The OFFICIAL Hardwood Flooring Thread

[Matrix_dot_ca]

I am thinking of installing Premium Laminate floor. I wanted real hardwood but since i have 2 small kids i rather not worry about scratches. What do you guys think about Bruce - Park Avenue Premium Laminate? They have it at Rona and selling for $3.50/sqft. Seems like a hardwood price to me. Anyone can comment about the quality/durability?

[patrob]

I am thinking of installing Premium Laminate floor. I wanted real hardwood but since i have 2 small kids i rather not worry about scratches. What do you guys think about Bruce - Park Avenue Premium Laminate? They have it at Rona and selling for $3.50/sqft. Seems like a hardwood price to me. Anyone can comment about the quality/durability?
Never installed it yet. Have you checked out Torlys laminate? Many times premium laminate will be in that price range or even higher.

[t3359]

Every wood product should be climatized if delivered from unknown/unclimatized location. If it's delivered dry, install it & give it min. 4-7 days before you install your floors. Products like plywood or OSB is usually stored in dry locations so there should be no problems.

EDIT: Just noticed 2,000 posts already :razz: :D

Thanks... we just ripped off the old parquet floor which was glued onto plywood... I don't know what kind of adhesive it was, but it was very difficult to remove. I plan to put the OSB on top of this to raise the level of the floor before putting the hardwood on top of it.

Currently, the plywood is perpendicular to the joists which runs the length of the room. In the end I want the hardwood to run parallel to the joists. Should I run the OSB perpendicular to the joists (parallel to the plywood) but staggered relative to the plywood?

Also, when we removed the parquet, certain parts of the plywood had a layer ripped off. When we put down the OSB, is it with scratch adhesive in addition to screws?

You're awesome man... definitely thread of the year!

bjl

[speedyforme]

I have parquet on my main floor, what isues would I be facing if I wanted to just lay laminet or hardwood on top as opposed to ripping it out? Uneven floors? Squeaking?

[t3359]

I have parquet on my main floor, what isues would I be facing if I wanted to just lay laminet or hardwood on top as opposed to ripping it out? Uneven floors? Squeaking?

In our relatively small family room (250 sq-ft), we just ripped out the parquet - took my cousin and I (relatively strong people) from 2:30pm until 10pm (excluding a 1hr dinner break). Do normal people rip these things out? :)

bjl

[speedyforme]

In our relatively small family room (250 sq-ft), we just ripped out the parquet - took my cousin and I (relatively strong people) from 2:30pm until 10pm (excluding a 1hr dinner break). Do normal people rip these things out? :)

bjl

Wow it sounds like a lot of work. I probably have an area the size less than 400 sq ft. (Living/Dining room combined and a Great room)

[t3359]

Wow it sounds like a lot of work. I probably have an area the size less than 400 sq ft. (Living/Dining room combined and a Great room)

Going through what we did yesterday, I would be more likely to take a circular saw to it and just replace the sub-floor. The only reasons I did want to was the cost and clean up of the basement. (and my aunt wouldn't like it if my cousin fell into the basement :))

bjl

[patrob]

Thanks... we just ripped off the old parquet floor which was glued onto plywood... I don't know what kind of adhesive it was, but it was very difficult to remove. I plan to put the OSB on top of this to raise the level of the floor before putting the hardwood on top of it.

Currently, the plywood is perpendicular to the joists which runs the length of the room. In the end I want the hardwood to run parallel to the joists. Should I run the OSB perpendicular to the joists (parallel to the plywood) but staggered relative to the plywood?

Also, when we removed the parquet, certain parts of the plywood had a layer ripped off. When we put down the OSB, is it with scratch adhesive in addition to screws?

You're awesome man... definitely thread of the year!

bjl

Stagger the new sheets with the same direction. Use construction adhesive & screws. The little parts of missing plywood will not interfere.

How thick is the new OSB? I hope it's 5/8" or 3/4".

[patrob]

I have parquet on my main floor, what isues would I be facing if I wanted to just lay laminet or hardwood on top as opposed to ripping it out? Uneven floors? Squeaking?

If you don't have squeaks right now & the floor is pretty straight & the parquet is not popping up anywhere, you can lay on top. But it will increase your height.

[speedyforme]

If you don't have squeaks right now & the floor is pretty straight & the parquet is not popping up anywhere, you can lay on top. But it will increase your height.

Thanks. Oddly enough the tiling of the powder room and kitchen/breakfast area is higher than the current parquet. So either way, I don't think the transition points will even be the same height.

[patrob]

In our relatively small family room (250 sq-ft), we just ripped out the parquet - took my cousin and I (relatively strong people) from 2:30pm until 10pm (excluding a 1hr dinner break). Do normal people rip these things out? :)

bjl

Yes you're normal :D


Wow it sounds like a lot of work. I probably have an area the size less than 400 sq ft. (Living/Dining room combined and a Great room)

If you have proper tools like sharp chisel, 6" - 8" ice scraper it comes off pretty well. 400 ft. you should be able to take off in one day. Don't forget about gloves - blisters everywhere :cheesygri

[t3359]

Stagger the new sheets with the same direction. Use construction adhesive & screws. The little parts of missing plywood will not interfere.

How thick is the new OSB? I hope it's 5/8" or 3/4".

It would be 3/4" (to make it flush with the other room). Would you recommend plywood? I'm only thinking OSB because of cost.

thanks...
bjl

[patrob]

It would be 3/4" (to make it flush with the other room). Would you recommend plywood? I'm only thinking OSB because of cost.

thanks...
bjl

3/4" OSB is just fine, should make the sub-floor nice & straight.

[ging54321]

I'm finishing the basement and we have put down a subfloor (styroform type then plywood). The plywood is buckling in the in the middle of some rooms. The boards don't look really tight so I'm not sure what's causing it. The plywood that we haven't used yet (has been in the basement now a few weeks) is also starting to warp. Can we screw the sheets down to the concrete to stop it from being 'springy'?

Also I'm looking at various flooring and leaning towards engineered. I have about 400sq ft I need to do and wanted to find something good but not really expensive (approx. $1000 - I'll install). Any suggestions in the GVR?

edited to add: I was reading up on the Golden Select laminate from Costco. Would that be an ok alternative to engineered?

[Winterman]

I know this brand, have bought this brand many times for high end commercial jobs. It's a commercial wholesale floor you usually can not find at retail outlets. Never had a problem but you must always glue and nail down any exotics from any manufacturer or you will get gapping, not a lot of glue just a squiggle on the back. Good luck and install it properly!!!

Also Kempas is not Brazilian Walnut. There is a lot of stuff from Asia that they call it Brazilian Walnut but it's not even close. Brazilian Walnut is not orange or red in colour, it's a darker brown. Also buying hardwood from auctions is what you see is what you get. Don't expect a quality product and there is no history on this product, where it came from, how it came, where was it stored and what kind of finish was really used...[/QUOTE]

[patrob]

I'm finishing the basement and we have put down a subfloor (styroform type then plywood). The plywood is buckling in the in the middle of some rooms. The boards don't look really tight so I'm not sure what's causing it. The plywood that we haven't used yet (has been in the basement now a few weeks) is also starting to warp. Can we screw the sheets down to the concrete to stop it from being 'springy'?

Also I'm looking at various flooring and leaning towards engineered. I have about 400sq ft I need to do and wanted to find something good but not really expensive (approx. $1000 - I'll install). Any suggestions in the GVR?

edited to add: I was reading up on the Golden Select laminate from Costco. Would that be an ok alternative to engineered?

Yes, you can screw down the plywood to concrete. If the plywood is starting to buckle a lot, I would look into moisture levels in the basement. It will be pretty much impossible to find 400 sq. ft. of engineered hardwood for $1K.

Some have said that the Costco laminate is not bad but it's def. not engineered hardwood.

[patrob]

I know this brand, have bought this brand many times for high end commercial jobs. It's a commercial wholesale floor you usually can not find at retail outlets. Never had a problem but you must always glue and nail down any exotics from any manufacturer or you will get gapping, not a lot of glue just a squiggle on the back. Good luck and install it properly!!!



You can glue the whole floor with moisture cured adhesive & nail it. But if you don't maintain your humidity at recommended levels, exotics especially will shrink, gap, crack & cap :!:

And if you can't find it at specialty flooring stores it's not a high end product :| If you Google Exoticorp only auctions come up, really high end :rolleyes:
Here is at least one unsatisfied customer with Exoticorp http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8431837&postcount=1504

[ging54321]

Yes, you can screw down the plywood to concrete. If the plywood is starting to buckle a lot, I would look into moisture levels in the basement. It will be pretty much impossible to find 400 sq. ft. of engineered hardwood for $1K.

Some have said that the Costco laminate is not bad but it's def. not engineered hardwood.

is there an easy way to figure out the moisture level? I have hardwood on the main floor and don't have any issues with it. We are opening all the windows and door from outside to get some circulation and to help dry out the mudding but it's been rather dry lately so I'm not sure if that adds to the problem or not. It's not in all areas that the boards are doing this but so far one room and a few in the hallway.

Is there a good product to screw the plywood down with? We tried one (they were blue screws but I can't recall the name) but they popped out and broke. We used almost the longest ones possible.

I saw engineered hardwood at Home depot today for around $3/sq ft which I thought looked nice. It was trafficmaster brand. Not sure if that is a good price or even a good brand name.

thanks

[patrob]

is there an easy way to figure out the moisture level? I have hardwood on the main floor and don't have any issues with it. We are opening all the windows and door from outside to get some circulation and to help dry out the mudding but it's been rather dry lately so I'm not sure if that adds to the problem or not. It's not in all areas that the boards are doing this but so far one room and a few in the hallway.

Is there a good product to screw the plywood down with? We tried one (they were blue screws but I can't recall the name) but they popped out and broke. We used almost the longest ones possible.

I saw engineered hardwood at Home depot today for around $3/sq ft which I thought looked nice. It was trafficmaster brand. Not sure if that is a good price or even a good brand name.

thanks
Hygrometer will tell you the temperature & humidity levels in the room.

The blue screws are called tapcons (for concrete). For reg. sub-floor, use 2" flooring screws. Can't comment on the HD engineered stuff, you get what you pay for. But if this is your budget, I don't think you will have too many choices.

[hsj1]

Great thread ! a wealth of info.
Trying to get my head around a few issues I have been thinking about lately

I am looking to install ~340 sq ft of solid hardwood in a room (Dining/Family Room) which is 11' X 31' feet

1. Near the center of the room off to the sides, there are decorative columns which span from the ceiling to the floor. Do you need to remove the columns and install the wood or is the wood normally cut-to-fit and placed around the column base.
What would the Pros normally do?

2. Transition Pieces: The entries into the room have a marble inlay between the tiles and the existing carpet. The wood I am looking at is 3/4' inch thick and the marble is slightly lower (~quarter inch). I have noticed in some homes that the wood butts up to the marble (tight and level; no noticeable ridges) .
Is this possible in my case ?

Any help is appreciated

Thanks

[right4you]

Hi patrob:

I plan to install laminate (Golden Select Walnut from Costco) on the main floor including kitchen. I have the following questions:
1. The laminate is 12.3� thick plus 2� underlayment . Is it required to be installed on some specific subfloor like plywood or any subfloor will be fine?
2. How to install a nosing (to stair) for laminate floor and where to buy the color matched nosing?
3. Is laminate floor good for kitchen? How water resistant is it?

Any input will be appreciated.

[patrob]

Great thread ! a wealth of info.
Trying to get my head around a few issues I have been thinking about lately

I am looking to install ~340 sq ft of solid hardwood in a room (Dining/Family Room) which is 11' X 31' feet

1. Near the center of the room off to the sides, there are decorative columns which span from the ceiling to the floor. Do you need to remove the columns and install the wood or is the wood normally cut-to-fit and placed around the column base.
What would the Pros normally do?

2. Transition Pieces: The entries into the room have a marble inlay between the tiles and the existing carpet. The wood I am looking at is 3/4' inch thick and the marble is slightly lower (~quarter inch). I have noticed in some homes that the wood butts up to the marble (tight and level; no noticeable ridges) .
Is this possible in my case ?

Any help is appreciated

Thanks

1. Do not remove the columns. Cut it tight around it. You may require a small moulding around it.

2. Transition pieces/reducers, you cut them from the same wood to match the height between the marble & 3/4" wood.

It should look like this
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2919/waseem1tm5.jpg
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/486/img8172.jpg

[patrob]

Hi patrob:

I plan to install laminate (Golden Select Walnut from Costco) on the main floor including kitchen. I have the following questions:
1. The laminate is 12.3� thick plus 2� underlayment . Is it required to be installed on some specific subfloor like plywood or any subfloor will be fine?
2. How to install a nosing (to stair) for laminate floor and where to buy the color matched nosing?
3. Is laminate floor good for kitchen? How water resistant is it?

Any input will be appreciated.

That's the beauty of Costco flooring, they do not sell any accessories. Take a piece of that floor & go around from store to store & try to match as close as possible if you want pre-finished nosing. Otherwise use 1/2" or 5/8" nosing & match to height & colour. Laminate can be installed over anything except for carpet. What do you mean by 2" underlayment? Laminate is fine in the kitchen & any spills have to wiped off right away.

[right4you]

That's the beauty of Costco flooring, they do not sell any accessories. Take a piece of that floor & go around from store to store & try to match as close as possible if you want pre-finished nosing. Otherwise use 1/2" or 5/8" nosing & match to height & colour. Laminate can be installed over anything except for carpet. What do you mean by 2" underlayment? Laminate is fine in the kitchen & any spills have to wiped off right away.

Sorry the laminate is 12.3mm thick plus 2mm underlayment. You said spills have to be wiped off right away. Does that mean laminate is not water resistant? If yes, it is not good for kitchen then.

[patrob]

Sorry the laminate is 12.3mm thick plus 2mm underlayment. You said spills have to be wiped off right away. Does that mean laminate is not water resistant? If yes, it is not good for kitchen then.

The 2mm underlay is fine. If the water penetrates the joints, the laminate will swell up http://www.statewideinspection.com/images/Laminate%20floor-swelling%20and%20peaking%20at%20the%20seams..JPG

It may be somewhat water resistant but it's not water proof. That's why tiles are the preferred choice in kitchens.

[ging54321]

Hygrometer will tell you the temperature & humidity levels in the room.

The blue screws are called tapcons (for concrete). For reg. sub-floor, use 2" flooring screws. Can't comment on the HD engineered stuff, you get what you pay for. But if this is your budget, I don't think you will have too many choices.

Tapcons are what we had used. Was it not the right product? It's going through a sheet of plywood, a styroform sheet then into the concrete to pull the plywood down (we are finishing the basement). Home Depot hasn't been able to give us any help on this issue so far so it's been trial and error to figure out what works.

I went back to HD and the engineered floor I looked at was actually a different product than the sign indicated - there had been a mixup. The trafficmaster was hardwood and the engineered hardwood was Trillium brand and was $4.29/sq ft. The budget is flexible and I do have a few hundred $$ in gift cards coming to me from a promo HD had a few months back. I was just trying to keep the costs down but am willing to spend a bit more to get a nice looking product.

I'll look for a hygrometer. Thanks for all the info you have provided.

[patrob]

Tapcons are what we had used. Was it not the right product? It's going through a sheet of plywood, a styroform sheet then into the concrete to pull the plywood down (we are finishing the basement). Home Depot hasn't been able to give us any help on this issue so far so it's been trial and error to figure out what works.

I went back to HD and the engineered floor I looked at was actually a different product than the sign indicated - there had been a mixup. The trafficmaster was hardwood and the engineered hardwood was Trillium brand and was $4.29/sq ft. The budget is flexible and I do have a few hundred $$ in gift cards coming to me from a promo HD had a few months back. I was just trying to keep the costs down but am willing to spend a bit more to get a nice looking product.

I'll look for a hygrometer. Thanks for all the info you have provided.

Yes, you used the right product. Have you followed instructions how to fasten the screws properly? Have you used the bit provided? If you don't drill deep enough or with too big of a bit, it will come loose. For example: 1" styrofoam plus 3/4" ply or OSB, you will need 3" tapcons.

[ashgotti]

Hey guys,

I just bought my first house: it was built in '55 and has original floors that need to be refinished. How much should I expect to pay for one floor (about 300 square feet is hardwood) + darker staining? Also, is there a way to protect it from my dog's paws? he's only about 35lbs but he has some claws on him.

Thanks!

[jjtsl]

Does anyone have an idea if refinishing hardwood flooring is eligible for the federal Home Renovation Tax Credit? I tried interpreting what the fed website says, but can't be sure. I know that installing carpets & hardwood floors do qualify, since they are of an enduring nature, but refinishing hardwood floors too can be interpreted to be of an enduring nature that will last for years. :confused:

[ToChicka]

hi patrob. 2 quick Q's...

1) does either wood specie have a + to it? i.e. I like red oak and hubby likes maple gun stock color. Does maple/oak either have any special I should be looking for or are they bot sturdy and good quality and will last longer? easier to manage etc.

2) I'm thinking definitely sold wood for now, but is that true that Engineered hardwood flooring can be repaired just like sold i.e remove plank that is scratched/bad and insert new one? where as Laminate can't be fixed right?

[hsj1]

1. Do not remove the columns. Cut it tight around it. You may require a small moulding around it.

2. Transition pieces/reducers, you cut them from the same wood to match the height between the marble & 3/4" wood.

It should look like this
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2919/waseem1tm5.jpg
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/486/img8172.jpg

Thanks for the reply,

Looking at the pictures, I noticed:

1. It looks like there is a slight gap between the wood and the tile or am I mistaken?
What would you normally use to fill the gap in?

2. Are there any issues around the expansion gap that is normally required for wood?

3. Where would you normally start the installation in a room like the one shown in the picture,
from the entry way or from the other side

[patrob]

Hey guys,

I just bought my first house: it was built in '55 and has original floors that need to be refinished. How much should I expect to pay for one floor (about 300 square feet is hardwood) + darker staining? Also, is there a way to protect it from my dog's paws? he's only about 35lbs but he has some claws on him.

Thanks!

Not sure about your location... There is really not much you can do to protect the floors from the dog. 35 lbs. dog should not do that much damage :D

[patrob]

Does anyone have an idea if refinishing hardwood flooring is eligible for the federal Home Renovation Tax Credit? I tried interpreting what the fed website says, but can't be sure. I know that installing carpets & hardwood floors do qualify, since they are of an enduring nature, but refinishing hardwood floors too can be interpreted to be of an enduring nature that will last for years. :confused:

Yes, it should qualify, just get a receipt.

[patrob]

hi patrob. 2 quick Q's...

1) does either wood specie have a + to it? i.e. I like red oak and hubby likes maple gun stock color. Does maple/oak either have any special I should be looking for or are they bot sturdy and good quality and will last longer? easier to manage etc.

2) I'm thinking definitely sold wood for now, but is that true that Engineered hardwood flooring can be repaired just like sold i.e remove plank that is scratched/bad and insert new one? where as Laminate can't be fixed right?

1. Both species from reputable manufacturers will be durable. Maple will show more damage because of its smooth finish. Oak has heavier grain which hides the imperfections better.

2. Any kind of floor can be fixed, including laminate. Nail down engineered is easily fixable like solid hardwood. It's trickier when it's floated.

[patrob]

Thanks for the reply,

Looking at the pictures, I noticed:

1. It looks like there is a slight gap between the wood and the tile or am I mistaken?
What would you normally use to fill the gap in?

2. Are there any issues around the expansion gap that is normally required for wood?

3. Where would you normally start the installation in a room like the one shown in the picture,
from the entry way or from the other side

There is no gap between the wood & tile. The reducer is installed right at the edge of the beveled marble. The expansion gap is at the wall side. Job like this should be started from the tile. A full piece of wood at the tile looks nicer.

[STFan]

I am looking at Maple Mocha, I like the dark colours and I do not like the grains in dark colours.

In my current house, I have the natural oak but I want the dark colours for my new house.

From the last comment, It says that imperfections or lets say scratches will show more on maple. Please give me options (mocha preferred). 2 adults, 3 kids (2 teens and a younger child) lots of kids friend show up in the house though. Visitors come around a lot also.

Also, it will be 2030 sq ft of hardwood for the entire house ( tiles in kitchen, bathroom etc).

Don't want to make a mistake.

Thanks a bunch.

[ashgotti]

Not sure about your location... There is really not much you can do to protect the floors from the dog. 35 lbs. dog should not do that much damage :D

Thanks for the advice! I'm in Ottawa. What would be a reasonable range of $/square feet?

[patrob]

You're awesome man... definitely thread of the year!

bjl

If you find this thread helpful, you can nominate it as Most Helpful Thread & vote :)
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=763768

[patrob]

I am looking at Maple Mocha, I like the dark colours and I do not like the grains in dark colours.

In my current house, I have the natural oak but I want the dark colours for my new house.

From the last comment, It says that imperfections or lets say scratches will show more on maple. Please give me options (mocha preferred). 2 adults, 3 kids (2 teens and a younger child) lots of kids friend show up in the house though. Visitors come around a lot also.

Also, it will be 2030 sq ft of hardwood for the entire house ( tiles in kitchen, bathroom etc).

Don't want to make a mistake.

Thanks a bunch.
Yes, maple will show more damage than oak. If you like the look of maple then go for it. Just make sure kids don't walk with shoes & you might want to use area rugs to protect higher traffic areas. With maple you just have to be more careful.

We had maple floors in our previous house & I loved maple but once the kids came, there went my smooth maple floors :D But since your kids are older, they will not damage it as much.

[patrob]

Thanks for the advice! I'm in Ottawa. What would be a reasonable range of $/square feet?

Not sure about prices in Ottawa but here in GTA it's around $2.50 - $3 sq. ft. depending on the job.

[ashgotti]

Not sure about prices in Ottawa but here in GTA it's around $2.50 - $3 sq. ft. depending on the job.

That's pretty much what I'm finding. Thanks! How long does it tend to take?

[STFan]

Yes, maple will show more damage than oak. If you like the look of maple then go for it. Just make sure kids don't walk with shoes & you might want to use area rugs to protect higher traffic areas. With maple you just have to be more careful.

We had maple floors in our previous house & I loved maple but once the kids came, there went my smooth maple floors :D But since your kids are older, they will not damage it as much.

Did you have to resurface your hardwood ? I have to make sure I do the right thing, My husband will be upset if the hard wood starts to show scratches, he wants carpet and I convinced him to use hardwood.

Do you have any suggestions for Mocha coloured hardwood (not maple) that will not have too many grains but will also not show minor scratches ?

Thanks a bunch.

[t3359]

If you find this thread helpful, you can nominate it as Most Helpful Thread & vote :)
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=763768

You do deserve it! Nomination (http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9069984#post9069984)

bjl

[patrob]

That's pretty much what I'm finding. Thanks! How long does it tend to take?

Depends on the size of the job. 1 day sand & stain, day 2 - first coat/varnish & day 3 - one more coat (or more) But approx. for 1 week you won't be able to use that area until it's fully dry.

[patrob]

Did you have to resurface your hardwood ? I have to make sure I do the right thing, My husband will be upset if the hard wood starts to show scratches, he wants carpet and I convinced him to use hardwood.

Do you have any suggestions for Mocha coloured hardwood (not maple) that will not have too many grains but will also not show minor scratches ?

Thanks a bunch.

Any hardwood will show scratches. The first scratch hurts but the 2nd & 3rd you get used to :D Even if you go into hard exotics, they will also show scratches. The only product that is resistant to scratches is laminate. We did not re-finish the floors (we moved) but even after 10 years they still look fairly decent. They mainly had surface scratches.

Were you looking for something like this dark brown?
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/sse_jatobavenetian.gif

Or lighter?
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/maple_windsor.jpg

[patrob]

You do deserve it! Nomination (http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9069984#post9069984)

bjl

Thank you ;)

[STFan]

Any hardwood will show scratches. The first scratch hurts but the 2nd & 3rd you get used to :D Even if you go into hard exotics, they will also show scratches. The only product that is resistant to scratches is laminate. We did not re-finish the floors (we moved) but even after 10 years they still look fairly decent. They mainly had surface scratches.

Were you looking for something like this dark brown?
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/sse_jatobavenetian.gif

Or lighter?
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/maple_windsor.jpg

The one I want is the Maple Java Mocha or Maple Mocha Java. It looks like the darker one.

Thanks. I nominated you. I have read a lot from your thread, you deserve the award.

[Anonymouse]

I have some gouges in a hardwood floor, deep enough to show the natural colour of the wood underneath the stain. I need to camoflage these gouges to pass the landlord's inspection. I have been using one of my daughter's brown pencil crayons, which actually works pretty well, but I'm wondering if there's a better product?

[Linutor]

I hope your landlord isn't reading this thread...:lol:

[ssainani]

i've always loved the wood used at BCBG stores ..... i live in a condo so i know it's not feasible with my budget to use the same hardwood as this .... but is there any high quality laminate which looks like this

and what is this wood colour called?

http://myfiletemp.com/files/bc1.jpg

http://myfiletemp.com/files/bc2.jpg

[patrob]

The one I want is the Maple Java Mocha or Maple Mocha Java. It looks like the darker one.

Thanks. I nominated you. I have read a lot from your thread, you deserve the award.

Thanks for the nomination :D

If you like the darker one, then take a look at the Vintage Maple Taboo. It's a new colour & very dark brown espresso.
http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/6582/img8564.jpg

[patrob]

I have some gouges in a hardwood floor, deep enough to show the natural colour of the wood underneath the stain. I need to camoflage these gouges to pass the landlord's inspection. I have been using one of my daughter's brown pencil crayons, which actually works pretty well, but I'm wondering if there's a better product?

Looks like you owe your daughter a new set of crayons :lol:

You can get a touch up kit or a putty stick that closely matches the colour of the floor & fill in the dents.

[patrob]

i've always loved the wood used at BCBG stores ..... i live in a condo so i know it's not feasible with my budget to use the same hardwood as this .... but is there any high quality laminate which looks like this

and what is this wood colour called?

http://myfiletemp.com/files/bc1.jpg

http://myfiletemp.com/files/bc2.jpg

Try Kahrs
http://www.kahrs.com/US/Consumer/DesignInspiration/VirtualShowroom/Pages/VirtualShowroom.aspx

[ssainani]

Try Kahrs
http://www.kahrs.com/US/Consumer/DesignInspiration/VirtualShowroom/Pages/VirtualShowroom.aspx

any idea what you'd call the colour or species i like from the photos i posted above?

[patrob]

any idea what you'd call the colour or species i like from the photos i posted above?

It looks like 3rd grade of either black walnut or maple. The lower the grade, the more colour variation you get.

Perhaps take your pics to a Kahrs dealer & they should help you find something similar.

[Brandon]

I've seen this thread around, but haven't had any use for it until now. I just bought a new house and am investigating costs associated with getting hardwood installed on the main floor.

I'm in Ottawa, and moving into a Mattamy home. I want the main floor to have a combination of ceramic (foyer, bathroom, kitchen, garage entrance)and hardwood (family room and dining/living room).

I'm getting the ceramic done by the builder, but I'm looking to do the hardwood myself (well, getting someone else to do it). So the main floor will have carpet installed. I'm not certain what the subfloor is, but I'm assuming it's recycled cork or something like that (I'll have to clarify with the builder).

Also, I'm looking for something relatively darker and with mild/low grain (so oak is out of the picture, but maple is nice). Low maintenance, other than cleaning would be nice as well. Another consideration is that I have a small dog (15lbs), and will be getting another dog within the near future (around 25-35lbs). My current dog runs crazily around the house. The house I'm living at now has birch (I think) and the wood is REALLY scratched up.

I've been recommended to get laminate, is that a good choice? What would your recommendations be if I wanted to get laminate but looking/feeling close to real hardwood? I don't mind spending more on a better quality laminate if this is the case. Are there any REAL hardwoods you'd recommend? Or is this not possible for what I want?

As well, would I have to do anything for the subfloor? Ideally it'd be nice if I could put something down that would reduce noise/vibration too.

What are your recommendations? Do you know any installers in the Ottawa area? I'm just trying to plan everything out as the closing date for the house is still far (May 2010).

Thanks! :)

[patrob]

I've seen this thread around, but haven't had any use for it until now. I just bought a new house and am investigating costs associated with getting hardwood installed on the main floor.

I'm in Ottawa, and moving into a Mattamy home. I want the main floor to have a combination of ceramic (foyer, bathroom, kitchen, garage entrance)and hardwood (family room and dining/living room).

I'm getting the ceramic done by the builder, but I'm looking to do the hardwood myself (well, getting someone else to do it). So the main floor will have carpet installed. I'm not certain what the subfloor is, but I'm assuming it's recycled cork or something like that (I'll have to clarify with the builder).

Also, I'm looking for something relatively darker and with mild/low grain (so oak is out of the picture, but maple is nice). Low maintenance, other than cleaning would be nice as well. Another consideration is that I have a small dog (15lbs), and will be getting another dog within the near future (around 25-35lbs). My current dog runs crazily around the house. The house I'm living at now has birch (I think) and the wood is REALLY scratched up.

I've been recommended to get laminate, is that a good choice? What would your recommendations be if I wanted to get laminate but looking/feeling close to real hardwood? I don't mind spending more on a better quality laminate if this is the case. Are there any REAL hardwoods you'd recommend? Or is this not possible for what I want?

As well, would I have to do anything for the subfloor? Ideally it'd be nice if I could put something down that would reduce noise/vibration too.

What are your recommendations? Do you know any installers in the Ottawa area? I'm just trying to plan everything out as the closing date for the house is still far (May 2010).

Thanks! :)

There are some single plank laminates that look very realistic like wood (Torlys) Have you looked into handscraped products like Hickory or Maple? Which has less grain, it's slightly distressed & pretty durable & is real wood (engineered Solid Sawn by Vintage).

Your sub-floors are most likely OSB, not cork. You don't need to do anything to the sub-floors. If nailed down, there is no additional sub-floor to minimize vibration. If floated (laminate) there are diff. types of underlay like cork, which is great for sound & cushion.

Check out the Ottawa forums on BuildingHomes.ca for installer recommendations, I personally don't know any there :D

[Anonymouse]

I ended up staining the damaged area, and it looks a bit darker than the surrounding area. (I thought it was red oak, and my wife later told me it's more like cherry) How would a professional repair this? Would you belt sand and then stain/urethane? Cut the boards out and replace with prefinished?

I can post pix tonight if that would be helpful.

[aas66969]

I have put 3/8" plywood on existing OSB.

Is expansion gap required along the seams and walls when i screwed the plywood?

I put it tight to the wall.

Will this cause me problems when I install 3/4" hardwood?

TIA

[taylyn]

Here is my situation.

The home is a large townhome. The living room, dining room, and upstairs is hardwood flooring, a lighter color which definitely needs to be touched up in places. The main entry in the hallway and the kitchen is a peel and stick tile with a black backing which has probably been there for 20 years (ugly ugly ugly). To remove a small piece took over an hour so removing it all is not fiscally or physically feasible.

What would you do?
a) refinish the existing floors and figure out how to install ceramic tile over the peel and stick (i.e. install new subfloor over it) or

b) new hardwood which would cover the entire main floor, all the same and forgo ceramic

Think of the layout as this. You enter the front door. The entire left half of the house is the hardwood. The entire right is the entry/hallway/kitchen and has peel and stick. A wall divides down the middle.

I have no idea what to do with it.

[Brandon]

There are some single plank laminates that look very realistic like wood (Torlys) Have you looked into handscraped products like Hickory or Maple? Which has less grain, it's slightly distressed & pretty durable & is real wood (engineered Solid Sawn by Vintage).

I'll take a look at Torlys. I found a few resellers that are listed on their website that are near me. As for Hickory or Maple, how is their durability compared to Torlys laminate? Any brand recommendations for those kinds of wood? I'm assuming the laminate will be significantly cheaper than the engineered wood?

And as for removing the carpet myself to save some money, is it as straight forward as just pulling it out? The steps on the stairs are carpet, but I'm assuming it will be completely separate from the carpet on the main floor?

[patrob]

I ended up staining the damaged area, and it looks a bit darker than the surrounding area. (I thought it was red oak, and my wife later told me it's more like cherry) How would a professional repair this? Would you belt sand and then stain/urethane? Cut the boards out and replace with prefinished?

I can post pix tonight if that would be helpful.

So is it red oak or cherry wood? Is it pre-finished or stained on site? Send it with a palm sander, belt sander will ruin it. Try a diff. stain colour.

[patrob]

I have put 3/8" plywood on existing OSB.

Is expansion gap required along the seams and walls when i screwed the plywood?

I put it tight to the wall.

Will this cause me problems when I install 3/4" hardwood?

TIA

Your walls are built on original sub-floor, there always should be a little bit of a gap around the walls for expansion. Plywood is multi-layered structure, it doesn't really expand & contract as much. It will be fine. No expansion gap on the seams.

[patrob]

Here is my situation.

The home is a large townhome. The living room, dining room, and upstairs is hardwood flooring, a lighter color which definitely needs to be touched up in places. The main entry in the hallway and the kitchen is a peel and stick tile with a black backing which has probably been there for 20 years (ugly ugly ugly). To remove a small piece took over an hour so removing it all is not fiscally or physically feasible.

What would you do?
a) refinish the existing floors and figure out how to install ceramic tile over the peel and stick (i.e. install new subfloor over it) or

b) new hardwood which would cover the entire main floor, all the same and forgo ceramic

Think of the layout as this. You enter the front door. The entire left half of the house is the hardwood. The entire right is the entry/hallway/kitchen and has peel and stick. A wall divides down the middle.

I have no idea what to do with it.
Those tiles are removable even though it takes long. It's usually installed over 1/4" plywood which should also be removed. Cut it with a skill saw & remove in sheets. Check in the vent how many layers there is before attempting. Then after removing, you can think about new floor covering.

Even though hardwood looks great, I still prefer ceramic or stone tiles in the kitchen. It's just more durable.

[patrob]

I'll take a look at Torlys. I found a few resellers that are listed on their website that are near me. As for Hickory or Maple, how is their durability compared to Torlys laminate? Any brand recommendations for those kinds of wood? I'm assuming the laminate will be significantly cheaper than the engineered wood?

And as for removing the carpet myself to save some money, is it as straight forward as just pulling it out? The steps on the stairs are carpet, but I'm assuming it will be completely separate from the carpet on the main floor?

You cannot compare laminate to hardwood. Of course solid sawn hardwood will be more expensive than laminate & I highly recommend Vintage.

If you don't need the carpet, cut it in 3 ft. strips, roll it, tape it & pitch it. Same thing with underlay. Remove ALL staples & tack strips around. Yes, the stairs will be separate.

[Brandon]

You cannot compare laminate to hardwood. Of course solid sawn hardwood will be more expensive than laminate & I highly recommend Vintage.

Thanks for all your help with my questions. What brands do you recommend for solid sawn hardwood from a value point of view? (and in general)

[patrob]

Thanks for all your help with my questions. What brands do you recommend for solid sawn hardwood from a value point of view? (and in general)

There's only one ;) www.vintageflooring.com

[Brandon]

There's only one ;) www.vintageflooring.com

Great I'm gonna take a look at the Torlys and Vintage Flooring resellers nearby this weekend. There's quite a few.

[Anonymouse]

So is it red oak or cherry wood? Is it pre-finished or stained on site? Send it with a palm sander, belt sander will ruin it. Try a diff. stain colour.

I assume that since there are pronounced ridges between the boards that they are prefinished. I used a palm sander to remove the too-dark stain I applied and now there is (mostly) bare wood again. I started with 60 grit and moved up to 180 grit.

