Entitlement Culture In Quebec

[Hitman21]

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/04/26/montreal-police-and-protesters-rage-through-the-night-as-tuition-march-turns-violent/

www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/commentary/gwyn-morgan/breaking-the-entitlement-addiction/article2387833/print/

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/03/07/quebec-students-strike-now-pay-later

Quebec has a massive entitlement culture, the students pay the lowest tuition compared to the other provinces yet still riot over an extra $325/year tuition increase, the average tuition in Quebec is $2159 compared to $6640 for Ontario. There are massive public sector unions in Quebec who help drive up debt along with the students. Quebec has the largest amount of debt of all the provinces and requires wealth transfer payments.

Its time that the government take a hard stand against Quebec and stop bailing them out and let them the fix the mess themselves otherwise they could have a massive impact on Canada's debt

Do you agree?

[Saibot]

we let quebec become too independent.

theyre like a nation within a nation. own immigration criteria, own education, health, own income tax

if anything we should either cut them off entirely; or remove their privledges.

[manmanny]

When is the !@#$ vote for its separation? Lets get rid of this mess at last.
Government gives them so much but they are never satisfied.
Almost all the prices are cheap in that province compare to Ontario and they still want more from government.

[Hitman21]

we let quebec become too independent.

theyre like a nation within a nation. own immigration criteria, own education, health, own income tax

if anything we should either cut them off entirely; or remove their privledges.

Agreed. Let them separate and pay back the debt they owe or remove this ridiculous spending

[KDSet]

Yes, Canada should be decentralized/devolved even further by ending equalization payments.

[flashy_mcflash]

Quebec has a massive entitlement culture, the students pay the lowest tuition compared to the other provinces yet still riot over an extra $325/year tuition increase, the average tuition in Quebec is $2159 compared to $6640 for Ontario.

Interesting that you bring this point up when you cannot shut up about how you're being taxed to death here in Ontario when Ontario pays less in taxes than any other province but Nunavut.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/fq/txrts-eng.html

[Hitman21]

Yes, Canada should be decentralized/devolved even further by ending equalization payments.

These payments help set up this culture because the province knows that they can get a bailout

[Piro21]

If Hitman put as much effort into a job as he put into Fox-Newsing this forum he would actually be doing pretty well by now. I wonder why he keeps it up.

[gilboman]

It's not just quebec, it's everybody. Just look at the Feds. Mackay with his F-35 toys and think its ok to lie and use military choppers as his personal taxi for fishing. Minister Bev Oda who thinks 4* hotel where all the delegates are staying and conference is at is beneath her and goes to a 5* royalty/celebrity hotel and orders a limo to take her to original hotel.

So young adults/students wanting subsidized tuition isn't any worst and I think better than wanting billion dollar jets for toys and 5* royalty treatment for the conservatives in ottawa.

[zonetbh]

My wife and I go to Montreal once a year as a mini vacation and to visit some friends and we were just there last weekend. Every year we go, some protest is happening. We were just there last weekend and we got in the street our hotel was on was shut down because of these greedy students who think everyone should pay for their art degrees. It needs to change. I personally don't understand why we didn't encourage them to bugger off and be their own country when they last tried to. How much money did we (the rest of Canada) give Quebec in 2011? 800 million or something?

Montreal is a fun place to visit but outside of that the province can go **** itself.

[Hitman21]

It's not just quebec, it's everybody. Just look at the Feds. Mackay with his F-35 toys and think its ok to lie and use military choppers as his personal taxi for fishing. Minister Bev Oda who thinks 4* hotel where all the delegates are staying and conference is at is beneath her and goes to a 5* royalty/celebrity hotel and orders a limo to take her to original hotel.

So young adults/students wanting subsidized tuition isn't any worst and I think better than wanting billion dollar jets for toys and 5* royalty treatment for the conservatives in ottawa.

It is everyone and I agree with you on that but if you look at Quebec its much more rampant there though compared to the other provinces and Mckay/Oda have nothing to do with this start a new thread if you want to discuss them

[KDSet]

My wife and I go to Montreal once a year as a mini vacation and to visit some friends and we were just there last weekend. Every year we go, some protest is happening. We were just there last weekend and we got in the street our hotel was on was shut down because of these greedy students who think everyone should pay for their art degrees. It needs to change. I personally don't understand why we didn't encourage them to bugger off and be their own country when they last tried to. How much money did we (the rest of Canada) give Quebec in 2011? 800 million or something?

