What do you think of Korean cars?

[manteiv]

Hi all,

What do you think of the quality of the Korean cars these days? I was told that they have surpassed the Japanese quality now but I would like to have input from actual recent owners.

I have owned several Toyotas and Volks but never owned a Korean car before because I had an unfavorable opinion on them but I find their recent models in the last 3-5 years very attractive but I am unsure about the quality and reliablilty.


I am in the market for a small SUV and I have in mind the Kia Sportage or the Sorento both with current offer of 0% for up to 60 months. I have considered the RAV4, CRV, Equinox, Ford Escape and the Mazda CX5 but without the 0% financing, the cost of financing could be $2-$3k over 48-60 months.

Should I give Kia a try?

thanks

[sandikosh]

Korean cars still have some ways to go before they match the japanese in quality. Styling, they are ahead. Engineering, still behind Toyota and Nissan.

[SoroSuub1]

If you're choosing the Sportage, be sure you're okay with the abnormally large blind spots created by the fat D-pillars (rear pillars). You might figure they're okay when you buy it, but then hate it when you start commuting with it. It's the price you pay for attractive design. Note that rear cameras don't help you when you do lane changes, nor do they cover the blindspot left by the pillars when reversing (ie. they face straight behind you... you can only react after they enter the danger zone, not before)
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/2772/2011kiasportagesideview.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/151/2011kiasportagesideview.jpg/)

Other than that, no other problems.

You might also look at the Nissan Rogue, Subaru Forester, Subaru XV Crosstrek, Dodge Journey, Volkswagen Tiguan and Hyundai Tucson if you want to see the rest of the economy crossovers. A much more fuel-efficient vehicle but with the same cargo room and length that you might also consider would be the Volkswagen Golf Wagon TDI.

[thrifthunter]

What I look for in a car is reliability. They have a lot to prove in that regard and if they can prove they are reliable it is going to take a sample size of 10 years to convince me.

[night blade]

Own a 2012 Kia Sportage, as mentioned the visability can be an issue if you're bothered by it, I got used to it pretty fast and use those small blind spot mirrors just in case.

Few things of note, first off its a great CUV for sure and I don't regret buying it (9 months ownership). My biggest issue so far has been the interior plastic, it marks very easily and I have actually cracked the rear hatch door panel by one of the access points, its mostly my fault for trying to fit a wheel chair in there twice a week, but you need to be careful. Secondly the MPG #s from Kia are somewhat inflated, my millege is getting much better as I hit 10,000K but at the beginning I was getting under 20MPG (USMPG), its now at around 24MPG under 70% city driving, not bad.

I took a chance buying a Kia, the 5 year / 100,000 warranty was bonus and eased my concerns about reliability, will have a better idea of how well it fairs in 4 more years ;).

[iEyeCaptain]

Still wouldn't buy a Korean car yet.

[tim-x]

My wife and I are likely getting a Kia rio. One of the of things for me is where it's made. I think either the sportage or the sorrento are made in Georgia. The rio is made in Seoul. Personally I'd rather have a car made in Korea.

From what I saw the warranty is too notch so im not overly worried. I'd think almost any car in this day and age will make it to 300k unless there are serious defects.

[night blade]

My wife and I are likely getting a Kia rio. One of the of things for me is where it's made. I think either the sportage or the sorrento are made in Georgia. The rio is made in Seoul. Personally I'd rather have a car made in Korea.

From what I saw the warranty is too notch so im not overly worried. I'd think almost any car in this day and age will make it to 300k unless there are serious defects.

No idea about the Sorrento, but the Sportage for Canada is made in Korea, the USA version is made in Georgia.

[Jordan866]

I think Korean cars are great. I also do believe they have always been underrated in the late 90s and moving into the 2000's when compared with Japanese. I have had a very old Elantra in the family that has lasted an amazing long time that has been passed on from new driver to new driver. It is amazing how well the car still runs with minimal maintenance.

That being said, if the same car at the same price was made in either Korea or Japan, I would take the Japanese made one, based on reputation. I love the new Elantras, was thinking of picking up a limited one as they come loaded with leather, navigation, and amazing fuel mileage.

[liorsyncro]

Korean cars still have some ways to go before they match the japanese in quality. Styling, they are ahead. Engineering, still behind Toyota and Nissan.

Even styling was a problem for the Koreans until they got a European design team, which is responsible for the new Hyundai-Kia lineup. Engineering wise I don't believe they're on the same level as the Germans or the Japanese although they're definitely catching up. The main problem for them is resale value and reliability. If they can build on that then I can see them surpassing the Japanese automakers over the next decade.

The problem for the Koreans has always been that they're competing on value, that is offering more for less than the competition. And when you engage in a battle based on value it's difficult to compete on the engineering level especially the compact and subcompact segment where profit margins are quite low. So quality definitely takes a hit. Honda and Toyota, for instance, have a solid reliability reputation so they can ride on that. But Hyundai-Kia have to offer more for less for consumers to seriously consider them. It's a delicate balancing act. The new and more stylish models that they have introduced will definitely help them but from a reliability perspective they're too new to determine how they'll run in, say, 10 years down the road.

[BioRage]

Stupid long warranty, I think that's enough.

7 years+?

[thrifthunter]

No idea about the Sorrento, but the Sportage for Canada is made in Korea, the USA version is made in Georgia.

Maybe it is ASSEMBLED in Gerogia, but it is still Korean engineering.

That is like saying my dining room set was made in my dining room, when really I bought it at a store and assembled in my dining room!

[hdom]

Old enough to remember the same concerns / comments about Japanese brands, only then it was being not as good as American/German. ;)

[thrifthunter]

Old enough to remember the same concerns / comments about Japanese brands, only then it was being not as good as American/German. ;)

Except the big difference is that there was never a time when honda/toyota made absolute garbage. The koreans have been making garbage since their inception!

[hdom]

Never had a first gen Civic I guess ?? ;) They were notorious for rusting within 3 yrs.

Believe me, there are still lots that would pick a Dodge before buying an Acura and it is that old school thinking / believe that I hope we could changing.

Cause it wouldn't be long before the Chinese are here, too.


Except the big difference is that there was never a time when honda/toyota made absolute garbage. The koreans have been making garbage since their inception!

[steve-0101]

When I think Hyundai, I think Pony. I know they've come a long way since then, but that car sealed it for me. I don't think I could ever buy one.

[iownyou]

it's well priced, but you pay what you get....
however, the koreans have earned my respect... their companies (automobile, electronics) have been doing fairly well considering the current economy

[hdom]

Like I mentioned, for some it was the old gen Civic / Corolla / Sunny.


