Take a new job, or sit tight?

[Icedawn]

I see myself at a crossroads, and curious to hear if anyone else has been in a similar position, and what they did or would do.

I started my career as a professional a few years ago at a first, very highly respected boutique firm in my field. I also spent a couple years there as a student before hand.

After about a year and a half, I left for a much bigger, also highly respected firm. I've spent about a year and a half here now.

There's now an opportunity for me to jump into the management of an unknown but growing small-medium sized tech company (200 < employees < 500). I'd be reporting directly to the CEO.

Now, normally, I would jump at it, but here's the thing.

A) On the side for the last few years, I've co-founded a VERY small, but growing web startup. I'd peg the odds of the startup starting to generate enough revenue/profit in the next year or two to support my partner and I full time at about 20%. If I had my way, I would love to focus on my startup, but it's a long shot, and my partner and I have a lifestyle to maintain in the meantime. =)

B) My overall experience with my profession has been extremely poor. It's long hours, highly stressful, and not very rewarding. Basically, I'm willing to do almost anything to get out of my current position. That being said, there's a good chance I would love doing what I do at a tech company instead of a professional services firm (i.e. if I was more integrated with the actual business, instead of simply being a third-party service provider)

C) In view of B), prior to this position being advertised, I'd actually just started working with some friends, including my wife, on putting together a new bricks and mortar business that a view to starting in about a year from now. My role was going to be pure management. That is, I was going to leave my profession altogether to work on building this new business (while concurrently continuing to do A).

So here's my quandrary. Do I take this new job which will be extremely challenging, but if I do well at it, put me well on the path to senior management? Does it matter that there's probably a 70%+ chance that, regardless of what happens, I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different? Do I sit tight at the position that I currently hate and wait until this new business is ready to go?

I recognize this may be a fairly unusual situation, so I guess I'm curious to hear from other professional service folk (e.g. accountants, lawyers, management consultants, ibankers, etc...) who had to face the choice of continuing with their high-stress careers or make the jump to something completely different and more low key. Do you regret your decision? How did you make the decision?

Happy to hear from any and all - my friends fit a certain mold and so they have a certain perspective, curious to hear what others think (assuming this little story makes any sense at all).

[damnos]

You already hated where you are now and have an opportunity for a fresh new challenge that also lead to career progression - take it.

Whatever comes next with your startup and business, deal with it when it's time, not now. If you move now and in a year your leave to pursue your own business there's no harm and in fact you might benefit from the experience of the new position.

If you don't leave now, you just prolonging the position you hate. If your business succeed then you will be lucky to jump out but if it doesn't hen you are stuck at the miserable job.

[danfromwaterloo]

I see myself at a crossroads, and curious to hear if anyone else has been in a similar position, and what they did or would do.

I started my career as a professional a few years ago at a first, very highly respected boutique firm in my field. I also spent a couple years there as a student before hand.

After about a year and a half, I left for a much bigger, also highly respected firm. I've spent about a year and a half here now.

There's now an opportunity for me to jump into the management of an unknown but growing small-medium sized tech company (200 < employees < 500). I'd be reporting directly to the CEO.

Now, normally, I would jump at it, but here's the thing.

A) On the side for the last few years, I've co-founded a VERY small, but growing web startup. I'd peg the odds of the startup starting to generate enough revenue/profit in the next year or two to support my partner and I full time at about 20%. If I had my way, I would love to focus on my startup, but it's a long shot, and my partner and I have a lifestyle to maintain in the meantime. =)

B) My overall experience with my profession has been extremely poor. It's long hours, highly stressful, and not very rewarding. Basically, I'm willing to do almost anything to get out of my current position. That being said, there's a good chance I would love doing what I do at a tech company instead of a professional services firm (i.e. if I was more integrated with the actual business, instead of simply being a third-party service provider)

C) In view of B), prior to this position being advertised, I'd actually just started working with some friends, including my wife, on putting together a new bricks and mortar business that a view to starting in about a year from now. My role was going to be pure management. That is, I was going to leave my profession altogether to work on building this new business (while concurrently continuing to do A).

So here's my quandrary. Do I take this new job which will be extremely challenging, but if I do well at it, put me well on the path to senior management? Does it matter that there's probably a 70%+ chance that, regardless of what happens, I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different? Do I sit tight at the position that I currently hate and wait until this new business is ready to go?

I recognize this may be a fairly unusual situation, so I guess I'm curious to hear from other professional service folk (e.g. accountants, lawyers, management consultants, ibankers, etc...) who had to face the choice of continuing with their high-stress careers or make the jump to something completely different and more low key. Do you regret your decision? How did you make the decision?