Montreal is a fun place to visit but outside of that the province can go **** itself.

It's more to do with the government reneging on the pay-it-forward scheme of low tuition and correspondingly much higher taxes later on.

[Hitman21]

My wife and I go to Montreal once a year as a mini vacation and to visit some friends and we were just there last weekend. Every year we go, some protest is happening. We were just there last weekend and we got in the street our hotel was on was shut down because of these greedy students who think everyone should pay for their art degrees. It needs to change. I personally don't understand why we didn't encourage them to bugger off and be their own country when they last tried to. How much money did we (the rest of Canada) give Quebec in 2011? 800 million or something?

Montreal is a fun place to visit but outside of that the province can go **** itself.

Agreed, They have spent too much money and they are getting more greedy, the federal government must stop all this nonsense and shut them down

[kenze]

we let quebec become too independent.

theyre like a nation within a nation. own immigration criteria, own education, health, own income tax

if anything we should either cut them off entirely; or remove their privledges.

if you can recall 1995, the rest of Canada (especially Ontario) came here with signs marching on our streets and crying for us to stay in Canada.

Bunch of crybabies like you seem to forget that we contribute to a huge part of the canadian economy and culture. I'd like to see Quebec seperate for just a short time. It would be amusing for us, not you.

Just face it, as hard as it is for you to accept. Canada depends on Quebec.

[Hitman21]

if you can recall 1995, the rest of Canada (especially Ontario) came here with signs marching on our streets and crying for us to stay in Canada.

Bunch of crybabies like you seem to forget that we contribute to a huge part of the canadian economy and culture. I'd like to see Quebec seperate for just a short time. It would be amusing for us, not you.

Just face it, as hard as it is for you to accept. Canada depends on Quebec.

Quebec couldn't sustain itself without the support of the rest of Canada especially considering the fact that they have the highest debt and rely on transfer payments

[r1lee]

if you can recall 1995, the rest of Canada (especially Ontario) came here with signs marching on our streets and crying for us to stay in Canada.

Bunch of crybabies like you seem to forget that we contribute to a huge part of the canadian economy and culture. I'd like to see Quebec seperate for just a short time. It would be amusing for us, not you.

Just face it, as hard as it is for you to accept. Canada depends on Quebec.

Quebec will receive ~$8B in transfer payments next year. Quebec has been the largest recipient of transfer payments since???

Company's left Quebec because of the potential of Quebec Seperating
Quebec "wanted" to use the Canadian dollar even after seperating?

Help me out.. we need Quebec? lol

[kenze]

Quebec couldn't sustain itself without the support of the rest of Canada especially considering the fact that they have the highest debt and rely on transfer payments

Really? Last time I checked we had an abundance of natural resources that will allow us to rake in billions in the near future.

Don't be too worried about our debt.

[uweschiffke]

When Quebec separates from the rest of Canada, it will become the first 3rd World Nation with snow.

[kenze]

Quebec will receive ~$8B in transfer payments next year. Quebec has been the largest recipient of transfer payments since???

Company's left Quebec because of the potential of Quebec Seperating
Quebec "wanted" to use the Canadian dollar even after seperating?

Help me out.. we need Quebec? lol

If you didn't need us then every single political party wouldn't be saying that a Canada without Quebec is impossible to think about.

Ask yourself this. Do you really think that you have all the facts by just reading your local newspaper? Do you really believe that Canada runs a charity and lets "rogue" provinces exist in its border for nothing? Quebec exists in its current form because we indeed benefit you more than you could know and imagine.

[Coz4k]

When Quebec separates from the rest of Canada, it will become the first 3rd World Nation with snow.

I'm from Quebec City and i totally agree with this.

Our province is supporting far-left policies and programs based on 1960-1970's economic growth. As soon as interest rates will jump, Quebec will be the new Greece.
Almost every political decision made in QC makes no economic sense and is strictly politic.
If our system at more than 40% unionization would work i believe we would have noticed.

Yes we have resources. We are just too stupid to exploit them efficiently. Just as our electricity that we are selling for the average cost while we should sell it for the marginal cost and make more profit exporting it to north east USA instead of feeding useless industries like Rio Tinto Alcan that is purchasing our electricity for less than the AVERAGE cost !

