience comparing crossing into the Communist Russia speaking about the border guards’ behavior and allowances not to mention the civilized European Countries where you are crossing the border without any borders at all.

Comparing the CBSA with border guards from the former Soviet Union takes a great deal away from any argument you might have had. If you don't like the rules with regards to importing goods into Canada then don't do it. The government needs revenue for all sorts of social programs and initiatives (some of which I agree with and some of which I don't) so they need to collect it somehow and I would much rather they do it this way than raise taxes. It is all good to complain about how things are done but I don't see you proposing a realistic way for the government to make up the shortfall in revenue that would be the result of you proposals. If they have a shortfall in revenue something will not recieve funding and it might be something that you value.

With regards to your comments about European countries you do still have to go through customs unless you are a citizen of one of the member countries and considering the shape Europe is in now I don't think we want to emulate their system. If you are such a fan of these other places and such a detractor of the way Canada operates then why are you here?

[spf1971]

The point is that, because you believe that crossing into Canada is worse than crossing into Russia when it was Communist and travel was severally restricted means, you seem to be lacking in perspective.

[Vasyl]

Comparing the CBSA with border guards from the former Soviet Union takes a great deal away from any argument you might have had. If you don't like the rules with regards to importing goods into Canada then don't do it. The government needs revenue for all sorts of social programs and initiatives (some of which I agree with and some of which I don't) so they need to collect it somehow and I would much rather they do it this way than raise taxes. It is all good to complain about how things are done but I don't see you proposing a realistic way for the government to make up the shortfall in revenue that would be the result of you proposals. If they have a shortfall in revenue something will not recieve funding and it might be something that you value.

With regards to your comments about European countries you do still have to go through customs unless you are a citizen of one of the member countries and considering the shape Europe is in now I don't think we want to emulate their system. If you are such a fan of these other places and such a detractor of the way Canada operates then why are you here?

Wow, I truly like the above "arguments" of "wall-lovers". There will be no shortfall in revenue. As soon as the limits are lifted, Canadian retailers will have to compete. As soon as they start competing, there is no incentive to go anywhere else but buy in Canada. I know it is hard to comprehend but you can try. :D Do not ask me why I am here, and I will not ask you why you were born, OK?

[Hunter316]

Wow, I truly like the above "arguments" of "wall-lovers". There will be no shortfall in revenue. As soon as the limits are lifted, Canadian retailers will have to compete. As soon as they start competing, there is no incentive to go anywhere else but buy in Canada. I know it is hard to comprehend but you can try. :D Do not ask me why I am here, and I will not ask you why you were born, OK?

I shop in the US all the time and when I come back I declare my purchases to the penny and have not been charged duty or taxes in at least 3 years. I have travelled all over Europe as well as other select parts of the world and have not found any country that has the balance of personal choice and support structure that Canada has. I, unlike you, though recognize that this costs money and that money has to come from somewhere. Retailers in Canada pay more for their products that their counterparts in the US so they can not sell them at the same price and make a profit unless our dollar was worth significantly more than that of the US. If we lower the duty and tariffs that are charged for importing we would see a revenue decline and either have to make do with less which no one seems to be willing to do or raise that money in another way which no one seems willing to pay.

As for your other comments I would think that it was obvious why I was born. My parents copulated. As for why you are here it seems to be more complex since you seem to compare Canada to a totalitarian regime but are choosing to live here since you are able to leave at any time. For someone who claims to be so well traveled it is a pity that you wit is so lacking that you need to resort to base personal attacks.

You have still not presented an alternative plan to make up the shortfall in revenue your plan (desire) would cause.

[ls17031]

In Soviet Russia you say stupid things to idiot.

[apn64]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Both France and Denmark in the "civilized" EU have re-introduced "random" border control inspections and checkpoints, within their internal EU borders.

Sure, but it's a safe bet they're focused on security, not shaking-down every returning resident for a few bucks.

[O1IN85]

if I'm going away for 4+ weeks, I fail to see how me bringing back a case of wine is detrimental to the economy.

Doesn't matter. You still brought currency out of the country. Duties are also a way to recover lost currency (alongside with other factors/reasons).

Yeah, online petitions in Canada are pretty much useless. I'd like to see it happen though.