Happy to hear from any and all - my friends fit a certain mold and so they have a certain perspective, curious to hear what others think (assuming this little story makes any sense at all).

Here's a problem that I see:

You seem to be jumping around a lot. Those are some warning signs to hiring managers. I personally see red flags on resumes for people who have only been in roles for a few years before jumping ship. Shows that either they're either unreliable or don't know where they're headed. I would say a minimum of four years at a firm. If you jump ship now to your third firm, from what I read, then "I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different", you'll put up a permanent red flag on your career.

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

[damnos]

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

I disagree.

Although jumping around too often is bad - 4 years is quite a long time.

Sure if in those 4 years with the same company you constantly progress, then why not. But due to various factors, companies often cannot keep up with the progression: may be the individual is super smart and company bureaucracy doesn't allow him/her to progress, or in tech where the latest and greatest change so fast while a company is tied to certain older technologies.

Jumping around every few months will look bad, but I think 1 year is about the limit where you should already give back enough contribution and possible to move. Obviously, this makes sense only when the move is vertical (an actual progression) as oppose to horizontal movement (move to do the same thing)

Obviously my background is in tech, different industry might be different.

[x2007ura]

Here's a problem that I see:

You seem to be jumping around a lot. Those are some warning signs to hiring managers. I personally see red flags on resumes for people who have only been in roles for a few years before jumping ship. Shows that either they're either unreliable or don't know where they're headed. I would say a minimum of four years at a firm. If you jump ship now to your third firm, from what I read, then "I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different", you'll put up a permanent red flag on your career.

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

Would depend on the type of work, field, locations, etc.

I'd say go for it, if you're finding openings in large firms as it is, they aren't suddenly going to disappear if you sadly are unable to be an entrepreneur for whatever reason. Life's too short!

[Abel4Life]

Here's a problem that I see:

You seem to be jumping around a lot. Those are some warning signs to hiring managers. I personally see red flags on resumes for people who have only been in roles for a few years before jumping ship. Shows that either they're either unreliable or don't know where they're headed. I would say a minimum of four years at a firm. If you jump ship now to your third firm, from what I read, then "I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different", you'll put up a permanent red flag on your career.

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

So what about those whom work project to project as contractors, whether incorporated or through an agency? Some can be 3 months, 6 months, 1 year + etc. Going by your red flag logic I would be unemployed right now and probably the majority of the contractors at my client site.

[danfromwaterloo]

So what about those whom work project to project as contractors, whether incorporated or through an agency? Some can be 3 months, 6 months, 1 year + etc. Going by your red flag logic I would be unemployed right now and probably the majority of the contractors at my client site.

It still says something about the person. And there is a market for contract people, but I was talking about permanent staff.

[Abel4Life]

It still says something about the person. And there is a market for contract people, but I was talking about permanent staff.

Agreed regarding market for contract people but I disagree that it says something about the person. What's the difference if a person is working many projects through a firm as a full-timer than working those projects independently without a firm?

[Icedawn]

Here's a problem that I see:

You seem to be jumping around a lot. Those are some warning signs to hiring managers. I personally see red flags on resumes for people who have only been in roles for a few years before jumping ship. Shows that either they're either unreliable or don't know where they're headed. I would say a minimum of four years at a firm. If you jump ship now to your third firm, from what I read, then "I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different", you'll put up a permanent red flag on your career.

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

This is a big worry for me as well.

I'm hoping what works in my favour is that both this jump, and the last jump, are both quite "diagonal" jumps. The first actually changed the nature of my work quite a lot (e.g. I wouldn't have been contemplated for this position but for my last 18 months of experience), and this next jump would be a big jump in responsibility (e.g. from a junior in my current firm to part of the senior management team while being probably 10-25 years younger than everyone else).

Let's say I do leave again after a year... do you think this could all be spun as "youthful" indecisiveness? I'll be in my 30s by then, might have a family by then, etc... a whole different person? Does this type of stuff stick with you forever?

[Icedawn]

Would depend on the type of work, field, locations, etc.

I'd say go for it, if you're finding openings in large firms as it is, they aren't suddenly going to disappear if you sadly are unable to be an entrepreneur for whatever reason. Life's too short!


You already hated where you are now and have an opportunity for a fresh new challenge that also lead to career progression - take it.

Whatever comes next with your startup and business, deal with it when it's time, not now. If you move now and in a year your leave to pursue your own business there's no harm and in fact you might benefit from the experience of the new position.

If you don't leave now, you just prolonging the position you hate. If your business succeed then you will be lucky to jump out but if it doesn't hen you are stuck at the miserable job.