Not even talking about the North Plan that will empty our province of its resources since we will be simply exporting raw material to other countries like a third world nation. At the margin, raw material value comes to 0. Lower you are in the value chain the less money you makes and in this case we are close to 0.

In short, QC is a joke from an economic angle.

[aviador]

The sources of wealth turns and people change.

Breaking apart Canada over a temporary pitiful wealth transfer is a nonsensical proposition. As it is the independentist movement based on a different culture, French Canadians are as canadians as any (anglo) English speaking Canadians. Quebecois are even more americanized than people in other provinces. The "different culture roots and language" argument is BS. It's just an argument used to empower local mafias and cronies.

Today QC receives federal funds, but given the enormous mineral and oil potential of QC, perhaps in the future the rest of Canada will be receiving QC wealth. Take for example the desert countries in minor Asia and north Afrika, or not too far Alberta. The so-called "bad lands" is gonna be a source of federal wealth for decades, nevertheless Alberta might have been considered before a "barren" province leaching federal wealth.

Get over it. The culture of entitlement can change and will change, not from night to day but gradually.

The students strike in Qc is because it's the first time they face a big tuition hike, not because they feel entitled to free or cheap education -- which should be and can be a plausible goal, take for example, Germany and France.

[aviador]

When Quebec separates from the rest of Canada, it will become the first 3rd World Nation with snow.

+1

[paradigmGT3]

If you didn't need us then every single political party wouldn't be saying that a Canada without Quebec is impossible to think about.

Ask yourself this. Do you really think that you have all the facts by just reading your local newspaper? Do you really believe that Canada runs a charity and lets "rogue" provinces exist in its border for nothing? Quebec exists in its current form because we indeed benefit you more than you could know and imagine.

Of course politicians have to say that crap, just so they can get the quebec vote. Do you really think the rest of Canada really sees any benefit from having quebec around? other than bagels, they can seperate and go sink into the atlantic for all I care.

What exactly is the rest of canada benefitting from that I am not able to know about or imagine?

Quebec is a welfare state - time to be treated equally. Raise Tuitions to $8000+/year, cut-off all the rest of the subsidies and be forced to either work or die.

[olssy]

Students are right to strike, education should be free for everyone if you get passing grades, from daycare all the way to post-doctorate levels. Study after study shows that the more education you get the higher pay you receive and the more taxes you end up paying. Removing all economic barriers to education ends up making more money in the long run and gives the bonus of having a highly educated population with all the advantages that brings.

[Mysticdragon]

Study after study shows that the more education you get the higher pay you receive .

I think this used to be the case... but thinking like this today can be dangerous.

There are students with Masters degrees that are working low end jobs because there are no high paying jobs to be had.
I was reading a story from the US the other day about 2 Ivy league grads with masters degrees, one is unemployed and the other is a janitor.


I don't really think that the amount of positions that require a higher education are increasing as fast as the amount of grads we are churning out.

College/University grads today seem to think that just having a B.A in whatever entitles them to an 80k job right away.

People seem to think if you just get a degree that its your magic ticket to wealth.

Do you really think that 2600$ for tuition is enough to pay the professors salary, administration staff, maintenance staff, site maintenance, supplies, utilities, equipment, etc... no.. it's not. Tuition should increase with inflation.
And many argue "Well these profs and admin staff are being paid to much"
Perhaps they are.. but aren't you going to school so that you can enter this same workforce and perhaps get a similar job for that same pay?

I'm not saying that tuition should be like 10k or anything, but I do think it needs to be bumped up. (In Quebec)
I came from a poor background with nothing saved for University and I was able to get through it just fine. I did my research and picked a field that I liked and that was in demand.

Don't go to school for something like art history, philosophy, history, woman's studies etc, get 30k in debt, never advance past a B.A and then complain about the lack of jobs.

This is just my opinion though.

[gilboman]

Really? Last time I checked we had an abundance of natural resources that will allow us to rake in billions in the near future.

Don't be too worried about our debt.

mafia and corruption are not considered natural resources.

[kenze]

mafia and corruption are not considered natural resources.

Minerals, forestry and electricity are.

[Hitman21]

Really? Last time I checked we had an abundance of natural resources that will allow us to rake in billions in the near future.

Don't be too worried about our debt.

