Authentic Japanese ramen in Toronto?

[Superhucard]

Any recommendations?

No, I don't like Ajisen ramen.

[junot111]

Dattebayo!

[Hairball]

This is Canada, shouldn't we be eating hamburgers, pizza, and poutine instead? (based on Superhucard logic)

[EchoAngel911]

there are jtown restaurants

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/642528

[ji2o0k]

hey OP, this topic has been discussed a lot before on RFD with plenty of threads...do a quick search and you will see:

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/ramen-stores-toronto-511773/
http://forums.redflagdeals.com/where-can-you-eat-best-ramen-849142/

Having said that, I can recommend:

Miyabi
280 West Beaver Creek Road Richmond Hill, ON L4B 3Z1
(905) 709-2915
Miyabi is run by Japanese people...food is delicious, ramen was pretty good but only complaint is that it takes a while for the food to be cooked...but I guess it is because it is authentic that is why it takes a while. Prices are reasonable.

But the place is small and ambience isn't really anything to write about. But I haven't been in a while (over 1 yr) so hopefully they are still good...

[yao416]

This is Canada, shouldn't we be eating hamburgers, pizza, and poutine instead? (based on Superhucard logic)

+1

[gadogry]

[Attempts to hijack thread]

Forget about finding a good ramen restaurant. Any recommendations on where to buy good ramen to cook at home?

I have this bottle of seven-flavour powder in my cabinet that is itching to be used :)

[winterfreshgrin]

aijsen is nasty, that restaurant is on my list of places i will not eat at.

i've tried kenzo, that place was alright

[ippon]

hey OP, this topic has been discussed a lot before on RFD with plenty of threads...do a quick search and you will see:

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/ramen-stores-toronto-511773/
http://forums.redflagdeals.com/where-can-you-eat-best-ramen-849142/

Having said that, I can recommend:

Miyabi
280 West Beaver Creek Road Richmond Hill, ON L4B 3Z1
(905) 709-2915
Miyabi is run by Japanese people...food is delicious, ramen was pretty good but only complaint is that it takes a while for the food to be cooked...but I guess it is because it is authentic that is why it takes a while. Prices are reasonable.

But the place is small and ambience isn't really anything to write about. But I haven't been in a while (over 1 yr) so hopefully they are still good...

that just means they are slow. ramen is supposed to be fast.

[slowtyper]

[Attempts to hijack thread]

Forget about finding a good ramen restaurant. Any recommendations on where to buy good ramen to cook at home?

I have this bottle of seven-flavour powder in my cabinet that is itching to be used :)

Use it with everything! I do...love it. There is a good frozen ramen to cook at home but I don't know the name...just what it looks like. I'll try to find it and post it.

[gadogry]

Use it with everything! I do...love it. There is a good frozen ramen to cook at home but I don't know the name...just what it looks like. I'll try to find it and post it.

Thanks! That would be great :)

[jayt90]

[Attempts to hijack thread]

Forget about finding a good ramen restaurant. Any recommendations on where to buy good ramen to cook at home?

I have this bottle of seven-flavour powder in my cabinet that is itching to be used :)

One of the best is Yamachan Tonkotsu which is usually frozen or refrigerated , at T&T, Taro, Sunny, or J-Town.
The mild pork package has a particularly good broth packet.

[DeathRazR]

Ippai
8865 Woodbine Ave., Unit D5

http://www.ippai.ca/index.html

[gadogry]

One of the best is Yamachan Tonkotsu which is usually frozen or refrigerated , at T&T, Taro, Sunny, or J-Town.
The mild pork package has a particularly good broth packet.



Thanks! Will try that out some time :)

[caitlink]

Yamachan (frozen section at T&T) is best. i think it's $4 for 2 noodle portion when not on sale.

Dine-in restaurants would have to be Niwatei at J town. Place is packed on weekends right now since they just did a groupon deal this month.

[gilboman]

Konichiwa on Baldwin St and Kenzo on Dundas is pretty good and definitely the better ones in Toronto

[polarb]

kenzo is good. maybe the best?

and just read this one on Jyuban but way up in markham -
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/food-and-wine/restaurant-reviews/jyuban-where-ramen-purists-get-their-fill/article2302108/

[kkl1208]

kenzo is good. maybe the best?

and just read this one on Jyuban but way up in markham -
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/food-and-wine/restaurant-reviews/jyuban-where-ramen-purists-get-their-fill/article2302108/

Jyuban was disappointing. I ordered the Tonkatsu and the broth was really light, and the noodles were not al dente, it was mushy. I'm not sure if the ink noodles was supposed to be super mushy or not, because this was my first time trying it. But it was like pasta that was cooked for way too long.

