BCLC online gambling is such a scam

[jkiller]

Long time lurker here, but I feel I need to inform you that DO NOT PLAY BCLC online casino games. I've been playing blackjack and usually end up even. However recently I tried baccarat. In baccarat, there are 3 places to bet. Banker, player, and tie. In this game the person(banker or player) who gets closest to 9 wins. In the event of a tie, then the money is returned to you. If you play player you get 1 to 1 odds, if you play banker you also get 1 to 1 odds, however, you pay a 5 percent commision. So basically, you have a 50/50 chance of winning. I put down 100 bucks and played banker. In 20 hands, I won 2 and lost 18. There is no way, that would happen in a real casino. I've seen streaks before. So any other RFDers want to chime in their online experience gambling?

[007craft]

I played blackjack online once for one of the American casinos. I lost $100 really fast on $1 hands. It was something like 120 losses to 20 wins.

There is absolutely no way that would ever happen in a real casino. I was playing by the basic hit on 16 if dealer was showing higher rule. The problem wasent even me busting. It was the dealer hitting blackjack or 20 almost every hand. I learned my lesson there and never played online gambling again. The facts are, unless we can see the source code for the game were playing, we have no idea how it was programed. Companies could very well program these games to be slightly in their favor and they are not going to tell us.

[Hugh Jass]

There is no way, that would happen in a real casino. I've seen streaks before. So any other RFDers want to chime in their online experience gambling?

OP, take the BCLC out of the title.

[blainehamilton]

Playing in an online casino is for suckers and addicts.

You might as well send your money to a nigeria prince via western union.

[stuntman]

OP...if you are doing online casino gambling you are showing a strong indication that you are a gambling addict.
Get help.

Also:
-The house taking 5% cut? That is not shocking....what did you expect them not to be in it for a profit. This is normal gambling house stuff.

-Why would you trust a gambling site? IT seems like the ideal environment for a thief to take you money.

[Justin]

OP, take the BCLC out of the title.

Haha, why? You or someone you know work for them?

[manixc]

All games are designed to have rakes for the house and all games are designed with volatility in mind.

While the game might be 50/50, it is only 50/50 after a million games.

Think coin toss, you can get head 10 times in a row but over long term, it gets closer to 50% head.


anyway, don't gamble, go donate or something.

[virgilaug]

I played blackjack online once for one of the American casinos. I lost $100 really fast on $1 hands. It was something like 120 losses to 20 wins.

There is absolutely no way that would ever happen in a real casino. I was playing by the basic hit on 16 if dealer was showing higher rule. The problem wasent even me busting. It was the dealer hitting blackjack or 20 almost every hand. I learned my lesson there and never played online gambling again. The facts are, unless we can see the source code for the game were playing, we have no idea how it was programed. Companies could very well program these games to be slightly in their favor and they are not going to tell us.

Could??? They are. Stay away from online games.

[Hugh Jass]

Haha, why? You or someone you know work for them?

lol, not what I meant.

Online gambling is a scam.

[PhillipJFry]

Could??? They are. Stay away from online games.

Scratch and win tickets, 6/49, Super 7 are, IMHO, transparent. They will tell you what are your chances of winning. The SportsFunder 50/50 is dependent on how many people are in the pot. Although, you get half the pot. Half goes to charity.

I never liked online gambling since I have no idea what are the odds of winning. I am pretty sure many online gambling software owners change the ratio in the software to 100 to 1 payout.

[steve-0101]

OP, take the BCLC out of the title.

I came in here to post exactly this.

[zz000ter]

Lotteries are a tax on stupidity

[jkiller]

Thank you for your replies. No I do not have a gambling problem. I was trying a progressive betting system which worked great in theory. I was able to cash out $32 bucks the previous day, and 30 bucks yesterday. I was surprised that when playing a game which has a 50/50 chance of winning, i ended up lossing 18 times out of 20 bets. I expected more out of a governement backed gaming entity, and didn't expect them to be of the same caliber as those sleazy us gambling websites. In fact, if you go online, you can't even find out their payout ratios for slots, or the provider of their gambling software. I didn't lose that much. except for my faith in bclc.

[XtremeModder]

Never tried online gambling.