I'm calling around for professionals to do a good colour-matching stain, but business seems to be good for them; they all claim they're too busy to do simple spot repairs.

[patrob]

I assume that since there are pronounced ridges between the boards that they are prefinished. I used a palm sander to remove the too-dark stain I applied and now there is (mostly) bare wood again. I started with 60 grit and moved up to 180 grit.

I'm calling around for professionals to do a good colour-matching stain, but business seems to be good for them; they all claim they're too busy to do simple spot repairs.

Yes, it does look like it's pre-finished. Nobody likes to do repairs but also customers don't like to pay what they want for the repairs :D
You should be able to match the colour from HD or Rona line (mini cans)

[danyo]

Hi we just bought a home and were moving in late August or early September.
We have carpet on the stairs leading upstairs as well as the entire 2nd floor (minus bathrooms). (There might be hardwood underneath, but we haven't checked yet)
The house is 11 years old.

We have been talking about possibly wanting to remove the carpet to install hardwood floors throughout the upstairs and stairs area. (depending on cost)

The house will be in the Markham region close to Kennedy and Steeles.

I just found the link in your signature. Is that your company?
If so, what measurements/information would you need from us to give us an estimate of how much it'll cost?
If there is hardwood underneath the carpet and we decide that we would STILL want to replace it, would the old hardwood need to be ripped out before the new installation process can begin?
What is the most cost effective route? If a laminate finish would give off a nice hardwood look with a big saving, we wouldn't mind that route. If the savings are minimal, we would prefer hardwood (if we do decide to refloor).

We might be shopping around for a floor installer soon, and wouldn't mind helping an RFD member out with a good price. :)
Thanks and I apologize for asking so many questions in 1 post!

[TorontoEh]

deciding b/w either going with Natural Red Oak or Maple (hard), is there some coating or stain can we get to ensure there won't be nicks or scratches?

Also, how would you describe 'ash' wood species? in terms of comparion b/w oak and maple? Is it expensive, better or stick with Oak?

[patrob]

Hi we just bought a home and were moving in late August or early September.
We have carpet on the stairs leading upstairs as well as the entire 2nd floor (minus bathrooms). (There might be hardwood underneath, but we haven't checked yet)
The house is 11 years old.

We have been talking about possibly wanting to remove the carpet to install hardwood floors throughout the upstairs and stairs area. (depending on cost)

The house will be in the Markham region close to Kennedy and Steeles.

I just found the link in your signature. Is that your company?
If so, what measurements/information would you need from us to give us an estimate of how much it'll cost?
If there is hardwood underneath the carpet and we decide that we would STILL want to replace it, would the old hardwood need to be ripped out before the new installation process can begin?
What is the most cost effective route? If a laminate finish would give off a nice hardwood look with a big saving, we wouldn't mind that route. If the savings are minimal, we would prefer hardwood (if we do decide to refloor).

We might be shopping around for a floor installer soon, and wouldn't mind helping an RFD member out with a good price. :)
Thanks and I apologize for asking so many questions in 1 post!

I highly doubt there is hardwood under the carpet in a 11 year old house. It's expensive to re-cap the stairs with wood & price comparison between high end laminate & hardwood is not that much. But if you are looking for cheap laminate, then it will be a big price difference.

Yes, that is our company :D You can e-mail me the room measurements & layout or if you have the floorplan or we can come over once you close, measure & go from there.

[patrob]

deciding b/w either going with Natural Red Oak or Maple (hard), is there some coating or stain can we get to ensure there won't be nicks or scratches?

Also, how would you describe 'ash' wood species? in terms of comparion b/w oak and maple? Is it expensive, better or stick with Oak?

You're still undecided :cheesygri Oak & ash are very similar with grain. Maple & ash are alike with durability & smoother finish. Ash shows defects same as maple. Ash is less expensive than the other two. There is no coating you can add to prevent scratches.

[t3359]

Your walls are built on original sub-floor, there always should be a little bit of a gap around the walls for expansion. Plywood is multi-layered structure, it doesn't really expand & contract as much. It will be fine. No expansion gap on the seams.

How about the other way around? I'm putting 3/4" OSB onto an existing plywood subfloor... What should the gap from the wall be?

thanks...
bjl

[patrob]

How about the other way around? I'm putting 3/4" OSB onto an existing plywood subfloor... What should the gap from the wall be?

thanks...
bjl

1/4" or so. While installing additional sub-floor or hardwood, try to avoid contact with walls (studs or baseboards) In case of any movement or flexing, it creates squeaks & creaks, so you want to avoid wood to wood contact.

[Anonymouse]

It turns out there's a local paint store with a woodstain-matching service. I took a small core of the original stained wood from underneath an air register to give to them.

Any tips on how to best apply gel-based stain would be welcome.

[danyo]

Sent you a PM. :)

[patrob]

It turns out there's a local paint store with a woodstain-matching service. I took a small core of the original stained wood from underneath an air register to give to them.

Any tips on how to best apply gel-based stain would be welcome.

It's better if you follow the instructions on the can. We never use gel stains.

[danyo]

It's better if you follow the instructions on the can. We never use gel stains.

Quick bump before bed. I sent you a personal message Patrob, check your inbox. :)
Let me know.

[patrob]

Quick bump before bed. I sent you a personal message Patrob, check your inbox. :)
Let me know.

PM sent again.

[danyo]

Your reply must've been lost in the server upgrades yesterday (same thing happened to my post a few times).

Anyway, I was also wondering, what colour hardwood best matches our pre-existing pickets/handrails?

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/3923/img0495.jpg

And of that colour, how much does each sq.ft cost in Vintage hardwood? Not familiar with types, if you don't mind, can you briefly explain the options and differences as well? And lastly, what is the thickness of them?

[patrob]

Your reply must've been lost in the server upgrades yesterday (same thing happened to my post a few times).

Anyway, I was also wondering, what colour hardwood best matches our pre-existing pickets/handrails?

And of that colour, how much does each sq.ft cost in Vintage hardwood? Not familiar with types, if you don't mind, can you briefly explain the options and differences as well? And lastly, what is the thickness of them?
That's probably what happened :D

The colour from Vintage that will match your existing handrails is Red Oak Galliano. Your stairs are oak but over the years, natural oak stairs yellow a bit & Galliano is a perfect colour match. Vintage actually developed Galliano in order to match older existing staircases. The wood is 3/4" thickness. You will also need new nosings on upper hallway, which will increase your cost.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakgalliano.gif

[Mint]

hey there, we initially thought about re-doing the hardwood at our house (~80 years old), but think we want to try to refinish the wood ourselves first and see how it turns out. It's the skinny beige type.

After sanding would we be able to stain it that dark expresso colour? Something like this colour on your website:
http://floorwood.webs.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=24821157

There are also some chips (4-5" thin strips) missing in some areas. I don't think we'll be able to sand it down far enough to even it out, but i'm hoping by going dark it won't be as obvious.

In additon, when you apply the coating afterwards does it fill in the gaps (chipped area)? and can you get the "satin" feel that you see on new hardwood?

Thanks in advance.

[patrob]

hey there, we initially thought about re-doing the hardwood at our house (~80 years old), but think we want to try to refinish the wood ourselves first and see how it turns out. It's the skinny beige type.

After sanding would we be able to stain it that dark expresso colour? Something like this colour on your website:
http://floorwood.webs.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=24821157

There are also some chips (4-5" thin strips) missing in some areas. I don't think we'll be able to sand it down far enough to even it out, but i'm hoping by going dark it won't be as obvious.

In additon, when you apply the coating afterwards does it fill in the gaps (chipped area)? and can you get the "satin" feel that you see on new hardwood?

Thanks in advance.
It might be possible to re-finish but that depends on the floor's condition, how many times it has already been re-finished. You def. need to have a professional re-finisher take a look at it & he will tell you if you can re-finish or need to replace the floors. I can provide you contact info for a re-finisher if you need :)

[jingyu]

Are you talking the price of hard floor installation labor charge or hardfloor material price itself? Thanks.

Not sure about prices in Ottawa but here in GTA it's around $2.50 - $3 sq. ft. depending on the job.

[patrob]

Are you talking the price of hard floor installation labor charge or hardfloor material price itself? Thanks.

No it's not for hardwood installation, it was for floor re-finishing.
Price for hardwood materials will be more than $3 sq. ft. ;)

[thomas101]

Patrob,

We were quoted $4.50/SF for 5" x 3/4 solid planks, Asian Cherry.

What is you opion on this particular type (sorry, did not notice the manufacturer) and if wide plank is a good idea? I am thinking in term of wood movement post installation. The wider plank could be more vulnerable with cupping?

Thanks in advance.

[patrob]

Patrob,

We were quoted $4.50/SF for 5" x 3/4 solid planks, Asian Cherry.

What is you opion on this particular type (sorry, did not notice the manufacturer) and if wide plank is a good idea? I am thinking in term of wood movement post installation. The wider plank could be more vulnerable with cupping?

Thanks in advance.

The price is def. very low but I have a feeling why. It's probably made in Asia & I do not recommend it. I would not go with anything wider than 4" in solid or you're asking for problems. You are correct about wider planks cupping unless it's engineered (solid sawn). Take a look at Vintage 5" or even 7" wide 3/4" Solid Sawn but the price will be higher. You can PM me & I will give you more pricing info.

[thomas101]

The price is def. very low but I have a feeling why. It's probably made in Asia & I do not recommend it. I would not go with anything wider than 4" in solid or you're asking for problems. You are correct about wider planks cupping unless it's engineered (solid sawn). Take a look at Vintage 5" or even 7" wide 3/4" Solid Sawn but the price will be higher. You can PM me & I will give you more pricing info.

We spoke to Rob once over the phone in June requesting some samples. Our job is small living room 17 x 20 including the space occupied by the stairsl and I am just looking to install it myself.

We are out of Rob's way so he probably could not make it.

Really appreciate your input regarding our Asian Cherry, we probaly continue to shop around.

[jbainton]

Hi,

I am in the middle of laying Vintage 3 1/4" Solid Sawn Jatoba Renaissance hardwood (I hope I got a decent price @ 7.29/sq. ft.), but I was wondering the best way to transition from the 3/4" height of the wood to ceramic which is probably about 3/8". The person I bought the wood from recommended a T-molding, but I was noticing the reducers in the catalogue. Is there anything that you could recommend that would be 'flat' from the top of the edge of the hardwood?

Thanks!

[rayq]

Hi, is it possible to reuse the hardwood floor? Our hallway up to the kitchen and its breadfast area have hardwood while our family room and reflex room have not. We'd like to reuse those hardwood floor to cover those rooms and use ceramic tiles for the hallway and kitchen instead. The purpose to reuse those hardwood floor material is the color matching with the stair. Will that be too much work and better to buy new ones? Thanks.

[patrob]

We spoke to Rob once over the phone in June requesting some samples. Our job is small living room 17 x 20 including the space occupied by the stairsl and I am just looking to install it myself.

We are out of Rob's way so he probably could not make it.

Really appreciate your input regarding our Asian Cherry, we probaly continue to shop around.

Not sure what happened then but you can certainly try calling him again if you want :)

[patrob]

Hi,

I am in the middle of laying Vintage 3 1/4" Solid Sawn Jatoba Renaissance hardwood (I hope I got a decent price @ 7.29/sq. ft.), but I was wondering the best way to transition from the 3/4" height of the wood to ceramic which is probably about 3/8". The person I bought the wood from recommended a T-molding, but I was noticing the reducers in the catalogue. Is there anything that you could recommend that would be 'flat' from the top of the edge of the hardwood?

Thanks!

Is that price before or after taxes? We make our own reducers from the same wood installed. If you search this thread, you can find a post on how to make one with a pic. A professional installer should know how to make a reducer.

[patrob]

Hi, is it possible to reuse the hardwood floor? Our hallway up to the kitchen and its breadfast area have hardwood while our family room and reflex room have not. We'd like to reuse those hardwood floor to cover those rooms and use ceramic tiles for the hallway and kitchen instead. The purpose to reuse those hardwood floor material is the color matching with the stair. Will that be too much work and better to buy new ones? Thanks.

If you remove it carefully line by line, you will be able to re-use some of it. Perhaps 60-70% of the hardwood you could save, not sure if it will be enough to cover the new rooms.

[jbainton]

Is that price before or after taxes? We make our own reducers from the same wood installed. If you search this thread, you can find a post on how to make one with a pic. A professional installer should know how to make a reducer.

$7.29 was before taxes.

[patrob]

$7.29 was before taxes.

Wow, that is on the high side. Too bad you did not ask me for a quote, I could have sold it to you for much less ;)

[fliime]

patrob,

thanks for this informative thread, it has been very helpful to many friends of mine, just wanted to say thank you for your time and efforts. I bookmarked your website so that I'll give you a call when services are needed.

[patrob]

patrob,

thanks for this informative thread, it has been very helpful to many friends of mine, just wanted to say thank you for your time and efforts. I bookmarked your website so that I'll give you a call when services are needed.

No problem :)

You & others will have an opportunity to vote for this thread as the Most Helpful in the upcoming

http://images.redflagdeals.com/rfdimages/promos/readerappreciation2009/appreciation380x150Frame3.png
http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=113
;)

[letitbe1973]

Is there special handling on the hardwood placed in front of the bathroom entrance? My bathroom entrance tile is higher than the hardwood floor. Will the reducer prevent the kids from kicking on the tile and falling? Thanks.

[patrob]

Is there special handling on the hardwood placed in front of the bathroom entrance? My bathroom entrance tile is higher than the hardwood floor. Will the reducer prevent the kids from kicking on the tile and falling? Thanks.

Try to have the hardwood installed & the piece by the tile raised or lowered to minimize the difference in height (no edge). In some cases if the tiles are very high, additional moulding might have to be installed on top of the wood.
For example, hardwood should be installed to the lower edge of the bevel of the marble threshold.

[t3359]

Hi Patrob,

I'm doing a floor with a border around the perimeter. I have a 3 1/4 hard maple fill, with a 2 1/4 birch border. Finally a 3 1/4 hard maple around that. Would there be a problem mixing these two?

In the diagram below, the brown is the maple, and the yellow is birch. The border is one 2 1/4 strip of birch and one 3 1/4 strip of maple.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/8822/patternp.th.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/i/patternp.jpg/)

thanks again!
bjl

[letitbe1973]

Try to have the hardwood installed & the piece by the tile raised or lowered to minimize the difference in height (no edge). In some cases if the tiles are very high, additional moulding might have to be installed on top of the wood.
For example, hardwood should be installed to the lower edge of the bevel of the marble threshold.

Thanks. Could you please give me a moulding sample picture or website?

[flixxx]

hey hey,

I recently bought some Hard maple and had it installed. towards the end of the installation we noticed quite a bit of dents and had to yell at my installer. He swore he never had tools on them and didn't do anything different then he usually does. After closer inspection he said that he believed they sold me Birch in place of maple. He took the wood to a co-worker of his and he too confirmed that's probably birch.

I'm planning to go back to the people that sold it to me, but i'm wondering if there is somewhere I can go officially to confirm whether it's birch or Maple? (And get it in writing).

I am living in Montreal.

Thanks

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I'm doing a floor with a border around the perimeter. I have a 3 1/4 hard maple fill, with a 2 1/4 birch border. Finally a 3 1/4 hard maple around that. Would there be a problem mixing these two?

In the diagram below, the brown is the maple, and the yellow is birch. The border is one 2 1/4 strip of birch and one 3 1/4 strip of maple.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/8822/patternp.th.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/i/patternp.jpg/)

thanks again!
bjl
No problem with mixing diff. species. I am sure it will look very good when finished, post some pics :D

[patrob]

Thanks. Could you please give me a moulding sample picture or website?

We make our own transition pieces according to height of tile & I don't have pic of a raised transition piece. Here is a pic of a transition piece going down to the tile/marble & with a raised transition, it would be the opposite, shimmed up to the tile. http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2919/waseem1tm5.jpg

[patrob]

hey hey,

I recently bought some Hard maple and had it installed. towards the end of the installation we noticed quite a bit of dents and had to yell at my installer. He swore he never had tools on them and didn't do anything different then he usually does. After closer inspection he said that he believed they sold me Birch in place of maple. He took the wood to a co-worker of his and he too confirmed that's probably birch.

I'm planning to go back to the people that sold it to me, but i'm wondering if there is somewhere I can go officially to confirm whether it's birch or Maple? (And get it in writing).

I am living in Montreal.

Thanks
Do you have pics? Who's the manufacturer of the hardwood you purchased? Not sure who would give you something in writing, maybe call some flooring stores in your area & ask if they can confirm it's birch not maple.

[Doiturselfguy72]

A person I was talking to the other day happened to mention the name of a company website for hardwood flooring in the US which ships to Canada at a highly discounted rate, but only sold bundles of flooring by the skid. Have you heard of this company? I know part of the site name was direct.com or factory.com, but I just can't seem to locate it using google. She was telling me friends of hers had used them and found huge savings vs local companies.

[jbainton]

Hi patrob,

I have a complex conundrum. I am floating Vintage Solid Sawn over concrete. I am just coming up on the transitions. I have three transitions, and I am trying to figure out how to make them look nice.

Transition 1:
Hardwood to Carpet - on a 45 degree angle to the way the hardwood flooring is layed. There is a little bit of a height difference.

Transition 2:
Hardwood to Tile - goes with how the flooring is layed. There is no 'indent' so it would have to continue at the same height as the rest of the wood in the row...so I am not sure how to make a transition for this one. There is about a half inch difference between the wood and tile.

Transition 3:
Hardwood to Tile - lays at 90 degrees to how the floor is layed. Again, there is no 'indent' to allow a transition piece to go in nicely at 90 degrees. There is about a half inch of difference between the wood and tile.


The Floor Shop told me to use T-moldings, and I bought them ($144 of them...ouch!), but I don't want to use them because they will look awful! They claimed it was the only thing you could use to transition to a floating floor.

Obviously I hate the look and would want to build my own, but I am worried about having them be so close to the tile when it is floating, and also how to get the grades correct. For Transition 1, I think it is straightforward to do, however, for #2 and #3, I am not sure how to transition them because the tile is already layed and I would have to change the levels as the run of boards goes past the one transition.

Am I going to have to use the T-molding? eek :(

[patrob]

A person I was talking to the other day happened to mention the name of a company website for hardwood flooring in the US which ships to Canada at a highly discounted rate, but only sold bundles of flooring by the skid. Have you heard of this company? I know part of the site name was direct.com or factory.com, but I just can't seem to locate it using google. She was telling me friends of hers had used them and found huge savings vs local companies.

This one :) www.builddirect.com

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

I have a complex conundrum. I am floating Vintage Solid Sawn over concrete. I am just coming up on the transitions. I have three transitions, and I am trying to figure out how to make them look nice.

Transition 1:
Hardwood to Carpet - on a 45 degree angle to the way the hardwood flooring is layed. There is a little bit of a height difference.

Transition 2:
Hardwood to Tile - goes with how the flooring is layed. There is no 'indent' so it would have to continue at the same height as the rest of the wood in the row...so I am not sure how to make a transition for this one. There is about a half inch difference between the wood and tile.

Transition 3:
Hardwood to Tile - lays at 90 degrees to how the floor is layed. Again, there is no 'indent' to allow a transition piece to go in nicely at 90 degrees. There is about a half inch of difference between the wood and tile.


The Floor Shop told me to use T-moldings, and I bought them ($144 of them...ouch!), but I don't want to use them because they will look awful! They claimed it was the only thing you could use to transition to a floating floor.

Obviously I hate the look and would want to build my own, but I am worried about having them be so close to the tile when it is floating, and also how to get the grades correct. For Transition 1, I think it is straightforward to do, however, for #2 and #3, I am not sure how to transition them because the tile is already layed and I would have to change the levels as the run of boards goes past the one transition.

Am I going to have to use the T-molding? eek :(
1. If you are not able to make a tongue & groove joint with the router, you might have to use a T-mold on 45 or 90 degree. If you are able to make the groove in the cut planks, make a threshold out of the wood used, fasten it solid to sub-floor. You may have to cut the bottom little bit to lower the threshold to press on the carpet.

2 & 3 Is the tile higher or lower? It's pretty much the same answer for all.

You can only use a T-mold if there is not that much height difference between floors. If your tile is lower than hardwood & if you use T-mold, the edge that sits on hardwood will stick up. If your tile is higher, you will have a hard time fastening the T-mold. BTW, are you doing the installation yourself?

[jbainton]

1. If you are not able to make a tongue & groove joint with the router, you might have to use a T-mold on 45 or 90 degree. If you are able to make the groove in the cut planks, make a threshold out of the wood used, fasten it solid to sub-floor. You may have to cut the bottom little bit to lower the threshold to press on the carpet.

2 & 3 Is the tile higher or lower? It's pretty much the same answer for all.

You can only use a T-mold if there is not that much height difference between floors. If your tile is lower than hardwood & if you use T-mold, the edge that sits on hardwood will stick up. If your tile is higher, you will have a hard time fastening the T-mold. BTW, are you doing the installation yourself?

For #1, understood.

#2 & #3, the difference in height is about 3/8" - 1/2" difference with the tile being lower.

I am doing the install myself.

Thanks,
James

[ToChicka]

been looking at the laminite products at my local costco, its called decor brand i believe, how is the quality of it? It looks pretty think and almost like a hardwood and color is what I like.

I haven't seen any engineerd hardwood there and do they sell quarter round etc there?

[t3359]

No problem :)

You & others will have an opportunity to vote for this thread as the Most Helpful in the upcoming

Hey Patrob,

You also got in on the Most Helpful/Knowledgeable user vote!

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=767960

bjl

[patrob]

For #1, understood.

#2 & #3, the difference in height is about 3/8" - 1/2" difference with the tile being lower.

I am doing the install myself.

Thanks,
James

As a reducer, you can undercut the piece of wood that you are installing to the height of tile on one side & the other leave it at the height of wood.

But remember which way you cut so you have a tongue & groove joint. PL to the sub-floor, put some weight on it for the night & there is your new reducer :D If you decide to use the T-mold leave more than 3/4" space between the tile & the wood so you can reduce the angle of the T-mold.

[patrob]

been looking at the laminite products at my local costco, its called decor brand i believe, how is the quality of it? It looks pretty think and almost like a hardwood and color is what I like.

I haven't seen any engineerd hardwood there and do they sell quarter round etc there?

Any building supply store sells quarter round, not Costco. Haven't installed that particular one yet, so can't really comment.
If you like the price & the look & you will install it yourself, then buy it.

[patrob]

Hey Patrob,

You also got in on the Most Helpful/Knowledgeable user vote!

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=767960

bjl

I appreciate the nomination :)

I love to answer everybody's questions & everybody seems to think it's a great thread but so far not too much support >:(

[DealGiver]

hi patrob, from the looks of it i think its oak but could you tell what specie is used in this house living/staircase?

http://www.myvisuallistings.com/tour_images/20/20521/still/virtual-tour-20521-11.jpg

http://www.myvisuallistings.com/tour_images/20/20521/still/virtual-tour-20521-47.jpg

Like Oak Mahagomay etc. with satin finish?

[patrob]

hi patrob, from the looks of it i think its oak but could you tell what specie is used in this house living/staircase?

http://www.myvisuallistings.com/tour_images/20/20521/still/virtual-tour-20521-11.jpg

http://www.myvisuallistings.com/tour_images/20/20521/still/virtual-tour-20521-47.jpg

Like Oak Mahagomay etc. with satin finish?

It's actually maple & so are the stairs. Are you trying to match the wood for upstairs?

BTW, nice house & looks like 10 ft. ceilings :D

[Brandon]

So I went to look at Torlys laminate and Vintage solid sawn flooring at your advice. After visiting a few stores, I've kicked laminate as an option and will most likely going with real hardwood.

Out of what my gf and I looked at, we're set on 3.25" dark brown hard maple, and just do the whole resanding thing whenever it's needed. The flooring will be installed on the main floor. In terms of the brands/series we like...

Vintage Estate (http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_sde_3.php)
Lauzon Classics (http://www.lauzonltd.com/index_en.html)
Eterna Pure Rendition (http://www.eternafloors.com/html/expression_erableEN.html)
They're pretty much the same cost per sq-ft.

Do you have any comments on those selections?

[patrob]

So I went to look at Torlys laminate and Vintage solid sawn flooring at your advice. After visiting a few stores, I've kicked laminate as an option and will most likely going with real hardwood.

Out of what my gf and I looked at, we're set on 3.25" dark brown hard maple, and just do the whole resanding thing whenever it's needed. The flooring will be installed on the main floor. In terms of the brands/series we like...

Vintage Estate (http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_sde_3.php)
Lauzon Classics (http://www.lauzonltd.com/index_en.html)
Eterna Pure Rendition (http://www.eternafloors.com/html/expression_erableEN.html)
They're pretty much the same cost per sq-ft.

Do you have any comments on those selections?

I would def. pick Vintage from all these. Vintage's board lengths are above average where the other 2 & most of the stuff from Quebec are shorter.
Also Vintage's finish looks more natural & milling quality is top notch. You're making the right choice going with hardwood.

[MJunkie]

Hi Patrob,

I am back in the market for hardwood flooring. Had postponed it earlier.

I primarily want to get Vintage hardwood. However, its difficult to see a small sample size and imagine how it wud look in our room. The website doesn't offer much help if there is no sample photograph of that wood being used in a room. Many other manufacturers such as Mirage and Kahr have virtual decorators that take a generic room photograph and allows user to lay any kind of wood. This helps tremendously in getting a feel of the look. I sorely miss this on Vintage's website.

We both absolutely love the Vintage Walnut hardwood. However, considering how soft the wood is we staying clear from it. We recognize that vintage fumed oak is similar but when we saw the sample board we weren't completely satisfied primarily because my wife hates the look of an 'oak' wood.

She really liked the Vintage Jatoba Venetian Brown. I started searching for some pics with this floor and found some on page 88. I wasn't too happy with what I saw. I was hoping to see some variations in the floor ... but because the wood is very dark its difficult to see them. So the floor appears to be just a dark floor with minimal variations (similar to maple i guess). Is this really true or perhaps the picture isn't doing the wood any justice?

Do you have any more pictures of this wood installed on a floor?

Thanks

[krusty2828]

Hi Patrob,
Need to pick your brain for your thoughts on Laurentian Hardwood, how good is the quality in comparision to Mirage?

VERY Much appreciated! :lol:

[mondriano]

I appreciate the nomination :)

I love to answer everybody's questions & everybody seems to think it's a great thread but so far not too much support >:(

First off, every person who has benefitted from this thread (and there are HUNDREDS of you out there) owes it to Patrob to vote for them. It only takes a minute! I know from experience that they have provided me with detailed advice, despite my procrastination!

Now...on to my question :razz:

My wife and I loathe our carpetted staircase. We'd like hardwood, but are not willing to spend the two or three thousand necessary on a house we don't plan on being in for more than a couple of more years. What alternatives (if any) are there to replacing the carpet with hardwood? Can actual hardwood flooring strips be used? Is it suggested? Are there cost savings? How about wood veneer (not laminate) that we've seen online that seems to be "floated" over the plywood?

Thanks as always...

[lisatse]

I appreciate the nomination :)

I love to answer everybody's questions & everybody seems to think it's a great thread but so far not too much support >:(

I voted for you! Thanks again for your help... your thread and knowledge really helped us out!

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I am back in the market for hardwood flooring. Had postponed it earlier.

I primarily want to get Vintage hardwood. However, its difficult to see a small sample size and imagine how it wud look in our room. The website doesn't offer much help if there is no sample photograph of that wood being used in a room. Many other manufacturers such as Mirage and Kahr have virtual decorators that take a generic room photograph and allows user to lay any kind of wood. This helps tremendously in getting a feel of the look. I sorely miss this on Vintage's website.

We both absolutely love the Vintage Walnut hardwood. However, considering how soft the wood is we staying clear from it. We recognize that vintage fumed oak is similar but when we saw the sample board we weren't completely satisfied primarily because my wife hates the look of an 'oak' wood.

She really liked the Vintage Jatoba Venetian Brown. I started searching for some pics with this floor and found some on page 88. I wasn't too happy with what I saw. I was hoping to see some variations in the floor ... but because the wood is very dark its difficult to see them. So the floor appears to be just a dark floor with minimal variations (similar to maple i guess). Is this really true or perhaps the picture isn't doing the wood any justice?

Do you have any more pictures of this wood installed on a floor?

Thanks
I have 2 more pics of the Jatoba Venetian Brown
Pic #1 (http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/4096/waseem5.jpg)
Pic #2 (http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/8731/waseem4.jpg)

But if you really want the colour variation, you will not get that with Venetian Brown. The colour is very uniform & fairly dark.
The only way to get more colour variation is to go with a lighter colour or natural & lower grade of wood. Dark stain covers most colour variations. Have you considered natural jatoba which has a lot of colour variation or maple in 2nd or 3rd grade?

Here is Maple Oxford Hand Scraped. It has some colour variation & is not oak :D
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/4617/img8075p.jpg

Also how about Tigerwood??
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/roomlarge/ss_ex_tigerwood.jpg

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,
Need to pick your brain for your thoughts on Laurentian Hardwood, how good is the quality in comparision to Mirage?

VERY Much appreciated! :lol:

Mirage is better than Laurentian.

[patrob]

First off, every person who has benefitted from this thread (and there are HUNDREDS of you out there) owes it to Patrob to vote for them. It only takes a minute! I know from experience that they have provided me with detailed advice, despite my procrastination!

Now...on to my question :razz:

My wife and I loathe our carpetted staircase. We'd like hardwood, but are not willing to spend the two or three thousand necessary on a house we don't plan on being in for more than a couple of more years. What alternatives (if any) are there to replacing the carpet with hardwood? Can actual hardwood flooring strips be used? Is it suggested? Are there cost savings? How about wood veneer (not laminate) that we've seen online that seems to be "floated" over the plywood?

Thanks as always...
Thank you mondriano :razz: I hope more people will vote! :D

If you do the labour yourself, you can save a lot of money. Just buy the wooden treads & veneer. I think I remember your stairs were curving at the bottom, so you will need those few treads custom made, which are a bit more $. You could install hardwood planks on the stairs but you will still need nosings, so not much saving if you have to buy the hardwood planks & nosings, might as well get the wooden treads. Unless you have some planks left over & want to use it up.

[patrob]

I voted for you! Thanks again for your help... your thread and knowledge really helped us out!

Thank you for the vote & support :)

[pmjbutler]

I've been searching this thread and haven't found the answer. Hard to search through when there's so many responses.

I'm going to be installing a bamboo floating floor. The subfloor is not 100% level, some low spots. For the low spots, could I double up with the foam underlay to even it out? Or could one use a self-leveling compound?

The subfloor is 1/2" plank and 1/2" plywood with countless screws (thank god for quikdrive).

Very informative thread.

[humansoul]

Just bought laminate flooring for an aboveground basement (Split level house). The ground is concrete so I made sure to place the vapour barrier underlay. However, the concrete appears to be not as flat as I had hope, would the vapour barrier assist in getting a level floor?

The wall I am starting from is not straight, thus giving me a gap from the first laminates to the wall and hard to cover using any baseboards. How can I remedy this? Should I just start from the middle of the room and work towards the walls? If so, would chalk line be the best way to get a straight line?

Thanks in advance for any help and/or assistance. Great thread by the way!

[MJunkie]

I have 2 more pics of the Jatoba Venetian Brown


But if you really want the colour variation, you will not get that with Venetian Brown. The colour is very uniform & fairly dark.
The only way to get more colour variation is to go with a lighter colour or natural & lower grade of wood. Dark stain covers most colour variations. Have you considered natural jatoba which has a lot of colour variation or maple in 2nd or 3rd grade?

Here is Maple Oxford Hand Scraped. It has some colour variation & is not oak :D


I think your idea of getting 2nd grade maple to get subtle color variations is brilliant. I used the virtual decorator utility on Mirage's website and chose Maple Vienna. Look at the pics attached. There is considerable variation in the darkness level of the color. At first I thought the pictures aren't accurate as Maple has a very uniform color scheme. However, I think the pics may be based on 2nd grade maple.

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img18.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img443.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img265.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

Do you think the same? ie the pics above use 2nd grade Maple?

Also, as I would prefer getting Vintage over Mirage, do you think Vintage Maple Godiva 2nd grade would be able to achieve the same look?

Thanks very much Patrob for being this helpful.

BTW: the Maple Oxform pics look really good... however we want to go with something dark.

[norm weininger]

i am planing a one time use of a flooring nailer, has anyone been in that position and wants to sell of their nailer that they no longer need

[patrob]

I've been searching this thread and haven't found the answer. Hard to search through when there's so many responses.

I'm going to be installing a bamboo floating floor. The subfloor is not 100% level, some low spots. For the low spots, could I double up with the foam underlay to even it out? Or could one use a self-leveling compound?

The subfloor is 1/2" plank and 1/2" plywood with countless screws (thank god for quikdrive).

Very informative thread.

Self leveling compound is better or maybe shims, 1/8" or 1/4" plywood if necessary (in spots).

[patrob]

Just bought laminate flooring for an aboveground basement (Split level house). The ground is concrete so I made sure to place the vapour barrier underlay. However, the concrete appears to be not as flat as I had hope, would the vapour barrier assist in getting a level floor?

The wall I am starting from is not straight, thus giving me a gap from the first laminates to the wall and hard to cover using any baseboards. How can I remedy this? Should I just start from the middle of the room and work towards the walls? If so, would chalk line be the best way to get a straight line?

Thanks in advance for any help and/or assistance. Great thread by the way!

Thanks & I hope you had a chance to vote :D

The beauty of click laminate it will not lock if the line is not straight. So no need for chalk line. To lose that difference on the first line, you have to cut it (rip it) to shape of the wall or you can add quarter round to the baseboard to cover the gap.

[patrob]

I think your idea of getting 2nd grade maple to get subtle color variations is brilliant. I used the virtual decorator utility on Mirage's website and chose Maple Vienna. Look at the pics attached. There is considerable variation in the darkness level of the color. At first I thought the pictures aren't accurate as Maple has a very uniform color scheme. However, I think the pics may be based on 2nd grade maple.

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img18.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img443.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/5740/miragemapleviennavariat.th.jpg (http://img265.imageshack.us/i/miragemapleviennavariat.jpg/)

Do you think the same? ie the pics above use 2nd grade Maple?

Also, as I would prefer getting Vintage over Mirage, do you think Vintage Maple Godiva 2nd grade would be able to achieve the same look?

Thanks very much Patrob for being this helpful.

BTW: the Maple Oxform pics look really good... however we want to go with something dark.

Glad to help ;)

The reason for the variation of colour in Mirage pics is that Mirage uses "Exclusive" grade which is a mix of 1st & 2nd grade for their stained products. But Vintage 1st grade Estate is clear & 2nd grade Select-V has more variation. Godiva is a darker stain & it will hide some of the variation. But Windsor might be a better choice as it's slightly lighter.


http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/maple_windsor.jpghttp://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/godiva.jpg

[patrob]

i am planing a one time use of a flooring nailer, has anyone been in that position and wants to sell of their nailer that they no longer need

http://toronto.kijiji.ca/f-floor-nailer-Classifieds-W0QQKeywordZfloorQ20nailerQQisSearchFormZtrue

http://toronto.en.craigslist.ca/search/?areaID=25&subAreaID=&query=floor+nailer&catAbbreviation=sss

[paolo84]

Hi there!