Lets just say that Quebec rakes in "Billions" that money will be gone with all the spending to public sector unions, corruption, students, welfare and many other programs. Quebec would be in much worse shape if there was no support from the other provinces

[anyasok]

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/04...turns-violent/

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...2387833/print/

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/03/07...-now-pay-later

Quebec has a massive entitlement culture, the students pay the lowest tuition compared to the other provinces yet still riot over an extra $325/year tuition increase, the average tuition in Quebec is $2159 compared to $6640 for Ontario. There are massive public sector unions in Quebec who help drive up debt along with the students. Quebec has the largest amount of debt of all the provinces and requires wealth transfer payments.

Its time that the government take a hard stand against Quebec and stop bailing them out and let them the fix the mess themselves otherwise they could have a massive impact on Canada's debt

Do you agree?
No I disagree. They have every right to protest. The only people entitled are the govenrment who think they can keep raising it all they want without justification.

As I said in the other post about this, student tuition should be eliminated completely, government sponsored or not.

[manmanny]

I think this used to be the case... but thinking like this today can be dangerous.

...

College/University grads today seem to think that just having a B.A in whatever entitles them to an 80k job right away.

People seem to think if you just get a degree that its your magic ticket to wealth.

Do you really think that 2600$ for tuition is enough to pay the professors salary, administration staff, maintenance staff, site maintenance, supplies, utilities, equipment, etc... no.. it's not. Tuition should increase with inflation.


This is just my opinion though.

At least some students on RFD think they can get 80K job right away.
Reality is different.

[manmanny]

Quebec will receive ~$8B in transfer payments next year. Quebec has been the largest recipient of transfer payments since???

Company's left Quebec because of the potential of Quebec Seperating
Quebec "wanted" to use the Canadian dollar even after seperating?

Help me out.. we need Quebec? lol

Good Question.

[Hitman21]

Students are right to strike, education should be free for everyone if you get passing grades, from daycare all the way to post-doctorate levels. Study after study shows that the more education you get the higher pay you receive and the more taxes you end up paying. Removing all economic barriers to education ends up making more money in the long run and gives the bonus of having a highly educated population with all the advantages that brings.

Education should not be free, its already rife with abuse right now and people getting more useless degrees, it would only get worse if it was free and who do you think pays for it.

[Syne]

Education should not be free, its already rife with abuse right now and people getting more useless degrees, it would only get worse if it was free and who do you think pays for it.

Education should be free. It's one of the long-term goals set out by Canada, the UN and most 1st world nations.

It's one thing to be realistic and talk about austerity in tough economic times. It's completely another when your philosophy and endgame is completely anti-social and you lose sight of the bigger picture. You strike me as a very sad man, Hitman.

[Hitman21]

Education should be free. It's one of the long-term goals set out by Canada, the UN and most 1st world nations.

It's one thing to be realistic and talk about austerity in tough economic times. It's completely another when your philosophy and endgame is completely anti-social and you lose sight of the bigger picture. You strike me as a very sad man, Hitman.

Education should not be free, who do you think will pay for it, its unsustainable and will increase the debt problems. The UN doesn't really matter, time and time again has shown that they are very corrupt just look at what they did to Canada with the UN security council seat

We are in tough economic times though, Ontario will end up like Greece unless they change their habits

[manmanny]

Education should not be free, who do you think will pay for it, its unsustainable and will increase the debt problems. The UN doesn't really matter, time and time again has shown that they are very corrupt just look at what they did to Canada with the UN security council seat

We are in tough economic times though, Ontario will end up like Greece unless they change their habits

On RFD asking something for Free is the Norm. People who want free stuff also want boomers to die. So who the hell is going to pay for this. Its Toronto Norm to ask Free stuff. Free Child care, Free Healthcare, Free education and on and on. But we dont want to pay for anything right?

[Hitman21]

On RFD asking something for Free is the Norm. People who want free stuff also want boomers to die. So who the hell is going to pay for this. Its Toronto Norm to ask Free stuff. Free Child care, Free Healthcare, Free education and on and on. But we dont want to pay for anything right?

Yes, Manmanny you are totally right on this. People want everything for free but they don't want to pay for it they want someone else to pay for it

[KDSet]

The UN doesn't really matter, time and time again has shown that they are very corrupt just look at what they did to Canada with the UN security council seat

What now, you believe Canada was entitled to that UN seat? ;)

[the_fm]

Education should be free. It's one of the long-term goals set out by Canada, the UN and most 1st world nations.