[the stig]

this is a good read, and a laughable one. canada will never increase nor decrease anything if it's making them a good income from travellers. so you can either put up with it or move to the states....

i have dual citizenship so it allows me some freedoms to do more than your average citizen in regards to crossing over and omissions. i have a house here and one in the states so i no longer have anything to complain about when it comes to duties or taxes, so it's a simple solution to what so many complain about. if you don't like it here then move... the voice of a few that want huge things changed will not make a difference. it's not like you are dealing with a retail chain and had poor customer service, you are dealing with regulations/rules of a whole country...

i don't understand why some that are from another country come here and then compare to how things are/were in their origin country, if you do not like it here then simply go back !! oh wait, is the reason you migrated here because your country is in such poor state because of wars or economic structure ? then just be thankful you were allowed to enter our country and have a fresh start because you can't have your cake and eat it too.

i'm not trying to be racist or anything remotely like that, but i'm tired of hearing how people want to live here yet have some other countries benefits or taxes or whatever OR expect to still have their rights and freedoms they had in their origin country. it simply doesn't work that way and usually it's for a reason...

and like a few have already said, if it was so much better where they were from then why did they/their family migrate here ?

and again if someone has been stopped and hassled it's usually because they have done something previously that raised suspicion and that is the reason for being questioned/searched.

this whole discussion is getting old, things are just how they are and they will most likely never really change.

[TrevorK]

I am (was) citizen of both. I crossed both borders and I can compare two experiences. Crossing the Canadian border is the worst experience comparing crossing into the Communist Russia speaking about the border guards’ behavior and allowances not to mention the civilized European Countries where you are crossing the border without any borders at all.

You should look for help in reversing the brainwashing your experienced in the Soviet Union. It will help you think for yourself and see what reality is.

[forgetpwd]

288 now, long way to go.

[spf1971]

288 now, long way to go.

5.3 signatures per day; with a desired 10,000 signatures it will be ready to go in about 5 years. :D

[NG]

I don't think I'm in the minority; I think that it would only harm Canadian business to increase the duty free allowances. It seems like a short-sighted solution that only benefits a small group of people while harming Canadian businesses (which employ Canadians).

Americans can bring back up to $200 while we're stuck at $20 for internet and $0 for land. What about American businesses being harmed? If I was the US I'd match the Canadian import allowances for Americans returning or ordering from Canada just to be fair to their businesses


Requesting a $200 allowance for day trips is pretty lame, since I've found that the border patrol will rarely pull an individual over if the tax haul is <$20, which amounts to an unofficial exemption ~$150 for ON residents. More passengers in the car often pushes this higher, especially if they all have individual receipts ;)

The US recently proposed a $1,000 exemption for all day trips (both ways) as a means to reduce congestion. I thought that was a fantastic idea and it would cause greedy SOB Cdn retailers to adjust their prices inline with a parity dollar faster than you can blink.

Of course Harpo and gang rejected the proposal on the basis of reduced tax revenues. In which case, $200 is i) comparable with current US limits, ii) better than nothing and iii) a start in the right direction...

Do what I do: Unless the price is cheaper (of course) just boycott Canadian retailers. The sooner they die and stores like Wal-Mart, Best Buy and Target take over in Canada the sooner they'll decide they want a North American business model.

Besides it's the Canadian businesses who like the low duty model since it puts barriers for us to buy from foreign stores.

[zoro69]

Americans can bring back up to $200 while we're stuck at $20 for internet and $0 for land. What about American businesses being harmed? If I was the US I'd match the Canadian import allowances for Americans returning or ordering from Canada just to be fair to their businesses



Do what I do: Unless the price is cheaper (of course) just boycott Canadian retailers. The sooner they die and stores like Wal-Mart, Best Buy and Target take over in Canada the sooner they'll decide they want a North American business model.

Besides it's the Canadian businesses who like the low duty model since it puts barriers for us to buy from foreign stores.