When I think Hyundai, I think Pony. I know they've come a long way since then, but that car sealed it for me. I don't think I could ever buy one.

[msqrade]

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/07/30/hyundai-recalls-over-220-000-sonata-and-santa-fe-models-over-air/

With stories like these it's hard to believe Korean cars have become more like Japanese cars. Sure, every auto maker has recalls, but the airbag is the ONE part that can only be tested destructively - you count on it to work and you don't know it doesn't until it's too late.

Time and time again, Hyundai's been having air bag problems..

When it first came out, I really wanted a Genesis Coupe. Only problem were these pics from Korea: http://carbl.com/2008/11/13/hyundai-genesis-coupe-crash.html which some of you may remember -- did the airbags get stuck?

[mr_raider]

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/07/30/hyundai-recalls-over-220-000-sonata-and-santa-fe-models-over-air/

With stories like these it's hard to believe Korean cars have become more like Japanese cars. Sure, every auto maker has recalls, but the airbag is the ONE part that can only be tested destructively - you count on it to work and you don't know it doesn't until it's too late.

Time and time again, Hyundai's been having air bag problems..

When it first came out, I really wanted a Genesis Coupe. Only problem were these pics from Korea: http://carbl.com/2008/11/13/hyundai-genesis-coupe-crash.html which some of you may remember -- did the airbags get stuck?


Air bags are irrelevant. Better to give the occupant fast egress from the vehicle, as the Japanese do:

http://www.thecarconnection.com/news/1077925_2012-honda-cr-v-2013-acura-ilx-recalled-for-door-latch-problem

[RCGA]

I'm looking at buying a car now. Kia isn't even a consideration. Hyundai is just lipstick on a pig.

[woodstock827]

My family have 2 Hyundais (a 2004 Elantra and a 2012 Accent)... here are some thoughts..

Build quality - I'd say it's on par or better than Japanese cars...

Material quality - Korean does have cheaper material. But I think they do a better job of hiding them. Honda is still not bad. Toyota there's cheap hard plastic everywhere and the seats are terrible!

Engineering - the Koreans still have some catching up to do but they're catching up fast. My Elantra drinks gas like it's a truck. The Accent is better but very dependent on driving style... Their auto transmissions is still not as efficient as they can be... Also driving dynamics can't be compared to Honda or the Europeans, which will take much longer for them to figure out..

Interior design - Koreans win hands down. There's no comparison.

Exterior design - Again Koreans win. Even if they hired the Europeans to do the design for them, at least they are willing to spend the money on it.

Reliability - My Elantra has had some issues, like on of the power mirror doesn't work intermittently and now the auto down drive window doesn't work intermittently as well. The radiator was replaced due to a leak but I think that has also to do with a previous crash. It's starting to rust a bit at the bottom of the door panels. But then, when my family bought the car, we were expecting some issues down the road since it was when Hyundai just started to improve... overall it's better than my expectation... engine is still going strong at 160k+ and the chassis still feel solid. My old 1.6EL had a serious oil burning issue that really bugged me so I'm glad it hasn't happened to the Elantra yet.
I do have higher expectation on my Accent though. Time will tell.

Overall, for the price and features you get from Hyundai/Kia, they're worth considering.

[qpixoraw]

My family have 2 Hyundais (a 2004 Elantra and a 2012 Accent)... here are some thoughts..

Build quality - I'd say it's on par or better than Japanese cars...

Material quality - Korean does have cheaper material. But I think they do a better job of hiding them. Honda is still not bad. Toyota there's cheap hard plastic everywhere and the seats are terrible!

Engineering - the Koreans still have some catching up to do but they're catching up fast. My Elantra drinks gas like it's a truck. The Accent is better but very dependent on driving style... Their auto transmissions is still not as efficient as they can be... Also driving dynamics can't be compared to Honda or the Europeans, which will take much longer for them to figure out..

Interior design - Koreans win hands down. There's no comparison.

Exterior design - Again Koreans win. Even if they hired the Europeans to do the design for them, at least they are willing to spend the money on it.

Reliability - My Elantra has had some issues, like on of the power mirror doesn't work intermittently and now the auto down drive window doesn't work intermittently as well. The radiator was replaced due to a leak but I think that has also to do with a previous crash. It's starting to rust a bit at the bottom of the door panels. But then, when my family bought the car, we were expecting some issues down the road since it was when Hyundai just started to improve... overall it's better than my expectation... engine is still going strong at 160k+ and the chassis still feel solid. My old 1.6EL had a serious oil burning issue that really bugged me so I'm glad it hasn't happened to the Elantra yet.
I do have higher expectation on my Accent though. Time will tell.

Overall, for the price and features you get from Hyundai/Kia, they're worth considering.

I think you forgot to mention Low Resale of these cars compare to Japanese...

If you know the problems why your family still decided to buy a second Huyndai Accent? Is it cause good price?

[qpixoraw]

I'm looking at buying a car now. Kia isn't even a consideration. Hyundai is just lipstick on a pig.

Better stick with Honda/Acura or go with BMW...

[ShadowVlican]

i think they've improved tremendously these recent years while the japanese big boys are just sitting on brand royalties

[da335]

No doubt they have improved a lot recent years, closing the gap with Japanese cars very fast.
And look at their designs. Inside and out, they're amazing. I used to be a die-hard Honda fan but now I'll consider Koreans cars as well.

[duckdown]

I hate Hyundai but Kia seems to be making a lot of strides in the right direction

I absolutely would never own a Hyundai though. I don't like anything about them.

[woof]

I like the look of the new Elantra but frankly I've seen more complaints from owners about that car not achieving it's rated gas mileage than any other car in the last year. I would not buy one as a result.

[sandikosh]

I like the look of the new Elantra but frankly I've seen more complaints from owners about that car not achieving it's rated gas mileage than any other car in the last year. I would not buy one as a result.

It seems that cars by Hyundai/Kia are overrated by the governing bodies.

[manteiv]

...my millege is getting much better as I hit 10,000K but at the beginning I was getting under 20MPG (USMPG), its now at around 24MPG under 70% city driving, not bad.

...

how is that so? MPG getting bettter with time? I have never heard that before.

[hdom]

The problem isn't that the Japanese are idling, it is that many are reporting they are heading backwards, with new models not being as good as model that was replaced.