It's one thing to be realistic and talk about austerity in tough economic times. It's completely another when your philosophy and endgame is completely anti-social and you lose sight of the bigger picture. You strike me as a very sad man, Hitman.

eventually, it should be free but right now, it's not viable. the system needs to be fix first and then, introducing free education will make sense. students don't really think about that right now. all they want is free this, free that as the rest of the population. what they should really do is fix this, fix that before asking for free stuff

[Hitman21]

What now, you believe Canada was entitled to that UN seat? ;)

No, I never said that, I said they got screwed out of that seat by the UN because the 60 member arab voting bloc voted against Canada and for Portugal because of Canada's foreign policy

[olssy]

I think this used to be the case... but thinking like this today can be dangerous.

There are students with Masters degrees that are working low end jobs because there are no high paying jobs to be had.
I was reading a story from the US the other day about 2 Ivy league grads with masters degrees, one is unemployed and the other is a janitor.


I don't really think that the amount of positions that require a higher education are increasing as fast as the amount of grads we are churning out.

College/University grads today seem to think that just having a B.A in whatever entitles them to an 80k job right away.

People seem to think if you just get a degree that its your magic ticket to wealth.

Do you really think that 2600$ for tuition is enough to pay the professors salary, administration staff, maintenance staff, site maintenance, supplies, utilities, equipment, etc... no.. it's not. Tuition should increase with inflation.
And many argue "Well these profs and admin staff are being paid to much"
Perhaps they are.. but aren't you going to school so that you can enter this same workforce and perhaps get a similar job for that same pay?

I'm not saying that tuition should be like 10k or anything, but I do think it needs to be bumped up. (In Quebec)
I came from a poor background with nothing saved for University and I was able to get through it just fine. I did my research and picked a field that I liked and that was in demand.

Don't go to school for something like art history, philosophy, history, woman's studies etc, get 30k in debt, never advance past a B.A and then complain about the lack of jobs.

This is just my opinion though.

I've also heard the stories about people with doctorates and masters not being able to get good jobs, often because they are over qualified and would cost the employer more. But this is anecdotal evidence and is not comparable to real statistics. I'm not going to cut and paste tons of excerpts but a quick google search shows that an enormous amount of studies and all seem to indicate a direct correlation between education and salary/employment, some statistics seem to suggest Doctorates are a bit less employable than Masters but still earn more.

What's a cool side effect of education is the more people you educate the more people you have with new ideas that in turn create employment for the other highly educated people.

And a degree almost is a magic ticket to wealth if that's what you're after. Of course a fine arts degree doesn't get you far in the job market, I speak from experience. But a computer science degree got me an 80k job even before I even finished my degree, if you study in a high paying field with a large demand for workers you will land yourself a high paying job.

I am for abolishing tuition for Quebec residents who can pass their courses and on top of that I firmly believe we should start investing a lot more in education as like you said, we need to pay the teachers and all the infrastructure.

I got to say congrats for finishing school even though you came from a poor background, I was lucky enough to not have to worry about money during my school years, that said I did live poorly during them. In my opinion probably 95% of the population can pay there way through university even from poor backgrounds(or middle class backgrounds as they do not get as many grants), we'd probably lose about 5% after the 75% tuition increase as enrollment always drops with tuition increases but putting it free would level the playing field for everyone and we could have 100% of people that wanted higher education receiving it if it was free. You never know, the next Einstein could be in that 5%.

[anyasok]

Education should not be free, who do you think will pay for it, its unsustainable and will increase the debt problems. The UN doesn't really matter, time and time again has shown that they are very corrupt just look at what they did to Canada with the UN security council seat

We are in tough economic times though, Ontario will end up like Greece unless they change their habits
Education should be free. Any alternative and we'll be stuck in the nightmare we're stuck in right now.

[r1lee]

currently education is not free. We pay through our taxes for it.

Post Secondary is heavily subsidized by the government (which we pay) and majority pay on top of it.

I'm ok with the idea of subsidizing our Post Secondary completely to a certain degree, but there would have to be some serious amount of rules to be put in place.

1. I wouldn't want every harry ***** and jane to be going to school for their "arts" degree. Higher Education for all doesn't mean we have a more intelligent work force.

2. After graduation, they must work in Canada X amount of years. If they do not, they must repay the real cost of school, completely, no subsidizing included.