This is fundamentally the thinking that's going through my mind.... but it's just so contrary to what's expected of me from so many people around me (work for big companies, stick with your job in the long term, focus on a single goal at a time, etc...) that it's tough. If I do this, I'll somehow need to balance three big priorities.... figure out how to do a completely new and apparently highly demanding job, figure out how to start a brand new bricks and mortar business, and figure out how to grow a fledging tech start-up. Maybe that's too crazy to think I can do all three successfully? (There's definitely an argument to be made that our start-up isn't yet successful partly because I've been doing too many other things concurrently, including spending time learning my LAST job....)

[danfromwaterloo]

Agreed regarding market for contract people but I disagree that it says something about the person. What's the difference if a person is working many projects through a firm as a full-timer than working those projects independently without a firm?

The only reason someone would take a number of little contracts is either because the market is so awful that there's nothing there permanent, or they're going to cash in on the high money for short term period deal that goes along with contract work. I would never hire a person that flitters around on 6 month contracts because that tells me that they're just looking for big bucks. They're hired guns. Yes, there's a market for it, but since I hire for permanent positions, that would never suit me or my team.

[danfromwaterloo]

This is a big worry for me as well.

I'm hoping what works in my favour is that both this jump, and the last jump, are both quite "diagonal" jumps. The first actually changed the nature of my work quite a lot (e.g. I wouldn't have been contemplated for this position but for my last 18 months of experience), and this next jump would be a big jump in responsibility (e.g. from a junior in my current firm to part of the senior management team while being probably 10-25 years younger than everyone else).

Let's say I do leave again after a year... do you think this could all be spun as "youthful" indecisiveness? I'll be in my 30s by then, might have a family by then, etc... a whole different person? Does this type of stuff stick with you forever?

Doesn't matter the reason for the jump. You don't put reasons on your resume. All that it will show is that you worked here for a year, then there for a year, then there for a year, etc. You don't get a chance to defend it on your resume. They just shrug and toss you into the pile of rejects. It's harsh but true. It's the single biggest turn-off I have when looking at resumes - is this person going to be a loyal employee? It shows something about the character of the person involved.

Once? Maybe a contract or a bad company. Twice? Worrisome, but maybe there's a reason. Three times? Next...

"Youthful indecisiveness" ends at college/university. This is your career, not deciding art history or music appreciation for an elective. Every move must be contemplated and the fallout must be thought about ahead of time.

[setell]

I am nowhere near your career level but I would take the executive position because it's a vertical move. You will learn skills that may help your start up and if the start up fails you'll have a plan B of another executive position at another company. I think it's a great opportunity to learn new skills and you hate your job. Can't ask for a better time for a change. The only concern is if you're say CFO/VP Finance then you'll be working hard to learn the job so your start up may suffer due to time constraints because our body can only do so much.

For once I don't agree with dan. I have no issue with moving around because in this day and age you have to look out for yourself. As to loyalty to the employer and the 4 year deal is just ridiculous to me. People move around because their employer don't/can't offer what the employee wants. It can be a variety of reasons like not enough money, no job progression, bad work environment, bad boss etc. What if you truly got rotten luck where job 1 you got bad pay, job 2 you got no progression and then in job 3 you go a crappy work environment. By dan's logic you're SOL. I actually have had crap luck in the last two jobs so crap can hit the fan and you land in garbage places back to back. Personally, dan's views only applies if you move around for horizontal movement vs vertical. Vertical movements are very difficult in accounting in a lot of companies since there isn't any opportunities available. If you have no upward movement then you leave the employee no choice but look outside the company for advancement. I would not hesitate for a big vertical jump. Usually for such a large vertical jump the chance may not come often.

A good firm that values that employee will help the employee grow into their desire career level if progression is available. If they aren't then it speaks volumes of the corporate culture and whether you want to stay with the company or not.

A huge congrats for the job offer and that is going well icedawn. Haven't seen you around in a while. :)

[damnos]

Doesn't matter the reason for the jump. You don't put reasons on your resume.

Errr ,... it kinda show from the position title ...

[redrockinhot]

Start off with the career path you want to take in. Then assess yourself what kind of job you would want to do, say for the next 10 years.

[x2007ura]

This is fundamentally the thinking that's going through my mind.... but it's just so contrary to what's expected of me from so many people around me (work for big companies, stick with your job in the long term, focus on a single goal at a time, etc...) that it's tough. If I do this, I'll somehow need to balance three big priorities.... figure out how to do a completely new and apparently highly demanding job, figure out how to start a brand new bricks and mortar business, and figure out how to grow a fledging tech start-up. Maybe that's too crazy to think I can do all three successfully? (There's definitely an argument to be made that our start-up isn't yet successful partly because I've been doing too many other things concurrently, including spending time learning my LAST job....)

