Dell 8500 i7 vs build my own

[ppcorrea]

I am replacing a 7 year old dell c521 "slim" computer (low profile, low power) so not able to reuse components other than the dvd drive, keyboard and display and maybe the old 200GB hard drive as a secondary drive.

I have 2 options:
Dell XPS 8500 with the i7-3770, AMD Radeon HD 7570 1GB GDDR5, 8GB RAM and 1TB HD, Windows 7 Home Premium
or build my own...

I am paying $734 all in (taxes and shipping included) for the Dell thanks to employee discount coupon and 5% friends and family event

I am looking at comparable options if I build my own and have not been able to find anything even close.

I know the GPU in the Dell is crappy but being an XPS I should be able to replace if needed (I haven't used my computer for games in years and I might consider Diablo 3 but nothing too demanding)

My alternative "build-my-own" would be
Processor: about 250
Cooling: 30
Motherboard: 100
RAM:50
GPU: 100
HD: 90
Case: 50
Power Supply: 50
DVD: Reuse
Total: 720 plus taxes(about 800 total) + time and no warranty if I screw up...

Am I missing something here?, seems that even with aggressive prices for components I'm still better off with the XPS thanks to the coupons and might not get an ivy bridge if I build my own...

[mikeo007]

The Dell seems like a decent machine for the price. I'd say go for it, knowing that you may be limiting future upgradability. If you're not concerned with heavyish gaming, that machine should be find and need no real upgrades for the foreseeable future.

You also haven't costed out Windows 7 in your custom build, which would add about $100.

[CMvan46]

Build your own. That GPU is terrible, I'd be pretty certain you have a very low end power supply and motherboard in there too. You likely won't be able to upgrade the GPU unless you buy a power supply too and now your looking at a much higher upgrade cost. Dell is trying to blind you with i7 and 8gb RAM.

Plenty of people around could help you with a build should you choose to but unless your buying a laptop or your basic browsing/office use PC I wouldn't recommend a dell desktop.

[ppcorrea]

You also haven't costed out Windows 7 in your custom build, which would add about $100.

Thanks didn't notice that... Well that does it then, Dell it is; I could do same price or even a little extra but I am getting in the $200+ difference territory and the wife will not approve.

[ppcorrea]

Build your own. That GPU is terrible, I'd be pretty certain you have a very low end power supply and motherboard in there too. You likely won't be able to upgrade the GPU unless you buy a power supply too and now your looking at a much higher upgrade cost. Dell is trying to blind you with i7 and 8gb RAM.

Plenty of people around could help you with a build should you choose to but unless your buying a laptop or your basic browsing/office use PC I wouldn't recommend a dell desktop.

I thought XPS were decent (not good but decent) compared to the rest of the dells. Power supply worries me though, I'm going to call and see if I can get more detailed info.

Not really worried for the GPU at this time, to be honest I would rather save 10 dollars and go with integrated for the time being as I don't plan on using it for games, but would like to have the option of upgrading at some time...

Right now is more about how much I'm spending and I can't seem to get something comparable for the price.

[DavidY]

I thought XPS were decent (not good but decent) compared to the rest of the dells. Power supply worries me though, I'm going to call and see if I can get more detailed info.

Not really worried for the GPU at this time, to be honest I would rather save 10 dollars and go with integrated for the time being as I don't plan on using it for games, but would like to have the option of upgrading at some time...

Right now is more about how much I'm spending and I can't seem to get something comparable for the price.

If you are planning to upgrade a Dell, don't. Get as much of a system as you need. They often are hard to upgrade....especially if your last system lasted 7 years.

Dave

[DrGizmo]

What CMvan46 says above is pretty accurate. Dell is notorious for using crappy, low quality cases, mobo's, PSU's and GPUs, regardless of it being an XPS or other.

I would strongly recommend building your own - it will be slightly more expensive, however the longevity of your own build will make it well worth it.

