Horrendous/despicable customer service from Lenovo Canada

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

An example of good customer service (Rogers honoring the SELLER's mistake/price error on the Galaxy Nexus) versus bad customer service (Lenovo shifting blame to the customers, when it was the SELLER's mistake). >:(

Canadian company = build goodwill
VS.
Asian company = can't destroy goodwill when it never existed in the first place, LOL!! :lol:

Typical of Lenovo to blame consumers when their IT and management team is incompetent... :facepalm:

[Avenger]

Way to support your position!

At least when I do something like this it is true because I said it. You just didn't back up what you said!

[Winkle]

OP instantaneously destroyed any credibility they had by using Rogers as an example of a Canadian company that builds goodwill with their customers.

[uber_shnitz]

OP instantaneously destroyed any credibility they had by using Rogers as an example of a Canadian company that builds goodwill with their customers.

What he said :|

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

Way to support your position!

At least when I do something like this it is true because I said it. You just didn't back up what you said!

The issue has been documented in the expired deals section. Feel free to read about how Lenovo has decided to renege on an existing contract and charge customers' money on their credit cards without shipping the product.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

OP instantaneously destroyed any credibility they had by using Rogers as an example of a Canadian company that builds goodwill with their customers.

Must've missed the Galaxy Nexus deal eh? Take a look at the Expired deals section. Rogers could have easily cancelled all outstanding orders for the $0.01 galaxy nexus deal, but decided to honor the mistake by shipping the phone when it should have been the deal was meant to be a Nexus S.

[Insider]

if you're going to reference a thread, at least link to it.

no, I don't read through expired deal threads, because they're expired. just a thought.

if you're going to post a thread like this, post the history of it, instead of expecting everyone on RFD to instantaneously know what it is that you're referring to.

[Avenger]

The issue has been documented in the expired deals section. Feel free to read about how Lenovo has decided to renege on an existing contract and charge customers' money on their credit cards without shipping the product.

My psychic mind-reading powers must have been malfunctioning for me not to have known what you were referring to without you saying it. My apologies. I will do a better job to mind read next time so you can type even less in your OP.

[hagbard]

This is what the OP is referring to:

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/lenovo-super-deal-lenovo-super-slim-thinkpad-x220-i3-318-i5-360-a-1181717/

[Rehan]

[SIZE="3"]An example of good customer service (Rogers honoring the SELLER's mistake/price error on the Galaxy Nexus) versus bad customer service (Lenovo shifting blame to the customers, when it was the SELLER's mistake). >:( In what way were they shifting blame to customers? All I can gather is that they realized an error on their website and did what they could to salvage the orders that exploited that obvious error.

The spirit of the consumer protection laws we have regarding contracts is to protect innocent consumers from greedy companies, not to enable greedy consumers to take advantage of companies that make innocent mistakes.

[hagbard]

In what way were they shifting blame to customers? All I can gather is that they realized an error on their website and did what they could to salvage the orders that exploited that obvious error.

The spirit of the consumer protection laws we have regarding contracts is to protect innocent consumers from greedy companies, not to enable greedy consumers to take advantage of companies that make innocent mistakes.

I'm not certain it was an innocent mistake. And...they seem to make a lot of them. At the least, their sales department is pretty incompetent and their PR management skills are nil.

[YippoHippo]

OP is mad that some got the x220, and he didn't.

[uber_shnitz]

It's not like Lenovo is the first one to do this. Dell's made some pricing mistakes on their website before too. My dad ordered a Vostro from them for 350$ and when they found out they emailed him and canceled his order.

No doubt that Lenovo's CS experience is pretty poor, but so are lots of companies.

[Rehan]

I'm not certain it was an innocent mistake. And...they seem to make a lot of them. When was the last such Lenovo "deal" (pricing error) like this? It was obvious from the beginning of that thread that the configuration was a mistake that should not have slipped through.