Who cares what other people think? You clearly have skills which are in demand given the fact that you've been able to switch positions so many times. You're young, you don't have a family and hopefully not a huge mortgage payment to make every month. Your last point is the one that stands out to me the most, if your start-up isn't performing the way you want/need it to be, give it 100% for awhile and see what develops. Or the new B&M opportunity you want to pursue.

Say it all flops. Both businesses completely fail and you lose every penny you put into it. So what? You still have highly demanded job skills and reasonable work experience. Maybe you end up working a year or two (or maybe 5, I don't know your situation) past the retirement age you had foreseen. So your peak earning years are pushed back a bit. Is this the end of the world? Obviously it's not an ideal situation, but such is life.

I say this in no way condescendingly, but you seem to want to have your cake and eat it too. I'm guessing based on your bio you're in your late 20s. This is the perfect time to take your shot, especially if your partner is committed to it as well. Your B&M store or your start-up are going to be only delayed further if you switch to a highly demanding position as you described. So let's say it takes 3 years for it to get to the point that you can reasonably switch. You talked about possibly having a family then, so it's clearly on your mind. Do you really want to put yourself in a situation where if you now fail at this venture, it's more than just your ***** on the line?

That's kind of my thought process here, when thinking about the same sorts of decisions in my own life. I'm 25, I've got a middling middle management job that I've been in for almost 2 years since graduating and just finished paying off my massive student loan. After building up some capital in the next few years, I'd jump at the chance to see if I can survive as an entrepreneur. If it fails, I am confident in being able to return to a similar position and work my way back up the ladder and be more or less in the same position as I would have been had I continued. Perhaps I'm naive, but like I said, life's too short not to take risks (non-life threatening ones) when you're young and no one is depending on you.

It seems I want to have my cake and eat it too! :)

[danfromwaterloo]

I am nowhere near your career level but I would take the executive position because it's a vertical move. You will learn skills that may help your start up and if the start up fails you'll have a plan B of another executive position at another company. I think it's a great opportunity to learn new skills and you hate your job. Can't ask for a better time for a change. The only concern is if you're say CFO/VP Finance then you'll be working hard to learn the job so your start up may suffer due to time constraints because our body can only do so much.

For once I don't agree with dan. I have no issue with moving around because in this day and age you have to look out for yourself. As to loyalty to the employer and the 4 year deal is just ridiculous to me. People move around because their employer don't/can't offer what the employee wants. It can be a variety of reasons like not enough money, no job progression, bad work environment, bad boss etc. What if you truly got rotten luck where job 1 you got bad pay, job 2 you got no progression and then in job 3 you go a crappy work environment. By dan's logic you're SOL. I actually have had crap luck in the last two jobs so crap can hit the fan and you land in garbage places back to back. Personally, dan's views only applies if you move around for horizontal movement vs vertical. Vertical movements are very difficult in accounting in a lot of companies since there isn't any opportunities available. If you have no upward movement then you leave the employee no choice but look outside the company for advancement. I would not hesitate for a big vertical jump. Usually for such a large vertical jump the chance may not come often.

A good firm that values that employee will help the employee grow into their desire career level if progression is available. If they aren't then it speaks volumes of the corporate culture and whether you want to stay with the company or not.

A huge congrats for the job offer and that is going well icedawn. Haven't seen you around in a while. :)

I was just providing my own opinion on the matter and what I look for in staff I hire. I consider a history of serial job hopping to be a clear indicator of future behavior. Just my own judgements, and I've yet to hire a bad employee.

[Icedawn]

Doesn't matter the reason for the jump. You don't put reasons on your resume. All that it will show is that you worked here for a year, then there for a year, then there for a year, etc. You don't get a chance to defend it on your resume. They just shrug and toss you into the pile of rejects. It's harsh but true. It's the single biggest turn-off I have when looking at resumes - is this person going to be a loyal employee? It shows something about the character of the person involved.

Once? Maybe a contract or a bad company. Twice? Worrisome, but maybe there's a reason. Three times? Next...

"Youthful indecisiveness" ends at college/university. This is your career, not deciding art history or music appreciation for an elective. Every move must be contemplated and the fallout must be thought about ahead of time.


I was just providing my own opinion on the matter and what I look for in staff I hire. I consider a history of serial job hopping to be a clear indicator of future behavior. Just my own judgements, and I've yet to hire a bad employee.