Although not a true ramen shop, but more of a izakaya, I prefer Ematei in downtown Toronto for their tonkatsu.

[X820]

Try Kenzo, went there a couple of times.

[ippon]

Jyuban was disappointing. I ordered the Tonkatsu and the broth was really light, and the noodles were not al dente, it was mushy. I'm not sure if the ink noodles was supposed to be super mushy or not, because this was my first time trying it. But it was like pasta that was cooked for way too long.

Although not a true ramen shop, but more of a izakaya, I prefer Ematei in downtown Toronto for their tonkatsu.

this happens very often, but it's tonkOtsu, not tonkAtsu.

[OctaneChicken]

kenzo is good. maybe the best?

and just read this one on Jyuban but way up in markham -
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/food-and-wine/restaurant-reviews/jyuban-where-ramen-purists-get-their-fill/article2302108/

+∞ for kenzo
http://www.kenzoramen.ca/

[rageking]

The J-town one I tried a while back, and the pork ramen was so so. The broth had almost no taste, and the ramen seemed similar to instant noodles. 2 pieces of pork, or pay up $2.25 for 2 more tiny slices. This is one of the top places around Toronto? Since I ordered a set meal, the true star of that meal was the appetizer of seasoned beef with terriyaki sauce.

[BananaWeed]

+1 for Kenzo.

[Superhucard]

hey OP, this topic has been discussed a lot before on RFD with plenty of threads...do a quick search and you will see:

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/ramen-stores-toronto-511773/
http://forums.redflagdeals.com/where-can-you-eat-best-ramen-849142/

Having said that, I can recommend:

Miyabi
280 West Beaver Creek Road Richmond Hill, ON L4B 3Z1
(905) 709-2915
Miyabi is run by Japanese people...food is delicious, ramen was pretty good but only complaint is that it takes a while for the food to be cooked...but I guess it is because it is authentic that is why it takes a while. Prices are reasonable.

But the place is small and ambience isn't really anything to write about. But I haven't been in a while (over 1 yr) so hopefully they are still good...

Miyabi, ok thanks.

One thread is too old, from 2007.
Another thread deteriorated into flame wars.

[Superhucard]

I am looking for one that actually comes from Japan.

Like this one:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/index.html

See their overseas locations:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/shoplist/index.html#overseas

[BananaHunter]

I think people need to set their expectations straight. How do you define authentic? Do you want it made by japanese chefs and served by a japanese waitress? Or do you just want it to taste like what's made in Japan? I've tried Ajisen (Chinatown & North York) and Niwatei at J-town. I think the quality does not vary too much. The major difference between Ajisen and Niwatei is that Ajisen is run by chinese, and they are more generous with their toppings. Niwatei feels like a scam with just 2 pieces of meat. I don't feel the price premium they charge justifies having the food prepared and served by real Japanese people. Taste wise, I think they are about the same. I actually think the noodles in Ajisen are better.

Authenticity is a fairly gimmick concept. Ramen is not that difficult to make. You just need the right ingredients. If you go to Japan, watch how Ramen is made. It's really fast. Some places have pre-filled bowls of noodles, and they just add broth to it and then toppings. In that place I tried in Japan, literally they made it under 30 seconds in front of my eyes. It's like poutine. I think people that argue stores in Montreal has better poutine have no case. Poutine is not a "cooking" dish. There's very little room to screw up. Different people will like different gravy. And there isn't much variation to fries. Likewise there isn't much variation to the noodles and the broth is typically made from POWDER. There's no reason why anyone can't make the same taste.

For Ramen, basically there are just 3 stores that specialize in Ramen: Ajisen, Niwatei, and Kenzo. Most other japanese restaurants, regardless of who's running it, may also serve Ramen.