However I really like blackjack at the casino now, however I barely ever go, what I do now is play on a site called hitorstand.net and it'll tell you what you should have done if you make a mistake that doesn't really work in your favour.

So I went last week, doubled my $ and went home.

Lesson to learn: play in a real casino...

[q1w2e3]

I played before, i played on pinnaclespots with my sports betting fund,

you lose some and you win some... its not impossible but you never know if they are indeed rigging it.

(i only play $1 hands STATIC when i'm bored and have literally nothing to do in the morning)

[sourkeys]

Well very sOon Ontario will be offering this. Apparently minimum payout will continue to be 85%

[DearSummer]

Thank you for your replies. No I do not have a gambling problem. I was trying a progressive betting system which worked great in theory. I was able to cash out $32 bucks the previous day, and 30 bucks yesterday. I was surprised that when playing a game which has a 50/50 chance of winning, i ended up lossing 18 times out of 20 bets. I expected more out of a governement backed gaming entity, and didn't expect them to be of the same caliber as those sleazy us gambling websites. In fact, if you go online, you can't even find out their payout ratios for slots, or the provider of their gambling software. I didn't lose that much. except for my faith in bclc.

The progressive betting system does not work well in theory. Do your research.

The fact that you think losing X amount of times in a row is proof of a rigged system is idiotic.

[stillmatic11]

Always baffles me how clueless the general public is when it comes to gambling. I guess it's not too surprising though, otherwise nobody would ever gamble if they knew their true odds of winning. The illusion of possibly winning needs to exist for people to gamble in the first place. Some online casinos will scam their customers, just the way it is when there is a way to make a quick buck. However, they don't need to scam you to make money, because online gambling aside from poker is already unbeatable. Blackjack is only beatable if you are counting, you obviously can't count cards online. These government run online casinos have no reason to scam you when their house edge is unbeatable in the first place.

Progressive Betting systems (Martingale) do not work, because of table limits.

The OP does not understand variance. 20 games is such a small sample size, it's just silly to base conclusions off that.

[jkiller]

The system I tried would allow me to break even if i won a little more than 40 percent of the time. It isn't your typical martingal system. I would bet one unit each time, and if i lost, I would raise the betting by 1 unit. If I won, i would reduce the bet by 1 unit. ie if i were to lose 6 times in a row and win the following 4. The betting pattern would be 1+2+3+4+5+6. -7 -6 -5. In this situation i would lose 21 dollars from the first 6 bets. on the following 3 bets i would win 18 betting units, as the wager would be 7 betting units, followed by 6 betting units, then 5 betting units. As you can see, If I won 6 times and lost 3. I would only be down by 3 betting units. For those who excel in statistics, can you explain how this system is faulty. I set a limit on what i wager as i don`t want to go overboard.

[Firebot]

The system I tried would allow me to break even if i won a little more than 40 percent of the time. It isn't your typical martingal system. I would bet one unit each time, and if i lost, I would raise the betting by 1 unit. If I won, i would reduce the bet by 1 unit. ie if i were to lose 6 times in a row and win the following 4. The betting pattern would be 1+2+3+4+5+6. -7 -6 -5. In this situation i would lose 21 dollars from the first 6 bets. on the following 3 bets i would win 18 betting units, as the wager would be 7 betting units, followed by 6 betting units, then 5 betting units. As you can see, If I won 6 times and lost 3. I would only be down by 3 betting units. For those who excel in statistics, can you explain how this system is faulty. I set a limit on what i wager as i don`t want to go overboard.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: There is no such thing as beating the system or breaking even. Casinos love addicts who think they have a system. The fact is you can lose 20 straight hands in a row and no system will save you. Not to mention that with your so called system you minimize your winnings if you go on a winning streak. You win 10 times to start then lose 10 times. Guess what? You are in the hole based on your system. 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 = 10 units won 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 = 54 units lost. It would take you another 10 game winning streak to breakeven despite in effect winning 50 percent of the time already. You are screwed with your logic because of minimum bets and table limits. You actually found a way to lose more money then normal with your so called system lol.