In my mind, one of the ways this all plays out is that I use these initial early stepping stones (e.g. first three or four real jobs) in my career to jump as high as I can on the totem pole, before settling down a bit and committing to a company for the longer term. To a certain extent, the reason for my jumping around is very simple - I'm one of those damn millenials who isn't willing to "pay his dues" and work his way up slowly. The idea of spending literally years extra at a place seems like a very heavy price to pay to avoid looking flighty on my resume.

For example, I'm actually on the extreme lower end of the experience that was requested for the current position under discussion. Realistically, even if I stay at my current job for another 2 years, I'd still be fighting for the same type of job.

This all being said, this is all a bit moot to the actual question that I had, albeit interesting. I agree it's a major concern, but my math says that it'd likely be worth it to me to jump diagonally in this way, if it wasn't for these entirely different options altogether.

[Icedawn]

I am nowhere near your career level but I would take the executive position because it's a vertical move. You will learn skills that may help your start up and if the start up fails you'll have a plan B of another executive position at another company. I think it's a great opportunity to learn new skills and you hate your job. Can't ask for a better time for a change. The only concern is if you're say CFO/VP Finance then you'll be working hard to learn the job so your start up may suffer due to time constraints because our body can only do so much.

For once I don't agree with dan. I have no issue with moving around because in this day and age you have to look out for yourself. As to loyalty to the employer and the 4 year deal is just ridiculous to me. People move around because their employer don't/can't offer what the employee wants. It can be a variety of reasons like not enough money, no job progression, bad work environment, bad boss etc. What if you truly got rotten luck where job 1 you got bad pay, job 2 you got no progression and then in job 3 you go a crappy work environment. By dan's logic you're SOL. I actually have had crap luck in the last two jobs so crap can hit the fan and you land in garbage places back to back. Personally, dan's views only applies if you move around for horizontal movement vs vertical. Vertical movements are very difficult in accounting in a lot of companies since there isn't any opportunities available. If you have no upward movement then you leave the employee no choice but look outside the company for advancement. I would not hesitate for a big vertical jump. Usually for such a large vertical jump the chance may not come often.

A good firm that values that employee will help the employee grow into their desire career level if progression is available. If they aren't then it speaks volumes of the corporate culture and whether you want to stay with the company or not.

A huge congrats for the job offer and that is going well icedawn. Haven't seen you around in a while. :)

Well, congrats are a little premature alas. I'm quite advanced in the process, but I figured I should realistically think about whether I should even take this position if its offered. Have been taking the opportunity to ask a lot of questions and learn more about the company as the process continues.

More generally, yeah, I think I pretty much agree with everything you say. I don't have any issues jumping frequently so long it's a vertical jump, or jumping enables a subsequent vertical jump. Indeed, one of the reasons for the last move was to broaden my skill set so that I could more easily make this next jump. I actually know for a fact that they didn't even both to interview candidates that are more senior to me, and have a very similar background, due to the fact that they stayed at my last firm, whereas I moved to my current firm.

I think the issue really comes down to my other two "non-professional" options though. If those options didn't exist, this would be a no-brainer to me. The issue is that they do, and so I'm trying to figure out what to do with myself. Is being your own boss over-hyped? Am I just temporarily burned out and so I see a lifestyle business as a panacea for happiness that it isn't? Will I regret taking myself off the path to senior leadership positions so that I can focus on doing my own thing? These are the issues I'm definitely struggling with, particularly because, as you predicted, my other projects do undoubtedly suffer as a result of my day job.

Good to see you as well. As you can tell, I've been busy. :) I troll the forums, but hard to find time to actually post and follow-up on threads.

[Icedawn]

Who cares what other people think? You clearly have skills which are in demand given the fact that you've been able to switch positions so many times. You're young, you don't have a family and hopefully not a huge mortgage payment to make every month. Your last point is the one that stands out to me the most, if your start-up isn't performing the way you want/need it to be, give it 100% for awhile and see what develops. Or the new B&M opportunity you want to pursue.

Say it all flops. Both businesses completely fail and you lose every penny you put into it. So what? You still have highly demanded job skills and reasonable work experience. Maybe you end up working a year or two (or maybe 5, I don't know your situation) past the retirement age you had foreseen. So your peak earning years are pushed back a bit. Is this the end of the world? Obviously it's not an ideal situation, but such is life.

I say this in no way condescendingly, but you seem to want to have your cake and eat it too. I'm guessing based on your bio you're in your late 20s. This is the perfect time to take your shot, especially if your partner is committed to it as well. Your B&M store or your start-up are going to be only delayed further if you switch to a highly demanding position as you described. So let's say it takes 3 years for it to get to the point that you can reasonably switch. You talked about possibly having a family then, so it's clearly on your mind. Do you really want to put yourself in a situation where if you now fail at this venture, it's more than just your ***** on the line?