Nothing worse then spending 800 on a dell, deciding to upgrade your GPU, then finding out you also need to replace your PSU, then if you dont want to buy a proprietary dell PSU, you also need to buy a new case or mod your dell case... as you can see, the chain goes on...

[spena]

build you own and ensure:
1. you save $$ (price matching, sales)
2. parts of you own choice
3. feeling of ownership of building your new toy

you can get started by using ncix pc builder site (http://pc.ncix.com/ncixpc/)

[ppcorrea]

If you are planning to upgrade a Dell, don't. Get as much of a system as you need. They often are hard to upgrade....especially if your last system lasted 7 years.

Dave

Well that's kind of the reason I thought about the dell... I added RAM and replaced the GPU about 3 years ago in the c521 and had no problems other than finding an affordable low profile GPU (I know it was pretty dumb to go with the slim tower).

It sounds things might not be that simple this time around, even with a supposed 460W PSU and 2 6-pin pcie connectors.

I'll check with the boss (wife) on how much we can stretch the budget and will aim to a i5 Sandy bridge instead (I think I might be able to do integrated graphics as a trade off).

I have the dell on my cart and ready to go but I need this last sanity check.

[Busybuyer888]

The question is this ... (because the price is pretty decent).

Does OP know of anyone whom will help them if they have problems with their custom build? (Lets say there is a 10% chance of issues.)

Dell will ensure your computer is functional and will support you for a full year.

What will OP be using their computer for? If is it not for serious gaming ... it doesn't matter what the GPU is. OP seems to be content with the Intel onboard graphics.

7 years of IE/Firefox/Chrome, Word/Excel doesn't require a Antec/Cosair/Seasonic power supply, nor does it need a GTX560/570/670 level GPU. There are litterailly millions of generic power supplies in use, most of them keep working and working.

OP's cost is $650 (before 13% HST) ... and that includes a licensed Win7 64-bit operating system.

[Busybuyer888]

I am replacing a 7 year old dell c521 "slim" computer (low profile, low power) so not able to reuse components other than the dvd drive, keyboard and display and maybe the old 200GB hard drive as a secondary drive.

I have 2 options:
Dell XPS 8500 with the i7-3770, AMD Radeon HD 7570 1GB GDDR5, 8GB RAM and 1TB HD, Windows 7 Home Premium
or build my own...

I am paying $734 all in (taxes and shipping included) for the Dell thanks to employee discount coupon and 5% friends and family event

I am looking at comparable options if I build my own and have not been able to find anything even close.

I know the GPU in the Dell is crappy but being an XPS I should be able to replace if needed (I haven't used my computer for games in years and I might consider Diablo 3 but nothing too demanding)

My alternative "build-my-own" would be
Processor: about 250
Cooling: 30
Motherboard: 100
RAM:50
GPU: 100
HD: 90
Case: 50
Power Supply: 50
DVD: Reuse
Total: 720 plus taxes(about 800 total) + time and no warranty if I screw up...

Am I missing something here?, seems that even with aggressive prices for components I'm still better off with the XPS thanks to the coupons and might not get an ivy bridge if I build my own...

Looking at what most RFD system builders recommend ... that power supply budget is inadequet. They are likely going to recommend an min. 600W Antec/Coarsair/Seasonic.

[DavidY]

Well that's kind of the reason I thought about the dell... I added RAM and replaced the GPU about 3 years ago in the c521 and had no problems other than finding an affordable low profile GPU (I know it was pretty dumb to go with the slim tower).

It sounds things might not be that simple this time around, even with a supposed 460W PSU and 2 6-pin pcie connectors.

I'll check with the boss (wife) on how much we can stretch the budget and will aim to a i5 Sandy bridge instead (I think I might be able to do integrated graphics as a trade off).

I have the dell on my cart and ready to go but I need this last sanity check.

Maybe Dell is getting a bit better for upgrading....12-15 years ago, adding generic memory was tough....or pay through the nose with Dell's own memory. That was it for me and Dell.