[blarg]

Raa

[slowtyper]

I think people need to set their expectations straight. How do you define authentic? Do you want it made by japanese chefs and served by a japanese waitress? Or do you just want it to taste like what's made in Japan? I've tried Ajisen (Chinatown & North York) and Niwatei at J-town. I think the quality does not vary too much. The major difference between Ajisen and Niwatei is that Ajisen is run by chinese, and they are more generous with their toppings. Niwatei feels like a scam with just 2 pieces of meat. I don't feel the price premium they charge justifies having the food prepared and served by real Japanese people. Taste wise, I think they are about the same. I actually think the noodles in Ajisen are better.

Authenticity is a fairly gimmick concept. Ramen is not that difficult to make. You just need the right ingredients. If you go to Japan, watch how Ramen is made. It's really fast. Some places have pre-filled bowls of noodles, and they just add broth to it and then toppings. In that place I tried in Japan, literally they made it under 30 seconds in front of my eyes. It's like poutine. I think people that argue stores in Montreal has better poutine have no case. Poutine is not a "cooking" dish. There's very little room to screw up. Different people will like different gravy. And there isn't much variation to fries. Likewise there isn't much variation to the noodles and the broth is typically made from POWDER. There's no reason why anyone can't make the same taste.

For Ramen, basically there are just 3 stores that specialize in Ramen: Ajisen, Niwatei, and Kenzo. Most other japanese restaurants, regardless of who's running it, may also serve Ramen.
I have to really disagree here. Not that Chinese can't make good ramen, they obviously could but just think the ajisen here is really bad. The noodles are spaghetti and its just wrong.

Now about what its like in japan, I disagree 150%. There are so many ramen places, yes they are all fast, but quality varies tremendously also (but all still better than what we have in Toronto). There are really exceptional ones and really crappy ones, all of them being just as fast to prepare. And no, most do not use powdered broth in Japan...that would be ridiculous. There are guys who spend their whole lives making ramen, and they guard their secrets closely with the other ramen chefs. Ramen is a huge deal to the Japanese and if there is one thing to know about their culture, its that they obsess over every freakin' detail to make things perfect. The broth, the noodles, the egg, the toppings...lots of care is put into each detail.

And to say that noodles are just noodles....as if they all just pick them up at the supermarket...that is blasphemy! (In japan, not here in Toronto)

[caitlink]

I have to really disagree here. Not that Chinese can't make good ramen, they obviously could but just think the ajisen here is really bad. The noodles are spaghetti and its just wrong.

Now about what its like in japan, I disagree 150%. There are so many ramen places, yes they are all fast, but quality varies tremendously also (but all still better than what we have in Toronto). There are really exceptional ones and really crappy ones, all of them being just as fast to prepare. And no, most do not use powdered broth in Japan...that would be ridiculous. There are guys who spend their whole lives making ramen, and they guard their secrets closely with the other ramen chefs. Ramen is a huge deal to the Japanese and if there is one thing to know about their culture, its that they obsess over every freakin' detail to make things perfect. The broth, the noodles, the egg, the toppings...lots of care is put into each detail.

And to say that noodles are just noodles....as if they all just pick them up at the supermarket...that is blasphemy! (In japan, not here in Toronto)

I totally agree with slowtyper. To say there is no reason why anyone can't make the same taste shows a lack of understanding of cooking. True, making a bowl of ramen is not rocket science. But there is bad ramen (Ajisen or most AYCE), ok Ramen (Niwatei) and ramen where folks do spend hours and hours cooking the broth til it's a milky white stock (for the pork bone version). I would say the version at Niwatei is ok for TO but does not compare to what we've had in Japan. But to say there's no reason why anyone can't make a decent bowl just does not make sense. Maybe that statement is true when it comes to boiling water, boiling an egg or making a cup of instant coffee. But not when it comes to cooking a bowl of ramen.

[slowtyper]

I totally agree with slowtyper. To say there is no reason why anyone can't make the same taste shows a lack of understanding of cooking. True, making a bowl of ramen is not rocket science. But there is bad ramen (Ajisen or most AYCE), ok Ramen (Niwatei) and ramen where folks do spend hours and hours cooking the broth til it's a milky white stock (for the pork bone version). I would say the version at Niwatei is ok for TO but does not compare to what we've had in Japan. But to say there's no reason why anyone can't make a decent bowl just does not make sense. Maybe that statement is true when it comes to boiling water, boiling an egg or making a cup of instant coffee. But not when it comes to cooking a bowl of ramen.

