Discrimination at Dollarama

[eiad77]

Here is an email I just sent to Dollarama:



I would like to make a complaint about the manager of the Dollarama
located at 34252 Marshall Rd, Abbotsford, BC V2S 1L9. The incident
happened at about noon on May 29, 2012.

I am a support work for a mentally disabled First Nations woman
(Nikki). I took her shopping at the Abbotsford Dollarama and she
rudely told that she had to leave the store. When she asked why she
had to leave the store, she was not told the reason. The manager then
threatened to call the police. When I later went to talk to the
manager, she again threatened to call the police and claimed that the
woman had stolen items in the past. The manager (a heavy-set short
woman with short red hair) and other casiers refused to give me the
manager's name. She was very rude throughout my conversation with
her.

I have been shopping with Nikki many times at this Dollarama as well
as other locations and she has never stolen any goods or even been
accused of stealing any goods. In particular, she has been to the
Abbotsford Dollarama many times (with me and with others) and has
never been accused of theft. If the manager had suspected Nikki of
theft on any particular occasion, why wasn't she asked about it at the
time? There seems to be no basis for these accusations. I understand
that theft is a large problem at retail stores, but unjustifiably
kicking people out of the store is not the way to deal with it. I
believe that because of Nikki's appearance and mannerisms, the manager
assumes she is a thief. I am very disgusted by this prejudice. The
BC Human Rights Code protects individuals against discrimination on
the basis of ethnic origin and mental disability. I look forward to a
speed response, thank you.

Anyone have any thoughts? Did I do the right thing? Or was the store right?

[Ojam]

Jumping the gun on the discrimination card.

[eiad77]

Jumping the gun on the discrimination card.

I can understand why you'd say that, but if you have ever worked with a mentally disabled person (I have worked with a few) you'd see how badly treated in stores and how rude the staff are to them sometimes. What other reason could you give for it?

[deadice]

well if the manager picked her out as easy as that, she probably stole stuff in the past. i used to work as loss prevention and have caught people stealing with their friend standing right next to them. they still try and say "oh my friend would never steal, blah blah blah".

guess you'll know for sure if she ever gets arrested for theft under $5000.... and has a criminal record and civil lawsuits against her...

also if the manager told her to leave the store and she stayed or returned later, she would be liable to be arrested under tresspass to property act (whatever its called in BC).

managers dont randomly go around falsely accusing people without just cause. just saying.

[rienquivaille]

Here is an email I just sent to Dollarama:...
I am a support worker for a mentally disabled First Nations woman
(Nikki). I took her shopping at the Abbotsford Dollarama and she was
rudely told that she had to leave the store. When she asked why she
had to leave the store, she was not told the reason.

Anyone have any thoughts?

Tip: Proper spelling, grammar and syntax will help you. Complaints are more likely to be taken seriously when they are written seriously.

[eiad77]

well if the manager picked her out as easy as that, she probably stole stuff in the past. i used to work as loss prevention and have caught people stealing with their friend standing right next to them. they still try and say "oh my friend would never steal, blah blah blah".

guess you'll know for sure if she ever gets arrested for theft under $5000.... and has a criminal record and civil lawsuits against her...

also if the manager told her to leave the store and she stayed or returned later, she would be liable to be arrested under tresspass to property act (whatever its called in BC).

managers dont randomly go around falsely accusing people without just cause. just saying.

Why wouldn't she have said something when she saw her stealing? She only claimed to have witnessed her stealing in the past.


Tip: Proper spelling, grammar and syntax will help you. Complaints are more likely to be taken seriously when they are written seriously.

Fair enough.

[NG]

Stores have the right to refuse customers for many reasons (I don't believe disability is one of them).

However public pressure can work wonders. If she never did steal anything taking it to the media or even a disability based Human Rights Commission complaint may help.

[rabbit]

The store's lack of cooperation and not able to directly answer your questions say a lot.


> I can understand why you'd say that, but if you have ever worked with a mentally disabled person (I have worked with a few) you'd see how badly treated in stores and how rude the staff are to them sometimes. What other reason could you give for it?

Don't know, but if you don't want them to assume, then you shouldn't make assumptions about them, either.


Let us know what, if any, reply you get.

[sacabeans]

What if they do have proof that she stole, but they are being nice about not calling the police? Your letter may press things forward in a different direction than you intended.

I wasn't there, so I am just playing devils advocate but sounds like the manager was being pretty serious.

[cloakster]

What if they do have proof that she stole, but they are being nice about not calling the police? Your letter may press things forward in a different direction than you intended.

This, the manager could have looked at a video tape later on, saw that she stole, but didn't think calling the police on a disabled woman over a few dollars was worth it. I would probably do that too.