I know it has a lot to do with the yen & other factors but the reality is, this creates room for other makers to gain on them for sure. Ie.New Civic is a good example, dropped from the Consumer Report Recommended list when it was at the top for years.


i think they've improved tremendously these recent years while the japanese big boys are just sitting on brand royalties

[Just thinking]

With stories like these it's hard to believe Korean cars have become more like Japanese cars. Sure, every auto maker has recalls, but the airbag is the ONE part that can only be tested destructively - you count on it to work and you don't know it doesn't until it's too late.

Time and time again, Hyundai's been having air bag problems..

I completely wrote off my Toyota last week. Of course, my air bags decided to stay where they were instead of coming out and enjoying the fun. WTF?

[Pete_Coach]

Maybe it is ASSEMBLED in Gerogia, but it is still Korean engineering. That is like saying my dining room set was made in my dining room, when really I bought it at a store and assembled in my dining room!
So it is OK to have an engineering marvel assembled by hillbillys? Most defects are caused in assembly.


http://www.autoblog.com/2012/07/30/hyundai-recalls-over-220-000-sonata-and-santa-fe-models-over-air/

With stories like these it's hard to believe Korean cars have become more like Japanese cars. Sure, every auto maker has recalls, but the airbag is the ONE part that can only be tested destructively - you count on it to work and you don't know it doesn't until it's too late.Time and time again, Hyundai's been having air bag problems..

When it first came out, I really wanted a Genesis Coupe. Only problem were these pics from Korea: http://carbl.com/2008/11/13/hyundai-genesis-coupe-crash.html which some of you may remember -- did the airbags get stuck?
Seems to me that problem was identified as a potential software issue. The recall was to ensure deployment.
A recall occurs on all brands, just because Hyundai recalls for a problem does not make them a more incompetent manufacturer than the numerous recalls Ford or GM or Chrysler or Honda or Toyota or other manufacturers have made.
A dumb argument.


It seems that cars by Hyundai/Kia are overrated by the governing bodies.
Exactly what "Governing Body" would thast be? The United Republic of Motor Trend? No wait, it could very well be the United States of Car and Driver?

[DougO]

I'm actually looking at an all electric like a Volt or some advanced hybrids. What are the Koreans doing in that regard?

[thrifthunter]

So it is OK to have an engineering marvel assembled by hillbillys?

haaahahahahhahaha
Yes, we know you own a KIA and have family that work for KIA but geez get over yourself!
And if KIA's quality control is such that they don't give a crap about having know nothing problem causing hillbillys assembling their "marvels" then that is their own doing! Just goes to show how stupid they are.

You said it, not me!

[woodstock827]

I think you forgot to mention Low Resale of these cars compare to Japanese...

If you know the problems why your family still decided to buy a second Huyndai Accent? Is it cause good price?

Low resale value doesn't matter much to me because I usually drive my cars to the ground before moving to a new one.

Like I said, even though there were problems with the Elantra, it still met my expectations (however low they were)...
Knowing how much Hyundai has improved in the last 5+ years (from various sources and surveys), and price vs features and design, it's still the best choice for me... the only real contenders for me were Fiesta and Fit, but they were both quite more expensive compared to the Accent.. even if problems come up in the future, I think it'll be unlikely that it'll cost that much more than the premium I'd have had to pay for say the Fit.

[thrifthunter]

Low resale value doesn't matter much to me because I usually drive my cars to the ground before moving to a new one.


Yeah but in that case longevity should. The fit is probably the most reliable car you can get. Will last twice as long as the accent while being cheaper to maintain.

[night blade]

how is that so? MPG getting bettter with time? I have never heard that before.

Engine break-in apparently, was quoted from various people on the Kia Forums, mostly from 10k miles onwards.

[Broli's Mom]

I have a 2011 Sportage SX, my first vehicle from a Korean manufacturer, and its been fine. My only concern with purchasing a Korean vehicle was, and still is, the size of the dealer network. It's not the same as any of the Japanese manufacturers which I have been accustomed to, but, for now, it's just adequate.

[googoo]

Korean cars still have some ways to go before they match the japanese in quality. Styling, they are ahead.

I actually agree with Sandikosh....however surprising that is.

Anyways, interior plastics are absolutely crap(my 03 civic had better plastic), and the seat(in my Forte) are junk too.

Brent

[jimmy-j]

lol i thought only the vtec fanatics on honda-tech referred to their cars as "engineering marvels"

[mr_raider]

I'm actually looking at an all electric like a Volt or some advanced hybrids. What are the Koreans doing in that regard?

The Volt is not all electric. It's a plug in hybrid with a preference for the electric motor.

[forthewinwin]

I guess it depends upon user experience.

But they are doing quite well- I'm surprised. New styling and pricing is serving them well. However, only time will tell to see whether they can match Toyota/Honda in reliability and quality.

[hdom]

^I believe Consumer Reports did a long term test between the last generation of Toyota Camry & Hyundai Sonta and they found the two cars were pretty much same in reliablity, with the Hyundai being cheaper to maintain.

So, the prove is already out there, just a lot of people not knowing or not excepting.

[thrifthunter]

^I believe Consumer Reports did a long term test between the last generation of Toyota Camry & Hyundai Sonta and they found the two cars were pretty much same in reliablity, with the Hyundai being cheaper to maintain.

So, the prove is already out there, just a lot of people not knowing or not excepting.

#1 - link to proof?
#2 - is this based just on a single car?
#3 - How many years was it based on? Anything under 10 is worthless imo..

[Pete_Coach]

haaahahahahhahaha
Yes, we know you own a KIA and have family that work for KIA but geez get over yourself!
And if KIA's quality control is such that they don't give a crap about having know nothing problem causing hillbillys assembling their "marvels" then that is their own doing! Just goes to show how stupid they are.

You said it, not me!
Get over myself? For what reason? My comment was in response to the statement "Maybe it is ASSEMBLED in Georgia, but it is still Korean engineering." I believe mine is a valid comment. I have no idea what you are trying to make of it or reading into it, there is no hidden agenda in my comment.

Yup, I recently (well, over a year ago) bought one but, I have the distinct benefit of having owned many different brands and models including most recently, the "higher end" luxury vehicles. I think I can speak from experience, can you? My comments are based on having them in my garage, taking care of them, driving them, fixing them myself or taking them to shops. The comments are from a point of view that includes putting my money where my mouth is.
Your comments seem to be rectal plucks. You ask others for proof yet you provide none yourself. When you get some experience with anything other than your beige Corrolla, come back LOL.