I had to laugh when you said even as easy as "boiling an egg" because getting the egg right is already quite a challenge! In the first issue of the Momofuku magazine (dedicated to ramen) there is a great article on softboiled eggs and what they come out like when they are cooked sous vide at different temperatures. Really cool stuff. In the momofuku cookbook, the chef David Chang says his perfect egg is boiled for 5minutes 10 seconds...

Also to go back to the part of poutine should all be the same....well, technically it should..but why isn't it? Why is the poutine in Toronto so poor? For one, we lack the fresh squeaky cheese curds...but aside from that..I agree that we should have places that have great fries and great gravy and not so fresh cheese curds...I think the reason we don't is because people aren't so obsessed with it and the customers settle for mediocrity so the vendors just serve mediocre food.

Fries seem easy to make but to make them consistently good is tricky. Thats why fries are so crappy most places you go.

[ippon]

I am looking for one that actually comes from Japan.

Like this one:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/index.html

See their overseas locations:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/shoplist/index.html#overseas

but ajisen IS japanese. it's a japanese owned franchise corporation. they have shops set up is many countries.
i do hope that their japanese shops serve up better stuff than they do here. i was shocked when i went to ajisen in north york at their poor quality.
do you have a problem with chinese run joints???
plenty of ramen shops in japan are owned by hakka, and ramen is still considered to be 'chinese' food by the japanese, although it's been claimed and perfected in its current state in japan. ramen is a very interesting dish, actually. most people don't really know or care about it's political backdrop. without the cheap american flour, we would not have the ramen we have today.


I think people need to set their expectations straight. How do you define authentic? Do you want it made by japanese chefs and served by a japanese waitress? Or do you just want it to taste like what's made in Japan? I've tried Ajisen (Chinatown & North York) and Niwatei at J-town. I think the quality does not vary too much. The major difference between Ajisen and Niwatei is that Ajisen is run by chinese, and they are more generous with their toppings. Niwatei feels like a scam with just 2 pieces of meat. I don't feel the price premium they charge justifies having the food prepared and served by real Japanese people. Taste wise, I think they are about the same. I actually think the noodles in Ajisen are better.

Authenticity is a fairly gimmick concept. Ramen is not that difficult to make. You just need the right ingredients. If you go to Japan, watch how Ramen is made. It's really fast. Some places have pre-filled bowls of noodles, and they just add broth to it and then toppings. In that place I tried in Japan, literally they made it under 30 seconds in front of my eyes. It's like poutine. I think people that argue stores in Montreal has better poutine have no case. Poutine is not a "cooking" dish. There's very little room to screw up. Different people will like different gravy. And there isn't much variation to fries. Likewise there isn't much variation to the noodles and the broth is typically made from POWDER. There's no reason why anyone can't make the same taste.

For Ramen, basically there are just 3 stores that specialize in Ramen: Ajisen, Niwatei, and Kenzo. Most other japanese restaurants, regardless of who's running it, may also serve Ramen.

i agree with you on some points, especially what you said about 'autheticity' being a gimmick.
and about the POWDER part,,, if a shop was known to do that in japan, they won't stay open very long. but when i think about it, i don't think it's impossible either. the shops might be just lying about their soup making process. who knows.


I have to really disagree here. Not that Chinese can't make good ramen, they obviously could but just think the ajisen here is really bad. The noodles are spaghetti and its just wrong.

Now about what its like in japan, I disagree 150%. There are so many ramen places, yes they are all fast, but quality varies tremendously also (but all still better than what we have in Toronto). There are really exceptional ones and really crappy ones, all of them being just as fast to prepare. And no, most do not use powdered broth in Japan...that would be ridiculous. There are guys who spend their whole lives making ramen, and they guard their secrets closely with the other ramen chefs. Ramen is a huge deal to the Japanese and if there is one thing to know about their culture, its that they obsess over every freakin' detail to make things perfect. The broth, the noodles, the egg, the toppings...lots of care is put into each detail.

And to say that noodles are just noodles....as if they all just pick them up at the supermarket...that is blasphemy! (In japan, not here in Toronto)

have you seen this? (click cc for subs. tampopo is a must watch for any ramen lover. this ranks as my top 5 best movies of ALL TIME)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4BQnw5WzY8

and this? (not as good as tampopo, but still pretty funny, and informative, stuff about udon)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQUdYSV0NF8

[BananaHunter]

I don't have a problem with chinese made ramen. In fact, I'm completely indifferent about who makes it. It's just that most people perceive chinese made things as inferior and may have an expectation bias just by walking into the restaurant, which results in them rating chinese made food as worse even when it's the same. This is actually my theory on why people think Ajisen is terrible. I don't think it's terrible. I actually think it's marginally better than Niwatei.