I was wondering which way would be best to install hardwood floors (3/4" thick) planks - nailing or stapling? And why?
Thanks!

[dustywallet]

I ripped up my basement carpet. Wood floors underneath were in good
shape. The sanders say they are gumwood. There is no where near the grain that we have with our quarter-sawn oak floors upstairs.

We would like a medium-dark look, without any red or orange. Considering either Minwax "Dark Walnut" or the slightly darker "Jacobean." But samples show the stain on oak.

Question: Does gumwood tend to stain darker or lighter than oak? i.e., If a wood is pretty uniform and not so "grainy", would a stain look darker or lighter than a sample on a grainier wood?

Thanks, Patrob!:razz:

[patrob]

Hi there!

I was wondering which way would be best to install hardwood floors (3/4" thick) planks - nailing or stapling? And why?
Thanks!

It's a tricky question. Floors are installed with both. For domestic species both are fine. For exotics def. cleats.
Crown of the staple tends to crack the tongue off on harder species.
Some installers say that staples hold better & others say the same about nails, so the decision is yours.

[patrob]

I ripped up my basement carpet. Wood floors underneath were in good
shape. The sanders say they are gumwood. There is no where near the grain that we have with our quarter-sawn oak floors upstairs.

We would like a medium-dark look, without any red or orange. Considering either Minwax "Dark Walnut" or the slightly darker "Jacobean." But samples show the stain on oak.

Question: Does gumwood tend to stain darker or lighter than oak? i.e., If a wood is pretty uniform and not so "grainy", would a stain look darker or lighter than a sample on a grainier wood?

Thanks, Patrob!:razz:
You should always make a test sample in a hidden corner to see how the stain will turn out before doing the whole floor. Every floor will take the stain differently.

[BlasterMaster]

Hello Patrob!! Excellent thread that you have here!

I just bought(so i am stuck with it independently of being good or not) Solid
3/4 inch maple hardwood floor from Dubeau company!

What's your opinion about them? Any advise or tips i should have with installing this?

I also read your post above with regards to stapling vs nailing, with maple solid hardwood floors should i staple or nail them?

Thanks Patrob.....:D

[CorradoGuy]

Hi Patrob,

Any opinion on GemFloor (Ash) hardwood flooring? I haven't had any success finding any info on them online.

Thanks.

[be4959]

So I am putting down hardwood on 2nd floor myself. In the hallway upstairs, there is a section where the floor is going to join the curved nosing.

I have tested my cuts with a cardboard template, and with a jig saw, and still cannot get the hardwood plank to join nicely with nosing.

this is driving me crazy. Anyone has any good tips?

Also, the nosing seems to be about 1/8 inch higher than my 3/4 inch hardwood. Can I sand it down with my belt sander and stain + varnish when I am all done?

Thanks

[tenen]

@Patrob:

Recently, I have paid someone to install my hardwood professionally.
I'm not quite happy with the job, they installed some really crappy pieces in high traffic areas, in two rooms there is a crackling sound when you walk over the hardwood. Sounds like a bunch of firecrackers. I suspect that they did not leave enough space around the walls for expansion. The subfloor is not squeaking, because we screwed it down with hundreds of screws.
I have attached some pictures of the small hallway. Do you find it wavy or is this common in 3 1/4" installations? I dont like how the light reflects off the hardwood. It was installed that way to be perpendicular to the joists. Do you think that it would look crappy if I tear up the hallway and change directions on the doorways so that the hardwood runs parallel to the joists?

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/6416/dscn7269.th.jpg (http://img115.imageshack.us/i/dscn7269.jpg/)

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/4952/dscn7272.th.jpg (http://img268.imageshack.us/i/dscn7272.jpg/)

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/1345/dscn7267.th.jpg (http://img33.imageshack.us/i/dscn7267.jpg/)

[canuck88]

i am planing a one time use of a flooring nailer, has anyone been in that position and wants to sell of their nailer that they no longer need

My opinion - just rent the Bostitch from Home Depot. It's like $140 for a week and totally worth it. I tried the route of buying with an eye to selling later... ended up returning it and just renting the bostitch and I was surprised at how much better the bostitch was.

[patrob]

Hello Patrob!! Excellent thread that you have here!

I just bought(so i am stuck with it independently of being good or not) Solid
3/4 inch maple hardwood floor from Dubeau company!

What's your opinion about them? Any advise or tips i should have with installing this?

I also read your post above with regards to stapling vs nailing, with maple solid hardwood floors should i staple or nail them?

Thanks Patrob.....:D

I thought you wanted to get bamboo floors?

I am not a fan of Dubeau floors, a lot of short pieces. If you watch your pressure not too much, not too low but just enough, you can staple it. Have you read the manufacturer instructions about specific recommendations. Take your time when racking the wood & lots of patience.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Any opinion on GemFloor (Ash) hardwood flooring? I haven't had any success finding any info on them online.

Thanks.

Same here, never heard of them.

[patrob]

So I am putting down hardwood on 2nd floor myself. In the hallway upstairs, there is a section where the floor is going to join the curved nosing.

I have tested my cuts with a cardboard template, and with a jig saw, and still cannot get the hardwood plank to join nicely with nosing.

this is driving me crazy. Anyone has any good tips?

Also, the nosing seems to be about 1/8 inch higher than my 3/4 inch hardwood. Can I sand it down with my belt sander and stain + varnish when I am all done?

Thanks
That's where the pros come in :D

We cut the curves on the table saw, it's hard to explain how to do it. You have to see it to believe it. It drives us nuts too when you have to cut the boards a few times to shape. Nosing height should be set before you install the floors. You may have to shim up the wood around the nosing to get the perfect height. If you are installing pre-finished, how will you sand off 1/8" of the nosing without scratching the wood. Regardless, that would be a hell of a challenge.

[patrob]

@Patrob:

Recently, I have paid someone to install my hardwood professionally.
I'm not quite happy with the job, they installed some really crappy pieces in high traffic areas, in two rooms there is a crackling sound when you walk over the hardwood. Sounds like a bunch of firecrackers. I suspect that they did not leave enough space around the walls for expansion. The subfloor is not squeaking, because we screwed it down with hundreds of screws.
I have attached some pictures of the small hallway. Do you find it wavy or is this common in 3 1/4" installations? I dont like how the light reflects off the hardwood. It was installed that way to be perpendicular to the joists. Do you think that it would look crappy if I tear up the hallway and change directions on the doorways so that the hardwood runs parallel to the joists?

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/6416/dscn7269.th.jpg (http://img115.imageshack.us/i/dscn7269.jpg/)

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/4952/dscn7272.th.jpg (http://img268.imageshack.us/i/dscn7272.jpg/)

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/1345/dscn7267.th.jpg (http://img33.imageshack.us/i/dscn7267.jpg/)

The wave is called capping. Yes, I see it. It's due to high humidity. It will show on maple especially, in anything above 50%. How recently was the wood installed & how new is the house?

The creaking sounds could be a board against board or board against baseboard, etc. It looks like the baseboard is not too thick & no quarter round, for that you have to go closer to the wall so the baseboard will cover. Check the humidity level with a hygrometer & you may have to turn your AC on to take the moisture away or de-humidifier.

[tenen]

The wave is called capping. Yes, I see it. It's due to high humidity. It will show on maple especially, in anything above 50%. How recently was the wood installed & how new is the house?

The creaking sounds could be a board against board or board against baseboard, etc. It looks like the baseboard is not too thick & no quarter round, for that you have to go closer to the wall so the baseboard will cover. Check the humidity level with a hygrometer & you may have to turn your AC on to take the moisture away or de-humidifier.

The hardwood was installed a week and a half ago, and I have climatized it for 5 days before the installation. The house is 20 years old.
I found out that the installers nailed the planks every 14-15 inches instead of the recommended 8-10. Can this cause problems too?
Thanks for your advice!

[patrob]

The hardwood was installed a week and a half ago, and I have climatized it for 5 days before the installation. The house is 20 years old.
I found out that the installers nailed the planks every 14-15 inches instead of the recommended 8-10. Can this cause problems too?
Thanks for your advice!

The capping is still a humidity issue. But the creaking of the floors could be lack of nails/staples. We usually nail approx. 5"-7" apart.

[Majoram]

Hello Patrob,

I just bought a resale home that has hardwood floors and stairs.

Can you suggest what I should use to:
1) Clean it/Protect it (before moving in)

2) Maintain it.

3) Also my wife wants to varnish the floor. Is this ok?
Is there anything specific I should use?

Sorry I don't have better pictures. These were just taken during a brief viewing.

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardWoodFloor3.jpg

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardwoodFloor1.jpg

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardwoodFloor2.jpg

[peej80]

Hello to all. Just thought I'd update you all on my Kurupay flooring self install. Armed with my Primatech flooring nailer (made in Quebec City) with primatech cleats, I proceeded to install the flooring over 15 lb roofing felt. I have to say that this wood is definitely hard and actually the hardest around. It ranks 3880 on the Janka scale. How hard is that? Well Ipe rates at 3680 and white oak is 1360. My nailer breezed through the Kurupay without a problem. Ocasionally a tongue would slightly crack but that happens with birch or oak. I know that Patrob mentioned the dryness and cracking and instability of the wood but my research shows Kurupay is quite stable compared to other tropical hardwoods and does not shrink or grow much with humidity changes like Jatoba. The real reward is the look of the finished floor. It looks amazing and no stain since the colour is natural and the grain looks like art. I'm getting rid of the throw rug and letting the floor be seen. I'll post pics as soon as the room is painted and I finish building the wall unit.

[patrob]

Hello Patrob,

I just bought a resale home that has hardwood floors and stairs.

Can you suggest what I should use to:
1) Clean it/Protect it (before moving in)

2) Maintain it.

3) Also my wife wants to varnish the floor. Is this ok?
Is there anything specific I should use?

Sorry I don't have better pictures. These were just taken during a brief viewing.

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardWoodFloor3.jpg

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardwoodFloor1.jpg

http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq12/Majoram/HardwoodFloor2.jpg

If I am not mistaken, it's an old 3/8" strip flooring. Any hardwood cleaning kit will do. If you want to bring back some life to it, you can do screen & coat (light sand & coat of varnish). If you apply varnish without sanding, there is higher chances of peeling off & you are covering all the dust/dirt/damage/imperfections. You can do the same with the stairs.

[patrob]

Hello to all. Just thought I'd update you all on my Kurupay flooring self install. Armed with my Primatech flooring nailer (made in Quebec City) with primatech cleats, I proceeded to install the flooring over 15 lb roofing felt. I have to say that this wood is definitely hard and actually the hardest around. It ranks 3880 on the Janka scale. How hard is that? Well Ipe rates at 3680 and white oak is 1360. My nailer breezed through the Kurupay without a problem. Ocasionally a tongue would slightly crack but that happens with birch or oak. I know that Patrob mentioned the dryness and cracking and instability of the wood but my research shows Kurupay is quite stable compared to other tropical hardwoods and does not shrink or grow much with humidity changes like Jatoba. The real reward is the look of the finished floor. It looks amazing and no stain since the colour is natural and the grain looks like art. I'm getting rid of the throw rug and letting the floor be seen. I'll post pics as soon as the room is painted and I finish building the wall unit.

Glad to hear the installation went well. The wood is a lot harder but also a lot heavier too :D Do post some pics.

[Majoram]

If I am not mistaken, it's an old 3/8" strip flooring. Any hardwood cleaning kit will do. If you want to bring back some life to it, you can do screen & coat (light sand & coat of varnish). If you apply varnish without sanding, there is higher chances of peeling off & you are covering all the dust/dirt/damage/imperfections. You can do the same with the stairs.

Thanks Patrob!
I got some more questions now though.

How would you go about sanding it?
It's a lot of floor, so just wondering if there are special sanding tools or should it be done by hand.

Also how light a grit to use?

Sorry for all the questions. Total newb to home ownership.

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob!
I got some more questions now though.

How would you go about sanding it?
It's a lot of floor, so just wondering if there are special sanding tools or should it be done by hand.

Also how light a grit to use?

Sorry for all the questions. Total newb to home ownership.

For things like that, I highly recommend getting a professional re-finisher.

[alicub]

My scenario is as follows:
I am readying a 30 year old townhouse for sale. Houses in the same complex have sold for just over 200,000, so while I do not want to spend more than I can honestly recoup, I need to do something about the floors. They are currently covered in dismal ratty-coloured (and looking) carpet. There is only subfloor beneath the carpet. There are approximately 50 stairs in the house.

Does it cost more to install flooring on stairs?
Should I even look at hardwood, or go directly to considering laminate flooring?
Does anyone have any feedback about flooring auctions? Specifically, the one found at http://www.principalliquidators.com/hwoodupcoming.htm ?
If I do buy flooring like this, will I find someone to install for the same price as I would if I bought it from them?

Thanks in advance for any feedback you can give me.

[patrob]

My scenario is as follows:
I am readying a 30 year old townhouse for sale. Houses in the same complex have sold for just over 200,000, so while I do not want to spend more than I can honestly recoup, I need to do something about the floors. They are currently covered in dismal ratty-coloured (and looking) carpet. There is only subfloor beneath the carpet. There are approximately 50 stairs in the house.

Does it cost more to install flooring on stairs?
Should I even look at hardwood, or go directly to considering laminate flooring?
Does anyone have any feedback about flooring auctions? Specifically, the one found at http://www.principalliquidators.com/hwoodupcoming.htm ?
If I do buy flooring like this, will I find someone to install for the same price as I would if I bought it from them?

Thanks in advance for any feedback you can give me.

Because of those 50 steps, price to re-cap the stairs in hardwood will be very expensive. It's more economical to just install new higher traffic carpet like berber. If you buy your own wood, you will always find somebody to install it. If you get laminate, you can probably install it yourself, so that will save you some money there.

[James_TheVirus]

Hi patrob,

How stable is Jatoba solid sawn? Should I worry about it moving very much?

[Smoothie]

Hi patrob,

How stable is Jatoba solid sawn? Should I worry about it moving very much?

I'm wondering the same. I'm getting the wood delivered a few days before install and my installer indicated I should put the wood in a seperate room and get a de-humidifier to bring the humidity down to 37-40%. This is in a brand new construction home.

[Majoram]

For things like that, I highly recommend getting a professional re-finisher.

Any idea how much that would cost?
Lets say the hardwood coverage is about 900 sq ft (including the stairs).

If we decide not to (because of cost), is there any alternative (to re-finishing) that you can recommended?

[t3359]

Here's my first experience installing laminate for someone... It was the Quickstyle Autoclic stuff they had on sale at Rona a few weeks ago (79c/sq-ft).

If it were up to me to choose, I would rather that stuff be nailed down - the Autoclic is supposed to let you snap them together, but it rarely happened... had to tap most of them in, and the tongue often didn't fit right into the groove, requiring a pretty hard smacking with the hammer.

I found that kneeling near the joint to push the tongue into the groove while tapping did help alot, and putting the tapping block on top of the tongue prevented damage to the tongue.

If you spend the time putting spacer around the edges, it helped alot with the first few rows... after that, and the where-to-kneel trick, things went pretty smoothly.

I did all my cross cuts with a mitre saw and length-wise rips with a orbital jigsaw.

Although the Quickstyle 8mm Autoclic was really cheap, the surface was pretty hard and looked reasonably nice.

Again, if there were such thing, I'd rather nail them all in, instead of tapping them together.

bjl

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

How stable is Jatoba solid sawn? Should I worry about it moving very much?

Any species on Solid Sawn construction is the best thing you can get for stability. But you still have to maintain your RH levels (humidifier in winter is a must).

[patrob]

I'm wondering the same. I'm getting the wood delivered a few days before install and my installer indicated I should put the wood in a seperate room and get a de-humidifier to bring the humidity down to 37-40%. This is in a brand new construction home.

I wonder why he would want the wood to dry out so much :confused:
If you dry out Jatoba, you have higher chances of stress cracks. I would question your installers knowledge of the product :|

[patrob]

Any idea how much that would cost?
Lets say the hardwood coverage is about 900 sq ft (including the stairs).

If we decide not to (because of cost), is there any alternative (to re-finishing) that you can recommended?

The screen & coat is approx. $1.50 - $2 sq. ft. Or maybe you rent a buffer with appropriate pad & try it yourself.

[patrob]

Here's my first experience installing laminate for someone... It was the Quickstyle Autoclic stuff they had on sale at Rona a few weeks ago (79c/sq-ft).

If it were up to me to choose, I would rather that stuff be nailed down - the Autoclic is supposed to let you snap them together, but it rarely happened... had to tap most of them in, and the tongue often didn't fit right into the groove, requiring a pretty hard smacking with the hammer.

I found that kneeling near the joint to push the tongue into the groove while tapping did help alot, and putting the tapping block on top of the tongue prevented damage to the tongue.

If you spend the time putting spacer around the edges, it helped alot with the first few rows... after that, and the where-to-kneel trick, things went pretty smoothly.

I did all my cross cuts with a mitre saw and length-wise rips with a orbital jigsaw.

Although the Quickstyle 8mm Autoclic was really cheap, the surface was pretty hard and looked reasonably nice.

Again, if there were such thing, I'd rather nail them all in, instead of tapping them together.

bjl
Unfortunately you can't nail laminate but overall you completed the job, somewhat satisfied & was only $.79 sq. ft., so you can't complain :D
The lock systems differ from product to product & Uniclic is one of the best. And most of the time it costs more than $.79 sq. ft.

BTW, how is your border coming along?

[t3359]

Unfortunately you can't nail laminate but overall you completed the job, somewhat satisfied & was only $.79 sq. ft., so you can't complain :D
The lock systems differ from product to product & Uniclic is one of the best. And most of the time it costs more than $.79 sq. ft.

BTW, how is your border coming along?

Hey Patrob, how about you and me design the world's first nailed laminate flooring? ha ha...

Thanks for asking... My own flooring is on hold (in fact, it's been acclimating for the last 3 weeks). The renovations at the other place were higher priority (laminate, drywalling, painting, tiling)... those should hopefully be done in the next few weeks. I needed help from someone to help with the OSB at my place before do the borders. So much to do with so little time to do it... *sigh*

bjl

[patrob]

Hey Patrob, how about you and me design the world's first nailed laminate flooring? ha ha...

Thanks for asking... My own flooring is on hold (in fact, it's been acclimating for the last 3 weeks). The renovations at the other place were higher priority (laminate, drywalling, painting, tiling)... those should hopefully be done in the next few weeks. I needed help from someone to help with the OSB at my place before do the borders. So much to do with so little time to do it... *sigh*

bjl

Great idea :D

I know what you mean by so much to do with so little time... I hope you post some pics when you are finally finished :)

[rinse]

Anyone have an idea of how much $/sq ft it'll run me for Satin Finish Red Oak Graphite (Solid Finished)? I plan on making a trip to Darmaga since they are close by but wanted to see if anyone knew a ballpark estimate from experience.

[patrob]

Anyone have an idea of how much $/sq ft it'll run me for Satin Finish Red Oak Graphite (Solid Finished)? I plan on making a trip to Darmaga since they are close by but wanted to see if anyone knew a ballpark estimate from experience.

It's around $6.50 - $7 sq. ft. plus tax. I highly recommend going with Vintage oak in that price range, better overall quality than Satin Finish & actually costs less than SF.

[DealGiver]

Dear Patrob,
could you tell me if I should go with either engineerd hardwood or solid for my living room?

We have a regular semi subdivision home with broadloom now and the stair railing bannister is oak (more yellowish) I think you mentioned earlier some specific oak color?

Will engineerd red oak be cheaper than solid?

[patrob]

Dear Patrob,
could you tell me if I should go with either engineerd hardwood or solid for my living room?

We have a regular semi subdivision home with broadloom now and the stair railing bannister is oak (more yellowish) I think you mentioned earlier some specific oak color?

Will engineerd red oak be cheaper than solid?

BTW, I like the Dear part :D

It's up to you which one you want, they are pretty much the same price. But engineered is more stable.

It's called Red Oak Galliano ;)
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakgalliano.gif

[Ta2ude]

Patrob I was wondering if you know anything about the Pro Knee kneepads. I am an installer and just happened upon these while trying to find some decent knee pads on the net. They are about $215.00 Canadian but well worth it if they save the knees.

http://www.proknee.com/

[Majoram]

The screen & coat is approx. $1.50 - $2 sq. ft. Or maybe you rent a buffer with appropriate pad & try it yourself.

Definitely worth a try. Need the money for some electrical work.

Thanks a lot for all the help!!!

I think I found that Hardwood Floor Cleaning kit you recommended from Home Depot.

Also, I saw this as well:
Rejuvenate Floor Restorer and Protectant (http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?id=100663631&jspStoreDir=hdus&catalogId=10053&marketID=401&productId=100663631&locStoreNum=8125&langId=-1&linktype=product&storeId=10051&ddkey=THDStoreFinder)

Is it any good? Or would it harm my floors?

[Sommerset]

Hello !

I have bought 10 yr old townhouse and will get possession by end of October. I am planning to put hardwood and paint the place before moving in. I have following questions.
1. should I paint before laying hardwood or later (I am planning to paint myself but hardwood laying by a professional)
2. One store showed a Maple hardwood, but doesn't say it is made in Canada on the back of the plank. Is it from a different country (China?). I didn't know about it when I was at the store and hence couldn't ask.
3. How to distinguish silver maple from hard maple
4. Is it ok to put different wood for main and first floor (Oak and Maple)? is it a normal practice?
5. I am also inclined to replace the tiles in the kitchen and foyer. Is it advisable to go in for Vinyl flooring for both?

thanks in advance !

Sommerset

[patrob]

Patrob I was wondering if you know anything about the Pro Knee kneepads. I am an installer and just happened upon these while trying to find some decent knee pads on the net. They are about $215.00 Canadian but well worth it if they save the knees.

http://www.proknee.com/

I heard about them but never had the chance to see or try them. If you work on your knees a lot (like parquet or tile installer, etc.) it might be worth it.

[patrob]

Definitely worth a try. Need the money for some electrical work.

Thanks a lot for all the help!!!

I think I found that Hardwood Floor Cleaning kit you recommended from Home Depot.

Also, I saw this as well:
Rejuvenate Floor Restorer and Protectant (http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?id=100663631&jspStoreDir=hdus&catalogId=10053&marketID=401&productId=100663631&locStoreNum=8125&langId=-1&linktype=product&storeId=10051&ddkey=THDStoreFinder)

Is it any good? Or would it harm my floors?

Never tried that product, so can't comment. I just don't know how it's able to fill in scratches :rolleyes:

[patrob]

Hello !

I have bought 10 yr old townhouse and will get possession by end of October. I am planning to put hardwood and paint the place before moving in. I have following questions.
1. should I paint before laying hardwood or later (I am planning to paint myself but hardwood laying by a professional)
2. One store showed a Maple hardwood, but doesn't say it is made in Canada on the back of the plank. Is it from a different country (China?). I didn't know about it when I was at the store and hence couldn't ask.
3. How to distinguish silver maple from hard maple
4. Is it ok to put different wood for main and first floor (Oak and Maple)? is it a normal practice?
5. I am also inclined to replace the tiles in the kitchen and foyer. Is it advisable to go in for Vinyl flooring for both?

thanks in advance !

Sommerset

1. Yes, you can paint before hardwood.
2. Rarely the wood will show on the back where it's made. It says on the box.
3. Silver maple is more white/silver in natural colour & a lot softer than hard maple. It will be very hard to distinguish when stained. Only few manufacturers use silver maple, it's hard maple that is usually used for hardwood floors.
4. Yes, you can split the species of wood on diff. floors. It's not a common practice but it's up to the homeowner & have seen it done.
5. No, I would leave the tiles or replace with new tiles or stone, it's more durable & practical than vinyl & better for re-sale.

[DealGiver]

BTW, I like the Dear part :D

It's up to you which one you want, they are pretty much the same price. But engineered is more stable.

It's called Red Oak Galliano ;)
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakgalliano.gif

Dear Patrob, thanks for replying to my post (I inserted 'Dearl' again lol)

For engineered flooring, would we have to worry about getting a humidifier in winter for like 250 sq feet of flooring? I have an AC for summer so all good these.

Also, can engineered flooring planks be replaced if they ever buckle up or scratch, so should we buy some planks in advance? (I know I'm being careful here)

Thanks Patrob,
Dealgiver

[Majoram]

Never tried that product, so can't comment. I just don't know how it's able to fill in scratches :rolleyes:

Dear Patrob ( heh :) maybe you should rename the thread!)

Thanks! I was wondering the same thing. Especially since it works for so many types of flooring. But surprisingly on the web, no one is complaining. There's quite a few positive reviews.

Ah well. I'll try it out anyway and see.

thanks again.

[t3359]

Dear Patrob ( heh :) maybe you should rename the thread!)

Thanks! I was wondering the same thing. Especially since it works for so many types of flooring. But surprisingly on the web, no one is complaining. There's quite a few positive reviews.

Ah well. I'll try it out anyway and see.

thanks again.

Hey Majoram - post your results?

thanks!
bjl

[Majoram]

Hey Majoram - post your results?

thanks!
bjl

Sure, no problem. I won't be moving in until Aug 28th though.
First time moving into a new home and my head is all over the place (hopefully I remember).

[patrob]

Dear Patrob, thanks for replying to my post (I inserted 'Dearl' again lol)

For engineered flooring, would we have to worry about getting a humidifier in winter for like 250 sq feet of flooring? I have an AC for summer so all good these.

Also, can engineered flooring planks be replaced if they ever buckle up or scratch, so should we buy some planks in advance? (I know I'm being careful here)

Thanks Patrob,
Dealgiver
:D

Yes, you will still need a humidifier. Yes, the engineered planks can be replaced. You will probably have some wood left over from the job for future repairs.

[patrob]

Here is an interesting video that I thought I would share with others
http://watch.ctv.ca/news/clip200679#clip200679

So buyer beware :idea:

[STFan]

Here is an interesting video that I thought I would share with others
http://watch.ctv.ca/news/clip200679#clip200679

So buyer beware :idea:

Good information, lessons learned for DIY.

[t3359]

Good information, lessons learned for DIY.

Wow. Anyone get the name of that brand? I haven't seen hardwood sold in 17sqft boxes... time to go measure.

bjl

[patrob]

Wow. Anyone get the name of that brand? I haven't seen hardwood sold in 17sqft boxes... time to go measure.

bjl

Here you go :)
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/6149/bhimperial.jpg

It's Imperial Collections, if you Google, there is no info on this "manufacturer", so it's most likely their in-house brand. What I find funny is when they say it's the first time in their 30 year history this had happened :rolleyes: It's more like the first time they got officially caught!

[t3359]

Here you go :)
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/6149/bhimperial.jpg

It's Imperial Collections, if you Google, there is no info on this "manufacturer", so it's most likely their in-house brand. What I find funny is when they say it's the first time in their 30 year history this had happened :rolleyes: It's more like the first time they got officially caught!

Thanks... Wow, I know some people who bought at Brampton Hardwood - will have to send them the link.

Maybe they're like McDonald's quoting "1/4 lbs of beef before frying"... quoting the square footage of flooring at 100% humidity, before cutting and planing.

bjl

[ginko123]

Here you go :)
http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/6149/bhimperial.jpg

It's Imperial Collections, if you Google, there is no info on this "manufacturer", so it's most likely their in-house brand. What I find funny is when they say it's the first time in their 30 year history this had happened :rolleyes: It's more like the first time they got officially caught!

lol I remember going to brampton hardwood and the lady telling me imperial is superior to vintage or satin finsih. RIGHT.:lol:

[squireglig]

Wow that's pretty interesting. Glad I came across this thread before buying floors..

I was thinking about buying Guoya brand bamboo in a vertical natural (from Brampton Hardwood :eek:).. however now I have some second thoughts..

I've seen some questions posted about bamboo... Patrob I was hoping you could comment on the various brands of bamboo flooring that you may know of or have experience with. I've seen Novo, Guoya, and a couple others myself, but I cant tell any difference in quality with my untrained eye ;)

Was thinking about maybe getting in on this Rona deal if I can find a store with the flooring I am looking for: http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9221396

This thread is awesome btw... I'm trying to read thru it but it's so so long.. :) I'm sure everyone appreciates all your help!

[patrob]

lol I remember going to brampton hardwood and the lady telling me imperial is superior to vintage or satin finsih. RIGHT.:lol:

They will say anything to sell but we know better :D

[patrob]

Wow that's pretty interesting. Glad I came across this thread before buying floors..

I was thinking about buying Guoya brand bamboo in a vertical natural (from Brampton Hardwood :eek:).. however now I have some second thoughts..

I've seen some questions posted about bamboo... Patrob I was hoping you could comment on the various brands of bamboo flooring that you may know of or have experience with. I've seen Novo, Guoya, and a couple others myself, but I cant tell any difference in quality with my untrained eye ;)

Was thinking about maybe getting in on this Rona deal if I can find a store with the flooring I am looking for: http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9221396

This thread is awesome btw... I'm trying to read thru it but it's so so long.. :) I'm sure everyone appreciates all your help!

We have installed some Goodfellow bamboo in mid price range $4 +- & was not bad. Vintage carries 7" wide plank bamboo which is a lot higher grade in the $7 range. Usually the cheaper bamboo in the $2-$3 range is softer. We have installed Golden Select from Costco & it was BAD, very soft!

[ginko123]

Hi patrob,
in terms of laminite flooring, what should I be looking out for in terms of shopping? I'm looking at 18mm and 15mm laminite....

I know there are new kinds of laminite flooring out there that may look superior to solid hardwood flooring you can't even tell... + I won't need to worry about buying a new humidifier in winter or an AC in summer?

Any other pros/cons of laminite....thanks

and do you recommend any good brands in laminite flooring? Like how you mention Vintage for solid :)

[fukngrvn]

Hi Patrob,

What are your thoughts on purchasing hardwood through an auction? There's an upcoming auction in Brampton here: http://auctionsfind.com/auction/5650

The listing mentions American Premium. Would that be the brand? or? Ever heard of them? What is their reputation like?

Any thoughts on auctions and what they seem to be selling would be great!

Thanks!

[patrob]

Hi patrob,
in terms of laminite flooring, what should I be looking out for in terms of shopping? I'm looking at 18mm and 15mm laminite....

I know there are new kinds of laminite flooring out there that may look superior to solid hardwood flooring you can't even tell... + I won't need to worry about buying a new humidifier in winter or an AC in summer?

Any other pros/cons of laminite....thanks

and do you recommend any good brands in laminite flooring? Like how you mention Vintage for solid :)

Were you looking at Continental laminate from BH :D The thicker the laminate, the more humidity it will absorb, it will still shrink & expand but not as much as solid hardwood. So you still need to maintain your humidity.

Torlys is very good for laminate & so is Kahrs but they are more expensive & are not available in 15 mm or 18 mm. Their technology is better, their HDF core is harder. Some say that the Costco laminate is pretty good, so check it out.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

What are your thoughts on purchasing hardwood through an auction? There's an upcoming auction in Brampton here: http://auctionsfind.com/auction/5650

The listing mentions American Premium. Would that be the brand? or? Ever heard of them? What is their reputation like?

Any thoughts on auctions and what they seem to be selling would be great!

Thanks!

I am not a fan of auctions. It's been discussed few times in the past, so do a search of this thread. Not familiar with American Premium, doesn't sound like a brand. Looks like the boxes are covered in plastic, indication of Chinese import. Just because it says American on the box, doesn't mean it's made there.

[Smoothie]

I wonder why he would want the wood to dry out so much :confused:
If you dry out Jatoba, you have higher chances of stress cracks. I would question your installers knowledge of the product :|

The humidity in the new house is ~55% right now. Is that ok for the Vintage Jatoba solid sawn installation? Anything I should do to make the install better? The wood has been delivered and is sitting in boxes for install in three days.

[James_TheVirus]

The humidity in the new house is ~55% right now. Is that ok for the Vintage Jatoba solid sawn installation? Anything I should do to make the install better? The wood has been delivered and is sitting in boxes for install in three days.


Oddly enough, when I installed my Vintage Solid Sawn Jatoba, the instructions in the box actually said NOT to acclimatize the wood. I have no idea why...but it ended up happening for me anyways because I installed it over a few weekends.

[patrob]

The humidity in the new house is ~55% right now. Is that ok for the Vintage Jatoba solid sawn installation? Anything I should do to make the install better? The wood has been delivered and is sitting in boxes for install in three days.

It's right on. Are you installing it yourself?

[patrob]

Oddly enough, when I installed my Vintage Solid Sawn Jatoba, the instructions in the box actually said NOT to acclimatize the wood. I have no idea why...but it ended up happening for me anyways because I installed it over a few weekends.

It doesn't say anything not to acclimatize the wood, it says "do not open prior to installation". BTW, no need to acclimatize Solid Sawn ;)

[James_TheVirus]

It doesn't say anything not to acclimatize the wood, it says "do not open prior to installation". BTW, no need to acclimatize Solid Sawn ;)

Taken right from the instruction sheet that came with the wood:
"DO NOT ACCLIMATE FLOORING PRIOR TO INSTALLATION. OPEN BOXES AT TIME OF INSTALLATION AND INSTALL IMMEDIATELY."

I can see what you mean...I took it to mean to install it as soon as you get it in the door.

[Just thinking]

Hi Patrob,

Great thread!

We have purchased a home in Vancouver and are in the process of renovating everything (bathrooms, kitchen, flooring, etc). Our house is only 13 years old, but really dated and worn-out. The flooring with be the last project.

We have approximately 1300 sf of hardwood to install on four levels plus 38 stairs and 3 big stairs on the landings. The bottom floor is over concrete. The second floor has a definite slope to one side. My questions:

1. Would you choose Preverco or Torlys? We are looking at maple stained with "expresso" in an engineered hardwood. Both seem to be around $6.70 + tax for the 5 1/4" wide plank. Is this a good price? I like that they are both Canadian companies.

2. We have been told that we cannot get single plank stair treads because the maple will not take the stain properly unless we spend $200+ per tread (not including installation). True?

3. What is the average price to install hardwood per stair? I heard that anything less than $140 means that the installer probably is cutting corners and likely won't do a good job.

4. Can you recommend any good places to check out in Vancouver area? is it better to use the installer from the flooring company, or buy the hardwood and then hire an installer?

5. What type of finish is best to use on stairs? We are not planning to put a carpet runner on them (unless we absolutely have to). we will use the same finish throughout the house.

This is costing us a small fortune, and would like to get the biggest bang for our buck. However, we don't want to end up having to replace the floors in a few years time because we made the wrong choices now.

I would appreciate any feedback or comments you have!

[lak8]

Hi patrob,

1. What do you think of the golden select maple hardwood from costco?

2. Im also just about ready to install my hardwoods. I removed all the old carpet and vinly. The floors are really smooth and strait from what i can tell. Would you recommend just leaving the subfloor plywood or poor self leveling just incase anything is out. again the place is really strait and no bumbs or anything in the ols plywood subfloor (3/4" then 1/4" subfloor)

3. Also when laying the hardwood would you lay down tar paper or just right over the plywood subfloor as is.

4. the instructions/manual says to have a 3/4" gap from the wall when installing the hardwood. This seems like quite alot to me. is this normal or would you make it less then 3/4"


Thanks for all your help. Im sure your quite busy with all these questions.

Have a good one

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Great thread!

We have purchased a home in Vancouver and are in the process of renovating everything (bathrooms, kitchen, flooring, etc). Our house is only 13 years old, but really dated and worn-out. The flooring with be the last project.