[thrifthunter]

Get over myself? For what reason? My comment was in response to the statement "Maybe it is ASSEMBLED in Georgia, but it is still Korean engineering." I believe mine is a valid comment. I have no idea what you are trying to make of it or reading into it, there is no hidden agenda in my comment.

LOL no hidden agenda in "engineering marvel". It's a ****ing kia!

I bet next year if your son goes to sell for dodge we'll be hearing about the "marvel" that is the avenger!
He must act like a typical salesman even towards you because those words related to kia is only something you'd hear from a full of crap salesman!

And btw, I can link you to several articles of proof that says japanese are still the most reliable and have been dominant for many years in that regard.
Do you really want me to show you up again?
Just say the word!

And I have had my beige corolla for 1000000kms now and never did any maintenance at all, not even so much as change the oil and yet it is still running like a champ.

[thrifthunter]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18973775
And you know there are dozens more where that link came from.

[canehdianman]

Hi angry kids.


Anyways, I have a 2011 Kia Optima EX-Luxury. I really like it, and the wife absolutely loves it.

[thrifthunter]

http://www.nydailynews.com/autos/japanese-cars-voted-reliable-huge-margin-consumer-reports-survey-article-1.968094

I can do this ALL DAY!
Pete you must have been living under a rock your whole life if seeing proof that japanese are most reliable is shocking to you.

[hdom]

1) Consumer Reports locks their content so direct links but I will try to find which issue that was in.
2) It was only the two models that was compared for that piece but they do long term test for many. However, their readers survey also ranks the Sonata very high, you can check the April 2012 Auto issue.
3) Years is useless, 10yrs would be comparing a model that is up to 3 gens old. Instead, they were comparing mileage to mileage, more useful infomation to new buyers.


#1 - link to proof?
#2 - is this based just on a single car?
#3 - How many years was it based on? Anything under 10 is worthless imo..

[thrifthunter]

3) Years is useless, 10yrs would be comparing a model that is up to 3 gens old. Instead, they were comparing mileage to mileage, more useful infomation to new buyers.

Only a homer of a brand that doesn't last in the long term would say this!

Comparing mileage to mileage is ***** .
If you got a 5 year old car with 200k and a 10 year old car with 200k, then likely the newer car had a lot of highway in its life which is a lot easier on all of the cars components.

To do it right you'd need to compare both cars within the same numbers of years and same mileage/type of driving.

[hdom]

If you know how CR works, they compares mixed mileage and do their survey with owners.

Yes, ideally you do a long long term comparsion but the reality is it would take 10yrs to test a model and report the results which then people like you would say is useless cause the new models are different.

I am not a Homer, if anything I still like my Honda more, thank you very much.

Is it really that hard to get that the Korean Cars have improved over the yrs at a quicker pace then the Japaneses ?? They already do rule with other products, TVs, Phones, Tablets, Washer & Dryers etc.


Only a homer of a brand that doesn't last in the long term would say this!

Comparing mileage to mileage is ***** .
If you got a 5 year old car with 200k and a 10 year old car with 200k, then likely the newer car had a lot of highway in its life which is a lot easier on all of the cars components.

[thrifthunter]

Is it really that hard to get that the Korean Cars have improved over the yrs at a quicker pace then the Japaneses ?? They already do rule with other products, TVs, Phones, Tablets, Washer & Dryers etc.

Yes it is hard to believe as far as the automotive world goes. Because the only source I have ever heard of state that there is proof that they are most reliable is you!
I have posted my links, and can post dozens more that backs up what I say. And the fact of the matter is I even posted a report from Consumer Reports so...
My job is done!

[Voltex]

If you know how CR works, they compares mixed mileage and do their survey with owners.

Yes, ideally you do a long long term comparsion but the reality is it would take 10yrs to test a model and report the results which then people like you would say is useless cause the new models are different.

I am not a Homer, if anything I still like my Honda more, thank you very much.

Is it really that hard to get that the Korean Cars have improved over the yrs at a quicker pace then the Japaneses ?? They already do rule with other products, TVs, Phones, Tablets, Washer & Dryers etc.

Lolwut

[hdom]

Never did I say they are the most reliable.

My proof is in the April 2012 Annual Auto issue of Consumer Reports, where they not only name just one but a few models from Hyundai to their Recommended List while dropping a few from Honda/Toyota.

If you want to see a link check this, Hyundai ranks highest among brands in retaining buyers:

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/01/15/hyundai-tops-j-d-powers-customer-retention-study/

That means Hyundai owners keep coming back to the brand.

Question was simple, would you buy another one ??
http://images.gizmag.com/hero/jdpower-auto-customer-retention-2012.jpg

Notice how many brands losing ground are Japanese ??

http://images.gizmag.com/gallery_lrg/jdpower-auto-customer-retention-2012-3.png

http://www.gizmag.com/automotive-customer-retention-survey/21140/


Yes it is hard to believe as far as the automotive world goes. Because the only source I have ever heard of state that there is proof that they are most reliable is you!
I have posted my links, and can post dozens more that backs up what I say. And the fact of the matter is I even posted a report from Consumer Reports so...
My job is done!

[Pete_Coach]

.......
And you know there are dozens more where that link came from.


.....

I can do this ALL DAY!
Pete you must have been living under a rock your whole life if seeing proof that japanese are most reliable is shocking to you.
Just as I suspected..an internet mechanic. :facepalm:

I don't remember asking anything about Japanese cars either but hey, why poop on your internet prowess. :lol:

I know what I have and I like it. I (or others) hardly need your approval.
Get over yourself (where have I heard that before? LOL).

[thrifthunter]

Just as I suspected..an internet mechanic. :facepalm:

I don't remember asking anything about Japanese cars either but hey, why poop on your internet prowess. :lol:

I know what I have and I like it. I (or others) hardly need your approval.
Get over yourself (where have I heard that before? LOL).

Just as I suspected....... not much from a junky car driving egomaniac.

[thrifthunter]

My proof is in the April 2012 Annual Auto issue of Consumer Reports, where they not only name just one but a few models from Hyundai to their Recommended List while dropping a few from Honda/Toyota.


LOL you just went completely off topic FTMFL!!! Says nothing about reliability(and especially LONG TERM reliability which we have been talking about).
keep digging buddy.

[hdom]

^They pick cars based on many factors, one requirement is predicted reliablity based on survey of pervious model. Even if a car ranks very well on their test, it wouldn't get recommended unless there is enough data to back the reliablity. Read that issue, would you ??

Also, retention is a good indicator of reliability and quaility; you wouldn't buy the same car if it isn't reliable, would you?

Btw, you seem to like links.