That's kind of my thought process here, when thinking about the same sorts of decisions in my own life. I'm 25, I've got a middling middle management job that I've been in for almost 2 years since graduating and just finished paying off my massive student loan. After building up some capital in the next few years, I'd jump at the chance to see if I can survive as an entrepreneur. If it fails, I am confident in being able to return to a similar position and work my way back up the ladder and be more or less in the same position as I would have been had I continued. Perhaps I'm naive, but like I said, life's too short not to take risks (non-life threatening ones) when you're young and no one is depending on you.

It seems I want to have my cake and eat it too! :)

No insult taken, I'll freely admit I want to have my cake and eat it too :) Who wouldn't want that. As for my bio, you're pretty close. In my mid-late 20s, professional, married, mortgage, kids in a few years probably.

As for my ventures, it's probably worth mentioning that only my tech venture is high risk. The B&M venture is actually very stable and unless I spectacularly screw us up, it'll be up and running very quickly and generating a good wage for those involved, but it's growth potential is quite limited. Basically, my tech venture is a shoot for the moon type of venture whereas the B&M venture is like starting a lifestyle business more than anything else.

The stability is actually part of the problem. Particularly since my wife will be involved in the B&M venture (and she'd likely be doing it regardless of whether or not I'm involved), it'll be a fine little business, running it's course, and it'd likely give us a comfortable upper-middle class life. I can try to grow it, but there's a cap as to how far it can go.

So really, it's more so that I see myself having two options. On the one hand, I can continue to climb the corporate ladder as quick as I can, and unless I start hitting the wall in terms of my abilities, there's at least the possibility of senior leadership positions. On the other hand, I can say screw it, stick it out for another year at my current job, launch the B&M venture then, give the tech startup another year after THAT to really take off, but realistically, I've likely significantly reduced my odds of getting to senior leadership, partially because after 3 years out of the corporate world, my skills as a professional are sure to have taken a big nose dive and I'm not sure it'll be realistic at that point in time for me to be fighting even for the same jobs that I'm realistically up for now.

Reading your thoughts on your own life, it basically comes down to your assumption that you'd be able to "return to a similar position" as before you left. Is there a reason why you don't think your skills will go downhill while you're off doing your own thing? If I felt confident that the only difference was time, I'd likely see things your way, but I'm worried that doing this would take me permanently "off track".

[professional]

Congrats on your success! It's a dilemma no doubt, but a good dilemma nonetheless.

Firstly, no offence to the other posters, but I never subscribe to any generic notions of how long one should stay at a job. Your cadence of every year to year and a half is fine. Just to give you some background colour, I graduated 8 years ago and I am currently on my 5th company. With the exception of one, all my jumps had been upwards. Plus I wouldn't want to work for someone that's too rigid and expect their employees to stay at their role for X years. A good manager wants their direct reports to be successful, even if it means taking flight elsewhere. I am a firm believer of constant growth and improvement, and your job needs to allow for that. So once your current position can no longer afford you this, it's time to move. The best way to grow professionally is to take on challenging role. Having said that, common sense still applies. If you were jumping around every few months or making illogical moves, then that will be detrimental to your career.

Now to your question, it seems both the startup and the new opportunity will provide you with excellent opportunities for professional growth. Both have their unique set of risks and rewards.

The startup can blow up and you end up losing your investment. On the flip side, it takes off and you become wildly successful. Now even if it fails, you will no doubt gain valuable experience. You can then apply that experience on future opportunities.

The management role sounds very challenging with elements of unknown. They could find out within a short timeframe that you are underqualifed, resulting in you getting canned. However based on your track record, I think you will be fine. On the positive side, the experience you will gain from this will definitely give you a boost up the corporate ladder. Plus you can apply this it on all your future endeavours, including startup. In my current role, I deal with executives and VP on a regular basis. Being in the same space and working closely with them gave me new perspective. I got to observe how they handle crisis, evaluate risks, what they care about, and even the way they communicate. I definitely learned more in 6 months than in the last 6 years.

So my suggestion to you is to pursue the management gig, with the startup as your backup. Both will provide you with excellent growth but the management opportunity is less risky. Best of luck to you.

[Cress]

I think people tend to forget about the other side of the jumper coin. Some people jump because they are the absolute best at what they do and there are very few companies out there that will keep up with your skills and overall growth (overall including perks, not just monetary).

