Doctors think we cannot read or we don't have access to research papers

[getmail99]

We, as parents, always come across stories in media about MMR and Autism. But this one makes me very angry and upset. :mad: Judge for yourself, do you trust your doctors again. The flaw is so obvious. Doctors think we cannot read, or we don't have access to research papers.



In “Pervasive developmental disorders in Montreal, Quebec, Canada: prevalence and links with immunizations” (1) Fombonne et al reported that in a group of English-speaking Montreal children born from 1987 to 1998, the prevalence of pervasive developmental disorders (PDD) was high and increasing. They also claimed that during the same period, Measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccination coverage had decreased and concluded, “Thus, pervasive developmental disorder rates significantly increased when measles-mumps-rubella vaccination uptake rates significantly decreased.”

The MMR uptake data used “were available through N. Bouliane, BN, MSc of the Direction de Santé Publique de la Capitale Nationale” and were “routinely collected in the region of Québec among 5-year-old children attending kindergarten during 1993-2004.”

La Capitale Nationale refers to Quebec City, located 265 kilometers from Montreal. Ms. Bouliane confirmed that the MMR vaccination rates were indeed from the Quebec City area but refused to release them to me because they were administrative internal information only intended for research.

......

The readers deserve to know why the authors compared developmental data from a specific group of children in Montreal with MMR vaccination data from the city of Quebec, some distance away.


So the original research paper used a set of data from Montreal compared to another set of data from Quebec City and concluded that that is no link between MMR vaccination and autism.

Here is the full article, http://www.vaproject.org/yazbak/tale-of-two-cities-20070307.htm

Here is the original research paper,
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/118/1/e139
in pdf format
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/118/1/e139.pdf

The doctors follow guidelines and policies from their associations. The associations establish guidelines and policies based on research papers. So, what is the purpose of this kind of research paper published in peer reviewed journal?

Thanks to the internet, now I can personally look at the research paper and make my own decision instead of just look at the media. We cannot do this ten years ago.

[sheldonchoo]

From your response it is evident that you have very strong feelings about the Autism/Vaccination debate.

However, one poorly executed/edited study does not mean the Physicians think we are incapable of reading.

There has been an assymetrical relationship between patients and physicians, mostly due to the old patriarchal (we know best) mode of thinking. Nowadays patients are better informed often because so much information is available, especially on the internet.

Unfortunately not all sources of information are equal. And while many studies are available online, to be honest, some research studies can be pretty damn confusing even if you do have a scientific background. They are not written to be understood by the lay public. Often due to the limitations of the studies they are not very generalizable to the real world and the media does a poor job in reporting what the studies are actually saying. To top it off medicine is full of conflicting studies, and not all are created equal. Many studies have problems in how they were conducted just like the one you posted about.

Back to your original post, If this was the only study being relied on to assert that there is no connection between Autism and MMR vacinations that would be one thing. All science is fraught with limitations, and I'm sure studies that link Autism with the vacinations also have weaknesses.

I agree with your point that we should try to educate yourself about medicine, but care must be taken in what sources you trust. There isn't a conspiracy by doctors to pull the wool over our eyes.

[getmail99]

The problem is not all people know how to find information on the internet and also the non-main stream info are considered by the doctors as "junk science". As usual, "the letter to the editor" which pointed out the flaw is not published, "junk science", right?

On the other hand, the good science just tells me "benefits outweigh the risks", that all I get! Trust your doctors, even they are sleeping while doing research and making long distance call to Quebec City the wrong place to get the data.

Oh, by the way, no doctor tells me that vaccine is not mandatory, I found it out from "junk science" website. The doctor will tell you that the baby needs vaccine record to go to school in Canada, but actually it is not required.

This is not the first flaw paper I came across, do you want me to show you some not-so-flaw research papers :cheesygri
I pointed out this one because this one really makes me angry :mad: .

[mart242]

If less and less kids are immunized, some deceased that had almost disappear would resurface and we could potentially end up with an epidemic. Immunizing kids might not be a perfect solution but it sounds like the best one.

[getmail99]

If less and less kids are immunized, some deceased that had almost disappear would resurface and we could potentially end up with an epidemic. Immunizing kids might not be a perfect solution but it sounds like the best one.

Yes, all human, not only parents, hope this is true, include me.

First, what is the cost? I ask you, if your son is the unlucky who die because of vaccination, do you still agree? Even doctors will not do it.

Conference paper on CDC website, so this is real. This is about Thimerosal. This is the link, you can look it up.

http://www.cdc.gov/nip/news/simptrans072005.pdf

On page 200,
"Forgive this personal comment, but I got called out
at eight o'clock for an emergency call and my
daughter-in-law delivered a son by C-section.
Our first male in the line of the next generation,
and I do not want that grandson to get a Thimerosal
containing vaccine until we know better what is going on.
It will probably take a long time. In the meantime, and I
know there are probably implications for
this internationally, but in the meanwhile I think I want
that grandson to only be given Thimerosal-free vaccines."

It is your son, if he dies, what else can you do. The doctor
may even say it is SID. It is very hard to prove the death
is because of vaccine. Look at the other thread, someone actually die of vaccination.

I am not against vaccine if it is safe and it works. Also,
does it really that effective? Do you want me to give you more link or you want to do your own research?

Yes, look at that research paper, mix up Montreal with Quebec City, they can cook up any data they want.