Yes I stand firm by the statement that noodles are noodles. It's like french fries and maybe rice. There are different shapes and grades of fries/rice. The only variation is perhaps how long it has stayed in the open air or in the broth, which may affect its texture. Unlike fried noodles, you can't really overcook noodles. The broth machines often have a preset temperature. If you feel a difference in noodle, maybe it's solely because the server took too long to bring it out. Plus, there is no secret engineering to noodles. Noodles of slightly varying quality can be obtained by anyone and made by anyone.

Yes the Japanese care about perfection. But I'm still quite sure a lot of them use powder at some point. It's not unthinkable that they use powder base and then add other ingredients to make it taste different. If you think about the creation process, the broth is often PRE-MADE. They just add noodles to the bowl and pour some broth from the machine. It's not like they hand craft every bowl of broth from scratch. And likewise it's not like they hand make the noodle in front of you for every customer. I know this because I WATCHED them "make" it. It's just like an assembly line. Noodle in bowl --> push button for broth --> add toppings (wait a little for toppings depending on order)--> give to customer.

For these reasons, I seriously think most of the differences in PERCEIVED quality stems from expectation bias. At the end of the day, you're eating noodles in a broth. Just like poutine, there's very little room to screw up. And there's no logical reason why it people outside Japan can't copy it 100%. People are often just really "proud" they went to Japan and will tell their friends Japan's ramen is better to make the trip sound more enticing (nothing wrong with this).

[slowtyper]

I find so many things wrong with what you said, but I'm trying not to be such a jerk online now so I'll just leave it at this to prove my point.

Unlike fried noodles, you can't really overcook noodles.

[ippon]

I find so many things wrong with what you said, but I'm trying not to be such a jerk online now so I'll just leave it at this to prove my point.

ya, he lost me there too...

[Shinobe]

Before I go on ranting, I do want to give another +1 for Kenzo, the food is pretty good if not awesome by my standards, not something you could go have everyday (it gets quite spend-y) but it's a treat every time I get to go.


I don't have a problem with chinese made ramen. In fact, I'm completely indifferent about who makes it. It's just that most people perceive chinese made things as inferior and may have an expectation bias just by walking into the restaurant, which results in them rating chinese made food as worse even when it's the same. This is actually my theory on why people think Ajisen is terrible. I don't think it's terrible. I actually think it's marginally better than Niwatei.

I do try to be completely indifferent about who makes my food at the restaurant because 90% of the time I don't go into the kitchen and go look at who is cooking my food. When my plate arrives, the only thing that matters should be taste. That said, having eaten a great many plates of fried rice in my life, (also being Asian helps) I have my doubts going into an American restaurant to order fried rice, not because a white person 'couldn't possibility' fry up a good plate but naturally you are safe to assume that it may not be what you expect. That said, you could be pleasantly surprised or regrettably disappointed. That isn't to say that an Asian will turn a perfect plate of fry rice every time; that is what you hope for when you step into a Chinese restaurant. No matter how 'politically correct' a person may be, I believe it is very hard to not make any assumption at all. (before tasting the food)

Side note: If I am not mistaken, Kenzo was? ran by a Korean. (I haven't gone back for a while, I honestly don't know if the owner switched hands)

I don't know why other people thinks Ajisen is terrible but I can say my personal experience was pretty terrible. It wasn't because it was ran by a bunch of Chinese, but it was because me and all my friends thought the portions were tiny as sh*t for the price and the soup was super salty and loaded with MSG. Maybe the cook wasn't on the ball that day...I can't honestly speak for him/her but to say it politely I didn't have a good time and we all left hungry.


Yes I stand firm by the statement that noodles are noodles. It's like french fries and maybe rice. There are different shapes and grades of fries/rice. The only variation is perhaps how long it has stayed in the open air or in the broth, which may affect its texture. Unlike fried noodles, you can't really overcook noodles. The broth machines often have a preset temperature. If you feel a difference in noodle, maybe it's solely because the server took too long to bring it out. Plus, there is no secret engineering to noodles. Noodles of slightly varying quality can be obtained by anyone and made by anyone.