At the least, their sales department is pretty incompetent and their PR management skills are nil. I won't argue with that. But apparently their products are solid enough that they are still doing well enough despite those problems.

[hagbard]

When was the last such Lenovo "deal" (pricing error) like this? It was obvious from the beginning of that thread that the configuration was a mistake that should not have slipped through.

I believe the last one was for a mouse. I also believed they had no intention of following through with those prices, and didn't order (and wouldn't anyway because I simply don't trust them based on all the reports here in RFDs).



I won't argue with that. But apparently their products are solid enough that they are still doing well enough despite those problems.

The product is probably good, but not worth the hassle and nonsense that comes with it.

[Rehan]

I believe the last one was for a mouse. I also believed they had no intention of following through with those prices, and didn't order (and wouldn't anyway because I simply don't trust them based on all the reports here in RFDs).

The product is probably good, but not worth the hassle and nonsense that comes with it. Sounds like you're only interested in them when they have a price error? From what I've seen, there are many happy customers that have purchased at legitimate prices and had no problems with the order (other than having to wait for the laptop to be built and shipped from China).

[hagbard]

Sounds like you're only interested in them when they have a price error? From what I've seen, there are many happy customers that have purchased at legitimate prices and had no problems with the order (other than having to wait for the laptop to be built and shipped from China).

Never bought a thing from Lenovo, I just read and learn. And what I've learned is they make a superior product but suck in every other way. My next laptop will likely be an Apple.

[Rehan]

Never bought a thing from Lenovo .... That's pretty much the same as the people that are whining about not getting an X220. :D

[ds2chan]

It's not like Lenovo is the first one to do this. Dell's made some pricing mistakes on their website before too. My dad ordered a Vostro from them for 350$ and when they found out they emailed him and canceled his order.

No doubt that Lenovo's CS experience is pretty poor, but so are lots of companies.

I think it was a little more than the order being cancelled. I read through the last few pages and this is what I got out of it.

1) Everybody got their CC charged.
2) A lot of laptops were shipped out.
3) Emails were sent with tracking numbers for UPS and people's accounts were updated saying that their laptop was shipped.
4) Somebody from inside Lenovo got wind of this and then got UPS to redirect all shipments to Lenovo's warehouse in Markham.
5) People logged into UPS with their tracking numbers and it showed that their shipment got redirected.
6) People received invoices for their laptops.

EDIT: The OP should have mentioned this in the first place. Since he didn't it made this thread a joke.

[Ticco]

I think it was a little more than the order being cancelled. I read through the last few pages and this is what I got out of it.

1) Everybody got their CC charged.
2) A lot of laptops were shipped out.
3) Emails were sent with tracking numbers for UPS and people's accounts were updated saying that their laptop was shipped.
4) Somebody from inside Lenovo got wind of this and then got UPS to redirect all shipments to Lenovo's warehouse in Markham.
5) People logged into UPS with their tracking numbers and it showed that their shipment got redirected.
6) People received invoices for their laptops.

EDIT: The OP should have mentioned this in the first place. Since he didn't it made this thread a joke.

Yea, so for anybody reading this thread - this is what happened essentially:

1) Hey everybody, there's this amazing X220 deal that seems like it's a price error. (cue in all the people placing orders, predicting they'll get cancelled anyway but hoping that there's a chance that they won't).

2) Ok guys, looks like they're cancelling the orders (cue in the people saying "i knew it" ah shucks)

3) Oh damn, looks like a few orders slipped though - credit cards were charged, invoices shipped out, UPS packages were shipped! (was this a mistake or was Lenovo honouring the first few orders?)

4) People getting excited and now, really invested emotionally (it's that close) they just might get their $400 barebones X220

5) Oh damn, looks like it was yet another mistake - because now they're intercepting and redirecting the orders. At this point everyone is pissed and it's understandable (salivating at the idea that you might actually score huge this time from a price error event that usually only RFDers know about. Order shipped, it's literally ours! It's like giving a thirsty man a glass of water only to take it away right before he takes a sip, he'll be more pissed than if he were never given the glass in the first place).