Is Hyundai better than Toyota and Honda? New models Suggest Yes (http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/thinking-tech/is-hyundai-better-than-toyota-and-honda-new-models-suggest-yes/2832) - Interview with Jake Fisher, Senior Auto Engineer For Consumer Reports.

[hdom]

Realize Hyundai Motor is only a piece of the giant Hyundai Group ??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai

It is scary how big they are, they seem to own or be involved in every step of way from mining the raw material to make the steel to shipping their products over on their own commerical tanks.


Lolwut

[mr_raider]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18973775
And you know there are dozens more where that link came from.

Chevy does better than the Germans. No surprise here.

[woodstock827]

Yeah but in that case longevity should. The fit is probably the most reliable car you can get. Will last twice as long as the accent while being cheaper to maintain.

I agree the Fit will likely have less issues than the Accent... but I really don't think they will differ that much, especially the new models...
Honda has its fair share of issues as well... (for my 1.6EL, rust, alternator, burning oil, CV boots)

Used to have a 1992 Camry that was pretty much bullet proof until it got flooded... too bad I keep hearing bad things from the newer Toyotas.. definitely not as reliable as they used to be... not to mention 90% of them are plain/ugly..

[Therion]

FWIW, we have a 2011 Hyundai Tucson, and love it. No issues so far, good on gas, lots of room in the trunk. Looks way better than any small SUV out there, except perhaps the new Escape. However, I'm buying a second car and will go with a Honda Fit. I go with what the research says, not brand loyalty.

[Mayosandwich]

Dont buy a Korean car if you want a real car. Korean cars have yet to prove themselves and rebuild their horrid track record from the Pony days. Sorry but 3 years of redesigned models since getting the new design team isnt proving yourself long term. A real cars quality is tested after it hits 100k miles (160k km). We have yet to see how they hold up 10-15 years from now, my guess is they will fall apart. If you knew where Hyundai and Kia cut corners under the engine bay, you wouldnt even consider a Korean car ever.

Why do you think theres so many people driving older Hondas around? Cause theyre built to last. Ask yourself how many Hyundais from the 90s or even early 00's you see on the road today? Theres a reason why you dont see many around, if any.

I dont know how many times I have to repeat myself. Although the quality of Hyundai has increased substantially from the early years in North America, when they were practically held together with glue from the factory instead of bolts, the quality they turn out domestically hasn't. What you see in North America is Hyundai's best shot at quality, and it still isn't anywhere near that of Honda long term. In general, they still have yet to prove in the long term that the very poor history has been shaken.

They do sell well in North America though, because they're cheap and America is a very consumeristic society. People think with their wallets and not their brains when they go car shopping. All they focus on is the up front cost.

Plus the new Hyundais are nothing but complete rip offs of other makes. Hyundai cant generate or innovate anything themselves so they have to rip of the big guys. Personally I think all the Hyundais from the past 2-3 years are ugly as hell. Elantra, Snota, Genesis, all ugly and over the top with way too overly complicated designs that wont age well at all. Lets see how many people will be talking about these cars in 5 years from now. They wont because theyll be outdated and falling apart by then.

"I drive a Kia" "I drive a Hyundai" Both sound horrible. First thing when I hear Kia is Ikea. And we all know Ikea = cheap garbage.

Hyundai and Kia are the Curtis and RCA brands for cars.

Hyundai is like your JR high school wannabe try hard who goes to class with fake gold chains and knock off jeans trying to impress others when really hes not impressing anyone.

[hdom]

^Once again, old enough to have heard the same concern about Japanese, look how far they came and if you guys are worry about Koreans now, wait until the Chinese Brands are here. Btw, they already make and build almost everything you would find in car of any brand. The car companies just don't want you to know too much about it. Ask your mechanics next time what isn't Chinese made in your car.

[RCGA]

^Once again, old enough to have heard the same concern about Japanese, look how far they came and if you guys are worry about Koreans now, wait until the Chinese Brands are here.

But Japanese brands have since proven to be rock solid for the past 20+ years.

To me, Kia and Hyundai are producing the same garbage they did in the mid-2000s, but with a new body kit and bluetooth.

[conix67]

But Japanese brands have since proven to be rock solid for the past 20+ years.

To me, Kia and Hyundai are producing the same garbage they did in the mid-2000s, but with a new body kit and bluetooth.

Rock solid? How do you define rock solid. I've owned Japanese, Korean, American, German brands. They all have their own issues and strength. If you'd call latest Korean cars flat out garbage, you have no idea what you're talking about.

[iownyou]

Rock solid? How do you define rock solid. I've owned Japanese, Korean, American, German brands. They all have their own issues and strength. If you'd call latest Korean cars flat out garbage, you have no idea what you're talking about.

+1

[RCGA]

Rock solid? How do you define rock solid. I've owned Japanese, Korean, American, German brands. They all have their own issues and strength. If you'd call latest Korean cars flat out garbage, you have no idea what you're talking about.

There's a reason why NO ONE buys a used Korean car...

[conix67]

There's a reason why NO ONE buys a used Korean car...

Again, back up your claims with some solid proof. "NO ONE buys.." "ROCK SOLID".. are already proven wrong as there are people buying Korean used cars, and Japaneses cars aren't rock solid.. (most are good, but I wouldn't go as far as calling all of them rock solid)

To me the general quality of products coming from Korea, be it cars or electronics, just about any manufactured goods, generally are on par or exceed quality of products coming from Japan these days. The same could not be said more than 10 years ago, but not anymore.

[dassub]

There's a reason why NO ONE buys a used Korean car...

You could argue that no one buys a new Korean car too, since there are likely several years of payments ahead of them.

[poedua]

Maybe it is ASSEMBLED in Gerogia, but it is still Korean engineering.

That is like saying my dining room set was made in my dining room, when really I bought it at a store and assembled in my dining room!

I'm assuming you think Korean engineering is inferior to that, say of, Japanese and or German engineering.

If so, what would you suggest are the best examples of Korean engineering that reflect an inferiority to Japanese and or or German engineering ?

[woodstock827]

wow... over confidence much for the Japanese?
Vtec burning oil issue, rear quarter rust, 90s Camry transmissions issue, Nissan CVTs, new Mazda rusts etc.. Not saying they're unreliable... but they're not without their faults neither.

whether new Hyundai/Kia designs are ugly or not I wouldn't argue since it's personal preference, but rip offs? what cars do the new Sonata, Elantra, Veloster, Accent rip off from?
Also there're still tons of early 2000 Accents driving around where I live, and pretty comparable to early 2000 Civics even though I'm sure the Civic sold a lot more in number.