[number8888]

If you had done no wrong then let them call the police, then we'll see if we can get the truth.

Unless you are always with her 24/7, only then can you say for sure that the accusations are wrong. Unfortunately it doesn't seem to be the case here.

[Angela V]

managers dont randomly go around falsely accusing people without just cause. just saying.

Yes they do. It happened to my friend's daughter. She left the store and was followed out. She was accused of stealing a cosmetic worth $75. So she said search me. Manager wouldn't, claimed she was caught on tape and was told not to come back. Friend herself found out this store doesn't even sale this item. It's a small town so it's not like there's many choices around. Friend called the head office but was told the store was indenpently owned and there was nothing they could do.

[uber_shnitz]

Why wouldn't she have said something when she saw her stealing? She only claimed to have witnessed her stealing in the past.

They cannot it's that simple. Even if they're sitting there next to you and see you put something in your pocket/purse, they cannot do anything until you leave the store (you could simply being "storing" it until you got to the cash after all), and even then, the only thing thye CAN do is call the police and give the police your plates (assuming you drove there) as well as the video camera feed. Store employees do not have the legal authority to confront or seize customers under the law; however, they do have the right to ban them from the store(s) and let the cops deal with it. I work at Staples and we have a billboard of security camera screencaps of people who were caught by the cameras stealing and leaving the store. Basically, we're told to call a manager should we meet these people and the manager will call the cops. Shoplifting can only be dealt wiht AFTER it's happened, that's how the legal system works for retail stores.

I don't mean to be discriminatory, but if indeed she is a mentally disabled aboriginal woman, she must stand out and be memorable enough (I have a clear memory of the mentally disabled customers I've dealt with and I only work part time), so if the manager is certain enough that this lady stole to make an open accusation, there can't really be 1000 ladies that fit the profile (with whom the manager might've confused your friend with), especially if her disability gives her very specific maneurisms that would appear on camera.

Certainly, the manager COULD be wrong, but I doubt she's accusing based on discrimination. Your friend might stand out (maneurisms for example) and if those got caught on camera or by whoever witnessed the theft, that's just using the known evidence, not discrminating. This is assuming they've actually had past thefts to base their "accusations" on and aren't just profiling.

[Cheap Cat]

Stores have the right to refuse customers for many reasons (I don't believe disability is one of them).

However public pressure can work wonders. If she never did steal anything taking it to the media or even a disability based Human Rights Commission complaint may help.

You can't refuse service to anyone based on prohibited grounds under the Human Rights Code. Disability would be one of those grounds. I agree that you may want to file a human rights complaint.

If she had stolen in the past, they should have done something then. Obviously they could not prove it. But the reality is that many people target those who are different. She has two strikes against her in this regard, being disabled and being First Nations. There are many narrow minded people in this world. I worked in retail where I was told to follow certain people based on the colour of their skin and I refused. I saw others who stereotyped shoplifters while the clean cut, polite white man in the business suit was robbing them blind. It really opened my eyes to who the scammers are.

I had an uncle who was mentally challenged and he was accused of many things including stealing when he was younger based on his disability, because some people weren't comfortable being around someone who was different. He didn't have the capacity to steal or lie to cover it up. It is highly likely that she is being targeted because of her disability particularly when you aren't getting a straight answer from Dollarama.

[Cheap Cat]

I don't mean to be discriminatory, but if indeed she is a mentally disabled aboriginal woman, she must stand out and be memorable enough (I have a clear memory of the mentally disabled customers I've dealt with and I only work part time), so if the manager is certain enough that this lady stole to make an open accusation, there can't really be 1000 ladies that fit the profile (with whom the manager might've confused your friend with), especially if her disability gives her very specific maneurisms that would appear on camera.

Certainly, the manager COULD be wrong, but I doubt she's accusing based on discrimination. Your friend might stand out (maneurisms for example) and if those got caught on camera or by whoever witnessed the theft, that's just using the known evidence, not discrminating.

Some people think they all look alike.

[uber_shnitz]

Some people think they all look alike.

Well I don't wanna get into a big politically (in)correct debate about it, but it depends. If they're unable of proper speech for example, a cashier will have to make an extra effort when dealing with them at the cash and this extra attention will usually etch the person into the cashier's memory moreso than a random white guy wearing a suit taht you see 50 times a day. I mean maybe yeah, the cashier might confuse 2 people with a speech issue, but compare that to the amount of other "kinds" of customer pass by the store; it's maybe a dozen vs dozens of thousands.

Really this issue boils down to whether the Dollarama's manager actually has prior thefts to back up her accusations. If not, then yes it's profiling and discrimination.