OP, The bottom line is that you got skills and people seem to know about it, that's very good in the current economy. What I would focus on is to make sure to maintain good relationships with your past employers and keep moving up.

Remember, change is good! Someone that can challenge themselves by staying out of the comfort zone very often deserves some credit in my book.
Of course there is also good in staying at the same company for a long time and that leads me to the most important point of my post: you need a long term (multi year) plan, that will help you decide when to move or not.

Cheers mate, you're doing great, enjoy it and be grateful!


Here's a problem that I see:

You seem to be jumping around a lot. Those are some warning signs to hiring managers. I personally see red flags on resumes for people who have only been in roles for a few years before jumping ship. Shows that either they're either unreliable or don't know where they're headed. I would say a minimum of four years at a firm. If you jump ship now to your third firm, from what I read, then "I'll leave in about a year to do something completely different", you'll put up a permanent red flag on your career.

Whatever role you take next, you SHOULD stay for four years, if not longer, if you desire to continue in your current career path.

[x2007ura]

No insult taken, I'll freely admit I want to have my cake and eat it too :) Who wouldn't want that. As for my bio, you're pretty close. In my mid-late 20s, professional, married, mortgage, kids in a few years probably.

As for my ventures, it's probably worth mentioning that only my tech venture is high risk. The B&M venture is actually very stable and unless I spectacularly screw us up, it'll be up and running very quickly and generating a good wage for those involved, but it's growth potential is quite limited. Basically, my tech venture is a shoot for the moon type of venture whereas the B&M venture is like starting a lifestyle business more than anything else.

The stability is actually part of the problem. Particularly since my wife will be involved in the B&M venture (and she'd likely be doing it regardless of whether or not I'm involved), it'll be a fine little business, running it's course, and it'd likely give us a comfortable upper-middle class life. I can try to grow it, but there's a cap as to how far it can go.

So really, it's more so that I see myself having two options. On the one hand, I can continue to climb the corporate ladder as quick as I can, and unless I start hitting the wall in terms of my abilities, there's at least the possibility of senior leadership positions. On the other hand, I can say screw it, stick it out for another year at my current job, launch the B&M venture then, give the tech startup another year after THAT to really take off, but realistically, I've likely significantly reduced my odds of getting to senior leadership, partially because after 3 years out of the corporate world, my skills as a professional are sure to have taken a big nose dive and I'm not sure it'll be realistic at that point in time for me to be fighting even for the same jobs that I'm realistically up for now.

Reading your thoughts on your own life, it basically comes down to your assumption that you'd be able to "return to a similar position" as before you left. Is there a reason why you don't think your skills will go downhill while you're off doing your own thing? If I felt confident that the only difference was time, I'd likely see things your way, but I'm worried that doing this would take me permanently "off track".

I still suggest now is the time to go all out with the startup, since at this very moment you don't have "a wife, kids or a mortgage". Down the line you will, plus will not want to be working 80 hour weeks trying to grow it with a bunch of little ones running around.

I'm not sure if you mentioned your field, so perhaps my position that you could return to your a similar position if you didn't succeed might not be realistic. If it is in the tech industry in some fashion, than perhaps a few years off definitely is a massive setback. Personally, I have soft skills which I don't believe would decay significantly if I were removed from the workforce for a year or two. Your situation might be very different.

What does your significant other think of all of this?

[setell]

Well, congrats are a little premature alas. I'm quite advanced in the process, but I figured I should realistically think about whether I should even take this position if its offered. Have been taking the opportunity to ask a lot of questions and learn more about the company as the process continues.

More generally, yeah, I think I pretty much agree with everything you say. I don't have any issues jumping frequently so long it's a vertical jump, or jumping enables a subsequent vertical jump. Indeed, one of the reasons for the last move was to broaden my skill set so that I could more easily make this next jump. I actually know for a fact that they didn't even both to interview candidates that are more senior to me, and have a very similar background, due to the fact that they stayed at my last firm, whereas I moved to my current firm.

I think the issue really comes down to my other two "non-professional" options though. If those options didn't exist, this would be a no-brainer to me. The issue is that they do, and so I'm trying to figure out what to do with myself. Is being your own boss over-hyped? Am I just temporarily burned out and so I see a lifestyle business as a panacea for happiness that it isn't? Will I regret taking myself off the path to senior leadership positions so that I can focus on doing my own thing? These are the issues I'm definitely struggling with, particularly because, as you predicted, my other projects do undoubtedly suffer as a result of my day job.

Good to see you as well. As you can tell, I've been busy. :) I troll the forums, but hard to find time to actually post and follow-up on threads.