[js321]

I think they are great if you don't care about driving dynamics. Also, Korean cars are not as cheap as they used to be. Toyota sometimes is even cheaper with incentives.

[mmdc]

A few years ago I would have never considered Hyundai or Kia. I would take a serious look at the Elantra GT or Sportage if I were in the market for a vehicle right now.

[KINGPIN33]

I currently own a Hyundai gen coupe and Although the car can use a bit more refinement, I find it's way better equipped than its rivals from a base to base comparison. Give them another 5 years and they'll take away Hondas comfortable sales.

[george__]

I like my 2011 Hyundai Santa Fe V6 but I had transmission problems initially... But this was a 1st gen 6 gear transmission used for the Santa Fe, so meh. Ended up getting 1 rebuilt tranny, another new tranny and finally got software update for the tranny. For the cost though, this thing is loaded compared to its competitors.

The car is fine now but if more than 1 person drives this car often, the tranny goes back to acting wacky. Hyundai says it's because the transmission learns the driver's method of driving and I kind of believe them... If I just drive it, no slippage and the car is smooth... Give it back to my parents for a week and I drive it, the transmission acts up for a bit but eventually goes back to normal.

Also insurance is cheaper on the the Hyundai than a older Toyota Camry by a lot...

If you want a bang for buck car go Hyundai or Kia.

[ancnfamily]

+1

[ancnfamily]

Go with what you can afford and what you think is the best for your hard earned $$$.¢¢

i was very happy with my Toyotas and Nissans that I owned. Very disappointed with 2 Hondas that I had. Replaced Hondas that were less than 4yrs old for Civic and 1.5 yrs old for Odyssey with a new 2012 VW Passat TDI and 2011 Golf 2.5 (used 1 yr old) and I can tell you that I've been very happy with my 1st set of VW's. People bash about everything, especially VW.

BTW my brother back in Europe owes 2002 Santa Fe Diesel with over 3000000 KM on it and he loves it. No issues at all.

[wal3145]

I onced owned a 1997 Elantra Wagon. Kept it for 4 years. Whenever I start the engine in the morning, there would be a lot of "tapping" noises until it warmed. The car was in service every 4-5 months to fix the transmission until they replaced it 2 years later. Other than those 2 main problems, the car was a pos to drive. 130hp felt like 90.

[wannaCRV]

As a former loyal Japanese auto owner (Supra, Corolla, Tercel , Camry, Civic (2) and CRV) and many months of research I am now proud owner of a 2012 Soul and
pleased to report after 7 months of ownership no issues what so ever. No squeaks rattles, mileage has improved and yes I knew before I bought what the TRUE mileage was.

[dassub]

I can't believe you can end that post by saying that you would still recommend Hyundai for bang for the buck!
This car sucks and keeps breaking, and still has problems to this day, but hey, buy one!


I like my 2011 Hyundai Santa Fe V6 but I had transmission problems initially... But this was a 1st gen 6 gear transmission used for the Santa Fe, so meh. Ended up getting 1 rebuilt tranny, another new tranny and finally got software update for the tranny. For the cost though, this thing is loaded compared to its competitors.

The car is fine now but if more than 1 person drives this car often, the tranny goes back to acting wacky. Hyundai says it's because the transmission learns the driver's method of driving and I kind of believe them... If I just drive it, no slippage and the car is smooth... Give it back to my parents for a week and I drive it, the transmission acts up for a bit but eventually goes back to normal.

Also insurance is cheaper on the the Hyundai than a older Toyota Camry by a lot...

If you want a bang for buck car go Hyundai or Kia.

[poedua]

As a former loyal Japanese auto owner (Supra, Corolla, Tercel , Camry, Civic (2) and CRV) and many months of research I am now proud owner of a 2012 Soul and
pleased to report after 7 months of ownership no issues what so ever. No squeaks rattles, mileage has improved and yes I knew before I bought what the TRUE mileage was.

Same here......and have now taken a ' leap of faith ' to make the move over to the ' dark side ' ..........got a Ford.;)

Guess only time will tell if that was a smart move or not.

[Pete_Coach]

same here......and have now taken a ' leap of faith ' to make the move over to the ' dark side ' ..........got a ford.;)

guess only time will tell if that was a smart move or not.
Oh No!! Not A Ford!! :D

You know, bottom line with any vehicle is that you get what you need... at the time. It's not like it is your mate for life.:)


Nothing wrong with a Ford either.

[poedua]

Oh No!! Not A Ford!! :D

You know, bottom line with any vehicle is that you get what you need... at the time. It's not like it is your mate for life.:)

Nothing wrong with a Ford either.

I know...I know....with a Ford, I'm in brand new territory ( at least for us )....no question.:lol:

But, our previous vehicle was ' totaled ' in an accident, necessitating the need for a replacement vehicle asap...certainly not the most ' ideal ' circumstances with which to get another vehicle...but it did afford us the opportunity to quickly reassess our needs in a vehicle, and taking all our current needs into consideration, to our surprise, Ford made the short list.

Granted, no vehicle is ' perfect' and can meet 100% of your needs IMO, but we found that in terms of engine and cabin technology, safety, cabin fit and finish and overall quality and reliability it appears Ford is on the upswing and certainly trending in the right direction...and in that regard, Ford's not unlike Korean products I suppose. Some folks may feel buying a Korean vehicle represents a ' leap of faith ' as well....I don't know.

At the end of the day, all other things being equal, the Ford represented the strongest ' value proposition ' ( at least for us ) - so - we ( crossed our fingers and ) pulled the trigger on a Ford.:D

[AudiDude]

Same here......and have now taken a ' leap of faith ' to make the move over to the ' dark side ' ..........got a Ford.;)

Guess only time will tell if that was a smart move or not.

I gotta say that I rented a Fusion a few months back and it was fine. It had 44K miles on it and it still looked new inside and out. Most American cars show signs of fatigue, creak, the vents are busted or show signs of wear, but this one did not. The interior was pretty much on par with my Audi (my 1998 Audi). The car got good gas mileage and was fast enough to get you out of any surprise "this lane ending" situations. With some options, it could be a good daily driver. The sound system vibrated all the mirrors and you could be heard coming for sure, from the low pounding bass.

[rocketdan9]

Korean cars still have some ways to go before they match the japanese in quality. Styling, they are ahead. Engineering, still behind Toyota and Nissan.

Nissan? really.

Infinity is good but Nissan is below avg in terms of quality.