3. No loopholes of getting out of it.

[r1lee]

Education should be free. Any alternative and we'll be stuck in the nightmare we're stuck in right now.

what Nightmare are you talking about, i'm curious.

[manixc]

Were there a tuition freeze in Quebec before?

I remember way back in my first or second year that BC universities removed the freeze and the tuition increased very quickly for those few years. IIRC, my first year was about $2500 for the whole year and by the time I finished it was almost $5000.

[manixc]

currently education is not free. We pay through our taxes for it.

Post Secondary is heavily subsidized by the government (which we pay) and majority pay on top of it.

I'm ok with the idea of subsidizing our Post Secondary completely to a certain degree, but there would have to be some serious amount of rules to be put in place.

1. I wouldn't want every harry ***** and jane to be going to school for their "arts" degree. Higher Education for all doesn't mean we have a more intelligent work force.

2. After graduation, they must work in Canada X amount of years. If they do not, they must repay the real cost of school, completely, no subsidizing included.

3. No loopholes of getting out of it.

2 and 3 will be hard to enforced. There are tons of people who moved back to the motherland shortly after graduating.

[manmanny]

Can anybody list countries with Free University education. Is Finland, South Korea, Taiwan, Norway, Denmark on that list?

[Hitman21]

currently education is not free. We pay through our taxes for it.

Post Secondary is heavily subsidized by the government (which we pay) and majority pay on top of it.

I'm ok with the idea of subsidizing our Post Secondary completely to a certain degree, but there would have to be some serious amount of rules to be put in place.

1. I wouldn't want every harry ***** and jane to be going to school for their "arts" degree. Higher Education for all doesn't mean we have a more intelligent work force.

2. After graduation, they must work in Canada X amount of years. If they do not, they must repay the real cost of school, completely, no subsidizing included.

3. No loopholes of getting out of it.

Agreed, many of these arts degrees are totally useless and many students are abusing OSAP and the whole system.

I agree with 2 as well in order to prevent abuse

[flashy_mcflash]

What is your degree in, Hitman? Curious what you studied in university.

[the_fm]

Were there a tuition freeze in Quebec before?

yes, there was a freeze for like a decade or so

[Mysticdragon]

I got to say congrats for finishing school even though you came from a poor background, I was lucky enough to not have to worry about money during my school years, that said I did live poorly during them. In my opinion probably 95% of the population can pay there way through university even from poor backgrounds(or middle class backgrounds as they do not get as many grants), we'd probably lose about 5% after the 75% tuition increase as enrollment always drops with tuition increases but putting it free would level the playing field for everyone and we could have 100% of people that wanted higher education receiving it if it was free. You never know, the next Einstein could be in that 5%.

Thanks.

You bring up many good points, and I don't think i'm against free education sometime in the future.
I think I would be worried about the "professional student". Someone who just keeps going to school taking this degree and that program. Free education is a good idea but there should be restrictions.

Maybe a good idea would be free (or lower cost) education for people who go into fields that are in need of more skilled workers, on the assumption that you pass your classes.
Or if there is a shortage of employable people for job A in location B, perhaps education grants or lower costs for people who agree to work in location B for X years would be a good idea?

Or perhaps something like how my employer does it. I can take any certification test I want (currently studying for my CCNA) and my employer will pay for it, if I pass. Same if I want to take a course related to my work. I pay the bill, and if I pass they reimburse me. This way we're not paying for the drop outs or the "forever students" lol

[manmanny]

yes, there was a freeze for like a decade or so

So basically Rest of Canada was paying for this? They never realized the free/Freeze now is Not free but deferred for future? Somewhere and somebody has to pay for the actual costs. And what they do burn some more. Typical European attitude.

[KDSet]

No, I never said that, I said they got screwed out of that seat by the UN because the 60 member arab voting bloc voted against Canada and for Portugal because of Canada's foreign policy

Screwed out of because of such and such? Yeah, you not only have an entitlement problem but are a sore loser as well.

[Hitman21]

Screwed out of because of such and such? Yeah, you not only have an entitlement problem but are a sore loser as well.

I said earlier that because Canada was pro-Israel the 60 members in the UN voted against Canada

[Syne]

eventually, it should be free but right now, it's not viable.

I get that and clearly you get that.