6) Legal basis favouring the consumer's side is established

7) Apparently one dude got his order through...

All this, in my opinion, is not due to the despicable practices of Lenovo, but pure and utter incompetence.

For the record - their lap-tops are good but they most certainly are not what you'd expect for a machine that costs that much. Not at all, not even close. The think pads, while nice, are not that sturdy and solid and should not be bought for over $1000.

Just do some reviews on the T420 and X220 and you'll find never ending reviews about the screen, the trackpad (terrible), etc

[hagbard]

Once they notified the customer that their order had gone through, then charged their cards, then actually shipped, I think they had an obligation to follow through. The last house I sold I knew I could get more (and had the opportunity to do so) but I believe a deal is a deal, even if you take a loss (in my case, thousands). They should have manned up and let the orders that they agreed to send go through. They put themselves before their customers, bad business.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

Lenovo's business etiquette is pure garbage. What happened was the equivalent of breaking a contract without even compensation for interest fees on the credit cards. Refunds STILL have not been processed at this time! The number of lies that I've been told by Lenovo is stupendous. Oh we can't sell you a laptop without an O/S or the "receiver" (i.e. customer) requested that UPS divert the package - when we never gave verbal or written consent.

What Lenovo did was the equivalent of a retail store selling you a product that you've paid for, and then realizing the price was too low and they could've sold it for more. After charging your credit card, as insurance, the merchant (i.e. Lenovo) then decides not to deliver the product at the agreed upon price. Essentially reneging on the entire contract.

If only more RFD members had backbones, we would have a strong class action lawsuit that would send Lenovo a message (if you screw up and charge people, on top of shipping the product, then it's your company's mistake). However, most people are either indifferent or too lazy to commit the time and resources to right what has been wronged.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

Yea, so for anybody reading this thread - this is what happened essentially:

1) Hey everybody, there's this amazing X220 deal that seems like it's a price error. (cue in all the people placing orders, predicting they'll get cancelled anyway but hoping that there's a chance that they won't).

2) Ok guys, looks like they're cancelling the orders (cue in the people saying "i knew it" ah shucks)

3) Oh damn, looks like a few orders slipped though - credit cards were charged, invoices shipped out, UPS packages were shipped! (was this a mistake or was Lenovo honouring the first few orders?)

4) People getting excited and now, really invested emotionally (it's that close) they just might get their $400 barebones X220

5) Oh damn, looks like it was yet another mistake - because now they're intercepting and redirecting the orders. At this point everyone is pissed and it's understandable (salivating at the idea that you might actually score huge this time from a price error event that usually only RFDers know about. Order shipped, it's literally ours! It's like giving a thirsty man a glass of water only to take it away right before he takes a sip, he'll be more pissed than if he were never given the glass in the first place).

6) Legal basis favouring the consumer's side is established

7) Apparently one dude got his order through...

All this, in my opinion, is not due to the despicable practices of Lenovo, but pure and utter incompetence.

For the record - their lap-tops are good but they most certainly are not what you'd expect for a machine that costs that much. Not at all, not even close. The think pads, while nice, are not that sturdy and solid and should not be bought for over $1000.

Just do some reviews on the T420 and X220 and you'll find never ending reviews about the screen, the trackpad (terrible), etc

Honestly, the price was probably Lenovo's cost. It wasn't that BIG of a steal. People who didn't follow the thread aren't aware that all the systems would still require a separate copy of Windows 7, upgrade to the RAM, and possibly an upgrade to the HDD. If you look up the definition of "shoody business", you'll see a picture of Lenovo HQ and its management team.

I'll be happy to give my business to Asus and watch Lenovo slowly burn down the goodwill that IBM built with its loyal followers. I'm over it and don't even want the X220 if Lenovo gave it to me now, I am simply going to make them compensate me for damages and all applicable interest/CC charges. Forget the laptop and a settlement, that's all off the table now.