Hyundais quality is on par with Ford and just below Hondayotas. Meanwhile Hyundai and Ford are quite a bit ahead in the design areas

[george__]

I can't believe you can end that post by saying that you would still recommend Hyundai for bang for the buck!
This car sucks and keeps breaking, and still has problems to this day, but hey, buy one!

.... The car has been trouble free for good 1 year now. That entire ordeal was when the car was first bought. The dealer gave us a rental car each time we went there for free + the car got cleaned too each time. So I'm happy

sandikosh is right - look at their engines.. The VQ has soo many rewards

[h3nry8888]

Hyundai Tucson 2005... 86000km.. engine issues.. Loud Clicking noise that the dealer claims non-repairable. it shares the same engine at the Sportage. Beware.

Air Bag light Issue, google it. Seems to be common.... Bad customer service.. Here is my experience...

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/who-has-hyundai-experience-air-bag-light-issue-1185302/2/#post15224070

[mr_raider]

I gotta say that I rented a Fusion a few months back and it was fine. It had 44K miles on it and it still looked new inside and out. Most American cars show signs of fatigue, creak, the vents are busted or show signs of wear, but this one did not. The interior was pretty much on par with my Audi (my 1998 Audi). The car got good gas mileage and was fast enough to get you out of any surprise "this lane ending" situations. With some options, it could be a good daily driver. The sound system vibrated all the mirrors and you could be heard coming for sure, from the low pounding bass.

The fusion has a rock solid chassis and buttoned down suspension. The drive really impressed me. The interior is a decade out of date though. I expect 2013 redesign to be killer.

On the subject, here is an interesting tidbit about owner loyalty:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jimgorzelany/2011/10/13/cars-with-the-most-brand-loyal-buyers/

[packardbell]

korean cars have really surprised me when they first came to NA with the pony. Back then no one could match the price, now 26 years later I say there are par with the other makes.
go for it

[Pete_Coach]

The fusion has a rock solid chassis and buttoned down suspension. The drive really impressed me. The interior is a decade out of date though. I expect 2013 redesign to be killer.

On the subject, here is an interesting tidbit about owner loyalty:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jimgorzelany/2011/10/13/cars-with-the-most-brand-loyal-buyers/
I looked at the fusion when I was buying. I was impressed. The Hybrid interested me but the price put me off right away. I was really interested in Hybrid technology but the price was way out of line for what you got. So, not Ford for me (but I have has a few in the past and liked them).

[mr_raider]

I looked at the fusion when I was buying. I was impressed. The Hybrid interested me but the price put me off right away. I was really interested in Hybrid technology but the price was way out of line for what you got. So, not Ford for me (but I have has a few in the past and liked them).

The model to get is the 3.5 awd sport. It chugs gas though.

[iownyou]

Worse than japanese but better than American...

[mr_raider]

Worse than japanese but better than American...

Not so sure. I had the chance to really take an Optima for a nice drive. The attention to detail was surprising. The hood had a gas strut to keep it open, while more expensive cars use a stupid rod (I'm looking at you VW!). The air intake on the turbo was ducted out to the front of the bay, essentially a factory CAI. The front bumper was dent resistant polymer. All the audio controls had redundancy on the wheel. The glove compartment was cooled, as were the seats. The interior lights were LEd, etc...

Clearly they are not cutting any corners. They don't have the suspension tuning down to being as smooth as the Americans or as sporty as the Germans, but they are getting there.

[ether01]

I drove both 2012 Elantra and 2012 Civic. Civic has better handling and suspension. There's nothing wrong with interior of Elantra but I prefer the digital display of the Civic. I also like the quality of drive more with the Civic as well. Civic is smoother on the road and touchy braking of Elantra is not really enjoyable. Side mirrors are also placed weird on the Elantra and block your vision when turning. As we all know, Hyundai real world mileage will be far below what they estimated and published on the window sticker. Elantra does not come with a spare tire. I can't believe Hyundai doesn't make it standard to provide it's customers with a spare. Another disappointment about Elantra is the steering. I blew around on the highway when there were strong wind gusts. The real question is how these new model Elantras holds up at high mileage, and how the rate of depreciation will fare against the Civic. Personally I'd stay with a japanese brand. They are reliable, dependable & last for a long while. The Korean base Hyundai are ok, they are slowly making their mark on the automotive scene

[Bamelin]

I posted this in another thread but regardless this happened on Tuesday:

http://web.stagram.com/p/258134310342467864_5094967

My airbag didn't go off and seatbelt didnt lock (doing 90km/hr). Full story in the elantra vs Veloster thread. (http://forums.redflagdeals.com/elantra-gt-vs-veloster-1193444/)

Korean cars? not a fan

[george__]

holy crap - you racing?

sue hyundai

[Bamelin]

holy crap - you racing?

sue hyundai

Not racing (see elantra vs Veloster thread below for full story)

I called a lawyer they told me no point going after manufacturer. They will fight tooth and nail and as wife and I weren't seriously hurt we wouldn't get any money even if we won. We both have neck back and (in my case because I slammed head on steering wheel) head pain. Will be going to physio.

[george__]

... Sorry to hear about this.
Good luck with new car / insurance!!

[Bamelin]

... Sorry to hear about this.
Good luck with new car / insurance!!

Thanks!

[george__]

Thanks!
:) Double check exxtra double check physio appointments...
They sometimes charge you even though you weren't there /// tell the insurance company you're still going and get charged up the butt (happened to me :()

Did you ever get any witness to say the taxi driver didn't have his hazard light on??

Maybe sue them

[ancnfamily]

The hood had a gas strut to keep it open, while more expensive cars use a stupid rod (I'm looking at you VW!).

At least VW owners don't need to keep a BROOM stick in the trunk to keep hood open..

[Bamelin]

:) Double check exxtra double check physio appointments...
They sometimes charge you even though you weren't there /// tell the insurance company you're still going and get charged up the butt (happened to me :()

Did you ever get any witness to say the taxi driver didn't have his hazard light on??

Maybe sue them

Taxi driver had a witness say hazards were on. They werent. Traffic cam got the whole thing on tape (police watched the accident happen live on camera). Ill be asking for that tape from prosecutor.

My wife sitting in passenger seat also swears taxi hazards were not on.

[george__]

Taxi driver had a witness say hazards were on. They werent. Traffic cam got the whole thing on tape (police watched the accident happen live on camera). Ill be asking for that tape from prosecutor.

My wife sitting in passenger seat also swears taxi hazards were not on.

Nobody outside!!!? I don't think wife will be my much (sorry lol)..