There is no national sales tax for americans to avoid shopping in Canada. And no one is going to argue american business are disadvantaged by lower costs in Canada, eg everyone knows minimum wage is higher here. So it doenst make any sense at all to compare the two situations. There is nohing to collect, americans aren't coming here to buy asian clothes marked up for Can import duty to avoid anything in the usa.

but American retailers have been lobbying very hard about the unfairness of online sales not collecting state sales tax giving amazon and ebay an advantage, change is coming

[NG]

There is no national sales tax for americans to avoid shopping in Canada. And no one is going to argue american business are disadvantaged by lower costs in Canada, eg everyone knows minimum wage is higher here. So it doenst make any sense at all to compare the two situations. There is nohing to collect, americans aren't coming here to buy asian clothes marked up for Can import duty to avoid anything in the usa.

but American retailers have been lobbying very hard about the unfairness of online sales not collecting state sales tax giving amazon and ebay an advantage, change is coming

1) I never commented on sales tax - Americans are allowed to bring back up to $200 duty free. We have $0 in person and $20 over the internet.

Having said that if Canada is going to be charging sales tax to Canadians shopping in the US then wouldn't it be fair for to American businesses to charge sales tax for Americans buying things in Canada?

In addition to lowering their duty free allotment from $200 to $20 that is.

[cyder]

Do what I do: Unless the price is cheaper (of course) just boycott Canadian retailers. The sooner they die and stores like Wal-Mart, Best Buy and Target take over in Canada the sooner they'll decide they want a North American business model.

Besides it's the Canadian businesses who like the low duty model since it puts barriers for us to buy from foreign stores.

doesnt walmart best buy and sears charge more than they do in the US already?



I would like to see debit /credit readers at each booth so they can collect applicable hst on every $ spent.

[FunSave22]

Do what I do: Unless the price is cheaper (of course) just boycott Canadian retailers. The sooner they die and stores like Wal-Mart, Best Buy and Target take over in Canada the sooner they'll decide they want a North American business model.

By North American business model do you mean:


Increased use of cheap illegal immigrants where ever corporations can get away with it.
Lower worker safety standards.
Lower environmental standards.
Lower minimum wage.
Lower taxes for corporations.
Lower taxes on fuel used in transportation.
etc...



If businesses in Canada are going to have the same prices as business in the US, either Canadian laws and standards are going to have to become more like the US, or the other way around. Which one do you think would be more likely to happen?

Many of us don't want to become more like the US just so you can buy a few things for a couple of dollars cheaper. Sorry.

[NG]

By North American business model do you mean:


Increased use of cheap illegal immigrants where ever corporations can get away with it.
Lower worker safety standards.
Lower environmental standards.
Lower minimum wage.
Lower taxes for corporations.
Lower taxes on fuel used in transportation.
etc...



If businesses in Canada are going to have the same prices as business in the US, either Canadian laws and standards are going to have to become more like the US, or the other way around. Which one do you think would be more likely to happen?

Many of us don't want to become more like the US just so you can buy a few things for a couple of dollars cheaper. Sorry.

I don't support any of those things (although I would quibble about how 'illegal' immigrants are demonized in society) however Canadian businesses are no better or less sleazier than their American counterparts.

Simply put capitalists are scum the world over.

[NG]

doesnt walmart best buy and sears charge more than they do in the US already?

They say that but I never found that to be true. I was actually there today and grabbed a pair of tube socks. 20pk for $10 or a 10pk for $6

There were no 20pks on the US site I could find but the cheapest 10pk was $6.40

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Starter-Men-s-Socks-10-Pairs/11004286


I would like to see debit /credit readers at each booth so they can collect applicable hst on every $ spent.

Totally cool with HST and that'd be great esp if it'd speed up the line. But it'd only be fair if they did the same thing on the US side for Americans returning home.

[FunSave22]

I don't support any of those things
So you don't support any of these things, but you want Canada to do them anyway.



however Canadian businesses are no better or less sleazier than their American counterparts.
Do you have any evidence to support this? Or does it just fit your ideological outlook, so evidence isn't required?

[NG]

So you don't support any of these things, but you want Canada to do them anyway.

I've never said that so I will thank you not to put words in my mouth.


Do you have any evidence to support this? Or does it just fit your ideological outlook, so evidence isn't required?

Being pro-worker or anti-worker doesn't stop at the border. America elected Obama and Canada has elected Harper. We're proving to be no better or worse than the Americans.