We have approximately 1300 sf of hardwood to install on four levels plus 38 stairs and 3 big stairs on the landings. The bottom floor is over concrete. The second floor has a definite slope to one side. My questions:

1. Would you choose Preverco or Torlys? We are looking at maple stained with "expresso" in an engineered hardwood. Both seem to be around $6.70 + tax for the 5 1/4" wide plank. Is this a good price? I like that they are both Canadian companies.

2. We have been told that we cannot get single plank stair treads because the maple will not take the stain properly unless we spend $200+ per tread (not including installation). True?

3. What is the average price to install hardwood per stair? I heard that anything less than $140 means that the installer probably is cutting corners and likely won't do a good job.

4. Can you recommend any good places to check out in Vancouver area? is it better to use the installer from the flooring company, or buy the hardwood and then hire an installer?

5. What type of finish is best to use on stairs? We are not planning to put a carpet runner on them (unless we absolutely have to). we will use the same finish throughout the house.

This is costing us a small fortune, and would like to get the biggest bang for our buck. However, we don't want to end up having to replace the floors in a few years time because we made the wrong choices now.

I would appreciate any feedback or comments you have!

1. I would choose Torlys over Preverco. I cannot comment on wood prices in Vancouver.

2. Maple or oak treads are usually single tread glued from 2 or 3 pieces together. It still looks fine. Maple does stain diff. than oak.

3. Again, cannot comment on Vancouver pricing. But in GTA it's $150 & up.

4. Someone mentioned BC Hardwood, maybe do a search of the this thread, there was a discussion about it a while back. If you know a trusted installer, then you can supply the material & have him install it. But if you don't, you may have to go through the store with everything.

5. It's a personal preference. But I personally don't recommend anything more than semi-gloss.

Since the wood you are looking at is in the high $6 range, why not look at solid 3/4" hardwood?? And use engineered over concrete installation. Take a look at Vintage hardwood, it shouldn't be that much more. But will be money well spent. In case of future re-finishing, you cannot re-finish floating floors :idea:

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

1. What do you think of the golden select maple hardwood from costco?

2. Im also just about ready to install my hardwoods. I removed all the old carpet and vinly. The floors are really smooth and strait from what i can tell. Would you recommend just leaving the subfloor plywood or poor self leveling just incase anything is out. again the place is really strait and no bumbs or anything in the ols plywood subfloor (3/4" then 1/4" subfloor)

3. Also when laying the hardwood would you lay down tar paper or just right over the plywood subfloor as is.

4. the instructions/manual says to have a 3/4" gap from the wall when installing the hardwood. This seems like quite alot to me. is this normal or would you make it less then 3/4"


Thanks for all your help. Im sure your quite busy with all these questions.

Have a good one

1. I am not a fan of Costco hardwood.

2. Self-leveling is only used only if you have to. So no need if the sub-floor is straight.

3. Use flooring underlay (wax paper)

4. The gap does not have to be 3/4". 3/8" - 1/2" is just fine.

[patrob]

BTW, for all those who find this thread helpful, you can rate the thread by voting http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif :)

[emjay]

My dad just retired from his contracting business/hardwood floor store, but he's not supposed to know about this :D

I don't smoke personally but my mother dropped a cigarette cherry onto the floor in her living rim and it made a circular black burn on the finish. Any way to get rid of it without sanding it down and refinishing it?

[patrob]

My dad just retired from his contracting business/hardwood floor store, but he's not supposed to know about this :D

I don't smoke personally but my mother dropped a cigarette cherry onto the floor in her living rim and it made a circular black burn on the finish. Any way to get rid of it without sanding it down and refinishing it?

I promise I won't tell :D

If you don't want to refinish it, replacing the damaged plank is the only way.

[choop]

Special thanks to patrob for answering all these questions. As a hardwood newbie this thread has helped me a ton!

[golfcraze]

Do you know of any reputable flooring store in edmonton? Also, do you know of any reputable floor installer? Thanks!

[peej80]

IMG_802IMGHi Patrob and all,
Here are the pics I promised of the Kurupay flooring installation. I finished the baseboards and 1/4 round moldings and the wainscotting and finally painted everything. I love it and hope it inspires you all to install your own flooring. Best of luck to all.

Peej80
Hope this works.

[patrob]

Special thanks to patrob for answering all these questions. As a hardwood newbie this thread has helped me a ton!

Glad you find it helpful :)

[patrob]

Do you know of any reputable flooring store in edmonton? Also, do you know of any reputable floor installer? Thanks!
Sorry I can't help, maybe someone else can.

IMG_802IMGHi Patrob and all,
Here are the pics I promised of the Kurupay flooring installation. I finished the baseboards and 1/4 round moldings and the wainscotting and finally painted everything. I love it and hope it inspires you all to install your own flooring. Best of luck to all.

Peej80
Hope this works.

We can't see the pics :D Try using www.imageshack.us

[Timhortons1221]

How much would it cost to install baseboards per lineal feet?

[sloman]

Hello, first let me thank patrob for the great advice on this thread.

My father purchased a cottage and the flooring currently carpeting that needs to go asap.

We are evaluating hardwood vs. laminate (specifically the Golden Select laminate at Costco that's $1.90/sqft). We are currently leaning toward the laminate for 3 reasons: 1) it is more durable for a cottage 2) the wide planks with walnut finish will give it a great look and the cost for similar hardwood is 4x more and 3) the installation price is $0.80/sqft vs $1.40 for hardwood.

However, I have always been partial to hardwood and wanted to solicit opinions before pulling the trigger.

The cottage is a 1000sqft bungalow and we plan to run new flooring throughout.

Thanks!

[patrob]

How much would it cost to install baseboards per lineal feet?

Depends on the thickness, height & what is made of (paint grade). 4" x 3/8" MDF approx. $1.50 ln. ft. 5" x 3/4" poplar approx. $2.50 ln. ft. The higher, the thicker, the more expensive. Oak, maple even more because the cuts have to be perfect.

[patrob]

Hello, first let me thank patrob for the great advice on this thread.

My father purchased a cottage and the flooring currently carpeting that needs to go asap.

We are evaluating hardwood vs. laminate (specifically the Golden Select laminate at Costco that's $1.90/sqft). We are currently leaning toward the laminate for 3 reasons: 1) it is more durable for a cottage 2) the wide planks with walnut finish will give it a great look and the cost for similar hardwood is 4x more and 3) the installation price is $0.80/sqft vs $1.40 for hardwood.

However, I have always been partial to hardwood and wanted to solicit opinions before pulling the trigger.

The cottage is a 1000sqft bungalow and we plan to run new flooring throughout.

Thanks!

You already know the answer :D Price wise/durability - laminate. Look wise - hardwood. Laminate you can attempt to install it yourself & save even more.
Make it a weekend-get-away project :lol:

[Freebird1]

Hi Patrob,

This thread is great. You helped me out when I got flooring now I�m hoping you can help me out again. My parents are looking at replacing/modifying their existing curved staircase and upper floor with hardwood. They can�t seem to find someone in the Markham area who will do it or who is reputable. Any suggestions on how they should go about doing this or where they can find someone?

[Narci]

I have original hardwood floors in my house (about 45 years old). It has a finish oin it but i'm not sure what it is.

What would be the best way toi refinish the floors besides sanding it down?

Would polishing it and adding wax be a good idea?

How much would it roughly cost?

[dmg79]

Do you know of any reputable flooring store in edmonton? Also, do you know of any reputable floor installer? Thanks!


Had our first hardwood installed during our new home construction from ASHLEY (I would not recommend them!!!) Install was terrible, floor had gaps everywhere and was lifting.

After the builder aggreed to replace the flooring they got DIVINE Hardwood to do the install. They did a fantastic job

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

This thread is great. You helped me out when I got flooring now I�m hoping you can help me out again. My parents are looking at replacing/modifying their existing curved staircase and upper floor with hardwood. They can�t seem to find someone in the Markham area who will do it or who is reputable. Any suggestions on how they should go about doing this or where they can find someone?

I assume you mean they want to re-cap the stairs in wood? Do they want to do hardwood in all the bedrooms or just the hallway?

[patrob]

I have original hardwood floors in my house (about 45 years old). It has a finish oin it but i'm not sure what it is.

What would be the best way toi refinish the floors besides sanding it down?

Would polishing it and adding wax be a good idea?

How much would it roughly cost?

It all depends what kind of finish it is. A simple screen & coat (pretty much dustless) may work. Price wise, contact your local re-finishers. Wax is only temporary & you will have to keep re-doing it often.

[Free Willy]

Hi Patrob,

We're getting ready to replace our carpets with hardwood throughout the house. Like Freebird1, I'd like to know if you can recommend a reputable company in the Markham area.

Also, we plan on re-carpeting our stairs rather than re-capping them. Should we deal with our stairs or our floors first?

[Freebird1]

I assume you mean they want to re-cap the stairs in wood? Do they want to do hardwood in all the bedrooms or just the hallway?

Yes, you're right. I guess recapping is what they need. I wasn't sure if they come in a replace the whole staircase or just finish the top with hardwood. I guess recapping makes more sense.

They also want to do just the upstairs hallway....no bedrooms right now. I think...

Does doing the bedrooms now or latter change anything? Thanks.

[horizontal8]

I've only found 1 place but it has nothing scheduled. Principle Liquidators at 403 and Dundas. Anywhere else?

[fly]

I'm looking to use Torly's floating engineered hardwood floor in my basement -- it's only 7' high so I'm looking for the solution that doesn't require a major sub-floor. According to the literature, all I need for the Torly is the 3-in-1 foam, right?

It's just concrete right now and definitely not leveled - would say a difference of 1" from wall to drain. I read this thread and Torly's website and there's no mention of needed it completely leveled. Will the 3-in-1 foam level the floor or should I use self-leveling compound on the concrete before I lay the foam?

Thanks in advance!

[JoeMir]

hi patrob!

I'm not sure if you already answered this question but i read somewhere here you can recommend a good hardwood floor installer. I just bought a new house and closing day is Oct 27th and i need to find a reputable installer , i already bought the wood.

[iBuildStuff]

The best place to get deals on hardwood flooring is AcademyFloor.com (http://www.academyfloor.com) . They offer a warehouse full of hardwood flooring , supplies, installation tools, and things for repair.

I used them for my entire DIY project. They have really fast shipping speeds and are the only customer support that could answered my questions in Details.

A+ in my book.

[alanbrenton]

I, surprisingly, discovered this thread while googling 'hardwood' flooring.

How can I tell if the standard hardwood flooring is already engineered hardwood? Or is engineered hardwood flooring only critical when used in more moist conditions like basements?

How good is radiant heating technology (Oakville/GTA winter climate) and how much does it cost to install per square foot? Will it be a technology to have around the entire house or limited to bathroom floors? When I used to live in Coquitlam, BC, my dad's house bought in 1994 already had radiant heating in all rooms.

What kind of hardwood flooring can withstand radiant heating?

Since it's new house that we are purchasing, how do I get radiant heating installed by a contractor if the builder will charge an arm and a leg for it?

Thanks so much guys and gals (Patrob).

[Free Willy]

Hi Patrob,

We spent most of today visiting showrooms and getting estimates for our floors. We've really taken a liking to Mirage Charcoal (maple) and I thought I'd come here and ask a few questions based on our experiences today.

1. One place quoted us $6.30 sq/ft for the material. Do you think this is a fair price?

2. Another location said they could offer $4.85 sq/ft, but it would be Mirage Charcoal stain on Wickham manufactured planks. Is this a common practice to take stain from one manufacturer to another manufacturer's wood? We have some reservations about possible quality issues (we're worried we might not get the same look). How are Wickham products?

3. We'd really like to do our stairs like the following:
http://i26.tinypic.com/34np3bd.jpg

Here's what our stairs look like now:
http://i28.tinypic.com/30svrbq.png
http://i26.tinypic.com/sd04dg.png

We've asked some of the hardwood flooring people about how to achieve this look, but none of them have any experience with stairs. Could you provide some insight as to how easy or difficult the transformation might be and how much you think it might run us in terms of cost? Are the stairs in the first image just hardwood stairs painted white with runners? We were hoping we could just change the side of the stairs (where the rails are).

Thanks!

[cxcr]

I don't know about the stain but we just bought Wickham floor select & better and don't like it. The color variation is more than we expected.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

We're getting ready to replace our carpets with hardwood throughout the house. Like Freebird1, I'd like to know if you can recommend a reputable company in the Markham area.

Also, we plan on re-carpeting our stairs rather than re-capping them. Should we deal with our stairs or our floors first?

It's better to have the carpets installed after the hardwood, you don't want contractors walking & dust up your brand new carpets.
When do you want to have this job done?

[patrob]

Yes, you're right. I guess recapping is what they need. I wasn't sure if they come in a replace the whole staircase or just finish the top with hardwood. I guess recapping makes more sense.

They also want to do just the upstairs hallway....no bedrooms right now. I think...

Does doing the bedrooms now or latter change anything? Thanks.

If all your joists are going in the same direction throughout, your floors will also be going the same direction throughout (across the joist) So if you install just a hallway & you have a room where the floors will be running in the same direction (in the future), there will be a cross piece in the doorway. If you don't mind that, you can do the bedrooms later.

[patrob]

I'm looking to use Torly's floating engineered hardwood floor in my basement -- it's only 7' high so I'm looking for the solution that doesn't require a major sub-floor. According to the literature, all I need for the Torly is the 3-in-1 foam, right?

It's just concrete right now and definitely not leveled - would say a difference of 1" from wall to drain. I read this thread and Torly's website and there's no mention of needed it completely leveled. Will the 3-in-1 foam level the floor or should I use self-leveling compound on the concrete before I lay the foam?

Thanks in advance!

Use the 3-in-1 underlay right over concrete. The drain & the slope towards it is there for a reason. The floor will have to follow the sub-floor unless you build an additional sub-floors which will reduce your height.

[patrob]

hi patrob!

I'm not sure if you already answered this question but i read somewhere here you can recommend a good hardwood floor installer. I just bought a new house and closing day is Oct 27th and i need to find a reputable installer , i already bought the wood.

We install hardwood for a living.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

We spent most of today visiting showrooms and getting estimates for our floors. We've really taken a liking to Mirage Charcoal (maple) and I thought I'd come here and ask a few questions based on our experiences today.

1. One place quoted us $6.30 sq/ft for the material. Do you think this is a fair price?

2. Another location said they could offer $4.85 sq/ft, but it would be Mirage Charcoal stain on Wickham manufactured planks. Is this a common practice to take stain from one manufacturer to another manufacturer's wood? We have some reservations about possible quality issues (we're worried we might not get the same look). How are Wickham products?

3. We'd really like to do our stairs like the following:
http://i26.tinypic.com/34np3bd.jpg

Here's what our stairs look like now:
http://i28.tinypic.com/30svrbq.png
http://i26.tinypic.com/sd04dg.png

We've asked some of the hardwood flooring people about how to achieve this look, but none of them have any experience with stairs. Could you provide some insight as to how easy or difficult the transformation might be and how much you think it might run us in terms of cost? Are the stairs in the first image just hardwood stairs painted white with runners? We were hoping we could just change the side of the stairs (where the rails are).

Thanks!

No idea about Wickham. The price will depend on the plank width & grade. Actually Vintage makes a similar colour on maple called Slate http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/mapleslate.jpg

Regarding the stairs, to achieve that look, yes you will need to re-cap the treads in wood & paint the sides/risers white. Or you can just paint your pickets white & stain the handrail to match the hardwood floors if you don't want to spend a lot of money now. That alone will change the way the stairs look.

[patrob]

I, surprisingly, discovered this thread while googling 'hardwood' flooring.

How can I tell if the standard hardwood flooring is already engineered hardwood? Or is engineered hardwood flooring only critical when used in more moist conditions like basements?

How good is radiant heating technology (Oakville/GTA winter climate) and how much does it cost to install per square foot? Will it be a technology to have around the entire house or limited to bathroom floors? When I used to live in Coquitlam, BC, my dad's house bought in 1994 already had radiant heating in all rooms.

What kind of hardwood flooring can withstand radiant heating?

Since it's new house that we are purchasing, how do I get radiant heating installed by a contractor if the builder will charge an arm and a leg for it?

Thanks so much guys and gals (Patrob).

Open the vent to see if the floor is solid or engineered. Engineered is versatile & can be used anywhere.

Not familiar with pricing for radiant heat but I now it's expensive. IMO there is no need for radiant heat in bedrooms. Only engineered hardwood can be installed over radiant heat. If your builder is installing your floors, he will have to also install radiant heat. And I am not surprised they are charging you an arm & a leg for it. They probably don't want to be bothered so they are quoting you high, so you say no :D

[patrob]

I don't know about the stain but we just bought Wickham floor select & better and don't like it. The color variation is more than we expected.

S&B should not have a lot of colour variation, the wood should be more clear, there is a reason why there are diff. grades available...
Grade of the wood will depend on the manufacturer, so you get what you pay for.

[cxcr]

Hi Patrob,

We have a squeaky floor problem in our master bedroom which we could not fix.

At first, we added screws but the sound didn't go away. Then, we opened up the OSB subfloor and found out the sound is actually form the supporting joist. So, we reinforced the joist by adding some wood. The sound went away. However, when we install the hardwood floor today, it start squeaking again. Do you know how we can fix it? Your help would be greatly appreciated.

[Free Willy]

It's better to have the carpets installed after the hardwood, you don't want contractors walking & dust up your brand new carpets.
When do you want to have this job done?
Thanks for the reply, Patrob. And yeah, we got the same answer when we asked around today. =) As for when we're hoping to complete the job, we're aiming for sometime before October. We'd ideally like to get things done before Labour Day, but we're sort of stuck on what to do with our stairs, and haven't gotten any estimates for the various options we're considering yet.

No idea about Wickham. The price will depend on the plank width & grade. Actually Vintage makes a similar colour on maple called Slate http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/mapleslate.jpg

Regarding the stairs, to achieve that look, yes you will need to re-cap the treads in wood & paint the sides/risers white. Or you can just paint your pickets white & stain the handrail to match the hardwood floors if you don't want to spend a lot of money now. That alone will change the way the stairs look.
The $6.30 quote was for 3 1/4" wide planks with Exclusive grade. Does this sound about right to you? What do you think about the other place's idea of custom ordering Mirage stain on Wickham wood? As for Vintage Slate, we did take a serious look at it, since you've recommended Vintage several times in this thread. Unfortunately, it was too dark/purple for us and we preferred the creamier undertones in the Charcoal.

Our deliberation on the treatment of our stairs is what's mainly holding up our project. So to achieve that look in the photo, do you mean we have to re-cap our entire staircase (full treads and risers)? Is it possible to just do the strip under the rails and add molding? We'd be happy with carpet running flush to the walls.

Again, thanks so much for taking the time to offer your help! It's really appreciated. =)

[Free Willy]

I don't know about the stain but we just bought Wickham floor select & better and don't like it. The color variation is more than we expected.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, cxcr! Have your Wickham floors been installed already? What sort of colour variation are you seeing that you weren't expecting? I'm actually interested in having some variance (hence why I'm looking at Mirage's Exclusive grade), but I'm not too keen on blotchy/cloudy variations in colour (looking for something a bit softer). Other than the colour variations, how do you find Wickham floors? Really appreciate your insight! =)

[cxcr]

Hi Free Willy,

I tried to upload a picture but have not figured out how to do so.

Well, a lot planks have very dark spots/lines/clouds. Just like Patrob said you got what you paid for. However, dark stain may be able to cover these.

Other than the colour variation, some planks have big dark hole on the back.

[fly]

Use the 3-in-1 underlay right over concrete. The drain & the slope towards it is there for a reason. The floor will have to follow the sub-floor unless you build an additional sub-floors which will reduce your height.

ah, so it's okay to have a slight slope. Thanks!

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

We have a squeaky floor problem in our master bedroom which we could not fix.

At first, we added screws but the sound didn't go away. Then, we opened up the OSB subfloor and found out the sound is actually form the supporting joist. So, we reinforced the joist by adding some wood. The sound went away. However, when we install the hardwood floor today, it start squeaking again. Do you know how we can fix it? Your help would be greatly appreciated.

If it's the same sound (sub-floor/joist) you will have to open it up again. If it's possible, fix it from underneath. Something is moving, could be joist against hanger, or joist against joist. If you don't want the mess, you will have to live with it.

[patrob]

Thanks for the reply, Patrob. And yeah, we got the same answer when we asked around today. =) As for when we're hoping to complete the job, we're aiming for sometime before October. We'd ideally like to get things done before Labour Day, but we're sort of stuck on what to do with our stairs, and haven't gotten any estimates for the various options we're considering yet.

The $6.30 quote was for 3 1/4" wide planks with Exclusive grade. Does this sound about right to you? What do you think about the other place's idea of custom ordering Mirage stain on Wickham wood? As for Vintage Slate, we did take a serious look at it, since you've recommended Vintage several times in this thread. Unfortunately, it was too dark/purple for us and we preferred the creamier undertones in the Charcoal.

Our deliberation on the treatment of our stairs is what's mainly holding up our project. So to achieve that look in the photo, do you mean we have to re-cap our entire staircase (full treads and risers)? Is it possible to just do the strip under the rails and add molding? We'd be happy with carpet running flush to the walls.

Again, thanks so much for taking the time to offer your help! It's really appreciated. =)
I took a look at the inspiration pic again & the stairs look fully carpeted. The part of the railing looks like a mini wall following the stairs with mouldings & railings are installed on it. So for this, you will not have to re-cap your stairs. But remove the railings, build up the railing side, re-install the railings/pickets & paint it. The price for wood sounds ok.

[t3359]

Hi Patrob,

I finally resumed my flooring project and put down 3/4" OSB on top of the existing plywood so that the finished floor would be the same height as the tile in the next room.

In doing so, I found that some of the OSB needs to be levelled... The stuff I got was Norbord from Home Depot. I don't know if it's normal, but there were variations in the thickness of this stuff... I even found a board around 1/2"!!!

Anyway, the Norbord installation instructions (http://norbord.com/OSB_Truflor_Installation.shtml) don't mention what I need to do to level the OSB... any recommendations?

First time I've worked with OSB - pretty easy to cut, easy to handle. It's great, except the tongue/groove get damaged easily... and the thickness variation problem. Perhaps just a bad board... but I don't want to rent a truck again to get more home. :)

thanks...
bjl

[Freebird1]

I assume you mean they want to re-cap the stairs in wood? Do they want to do hardwood in all the bedrooms or just the hallway?

Hi Patrob,

Looks like they want to re-cap the floors, put hardwood in 1 upstairs bedroom and the upper hallway. Any people in the Markham area you would recommend who could do this kind of work?

Thanks.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I finally resumed my flooring project and put down 3/4" OSB on top of the existing plywood so that the finished floor would be the same height as the tile in the next room.

In doing so, I found that some of the OSB needs to be levelled... The stuff I got was Norbord from Home Depot. I don't know if it's normal, but there were variations in the thickness of this stuff... I even found a board around 1/2"!!!

Anyway, the Norbord installation instructions (http://norbord.com/OSB_Truflor_Installation.shtml) don't mention what I need to do to level the OSB... any recommendations?

First time I've worked with OSB - pretty easy to cut, easy to handle. It's great, except the tongue/groove get damaged easily... and the thickness variation problem. Perhaps just a bad board... but I don't want to rent a truck again to get more home. :)

thanks...
bjl

3/4" OSB is supposed to be 3/4" right through. If it's thinner or thicker, that sheet should not be installed. If it's tongue & groove it goes this side up if it's installed upside down, you will have diff. heights! Because the tongue is offset on both OSB & ply. That's why sometimes it's better to buy square cut vs. tongue & groove. If you have to level the sub-floor, it has to be done before installing the final layer of new sub-floor.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Looks like they want to re-cap the floors, put hardwood in 1 upstairs bedroom and the upper hallway. Any people in the Markham area you would recommend who could do this kind of work?

Thanks.

I will PM you contact info.

[t3359]

3/4" OSB is supposed to be 3/4" right through. If it's thinner or thicker, that sheet should not be installed. If it's tongue & groove it goes this side up if it's installed upside down, you will have diff. heights! Because the tongue is offset on both OSB & ply. That's why sometimes it's better to buy square cut vs. tongue & groove. If you have to level the sub-floor, it has to be done before installing the final layer of new sub-floor.

Yeah... I definitely didn't install the 1/2" one... I ended up measuring them all before install and they all came up to 3/4". After install though, there was probably 1/16" or 1/32" differences between the height of two adjacent boards. The floor was level, so I'm not sure where the difference came from.

I read online that some companies recommend sanding down uneven edges - might end up doing that, or doubling the building paper in the lower areas depending if it was a hill or valley. I might try asking Norbord as well.

Overall, I'm not too happy with the quality control from Norbord.

bjl

[7jai]

I will PM you contact info.

Hey Patrob,

Could you help me with my below inquiry from this thread I created?

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/showthread.php?t=780635

Thanks :)

[patrob]

Yeah... I definitely didn't install the 1/2" one... I ended up measuring them all before install and they all came up to 3/4". After install though, there was probably 1/16" or 1/32" differences between the height of two adjacent boards. The floor was level, so I'm not sure where the difference came from.

I read online that some companies recommend sanding down uneven edges - might end up doing that, or doubling the building paper in the lower areas depending if it was a hill or valley. I might try asking Norbord as well.

Overall, I'm not too happy with the quality control from Norbord.

bjl

1/16" or 1/32" might also be storage & humidity issue (store) You should always sand all seams/joints regardless. Don't even bother with the paper. It's wood, not glass, eventually it will move. Have fun installing :D

[Matrix_dot_ca]

hi Patrob,

I am planning on installing a 230sqft of laminate into the basement. I am planning to use Costco's Golden Select laminate and use delta-fl as underlay. Would this be ok? Is there a laminate that is good for basement?

[RabidRabbit]

Is it normal for a newish hardwood floor (about four or five months old, but house has only been lived in for a month) to be somewhat creaky? It is hardwood that has been nailed down to a 3/4" plywood subfloor.

I find in the morning it is quite creaky, after you walk on it a bit, it tends to quieten down. I did not notice this so much when it was very hot and humid outside a few weeks ago, but now it is cooler and normal humidity.

Thanks

[konax]

Hi Patrob,

I have this freshly built unit with engineered hardwood floor. Can you please suggest what should be used for cleaning the floor - dry and wet alternatives? Frequency of cleaning with normal usage (no pets, no golf shoes etc).

PS: I don't know the contractor who built the floor, so I can't ask anyone about the recommended cleaning product.

TIA!!!!

[Free Willy]

Hi Free Willy,

I tried to upload a picture but have not figured out how to do so.

Well, a lot planks have very dark spots/lines/clouds. Just like Patrob said you got what you paid for. However, dark stain may be able to cover these.

Other than the colour variation, some planks have big dark hole on the back.
Thank you for the info. We've decided not to go with Wickham. =)

I took a look at the inspiration pic again & the stairs look fully carpeted. The part of the railing looks like a mini wall following the stairs with mouldings & railings are installed on it. So for this, you will not have to re-cap your stairs. But remove the railings, build up the railing side, re-install the railings/pickets & paint it. The price for wood sounds ok.
Sorry for all the questions, Patrob. We're still deciding which direction we want to go in and appreciate your patience. As of now, we're leaning towards all hardwood stairs. If we end up going this route, should we install the floors or the stairs first? We're going to be getting different companies to do the separate projects.

Also, we dropped by Darmaga and the sales rep we spoke to didn't seem too impressed with Mirage's "Exclusive" grade. He suggested Superior instead. How does Mirage's "Exclusive" compare to Superior's "Select" and "Select & Better"?

[patrob]

hi Patrob,

I am planning on installing a 230sqft of laminate into the basement. I am planning to use Costco's Golden Select laminate and use delta-fl as underlay. Would this be ok? Is there a laminate that is good for basement?

Any laminate is fine for the basement. The Delta underlay will probably come out more than the laminate...

[patrob]

Is it normal for a newish hardwood floor (about four or five months old, but house has only been lived in for a month) to be somewhat creaky? It is hardwood that has been nailed down to a 3/4" plywood subfloor.

I find in the morning it is quite creaky, after you walk on it a bit, it tends to quieten down. I did not notice this so much when it was very hot and humid outside a few weeks ago, but now it is cooler and normal humidity.

Thanks

That's pretty much normal, that's the beauty of wood. It will go away after time. It might have been installed too close to the wall & it's rubbing against wall or baseboard.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I have this freshly built unit with engineered hardwood floor. Can you please suggest what should be used for cleaning the floor - dry and wet alternatives? Frequency of cleaning with normal usage (no pets, no golf shoes etc).

PS: I don't know the contractor who built the floor, so I can't ask anyone about the recommended cleaning product.

TIA!!!!
Here you go http://www.vintageflooring.com/ecommerce/product_detail.php?id=178

You can order it online directly from Vintage & they ship it to your house :) Make sure you spray the cleaning solution on the cotton cloth, not directly on the floors! For dry alternative vacuum or dry swiffer.

[patrob]

Sorry for all the questions, Patrob. We're still deciding which direction we want to go in and appreciate your patience. As of now, we're leaning towards all hardwood stairs. If we end up going this route, should we install the floors or the stairs first? We're going to be getting different companies to do the separate projects.

Also, we dropped by Darmaga and the sales rep we spoke to didn't seem too impressed with Mirage's "Exclusive" grade. He suggested Superior instead. How does Mirage's "Exclusive" compare to Superior's "Select" and "Select & Better"?

Of course they are pushing Superior because they have a bigger mark up on it :rolleyes: Mirage quality/milling in any grade would be better than Superior. Apparently Superior uses water based finish, which is not as strong & therefore shows damage a lot easier. But we also noticed lately that Mirage uses a lot more short pieces.

If you will re-cap your stairs, do it before the hardwood installation. It's a lot of mess with preparation.

[Matrix_dot_ca]

Any laminate is fine for the basement. The Delta underlay will probably come out more than the laminate...

what would you recommend as underlay for basement flooring? Laminate over concrete would be too cold, right?

[RabidRabbit]

That's pretty much normal, that's the beauty of wood. It will go away after time. It might have been installed too close to the wall & it's rubbing against wall or baseboard.

Ok, thank you

I'll give it six months or so and see if anything changes before taking any action.

[enjoku]

Hi patrob,

I guess your the flooring guru here. :D I just purchased a home and the builder is going to install 2 1/4 x 3/4 oak hardwood Natural Finish in the main floor. Since it is a natural finish the builder told us that to stain the floor would be considered an upgrade. They will have to stain the floor as well as the staircase as it is also oak. I'm just curious if this upgrade is expensive or not. Is it better to get someone sles to do it rather than the builder?

Thanks

[patrob]

what would you recommend as underlay for basement flooring? Laminate over concrete would be too cold, right?

You can use 6mm cork under the laminate to make it feel warmer.

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

I guess your the flooring guru here. :D I just purchased a home and the builder is going to install 2 1/4 x 3/4 oak hardwood Natural Finish in the main floor. Since it is a natural finish the builder told us that to stain the floor would be considered an upgrade. They will have to stain the floor as well as the staircase as it is also oak. I'm just curious if this upgrade is expensive or not. Is it better to get someone sles to do it rather than the builder?

Thanks

I guess I am :cheesygri

If your standard floor is natural, the stain will be an upgrade. Find out what they will charge you but you don't have much choice because if you don't take it, they will install the natural hardwood. It's one of those upgrades that you have to pay for unless you take credit for the floors & do it after but that credit might not be worth very much (if they even agree). But the stairs stain def. upgrade through the builder.

[Matrix_dot_ca]

You can use 6mm cork under the laminate to make it feel warmer.

Sorry if i got tons of questions. Can moisture get trapped on cork though? How much is the price per sqft on it. I got quoted $1 per sqft on delta FL.

[Matrix_dot_ca]

seems that the cork is cheaper than delta fl. I got quoted $0.70 /sqft. BUt i still need to know if i have to put a moisture barrier or directly on concrete.

[patrob]

Sorry if i got tons of questions. Can moisture get trapped on cork though? How much is the price per sqft on it. I got quoted $1 per sqft on delta FL.


seems that the cork is cheaper than delta fl. I got quoted $0.70 /sqft. BUt i still need to know if i have to put a moisture barrier or directly on concrete.

I thought the DeltaFL would be more $, then you can go with the Delta. Delta is a heavy moisture barrier & works really well but you will still need underlay under the laminate. Cork is more for cushion/sound, not a moisture barrier.

[Matrix_dot_ca]

I thought the DeltaFL would be more $, then you can go with the Delta. Delta is a heavy moisture barrier & works really well but you will still need underlay under the laminate. Cork is more for cushion/sound, not a moisture barrier.

The Golden select laminate has the underlay attached on the back of it. So Delta Fl>foam underlay>laminate.

[patrob]

The Golden select laminate has the underlay attached on the back of it. So Delta Fl>foam underlay>laminate.

A lot of people are complaining about the built-in underlays in laminates, so I would spend few extra pennies & get additional foam underlay.
Yes, Delta Fl>foam underlay>laminate.

[enjoku]

I guess I am :cheesygri

If your standard floor is natural, the stain will be an upgrade. Find out what they will charge you but you don't have much choice because if you don't take it, they will install the natural hardwood. It's one of those upgrades that you have to pay for unless you take credit for the floors & do it after but that credit might not be worth very much (if they even agree). But the stairs stain def. upgrade through the builder.

There's also 2 kinds of wood width. Is there an advantage in getting a wider with than a thinner width?

[ratface]

I'm planning to install hardwood floors in m basement, and there is already ceramic tile (which I found when I took up the carpet). Should I treat this the same as a concrete floor and install delta Fl / foam underlay, or is something else preferred?

[Narci]

Why is refinishing hardwoord floors so expensive? They just take a machine to sand down the old polish and put on a new coat right?

I got a quote for $4800 for 700 sq. ft. just strip and polish, no replacing.

[Narci]

Me again.

Do you think refinishing original hardwood floors can be a DIY kind of project?

[patrob]

There's also 2 kinds of wood width. Is there an advantage in getting a wider with than a thinner width?

It's a personal preference really but generally 3 1/4" is the preferred width.

[patrob]

I'm planning to install hardwood floors in m basement, and there is already ceramic tile (which I found when I took up the carpet). Should I treat this the same as a concrete floor and install delta Fl / foam underlay, or is something else preferred?

As long as your tiles are not coming loose, treat it as a sub-floor.

[patrob]

Why is refinishing hardwoord floors so expensive? They just take a machine to sand down the old polish and put on a new coat right?

I got a quote for $4800 for 700 sq. ft. just strip and polish, no replacing.
Yes I heard that re-finishers in Vancouver get paid like lawyers :D Here in GTA screen & coat is around $2 sq. ft.

Me again.

Do you think refinishing original hardwood floors can be a DIY kind of project?
You can certainly try DIY & if it does not work out, then you can hire somebody. If you only need a light sand & coat, yes.
But if you want to re-sand to bare wood & then stain/coat, that's a lot more difficult.

[KevB]

Hi Patrob,

Well this thread just inspired me to join the forum. Wow there is a lot of great information here. Thanks!

I have a question about subflooring/underlay for an engineered wood floor in our older ~1950's?) house.

What we have now is 3/4 inch Douglas-fir shiplap boards (I think also known as car decking?) as the original subfloor, with 1/4 inch ply on top of that, I guess as an underlayment to the ugly old glued on resilient floor over that. The shiplap runs perpendicular to the floor joists, which are 2X10's on 16 inch centers. This is on the main floor which is above a full height reasonably heated basement. For aesthetic reasons we would like the planks to run in a direction that happens to be perpendicular to the joists but parallel with the shiplap subfloor.