[cyder]

Honestly, the price was probably Lenovo's cost. It wasn't that BIG of a steal. People who didn't follow the thread aren't aware that all the systems would still require a separate copy of Windows 7, upgrade to the RAM, and possibly an upgrade to the HDD. If you look up the definition of "shoody business", you'll see a picture of Lenovo HQ and its management team.

I'll be happy to give my business to Asus and watch Lenovo slowly burn down the goodwill that IBM built with its loyal followers. I'm over it and won't even want the X220 if Lenovo gave it to me now, I am simply going to make them compensate me for damages and all applicable interest/CC charges. Forget the laptop and a settlement, that's all off the table now.

haha you are funny

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

In what way were they shifting blame to customers? All I can gather is that they realized an error on their website and did what they could to salvage the orders that exploited that obvious error.

The spirit of the consumer protection laws we have regarding contracts is to protect innocent consumers from greedy companies, not to enable greedy consumers to take advantage of companies that make innocent mistakes.

The reason your response is stupid is because companies take advantage of consumers everyday. Unless YOU are naive enough to believe that what you pay for is "fair market value" or the company's "cost". BS. There's built-in margins, but in any case, I'm not going to debate about the right of corporations to earn profits.

We were talking about Lenovo shipping the product AND charging people's CCs, before deciding to divert packages from the customer who were the rightful owners. Furthermore, the refunds still HAVE NOT been processed (2 weeks later) and many of us will have a $500 payment that we will need to pay our credit card company, along with any interest charges, if applicable. And guess what, almost all of us who've already PAID still don't have a product to offset the bill/payment.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

haha you are funny

haha, not as funny as your little complaint/SOL story about Future Shop. LOL! :D
You should've done something other than just complaining on RFD, like some of us who've taken on the task/duty of excercising our consumer rights for the greater community.

Cyder, here's a quote that is befitting of your posts on FS. ;)
"Complaints without action is just whinning. No one likes whinners".
-Anonymous

[justmoe]

Never bought a thing from Lenovo, I just read and learn. And what I've learned is they make a superior product but suck in every other way. My next laptop will likely be an Apple.

there are enough sheep in the world. what more do you want then a superior product? Also, Lenovo has very good customer service, better then most. reading bad things from a bunch of hot heads who were themselves trying to get away with something they already knew they might not get does not make a bad company. i can guarantee you will find 100 times more good reviews about lenovo products then bad reviews.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

there are enough sheep in the world. what more do you want then a superior product? Also, Lenovo has very good customer service, better then most. reading bad things from a bunch of hot heads who were themselves trying to get away with something they already knew they might not get does not make a bad company. i can guarantee you will find 100 times more good reviews about lenovo products then bad reviews.

Hey Justmoe, do you work for Lenovo? How about you send me $500 of YOUR money and I'll keep it for a month without paying you any interest. Then let's see if you have the same opinion of Lenono, rofl. Please refrain from spreading lies about the company and the quality of Lenovo products have been going down (T420 short battery life, T430 changing the K/B layouts etc...)

If you haven't been in a similar situation, then you don't know how it feels. Lenovo's basically holding our product and money hostage! :evil: And I seriously doubt you'll have the same positive opinion of the company if it backed out of a promise to deliver a product, yet decided that holding your money WAS NOT an issue.

[cyder]

haha, not as funny as your little complaint/SOL story about Future Shop. LOL! :D
You should've done something other than just complaining on RFD, like some of us who've taken on the task/duty of excercising our consumer rights for the greater community.

Cyder, here's a quote that is befitting of your posts on FS. ;)
"Complaints without action is just whinning. No one likes whinners".
-Anonymous

I dont shop at fs, that was a summary of other peoples complaints.