[Mayosandwich]

The real question is how these new model Elantras holds up at high mileage, and how the rate of depreciation will fare against the Civic

They wont, they will fall apart well before these 2011, 2012 hunnnndais hit 100k miles. And they have the worst depreciation in the industry. A 97 Corolla will net more than a 04 accent

[george__]

^^ Insurance on old toyota and honda are crazy

[Mayosandwich]

Hyundai Tucson 2005... 86000km.. engine issues.. Loud Clicking noise that the dealer claims non-repairable. it shares the same engine at the Sportage. Beware.

Air Bag light Issue, google it. Seems to be common.... Bad customer service.. Here is my experience...

http://forums.redflagdeals.com/who-has-hyundai-experience-air-bag-light-issue-1185302/2/#post15224070

Not surprised, i have a friend who works at a dealer and sees quite a few new hyundais coming back with engine issues. Thats why id never trust a manufacturer who just recently started manuacturering their own engines. Stick with japanese engines, theyre proven.

[poedua]

On the subject, here is an interesting tidbit about owner loyalty:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jimgorzelany/2011/10/13/cars-with-the-most-brand-loyal-buyers/

This is only for the U.S mind you, but for early 2012....


" Seven out of the 10 models that engender the most brand loyalty in the U.S. are Fords "

...with..


" More than six out of 10 Ford Fusion owners bought another Ford, making it the top model for owner loyalty "


http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2012/07/ford-rules-among-models-that-generate-most-owner-loyalty/1#.UDJDeaDhdoI

The Fusion certainly seems to be garnering quite a following ...and loyalty.;)

[poedua]

They wont, they will fall apart well before these 2011, 2012 hunnnndais hit 100k miles. And they have the worst depreciation in the industry. A 97 Corolla will net more than a 04 accent

Actually, Elantras hold their value just about as much as a Corolla currently does....they both experience roughly about the same amount of deprecation these days.

[mr_raider]

This is only for the U.S mind you, but for early 2012....


" Seven out of the 10 models that engender the most brand loyalty in the U.S. are Fords "

...with..


" More than six out of 10 Ford Fusion owners bought another Ford, making it the top model for owner loyalty "


http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2012/07/ford-rules-among-models-that-generate-most-owner-loyalty/1#.UDJDeaDhdoI

The Fusion certainly seems to be garnering quite a following ...and loyalty.;)

Part of this, in the US at least, is American public backlash against GM for taking taxpayer money.

[poedua]

Part of this, in the US at least, is American public backlash against GM for taking taxpayer money.

I dunno....I think most U.S. consumers are more self-serving and mercenary rather than being primarily political or principled when it comes to buying a car...if they thought a Honda or Hyundai was the better vehicle, then I suspect one of their models would be top model for owner loyalty...and not a Ford.

[george__]

I like Ford Fusion it's nice... Especially AWD model

[Biff88]

wow... over confidence much for the Japanese?
Vtec burning oil issue, rear quarter rust, 90s Camry transmissions issue, Nissan CVTs, new Mazda rusts etc.. Not saying they're unreliable... but they're not without their faults neither......

+1..I am no longer a fan of Japanese cars and am the unproud owner of my first(and will be only japanese car) a '01 Corolla.
As many owners of 8th generation Corollas now know, there was a design gaffe/defect on '98-'02 engines which was never acknowledged/resolved for vehicle owners. The symptoms are significant oil consumption which starts all of a sudden after 100,000 km, no matter how well the vehicle is maintained. This is due to insufficient piston return drain holes, is plain poor/bad engineering and design which was fixed in the '03 model year run. The Toyota message boards are now full of info on this topic. Many have had their engines destroyed before finding out about the excessive consumption.

I was planning on keeping the vehicle for 200+k which is what I got from my previous vehicle, but starting at 135k, now at 145k the engine is consuming 4 litres of oil between oil changes and does not run that well. Not sure how much longer it will last. I have owned a variety of vehicles over 34 years of driving and this is the ONLY vehicle that I have ever had with an engine problem and the only one that I will have to dispose of prematurely, not on my own terms.

Sorry to get on this long winded soap box, but any one out there who wants to keep drinking the koolaid of the superiority of japanese cars...well..keep drinking.

[Biff88]

.....Stick with japanese engines, theyre proven.

really?...read my/woodstocks posts above.
Quick question, how old are you and what is your success rate ie years of ownership with said proven engines?

[DJ_Peanuts22]

I love Korean girls.

They produce some good cars too.

[ancnfamily]

stick with japanese engines, theyre proven.

don't think so...

[mr_raider]

It must be my luck, but I am on my 2nd Japanese car, and both have had major design flaws in the engine. I had Sentra Se-R with a qr25de engine that had a bunch of TSBs for oil consumption, and ultimately Nissan had to stop sales of the model. My current car has the Toyota 4gr-FSE engine which gets fouled up intakes, due to a crappy DI system. Lexus is now rebuilding the engines with new pistons. My only hope is to pray my engine gets borked before the powertrain warranty is up.

I have had my fill of Japanese quality. My dad is running a a 15 year old J body on the original engine and tranny. When it came to my wife's car, we bought American. You can bet that when I come to replace my car, Koreans and Americans will be on the list.

[Zero Hope]

I'd take an Optima over a Accord or Camry.
Elantra over a Corolla or Civic.

[CF77]

Saw the title..have a Sonata...No ..would not go back again.. lots of features... but...cheapest fluids, tires and materials. worst brakes just like Mitsubishi. Korean design these cars to fail at certain km...beware...

oh.. parts are expensive......

[poedua]

Saw the title..have a Sonata...No ..would not go back again.. lots of features... but...cheapest fluids, tires and materials. worst brakes just like Mitsubishi. Korean design these cars to fail at certain km...beware...

oh.. parts are expensive......

What model year ?

[hdom]

^Same with early Japanese models too, once they reach the volume, parts are cheaper.

[woodstock827]

Saw the title..have a Sonata...No ..would not go back again.. lots of features... but...cheapest fluids, tires and materials. worst brakes just like Mitsubishi. Korean design these cars to fail at certain km...beware...

oh.. parts are expensive......

cheap fluids and tires? really this is what it comes down to K-bashing now? are people running out of stuff to bash about? haven't heard anything about cheap fluids before... only knew they were quite picky about transmission fluids... tires come on... all cars comes with cheap tires these days...

bad brakes on the Sonata... braking feel may be as driving dynamics are not Hyundai's best.. but braking distance is one of the best according to various tests...