Yes the Japanese care about perfection. But I'm still quite sure a lot of them use powder at some point. It's not unthinkable that they use powder base and then add other ingredients to make it taste different. If you think about the creation process, the broth is often PRE-MADE. They just add noodles to the bowl and pour some broth from the machine. It's not like they hand craft every bowl of broth from scratch. And likewise it's not like they hand make the noodle in front of you for every customer. I know this because I WATCHED them "make" it. It's just like an assembly line. Noodle in bowl --> push button for broth --> add toppings (wait a little for toppings depending on order)--> give to customer.

You can honestly tell me that fresh cut fries taste like the crap McDonald pours out by the metric-ton? That instant ramen taste the same as fresh ramen? I really don't honestly believe you think that joe-blow working at a 8.50/hour-generic fast food restaurant can turn the same quality burger as a Michelin stars chef. Yes, its a just bun and a piece of meat but just about a ton of things could makes it from very good to very bad.

I do agree that taste -like beauty- is very much a 'perception' but it really doesn't take a rocket scientist to tell you what taste good and what taste bad. You can tell what was pre-made/re-heated by looking at it. Frankly, my taste buds are too dead to be able to tell what is MSG and what is isn't but that isn't to say most people can't tell the difference. Food isn't as simple as you make it to be, if it was, we wouldn't go out and eat in the first place. There is robot food; aka the frozen section at the market and then there is gourmet. It is called 'culinary arts' for a reason.


For these reasons, I seriously think most of the differences in PERCEIVED quality stems from expectation bias. At the end of the day, you're eating noodles in a broth. Just like poutine, there's very little room to screw up. And there's no logical reason why it people outside Japan can't copy it 100%. People are often just really "proud" they went to Japan and will tell their friends Japan's ramen is better to make the trip sound more enticing (nothing wrong with this).

Yes, perception is always bias, you can't quantify the quality of something by a sheer numeric or letter grade and call it a day but it isn't as simple as putting noodle in broth. There are a ton of places one could screw up. MSG soup, over boiled noodles, cheap / old toppings. Like you said, it isn't impossible to make carbon clone of a dish but to make something very good takestime and effort. It isn't so much about having something at the place of origin; most people feel that it IS better because of the setting and it is very much gloating about an experience but people know when they are getting a raw deal when they taste one.

[ippon]

Side note: If I am not mistaken, Kenzo was? ran by a Korean. (I haven't gone back for a while, I honestly don't know if the owner switched hands)


the family that started it in north york is zainichi, ethnic koreans with landed status in japan. i'm not sure if they are still at that location though, since opening more locations. they actually speak japanese amongst eachother. for the most part, the zainichi are much more like japanese than korean, in their palate and behaviour. it is absolutely amazing to me that there are 4th and 5th generation ethnic koreans in japan who refuse to naturalize.



I don't know why other people thinks Ajisen is terrible but I can say my personal experience was pretty terrible. It wasn't because it was ran by a bunch of Chinese, but it was because me and all my friends thought the portions were tiny as sh*t for the price and the soup was super salty and loaded with MSG. Maybe the cook wasn't on the ball that day...I can't honestly speak for him/her but to say it politely I didn't have a good time and we all left hungry.


the noodles at ajisen were terrible, the broth less so, i thought. my guess is that their broth is corporate powder or concentrate stuff and noodles are supplied locally from a chinese noodle factory.




You can honestly tell me that fresh cut fries taste like the crap McDonald pours out by the metric-ton? That instant ramen taste the same as fresh ramen? I really don't honestly believe you think that joe-blow working at a 8.50/hour-generic fast food restaurant can turn the same quality burger as a Michelin stars chef. Yes, its a just bun and a piece of meat but just about a ton of things could makes it from very good to very bad.


personally i think mcd's fries are very good and the benchmark for shoestring fries. well, was the benchmark before the oil change. beef tallow FTW!
and i think it's very possible for a line cook to make the same quality burger as a michelin star chef. it just depends on who obsesses over it more and the quality of ingredients. a michelin star chef knows that he/she can charge premium dollars for the creation, so would use high quality ingredients, whereas a line cook knows that charging $20-$30 for a burger at a diner ain't gonna fly. i do not think it was a good subjective comparison.