But you are right, you are fighting for such a noble cause, to allow rampant consumerism. Them not reversing charges sucks but on the otherhand you seem to be the one who purchased a product you cant afford

[hagbard]

there are enough sheep in the world. what more do you want then a superior product? Also, Lenovo has very good customer service, better then most. reading bad things from a bunch of hot heads who were themselves trying to get away with something they already knew they might not get does not make a bad company. i can guarantee you will find 100 times more good reviews about lenovo products then bad reviews.

Already said they have a good product, but what I mostly read about them is how they have lots of price errors, just say too bad when they're found, and are awful at actually getting the product shipped in a reasonable time (less so now than in the past). Oh, and screwing up orders. I wouldn't buy a notebook computer from a mail order outfit regardless.

[porphyra]

Hey Justmoe, do you work for Lenovo? How about you send me $500 of YOUR money and I'll keep it for a month without paying you any interest. Then let's see if you have the same opinion of Lenono, rofl. Please refrain from spreading lies about the company and the quality of Lenovo products have been going down (T420 short battery life, T430 changing the K/B layouts etc...)

If you haven't been in a similar situation, then you don't know how it feels. Lenovo's basically holding our product and money hostage! :evil: And I seriously doubt you'll have the same positive opinion of the company if it backed out of a promise to deliver a product, yet decided that holding your money WAS NOT an issue.

I think you need to calm down as little, as now you just seem greedy and whiny and do not endear many to your cause. First, it's been 2 weeks and not a month since the orders. I too placed an order, knowing that it was likely a price error. I got the cancellation email, like EVERYONE else, and left it there.

Now that they shipped some out, by mistake, and after sending the cancellation email, is gross incompetence on their part. However, you haven't "Lost" money or interest, as it is charged to your credit card and NOT your bank account. CC companies give 21-30 days grace to pay off your balance before they charge interest. Even if you try to do a charge back, you will be told by your CC company that you need to give the retailer 30 days to refund your amount.

I think the guy who used the glass of water analogy summed it perfectly. You were now invested in getting the laptop after getting the shipping notice. You can argue that a handful actually got their laptop so should you. However, then a much greater proportion of people could argue that we should also receive our laptops, and its not fair that only a fraction got shipped out.

If they do not return your money within 30 days, then you have a legitimate beef and we can rally with your cause. Otherwise, "read" the above about being whiny and greedy.

You, I and a lot of others agree that Lenovo is grossly incompetent. If you want to show them that, the best way to do it is to take your business to another competitor. Once they see droves moving to their competition, hopefully they will get the message. I do hope you get your laptop. But you have to realize that first thing Monday/Tuesday, before the laptops shipped, they had sent everyone an email that this was a price error and they will cancel the orders.

I have had Staples do this to me and kept my money for 29 days where my laptop was lost in some mysterious warehouse. Eventually they refunded my money but they do take awhile. It was annoying, and I avoid shopping at staples now, but that is just the way these things are. Life is too short to get this worked up.

And no, I don't work for Lenovo.

[ashground]

I just wanted to chime in and say that Lenovo has been the best customer service I've ever experienced from a tech company. I bought an x220 from them, but regretted getting the regular display (and not their Premium HD). I sent them an e-mail asking if it was possible to return the laptop and get one with the better screen. I ended up getting a call from them the next day. Not only did they allow me to return it, they paid all the shipping charges and actually gave me a discount on the cost of the Premium upgrade. And then, a week after I got the new laptop, I got another call from them, just wanting to make sure that I was happy with the new display.

Honestly, I'll never buy a laptop from any other company ever again. They had even given me a phone number and extension for someone directly responsible for the exchange. It was amazing. Not only that, but they have an entire website devoted to fixing their laptops and video guides for replacing parts.

One great story about their customer service doesn't negate what the OP went through, but neither should people let one bad story sour them.

[Terrific_Deals2k8]

I'm guessing this thread will be updated once a lot of RFDer's have their T430s orders cancelled BUT still charged on their CC's ;)