If you need Dell's onsite warranty service, then Dell may be better than build your own system (or have a sysem builder build it for you). There is typically a 1 year warranty with a system builder like NCIX (but no onsite service)....good to have a system builder who is local to you. If you can add memory and add/change the graphics card, it appears that you are quite handy (enough to talk to your system builder about any future problems). Dell is more oriented for those who don't want to open up their PC at all....reason for onsite servicing.

Dave

[mikeo007]

You'll be fine with that system. Some people here tend to think that all users need a computer capable of epic benchmarks on the latest games.
They also suffer from the old stigma of Dell systems not being upgradable.
I won't argue that they use some cheaper parts, but for what you need, the computer is totally capable.

[warpdrive]

I’m going to go against the grain here and say that the Dell is fine.

I agree with the above, the old stigma about proprietary components doesn’t really apply. I have a Vostro system and I ended up gutting it and swapping out many parts to repurpose it, I swapped out nearly everything including fans, power supply, drives, memory, video card. The Dell uses standard ATX PC parts (the only thing I kept was the Dell motherboard)

If you absolutely need to get a new GPU, you will be restricted somewhat with the stock XPS power supply and chassis, but even then, you should be able to drop in a 7850 fine and play Diablo 3 fine

I've recently built two different PCs since I bought the Dell (an full sized HTPC and an overclocked gaming PC with lots of corsair/noctua parts) so I am aware of what DIY builds can offer, but I think that unless you have a very specific goal in mind for your PC, the brand name PC's are fine for general use.

[Busybuyer888]

You'll be fine with that system. Some people here tend to think that all users need a computer capable of epic benchmarks on the latest games.
They also suffer from the old stigma of Dell systems not being upgradable.
I won't argue that they use some cheaper parts, but for what you need, the computer is totally capable.

+1. We must always ask what the purchaser intends to use their computer for.

These Intel i5/i7 & AMD Phemon II X4/X6 (and beyond) are capable of running 4 VM allowing a family of 4 users to browse the Internet, run Excel, Word, and Outlook at the same time. This is how much processing power is sitting idle under many of our desks!

[CMvan46]

You'll be fine with that system. Some people here tend to think that all users need a computer capable of epic benchmarks on the latest games.
They also suffer from the old stigma of Dell systems not being upgradable.
I won't argue that they use some cheaper parts, but for what you need, the computer is totally capable.

No I think buying a computer that is more easily upgradeable with better quality parts, longer warranties than a year on almost all parts, and better performance for not much more is a better decision.

[Busybuyer888]

No I think buying a computer that is more easily upgradeable with better quality parts, longer warranties than a year on almost all parts, and better performance for not much more is a better decision.

Dell has a better warrantee than a custom build. A custom build requires us to warrantee each part separately. (Some parts need to be sent to USA - $$$)

Dell is one local company to deal with. (And six years from now ... one can still access the device drivers via the service tag #)

Dells can be purchased with a 3 year warrantee if desired too.

After RFD get through with the custom build it will cost like $850 - $1,000. (ie. why have a 600W-750W p/s and only run $100 video card?) ;)

There is enthusists mindset & general user mindset. Each has slightly different needs.

[warpdrive]

Dell has a better warrantee than a custom build. A custom build requires us to warrantee each part separately. (Some parts need to be sent to USA - $$$)


That is true. I had a hard disk, and video card go bad on me, and I had a replacement from Dell in two days. They sent me a mailing label to return the old one and I didn't have to pay a cent except the gas I used to drop off the item at purolator. If you DIY, you have to go through their RMA and often it will take much longer and they only cover one way return postage.

[divx]

dude! get a dell!

[elgros4]

@divx

Do you know DIY PC ?

I would not buy a Dell of a desktop, only for laptop. You should build your own, OEM pc like
Dell are cheap and hard to upgrade. For exemple, try to get the wattage of the Dell Pw supply...

[mikeo007]

No I think buying a computer that is more easily upgradeable with better quality parts, longer warranties than a year on almost all parts, and better performance for not much more is a better decision.