[caitlink]

Being chinese, I don't think Ajisen is bad because it's Chinese owned. I think it's bad because like others have said, portions are small compared to the price.
I have been to Kenzo and Niwatei and think I did get good value. I was full from the bowl of ramen that I got from Niwatei. Not a lot of meat. But there was plenty of noodle.
I think a lot of us are saying the ramens we ate in Japan are better because that is the truth. Not to brag. But because we are speaking from experience and based on facts.

Once again, to say that anyone can make ramen taste the same is just plain wrong. And disrespectful to folks who spend their lives perfecting this. In Japan and other countries, some folks specialize in a 'signature dish' and are working hard to keep the craft going. Whether it be ramen, won ton noodle, congee, freshly made noodle, etc.

to say anyone can make pizza would probably piss off a lot of folks in Italy as well.

[Shinobe]

to say anyone can make pizza would probably piss off a lot of folks in Italy as well.

Pretty much.

Gonna grab a odd quote from Ratatouille (which is sorta/kinda/not really on topic of this thread :P):


Gusteau: ...you must not let anyone define your limits because of where you come from. Your only limit is your soul. What I say is true - anyone can cook... but only the fearless can be great.

To backup my previous opinion on Ajisen, I went more then an eternity ago...when the FIRST Ajisen opened near T&T on Warden & Steeles, I have no idea if they've improved at all over the years but it is safe to say portions at Ajisen the world over is pretty small. Just enough in most case, you're better off with side dishes unless you eat like a mouse.

I have been to ones in Hong Kong and the one near China town in Toronto, they seem to fair a lot better then my very first experience but again, if given a choice I prefer Kenzo for the authenticity.

[windforcexx28]

I have been to ones in Hong Kong and the one near China town in Toronto, they seem to fair a lot better then my very first experience but again, if given a choice I prefer Kenzo for the authenticity.

I recall the portion sizes of Ajisen in HK being larger than the portions served at the Warden/Steeles location. Haven't tried the other locations in Toronto, but I'm definitely not going back to the Warden/Steeles location. It was both smaller and inferior than the HK equivalent.

[ihacki]

Having had Ajisen in California with satisfactory result, so I've returned the Markham store with the same expectations... Instead of curly ramen, I've found uncooked thin spaghetti in my bowl. Someone please post the contact info for their headquarters. They shouldn't allow franchise to be run like this. Sadly, a pack of quality instant noodles are better than what they had served in Ajisen of Canada...

Boy, I miss this:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/

[slowtyper]

to say anyone can make pizza would probably piss off a lot of folks in Italy as well.
Not to mention the whole "you can't overcook noodles" thing would really set the italians off!

But really you can't flame him too much. There are many people out there who will never appreciate how much variation there really is a single item, for example a noodle, and how much work it can be to find the right ratio of ingredients to give the right texture and taste and strength etc and how to alter it due to weather, season, other external factors, etc. I mean to many people food just isn't that important and I guess they are right...there are a lot more important things in the world to worry about. I guess to me it would be better if they understood but didn't care rather than just being ignorant and thinking everything comes from a supermarket shelf.

[Shinobe]

Boy, I miss this:
http://www.santouka.co.jp/en/

Didn't realize Hokkaido Ramen|Santouka was such a huge franchise. I was just there last week, there is one near me in HK!

[felixdd]

Jyuban was disappointing. I ordered the Tonkatsu and the broth was really light, and the noodles were not al dente, it was mushy. I'm not sure if the ink noodles was supposed to be super mushy or not, because this was my first time trying it. But it was like pasta that was cooked for way too long.

Although not a true ramen shop, but more of a izakaya, I prefer Ematei in downtown Toronto for their tonkatsu.

I actually liked Jyuban a lot. I ordered their Tonkotsu a while ago.

Admittedly their noodles are a bit weak, but I think the quality of their broth more than makes up for it. It's not heavily seasoned with salt/MSG like the other chains, and you can tell from the flavor that it's actually genuinely braised from true ingredients -- you can taste the creaminess that only comes with prolonged boiling of the bone.

Same with their spicy version -- you can tell they actually cook the pepper into the broth. The resultant spice is a warm, lingering heat more than the intense sear that you get from adding spicy oil/sauce after-the-fact.

Comparing to Kenzo (and I live near the branch on Steeles and Yonge), I would choose Jyuban. Kenzo is good...but too salty for my taste.