Would I be correct to assume that I should rip everything up down to the shiplap subfloor? If so, what should I lay down over that before the flooring? There are a few squeaks here and there, and I would imagine they'd be easier to track down and fix if the subfloor was exposed. If I need to rip everything up, I was planning on screwing down the subfloor like you have recommended, but there are already a couple of nails at every joint location - would this then be too much?

The product we are thinking of going with is the Satin Finish multi-plank (1/2" X 3-5/8"), in a clear finish maple.

Thanks for any advice you have!

Kevin

[ashgotti]

Hey Patrob,

I just got my floors refinished. They're putting in a second coat today at 3PM. They said to stay off it till Monday. I'm kind of in a rush to move tomorrow, can I lay down tarp and move the furniture in tomorrow night?

Thanks,

Ash

[patrob]

Hey Patrob,

I just got my floors refinished. They're putting in a second coat today at 3PM. They said to stay off it till Monday. I'm kind of in a rush to move tomorrow, can I lay down tarp and move the furniture in tomorrow night?

Thanks,

Ash

You should let it dry for min. 24 hrs. But the finish cures a lot longer, so if you place your furniture, you could see some indentations. To be safe, wait until Monday.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Well this thread just inspired me to join the forum. Wow there is a lot of great information here. Thanks!

I have a question about subflooring/underlay for an engineered wood floor in our older ~1950's?) house.

What we have now is 3/4 inch Douglas-fir shiplap boards (I think also known as car decking?) as the original subfloor, with 1/4 inch ply on top of that, I guess as an underlayment to the ugly old glued on resilient floor over that. The shiplap runs perpendicular to the floor joists, which are 2X10's on 16 inch centers. This is on the main floor which is above a full height reasonably heated basement. For aesthetic reasons we would like the planks to run in a direction that happens to be perpendicular to the joists but parallel with the shiplap subfloor.

Would I be correct to assume that I should rip everything up down to the shiplap subfloor? If so, what should I lay down over that before the flooring? There are a few squeaks here and there, and I would imagine they'd be easier to track down and fix if the subfloor was exposed. If I need to rip everything up, I was planning on screwing down the subfloor like you have recommended, but there are already a couple of nails at every joint location - would this then be too much?

The product we are thinking of going with is the Satin Finish multi-plank (1/2" X 3-5/8"), in a clear finish maple.

Thanks for any advice you have!

Kevin
Welcome to RFD :)

It's better if you remove everything down to the sub-floor. Fix all the squeaks & then lay new 1/4" ply min. to make everything flat. The Satin Finish multiplank because it's so thin, shows everything. So if you run parallel with the shiplap boards you will see every line of the boards in the new flooring. I recommend something more rigid like 9/16" or 3/4".

[vr6man25]

hey Patrob ,

can you please let me know what types of floors I have from images below.
Also what type of paper goes under the hardwood? Do I just roll it out or glue or tack it down?
Also do you do stairs staining?


http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/9343/img4490rdj.jpg

[patrob]

hey Patrob ,

can you please let me know what types of floors I have from images below.
Also what type of paper goes under the hardwood? Do I just roll it out or glue or tack it down?
Also do you do stairs staining?

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/5594/img4489a.jpg
http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/9343/img4490rdj.jpg

This looks like aspenite. Builder's standard is usually 5/8". Use flooring underlay (wax paper) & is not glued or tacked to the sub-floor.
Just overlap the edges by 1".

[cn008]

Hi, I got various quote on installing the hardwood, some people said it is not necessary to screw whole subfloors, just those areas with squeaks; some said they will do it according to the "code" --- one screw per 6''?; some said just screw in places where there were nails....

And the quotation to screw as per the code is $1 per sq ft(total would be $800+)! this is only screwing, installation is another $1.8 per sq ft.

Other quotation for screwing is like $200 total including materials.

So what are the "code" for screwing subfloor?

Thanks.

[KevB]

Thanks Patrob,

I'll go with the 3/4". Is there another engineered product that you'd recommend over the Satin Finish which would be in a similar price range? We are looking at ~$6 per foot for the Multi Plank engineered, 3-5/8" wide, clear finish Maple in something they call their "common #1" grade which looks to show a little more variation in coloring than the regular select. It sounds like you prefer Vintage and Mirage but I seem to remember that they cost significantly more $$.

[ashgotti]

You should let it dry for min. 24 hrs. But the finish cures a lot longer, so if you place your furniture, you could see some indentations. To be safe, wait until Monday.

Great, thanks for the help again.

[woodywest]

We're looking to get the upstairs switched to hardwood for a 3 year-old home in Markham... there's about 1500 SF required.... we also have 2 sets of stairs that we may also want to have upgraded to oak. Some questions:

1. What companies are generally considered the best (or, who are in your top 10)... we had Mirage in a previous place and are looking at Preverco Red Oak Select, currently. We've also been told of Lauzon and see that you install Vintage. Just trying to gauge how companies stack up against one another.

2. What kind of price per SF should we be looking at based on Preverco quality range in terms of removing/disposing carpet and baseboards, installation of floor, installing 5.25 inch baseboards and doorstop with tax.

3. There is OSB subfloor currently... quote we have says there's no need to upgrade the subfloor as long as installation is perpendicular to joists... what's your opinion?

4. We have 2 sets of stairs that need carpets removed and Oak upgrading... what is the price of something like this?

Thanks in adavance for any assistance!

[evanryan]

Hi

On the way home I saw this new flooring place on Tomken Rd in Mississauga
Floors at Work Floors@work.com
They sell a 15.3m Unlclic floor made by NAF
Has you heard of this. I have tried to google but can't seem to find anything. I understand that Uniclic is a system that is licensed but just wondering at the brand.

Thanks

[effie]

Is it fair & reasonable for a charge of $50.00 each for appliances to be moved prior to having a new floor put down? I was shocked to see this in our recent quote.

We have 5 appliances that need to be pulled out, so this really adds up. I would have expected the installer to do this as part of the job; not extra.

Can anybody recommend a good carpet/floor installer in the Ottawa/Gatineau area? Thanks! I can certainly tell anyone who wants to know to avoid one in particular....just pm me & I'll tell you the name.

[trallen]

Has anyone used the 0.6mm Engineered hardwood? Kultur sells it for much cheaper then the regular 3mm Engineered hardwood and states the only differences are you don't have to lay down padding on a wooden subfloor with the 0.6mm, and you can't sand & refinish the 0.6mm.
The price difference for their high end 4" stock is 4.99 compared with 2.99 for the 0.6mm.

patrob do you have any other comments about the 0.6mm or Kultur flooring in general? This flooring will be put on the main floor in the front hallway/main entrance and the kitchen floor.

[patrob]

Hi, I got various quote on installing the hardwood, some people said it is not necessary to screw whole subfloors, just those areas with squeaks; some said they will do it according to the "code" --- one screw per 6''?; some said just screw in places where there were nails....

And the quotation to screw as per the code is $1 per sq ft(total would be $800+)! this is only screwing, installation is another $1.8 per sq ft.

Other quotation for screwing is like $200 total including materials.

So what are the "code" for screwing subfloor?

Thanks.
Never heard of any code but I guess there must be a code for everything.
I recommend screwing the sub-floor regardless every 6" to 8" apart before installing any kind of floor covering. Prices for sure will vary, .50 to .75 cents is ok but $1 is little bit too high. Most homeowners can do this themselves.

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob,

I'll go with the 3/4". Is there another engineered product that you'd recommend over the Satin Finish which would be in a similar price range? We are looking at ~$6 per foot for the Multi Plank engineered, 3-5/8" wide, clear finish Maple in something they call their "common #1" grade which looks to show a little more variation in coloring than the regular select. It sounds like you prefer Vintage and Mirage but I seem to remember that they cost significantly more $$.

I would still shop around, call diff. dealers. Both of those products are from Ontario & should be in close price range but def. Vintage is better quality than SF.

[patrob]

We're looking to get the upstairs switched to hardwood for a 3 year-old home in Markham... there's about 1500 SF required.... we also have 2 sets of stairs that we may also want to have upgraded to oak. Some questions:

1. What companies are generally considered the best (or, who are in your top 10)... we had Mirage in a previous place and are looking at Preverco Red Oak Select, currently. We've also been told of Lauzon and see that you install Vintage. Just trying to gauge how companies stack up against one another.

2. What kind of price per SF should we be looking at based on Preverco quality range in terms of removing/disposing carpet and baseboards, installation of floor, installing 5.25 inch baseboards and doorstop with tax.

3. There is OSB subfloor currently... quote we have says there's no need to upgrade the subfloor as long as installation is perpendicular to joists... what's your opinion?

4. We have 2 sets of stairs that need carpets removed and Oak upgrading... what is the price of something like this?

Thanks in adavance for any assistance!

1. Top 5: Vintage, Mirage, Muskoka, Lauzon, Superior.
Preverco will fit at the bottom of top 10. Never liked their product.

2. Not familiar with Preverco's prices.

3. Correct.

4. Stairs are approx. $150-$200 per step, plus...

Prices for removal & installation are per ft. & price will vary between contractors. Baseboard & doorstop is per ln. ft. & that will also vary. If you need more info, let me know.

[patrob]

Hi

On the way home I saw this new flooring place on Tomken Rd in Mississauga
Floors at Work Floors@work.com
They sell a 15.3m Unlclic floor made by NAF
Has you heard of this. I have tried to google but can't seem to find anything. I understand that Uniclic is a system that is licensed but just wondering at the brand.

Thanks

Uniclic is one of the best locking systems on the market. It's a patent owned by Torlys. But not familiar with NAF. The 12-15 mm laminates are not any better than 7-8-9 mm from Torlys, so the thickness does not matter in this case. It's about the hardness of the HDF.

[patrob]

Is it fair & reasonable for a charge of $50.00 each for appliances to be moved prior to having a new floor put down? I was shocked to see this in our recent quote.

We have 5 appliances that need to be pulled out, so this really adds up. I would have expected the installer to do this as part of the job; not extra.

Can anybody recommend a good carpet/floor installer in the Ottawa/Gatineau area? Thanks! I can certainly tell anyone who wants to know to avoid one in particular....just pm me & I'll tell you the name.

I am not surprised. 5 appliances which are very heavy & no installer wants to be responsible for water hook up of fridge & dishwasher, etc. Do you have a double fridge & a wine cooler? Or you have hardwood floors going in the laundry? Maybe ask your friend to help you move them to save that money.

[patrob]

Has anyone used the 0.6mm Engineered hardwood? Kultur sells it for much cheaper then the regular 3mm Engineered hardwood and states the only differences are you don't have to lay down padding on a wooden subfloor with the 0.6mm, and you can't sand & refinish the 0.6mm.
The price difference for their high end 4" stock is 4.99 compared with 2.99 for the 0.6mm.

patrob do you have any other comments about the 0.6mm or Kultur flooring in general? This flooring will be put on the main floor in the front hallway/main entrance and the kitchen floor.

The 0.6 mm & 3 mm refers to thickness of the veneer. The 0.6 mm is paper thin. I would rather have thicker veneer but you get what you pay for. It's a fairly new company & they put a lot of money into advertising (billboards).

[DarthVader]

Has anyone ever bought from a place near Sherway Gardens called AA Floors and More?
Guy's offering a great deal on hardwood and seems to have a lot of contractors coming in but i'm not sure if he's shadey (he's offering S&B hardwood at a price which no one can seem to beat.)

[fukngrvn]

Has anyone ever bought from a place near Sherway Gardens called AA Floors and More?
Guy's offering a great deal on hardwood and seems to have a lot of contractors coming in but i'm not sure if he's shadey (he's offering S&B hardwood at a price which no one can seem to beat.)

I friend of mine just mentioned AA Floors to me. He had a great experience there. Sorry that I can't provide more details, all I can remember is that it was a positive experience and recommended that I visit.

[remmuh]

Hi,

I just moved into a place with hardwood in all rooms except the kitchen.
I would like to maybe put a protective layer of varnish on the floors before I move in, as this would probably be the best time to do it.

My question is, if the floor is already finished, would I need to lightly sand it first?
I've been looking at products and what is the difference between Minwax and Varathane floor finishes?
Do they make a difference?
Is Varathane Nano Defence worth it?
Or maybe there is another alternative which would work better?

Thanks in advance.

[patrob]

Has anyone ever bought from a place near Sherway Gardens called AA Floors and More?
Guy's offering a great deal on hardwood and seems to have a lot of contractors coming in but i'm not sure if he's shadey (he's offering S&B hardwood at a price which no one can seem to beat.)

They offer a lot of lower quality products & a lot of it is imported. Find out where the wood is made before you buy it.

[patrob]

Hi,

I just moved into a place with hardwood in all rooms except the kitchen.
I would like to maybe put a protective layer of varnish on the floors before I move in, as this would probably be the best time to do it.

My question is, if the floor is already finished, would I need to lightly sand it first?
I've been looking at products and what is the difference between Minwax and Varathane floor finishes?
Do they make a difference?
Is Varathane Nano Defence worth it?
Or maybe there is another alternative which would work better?

Thanks in advance.
You have to do a light sand & apply finish & it's called screen & coat. If it's pre-finished wood & the bevel is a little bit deeper, you have a higher tendency of the new finish peeling off in that beveled area. If the floor is finished on site, a simple screen & coat is all you need. Nano finish is supposed to be stronger & a lot of finishes have Nano added. But at the same time you lose the clarity of the finish (looks more milky).

[remmuh]

You have to do a light sand & apply finish & it's called screen & coat. If it's pre-finished wood & the bevel is a little bit deeper, you have a higher tendency of the new finish peeling off in that beveled area. If the floor is finished on site, a simple screen & coat is all you need. Nano finish is supposed to be stronger & a lot of finishes have Nano added. But at the same time you lose the clarity of the finish (looks more milky).

THanks!
Do you recommend a certain product to use as a finish?

[patrob]

THanks!
Do you recommend a certain product to use as a finish?

For staircases we usually use Varathane but for floors, it's better if you ask a floor re-finisher.

[corkercoon]

Hi there,

I was looking at installing hardwood in a great room in my home. The one concern I have is that one side of the room (about a 1/4 of the room) has skylights and gets a great deal of sun. The other side of the room, although it has many windows, gets signifigantly less sunlight. I am worried about the floor on one side of the room fading or changing signifigantly in relation to the other side when it is the same flooring.
Is there a particular species of wood, or finish that would stand up to this type of situation than others?

Thanks in advance.

[mgnr]

Hi Patrob. I am new to RFD, and have spent the last hour going through this entire thread. I can't believe that it has been going for close to 2 years. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience. Now for my question - we are taking possession of a house in Thornhill mid-September and want to refinish the hardwood floors on the main floor before we actually move in. Can you give us the names of a couple of good refinishers in the area? I had one person come in with a quote of $2/ sq foot including sanding, staining and 2 coats of polyurethane. Is this reasonable or below market? Does the quarter round need to come up when the floors are being redone?

[patrob]

Hi there,

I was looking at installing hardwood in a great room in my home. The one concern I have is that one side of the room (about a 1/4 of the room) has skylights and gets a great deal of sun. The other side of the room, although it has many windows, gets signifigantly less sunlight. I am worried about the floor on one side of the room fading or changing signifigantly in relation to the other side when it is the same flooring.
Is there a particular species of wood, or finish that would stand up to this type of situation than others?

Thanks in advance.

We install a lot of hardwood in upper hallways where they have skylights & oak or hickory shows no colour change. You have to be careful with maple, walnut, cherry & exotics. Looks for manufacturers that use UV cured finish.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob. I am new to RFD, and have spent the last hour going through this entire thread. I can't believe that it has been going for close to 2 years. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience. Now for my question - we are taking possession of a house in Thornhill mid-September and want to refinish the hardwood floors on the main floor before we actually move in. Can you give us the names of a couple of good refinishers in the area? I had one person come in with a quote of $2/ sq foot including sanding, staining and 2 coats of polyurethane. Is this reasonable or below market? Does the quarter round need to come up when the floors are being redone?

Welcome to RFD :)

Yes, quarter round has to be removed to re-sand. $2 sq. ft. sanding, staining & finishing is cheap. Often this price is for natural & stain is more. I will PM you the contact info.

[rinse]

patrob, do you guys stain oak steps?

I've asked the builder to leave my oak staircase unfinished as they were going to charge me a ridiculous amount for them to stain it. It's about 15 steps with railings.

[doggydoo]

Hi Patrob,

I have a dilemma and would appreciate your advise.

I have an fairly open concept house and the floor joists change direction right in the middle of the place. The subloor is �� OSB and I�d prefer not to install the hardwood at a 45 degree angle.

Is the �� OSB sufficiently strong to run the floorboards in the same direction as the joists?

If I were to replace the sub floor in the area in question, would � plywood be strong enough?

The above scenarios assume a appropriate level of humidity in the house.

Thanks!

[patrob]

patrob, do you guys stain oak steps?

I've asked the builder to leave my oak staircase unfinished as they were going to charge me a ridiculous amount for them to stain it. It's about 15 steps with railings.

Yes but that depends how busy we are. When is your closing & location? sp

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I have a dilemma and would appreciate your advise.

I have an fairly open concept house and the floor joists change direction right in the middle of the place. The subloor is �� OSB and I�d prefer not to install the hardwood at a 45 degree angle.

Is the �� OSB sufficiently strong to run the floorboards in the same direction as the joists?

If I were to replace the sub floor in the area in question, would � plywood be strong enough?

The above scenarios assume a appropriate level of humidity in the house.

Thanks!

Are your joists 12 or 16 o.c.? Floors should be installed perpendicular to the majority of the joists. If small part of the floor will be with joists, it's still ok. 3/4" OSB is very rigid & you should have no problems. If you can, add additional subfloor like 3/8" ply, it will def. give you more strength.

[Easto]

My wife and I really like the look of wood flooring. We are building a house, but we have a 82lb German Shepherd dog.

Is there any chance of getting a hardwood that the dog won't destroy?

If not, can you recommend a good laminate that looks like real wood.

[t3359]

Hi...

I was reading the installation requirements for the hardwood and they specify this:

... construction paper (15 lb/6 kg) on wood subfloors;

I actually have a roll of the BP Canada RG401 felt paper (link (http://www.bpcan.com/products.aspx?f=1&cat=7&id=57))... would that be the right stuff, or did I totally get the wrong thing? :)

thanks!
bjl

[trini]

Hey Patrob they should give you god status for tall the info and people you helped.
I haven't read through the posts but from what i have seen i will say thank you for your efforts.

[patrob]

Hi...

I was reading the installation requirements for the hardwood and they specify this:

I actually have a roll of the BP Canada RG401 felt paper (link (http://www.bpcan.com/products.aspx?f=1&cat=7&id=57))... would that be the right stuff, or did I totally get the wrong thing? :)

thanks!
bjl
It's hell to install floors on that paper. It catches between boards & it's so thick if it does, you can't put the boards together. I don't know why some manufacturers specify it but regular flooring underlay (wax paper) works the best. We usually use that BP paper to cover the floors after installation.

[patrob]

My wife and I really like the look of wood flooring. We are building a house, but we have a 82lb German Shepherd dog.

Is there any chance of getting a hardwood that the dog won't destroy?

If not, can you recommend a good laminate that looks like real wood.

Yes, check out Vintage Solid Sawn Hand Scraped hardwood :)

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/8228/vintagehandscrapeddarekty9.jpg

Laminate is still laminate & the higher end stuff will cost you. Check out Torlys or Kahrs.

[patrob]

Hey Patrob they should give you god status for tall the info and people you helped.
I haven't read through the posts but from what i have seen i will say thank you for your efforts.

Thank you :D

Anyone is welcome to rate this thread & vote http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif if they find it helpful :)

[tpirovol]

Hi Everyone,

I was hoping someone could help me out. My wife and I are looking to hardwood 1200sq of our home. My wife decided on a Oak Walnut colour. We have gone to homedepot and lowes(Goodfellow). We are trying to find the best product under $6 per sq ft. Just wondering what brand people recommend and the best store to purchase them at? I have heard satin finish is an excellent brand just wondering if there are any others?

The main reason for the oak is that we have an unfinished oak stair case that we want to try and match with the floors.

Thanks Terry

[Easto]

Yes, check out Vintage Solid Sawn Hand Scraped hardwood :)

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/8228/vintagehandscrapeddarekty9.jpg

Laminate is still laminate & the higher end stuff will cost you. Check out Torlys or Kahrs.

Would it be worth it to go with a higher end laminate instead of risking it with the wood?

[Majoram]

Dear Patrob,

We're going to be painting all our house but we want to re-finish the floors too.

Like you mentioned to me before, I can sand down the floors a bit to bring some of the life back to it.

Would it make sens to prep the walls AND the floors at the same time?
Or should we finish prep/painting the wall first and then do the floors? or vice versa?

Thanks!

[joeblowyy]

Is anyone familiar with Acacia (African walnut)? It's an amazing looking wood in my opinion. It's very hard but I'm wondering about the suitability for Canadian climate, since it's an exotic wood.

The manufacturer of the piece I saw is Kentwood. The price I was quoted seems a bit high, curious to know if anyone has experience with wood from this manufacturer.

Thanks

[tareks]

We're replacing the carpet in our condo. I'm getting a pretty good deal on 'Beaufort' laminate - $2.19/sqft. I've called around and this laminate usually goes from 2.69-3.50. I was wondering if anyone was familiar with this laminate and if it is a good laminate or not?

Thanks!

[patrob]

Hi Everyone,

I was hoping someone could help me out. My wife and I are looking to hardwood 1200sq of our home. My wife decided on a Oak Walnut colour. We have gone to homedepot and lowes(Goodfellow). We are trying to find the best product under $6 per sq ft. Just wondering what brand people recommend and the best store to purchase them at? I have heard satin finish is an excellent brand just wondering if there are any others?

The main reason for the oak is that we have an unfinished oak stair case that we want to try and match with the floors.

Thanks Terry

Satin Finish might be ok but it's far away from excellent. If you are looking for wood in the $6 price range, you should def. consider Vintage.

[patrob]

Would it be worth it to go with a higher end laminate instead of risking it with the wood?

It's really up to you. I personally would go with wood. Laminate is still laminate. We have a friend who has a 75 lbs. dog & has the Vintage hand scraped wood & has no problems.

[patrob]

Dear Patrob,

We're going to be painting all our house but we want to re-finish the floors too.

Like you mentioned to me before, I can sand down the floors a bit to bring some of the life back to it.

Would it make sens to prep the walls AND the floors at the same time?
Or should we finish prep/painting the wall first and then do the floors? or vice versa?

Thanks!

Prepare the walls & paint one coat. Then do your floors & then your final coat of paint.

[patrob]

Is anyone familiar with Acacia (African walnut)? It's an amazing looking wood in my opinion. It's very hard but I'm wondering about the suitability for Canadian climate, since it's an exotic wood.

The manufacturer of the piece I saw is Kentwood. The price I was quoted seems a bit high, curious to know if anyone has experience with wood from this manufacturer.

Thanks

Yes it's a very good looking wood. Some exterior furniture is made out of Acacia wood. Some say it's 1750 Janka hardness & others 2,400. I can't comment on the durability, it's not a common wood used as flooring material.

[Easto]

It's really up to you. I personally would go with wood. Laminate is still laminate. We have a friend who has a 75 lbs. dog & has the Vintage hand scraped wood & has no problems.

Which species of wood should we be looking into?

I don't like a whole lot of grain like you see in oak

[nexposure]

It's really up to you. I personally would go with wood. Laminate is still laminate. We have a friend who has a 75 lbs. dog & has the Vintage hand scraped wood & has no problems.


Satin Finish might be ok but it's far away from excellent. If you are looking for wood in the $6 price range, you should def. consider Vintage.

You do sell Vintage products, just to be clear.

I'm a consumer, not a retailer, and have had both finished and unfinished wood installed in our home, and of the two, I much preferred the unfinished. We had quartersawn oak installed and its appearance is stunning. More costly than pre-finished but worth it to us.

[patrob]

Which species of wood should we be looking into?

I don't like a whole lot of grain like you see in oak

With a dog, the more grain the better. It will hide damages better. The less grainy the wood, the more it shows. If you don't like the grain of oak & want something durable with no grain, then you might have to go with laminate imitating maple, beech, etc.

[patrob]

You do sell Vintage products, just to be clear.

I'm a consumer, not a retailer, and have had both finished and unfinished wood installed in our home, and of the two, I much preferred the unfinished. We had quartersawn oak installed and its appearance is stunning. More costly than pre-finished but worth it to us.

Just to be clear, I can sell you any hardwood you like. We recommend Vintage because we have full confidence in their products! In past couple of months we have installed at least 12 manufacturers of wood & we can clearly see the differences between all.

Actually we just have installed close to 2,000 sq. ft. of quartersawn oak pre-finished (not from Vintage) & it does have its look but for durability & quality of finish, pre-finished is still better no matter what species. And price between pre & finished on site is not that significant. Quartersawn oak overall is more expensive.

[nexposure]

Just to be clear, I can sell you any hardwood you like. We recommend Vintage because we have full confidence in their products! In past couple of months we have installed at least 12 manufacturers of wood & we can clearly see the differences between all.

Actually we just have installed close to 2,000 sq. ft. of quartersawn oak pre-finished (not from Vintage) & it does have its look but for durability & quality of finish, pre-finished is still better no matter what species. And price between pre & finished on site is not that significant. Quartersawn oak overall is more expensive.

(1) The quality of the finish of that done in our home rather than the factory was superior to any pre-finish we saw, including Vintage. Finishing on-site also offers the advantage of being able to get exactly what you want because you can fine tune the color and tone at your home. Do you ever finish on site, and if so, what percentage of your business is that?

(2) As for durability, can you point to an objective study that compared the durability of pre-finished and hardwood finished on site?

(3) Quartersawn is more expensive (and well worth it, I might add) and I see Vintage doesn't offer it. I believe there's a producer of pre-finished quartersawn in Western Canada but that's about it. If you want quartersawn and a Canadian product, you need to finish on-site. For those who haven't seen quartersawn oak, it is stunning. It has a more elegant grain than oak and also rays -- lighter areas that streak across the grain -- that give it almost a 3-dimensional quality. I'll have to post a photo later.

(4) It's true the places that rely mostly on pre-finished are so-so finishing on site, at least in my neck of the woods in London, Ontario. But we found another company that does mainly finishing on-site whose quality work has them in demand from the GTA to Windsor. You pay more but it's worth it.

(5) On your web site the only wood you advertise is Vintage. You may install others but its clear which brand is your bread and butter.

[patrob]

(1) The quality of the finish of that done in our home rather than the factory was superior to any pre-finish we saw, including Vintage. Finishing on-site also offers the advantage of being able to get exactly what you want because you can fine tune the color and tone at your home. Do you ever finish on site, and if so, what percentage of your business is that?

(2) As for durability, can you point to an objective study that compared the durability of pre-finished and hardwood finished on site?

(3) Quartersawn is more expensive (and well worth it, I might add) and I see Vintage doesn't offer it. I believe there's a producer of pre-finished quartersawn in Western Canada but that's about it. If you want quartersawn and a Canadian product, you need to finish on-site. For those who haven't seen quartersawn oak, it is stunning. It has a more elegant grain than oak and also rays -- lighter areas that streak across the grain -- that give it almost a 3-dimensional quality. I'll have to post a photo later.

(4) It's true the places that rely mostly on pre-finished are so-so finishing on site, at least in my neck of the woods in London, Ontario. But we found another company that does mainly finishing on-site whose quality work has them in demand from the GTA to Windsor. You pay more but it's worth it.

(5) On your web site the only wood you advertise is Vintage. You may install others but its clear which brand is your bread and butter.

This subject was discussed here before, some like this, some like that.

Now most of our business is pre-finished & this is what our customers prefer. But 10 years & back, it was about 50-50. Then & now we can still see the difference in hardness of finish between both. Unless you use epoxy finish the on-site is softer. Also most of re-finishers don't have UV cured machines & there is not too many good finishers left. Here in GTA, demand of new on-site finish is really low. Custom homes, designers & many others prefer pre-finished. And you can also fine tune a custom colour with pre-finished :)

Not everybody likes quartersawn because it has a tight grain. Vintage has made tons of that product in engineered for specific US & Canadian projects. It's just not shown on their website. As for others there are a few that offer pre-finished quartersawn & one for sure can do custom colours to your specs.

We have a link on our website to Vintage because we like their products & never had problems with it. And of course I will recommend what is good. Just because you have finished on site floors doesn't mean everyone else will follow. Let's leave this decision up to the customers what they prefer. For simple 400 sq. ft. of flooring, 1 day in & out done or close to 1 week of dust & smell? And if you get the wrong person to finish it, expect to see: machine marks, edger marks, un-even stain, bubbles/dust in the finish :idea:

Every customer is unique & will like diff. things. As long as you are happy with what you picked, that's all that matters ;)

[nexposure]

This subject was discussed here before, some like this, some like that.

Now most of our business is pre-finished & this is what our customers prefer. But 10 years & back, it was about 50-50. Then & now we can still see the difference in hardness of finish between both. Unless you use epoxy finish the on-site is softer. Also most of re-finishers don't have UV cured machines & there is not too many good finishers left. Here in GTA, demand of new on-site finish is really low. Custom homes, designers & many others prefer pre-finished. And you can also fine tune a custom colour with pre-finished :)

Not everybody likes quartersawn because it has a tight grain. Vintage has made tons of that product in engineered for specific US & Canadian projects. It's just not shown on their website. As for others there are a few that offer pre-finished quartersawn & one for sure can do custom colours to your specs.

We have a link on our website to Vintage because we like their products & never had problems with it. And of course I will recommend what is good. Just because you have finished on site floors doesn't mean everyone else will follow. Let's leave this decision up to the customers what they prefer. For simple 400 sq. ft. of flooring, 1 day in & out done or close to 1 week of dust & smell? And if you get the wrong person to finish it, expect to see: machine marks, edger marks, un-even stain, bubbles/dust in the finish :idea:

Every customer is unique & will like diff. things. As long as you are happy with what you picked, that's all that matters ;)

A week of dust and smell for 400 sq. ft? We had three rooms done this year totaling close to 1,000 sq. ft. There was almost no dust (perhaps you aren't using the right equipment). You do smell the stain for up to a week but it's a minor inconvenience.

As for customizing color, there's a big difference between doing it in a factory and doing it in a home.

As for quartersawn, to be clear, Vintage does not make quartersawn oak hardwood flooring -- they make an engineered product whose top layer is quartersawn? Of course graining is a matter of personal preference. But most folks I know who see our floor wish they had known about quartersawn oak before the installed their floors -- the problem is most deal with companies that don't offer it.

As for durability, please point to studies that compare the two.

I do agree that there are companies who finish on site that do mediocre work at best -- many of them specialize in pre-finished and don't know what they're doing when they have to finish the wood themselves. But when you can find someone with the skill and craftmanship to finish floors, the quality simply surpasses anything I've seen in pre-finished.

[Agram]

Two years ago I ripped out all my old hardwood and had a guy install all new oak, it all looked great until the next summer. After I came back from holidays I noticed the floor was 'cuping' I could not close doors in bedrooms and at an angle you could actually see the wood was raised. It is driving me crazy after spending $7000 it looks really bad........what are my options and why did this happen

[patrob]

A week of dust and smell for 400 sq. ft? We had three rooms done this year totaling close to 1,000 sq. ft. There was almost no dust (perhaps you aren't using the right equipment). You do smell the stain for up to a week but it's a minor inconvenience.

As for customizing color, there's a big difference between doing it in a factory and doing it in a home.

As for quartersawn, to be clear, Vintage does not make quartersawn oak hardwood flooring -- they make an engineered product whose top layer is quartersawn? Of course graining is a matter of personal preference. But most folks I know who see our floor wish they had known about quartersawn oak before the installed their floors -- the problem is most deal with companies that don't offer it.

As for durability, please point to studies that compare the two.

I do agree that there are companies who finish on site that do mediocre work at best -- many of them specialize in pre-finished and don't know what they're doing when they have to finish the wood themselves. But when you can find someone with the skill and craftmanship to finish floors, the quality simply surpasses anything I've seen in pre-finished.

Even when sanding with best vacuum system there is always a little bit of dust. Stains & varnish stink for more than a week even when using water based. And the rooms are def. not usable for couple of days. We know a few good finishers & we work with one on daily basis which specializes mainly in floor finishing. Yes, finishing floors is a craftsmanship & not many know how to do it right.

The study comes from years of experience. We have replaced many on-site finished floors with pre-finished due to homeowner's dis-satisfaction with the quality. And we have seen thousands of square feet of both, so I don't take this lightly. You don't have to agree with my opinions.

Regarding Vintage engineered, the veneer layer is slightly thinner on Crafted but pretty much the same on 3/4" Solid Sawn. Engineered is the future in hardwood but only a few are ready for it. Most still prefer solid.

We will agree to disagree, so no point in arguing any further. I will let my customers decide what they prefer.

[patrob]

Two years ago I ripped out all my old hardwood and had a guy install all new oak, it all looked great until the next summer. After I came back from holidays I noticed the floor was 'cuping' I could not close doors in bedrooms and at an angle you could actually see the wood was raised. It is driving me crazy after spending $7000 it looks really bad........what are my options and why did this happen

How wide are the planks? And what is the RH level in the house? Cupping is a moisture problem. Your doors should be cut at least 1/2" to 3/4" above the floor, I don't think it cupped that much. It will def. be visible & shows mainly in summer in houses with no AC or de-humidifier. Most of the time it goes back to normal in heating season but may show some gapping.

[t3359]

I'm a consumer, not a retailer, and have had both finished and unfinished wood installed in our home, and of the two, I much preferred the unfinished. We had quartersawn oak installed and its appearance is stunning. More costly than pre-finished but worth it to us.

Hi nexposure...

Can you post a photo? I'm curious as to how the quartersawn oak looks.

thanks...
bjl

[jl001]

Patrob,
thanks for the great thread.
I would like to replace the main floor carpet with hardwood flooring.
We had decided to go with Vintage Maple Vienna.
Can you please PM with the details on who I can get decent deal for wood and installation?

I'm in west Mississauga, and ~500 sq.ft area (living, dinining, family room, and some corridor).
For installation, I would like carpet removal, hardwood install, and white primed quarter rounds.
Actually, my baseboard seems too short to accommodate hardwood and quarter rounds. Baseboard is likely needed to be replaced.
Are quarter rounds required even with new baseboards?

[LoDown]

Patrob,

Excellent information! So here's my challenge:

Stats:

Age: Older rowhouse home (1896);
Existing flooring - 3 layers made up of: Carpet - old 3/4 inch hardwood - 1.125 inch T&G wood with some gaps between the T&G planks
Problem 1: sag in flooring on second level from edge of home towards center of home.
Degree of sag: Example: 39 inch wide hallway sags 1.5-1.75 inches over the 39 inch span.
Problem 2: Squeaks and squeals...like a pig.

Questions:

I want to install new hardwood flooring. I assume the old 3/4 wood flooring should be removed:

what is the best method of leveling the floor without problems downstream?

what type and length of screw and screw spacing should be used on the original T&G under-layment to be assured of eliminating all squeaks?

do I need 3/4 plywood over top the old T&G before installing the new hardwood?


...should I even bother with leveling the floor with a house of this age? Home decorator's - feel free to chime in!