The advantages of a custom build are so small in this case, and just don't outweigh the advantages of the Dell.
Most warranty covered parts have to be shipped back to the USA as well, which can cost a lot of money.
It's also not like the Dell parts are total trash, especially in the XPS series. You're exaggerating the possible problems with the Dell.

[divx]

@divx

Do you know DIY PC ?

I would not buy a Dell of a desktop, only for laptop. You should build your own, OEM pc like
Dell are cheap and hard to upgrade. For exemple, try to get the wattage of the Dell Pw supply...

Yes I custom built my own, but would not recommend it to others.

[stillmatic11]

Personally I would go budget PC and spend around $300-$400 if I was getting a pre-build. The parts will suck and you won't be upgrading, so just run it into the ground and replace when time comes. This makes sense, because the OS is going to be $100 on it's own. If you're just internet browsing and have no need for performance stuff like gaming, which seems to be the case, then getting an i7 is pointless and any PC sold today will meet your needs. The problem with Dell's and all Pre-builds if they have junk parks inside the machine and upgrading is not really possible. They tend to have overheating problems, because the case usually never fits well. The PSU is also bound to be crap and could cause problems down the road.

Spending $700+, I'd look to build my own. You'll spend more, but get to pick out quality parts that will perform well and be durable. I'm building my own right now and it's definitely costly, but I shouldn't have to replace it for a while.

[warpdrive]

The problem with Dell's and all Pre-builds if they have junk parks inside the machine and upgrading is not really possible. They tend to have overheating problems, because the case usually never fits well. The PSU is also bound to be crap and could cause problems down the road.

So much misinformation.....so little time.

[stillmatic11]

So much misinformation.....so little time.

Just my opinion having owned a few pre-builds including a Dell. I'm not a Dell hater by any means, both my monitors are Dell.

[cloakster]

Unless you already know how to and willing to build your own, that Dell is one hell of a deal. If you add a 64GB SSD and reformat windows onto that, it will be a perfect all around computer.

[ippon]

Just my opinion having owned a few pre-builds including a Dell. I'm not a Dell hater by any means, both my monitors are Dell.

let's not mix up opinions with facts.

[stillmatic11]

let's not mix up opinions with facts.

I suppose, but I'd like to know the actual specs of the case, PSU, RAM and motherboard to get a better opinion. This PC will perform just fine and is a good deal, but like I said if spending $700+ I'd like to pick the exact parts I want personally.

[divx]

Unless you already know how to and willing to build your own, that Dell is one hell of a deal. If you add a 64GB SSD and reformat windows onto that, it will be a perfect all around computer.

/thread

[warpdrive]

Just my opinion having owned a few pre-builds including a Dell. I'm not a Dell hater by any means, both my monitors are Dell.

The thing is: the quality of the Dell components is fine as they use the same OEMs that make your aftermarket boards. The boards/cases are bare bones feature wise, but they do the job. The memory is standard spec DDR3 1333. There is nothing preventing you from upgrading every single part if you wanted to. I did exactly that and it worked out fine. The ONLY issue I had is that the front panel header is not quite standard, the front panel connector doesn't have the reset and power connectors that you find on standard ATX boards, so if you do want to change out the motherboard and keep the Dell case, you will have to splice some wires

I've owned many prebuilt Dells. I've used my last Vostro with i7-860 and it never overheated despite the fact I used it a lot for high stress HD video editing and encoding, I even used it as a gaming machine playing COD2/MW and even though the PS was only 400W, and it could handle a single mid-range video card like my 5770 fine. The system didn't come close to taxing the PS. Many people overestimate their PS needs. I did swap out my PS for a 500W one later and it fit fine. I took out the old PS and used it in a separate computer and it's chugging along fine.