[stillmatic11]

The system I tried would allow me to break even if i won a little more than 40 percent of the time. It isn't your typical martingal system. I would bet one unit each time, and if i lost, I would raise the betting by 1 unit. If I won, i would reduce the bet by 1 unit. ie if i were to lose 6 times in a row and win the following 4. The betting pattern would be 1+2+3+4+5+6. -7 -6 -5. In this situation i would lose 21 dollars from the first 6 bets. on the following 3 bets i would win 18 betting units, as the wager would be 7 betting units, followed by 6 betting units, then 5 betting units. As you can see, If I won 6 times and lost 3. I would only be down by 3 betting units. For those who excel in statistics, can you explain how this system is faulty. I set a limit on what i wager as i don`t want to go overboard.

Pretty simple why it's faulty. Every bet you make is negative Expected Value. Whether you bet 1 unit or 10 units, it doesn't matter because the long-term expectation is that you will lose money from making this bet. The Martingale System at least would work if there were no betting limits and you have an infinite bankroll. Your system of betting more units after a previous loss and less units after a previous win does nothing for you and you would still lose money using it even with no betting limits and an infinite bankroll.

[jkiller]

There is no such thing as beating the system or breaking even. Casinos love addicts who think they have a system. The fact is you can lose 20 straight hands in a row and no system will save you. Not to mention that with your so called system you minimize your winnings if you go on a winning streak. You win 10 times to start then lose 10 times. Guess what? You are in the hole based on your system. 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 = 10 units won 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 = 54 units lost. It would take you another 10 game winning streak to breakeven despite in effect winning 50 percent of the time already. You are screwed with your logic because of minimum bets and table limits. You actually found a way to lose more money then normal with your so called system lol.

I disagree with this as If you win the following 10 hands you would win 65 betting units. 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 = 65. So this way makes more money.


Your system of betting more units after a previous loss and less units after a previous win does nothing for you and you would still lose money using it even with no betting limits and an infinite bankroll.

Can you explain why its a negative expected value? If i lose 8 times in a row and win the following 8. then the lost would be 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 = 36. The following wins would be 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 = 44. So with no betting limits and an infinite bankroll. If i won 40 percent of the time, wouldn't i be winning money?

[colossk]

OP, do you really think you invented a system to beat a game that no one else has thought of for all the years baccarat has been around? People have been trying to beat the casino games for years and they can't simply because the casino has a built in edge. Every bet you palce in a casino is +EV for the Casino and -EV for you.

The only games that are beatable are poker and blackjack(if you can card count which you can't do online)

[rommelrommel]

Wow, so much ignorance here. 18/20 losses doesn't prove a damned thing and there's no system to beat probability in the long run. Online gaming is a total scam but are you've proven is that you don't understand gaming. It's entertainment at best.

[Raptors]

Did a quick simulation of 10 million 20 hand sequences ignoring ties.

Probabilities based on http://wizardofodds.com/games/baccarat/ and assuming an 8 deck shoe.

Number of winning hands for banker per 20 hand sequence is shown below:

[0] => 7
[1] => 129
[2] => 1427
[3] => 8908
[4] => 39059
[5] => 128894
[6] => 332001
[7] => 678737
[8] => 1135808
[9] => 1556880
[10] => 1757382
[11] => 1643144
[12] => 1265998
[13] => 801052
[14] => 412082
[15] => 168218
[16] => 54724
[17] => 13062
[18] => 2227
[19] => 245
[20] => 16

Shows around a 1 in 7,008 chance of banker winning only 2 out of 20 hands.

P.S. Player bet is not 1 to 1 as there are more combinations for the banker to win. There are different rules for when player and banker have to draw a third card.

[twoplustwo]

Wow such ignorance when it comes to gambling in this thread. Look, it's very simple. YOU CANNOT WIN MONEY PLAYING ANY GAME IN A CASINO. Sure, you might be on the right side of variance once in a while, but overall in the long term you simply cannot win. If you really must gamble in a casino, learn to play poker against other humans (not video poker).

[sleepyguy]

poker ONLY online... casino online is all scams... super rigged. Even poker is getting pretty 'iffy' online. Play BJ live but still you are losing EV on every hand so it's a suckers game.

only time I play casino games is free drinks :) penny slots + free booze FTW! :)

[t3359]

Pretty simple why it's faulty. Every bet you make is negative Expected Value. Whether you bet 1 unit or 10 units, it doesn't matter because the long-term expectation is that you will lose money from making this bet.