.. but isn't it funny that Hitman completely ignored that education ideally should be free? It's little things that like that make me feel sad for humanity; that there are people so completely up their own ***** , that they've discarded idealism to the point where they won't even let themselves think on those terms.


the system needs to be fix first and then, introducing free education will make sense. students don't really think about that right now. all they want is free this, free that as the rest of the population. what they should really do is fix this, fix that before asking for free stuff

I agree, and we need a populist movement, not individual private interests to fix these things and push forward.

[gilboman]

Education should be free. Any alternative and we'll be stuck in the nightmare we're stuck in right now.

We are one of the if not most educated generations and countries in the world already. We have so many post secondary grads doing menial work and qualified immigrants driving taxis. More education won't do anything. we are educated enough and it's attainable enough. Not everybody should be given subsidies for education. Too much is being used to support post secondary education that are useless.

We need a quota system so that only certain majors/degrees are subsidized or subsidized more. E.g., more subsidies for medical, nursing, trades, commerce, engineering and other professional programs and none/less for general arts degrees like travel and tourism or marketing :facepalm:

[the_fm]

So basically Rest of Canada was paying for this? They never realized the free/Freeze now is Not free but deferred for future? Somewhere and somebody has to pay for the actual costs. And what they do burn some more. Typical European attitude.

in a certain way, i guess so. and foreign students are definitely paying for this yet, we don't hear them complaining

[Syne]

What is your degree in, Hitman? Curious what you studied in university.

+1

What's your degree in, Hitman?

[Mysticdragon]

E.g., more subsidies for medical, nursing, trades, commerce, engineering and other professional programs and none/less for general arts degrees like marketing :facepalm:

well you could argue that a lot of skill goes into marketing. I've never taken a marketing class in school but I've taken classes that talk about the background behind marketing and there can be a lot of psychological and sociological ideas/skills/principles required to be really good at marketing.

edit: I guess my point was marketing (at least top marketing positions) aren't totally useless and may actually require some skill ;)

[gilboman]

well you could argue that a lot of skill goes into marketing. I've never taken a marketing class in school but I've taken classes that talk about the background behind marketing and there can be a lot of psychological and sociological ideas/skills/principles required to be really good at marketing.

edit: I guess my point was marketing (at least top marketing positions) aren't totally useless and may actually require some skill ;)

Oh, I'm not saying there's no skills or that marketing is easy. Just that employment rates and earning potential after graduation for them is lower than other degrees. We have finite resources, we shouldn't be giving equal subsidies to someone studying something in demand vs say history/fine arts.

[anyasok]

We are one of the if not most educated generations and countries in the world already. We have so many post secondary grads doing menial work and qualified immigrants driving taxis. More education won't do anything. we are educated enough and it's attainable enough. Not everybody should be given subsidies for education. Too much is being used to support post secondary education that are useless.

We need a quota system so that only certain majors/degrees are subsidized or subsidized more. E.g., more subsidies for medical, nursing, trades, commerce, engineering and other professional programs and none/less for general arts degrees like travel and tourism or marketing :facepalm:
You are tackling different issues here. We need free education so that anyone could get one that's priority #1. Priority #2 is to subsidize those professions that are actually worth something on the job market more than something you would study just for your own sake (i.e. arts degree).

Education is beneficial to everyone in the long run, but obviously we should encourage and help professions that are more in demand more than just any other degree, but again, this is a separate issue.

[sylpherware]

+1

What's your degree in, Hitman?

Majored in Free-marketing, with a minor in complainiology.

[anyasok]

Majored in Free-marketing, with a minor in complainiology.
With a ph.d paper "Capitalism and me: a story of irrational love affair"

[Hitman21]

Majored in Free-marketing, with a minor in complainiology.

It doesn't matter what degree that I have since I work in the private sector and I don't take taxpayers money but I do have more than one degree and have seen how the education system needs massive overhaul. Your right on one thing which is that I have studied a lot in economics, Free Markets and Capitalism

[Syne]

^ So... Poli Sci? Economics? Why is this a big secret?

[Hitman21]

^ So... Poli Sci? Economics? Why is this a big secret?

Because it has absolutely nothing to do with this thread :facepalm:

This thread is about how the system in Quebec will destroy Canada and how they have a problem not about me. It seems like you have nothing to debate about so you resort to these derailing tactics

[r1lee]

are we all suddenly needing to list our degree(s) for the sake of arguing?

lol

[AcidBomber]

Why do we have new 'Quebec' threads popping up every week?
Derailed, Politics, Locked.