[eiad77]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'll just add a few more details. The woman looks quite distinct, so I don't think she would be confused with anyone else.

I can understand that it's hard for retailers to deal with theft since you have to wait until the person leaves the store. However, the manager claims to have witnessed many incidents of theft in the past. I can't understand why she wouldn't say anything (after witnessing many thefts) before banning her from the store. The manager didn't tell her the reason she was banned from the store in the beginning either, it's only after I went and talked to her that we were told the reason. I also don't know why the manager would refuse to give me her name.

And no I can't be 100% certain that she didn't steal. But I have been inside Dollarama and many other stores with her and she hasn't ever stolen or attempted to steal. She doesn't lie and she says she hasn't stolen so I tend to believe her.

I'd rather not get the police involved since I don't really want to make a scene and it would be very stressful for my client. If it were me on my own I would have called her bluff but with my client it's better to just avoid confrontations. A human rights complaint was something I thought about but it's probably a bigger headache than it's worth. If it were just me I'd definitely do it, but again I'd rather avoid confrontations with my client.

Oh and I forgot to add that she found $10 on the ground outside the store so it wasn't a totally failed trip.

Anyways, I will update the thread when/if I get a response.

[pupazzo]

Lol way to pull out the discrimination card. It sounds like you were up to funny business. I would love to hear manager's side of the story.

[nyder74]

Thanks for the replies everyone. I'll just add a few more details. The woman looks quite distinct, so I don't think she would be confused with anyone else.

I can understand that it's hard for retailers to deal with theft since you have to wait until the person leaves the store. However, the manager claims to have witnessed many incidents of theft in the past. I can't understand why she wouldn't say anything (after witnessing many thefts) before banning her from the store. The manager didn't tell her the reason she was banned from the store in the beginning either, it's only after I went and talked to her that we were told the reason. I also don't know why the manager would refuse to give me her name.

And no I can't be 100% certain that she didn't steal. But I have been inside Dollarama and many other stores with her and she hasn't ever stolen or attempted to steal. She doesn't lie and she says she hasn't stolen so I tend to believe her.

I'd rather not get the police involved since I don't really want to make a scene and it would be very stressful for my client. If it were me on my own I would have called her bluff but with my client it's better to just avoid confrontations. A human rights complaint was something I thought about but it's probably a bigger headache than it's worth. If it were just me I'd definitely do it, but again I'd rather avoid confrontations with my client.

Oh and I forgot to add that she found $10 on the ground outside the store so it wasn't a totally failed trip.

Anyways, I will update the thread when/if I get a response.

Yeah Dollarama discriminates against ALL natives, pff. That would cut into their profits a bit wouldn't it? Just be thankful they didn't press charges the first time and find another store.

Nyd

[sandy_beach]

Is there a reason why you claimed discrimination? Perhaps it's just a case of sour grapes with you.

[Simaahoy]

Why not just speak to the police about if it's really a case of discrimination? It's quite possible the manager did witness her stealing, I don't think anyone who make allegations like that out of nowhere.

[eiad77]

Is there a reason why you claimed discrimination? Perhaps it's just a case of sour grapes with you.

One reason is because the manager wouldn't tell her the reason she wasn't allowed in the store until I went to talk to her. Another reason is because the manager's story about seeing her stealing many times without saying anything about it doesn't make sense. Third reason is that she refused to give her name, if she were doing nothing wrong she shouldn't have a problem giving her name for someone to make a complaint.


Why not just speak to the police about if it's really a case of discrimination? It's quite possible the manager did witness her stealing, I don't think anyone who make allegations like that out of nowhere.

I mentioned above why I didn't want to involve the police.

[Ojam]

One reason is because the manager wouldn't tell her the reason she wasn't allowed in the store until I went to talk to her. Another reason is because the manager's story about seeing her stealing many times without saying anything about it doesn't make sense. Third reason is that she refused to give her name, if she were doing nothing wrong she shouldn't have a problem giving her name for someone to make a complaint.



I mentioned above why I didn't want to involve the police.

What is your full name?

[eiad77]

What is your full name?

Same exact thing, excellent point in fact. Thanks for your convincing argument.

[Ojam]

Same exact thing, excellent point in fact. Thanks for your convincing argument.

If were were doing nothing wrong you shouldn't have a problem giving your name.

[eiad77]

If were were doing nothing wrong you shouldn't have a problem giving your name.

I already said you convinced me, thanks.

[Jalmir]

If were were doing nothing wrong you shouldn't have a problem giving your name.

nice backward thinking!

[Ojam]

nice backward thinking!