Not to detract from the train of thought, but the expected value isn't negative. Your expected value is:
= (your bet) * (expected value)

Probability of losing 18 of 20 is (been a while, so someone correct me if I'm wrong):
= (20 choose 18) * (40%^2 * (1 - 40%)^18)
= 190 * 0.0000162495930669466
~ 0.3%

i.e., fairly unlikely.

bjl

[Montague]

Wow such ignorance when it comes to gambling in this thread. Look, it's very simple. YOU CANNOT WIN MONEY PLAYING ANY GAME IN A CASINO. Sure, you might be on the right side of variance once in a while, but overall in the long term you simply cannot win. If you really must gamble in a casino, learn to play poker against other humans (not video poker).

You can if you are a good 'card counter' in BlackJack.

Course the casinos know this and are able to strong arm the local governments to claim that "card counting is cheating" and thus kick you out.

[Hugh Jass]

YOU CANNOT WIN MONEY PLAYING ANY GAME IN A CASINO.

It's pretty rare but it's possible if you're very disciplined. My best bud makes a small fortune playing BJ. He brings in $500 and leaves his plastic at home ( learnt the hard way years back) and if he loses it, he goes home. He wins probably 8 out of 10 times, making anything from $500-$3,000, depending on the day. This year he's $40,000 in the black.

[jkiller]

Did a quick simulation of 10 million 20 hand sequences ignoring ties.

Probabilities based on http://wizardofodds.com/games/baccarat/ and assuming an 8 deck shoe.

Number of winning hands for banker per 20 hand sequence is shown below:

[0] => 7
[1] => 129
[2] => 1427
[3] => 8908
[4] => 39059
[5] => 128894
[6] => 332001
[7] => 678737
[8] => 1135808
[9] => 1556880
[10] => 1757382
[11] => 1643144
[12] => 1265998
[13] => 801052
[14] => 412082
[15] => 168218
[16] => 54724
[17] => 13062
[18] => 2227
[19] => 245
[20] => 16

Shows around a 1 in 7,008 chance of banker winning only 2 out of 20 hands.


Not to detract from the train of thought, but the expected value isn't negative. Your expected value is:
= (your bet) * (expected value)

Probability of losing 18 of 20 is (been a while, so someone correct me if I'm wrong):
= (20 choose 18) * (40%^2 * (1 - 40%)^18)
= 190 * 0.0000162495930669466
~ 0.3%

i.e., fairly unlikely.


Thank you for some hard evidence showing how slim a probability of losing 18 hands of 20. Some people are baffled at how clueless the general public is when it comes to gambling, yet they themselves don't know the actual statistics. I never said I knew how to beat the casino. I merely wanted to risk x amount of dollars($100) and hopefully be on the right side of variance long enough so that even losing the $100, I will still be ahead. I only played 150 or so hands and surprised that I would lose 18 out of 20 hands so soon. Thus proving that the system is rigged.
bjl

[Firebot]

I disagree with this as If you win the following 10 hands you would win 65 betting units. 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 = 65. So this way makes more money.


If you truly make money with your system no matter what and believe it's even 'better' then Martingdale, what's the reason why you stopped when you were 2 for 20? You'd just have to win the next 18 out of 20 times to make money :facepalm:. BTW winning 10 in a row, losing the next 10 in a row, then winning the next 10 in a row is much more unlikely then losing a mere 18 out of 20 times:|



Thank you for some hard evidence showing how slim a probability of losing 18 hands of 20. Some people are baffled at how clueless the general public is when it comes to gambling, yet they themselves don't know the actual statistics. I never said I knew how to beat the casino. I merely wanted to risk x amount of dollars($100) and hopefully be on the right side of variance long enough so that even losing the $100, I will still be ahead. I only played 150 or so hands and surprised that I would lose 18 out of 20 hands so soon. Thus proving that the system is rigged.
bjl

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: Enjoy your gambling addiction. Trust me, you will get a lot worse then 18 hands out of 20 variance no matter what the odds are showing and the fact you think the game is rigged solely because of that is proof you are an addict. And 1 in 7008 odds is nothing if you play a lot in any gambling game, and that you have as many chances as losing 19 out of 20 times or 20 out of 20 times over a certain period.