[Superhucard]

Didn't realize Hokkaido Ramen|Santouka was such a huge franchise. I was just there last week, there is one near me in HK!

You were in HK last week?

[Superhucard]

A lot of misconceptions here:

1. Ramen was invented in China. So I specifically asked for "Japanese" Ramen.

2. Ajisen sold a license to that chinese guy to use its name in Canada, China and whatever. It is not a franchise and they don't get cooking directions and help from Ajisen Japan.

3. Authentic, I mean, same or about the same quality ramen as seen in Japan.

4. About who cook the ramen, I know another authentic ramen place in Vancouver, Benkei Ramen.
http://www.benkeiramen.com/home.html

I once saw a white guy in the kitchen, cooking ramen. I don't care as long as the taste is authentic.

[slowtyper]

The ramen craze is hitting HK hard now.

If you want ramen as good as you can find in Japan, you will not find it in Toronto guaranteed. Not yet anyways.

I guess the closest you can do is go to NYC. Ippudo is there and is a huge ramen chain from Japan and their food is actually good. Also a few other good ramen places in NYC as well which aren't huge chains.

[Shinobe]

The ramen craze is hitting HK hard now.

If you want ramen as good as you can find in Japan, you will not find it in Toronto guaranteed. Not yet anyways.

I guess the closest you can do is go to NYC. Ippudo is there and is a huge ramen chain from Japan and their food is actually good. Also a few other good ramen places in NYC as well which aren't huge chains.

Any chain to recommend in HK?


You were in HK last week?

Still in HK, going to be here for 2-3 more weeks.

[slowtyper]

Any chain to recommend in HK?



Still in HK, going to be here for 2-3 more weeks.

I didn't try any in HK. I was kind of ramen'ed out since right before HK i had a mini 3 day trip to Japan where I stuffed as much ramen down my throat as possible. Now I kind of regret not trying one or two....

I know there is IPPUDO, which is a big chain (and is GOOD) which is the same as the NYC one. Def'n should check that out. However usually I try to avoid chains and try to find better independent versions. I would check out openrice and try to find some good ramen restaurants there.

And besides openrice just google...as I said there is a ramen craze so there are lots of articles /reviews out there. Just googled and found this one that looks good, but I wouldn't line up like crazy for it....

http://www.cnngo.com/hong-kong/eat/hong-kong-hottest-hole-wall-ramen-shop-974723


article from same site about ippudo in HK: http://www.cnngo.com/hong-kong/eat/ramen-king-visits-hong-kong-ramen-limitless-384196

[Superhucard]

Still in HK, going to be here for 2-3 more weeks.

Good for you! You will be in HK for one month? Just vacationing?



Ippudo Japan
http://www.ippudo.com/store/

Hong Kong site:
http://www.ippudo.com.hk/en/

[rvs007]

Dine-in restaurants would have to be Niwatei at J town. Place is packed on weekends right now since they just did a groupon deal this month.+1... I've been to Niwatei many times since it opened and their ramen has been consistently great. I love the pork ramen (tonkotsu) there and the ramen is cooked perfectly every time. And their recent Groupon deal of $20 for $10 makes it even better!

http://niwatei.com/

[slowtyper]

+1... I've been to Niwatei many times since it opened and their ramen has been consistently great. I love the pork ramen (tonkotsu) there and the ramen is cooked perfectly every time. And their recent Groupon deal of $20 for $10 makes it even better!

http://niwatei.com/
ouch I wish I still looked at groupon deals, would have picked some up. I found Niwatei's broth too weak and their egg was severely overcooked (thats just the way they do it I guess).

But if I felt like ramen I would go to kenzo or niwatei.

[Xeros]

So which place in Toronto has the pork broth that's milky white? I've tried Kenzo, Aijisen, JyuBan and so far nothing's close to the ramen I like that I had in Tokyo.

[rvs007]

I found Niwatei's broth too weak and their egg was severely overcooked (thats just the way they do it I guess).

But if I felt like ramen I would go to kenzo or niwatei.I was there last weekend and the broth was tasty and the egg is perfect (a touch undercooked in the centre, which is the way I like it).


So which place in Toronto has the pork broth that's milky white? I've tried Kenzo, Aijisen, JyuBan and so far nothing's close to the ramen I like that I had in Tokyo.
Highly recommend trying Niwatei. Their pork ramen is milky white and very tasty.