As far as "evidence" (didn't think we were obligated to provide sourcing on an internet shopping discussion forum) but for example Tim Hortons HQ only moved back to Canada when Harper made Canada's corporate tax rate lower than in the US.

Until then Timmy's HQ was perfectly happy being in the US.

http://www.theguardian.pe.ca/Business/Manufacturing/2009-09-24/article-1292199/Tim-Hortons-returns-to-Canada%3B-Harper-credits-low-corporate-taxes/1

[FunSave22]

I've never said that so I will thank you not to put words in my mouth.

So you refuse to shop in Canada until the prices are the same as the US. But you refuse to say if you support the steps necessary for the prices to be the same in Canada as the US.

Brilliant logic.

[NG]

So you refuse to shop in Canada until the prices are the same as the US. But you refuse to say if you support the steps necessary for the prices to be the same in Canada as the US.

Brilliant logic.

I never said that again. Are you just in the business about lying about what people say to push your arguement?

I did say that I boycott Canadian businesses because what we can import without duties is so much less than what American can import without duties. It's my right to shop at whatever store I want for whatever reason and it's none of your business.

Fact is I do support unions in both Canada and the US. I do support the living wage in both Canada and in the US. I do support medicare and Obamacare.

I just don't see Canadians as "all that" while Americans suck. They elected Obama and that rocks. We elected Harper and that sucks.


I've never said that so I will thank you not to put words in my mouth.



Being pro-worker or anti-worker doesn't stop at the border. America elected Obama and Canada has elected Harper. We're proving to be no better or worse than the Americans.

As far as "evidence" (didn't think we were obligated to provide sourcing on an internet shopping discussion forum) but for example Tim Hortons HQ only moved back to Canada when Harper made Canada's corporate tax rate lower than in the US.

Until then Timmy's HQ was perfectly happy being in the US.

http://www.theguardian.pe.ca/Business/Manufacturing/2009-09-24/article-1292199/Tim-Hortons-returns-to-Canada%3B-Harper-credits-low-corporate-taxes/1

You asked for proof Canadian capitalists are just as money grubbing as their American counterparts - you then ignore the example I give only to start a new attack on me.

That's a very cowardly and pathetic way to debate.

[zoro69]

When Tim hortons "moved" (didnt actually move anything) it was 100% owned by USA corp Wendy's. When Wendy's spun it off, leaving a corp with the vast majority of its revenue in canada, with its senior execs who never left in canada, it "moved' back to Canada

Your scattered arguments make little sense, there isn't any duty on nafta sourced product, and isn't on many other product. primarily clothes are the issue with duty (most cross boarder shoppers are really complaining about tax), where the same duty you pay importing from the usa has already been paid by the Can retailers selling here...which blows your theory of canadian retailers "gouging' out of the water

its fairly simple, there are a number of can only public retailers who publish audited financials. In minutes you could look up their gross and net margins, then find comparables in the USA to compare with. it will be very clear if can retailers are getting significantly better margin or not (and you'll find its not)

[NG]

When Tim hortons "moved" (didnt actually move anything) it was 100% owned by USA corp Wendy's. When Wendy's spun it off, leaving a corp with the vast majority of its revenue in canada, with its senior execs who never left in canada, it "moved' back to Canada

But according to that CP article they didn't move back until the corporate tax rate was lowered. They were happy to stay in the US and enjoy the lower tax rate until it became cheaper for them to come back to Canada. They were the typical capitalists - going for the biggest bang for the buck.


Your scattered arguments make little sense, there isn't any duty on nafta sourced product, and isn't on many other product. primarily clothes are the issue with duty

I just got a DVD package from Amazon UK and on the UPS bill there was a charge for both duties and HST.


(most cross boarder shoppers are really complaining about tax),

Not me - I'm happy with the HST part and support the US states trying to get retailers like Amazon to charge state sales tax.


where the same duty you pay importing from the usa has already been paid by the Can retailers selling here...which blows your theory of canadian retailers "gouging' out of the water

I don't recall saying in this thread that Canadian retailers are 'gouging' (I'm not saying this isn't true).

What I did state is that Canadian retailers have their cake and eat it too. They enjoy Americans being able to shop here and bring back up to $200.