So a Dell like this is a good deal, you could do a few strategic upgrades like SSD or mid-range GPU and you have a very good performing system

[ppcorrea]

Ok so I tried my best with the NCIX tool and could not get close at all, at the end it was more based on the following:

- Last time I built my own computer was about 10 years ago. I can't say it was hard but it was time consuming (had a faulty motherboard that was a pain to return)
- Computer will be used mainly for browsing and the most critical use will be Handbrake and streaming via PLEX (so cpu actually is more important than GPU for me)
- Last dell I had was as bad as it can get on "upgreadability" (slim body low power PSU) and I still was able to use standard RAM and quasi standard PSU (low profile) still lasted about 7 years
- Warranty/Accountability, this will be the family computer so I would rather be sure that if someone screws something up is Dell and not me (as the wife will be quite unhappy with whoever screws up here)
- Apparently someone has been able to upgrade all the way to a GTX680 which is way beyond my upgrade plans for some yearshttp://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/desktop/f/3514/p/19449652/20107458.aspx
- Finally and the most important factor was price, Ivy Bridge i7, 8GB DDR3, 1TB AND Windows license for less than 650 before taxes is hard to beat... closest I got in NCIX by trading the i7 for a Sandy bridge i5, cheap 8GB RAM, 1TB Hard Drive, windows license, cheap std case, avg PSU, wifi (computer is nowhere near router), and similar crappy GPU was about $760 plus taxes and I don't think I was picking any quality component there.

Without the coupon, building my own would be a no-brainer, but I couln't justify the price difference

Thanks to everyone,

I understand the appeal of building my computer and I will likely do that in the future if I plan to use it for gaming/personal use but for the family this seemed like the best option.

These were the final details of the order:

XPS 8500 XPS 8500 Fast track config04
Processors 3rd Generation Intel® Core™ i7-3770 processor (3.40 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.90 GHz)
Memory 8GB Dual Channel DDR3 1600MHz - 2 DIMMs
Keyboard Dell KB213 Wired Multimedia Keyboard
Monitor No Monitor
Video Card AMD Radeon™ HD 7570 1GB GDDR5
Wireless Driver Dell SRV Software 1703
Hard Drive 1TB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive 6.0 Gb/s
Chassis XPS 8500, Black Chassis w/19:1 media card reader
Operating System Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64Bit, English
Mouse Dell Laser Mouse
Network Card Integrated 10/100/1000 Ethernet
Adobe Reader Adobe® Acrobat® X Reader Multi-Language
Optical Drive 16X CD/DVD burner (DVD+/-RW), write to CD/DVD
Sound Integrated 7.1 with WAVE MAXXAudio 4
Speakers No speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system)
Wireless Dell Wireless 1703 802.11b/g/n, Bluetooth v4.0+LE
Power Cord US Power Cord

Offer Expires 8/6/2012 at 5 am EST. - $149.00
5% off in savings with eligible online purchase. - $40.00
15% Discount through the Dell EPP - $114.00
Subtotal: $649.59

[number8888]

The Dell looks good, and I think you'll enjoy it for your needs.

If you don't do anything beyond the expected usage then it will be fine. But if you start adding parts or upgrading components then yeah chances are it won't last long. This is usually the source of the complaints.

Adding a SSD or extra drive should be fine, but not if you decide to start overclocking or adding a high-end GPU.

[HandsomeRob]

The thing is: the quality of the Dell components is fine as they use the same OEMs that make your aftermarket boards. The boards/cases are bare bones feature wise, but they do the job. The memory is standard spec DDR3 1333. There is nothing preventing you from upgrading every single part if you wanted to. I did exactly that and it worked out fine. The ONLY issue I had is that the front panel header is not quite standard, the front panel connector doesn't have the reset and power connectors that you find on standard ATX boards, so if you do want to change out the motherboard and keep the Dell case, you will have to splice some wires

I've owned many prebuilt Dells. I've used my last Vostro with i7-860 and it never overheated despite the fact I used it a lot for high stress HD video editing and encoding, I even used it as a gaming machine playing COD2/MW and even though the PS was only 400W, and it could handle a single mid-range video card like my 5770 fine. The system didn't come close to taxing the PS. Many people overestimate their PS needs. I did swap out my PS for a 500W one later and it fit fine. I took out the old PS and used it in a separate computer and it's chugging along fine.