Personally, I would still go and take this new job because it’ll put you into a different league in the game. You will be in a different pool of employees if your startups do flop and you have to re-enter the work force. Leaving the new job after a year to start your own business is an excellent reason to do it and if you have to re-enter the job market I doubt anybody will look at you negatively if you tell them the truth that your business failed. That’s assuming that things don’t go so well with your ventures and you’ve still got a plan B. I am also assuming you have a spouse that can put in a big share of the work since you said she can handle the B&M side of it and be fairly self-sufficient. I would work on your start up just as you have now and help your wife out with the B&M. It’ll be an insane year or two but you’re young and the body won’t break down just yet! Let’s have the cake and eat it because it’s there for the grabbing! This is a game of risk analysis and what your tolerance are. LOL :cheesygri

I think you have to ask yourself if you’re just tired from the stress that your job/industry is giving you or you truly want to be your own boss. What is your real goal in life? I have goals and to be really honest, constant month ends, quarter ends, and year ends is not one of them. You’re giving me courage to go out and do my own startup!

You haven’t missed much other than a whole slew of trolling that’s very different than you guys. I miss you guys! LOL

[thunderchunky]

I would take the new job, let my spouse take on most of the responsibility for the B&M, and continue to plug away on the start-up on the side in the hopes that it takes off. I would re-evaluate the situation in two years, and decide whether it's worthwhile to abandon my job. That said, I don't have a very entrepreneurial spirit... and the entrepreneurs I know never seem to take a vacation.

[Icedawn]

All the thoughts and comments are definitely much appreciated. This might all be moot if I don't get the offer, but definitely helped me clarify my own thinking.

More generally, x2007ura, you're probably right actually. My soft skills are probably more important and so in that respond, I probably should worry less than I am. It's just that there's this traditional path in my field, and I'm definitely "off-track" compared to most and I wonder if I can "get back on it" a few years down the road if I wanted to. Also, my wife is very supportive of anything I choose to do. Somewhere in our relationship I've conned her into thinking I'll do okay whatever I do, so she's just looking for me to find something I'm happy doing in the long term. =)

Setell/Professional/thunderchunky - I tend to think your comments make sense. Keep plugging away, take the new job, see what I can make of it, and reevaluate later as to what exactly we're doing. One caveat is that my wife is totally capable of doing the actual "work" of the B&M venture, but she has no interest in actually running the "business" side of things - that was going to be my job. I'm not sure what would happen if I didn't end up working with her, would likely cause problems for everyone involved. But regardless, I think the consensus, and this kinda matches what I'm thinking, is that really, I don't know what the next year will bring, and so long this is a good opportunity for the time being, I should take it and see where it leads.

But again, god, I'm just so tired already. Part of me definitely is wondering whether I'm just tired, and that's why I'm looking forward to this B&M venture. Both my tech startup and my regular job are just so much work, makes me tired just thinking about it sometimes =) Maybe this is why I'm not jumping on this opportunity - I've been going full tilt for a few years now, don't know how much longer I can do this.

[thunderchunky]

If you do get an offer, see if you can set your start date a bit later and take a few weeks of vacation between jobs. It sounds like you need it!

[setell]

If you do get an offer, see if you can set your start date a bit later and take a few weeks of vacation between jobs. It sounds like you need it!

+1 Take time off to re-charge and then go out there to go to war! :D

Since this is a what if assuming you got the job, let me be a downer and say this is what I think you should do if you don't get the job. Quit your job and put 100% effort in your startup and B&M. Without the job offer I agree with x2007ura 100%. You're not content with your job and need a change. That is the best time to recharge and do something that you enjoy more. So what if you're off track to be in executive management, who gives a crap if you're happier doing something else. That is what I would do without the job offer.

[Icedawn]

Well, it's done... and I decided to go a different route than what was discussed above.

It was put to me that "the job is yours if you truly want it", but I decided that I couldn't in good faith take it. Instead, I talked to them about my other commitments, and in particular, the high likelihood that I couldn't stick around for more than a year. Obviously, a small part of me was hoping they'd work around it, but as expected, the offer is off the table now.

I think, all things considered, it was actually an amazing opportunity that would, as someone mentioned, put me into a different category. Alas, but c'est la vie. Much appreciate all the kind thoughts and useful advice.

[thunderchunky]

Follow your heart! It's obvious you want to be pursuing your new projects, and you would be selling yourself short if you didn't do that. Now you have incentive to go full throttle. Good luck!

[setell]

Glad to hear you made a decision and is happy with it! Go full force and I'm sure you'll succeed! Good luck with the startup and B&M! :D