On the other side they also get to enjoy having the consumer restricted to bringing back $20 (for internet) or $0 for in person shopping thus putting a barrier against us shopping outside of Canada.

By not shopping at Canadian stores (Canadian Tire, Home Hardware, Metro etc), at least for myself, I bite back that advantage from them.


its fairly simple, there are a number of can only public retailers who publish audited financials. In minutes you could look up their gross and net margins, then find comparables in the USA to compare with. it will be very clear if can retailers are getting significantly better margin or not (and you'll find its not)

Pretty much everything comes from China. It wouldn't surprise me if the wholesalers are charging Canadian retailers more because they think they can get away with it.

[Pointseeker]

NO LIMIT PERIOD. :!:

Why spend so much time on free trade and then put on duty on travelers. If Canada is loosing tax take from undeclared stuff brought in from outside, put on another stupid tax on travels and eliminate the duty when they are returning. Supposedly it will increase travel outside and improve bottom line of the airline business. Everybody benefits. This does not include a reduction of boarder staff, customs officers which would reduce cost to the government and the unnecessary wait time coming home. Time is money.

No duty levied when traveling across provinces. No duty traveling across states in USA. And no duty or boarder checks across Europe, and they manage.

[NG]

Why spend so much time on free trade and then put on duty on travelers.

That's the thing. These international free trade agreements are just meant for the big boys (the 1%).

But the rest of everyone else is expected to be boxed into what we always had (while losing ground financially because of these free trade agreements) in order to protect the 1% and their business interest.

[ls17031]

That's the thing. These international free trade agreements are just meant for the big boys (the 1%).

But the rest of everyone else is expected to be boxed into what we always had (while losing ground financially because of these free trade agreements) in order to protect the 1% and their business interest.

I'm in the 99%.

Explain how NAFTA or any other FTA does not apply to me.

Trust me. I use NAFTA to my advantage at every opportunity.

[apn64]

NO LIMIT PERIOD. :!:

Why spend so much time on free trade and then put on duty on travelers. If Canada is loosing tax take from undeclared stuff brought in from outside, put on another stupid tax on travels and eliminate the duty when they are returning. Supposedly it will increase travel outside and improve bottom line of the airline business. Everybody benefits. This does not include a reduction of boarder staff, customs officers which would reduce cost to the government and the unnecessary wait time coming home. Time is money.

No duty levied when traveling across provinces. No duty traveling across states in USA. And no duty or boarder checks across Europe, and they manage.

^ This. Except for http://www.ross.net/notes/loose.shtml and http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/boarders.html

NAFTA should be expanded to be a true FREE TRADE zone and quit the bullschitt, sniping and Canuck keystone cops trying to pickpocket returning residents at every turn. Consumers get the best service/selection/prices and businesses compete or die on a level playing field.

Canuck business must be lobbying heavily against lowering the daily exemptions because they know what we know; accepting the US proposal for a $1K daily exemption would force them to drop their prices faster than they could blink. They're hiding behind a protectionist scam.

I just purchased an auto part from a US Honda dealer and had it shipped. The part cost was us$76 vs. cad$281 for the exact same part from a Canuck Honda dealer. WTF? >:(

[FunSave22]

I did say that I boycott Canadian businesses because what we can import without duties is so much less than what American can import without duties. It's my right to shop at whatever store I want for whatever reason and it's none of your business.

If you don't want people commenting on things you don't feel are any of their business, may I suggest that you don't post these things on a public bulletin board.




You asked for proof Canadian capitalists are just as money grubbing as their American counterparts - you then ignore the example I give only to start a new attack on me.

Providing one example of one what you claim is a Canadians company acting just as bad as American companies is not the same as proof that all Canadian capitalists are just as money grubbing as their American counterparts. Hopefully you understand that.

It's like saying all whites are horrible people and then showing how one white person is horrible as your proof.

[NG]

I'm in the 99%.

Explain how NAFTA or any other FTA does not apply to me.

Trust me. I use NAFTA to my advantage at every opportunity.

Ok the top 10% then who can actually make use of NAFTA in a B2B model and not as the end consumer/worker.


If you don't want people commenting on things you don't feel are any of their business, may I suggest that you don't post these things on a public bulletin board.