Watch this 1 in 1.2 billion chance poker hand, caught on TV as it happened no less! Clearly the World Series of Poker is rigged beyond belief according to your logic:facepalm:.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDGBvzEVwYM

[stillmatic11]

I disagree with this as If you win the following 10 hands you would win 65 betting units. 11 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 = 65. So this way makes more money.

.

Can you explain why its a negative expected value? If i lose 8 times in a row and win the following 8. then the lost would be 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 = 36. The following wins would be 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 = 44. So with no betting limits and an infinite bankroll. If i won 40 percent of the time, wouldn't i be winning money?

I already explained it several times. Every individual bet has the expected value in the negative, because the house has an edge. Altering betting amounts based on previous outcomes doesn't change this fact. For your sample size, you would come out ahead with those results. That is no different than going on a hot run of cards and coming out ahead for a session. That doesn't make it a winning strategy in the long run. It's funny you bring up this lose 8 in a row and then win 8 in a row example which is far more unlikely to happen than losing 18 out of 20 hands.

[stillmatic11]

Not to detract from the train of thought, but the expected value isn't negative. Your expected value is:
= (your bet) * (expected value)

Probability of losing 18 of 20 is (been a while, so someone correct me if I'm wrong):
= (20 choose 18) * (40%^2 * (1 - 40%)^18)
= 190 * 0.0000162495930669466
~ 0.3%

i.e., fairly unlikely.

bjl

I'm a poker player, so we use -EV in any situation where we expect to lose money. Losing 18 out of 20 hands is unlucky, doesn't mean it's rigged.

[t3359]

I'm a poker player, so we use -EV in any situation where we expect to lose money. Losing 18 out of 20 hands is unlucky, doesn't mean it's rigged.

Ahhh, I see. In stats, we would say that the EV in this case is 40%.

bjl

[bdhashe]

i have played many casinos all over north america... joined bclc for the ease of use......................... DO NOT JOIN.................... they profile their customers based on their betting habits amount $ per hand ect ect... you will never win............. odds of winning is way less than visiting a casino anonymously ........ once bclc online learns your betting habits you are screwed....... bclc is a huge scam................. DO NOT FEED THE MONSTER

[jjboy]

OP...if you are doing online casino gambling you are showing a strong indication that you are a gambling addict.
Get help.

Also:
-The house taking 5% cut? That is not shocking....what did you expect them not to be in it for a profit. This is normal gambling house stuff.

-Why would you trust a gambling site? IT seems like the ideal environment for a thief to take you money.

Do you know much about how Casino works? All games are in favour of the house, so Casinos can be commission free and still earn a profit. I have been to Casinos with no commissions. They are not hard to find.

[Beachdown]

I play on partycasino. Win some, lose some. A couple of big wins put me ahead early on ($14K and $5K within a month) so I'm far ahead of the game. I stay away during the week and put limits on deposits in case I'm tempted. It's all fun and games but I can see how it could turn into a serious problem - it's not for the faint of heart and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone. Too easy when you just have to click the mouse as opposed to making the effort to go to a casino. When OLG brings their casino online, I think there's going to be a serious increase in problem gambling.

[starboy869]

I haven't played poker in ages. However there's a few time where I brought $20 to the table and at the end of the night walked away with $300. However there's other times $50 to the table and poof gone + $10 for two beers.

Gambling for me is entertainment. I don't need a system. I just need to read the player.

[toros]

This kind of stuff is a waste of cash.

If you're going to gamble...At least play real poker, or real roulette [betting red or black quite decent odds].

Or do like me and sportsbet.

As long as you keep it to a reasonable amount you can afford.

but the online casino ***** is a waste of coin.

[Hello-]

Luls online gambling. There's no agency that goes through their source code and approves their program. Even if there was they can change the odds however they want to pass inspection then rig it back the next day.

[jmjoseph]

I only play the freebets they give out. Won some nice coin with those.