No, it really isn't, but it's the OPs line of reasoning, which is really the same as the people who say that you shouldn't mind your privacy being invaded if you are not doing anything wrong. We are getting one side of a story from a heavily biased (and illogical) person who is claiming a serious offense without a shred of proof. Why would the manager cause a scene for no reason?

[Jalmir]

No, it really isn't, but it's the OPs line of reasoning, which is really the same as the people who say that you shouldn't mind your privacy being invaded if you are not doing anything wrong. We are getting one side of a story from a heavily biased (and illogical) person who is claiming a serious offense without a shred of proof. Why would the manager cause a scene for no reason?

and yet, your reasoning that the OP should brodcast his name here is completely illogical!

You're aware that giving your full name to someone face to face is completely different than brodcasting it on the internet, right?

BTW, I'm not saying the OP is right, I was just pointing out your flawed reasoning! I agree that the OP over-reacted and that we only have one side of the story!

[Ojam]

You're aware that giving your full name to someone face to face is completely different than brodcasting it on the internet, right?


Of course it is, I was taking her reasoning to an extreme to point out her fallacious argument that just because the manager didn't want to tell her their name they must be in the wrong.

[Jalmir]

Of course it is, I was taking her reasoning to an extreme to point out her fallacious argument that just because the manager didn't want to tell her their name they must be in the wrong.

BTW, I just realized that the OP basically took your "invalid point" as completely logical ... no offence to the OP here but logical thinking doesn't seem to be his strong suit!

I do agree that the fact that the manager didn't give out her name doens't imply any wrondoing on her part. Managers deals with TONS of weird, aggressive and/or disgruntled clients all the time and I guess at some point they get "fed up"!

[chemical_echo]

If the manager knows they are right, they should have no problem giving their first name so the customer can give a formal complaint.

At an arena I used to work at somebody tried stealing something from the suites I worked in. I confornted them and they told me that the hostess said they could take it (they didn't). I argued with them until they gave it back, at which point they demanded my name so they could file a complaint with management. I happily gave them my first name and showed them my name tag because I knew I was in the right and management would stand behind me. I informed my supervisors right after that there was likely a complaint coming (which never did) and told them exactly what happened.

If the manager is so sure she's right then she should have no problem giving her first name and informing her higher ups that a complaint is likely coming.



I say first name only because there are crazies out there that might want to look you up and harass you at home.

[Ojam]

If the manager knows they are right, they should have no problem giving their first name so the customer can give a formal complaint.

At an arena I used to work at somebody tried stealing something from the suites I worked in. I confornted them and they told me that the hostess said they could take it (they didn't). I argued with them until they gave it back, at which point they demanded my name so they could file a complaint with management. I happily gave them my first name and showed them my name tag because I knew I was in the right and management would stand behind me. I informed my supervisors right after that there was likely a complaint coming (which never did) and told them exactly what happened.

If the manager is so sure she's right then she should have no problem giving her first name and informing her higher ups that a complaint is likely coming.



I say first name only because there are crazies out there that might want to look you up and harass you at home.

I'd agree with that, the professional thing to do would have been to give their name.

[rabbit]

> Even if they're sitting there next to you and see you put something in your pocket/purse, they cannot do anything until you leave the store (you could simply being "storing" it until you got to the cash after all),

The merchandise doesn't need to leave the store, but the retailer needs to prove, within reason, the intent to shoplift.

[eiad77]

BTW, I just realized that the OP basically took your "invalid point" as completely logical ... no offence to the OP here but logical thinking doesn't seem to be his strong suit!

I do agree that the fact that the manager didn't give out her name doens't imply any wrondoing on her part. Managers deals with TONS of weird, aggressive and/or disgruntled clients all the time and I guess at some point they get "fed up"!

Sorry I guess the sarcasm wasn't clear. Obviously, me giving my full name out on an anonymous forum is not the same thing as the manager giving me her first name so I could identify her in my complaint. The analogous situation would be me giving my name when I made the formal complaint, which is what I did.

Response from Dollarama


Thank you for contacting us.

Our customer's feedback is very important and we will definitely investigate this situation and get back to you as soon as possible.

Kindness Regards

I will update the thread if they respond again.

[elitegundam]

I'm starting to think that the only way to go shopping with any scale of confindence, is to have a lawyer you can contact in these situations. Even the promise of a lawyer will make a manager think twice about their (potential) theft claim versus a (potential) case of discrimination, or other wrongdoings. I'm surprised there isn't a retail line of X-cops to handle this, like carr accidents. a 5 min phone call to tell the client to go along with whatever the manager is saying, or a nice profitable legal battle seems win win. More than a few times I would have called, as customer and employee.