Reasoned responses are one thing. You just seem to have a hate on because I've chosen to boycott all Canadian business because of how better Canadian businesses have it for such a high duty free allotment for Americans returning home compared to how Canadians have it for American businesses.


Providing one example of one what you claim is a Canadians company acting just as bad as American companies is not the same as proof that all Canadian capitalists are just as money grubbing as their American counterparts. Hopefully you understand that.

You slammed me because I didn't provide proof so I provided an example. If you refuse to acknowledge that businesses play the "lowest tax rate" jurisdiction to maximize profits at the expense of society game on a regular basis that's your business.

Your denials of a standard business practice mean nothing to me.


It's like saying all whites are horrible people and then showing how one white person is horrible as your proof.

That line smacks of the "corporations are people too under the law" thing.

Funny thing is, at least in the US, according to "The Corporation (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4924385683686207744)" corporations got their designation being "people" because they snuck through and got it for themselves when African Americans were recognized as people.

That aside if you don't like that I boycott Canadian business because of our biased duty rates compared to America for purchases under $200 that's fine - you can buy from Canadian business 100% - I don't care.

For anybody else annoyed that we're hit with duties for $20 with internet orders and $0 for in person importing while Americans can import up to $200 then you're more than welcome to boycott Canadian businesses as well to bite back.

[TrevorK]

That aside if you don't like that I boycott Canadian business because of our biased duty rates compared to America for purchases under $200 that's fine - you can buy from Canadian business 100% - I don't care.

For anybody else annoyed that we're hit with duties for $20 with internet orders and $0 for in person importing while Americans can import up to $200 then you're more than welcome to boycott Canadian businesses as well to bite back.

What I find irritating about your posts is that you insist the American model of conducting business is the correct model, as you are advocating that Canada follows suit with the American way of doing things (in terms of taxation at the border). This nullifies any value your argument has because it is now based on the philosophy of a single country rather than a well thought of plan that isn't partial to countries but is partial to ideas and theories.

Your opinion would be much more credible if you advocate to "do this (insert plan here) because it will result in this (insert outcomes here) based on my idea that (insert your thought here)" rather than "do this (insert plan here) because the mighty US economy does it." Canada doesn't have to do something because another country does it, and it's ignorant to suggest that we just blindly follow the policies of another country because you're cranky about paying tax on your shoes you buy cross-border.

[NG]

What I find irritating about your posts is that you insist the American model of conducting business is the correct model, as you are advocating that Canada follows suit with the American way of doing things (in terms of taxation at the border). This nullifies any value your argument has because it is now based on the philosophy of a single country rather than a well thought of plan that isn't partial to countries but is partial to ideas and theories.

I never meant to intend to state that the US model is the correct one and I regret if that's how it's come across.

I did state earlier that I would be supportive of the US adopting the Canadian policy of duties and taxes being applied above $20 for Americans returning from Canada.

It's not a "the other guys right" position that I've been trying to take - it's an equal footing for both parties where both follow the same rules (the old don't do to others what you wouldn't want done to you thing).

Perhaps Canada has exactly the right position on duties and America should adopt the Canadian policy.


and it's ignorant to suggest that we just blindly follow the policies of another country because you're cranky about paying tax on your shoes you buy cross-border.

Just to be clear here I'm not talking taxes (HST) - the thread topic states duties and that's what I've been basing my position on.

[Pointseeker]

I never meant to intend to state that the US model is the correct one ............ that's what I've been basing my position on.


Who the h... cares what US model is or what your position regarding it is. DUTY is old, outdated, biased form of taxes that is costing Canadians too much. A tourist with the luggage allowance will go to another country to bring goods to bankrupt our merchants here at home?? That weight allowance includes the space needed for several changes of underwear that most folks,I hope, carry with them. You want protection, then prevent the overpriced for quality junk that is imported from China and other developing countries. No, that will not happen because that cuts into the importers' profits and the international monopolies. Its better to squeeze an average tourist that gets a trinket oversees or even south of the border.

That is the topic of discussion and not your philosophical recitation of US vs Canada stupid tax policies.