[patrob]

Patrob,
thanks for the great thread.
I would like to replace the main floor carpet with hardwood flooring.
We had decided to go with Vintage Maple Vienna.
Can you please PM with the details on who I can get decent deal for wood and installation?

I'm in west Mississauga, and ~500 sq.ft area (living, dinining, family room, and some corridor).
For installation, I would like carpet removal, hardwood install, and white primed quarter rounds.
Actually, my baseboard seems too short to accommodate hardwood and quarter rounds. Baseboard is likely needed to be replaced.
Are quarter rounds required even with new baseboards?

I will PM you with more info. Regarding the baseboards, you may not need quarter round but that all depends how straight your floors are. And on style & thickness of baseboard. The thicker the baseboard, the harder to install & follow the floor. For example, if there is a small hump/dip in the sub-floor, it will show under the baseboard. Some can be shaved to follow the floor. Quarter round can be substituted with doorstop style moulding, which looks much nicer.

http://www.shetler.com/Upload/Images/557.jpg

[nexposure]

Hi nexposure...

Can you post a photo? I'm curious as to how the quartersawn oak looks.

thanks...
bjl

I'd be happy to -- I'll take some photos this week.

[nexposure]

Even when sanding with best vacuum system there is always a little bit of dust. Stains & varnish stink for more than a week even when using water based. And the rooms are def. not usable for couple of days. We know a few good finishers & we work with one on daily basis which specializes mainly in floor finishing. Yes, finishing floors is a craftsmanship & not many know how to do it right.

The study comes from years of experience. We have replaced many on-site finished floors with pre-finished due to homeowner's dis-satisfaction with the quality. And we have seen thousands of square feet of both, so I don't take this lightly. You don't have to agree with my opinions.

Regarding Vintage engineered, the veneer layer is slightly thinner on Crafted but pretty much the same on 3/4" Solid Sawn. Engineered is the future in hardwood but only a few are ready for it. Most still prefer solid.

We will agree to disagree, so no point in arguing any further. I will let my customers decide what they prefer.

Thanks for the courteous exchange. There would be nothing to talk about if we all agreed.

Cheers.

[patrob]

Patrob,

Excellent information! So here's my challenge:

Stats:

Age: Older rowhouse home (1896);
Existing flooring - 3 layers made up of: Carpet - old 3/4 inch hardwood - 1.125 inch T&G wood with some gaps between the T&G planks
Problem 1: sag in flooring on second level from edge of home towards center of home.
Degree of sag: Example: 39 inch wide hallway sags 1.5-1.75 inches over the 39 inch span.
Problem 2: Squeaks and squeals...like a pig.

Questions:

I want to install new hardwood flooring. I assume the old 3/4 wood flooring should be removed:

what is the best method of leveling the floor without problems downstream?

what type and length of screw and screw spacing should be used on the original T&G under-layment to be assured of eliminating all squeaks?

do I need 3/4 plywood over top the old T&G before installing the new hardwood?

...should I even bother with leveling the floor with a house of this age? Home decorator's - feel free to chime in!

Houses like these need special attention :)

If you want all new flooring, remove everything to bare sub-floor. How is the condition of the floor under the carpet? Maybe it can be re-finished?
The best solutions for a sag buy one shoe with a taller heel :D (jk) But if you really want to fix it, you can level it out pretty much to zero with diff. thicknesses of plywood & one cover sheet of ply over whole sub-floor to make it look nice. Before installing additional sub-floor, you can pretty much fix all higher & lower spots. Use 2" or 2 1/2" sub-floor screws, 6-8" apart. If the sub-floor is plank boards, screw each board with 2 screws on joist about 1" from the edge to minimize cracking of the board. 3/8" ply is sufficient but 3/4" would be better. Even with 3/4" you still have to fix the sub-floor because it will show imperfections.

[LoDown]

Houses like these need special attention :)

If you want all new flooring, remove everything to bare sub-floor. How is the condition of the floor under the carpet? Maybe it can be re-finished?
The best solutions for a sag buy one shoe with a taller heel :D (jk) But if you really want to fix it, you can level it out pretty much to zero with diff. thicknesses of plywood & one cover sheet of ply over whole sub-floor to make it look nice. Before installing additional sub-floor, you can pretty much fix all higher & lower spots. Use 2" or 2 1/2" sub-floor screws, 6-8" apart. If the sub-floor is plank boards, screw each board with 2 screws on joist about 1" from the edge to minimize cracking of the board. 3/8" ply is sufficient but 3/4" would be better. Even with 3/4" you still have to fix the sub-floor because it will show imperfections.

Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately, floor under carpet is no good. It sounds like hiring someone to properly level everything will be expensive - I'll have to think it over:(.

Oh, and buying 1 shoe with taller heel won't work...unless I only walk in one direction:confused:....buts thanx for the option:D

[emjay]

Oh, and buying 1 shoe with taller heel won't work...unless I only walk in one direction:confused:....buts thanx for the option:D

Not if you moonwalk

[bird]

I'm planning to do a floating install using engineered wood in my basement. Once the Barricade is installed, what material would you recommend between the Barricade and engineered wood?

thanks

[patrob]

I'm planning to do a floating install using engineered wood in my basement. Once the Barricade is installed, what material would you recommend between the Barricade and engineered wood?

thanks

You mean something like Dricore, DeltaFL, etc.? Regular foam underlay will do or whatever is specified by the manufacturer.

[bird]

You mean something like Dricore, DeltaFL, etc.? Regular foam underlay will do or whatever is specified by the manufacturer.

yes... i guess ill go with the regular foam...

thanks

[Matrix_dot_ca]

HI Patrob,

what kind of transition piece should i put on

1. the front door.
2. carpet to laminate

Appreciate your help.

[WL1980]

I have an installer who came over to do an estimate for laminate floor installation. He charges around $1.70 per sq ft for carpet removal + floor and baseboard installation. But he also said our floor is not even so it could cost us up to $1500 to even a 500 sq ft apartment with concrete. He said there are cheaper solutions than using concrete and we probably only need to fill a few bumps here and there but he will have to remove the carpets to see. This way, it would cost us around $50/hr labor to fill the bumps. Do we have to even the floors and is the price quoted reasonable?

[patrob]

HI Patrob,

what kind of transition piece should i put on

1. the front door.
2. carpet to laminate

Appreciate your help.

Your front door threshold is flush with the hardwood/laminate? If it's slightly higher, simple quarter round or doorstop.
And a T-mould or laminate reducer for the carpet to laminate transition.

[patrob]

I have an installer who came over to do an estimate for laminate floor installation. He charges around $1.70 per sq ft for carpet removal + floor and baseboard installation. But he also said our floor is not even so it could cost us up to $1500 to even a 500 sq ft apartment with concrete. He said there are cheaper solutions than using concrete and we probably only need to fill a few bumps here and there but he will have to remove the carpets to see. This way, it would cost us around $50/hr labor to fill the bumps. Do we have to even the floors and is the price quoted reasonable?

Wow, I think we should be moving to Vancouver with those prices :D
You should remove the carpet yourself & save the $850 (that's pretty much the cost of the laminate floor). The carpet has to be removed to see if anything has to be done to the sub-floor. If it's really bad & you have to re-pour a thin slab, it's expensive. But if it's only a couple of spots, you can use self leveling compound which will cost less. West Coast pricing will be diff. than here in GTA.

[KevB]

Welcome to RFD :)

It's better if you remove everything down to the sub-floor. Fix all the squeaks & then lay new 1/4" ply min. to make everything flat. The Satin Finish multiplank because it's so thin, shows everything. So if you run parallel with the shiplap boards you will see every line of the boards in the new flooring. I recommend something more rigid like 9/16" or 3/4".


Okay, so everything has now been removed down to the 3/4" ship-lap subfloor. It looks fairly good but since it is just nailed down there are a lot of loose boards, etc.

Do I understand correctly that the best thing to do, is to screw down the existing subfloor boards to the joists, sink in all the nails, and then install the 3/4" plywood over that?

-Do I nail down the extra layer of 3/4" or screw it down? What sort of nails or screws would you recommend? Should I use longer screws at the joists to ensure that the plywood gets screwed to the joists?
-What is the suitable kind of plywood to use (i.e. grade, and regular, or tongue and groove)?
-Can I use a self-leveling compound to make the final plywood flat, or is that a bad idea? I think that a few humps and valleys will be carried through to the new plywood. A few of the floor joists have either bowed or sagged in the last 50 years :o

I had a friend suggest that I could use the cheapest grade of plywood and that I should just screw the new plywood into the joists through the subfloor planks without screwing the subfloor down first, then use some shorter screw to screw the plywood to the subfloor. He also suggested that I glue down the new plywood onto the subfloor (presumably with PL200?) to further minimize movement. I thought that might not be a great idea if we ever wanted to remove/replace the floor. What are your thoughts?

And thank you very much again! I would vote 5 stars again but apparently you can only vote once.

cheers

[PlugInBaby]

We're in the process of collecting supplies to do a large hardwood flooring project. Does anyone have a suggestion as to where we could find the best deal on Barricade subflooring? I'm halfway between Toronto and Ottawa, if that matters. Thanks!

[patrob]

Okay, so everything has now been removed down to the 3/4" ship-lap subfloor. It looks fairly good but since it is just nailed down there are a lot of loose boards, etc.

Do I understand correctly that the best thing to do, is to screw down the existing subfloor boards to the joists, sink in all the nails, and then install the 3/4" plywood over that?
Fix all the loose boards & screw down each of them to the joists first. Then install new plywood. It can be screwed or stapled. Screws have to be long enough to go through plywood, sub-floor & then at least 1" into the joist. So you have to figure out the length you need

-Do I nail down the extra layer of 3/4" or screw it down? What sort of nails or screws would you recommend? Should I use longer screws at the joists to ensure that the plywood gets screwed to the joists?
-What is the suitable kind of plywood to use (i.e. grade, and regular, or tongue and groove)?
Regular ply, no need for tongue & groove & no need for grade A.

-Can I use a self-leveling compound to make the final plywood flat, or is that a bad idea? I think that a few humps and valleys will be carried through to the new plywood. A few of the floor joists have either bowed or sagged in the last 50 years :o
All plywood seams & high spots should be sanded down to make it as flat as possible. Low spots should be shimmed up with shims or diff. thickness of ply (1/8", 1/4", etc.) before installing new ply.

I had a friend suggest that I could use the cheapest grade of plywood and that I should just screw the new plywood into the joists through the subfloor planks without screwing the subfloor down first, then use some shorter screw to screw the plywood to the subfloor. He also suggested that I glue down the new plywood onto the subfloor (presumably with PL200?) to further minimize movement. I thought that might not be a great idea if we ever wanted to remove/replace the floor. What are your thoughts?
The PL is up to you. It will make the floor become one piece & stronger. But you better fix everything prior installing the new plywood.

And thank you very much again! I would vote 5 stars again but apparently you can only vote once.

cheers

Here are the answers. And thanks for the vote ;)

[patrob]

We're in the process of collecting supplies to do a large hardwood flooring project. Does anyone have a suggestion as to where we could find the best deal on Barricade subflooring? I'm halfway between Toronto and Ottawa, if that matters. Thanks!

Try calling their diff. dealers for the best price.

[-=phelan=-]

patrob,

First of all this is a great thread. I'm new to the hardwood thread as my last house had the hardwood already done for me. I haven't done too much research on this yet but i figured i'd ask a pro like yourself so forgive my newbie questions :)

The main level has natural oak 2 1/4" strips throughout and also the staircase is finished in natural oak colour. (about 8-900 sq ft of wood) What would be a good estimate for refinishing it to make it look new again? And what would be the estimate to restain to make both stairs and the main level a darker shade?

I also have some light creaking noises on the hardwood near my powder room, is there a way i can go about fixing this? or would i have to tear up the whole floor?

Is there any problem with having installation done in the winter times (looking @ December/January)?

lastly any recommendations for installers in mississauga?

[patrob]

patrob,

First of all this is a great thread. I'm new to the hardwood thread as my last house had the hardwood already done for me. I haven't done too much research on this yet but i figured i'd ask a pro like yourself so forgive my newbie questions :)

The main level has natural oak 2 1/4" strips throughout and also the staircase is finished in natural oak colour. (about 8-900 sq ft of wood) What would be a good estimate for refinishing it to make it look new again? And what would be the estimate to restain to make both stairs and the main level a darker shade?

I also have some light creaking noises on the hardwood near my powder room, is there a way i can go about fixing this? or would i have to tear up the whole floor?

Is there any problem with having installation done in the winter times (looking @ December/January)?

lastly any recommendations for installers in mississauga?

Refinishing starts around $2 sq. ft. for natural & more for stain. Refinishing stairs is expensive especially if you have wooden pickets, you might have to think about two tone staircase.

The squeak could be fixed if accessible from underneath. But also depends what is causing it. The only problem installing in the winter is the dust, most installers will not cut outside. If you need an installer, you can contact us directly through our website :)

[-=phelan=-]

Refinishing starts around $2 sq. ft. for natural & more for stain. Refinishing stairs is expensive especially if you have wooden pickets, you might have to think about two tone staircase.

The squeak could be fixed if accessible from underneath. But also depends what is causing it. The only problem installing in the winter is the dust, most installers will not cut outside. If you need an installer, you can contact us directly through our website :)

I never thought about two tone staircase with natural tone pickets. What colours usually go well with that two tone staircase if the pickets are natural oak stain?

Unfortunately access from underneath wouldn't be possible because it's a builder finished basement ceiling beneath.

I suppose the installers would have to cut in the garage then.

[SaraLee]

Hi patrob, got a bit of an emergency here. My builder has at the last minute informed us that the hardwood oak flooring we picked isn't available. Our original choice is Avant Guard Red Oak in Choco Brown colour. Our replacement choice is Northern Woods Collection by Laurentian Hardwood. In your opinion, am I being downgraded significantly or are the two types of hardwood comparable?

[patrob]

I never thought about two tone staircase with natural tone pickets. What colours usually go well with that two tone staircase if the pickets are natural oak stain?

Unfortunately access from underneath wouldn't be possible because it's a builder finished basement ceiling beneath.

I suppose the installers would have to cut in the garage then.

This is the two tone staircase I was referring to:

http://www.cpstairmasters.com/staircase-pic-pinehurst1.jpg

There are still possible ways to fix a squeak. I guess you should start thinking about a good portable heater for the garage :D

[patrob]

Hi patrob, got a bit of an emergency here. My builder has at the last minute informed us that the hardwood oak flooring we picked isn't available. Our original choice is Avant Guard Red Oak in Choco Brown colour. Our replacement choice is Northern Woods Collection by Laurentian Hardwood. In your opinion, am I being downgraded significantly or are the two types of hardwood comparable?

Avant Guard is a fairly new company, so not very familiar with it. Laurentian has been around for longer, so I think you will be fine with it. Not really sure how both would compare in terms of quality with each other.

[Konowl]

Great thread!

Have a "colouring" question... I'm redoing the entire interior of my house, which is a very small bungalow on the lake (I'm talking 25 feet by 25 feet here). There are two bedrooms, and the living room/kitchen/dining is one big open concept place. I've done white Ikea cabinets and will be installing my own countertop, most likely black tile granite. I want to do laminte floors throughout the entire house except for the bathroom (whatever makes it look bigger, the better, you know what I'm talking about guys....)

To make the place "look" bigger, I'm somewhat concerned with which colour I use. I'm eyeing up the Golden Select on sale at Costco right now due to it's fantastic price, but the lightest colour it comes in is what I would call a medium-brown. Think this will look too dark?

[jingyu]

Hi,

I just bought 50 boxes of hardwood maple and each box comes with a sealed plastic wrap outside. Do I need to peel off all the plastic or punch a hole in each box till the plank to climate inside the rooms to be installed? Do I need to open all boxes and re-pile the plank aside? How many days I should wait before to start real DIY project? Thanks

[patrob]

Great thread!

Have a "colouring" question... I'm redoing the entire interior of my house, which is a very small bungalow on the lake (I'm talking 25 feet by 25 feet here). There are two bedrooms, and the living room/kitchen/dining is one big open concept place. I've done white Ikea cabinets and will be installing my own countertop, most likely black tile granite. I want to do laminte floors throughout the entire house except for the bathroom (whatever makes it look bigger, the better, you know what I'm talking about guys....)

To make the place "look" bigger, I'm somewhat concerned with which colour I use. I'm eyeing up the Golden Select on sale at Costco right now due to it's fantastic price, but the lightest colour it comes in is what I would call a medium-brown. Think this will look too dark?
Here are some pics of a townhouse we did that was 13 ft. wide x 25 ft. long in a med. dark brown wide plank hardwood.
As you can see it looks great & it does not make the space feel or look any smaller :)

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8736.JPG
http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8737.JPG
http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo-Gallery/IMG_8755.JPG

So choose a colour that you like best.

[patrob]

Hi,

I just bought 50 boxes of hardwood maple and each box comes with a sealed plastic wrap outside. Do I need to peel off all the plastic or punch a hole in each box till the plank to climate inside the rooms to be installed? Do I need to open all boxes and re-pile the plank aside? How many days I should wait before to start real DIY project? Thanks

If it's a tight plastic wrap, you have to open up the boxes for the wood to breathe/acclimatize. Auction?
Wait couple of days before installing.

[malyq]

Hi Patrob,

I plan to lay 3/8 inch engineered hardwood over 1/2 inch plywood which has been screwed in over 3/4 inch osb subfloor. Since I am installing the hardwood in the kitchen, I want to ensure that there is a good vapour barrier. At the suggestion of a rep at a big box store, I was told that I could use cork foam as underlayment. I plan to staple down the floor. However, from my research on the net, it seems that this type of underlayment is used on floating floors only. Do you forsee any problems with using the cork? Would it cause the staples to pull up?

Thanks!

[KevB]

Here are the answers. And thanks for the vote ;)



Thank you very much!

I will think on the PL. It seems to me that it may create more difficulties down the road, than the good it does now.

[emituofuo]

Patrob,

I love the dark brown wide plank in your pics. Would you mind let me know which product it is?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I plan to lay 3/8 inch engineered hardwood over 1/2 inch plywood which has been screwed in over 3/4 inch osb subfloor. Since I am installing the hardwood in the kitchen, I want to ensure that there is a good vapour barrier. At the suggestion of a rep at a big box store, I was told that I could use cork foam as underlayment. I plan to staple down the floor. However, from my research on the net, it seems that this type of underlayment is used on floating floors only. Do you forsee any problems with using the cork? Would it cause the staples to pull up?

Thanks!

If the kitchen is over a crawl space or very humid/damp area, then you need additional vapour barrier (floating installation). Otherwise, no need plus cork is not an adequate vapour barrier. If you do want to use cork, you will be better off if you glue down the cork to sub-floor, cover with flooring underlay (wax paper) & then staple the floors. But remember, you are adding couple of mm & for that you will need longer staples. And yes, cork is usually used for floating installations.

[patrob]

Patrob,

I love the dark brown wide plank in your pics. Would you mind let me know which product it is?

It's Vintage 5" Fumed White Oak (Old Oak) Solid Sawn in oil finish. It's also available in 7" planks.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/old_oak_fumed.jpg

[t3359]

Hi Patrob,

I'm about to continue my flooring (again)... I'm putting solid hardwood in the family room which has an exit to the backyard and is over a crawl space. I put 3/4" OSB on glued/screwed on top of the previous plywood.

I was reading that some people recommend sealing the OSB, or at least the places where I had cut it (e.g., Killz primer or the like). Do you think this is required? Also, what type of underlay would you recommend? I'm just worried about moisture from the crawl space and the back door.

thanks again!
bjl

[emituofuo]

Patrob,

Thanks for your reply. Got some more questions about Vintage fumed oak. They have a special kind called Edgeline which is built by micro strips glued together. I really like its unique look, but it's only available in 7" width. The problem is my living room is 10'*25', it's kind of narrow. So I'm not sure if the 7" plank will be too wide for the room that will make it looks weird? It'll be great if you can post some pics of Edgeline in the real-life projects since I can't find any on the web.

Thanks!

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I'm about to continue my flooring (again)... I'm putting solid hardwood in the family room which has an exit to the backyard and is over a crawl space. I put 3/4" OSB on glued/screwed on top of the previous plywood.

I was reading that some people recommend sealing the OSB, or at least the places where I had cut it (e.g., Killz primer or the like). Do you think this is required? Also, what type of underlay would you recommend? I'm just worried about moisture from the crawl space and the back door.

thanks again!
bjl

Solid hardwood is not the best choice for installation over crawl space. I don't really recommend any special underlays for nail down. If you do install some sort of vapour barrier, it will protect the hardwood somewhat but it will be full of nail holes. It may also cause others problems with the sub-floor, it may keep the moisture below (in plywood & OSB).

[patrob]

Patrob,

Thanks for your reply. Got some more questions about Vintage fumed oak. They have a special kind called Edgeline which is built by micro strips glued together. I really like its unique look, but it's only available in 7" width. The problem is my living room is 10'*25', it's kind of narrow. So I'm not sure if the 7" plank will be too wide for the room that will make it looks weird? It'll be great if you can post some pics of Edgeline in the real-life projects since I can't find any on the web.

Thanks!
The 7" will not be too wide. Here is the only pic I have of the Fumed Oak Edgeline. This wood looks better if installed across the room not length wise.
With Edgeline, you will not see the width of the plank anyways because of its "busy" look.

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/7144/img7856t.jpg

[emituofuo]

Thanks again Patrob. So about the finish of Vintage fumed oak, the sample I saw from the builder is a pearl finish. It looks like the cashmere finish from Mirage. It's oil finish a lower sheen than pearl? I love its feel in your pictures. What do you think the difference between these 2 finishes in terms of quality?

[mason]

Hi Patrob,
I have a similar problem to a previous poster re: vapor barriers.

I'm installing 3/4" ash in a loft above the garage over 5/8" osb, overlayed with 1/2" ext grade plywood. From an accessable space in one corner I can feel air movement and the vapor barrier is loose... so I have no idea what's going on around the rest of the garage ceiling, but based on the construction shortcuts I've found in my other projects, I'm betting the vapor barrier below the loft floor is not continous.
So I am laying 30lb felt on the subfloor, but am thinking a vapor retarding paint such as BIN on the subfloor would be a safer bet. Is this a good idea?

Thanks!

[Easto]

How hard is walnut?

My wife wants to get a natural walnut floor, but how does the hardness compare to maple or oak?

We are trying to find a floor that is going to be modern but will hold up to our 80lb dog.

[Tudval]

I haven't read something over 100 pages long since reading 'War and Peace', but this thread is so informative I could hardly skip any pages.

I am replacing the original 5/16 oak floor in a 50 year old house. It was nailed directly on the 3/4 subfloor wood planks. I am fixing the squeaks in this fairly even subfloor (with only minor dips mostly in places where boards are joined), by replacing some of the squeaking nails with 2 1/2 decking screws, which I berry about 1/4 inch (the subfloor board are fairly soft wood, probably pine)

And now for my question: Can I reinstall 3/4 oak in the same manner, just laying some construction paper over and staple/nail the hardwood directly into the subfloor planks? or would it be advisable to lay plywood on top, given the age of the house?

Cheers,

Tudval

[dutchca]

Unfortunately, we have been using the "wet" swiffer cleaning solution on our hardwood.

It has left a haze and the floors look terrible.

1) how do I get it off
2) what to clean the floors with after

Thanks.

[patrob]

Thanks again Patrob. So about the finish of Vintage fumed oak, the sample I saw from the builder is a pearl finish. It looks like the cashmere finish from Mirage. It's oil finish a lower sheen than pearl? I love its feel in your pictures. What do you think the difference between these 2 finishes in terms of quality?

Pearl finish is a lower sheen than semi-gloss & IMO it's more durable than oil finish. Oil finish is easier to touch up in case of damage by the homeowner but IMO it always looks a bit "dirty" but it does have that more natural look that you are seeing in the pics. Also oil finish is a little bit more expensive. Are you planning to upgrade to the fumed oak through the builder here in GTA?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,
I have a similar problem to a previous poster re: vapor barriers.

I'm installing 3/4" ash in a loft above the garage over 5/8" osb, overlayed with 1/2" ext grade plywood. From an accessable space in one corner I can feel air movement and the vapor barrier is loose... so I have no idea what's going on around the rest of the garage ceiling, but based on the construction shortcuts I've found in my other projects, I'm betting the vapor barrier below the loft floor is not continous.
So I am laying 30lb felt on the subfloor, but am thinking a vapor retarding paint such as BIN on the subfloor would be a safer bet. Is this a good idea?

Thanks!

Vapour barrier between cold & warm area like a floor above garage, should be installed on the outside (garage ceiling). You can spray some insulation foam around the walls & under the baseboard (the vapour barrier is most likely not sealed around the walls that's why you have the air movement) I don't recommend moisture barrier directly under solid hardwood.

[patrob]

How hard is walnut?

My wife wants to get a natural walnut floor, but how does the hardness compare to maple or oak?

We are trying to find a floor that is going to be modern but will hold up to our 80lb dog.

I assume you mean American Black Walnut? If so, it's very soft 1,010 on Janka hardness scale http://www.brazilianhardwood.com/images/jankahardness.gif
vs. Red Oak 1,290 & Maple 1,450. Unless you are referring to Brazilian Walnut (Ipe) which is one of the hardest species 3,680.

If you like the look of Black Walnut, then take a look at Vintage Fumed Oak, much better choice for your 80 lbs. dog :D

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_8160.JPG

[patrob]

I haven't read something over 100 pages long since reading 'War and Peace', but this thread is so informative I could hardly skip any pages.

I am replacing the original 5/16 oak floor in a 50 year old house. It was nailed directly on the 3/4 subfloor wood planks. I am fixing the squeaks in this fairly even subfloor (with only minor dips mostly in places where boards are joined), by replacing some of the squeaking nails with 2 1/2 decking screws, which I berry about 1/4 inch (the subfloor board are fairly soft wood, probably pine)

And now for my question: Can I reinstall 3/4 oak in the same manner, just laying some construction paper over and staple/nail the hardwood directly into the subfloor planks? or would it be advisable to lay plywood on top, given the age of the house?

Cheers,

Tudval

Thanks, glad you find it helpful & welcome to RFD :)

You don't have to add any sub-floor but if you have any additional sub-floor fix ups, it would be a good idea (3/8"). Yes, you can install your 3/4" oak directly over your orig. sub-floor.

[patrob]

Unfortunately, we have been using the "wet" swiffer cleaning solution on our hardwood.

It has left a haze and the floors look terrible.

1) how do I get it off
2) what to clean the floors with after

Thanks.

At least you were not using a steam mop or Murphy's Oil :D

Get the Vintage hardwood cleaning kit
http://www.vintageflooring.com/product/Accessories/img_mid/Cleaning%20Kit.jpg
You can actually order it directly from their webiste for $34.95 shipped to your house http://www.vintageflooring.com/ecommerce/product_detail.php?id=178
If you already have the mop, you can just get their cleaning solution for $6.99 shipped http://www.vintageflooring.com/ecommerce/product_detail.php?id=177

It will take couple of cleanings to totally get rid of the residue/film but works the best. Spray the solution on the mop not directly on the floors :idea:

[Easto]

I assume you mean American Black Walnut? If so, it's very soft 1,010 on Janka hardness scale http://www.brazilianhardwood.com/images/jankahardness.gif
vs. Red Oak 1,290 & Maple 1,450. Unless you are referring to Brazilian Walnut (Ipe) which is one of the hardest species 3,680.

If you like the look of Black Walnut, then take a look at Vintage Fumed Oak, much better choice for your 80 lbs. dog :D

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_8160.JPG

The walnut my wife likes is a light colour. It's multitoned, but the light parts are as light as oak. Similar to this: http://www.environmentalhomestore.com/images/products/large/ecotimberHardwood/ex1.jpg

http://www.floormall.com/images/TerraVerdeFlooring/domestic/natural-walnut.jpg

So you are suggesting going with Oak considering the size of dog we own?

[TheZodiac]

Hi Patrob ..great thread..very informative,
My wife and I are looking to do 700 sq feet of hardwood, have you ever heard or have an opinion on Kraus line of hardwood? As much as I'd like Mirage or Vintage is out of range for our budget.
Thanks

[patrob]

The walnut my wife likes is a light colour. It's multitoned, but the light parts are as light as oak. Similar to this: http://www.environmentalhomestore.com/images/products/large/ecotimberHardwood/ex1.jpg

http://www.floormall.com/images/TerraVerdeFlooring/domestic/natural-walnut.jpg

So you are suggesting going with Oak considering the size of dog we own?

That first pic looks like a lower grade of walnut because it's so "colourful".
If you find the Fumed Oak too dark, then there is not that many choices left. You could go with maple in 2nd or 3rd grade & it will also have a lot of colour variation which you like. You could also try going with exotic like Tigerwood http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/roomlarge/ss_ex_tigerwood.jpg

But with your 80lb. dog, walnut will get damaged faster because it's soft. The fumed white oak is much harder because of the fuming process. Maple will also be harder but because it's smooth, it will show damage faster than oak (the grain in oak helps to hide small dents). Have you considered handscraped hardwood?? It's the best choice for someone with a large dog. Or you can always go for laminate in the "walnut" look & it will be scratch resistant :)

[patrob]

Hi Patrob ..great thread..very informative,
My wife and I are looking to do 700 sq feet of hardwood, have you ever heard or have an opinion on Kraus line of hardwood? As much as I'd like Mirage or Vintage is out of range for our budget.
Thanks

We heard about it but never worked with it. What is your budget?? What species/colours do you prefer?

[TheZodiac]

We heard about it but never worked with it. What is your budget?? What species/colours do you prefer?

$3.50-4.50 sq foot, I have an Oak staircase stained chestnut... we were looking at Kraus Oak Gunstock color, we don't really want too dark because of dust is so easy to see. Could also use some color idea's if you have one.

Thanks

[jingyu]

I have done the preparation of OSB base floor for hardwood installation. I have few questions and need your advice.
1. There is a squrk from the joist but I am not able to fix it even I put many screws down and the noise is from one joist itself. How can I fix this?
2. There is a one spot that has a little bit bumped out but I can still push my hardwood down to floor if I force it. Do I need to thin the area to make it flat?
3. I went to Home depot and one guy said I need to put PL glue the first row (in my case it is not the last row near the wall but third row from the wall since the last row have some interference like registers and two from wood raised out from fireplace). Another guy from how depot told me not to put PL glue since it will prevent the wood expansion/contraction. Should I use glue or not use it? Also do I need to glue spline into groove since I need to use it to change the direction?

Thanks,

[flashy]

We are (or will be) in the market for flooring and installation, a few questions....

1. we will be taking possession of a new home build in early Februrary, is it possible to purchase the materials and take advantage of the HRTC prior to February 2010?

2. how soon should we be looking at acquiring the services of an installer?

3. the house is 3,300 sq ft we are looking to install hardwood on both levels in all areas except wet, is there a ball park figure we can expect? I understand this varies based on type of wood, am looking for a rough estimate for budgeting purposes.

4. any recommendations for services (materials and installation) in Whitby?


Any help is of course much appreciated!!

[KPK]

Hi,

I'm hoping someone can help me. We renovated our kitchen recently and put in a commercial laminate floor whose color closely matches that of Brazilian Oak.

http://www.mercier-wood-flooring.com/products/collections/exotic/brazilian-oak.html#couleur=amendoim

We now want to put in a new hardwood floor in our living/dining room area but are afraid that this color would be too dark for those rooms. Is there a wood which would be lighter in color and still tie in nicely colorwise with the kitchen floor? We were thinking of Galliano Red Oak but are afraid it's too orangy. Not sure a honey colored stain would work either.

[patrob]

I have done the preparation of OSB base floor for hardwood installation. I have few questions and need your advice.
1. There is a squrk from the joist but I am not able to fix it even I put many screws down and the noise is from one joist itself. How can I fix this?
2. There is a one spot that has a little bit bumped out but I can still push my hardwood down to floor if I force it. Do I need to thin the area to make it flat?
3. I went to Home depot and one guy said I need to put PL glue the first row (in my case it is not the last row near the wall but third row from the wall since the last row have some interference like registers and two from wood raised out from fireplace). Another guy from how depot told me not to put PL glue since it will prevent the wood expansion/contraction. Should I use glue or not use it? Also do I need to glue spline into groove since I need to use it to change the direction?

Thanks,

1) Is it a joist or is it the cross between the joist or a nail rubbing against the joist?
2) It's better to take off a little bit to make it smoother.
3) Don't use the PL on the first row, unless you are starting from tile or nosing. Top nail the first row against the baseboard or wall & angle in the tongue. When we reverse direction, nail the board first in the tongue along the line, insert the spline & nail it through the spline like regular tongue. Don't make the spline too loose.

[patrob]

We are (or will be) in the market for flooring and installation, a few questions....

1. we will be taking possession of a new home build in early Februrary, is it possible to purchase the materials and take advantage of the HRTC prior to February 2010?

2. how soon should we be looking at acquiring the services of an installer?

3. the house is 3,300 sq ft we are looking to install hardwood on both levels in all areas except wet, is there a ball park figure we can expect? I understand this varies based on type of wood, am looking for a rough estimate for budgeting purposes.

4. any recommendations for services (materials and installation) in Whitby?

Any help is of course much appreciated!!
1) Yes.
2) At least 2 months before or earlier. Many contractors are very busy & if they know a job is coming up, they can schedule accordingly.
3/4) Will the builder stain your stairs?

Let me know if you need more help.

[patrob]

Hi,

I'm hoping someone can help me. We renovated our kitchen recently and put in a commercial laminate floor whose color closely matches that of Brazilian Oak.

http://www.mercier-wood-flooring.com/products/collections/exotic/brazilian-oak.html#couleur=amendoim

We now want to put in a new hardwood floor in our living/dining room area but are afraid that this color would be too dark for those rooms. Is there a wood which would be lighter in color and still tie in nicely colorwise with the kitchen floor? We were thinking of Galliano Red Oak but are afraid it's too orangy. Not sure a honey colored stain would work either.
We just installed some Brazilian oak & it does turn more orangy/red. Galliano from Vintage looks like aged natural oak. It's more yellow than orange. If you want something light with no grain, go into maple in a light colour like Vintage Maple Yorkshire http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/builder-selected-maple-yorkshire.jpg

[ufoflag]

Mirage Hardwood floor question

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi patrob,

I want to upgrade to hardwood floor in dinning room.
(Size est. 240sqft)

I plan to use Mirage natural oak classic, 3 1/4" wide, middle grade.

Does anybody know how much will it cost per sqft. now?
There are three grades.

How about the other two grades: top, low?

Plus, Labor cost is est. $2 per sqft? Correct?

Thanks.

[KPK]

We just installed some Brazilian oak & it does turn more orangy/red. Galliano from Vintage looks like aged natural oak. It's more yellow than orange. If you want something light with no grain, go into maple in a light colour like Vintage Maple Yorkshire http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/builder-selected-maple-yorkshire.jpg

Since the humidity in our our house drops like a rock in the winter even with a humidifier constantly running, we thought we would use engineered floor instead. Would you have an idea what Vintage Maple Yorkshire would cost as an engineered wood on a sq foot basis with installation included (roughly)?

Thx!

[jingyu]

1) It looks like squeak is from the joist itself when any force on it and no rubbing spotted. Even I pull that joist from basement I can hear the squeak. How possible I can fix this?
3)Do I need to use PL on spline or just nail it even spline is not very tight?

Thanks.