So a Dell like this is a good deal, you could do a few strategic upgrades like SSD or mid-range GPU and you have a very good performing system

Think about it logically, we're talking I7 3570, going to drop a bunch of money, serious about the computer.

-460w Dell PSU - inferior. Will be upgraded to something reputable with multiple rails and a much higher capacity. Is it going to have sufficient SATA/PCI connectors?
-MotherBoard - Probably an H77 chipset. If you want to have any fun with it you want to go Z68/Z77. I haven't screwed with a dell computer in some but last I did they had proprietary front panel connectors. Upgrade the board, upgrade the case too.
-DDR3 1333 - Just fine, but if you want to upgrade in quantity it's just plain easier to get enthusiast memory.
-How solid is the 1 TB HDD? What's the seek time? Buffer size?

If you're going to spend this much money on a computer it makes sense to spend it properly. You could buy a downright solid i5 2500k or i5 3570k system and pay the NCIX build fee and never worry about having sufficient performance. If you wanted to overclock it you could probably mop the floor with this system. Not to mention the benefits of an Retail Windows license that can be moved on to the next machine, lack of Dell Bloatware, and having a machine configured exactly as you want it without headaches.

I just see Dell as a manufacturer for businesses that need 300 workstations, or cheap consumer desktops that just want to browse. I'm sure the OP could buy this and never think twice about it again, but many would tell you there are better deals to be had.

BTW, OP you're not re-using your optical drive or HDD. The interface has changed from IDE Ribbon to SATA, completely different connectors and technology

[ppcorrea]

...If you're going to spend this much money on a computer it makes sense to spend it properly. You could buy a downright solid i5 2500k or i5 3570k system and pay the NCIX build fee and never worry about having sufficient performance...

BTW, OP you're not re-using your optical drive or HDD. The interface has changed from IDE Ribbon to SATA, completely different connectors and technology

Well that was the thing, I could not get close to $650 with an i5 2500k or 3570k build and I was planning to reusing optical drive which seems like a no-go now.

I agree that for 850-1,000 before taxes I can get a nice computer with an i5, the motherboard you recommended, PSU and Win 7.

But the Dell, as a family (browsing/media streaming) computer, will see almost no upgrades for years and I can only think about getting a little extra RAM or a GPU in 2 or 3 years.

I guess the damage is done now, but I will be happy to post an update once I get it. I'll try to dig in as much info on the components as I can.

[RedFoxComp]

I am replacing a 7 year old dell c521 "slim" computer (low profile, low power) so not able to reuse components other than the dvd drive, keyboard and display and maybe the old 200GB hard drive as a secondary drive.


Am I missing something here?, seems that even with aggressive prices for components I'm still better off with the XPS thanks to the coupons and might not get an ivy bridge if I build my own...

You're missing the OS and keyboard/mouse. That is a great deal and you'll never be able to assemble the parts yourself cheaper. If you never plan on opening the case except to blow the dust out, you're fine. If you want to overclock and tinker it's better to spend the money on a home built.

Contrary to the other poster, a 460W PSU is more than enough for that system. Granted it's not going to be the most efficient and longest lasting but even with a video card upgrade in the future it will be fine. People go crazy with 800+ watt PSUs and they're major overkill in most circumstances. I have an I5 2500K overclocked with crossfired 6870's, 16GB ram, 3HDDs and 5 fans and I've never seen my system pull more than 453 watts from the wall.

[brucered]

http://www.dell.com/ca/p/desktop-deals.aspx?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=mn

looking to add the XPS8500 BUNDLE shortly...our Vostro 200 just konked out, i'm just gonna test a power supply 1st.

for $1000 it doens't look bad. lots of ram, nice processor, lots of storage and an HD monitor.

anyone know of any CPN's that will work with this system to bring the price down, as i haven't been able to find any.

not looking to build a unit, as we need it quick and i've been happy with out last 3 dells, they have served us well.