[zoro69]

Who the h... cares what US model is or what your position regarding it is. DUTY is old, outdated, biased form of taxes that is costing Canadians too much. A tourist with the luggage allowance will go to another country to bring goods to bankrupt our merchants here at home?? That weight allowance includes the space needed for several changes of underwear that most folks,I hope, carry with them. You want protection, then prevent the overpriced for quality junk that is imported from China and other developing countries. No, that will not happen because that cuts into the importers' profits and the international monopolies. Its better to squeeze an average tourist that gets a trinket oversees or even south of the border.



Do you not realize the duties the individual vacationer pays bringing things back...are exactly the same as the retailer or wholesaler pays when they bring in the same item?! or that other countries impose duties on canadian goods when they are imported to their country?

[Pointseeker]

Do you not realize the duties the individual vacationer pays bringing things back...are exactly the same as the retailer or wholesaler pays when they bring in the same item?! or that other countries impose duties on canadian goods when they are imported to their country?

Who cares??????????


Retailers import by billions ....... and have you ever travel anywhere lately. I have at least for the last 10 years been going to Europe and have never had to declared anything nor had been ask to pay anything for stuff I had with me. So what are you talking about.

[ls17031]

Who cares??????????


Retailers import by billions ....... and have you ever travel anywhere lately. I have at least for the last 10 years been going to Europe and have never had to declared anything nor had been ask to pay anything for stuff I had with me. So what are you talking about.

What did you have with you that you were leaving in the country you were visiting?

[Pointseeker]

What did you have with you that you were leaving in the country you were visiting?

fresh set of underwear

[ls17031]

Who cares??????????


Retailers import by billions ....... and have you ever travel anywhere lately. I have at least for the last 10 years been going to Europe and have never had to declared anything nor had been ask to pay anything for stuff I had with me. So what are you talking about.


fresh set of underwear

So then why would you have had to pay anything upon entry into any of the countries you've visited?

What are YOU talking about?

[Pointseeker]

So then why would you have had to pay anything upon entry into any of the countries you've visited?

What are YOU talking about?

Where did I say I paid anything. No Duty in Europe.

[spf1971]

Where did I say I paid anything. No Duty in Europe.

You don't pay duty when you go to Europe on vacation. You pay duty when you bring things back home. :facepalm:

[Pointseeker]

You don't pay duty when you go to Europe on vacation. You pay duty when you bring things back home. :facepalm:


DO YOU READ POSTS? Or you just want to show off you intelligence.

That is my point, no one charges duty except CANADA and USA (I care less about them) .
ELIMINATE as it is a stupid tradition to uphold.

[zoro69]

", no one charges duty except CANADA and USA

???

if you are that clueless its pointless to even continue. the few people ranting away here dont even understand what duty is

[spf1971]

DO YOU READ POSTS? Or you just want to show off you intelligence.

That is my point, no one charges duty except CANADA and USA (I care less about them) .
ELIMINATE as it is a stupid tradition to uphold.

I'll try and make this very simple for you; now matter where you're from or where you go, you don't pay duty when you go on vacation. You pay duty when you return home.

I.E. If you're from Germany and go on vacation in the US; you don't pay duty when you go to the US, you pay duty on things you bring back to Germany.
If you're from France and go on vacation in Canada; you don't pay duty when you go to Canada, you pay duty on things you bring back to France.

Here is a list of duty allowances. http://www.taxfreetravel.com/EU%20Duty%20Free%20Allowances It really isn't a difficult concept, pretty much everyone here understands it except you.

Some places will have duty free zones; NAFTA for instance, buy something covered under the agreement and you don't pay duty, you just have to pay taxes.

[TrevorK]

I never meant to intend to state that the US model is the correct one and I regret if that's how it's come across.

I did state earlier that I would be supportive of the US adopting the Canadian policy of duties and taxes being applied above $20 for Americans returning from Canada.

It's not a "the other guys right" position that I've been trying to take - it's an equal footing for both parties where both follow the same rules (the old don't do to others what you wouldn't want done to you thing).

Perhaps Canada has exactly the right position on duties and America should adopt the Canadian policy.

Why should Canada and the US adopt the same policy in this sort of issue? I'm not sure that it's reasonable to advocate equality across all countries in issues such as these because each country has the right to set their own priorities.