1) Is it a joist or is it the cross between the joist or a nail rubbing against the joist?
2) It's better to take off a little bit to make it smoother.
3) Don't use the PL on the first row, unless you are starting from tile or nosing. Top nail the first row against the baseboard or wall & angle in the tongue. When we reverse direction, nail the board first in the tongue along the line, insert the spline & nail it through the spline like regular tongue. Don't make the spline too loose.

[patrob]

Mirage Hardwood floor question

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi patrob,

I want to upgrade to hardwood floor in dinning room.
(Size est. 240sqft)

I plan to use Mirage natural oak classic, 3 1/4" wide, middle grade.

Does anybody know how much will it cost per sqft. now?
There are three grades.

How about the other two grades: top, low?

Plus, Labor cost is est. $2 per sqft? Correct?

Thanks.
The middle grade should be just below $6 sq. ft. roughly, best to call Mirage dealer for pricing.
I do recommend going with 1st grade when choosing natural colour due to more colour variation in the lower grades unless you like the variation.
The cost for labour sounds correct.

[patrob]

Since the humidity in our our house drops like a rock in the winter even with a humidifier constantly running, we thought we would use engineered floor instead. Would you have an idea what Vintage Maple Yorkshire would cost as an engineered wood on a sq foot basis with installation included (roughly)?

Thx!

Yes, eng. might work better in your case.

[patrob]

1) It looks like squeak is from the joist itself when any force on it and no rubbing spotted. Even I pull that joist from basement I can hear the squeak. How possible I can fix this?
3)Do I need to use PL on spline or just nail it even spline is not very tight?

Thanks.

Remove all the nails & screws where the squeak is located. Pry the plywood from joist & shoot some PL. Then re-screw only, no more nails. No PL on spline, just nails. You can use carpenters glue & fasten the other board right away.

[jingyu]

May I ask why carpenter's glue is used on spline instead of PL? Is PL more stronger than carpenter's glue? Thanks.


Remove all the nails & screws where the squeak is located. Pry the plywood from joist & shoot some PL. Then re-screw only, no more nails. No PL on spline, just nails. You can use carpenters glue & fasten the other board right away.

[tandtmah]

Patrob,
I have a 13 year old home in Edmonton, we have 5/16" Bruce maple hardwood flooring on our main floor. Each winter there is one spot in our family room near a west facing window (by our gas fireplace), where 2 boards buckle. then in Spring the boards seem to shrink back to normal. This seems reverse of what should be happening correct ? I did have a professional repair the floor one year, in Spring he cut out an area down to the sub-floor, took a fan to the subfloor for 2 days, then re-installed new boards. The new boards were rested for about 2 weeks prior to installation, but the problem re-occurred the very next year.

I'm guessing it is condensation from the windows seeping onto the subfloor somehow (from behind the drywall and trim?).

I have 2 questions:

1. Does my explanation sound plausible?
2. If we wanted to replace our 5/16" with a harder wood in a 3/4" would our problems re-occur?, also if we did want to replace our flooring in the spring, we were thinking something along the lines of a cherry wood, could you offer a suggestion here and give an estimate on about 1200 sq feet?

The existing buckling I would not say is severe, just very noticeable.


Thanks a lot for your advice.

[ufoflag]

The middle grade should be just below $6 sq. ft. roughly, best to call Mirage dealer for pricing.
I do recommend going with 1st grade when choosing natural colour due to more colour variation in the lower grades unless you like the variation.
The cost for labour sounds correct.

Thanks patrob for your kindly help.
I bought 1st grade already yesterday.:razz:

[daveyflakes]

Hey guys,

I'm just starting to remove the carpet in my condo in preparation to install floating engineered hardwood.

The subfloor is concrete and the existing carpet is held in place by tack strips on the floors along the walls. My concern is that when I'm removing the tack strips I end up leaving a hole/crater where the cement nails were hammered in.

The holes left by the nails seem small enough to not worry about. But many times there is a crater left behind by the removal of the cement nail. These small craters range in diameter up to the size of a loonie or so, and range in depth up to a few millimeters.

Should I be concerned about these holes/craters? Would I need to fill them back in before installing the hardwood?

Thanks for any advice!

Cheers

Dave

[devilla]

You can buy filler at any hardware store for those holes and do it yourself.

I just wanted to pop in and warn everyone to stay far, far away from Mr. Sandless. They destroyed the oak floors in my loft. Now I have woodrot and cracks from their water-based treatment.
Now that I'm house poor, I did alot of research and I can apply a base which will take care of rot, mould, fungus and wood critter, then apply a modern polyurythane high gloss base, resulting in this!

http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/sf/inspiration/inspiration-high-gloss-black-floors-069826

It's the cheapest solution.

[vr6man25]

hey patrob,

can you help?
I am trying to install ash hardwood,with power mist stapler from princess auto.
I setup the compressor to 115 psi
Problem I am having is the staple is not going in all the way. I tried two different compressor's and no change. I adjust air pressure to the highest, and still noting.

What am I doing wrong? What do you suggest?

[meta-64]

Hi guys,

Need advice/comments on this.

My wife saw a photo from a design magazine (forgot the name of the mag), the designer uses bamboo flooring on one of the walls in the living room as an accent wall. It looks really nice and now she wants me to do the same.

So, how do I do this? Do I install it the usual way, except vertically? Please help!!!!

Thanks in advance,

[patrob]

May I ask why carpenter's glue is used on spline instead of PL? Is PL more stronger than carpenter's glue? Thanks.

Regular carpenters glue or white glue. PL is very thick, if you put too much, sometimes it very hard to put the boards together. PL is flexible, carpenters glue dries hard & strength depends on the cleanliness of the surface.

[patrob]

Patrob,
I have a 13 year old home in Edmonton, we have 5/16" Bruce maple hardwood flooring on our main floor. Each winter there is one spot in our family room near a west facing window (by our gas fireplace), where 2 boards buckle. then in Spring the boards seem to shrink back to normal. This seems reverse of what should be happening correct ? I did have a professional repair the floor one year, in Spring he cut out an area down to the sub-floor, took a fan to the subfloor for 2 days, then re-installed new boards. The new boards were rested for about 2 weeks prior to installation, but the problem re-occurred the very next year.

I'm guessing it is condensation from the windows seeping onto the subfloor somehow (from behind the drywall and trim?).

I have 2 questions:

1. Does my explanation sound plausible?
2. If we wanted to replace our 5/16" with a harder wood in a 3/4" would our problems re-occur?, also if we did want to replace our flooring in the spring, we were thinking something along the lines of a cherry wood, could you offer a suggestion here and give an estimate on about 1200 sq feet?

The existing buckling I would not say is severe, just very noticeable.


Thanks a lot for your advice.
The problem could be caused by water penetration from the window or maybe even fireplace vent. Have you checked the caulking outside around the window? Is the baseboard or drywall wet after rain? If not fixed properly, no matter what floors you put in, it will keep on happening. Water & wood don't mix.

Cherry wood looks nice but it's a softer species & shows damages easily. For pricing, you will have to call your local hardwood dealers.

[patrob]

Hey guys,

I'm just starting to remove the carpet in my condo in preparation to install floating engineered hardwood.

The subfloor is concrete and the existing carpet is held in place by tack strips on the floors along the walls. My concern is that when I'm removing the tack strips I end up leaving a hole/crater where the cement nails were hammered in.

The holes left by the nails seem small enough to not worry about. But many times there is a crater left behind by the removal of the cement nail. These small craters range in diameter up to the size of a loonie or so, and range in depth up to a few millimeters.

Should I be concerned about these holes/craters? Would I need to fill them back in before installing the hardwood?

Thanks for any advice!

Cheers

Dave

No need to fill them, don't worry.

[patrob]

hey patrob,

can you help?
I am trying to install ash hardwood,with power mist stapler from princess auto.
I setup the compressor to 115 psi
Problem I am having is the staple is not going in all the way. I tried two different compressor's and no change. I adjust air pressure to the highest, and still noting.

What am I doing wrong? What do you suggest?

Faulty stapler. Exchange it or return. Try Can. Tire maybe, some people like their staplers.
Those staplers operate around 80-90 PSI, 115 is way too high.

[patrob]

Hi guys,

Need advice/comments on this.

My wife saw a photo from a design magazine (forgot the name of the mag), the designer uses bamboo flooring on one of the walls in the living room as an accent wall. It looks really nice and now she wants me to do the same.

So, how do I do this? Do I install it the usual way, except vertically? Please help!!!!

Thanks in advance,
Screw 3/8" ply to the wall studs & install it the usual way with finishing nails.
Sometime ago we installed engineered hardwood on the ceiling :D Some designers should be shot for their ideas :twisted:

[meta-64]

Screw 3/8" ply to the wall studs & install it the usual way with finishing nails.
Sometime ago we installed engineered hardwood on the ceiling :D Some designers should be shot for their ideas :twisted:

Thanks patrob. I will do that.

[lamborghinireventon]

Hi Patrob,

since I am looking to go with dark coffee brown color..do you suggest bamboo flooring in terms of strength and durability. How would you compare Kempas wood to bamboo flooring? the price is obviously cheaper on Bamboo but is it worth the savings since I want the dark finish..

my dad is telling me that i would have to go with oak stairs and stain them darker..will it have lot of variation in the pattern if i go with kempas wood or bamboo??

Thanks,
Lamb.

[gonzilla]

Hi partob,

First of all, great job with this thread! I have learned so much from this thread.

My wife and I have pretty much decided to go with Vintage flooring in the upcoming new house (likely from you), and are now trying to decide on a colour. We have a small dog and a little boy on the way, so from what I've read so far it's sounds like Maple is out for wear and tear reasons and we also want the grain/stain to match better with the oak staircase from the builder.

I think we've narrowed the choices to Chariot Red Oak, Carleton Ash, and Hickory Winchester.

I've seen the sample pictures on the vintage website, but do you have any pictures like this (http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/8382769-post1464/) of jobs you have done with Chariot and Carleton?

Thanks!

[netcbc]

Monster thread, sorry couldn't get through it all, saw some mentioning of mirage?

I'm a complete newbie looking at hardwood for my condo, looking at bamboo with a dark color, burnt mocha or charcoal I believe it's called? Condo is in North York.

Best place for bamboo and contractors?

[Matrix_dot_ca]

I have a rectangular shaped room. How do i lay the laminate floors, lenghtwise or crosswise?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

since I am looking to go with dark coffee brown color..do you suggest bamboo flooring in terms of strength and durability. How would you compare Kempas wood to bamboo flooring? the price is obviously cheaper on Bamboo but is it worth the savings since I want the dark finish..

my dad is telling me that i would have to go with oak stairs and stain them darker..will it have lot of variation in the pattern if i go with kempas wood or bamboo??

Thanks,
Lamb.

For durability I would look at hardness of the wood but mainly at the quality of finish. Bamboo is softer than Kempas & will show damages more. Either way, for both of those products I would go with a known manufacturer. Kempas is an unstable wood & bamboo has to be finished right to optimize its strength. Most staircases are red oak or maple. Maple would be closer to exotic species but will also run you double the price or so. Oak, even in a dark stain, will still show some grain.

[jingyu]

Thanks Patrob, I have two more questions here. I have installed few rows already in family room. The joint with kitchen is a wide (3" width) stone like plank and my hardwood is leveled with the edge facing family room so I put hardwood plank vertically to the fake plastic tightly as homedepot guy told me and no T shape reducer required. I left a little bit wider gap in another side approximately 6/8" ~ 7/8" since no gap in kitchen joint side. Is this right? The Humility level is around 55% and I think the contraction will enlarge the gap in winter and I am worried about if the baseboard and quarter can cover it in winter season. Another question is the fireplace is parallel to my wood plank and I am not sure if I need to leave any gap between the fireplace hearth and if I do need to leave expansion gap how can I cover it after. Do I still use quarter which I think it will be ugly or something else more elegent? Thanks.


Regular carpenters glue or white glue. PL is very thick, if you put too much, sometimes it very hard to put the boards together. PL is flexible, carpenters glue dries hard & strength depends on the cleanliness of the surface.

[patrob]

Hi partob,

First of all, great job with this thread! I have learned so much from this thread.

My wife and I have pretty much decided to go with Vintage flooring in the upcoming new house (likely from you), and are now trying to decide on a colour. We have a small dog and a little boy on the way, so from what I've read so far it's sounds like Maple is out for wear and tear reasons and we also want the grain/stain to match better with the oak staircase from the builder.

I think we've narrowed the choices to Chariot Red Oak, Carleton Ash, and Hickory Winchester.

I've seen the sample pictures on the vintage website, but do you have any pictures like this (http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/8382769-post1464/) of jobs you have done with Chariot and Carleton?

Thanks!

Thanks :D

We just installed Carleton last week & we are currently finishing Chariot job. I will take some pics of the Carleton. But we do have pics of Chariot & Winchester on our website :) If you need more info, let me know.

[patrob]

Monster thread, sorry couldn't get through it all, saw some mentioning of mirage?

I'm a complete newbie looking at hardwood for my condo, looking at bamboo with a dark color, burnt mocha or charcoal I believe it's called? Condo is in North York.

Best place for bamboo and contractors?

Here are some dark Bamboo colours available from Vintage that come in 7" planks:
And if you are looking for an installer, contact us directly :)

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/yanzi_brdseye_bmboo.jpg
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/angkrW_brdseye_bmboo.jpg

[patrob]

I have a rectangular shaped room. How do i lay the laminate floors, lenghtwise or crosswise?

I believe it's in the basement correct, then go lengthwise. But it's really a personal preference.

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob, I have two more questions here. I have installed few rows already in family room. The joint with kitchen is a wide (3" width) stone like plank and my hardwood is leveled with the edge facing family room so I put hardwood plank vertically to the fake plastic tightly as homedepot guy told me and no T shape reducer required. I left a little bit wider gap in another side approximately 6/8" ~ 7/8" since no gap in kitchen joint side. Is this right? The Humility level is around 55% and I think the contraction will enlarge the gap in winter and I am worried about if the baseboard and quarter can cover it in winter season. Another question is the fireplace is parallel to my wood plank and I am not sure if I need to leave any gap between the fireplace hearth and if I do need to leave expansion gap how can I cover it after. Do I still use quarter which I think it will be ugly or something else more elegent? Thanks.

1st piece by the tile should be glued & nailed. Gap on both ends against the wall doesn't have to be as wide, 3/8" or 1/2" is enough (wood expands in width not in length) And on opposite side, wood around the fireplace hearth should also be glued. In cases like this, you do not leave any expansion, it will awful around the fireplace. Maintain your humidity around 45-55% (AC/humidifier) & you will have no problems.

[evanryan]

We are considering selling our home in the near future.
Currenlty we have carpet, that needs to be replaced.

Should we go ahead and have new carpet put down?
Should we put down laminate? or Hardwood?

Just wondering what buyers would like to see?
Would you have an issue if a good qualty laminate was down.

Problem is, we do not want to go through the expense of harwood, as we would really only be doing it to sell the house, and would not get much personal enjoyment out of it.

What would you do ?

[Matrix_dot_ca]

I believe it's in the basement correct, then go lengthwise. But it's really a personal preference.

Thanks patrob! Very helpful thread indeed.

[jingyu]

Are you saying the gap 3/8 or 1/2" is for the length direction or apply just hardwood width direction or both. If I glued the plank with PL, how possible the wood can do expansion/contraction especially around fireplace hearth. Again, Home depot guy told me no glue used except for steps. I will try post some photos tomorrow. What I can do for the big gap (6/8") I left in the length direction? I really want to make sure I did my DIY right. Thanks.


1st piece by the tile should be glued & nailed. Gap on both ends against the wall doesn't have to be as wide, 3/8" or 1/2" is enough (wood expands in width not in length) And on opposite side, wood around the fireplace hearth should also be glued. In cases like this, you do not leave any expansion, it will awful around the fireplace. Maintain your humidity around 45-55% (AC/humidifier) & you will have no problems.

[netcbc]

Thanks for the pics, what would you recommend for a condo? It'll definitely be high traffic as it'll be the living room and we hold gatherings weekly to biweekly so spills are gonna happen? Any reason why you're exclusive to Vintage as opposed to 4-5 brands as some others do?


Here are some dark Bamboo colours available from Vintage that come in 7" planks:
And if you are looking for an installer, contact us directly :)

[lamborghinireventon]

For durability I would look at hardness of the wood but mainly at the quality of finish. Bamboo is softer than Kempas & will show damages more. Either way, for both of those products I would go with a known manufacturer. Kempas is an unstable wood & bamboo has to be finished right to optimize its strength. Most staircases are red oak or maple. Maple would be closer to exotic species but will also run you double the price or so. Oak, even in a dark stain, will still show some grain.

Thanks Patrob for your response..it has puzzled me more now whether to go with Bamboo?? I always thought and even when spoke to hardwood sellers that Bamboo is quite stain and moisture resistant and doesn't warp easily..do you have any prices or manufacturers that you suggest on bamboo??

Re: Kempas I am looking at Manulife company..any thoughts on their product??

Thanks, Lamb.

[Easto]

My main level of my house is going to be almost 1300sq feet. Half tile and half wood. I also have a wood stair case and I am sure as time does on we will put wood on the whole upper level.

In the summer I run the A/C all the time, but in the winter I find homes are pretty dry. Would you recommend a humidifier to anyone with wood floors? Should it be tied in with the furnace?

How about dehumidifiers?

[lamborghinireventon]

Thanks Patrob for your response..it has puzzled me more now whether to go with Bamboo?? I always thought and even when spoke to hardwood sellers that Bamboo is quite stain and moisture resistant and doesn't warp easily..do you have any prices or manufacturers that you suggest on bamboo??

Re: Kempas I am looking at Manulife company..any thoughts on their product??

Thanks, Lamb.

Sorry correction: Kempas co is Manuflow

[patrob]

We are considering selling our home in the near future.
Currenlty we have carpet, that needs to be replaced.

Should we go ahead and have new carpet put down?
Should we put down laminate? or Hardwood?

Just wondering what buyers would like to see?
Would you have an issue if a good qualty laminate was down.

Problem is, we do not want to go through the expense of harwood, as we would really only be doing it to sell the house, and would not get much personal enjoyment out of it.

What would you do ?
Don't waste money on new carpet. Next cheapest solution would be single plank laminate. But people generally love hardwood but it is more expensive.

But also depends on the house. Sometimes none of it might be worth it. Hardwood will make the house sell faster but not necessarily increase the value of your house. In some cases it might be easier to drop the price by couple thousands & not have to worry about anything.

[patrob]

Are you saying the gap 3/8 or 1/2" is for the length direction or apply just hardwood width direction or both. If I glued the plank with PL, how possible the wood can do expansion/contraction especially around fireplace hearth. Again, Home depot guy told me no glue used except for steps. I will try post some photos tomorrow. What I can do for the big gap (6/8") I left in the length direction? I really want to make sure I did my DIY right. Thanks.

Yes wood expands & contracts with changes of humidity. But if you maintain your RH levels, it will minimize the expansion. PL is a flexible glue, it will let the plank move if it has to. The gap can be covered by baseboard plus quarter round. You may have to go with a thicker baseboard & 3/4" quarter round.

[patrob]

Thanks for the pics, what would you recommend for a condo? It'll definitely be high traffic as it'll be the living room and we hold gatherings weekly to biweekly so spills are gonna happen? Any reason why you're exclusive to Vintage as opposed to 4-5 brands as some others do?

Vintage is our preferred manufacture that we work with. They make exquisite products that are one of the best in the market. We highly recommend it to eliminate problems for our customers, homeowners & ourselves. We don't like complaints, so we work with the best. Of course there are other brands out there but they are not comparable. You may want to look into laminate for high traffic, more scratch resistant & more durability. Bamboo will still get damaged as regular hardwood.

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob for your response..it has puzzled me more now whether to go with Bamboo?? I always thought and even when spoke to hardwood sellers that Bamboo is quite stain and moisture resistant and doesn't warp easily..do you have any prices or manufacturers that you suggest on bamboo??

Re: Kempas I am looking at Manulife company..any thoughts on their product??

Thanks, Lamb.


Sorry correction: Kempas co is Manuflow

You have to tread bamboo as regular hardwood in every sense. Most of bamboos are engineered flooring which will not or not supposed to warp. So I would not be worried about that. Sorry but I have never heard of Manuflow.

[patrob]

My main level of my house is going to be almost 1300sq feet. Half tile and half wood. I also have a wood stair case and I am sure as time does on we will put wood on the whole upper level.

In the summer I run the A/C all the time, but in the winter I find homes are pretty dry. Would you recommend a humidifier to anyone with wood floors? Should it be tied in with the furnace?

How about dehumidifiers?

Your AC is your de-humidifier, in winter if you need a de-humidifier, you use a portable one. But more likely you will need a humidifier in winter which for best results should be central (furnace mounted). Humidifiers are highly recommend in winter.

[Dr.Know]

Your AC is your de-humidifier, in winter if you need a de-humidifier, you use a portable one. But more likely you will need a humidifier in winter which for best results should be central (furnace mounted). Humidifiers are highly recommend in winter.

On this note, this past summer I had a pretty bad humidity problem in my house (wayyy too humid) and I was not knowledgable on what to do. Needless to say, my Vintage hardwood began to swell a little due to too much moisture. I've slowly gotten the humidity down in the house using a dehumidifier in the basement non-stop for the past few months (still a bit high with the recent rain). Eventually when winter hits the the moisture from the house is gone, will the hardwood go back to it's original state of how it looked when it was first installed? Does the excess moisture damage the hardwood at all?

[patrob]

On this note, this past summer I had a pretty bad humidity problem in my house (wayyy too humid) and I was not knowledgable on what to do. Needless to say, my Vintage hardwood began to swell a little due to too much moisture. I've slowly gotten the humidity down in the house using a dehumidifier in the basement non-stop for the past few months (still a bit high with the recent rain). Eventually when winter hits the the moisture from the house is gone, will the hardwood go back to it's original state of how it looked when it was first installed? Does the excess moisture damage the hardwood at all?

Usually it goes back to normal but it might show some gapping in winter, especially over heat runs. Wood doesn't like drastic changes in humidity. Excessive humidity may expand the wood too much & then when it dries, it might show some stress cracks on some boards (usually on tight grain boards). But no significant damage should be caused. You may also have some squeaks & creaks.

[patrob]

For anyone interested in installing hardwood floors in their house, Vintage 3/4" Solid Sawn Engineered
IMO it is the most stable product & will not shrink, expand or cup :!:
Solid Sawn is one of the products you should be looking into if you have concerns about proper RH levels.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/solidsawn_chart.jpg

[enjoku]

Would it be really expensive if I upgrade from Oak to Maple, considering that my house is under construction right now and one of the options from the builder is Maple flooring.

[drrs]

Hi Patrob
Interesting points of view.My only question is please tell me where can I find different hardwood stair treads with different shape(round in one side for example).Maybe you know because I saw on your website stair with nice trades installed and I am wondering if you can tell me your source (and the price if is possible).Thank you and keep the good job

[patrob]

Would it be really expensive if I upgrade from Oak to Maple, considering that my house is under construction right now and one of the options from the builder is Maple flooring.

Ask the builder but retail price between oak & maple is less than 10% difference but builders have huge mark ups :D

[patrob]

Hi Patrob
Interesting points of view.My only question is please tell me where can I find different hardwood stair treads with different shape(round in one side for example).Maybe you know because I saw on your website stair with nice trades installed and I am wondering if you can tell me your source (and the price if is possible).Thank you and keep the good job

A good friend of ours makes custom stair tread for us. But any stairs & railings shops will be able to help you. Prices will vary on the shape of the treads but they are not cheap if you add them up.

[MaxwellMcGee]

Patrob, Fantastic Thread!! Thanks for doing this!

I read through the first 30 pages or so, then ran out of time so I apologize if this question has been asked already.


I'm thinking of changing the flooring in my condo to engineered hardwood. Currently there are laminate floors in place.

Background: I'm only planning on living in this unit for another 2-4 years max. Currently it's just me an my wife -- no kids (none planned in the next 2-4 years) and no pets. We also strictly enforce a no shoes in the house policy (esp. no high heels).

Are there any more budget-friendly hardwood manufacturers you could recommend that will hold up well for the next 5 years or so? I'm willing to trade a shorter lifespan for a cheaper price, since I won't be the one enjoying the floors for the next 30 years anyway.

Also, can you recommend any stores/installers that service downtown Toronto condos?

[emituofuo]

Ok, this might be a stupid question. I've always heard that people think Maple is a more expensive wood than Oak. Recently I checked the price of Mirage from one of its dealer. Mirage's Red Oak is actually more expensive than Maple which makes me really confused. Patrob, what's your opinion on this?

[Easto]

patrob, what company makes the fumed oak flooring?

I sent my wife to look at some this week while I was working. When she got to the store they sales person had no clue what fumed oak was.

Is there a specific company that we can mention? Maybe they can order some for us if that's what we want.

[patrob]

Patrob, Fantastic Thread!! Thanks for doing this!

I read through the first 30 pages or so, then ran out of time so I apologize if this question has been asked already.

I'm thinking of changing the flooring in my condo to engineered hardwood. Currently there are laminate floors in place.

Background: I'm only planning on living in this unit for another 2-4 years max. Currently it's just me an my wife -- no kids (none planned in the next 2-4 years) and no pets. We also strictly enforce a no shoes in the house policy (esp. no high heels).

Are there any more budget-friendly hardwood manufacturers you could recommend that will hold up well for the next 5 years or so? I'm willing to trade a shorter lifespan for a cheaper price, since I won't be the one enjoying the floors for the next 30 years anyway.

Also, can you recommend any stores/installers that service downtown Toronto condos?

Thank you :)
You can always take a look at HD or Rona for more budget friendly engineered hardwood options, I know they do carry it or any hardwood flooring store should have diff. options.

I know Vintage just came out with a new product called 'U-LOC' Engineered Hardwood that is DIY friendly & clicks together. You can save some money by removing the old flooring yourself & try doing the installation yourself. But if you still need an installer, we install all over GTA incl. downtown :cheesygri

[patrob]

Ok, this might be a stupid question. I've always heard that people think Maple is a more expensive wood than Oak. Recently I checked the price of Mirage from one of its dealer. Mirage's Red Oak is actually more expensive than Maple which makes me really confused. Patrob, what's your opinion on this?

Maple generally is more expensive than oak. Maybe that particular dealer had a special price on maple & has it in stock, therefore can lower the price if he needs to get rid of it.

[patrob]

patrob, what company makes the fumed oak flooring?

I sent my wife to look at some this week while I was working. When she got to the store they sales person had no clue what fumed oak was.

Is there a specific company that we can mention? Maybe they can order some for us if that's what we want.

Vintage makes Fumed Oak www.vintageflooring.com

[Peggy3]

I just finished a walk through with the builder on a new house with hardwood floors (maple) in the kitchen/dining room. There were a few dents/scratches in the flooring which I asked the builder to correct. There was also some issues with the cabinetr, which required quite a bit of carpentry work to repair.

I recently went to visit my house again and found that the original areas where there were dents/chips in the HW have been mostly fixed (I think they removed those pieces and glued in new pieces because there are a few drips of adhesive around the pieces), but I found LOTS of new scratches on the flooring in the area around the cabinetry that was being repaired - I think the workers scratched my floors!!! erghhhh!

I am thinking that if I ask the builder to repair all the scratches, then there will be LOTS of pieces of HW that need to be removed, and lots of pieces that will be glued in place for the repair. I am annoyed because I don't want my new house to already have scratches in the floors :( My question is: Will that compromise the longevity of the floor by attaching so many pieces in the floor with adhesive like that???

Thanks for you help. Love readind all the good advice on RFD forums!

[patrob]

I just finished a walk through with the builder on a new house with hardwood floors (maple) in the kitchen/dining room. There were a few dents/scratches in the flooring which I asked the builder to correct. There was also some issues with the cabinetr, which required quite a bit of carpentry work to repair.

I recently went to visit my house again and found that the original areas where there were dents/chips in the HW have been mostly fixed (I think they removed those pieces and glued in new pieces because there are a few drips of adhesive around the pieces), but I found LOTS of new scratches on the flooring in the area around the cabinetry that was being repaired - I think the workers scratched my floors!!! erghhhh!

I am thinking that if I ask the builder to repair all the scratches, then there will be LOTS of pieces of HW that need to be removed, and lots of pieces that will be glued in place for the repair. I am annoyed because I don't want my new house to already have scratches in the floors :( My question is: Will that compromise the longevity of the floor by attaching so many pieces in the floor with adhesive like that???

Thanks for you help. Love readind all the good advice on RFD forums!

Before you move in, you have to point out to the builder the new damages. It's ok to replace, plank here & plank there but if you are starting to remove larger sections & a lot of them have to be glued in, it will affect the expansion & contraction of the floor. The glued planks will stay in place, where the rest will have place to move. It should not affect the structural integrity of the floor if done correctly.

[ilovetrouble]

I thought I would start The OFFICIAL Hardwood Flooring Thread, since there are many people always asking for hardwood flooring advice/help.

Since I have knowledge on the topic, just ask away if you have any specific questions ;)

Great thread. Thanks for posting!

I'm living in a TINY condo right now (500 sq ft). It has black painted concrete floors throughout and is jammed full of furniture.

I want to have a high grade laminate or engineered h/w floor installed soon (plus I'll need to do a ceramic tile floor in bth-room) however I have been putting it off as I have sooo much furniture. I'm getting ready to sell and know that with new floors, the place will show 100% better.

How do contractors handle this amount of furniture & installation?
Should I expect additional costs because of it? I live alone so moving most of it by myself would be impossible.
Also, how long would an installation like this take? Can you install bamboo floors over concrete?

Any advice is appreciated!

Cheers,
ihearttrouble

[RomanDesign]

Sorry for the noob questions, but this thread is so long, I could not find what I was looking for, though some of those sure were answered here...

I'm moving into a new house in 2 weeks in Oakville where I want to replace carpeting with hardwood (roughly 900 sq.ft. or a bit more)

1. What are current best deals and stores for cheap and decent quality hardwood and underlying padding? I did not find many resources on that. We like cherry and dark red colours. What is considered a good deal in terms of price per sq.ft.? So far I see $3.70 to $4.50 on specials but I can't tell if the product quality is good.

2. What kind of wood would you recommend? I was leaning to Oak as hard and not too expensive, but I don't know much about it.

3. How much should installation cost per sq.f. be (with padding)?

4. What padding should I use? Do I need it at all? Is it expensive?

5. If I install it myself, is there a good DIY guide? I don't like click-and-lock (users complain of creaks), so I'll have to buy a nailing machine (rent would be too expensive as I can only work on this evenings and weekends). How much a machine would be and where to buy it? I can borrow compressor from a friend of mine.

I appreciate any advice! Thanks!

[Easto]

Ok, I may be slow but ...... where do I find the fumed oak on the vintage website?

[jollygreengiant]

I'd be grateful for patrob's or anyone else's input ...

We're trying to decide between the following options. Our area is 350 sq feet, so we're not talking huge spaces. All prices are for 3 1/4" Maple planks, and in a dark brown colour (godiva/mocha/vienna). We have a young family so wear & tear is high.

1. Vintage Estate 6.31
2. Vintage Select V 5.85
3. Superior Select & Better 5.98
4. Superior Select 4.89
5. Mirage 6.20 (whatever their grade is ???)

From what I can tell from my research is that Vintage & Mirage are better brands. In a dark stain, maybe mid-grade is good enough.

Do we put out the extra money for the better or best product? The difference from the most expensive to cheapest product of the bunch is $500.

Is it surprising here that Vintage is more expensive than Mirage?

If we go with Vintage, is their Select V grade good "enough" - considering we are going with a dark colour?

Thank you all. If anyone has input on their search / prices I'd love to hear your perspective also.

[patrob]

Great thread. Thanks for posting!

I'm living in a TINY condo right now (500 sq ft). It has black painted concrete floors throughout and is jammed full of furniture.

I want to have a high grade laminate or engineered h/w floor installed soon (plus I'll need to do a ceramic tile floor in bth-room) however I have been putting it off as I have sooo much furniture. I'm getting ready to sell and know that with new floors, the place will show 100% better.

How do contractors handle this amount of furniture & installation?
Should I expect additional costs because of it? I live alone so moving most of it by myself would be impossible.
Also, how long would an installation like this take? Can you install bamboo floors over concrete?

Any advice is appreciated!

Cheers,
ihearttrouble
All the small stuff & accessories will have to be packed by the homeowner. The contractor/installer will take care of the furniture upon agreement most likely at an additional charge. Depends on the amount of furniture, but most likely the installation will take 2 days. Because of the painted concrete, you can only install floating floor. And this can be any type of floor like laminate or engineered hardwood incl. bamboo. You also need to find out from the condo management what underlay is required.

[patrob]

Sorry for the noob questions, but this thread is so long, I could not find what I was looking for, though some of those sure were answered here...

I'm moving into a new house in 2 weeks in Oakville where I want to replace carpeting with hardwood (roughly 900 sq.ft. or a bit more)

1. What are current best deals and stores for cheap and decent quality hardwood and underlying padding? I did not find many resources on that. We like cherry and dark red colours. What is considered a good deal in terms of price per sq.ft.? So far I see $3.70 to $4.50 on specials but I can't tell if the product quality is good.

2. What kind of wood would you recommend? I was leaning to Oak as hard and not too expensive, but I don't know much about it.

3. How much should installation cost per sq.f. be (with padding)?

4. What padding should I use? Do I need it at all? Is it expensive?

5. If I install it myself, is there a good DIY guide? I don't like click-and-lock (users complain of creaks), so I'll have to buy a nailing machine (rent would be too expensive as I can only work on this evenings and weekends). How much a machine would be and where to buy it? I can borrow compressor from a friend of mine.

I appreciate any advice! Thanks!

1. Every store will offer diff. products/specials. You have to visit couple of stores to see what you like. Anything below $4.50 will be a lower quality product.

3. No padding required for nail down floors. Installation cost will vary on type of wood, type of installation & contractor.

5. Home Depot seminars would be your best bet or you can Google for DIY videos. The pneumatic nailer will cost you from $200 plus, you also need a finish nailer, table/mitre saw & couple of small handy tools.

[patrob]

Ok, I may be slow but ...... where do I find the fumed oak on the vintage website?

It's under Solid Sawn Domestic Colours :) http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_ss_ex_2.php

[patrob]

I'd be grateful for patrob's or anyone else's input ...

We're trying to decide between the following options. Our area is 350 sq feet, so we're not talking huge spaces. All prices are for 3 1/4" Maple planks, and in a dark brown colour (godiva/mocha/vienna). We have a young family so wear & tear is high.

From what I can tell from my research is that Vintage & Mirage are better brands. In a dark stain, maybe mid-grade is good enough.

Do we put out the extra money for the better or best product? The difference from the most expensive to cheapest product of the bunch is $500.

Is it surprising here that Vintage is more expensive than Mirage?

If we go with Vintage, is their Select V grade good "enough" - considering we are going with a dark colour?

Thank you all. If anyone has input on their search / prices I'd love to hear your perspective also.

I would def. exclude Superior. After few recent installations, we noticed that their maple is softer than others! It's like they are using lower quality lumber for their product. It just seems more delicate, not worth the saving.

The other two are fine. Mirage Exclusive grade is a mix of two grades vs. Vintage Estate grade which is clear & Vintage Select-V is like Mirage Exclusive. You mentioned a darker colour, Select-V might be just fine & it's also locally made. Pricing will depend on the dealer/store. Vintage/Mirage should be similarly priced.

[Easto]

First Question:

SOLID SAWN DOMESTIC COLORS

Natural Maple
Natural Hickory
Maple Oxford
Hickory Chivas
Hickory Thames
Maple Morocco
Maple Windsor
Natural Black Walnut
Merbau Tudor
Hickory Winchester
Hickory Old Mission
White Oak Old Oak
Maple Godiva
White Oak Edgeline
White Oak Fineline
Maple Rembrandt
Hickory Notre Dame
White Oak Black Oak
Maple Taboo

Which one? The two floor suppliers have no idea what I am talking about when I mention Fumed Oak, so I assume it is listed as some other name.

Second Question:

What do you think about Tigerwood? My wife really likes the colour variation in it. The supplier is having the Tigerwood on sale this week as well which is nice.

Do you have much experience with it? How does it hold up? Any reason why would you convince someone not to use it?

[patrob]

First Question:

SOLID SAWN DOMESTIC COLORS

Natural Maple
Natural Hickory
Maple Oxford
Hickory Chivas
Hickory Thames
Maple Morocco
Maple Windsor
Natural Black Walnut
Merbau Tudor
Hickory Winchester
Hickory Old Mission
White Oak Old Oak
Maple Godiva
White Oak Edgeline
White Oak Fineline
Maple Rembrandt
Hickory Notre Dame
White Oak Black Oak
Maple Taboo

Which one? The two floor suppliers have no idea what I am talking about when I mention Fumed Oak, so I assume it is listed as some other name.

Second Question:

What do you think about Tigerwood? My wife really likes the colour variation in it. The supplier is having the Tigerwood on sale this week as well which is nice.

Do you have much experience with it? How does it hold up? Any reason why would you convince someone not to use it?

All 4 I highlighted are Fumed White Oak & the dealer should have known that :rolleyes:

The one you probably want is the Old Oak

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/old_oak_fumed.jpg

The Black Oak is the same but selected only with the dark black boards

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/whiteoak-blackoak.jpg

Tiger wood is nice but not many people are brave enough for it :D
It has a lot of colour variation which some people don't like but that's what gives its beauty.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/roomlarge/ss_ex_tigerwood.jpg

Hope this helps ;)

[jingyu]

I came to the middle phase of my DIY project where living room meet the hall way. The hall way have some angles planks along the upstair. The width when hall way meet the wall of living room is very narrow(less 1"). Shouls I cut the last piece in hall way to a small piece so I can use a full plan in the first row in living room or keep going? My another concern is that if I use PL glue in the first row of the living room, will it prevent the whole floor expension/contraction in the both dicrection and only one way to go? That why I only use glue in the joint with stair but not other place even the fireplace. How to use PL glue wisely and still allow the wood floor expension/contract? Thanks,

[patrob]

I came to the middle phase of my DIY project where living room meet the hall way. The hall way have some angles planks along the upstair. The width when hall way meet the wall of living room is very narrow(less 1"). Shouls I cut the last piece in hall way to a small piece so I can use a full plan in the first row in living room or keep going? My another concern is that if I use PL glue in the first row of the living room, will it prevent the whole floor expension/contraction in the both dicrection and only one way to go? That why I only use glue in the joint with stair but not other place even the fireplace. How to use PL glue wisely and still allow the wood floor expension/contract? Thanks,

No need to use glue around the walls. Glue is necessary only on/around transition pieces, doorways, nosings, stairs. You don't install narrow piece in archways between hallways & rooms to start continuous room with a full piece. Just keep going & rip the piece along the wall. Keep your RH levels to the manufacturers specs & don't worry about the expansion/contraction of the wood. I hope this is what you meant.

[glenn8]

I tried searching the thread but there are just too many posts to go through. :)

Anyhow, my question is pre-finished wood VS finishing on site. I have the option to do either. Which one is the "better" choice? The only difference I can see is that finishing on site fills in the gaps for you, but probably factory finishes are more durable. Also is one option more overall expensive than the other? Any opinions?
Thanks!

[PlugInBaby]

We're in the process of installing a subfloor in the house we just bought. It has an active sump pump so we went with the Dricore flooring. I'd read somewhere that they recommend installing some sort of vents around the room to ventilate the air pocket underneath. Anyone have any helpful information regarding this?

BTW, as a tip for anyone else with a similar project, we bought all the Dricore in lots of 24 pieces with the $30 off $150 coupon they have in the Lowes Flyer at the moment. If you haven't noticed this deal yet, it's certainly saved us a ton with all the purchases we've made in the past few weeks! I believe the flyer is changing in the next couple of days but the coupon is good until the 23rd so grab up a bunch on flyers before they're gone :)

[patrob]

I tried searching the thread but there are just too many posts to go through. :)

Anyhow, my question is pre-finished wood VS finishing on site. I have the option to do either. Which one is the "better" choice? The only difference I can see is that finishing on site fills in the gaps for you, but probably factory finishes are more durable. Also is one option more overall expensive than the other? Any opinions?
Thanks!

This subject has been discussed here numerous times :) Price between both is not significant. Pre-finished finish from reputable manufacturer is more durable than on site. Reputable manufacturers have micro bevel that are close to smooth finish Your eye get used to the lines and gapping with expansion/contraction is a lot less visible. You still get the gapping occasionally with on-site finish because no mater what you do, solid wood moves. On-site finish takes longer from start to end. If you have a poor finisher, you will see a lot of imperfections with on-site. But overall it's a personal preference.

[patrob]

We're in the process of installing a subfloor in the house we just bought. It has an active sump pump so we went with the Dricore flooring. I'd read somewhere that they recommend installing some sort of vents around the room to ventilate the air pocket underneath. Anyone have any helpful information regarding this?

BTW, as a tip for anyone else with a similar project, we bought all the Dricore in lots of 24 pieces with the $30 off $150 coupon they have in the Lowes Flyer at the moment. If you haven't noticed this deal yet, it's certainly saved us a ton with all the purchases we've made in the past few weeks! I believe the flyer is changing in the next couple of days but the coupon is good until the 23rd so grab up a bunch on flyers before they're gone :)

For best results, there should be air circulation under DriCore. The vents should be approx. 10 ft. apart on both ends of the room but it's best to follow the manufacturer's recommendations.

[Mint]

hey patrob,

I'm planning to buy some hardwood floors (only need about 67sqft). Rona has a sale for scratch and save 10% off. THey have some bruce hardwood floors and with the 10% off I think it should be about $4. Is it worth it? In addition, I can likely pricematch the 10% off and go with homedepot selection. Some of them seem pretty pricey, but I don't know how good the brands are.

I'm not looking for anything too fancy, just bang for your buck type a deal.

Here is a list of the brands at homedepot:
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=1&srchFor=Brand&Ntt=Hardwood&langId=-15&Ntk=level1&Dx=mode%2Bmatchall&catNav=3&storeId=10051&Ntx=mode%2Bmatchall&catalogId=10051&N=112447&Nty=1

Here is a list of brands at rona:
http://www.rona.ca/shop/!hardwood_more..._shop

TIA.

[mikeroyal]

Hi anyone have any experience with this outfit www.simplefloors.com prices seem very good was going to get them to make a site visit.

[patrob]

hey patrob,

I'm planning to buy some hardwood floors (only need about 67sqft). Rona has a sale for scratch and save 10% off. THey have some bruce hardwood floors and with the 10% off I think it should be about $4. Is it worth it? In addition, I can likely pricematch the 10% off and go with homedepot selection. Some of them seem pretty pricey, but I don't know how good the brands are.

I'm not looking for anything too fancy, just bang for your buck type a deal.

Here is a list of the brands at homedepot:
http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=1&srchFor=Brand&Ntt=Hardwood&langId=-15&Ntk=level1&Dx=mode%2Bmatchall&catNav=3&storeId=10051&Ntx=mode%2Bmatchall&catalogId=10051&N=112447&Nty=1

Here is a list of brands at rona:
http://www.rona.ca/shop/!hardwood_more..._shop

TIA.

$4 for Bruce is fine. You mentioned 67 sq. ft. but you probably need to add waste to that, which will be close to 4 boxes.

[patrob]

Hi anyone have any experience with this outfit www.simplefloors.com prices seem very good was going to get them to make a site visit.

Not familiar with them.

[typer100]

Hi! I just got my basement stairs done by a very good carpenter. I did pretty much everything in my basement. But hanging doors, laminated floor and installing walls is one thing, building a staircase is another.

The stairs are on bare maple right now. I'm thinking on doing the finish myself.

-Quick sanding with 220 and cleanup
-4&5 coats of Varathane Nano Defence or Diamond (79$ vs 59$ per gallon)
-quick sanding with 300 between coats (really necessary?)

How hard is it to get a great looking finish? Varathane good product? Nano worth the extra $

Tips or comments are welcome !

Thanks,

[Mint]

$4 for Bruce is fine. You mentioned 67 sq. ft. but you probably need to add waste to that, which will be close to 4 boxes.

thanks for the info. I think the price dropped and was able to get it for $3.30/sqft.

I bought 3 boxes (had to return the 4th box as it wouldn't fit in the car). Each box was 22sqft so thats 66sqft. How much extra do people normally need (rooms is pretty square)? I'm thinking of trying to buy some "sample" pieces to get the last bit. :)

[patrob]

Hi! I just got my basement stairs done by a very good carpenter. I did pretty much everything in my basement. But hanging doors, laminated floor and installing walls is one thing, building a staircase is another.

The stairs are on bare maple right now. I'm thinking on doing the finish myself.

-Quick sanding with 220 and cleanup
-4&5 coats of Varathane Nano Defence or Diamond (79$ vs 59$ per gallon)
-quick sanding with 300 between coats (really necessary?)

How hard is it to get a great looking finish? Varathane good product? Nano worth the extra $

Tips or comments are welcome !

Thanks,
4 - 5 coats is up to you, IMO 3 is enough. Yes, sand between coats for best results. And make sure it's vacuumed before application. Diamond is more clear vs. Nano more "milky" finish. But everybody says Nano is harder but I haven't noticed any difference yet. For single staircase, 1 gallon should be good for 4 coats, so $20 more is no big deal but it's totally up to you.

[patrob]

thanks for the info. I think the price dropped and was able to get it for $3.30/sqft.

I bought 3 boxes (had to return the 4th box as it wouldn't fit in the car). Each box was 22sqft so thats 66sqft. How much extra do people normally need (rooms is pretty square)? I'm thinking of trying to buy some "sample" pieces to get the last bit. :)

What room is this, closet? You might be up for a surprise. If you have to rip a piece at the end of the wall an inch from 3 1/4", that's a lot of waste. You may need a lot of those "sample" pieces :D And the samples have no fronts or ends ;)
Depends on the room, but usually you add 5% +- for waste.

[ginostyle]

Hi Patrob,

I just bought a new home and want to refinish the hardwood floors.

The home is built in 1971 and the hardwood has been under carpet for most of its life.

What are the costs to sand and refinish? Also, what about making the hardwood lighter or darker?

Let me know an approx per sq ft cost?

Regards,

Paul

[mtlrabbit]

THIS THREAD IS AN AMAZING HARDWOOD TEXTBOOK AND PATROB IS SO HELPFULL.

Time to redo my 300sqf wood floor in natural maple (since one room already has natual maple installed by previous onwer). According to info here, I will skip RN, RDor HD for the quailty issue although the price for natural maple is very impressing (brand forestra, $3.99/sqt with 10%-50% scrach card). Here is my two option:
1. Mirage select and better, quoted $5.60/sqf (select and better 3 1/4) after $10/box fty rebate from a specialty floor store, $1.95/sqf installation. I think the price is reasonable so I put in deposit and the store told me the installer will call me to measure my room. 10 DAYS PASSED. Nobody calls.
2. Pass the Sears Flooring store yesteday, so I came in and the guy show me BSL floor, he told me select is the best grade BSL has and is equal to other brand's select and better. However, the price is $5.90/sqf. The good thing is this guy come to my home in 15 minutes to do the measurement even he knows what I can get from Mirage. (I also buy carpet from this sears store)

Does anybody have any experence with BSL since I can't find much info from the internet. I know I prefer mirage but they look not serious about my business, meanwhile, the advantage to go with sears is that I can have both hardwood and stair carpet be installed with one company.

Nowdays, you do not have many honest man like patrob in this bussiness, here is what I get from both store:

Mirage store: BSL is not as good us, it is uncompareble.
Sears: Mirage only has a big name, the quality is not good anymore, we carrired them before and now we drop it.

Dear Patrob, where is the truth?

[A3Scott]

Hi .. Great thread ... tonnes of good info ... thanks for sharing your expertise.

I'm renovating a kitchen and want to install the same red oak floors that the rest of the house has. It is 40 year old 3/8" red oak. I've had a quote of $12/sqft installed and finished (3 coats)selext oak. I have approx 140 sq ft to do. Does this price sound ok ? Also, the installer suggested going with 3/4". It will be cheaper and more durable in the long run due to the traffic in the kitchen. My concern is I want to match the height of the old floors in the other parts of the house. Should I be concerned with the 3/8 vs 3/4 over the long term ?

Thanks, Andrew

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I just bought a new home and want to refinish the hardwood floors.

The home is built in 1971 and the hardwood has been under carpet for most of its life.

What are the costs to sand and refinish? Also, what about making the hardwood lighter or darker?

Let me know an approx per sq ft cost?

Regards,

Paul
I will PM you the contact info of a re-finisher. He will give you all the details if the floors can be re-finished, pricing, etc. If sanded to bare wood, you can stain it to any colour you like.

[patrob]

THIS THREAD IS AN AMAZING HARDWOOD TEXTBOOK AND PATROB IS SO HELPFULL.

Time to redo my 300sqf wood floor in natural maple (since one room already has natual maple installed by previous onwer). According to info here, I will skip RN, RDor HD for the quailty issue although the price for natural maple is very impressing (brand forestra, $3.99/sqt with 10%-50% scrach card). Here is my two option:
1. Mirage select and better, quoted $5.60/sqf (select and better 3 1/4) after $10/box fty rebate from a specialty floor store, $1.95/sqf installation. I think the price is reasonable so I put in deposit and the store told me the installer will call me to measure my room. 10 DAYS PASSED. Nobody calls.
2. Pass the Sears Flooring store yesteday, so I came in and the guy show me BSL floor, he told me select is the best grade BSL has and is equal to other brand's select and better. However, the price is $5.90/sqf. The good thing is this guy come to my home in 15 minutes to do the measurement even he knows what I can get from Mirage. (I also buy carpet from this sears store)

Does anybody have any experence with BSL since I can't find much info from the internet. I know I prefer mirage but they look not serious about my business, meanwhile, the advantage to go with sears is that I can have both hardwood and stair carpet be installed with one company.

Nowdays, you do not have many honest man like patrob in this bussiness, here is what I get from both store:

Mirage store: BSL is not as good us, it is uncompareble.
Sears: Mirage only has a big name, the quality is not good anymore, we carrired them before and now we drop it.

Dear Patrob, where is the truth?
Thanks :) You can cast your vote & rate this thread http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif if you find it helpful ;)

There is some truth about Mirage that it's not the same as it used to be. Everybody is trying to cut costs, I am sure they are doing everything to increase their profits. For example Mirage dropped their Select & Better line for stained products & made an "Exclusive" line, which is a mix of 2 grades. But they still offer S&B in the natural finish.

On the other hand they came out with Nano finish which apparently is stronger (I haven't noticed any difference). So marketing has a lot of impact on the brand & sales.

Not really familiar with BSL hardwood but looks like they are competing with Mirage at least in Quebec. One thing for sure it should not be more expensive than Mirage. Maybe because it's from Sears.

I would still choose Mirage over BSL or at least have Sears lower the price since you are getting other floor coverings from them. Maybe the Mirage dealer never called the installer to contact you. Also will you be able to get your deposit back? In the end you should go with whom you feel most comfortable with.

[patrob]

Hi .. Great thread ... tonnes of good info ... thanks for sharing your expertise.

I'm renovating a kitchen and want to install the same red oak floors that the rest of the house has. It is 40 year old 3/8" red oak. I've had a quote of $12/sqft installed and finished (3 coats)selext oak. I have approx 140 sq ft to do. Does this price sound ok ? Also, the installer suggested going with 3/4". It will be cheaper and more durable in the long run due to the traffic in the kitchen. My concern is I want to match the height of the old floors in the other parts of the house. Should I be concerned with the 3/8 vs 3/4 over the long term ?

Thanks, Andrew
3/8" is half the thickness of 3/4" & after finishing it's close to 5/16". 3/8" (strip) shows more expansion & contraction with possible gapping. Kitchen floors take the most abuse, so yes I would be concerned about the durability of 3/8" over the long run. Did you consider ceramic/porcelain or stone tiles? That would be the most durable in the kitchen & the height would be closer than 3/4" hardwood.

The cost does look a bit high but that's because of the small square footage. Have it installed, sanded, finished, come back 2-3 times, it all adds up to the cost. So the total is not that expensive. If you want to match the height exactly, then you don't have much choice.

[mtlrabbit]

Thanks :) You can cast your vote & rate this thread http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif if you find it helpful ;)

There is some truth about Mirage that it's not the same as it used to be. Everybody is trying to cut costs, I am sure they are doing everything to increase their profits. For example Mirage dropped their Select & Better line for stained products & made an "Exclusive" line, which is a mix of 2 grades. But they still offer S&B in the natural finish.

On the other hand they came out with Nano finish which apparently is stronger (I haven't noticed any difference). So marketing has a lot of impact on the brand & sales.

Not really familiar with BSL hardwood but looks like they are competing with Mirage at least in Quebec. One thing for sure it should not be more expensive than Mirage. Maybe because it's from Sears.

I would still choose Mirage over BSL or at least have Sears lower the price since you are getting other floor coverings from them. Maybe the Mirage dealer never called the installer to contact you. Also will you be able to get your deposit back? In the end you should go with whom you feel most comfortable with.

Thanks a lot patrob for quick reply, I think if Mirage keep taking short cut to compete with Chinese made floor, it is totally a suside. Nobody can compete with Chinese in price, never a chance. I hope they are not going that far so I can still have qaulity product from them now. Just let people know that good hardwood floor(non of them use chinese local wood) is at least $10/sqf in China, so when we I see $3.00 floor in big chain, the question bothers me is:
Why are we importing these low quality(or at least shortcut involved) stuff to kill our local business. The only answer I get is because we are cheap customer, it is not problem of chinese goods, it is us.

By the way, mirage guy called me finally so I feel a little better now.

[jingyu]

Thank to Patrob's continuous advise and now I came to the final part of the DIY. I have to deal with hall way and part of the living room now. There is one raised step from entry room into living room and I already bought two nosing pieces. My questions now are:
. The hall way near steps are not leveled and badly unlevel area is from approximately 14 SF left and right around the stair and it is a high traffic area. It looks like the subfloor support the steps are lower than the rest of joists that caused the level issue. The biggest gap I measured is 15mm(0.6 in). How should I fix this? Buy a thin plywwod and then apply floor patch around the joint area? Or totally apply floor patch. Can the floor patch take nailer fastner and stable enoguh for high trafic in the future?

.Can I just nail longer hardwood planks along those uneven area to force the easy installation without level the sub-floor? What is the potential consequence if ignoring the lelvel issue cause I see the plank can be forced to bend a little bit?

. The edges of old stairs(two places) under the carpet are round edge and do I need to cut them square to fit nosing? How to accomplish that?

Thanks.


No need to use glue around the walls. Glue is necessary only on/around transition pieces, doorways, nosings, stairs. You don't install narrow piece in archways between hallways & rooms to start continuous room with a full piece. Just keep going & rip the piece along the wall. Keep your RH levels to the manufacturers specs & don't worry about the expansion/contraction of the wood. I hope this is what you meant.

[onlineharvest]

Patrob,
What is your advise on how to fix little chips in hardwood floors? I have a few located on the edges of some strips. Do I need some kind of special pencil, puddy, etc?

Also, I would like a solution that still allows me to clean the floors with a VERY damp cloth (and if not good, let me know, it's a very diluted vinegar solution in warm water, and the cloth is rung until practially nothing is left).

For reference, I have Mirage 'Red Oak-Idaho' hardwood floors.

Thanks for the help!

[patrob]

Thanks a lot patrob for quick reply, I think if Mirage keep taking short cut to compete with Chinese made floor, it is totally a suside. Nobody can compete with Chinese in price, never a chance. I hope they are not going that far so I can still have qaulity product from them now. Just let people know that good hardwood floor(non of them use chinese local wood) is at least $10/sqf in China, so when we I see $3.00 floor in big chain, the question bothers me is:
Why are we importing these low quality(or at least shortcut involved) stuff to kill our local business. The only answer I get is because we are cheap customer, it is not problem of chinese goods, it is us.

By the way, mirage guy called me finally so I feel a little better now.

You are right. Most of people but not all, look only for "hardwood floors" but don't look at the origin, quality or how it's made. Don't worry Mirage or other reputable Canadian companies will not go that low. The hope is still there & people are learning & many now are keeping away from Chinese made hardwood.

[patrob]

Thank to Patrob's continuous advise and now I came to the final part of the DIY. I have to deal with hall way and part of the living room now. There is one raised step from entry room into living room and I already bought two nosing pieces. My questions now are:
. The hall way near steps are not leveled and badly unlevel area is from approximately 14 SF left and right around the stair and it is a high traffic area. It looks like the subfloor support the steps are lower than the rest of joists that caused the level issue. The biggest gap I measured is 15mm(0.6 in). How should I fix this? Buy a thin plywwod and then apply floor patch around the joint area? Or totally apply floor patch. Can the floor patch take nailer fastner and stable enoguh for high trafic in the future?

.Can I just nail longer hardwood planks along those uneven area to force the easy installation without level the sub-floor? What is the potential consequence if ignoring the lelvel issue cause I see the plank can be forced to bend a little bit?

. The edges of old stairs(two places) under the carpet are round edge and do I need to cut them square to fit nosing? How to accomplish that?

Thanks.

- The straightening of the sub-floor has to be resolved before installation of the floor. If it's lower, up to a 1/4" you can use self leveling compound. Anything more than that fill in with plywood, shims around, sand it smooth & if you really have to , apply self leveling compound around. Nails will go through self leveling if not too thick. But it also may crack the leveling & it will not serve any purpose.

- If you are talking about the bottom riser (rounded sides) you don't trim that square. You cut the nosing to the round part, shape of the riser. You shape the nosing with a jig saw or you can make a template to make it easier. Try with spare piece of wood before you cut the nosing.

[patrob]

Patrob,
What is your advise on how to fix little chips in hardwood floors? I have a few located on the edges of some strips. Do I need some kind of special pencil, puddy, etc?

Also, I would like a solution that still allows me to clean the floors with a VERY damp cloth (and if not good, let me know, it's a very diluted vinegar solution in warm water, and the cloth is rung until practially nothing is left).

For reference, I have Mirage 'Red Oak-Idaho' hardwood floors.

Thanks for the help!

I am curious where the chips came from :D You can buy a touch up stick that closely matches the colour at HD or Rona, etc. but the best thing is to obtain a touch up kit from Mirage to the exact Idaho colour from a local dealer. A cleaning kit from Mirage or Vintage will last you at least a year & does a lot better job & is much safer than solution of water & vinegar.

[jingyu]

What do you mean 'shims around'? Do you mean I should thin the edge area of plywood to fit the sub-floor around the plywood edge or use seperate wood shims to transite to sub-floor? Can I mix roof shingles with plywood to achieve the flatness effect? Do I screw plywood (or/and wood shims) to sub floor or glue them using PL? Thanks.

- The straightening of the sub-floor has to be resolved before installation of the floor. If it's lower, up to a 1/4" you can use self leveling compound. Anything more than that fill in with plywood, shims around, sand it smooth & if you really have to , apply self leveling compound around. Nails will go through self leveling if not too thick. But it also may crack the leveling & it will not serve any purpose.

- If you are talking about the bottom riser (rounded sides) you don't trim that square. You cut the nosing to the round part, shape of the riser. You shape the nosing with a jig saw or you can make a template to make it easier. Try with spare piece of wood before you cut the nosing.

[Shredder59]

I was thinking about refinishing a 3/4" solid maple floor in my new house because I don't care for the stain that is on it. The area is a large rectangular room and I got a couple quotes and both were about $1000 to do the job. Works out to about $3 Per square foot to refinish (area is about 300-350 square feet).

I'm wondering if I should consider buying a whole new floor instead and installing it myself so that I can get the exact finish and look that I'm after. Assumption is that I can get a good quality oak product for about $5 per square foot (materials cost).

3 questions:

1. Assuming my current Maple floor is only a couple years old and in excellent condition, is there a market for someone to buy the floor pieces from me once I remove them? If so, what *might* I get for it? Or is it just going in the garbage / garage ?

2. Am I correct in assuming I can get a good quality oak floor for around $5 PSF (materials cost)?

3. Am I too worried that I can't get the exact stain that I want? Are most experienced floor finishers good at matching a given stain/look exactly?

[onlineharvest]

I am curious where the chips came from :D You can buy a touch up stick that closely matches the colour at HD or Rona, etc. but the best thing is to obtain a touch up kit from Mirage to the exact Idaho colour from a local dealer. A cleaning kit from Mirage or Vintage will last you at least a year & does a lot better job & is much safer than solution of water & vinegar.

That smile makes me think you AREN'T curious and KNOW where the chips came from?! When floors were first installed, I had a couple chips repaired by the installer, but whatever he did, it came off (didn't stick). And for another chip in a bedroom, I thought his repair job was terrible so I had him change the whole plank (which is a disaster of mess!).

I'd rather do it myself with the right tools.

A couple of the newer chips I saw look as if the nail was too close to the edge and eventually a sock got caught and out it came. None of these are large at all, but since this is a dark color, they are more visible.

I will go ahead and locate something from a Mirage dealer and pick up that cleaner. I originally did not want to use water AT ALL on the floors, but was encouraged to do so anyway because my inlaws used the same cleaning method for over 30 years and never had a problem. Are you suggesting water damage may have resulted in chips eventually forming (loosening of the wood and out it comes?).

Thanks for the help patrob!

[poupa]

Hi,

Rona has a sale for 3 1/4 x 3 1/2 Ash hardwood (in chocolate, which should go together with my maple expresso kitchen cabinets) in their latest flyer for $2.96 sqf. Is this a 'good' deal with respect to durability, quality etc. I'll be installing about 1900 sqf in April, and want to avoid going over $4/sqf.
Thanks!

[patrob]

What do you mean 'shims around'? Do you mean I should thin the edge area of plywood to fit the sub-floor around the plywood edge or use seperate wood shims to transite to sub-floor? Can I mix roof shingles with plywood to achieve the flatness effect? Do I screw plywood (or/and wood shims) to sub floor or glue them using PL? Thanks.

If you have one section of the plywood lower from others with a sharp height difference, then you just fill in with appropriate pieces of plywood. But if it's gradually sloping down, then you fill in deepest part with appropriate size of ply & then feather the edges to your needed height with cedar shims. The shims are from 0 to 3/8" & work the best to transition the height. You can glue it, nail it or both.

[patrob]

I was thinking about refinishing a 3/4" solid maple floor in my new house because I don't care for the stain that is on it. The area is a large rectangular room and I got a couple quotes and both were about $1000 to do the job. Works out to about $3 Per square foot to refinish (area is about 300-350 square feet).

I'm wondering if I should consider buying a whole new floor instead and installing it myself so that I can get the exact finish and look that I'm after. Assumption is that I can get a good quality oak product for about $5 per square foot (materials cost).

3 questions:

1. Assuming my current Maple floor is only a couple years old and in excellent condition, is there a market for someone to buy the floor pieces from me once I remove them? If so, what *might* I get for it? Or is it just going in the garbage / garage ?

2. Am I correct in assuming I can get a good quality oak floor for around $5 PSF (materials cost)?

3. Am I too worried that I can't get the exact stain that I want? Are most experienced floor finishers good at matching a given stain/look exactly?

If you remove the floors, it will be hard to find somebody to sell it. Plus you would have to remove it gently & take out all nails, which will be a PITA. If you shop around, you can get good quality oak for that price. A good floor finisher should be able to match the colour extremely close.

[patrob]

That smile makes me think you AREN'T curious and KNOW where the chips came from?! When floors were first installed, I had a couple chips repaired by the installer, but whatever he did, it came off (didn't stick). And for another chip in a bedroom, I thought his repair job was terrible so I had him change the whole plank (which is a disaster of mess!).

I'd rather do it myself with the right tools.

A couple of the newer chips I saw look as if the nail was too close to the edge and eventually a sock got caught and out it came. None of these are large at all, but since this is a dark color, they are more visible.

I will go ahead and locate something from a Mirage dealer and pick up that cleaner. I originally did not want to use water AT ALL on the floors, but was encouraged to do so anyway because my inlaws used the same cleaning method for over 30 years and never had a problem. Are you suggesting water damage may have resulted in chips eventually forming (loosening of the wood and out it comes?).

Thanks for the help patrob!
Pre-finished floors have a diff. structure of finish. No manufacturer that I know of will recommend mixture of water & vinegar as a cleaning solution.
It's your choice but recently we have repaired couple pieces of floor that was cleaned with a mixture & while cutting, you could smell the vinegar!

If the finish is damaged (chipped) the moisture could get under the finish & start peeling off. Cleaners dry faster & don't leave any residue.

[patrob]

Hi,

Rona has a sale for 3 1/4 x 3 1/2 Ash hardwood (in chocolate, which should go together with my maple expresso kitchen cabinets) in their latest flyer for $2.96 sqf. Is this a 'good' deal with respect to durability, quality etc. I'll be installing about 1900 sqf in April, and want to avoid going over $4/sqf.
Thanks!

Quality floors are not sold for that price. As the saying goes, you get what you pay for. I am not familiar with durability of Rona hardwood. But if you like the price & have a strict budget, then go for it.

[onlineharvest]

Pre-finished floors have a diff. structure of finish. No manufacturer that I know of will recommend mixture of water & vinegar as a cleaning solution.
It's your choice but recently we have repaired couple pieces of floor that was cleaned with a mixture & while cutting, you could smell the vinegar!

If the finish is damaged (chipped) the moisture could get under the finish & start peeling off. Cleaners dry faster & don't leave any residue.

Well, that's what I thought and it actually WASN'T my choice! :) On my way to find a dealer of Mirage cleaning product...

[mtlrabbit]

Thanks :) You can cast your vote & rate this thread http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif if you find it helpful ;)

There is some truth about Mirage that it's not the same as it used to be. Everybody is trying to cut costs, I am sure they are doing everything to increase their profits. For example Mirage dropped their Select & Better line for stained products & made an "Exclusive" line, which is a mix of 2 grades. But they still offer S&B in the natural finish.

On the other hand they came out with Nano finish which apparently is stronger (I haven't noticed any difference). So marketing has a lot of impact on the brand & sales.

Not really familiar with BSL hardwood but looks like they are competing with Mirage at least in Quebec. One thing for sure it should not be more expensive than Mirage. Maybe because it's from Sears.

I would still choose Mirage over BSL or at least have Sears lower the price since you are getting other floor coverings from them. Maybe the Mirage dealer never called the installer to contact you. Also will you be able to get your deposit back? In the end you should go with whom you feel most comfortable with.

Dear Patrob, the mirage guy finally came in and here is some new stuff popping up after labor rate and wood price settled with them.
1. they said the nosing aorund hallway stair has to be changed since the original nosing is 3/8" not 3/4", otherwise, they will not do the job in order to pretect their reputation. So the labour for change that will be $166 (11' long with 10 post), plus $130 mirage nosing , plus $25 for something need finsh the installation.
2. $20 for silicon paper under the hardwood.
3. $50 for material delivery

So now instead of paying agreed $600 installation fee, the bill comes out over $1000 after tax without hardwood. The sears guy is laughing at me and tell me they will match the mirage price without $25 in 1, 2 and 3.

Would you pls advise if all these cost are reasonable so I will not seriously argue with them. From carpet experience, I am so tired to argue with these reputabe stores since they are all liers. I hope I can do everything myself next time. Thanks.

[patrob]

Dear Patrob, the mirage guy finally came in and here is some new stuff popping up after labor rate and wood price settled with them.
1. they said the nosing aorund hallway stair has to be changed since the original nosing is 3/8" not 3/4", otherwise, they will not do the job in order to pretect their reputation. So the labour for change that will be $166 (11' long with 10 post), plus $130 mirage nosing , plus $25 for something need finsh the installation.
2. $20 for silicon paper under the hardwood.
3. $50 for material delivery

So now instead of paying agreed $600 installation fee, the bill comes out over $1000 after tax without hardwood. The sears guy is laughing at me and tell me they will match the mirage price without $25 in 1, 2 and 3.

Would you pls advise if all these cost are reasonable so I will not seriously argue with them. From carpet experience, I am so tired to argue with these reputabe stores since they are all liers. I hope I can do everything myself next time. Thanks.

Delivery fee should be included in the price of the floor. The questionable $25 could be for trim under the nosing. Underlay should be included in the price of the installation. So what's next, they will ask you to cover the cost of nails? Yes, nosings are expensive & the labour to remove the railing, existing nosing & then put back everything together, that's normal. Actually I think the price is very reasonable.

[Easto]

Does all Tigerwood have an orange tinge to it?

From the pictures I have seen it doesn't look orange, but the sample I have is really orange which is kind of disappointing. I was really hoping to use the Tigerwood, but the orange tint to it isn't going to work with the rest of the colour scheme

[patrob]

Does all Tigerwood have an orange tinge to it?

From the pictures I have seen it doesn't look orange, but the sample I have is really orange which is kind of disappointing. I was really hoping to use the Tigerwood, but the orange tint to it isn't going to work with the rest of the colour scheme

Yes, Tigerwood ages & when exposed to sunlight, it will change colour to a deeper orange tone. And you will see diff. in colour for ex: if rugs are placed before the wood had time to age. But this is common with all exotic species.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/muiracatiara.jpg

This is aged Tigerwood

http://www.pawbrandflooring.com/assets/pics/Tiger-wood.jpg
http://www.pawbrandflooring.com/assets/pics/Tiger-wood2.jpg

Why don't you just go for the Fumed Oak after all :D

[Odd I/O]

Does all Tigerwood have an orange tinge to it?

From the pictures I have seen it doesn't look orange, but the sample I have is really orange which is kind of disappointing. I was really hoping to use the Tigerwood, but the orange tint to it isn't going to work with the rest of the colour scheme

Have you tried leaving the sample in direct sunlight to darken? That will give you a better idea of the final colour.

Patrob, are those pictures above of the Tigerwood from Vintage or just some random Tigerwood floor pictures?

[patrob]

Patrob, are those pictures above of the Tigerwood from Vintage or just some random Tigerwood floor pictures?

The first pic is from Vintage to show the colour diff. after it's aged. The other pics are random that show aged Tigerwood.
It takes time for the wood to age, at least 2 - 3 months to see a diff. Cover half with cardboard & expose the other half.

[Easto]

My wife really like the Walnut now, but I don't like that walnut is so soft. I think we'll have some regrets with the Walnut and the dog.

I don't mind the oak. I just like the character of the tigerwood, but not a big fan of the orangeness.

[patrob]

My wife really like the Walnut now, but I don't like that walnut is so soft. I think we'll have some regrets with the Walnut and the dog.

I don't mind the oak. I just like the character of the tigerwood, but not a big fan of the orangeness.

Kids, dogs & walnut does not go together. Take a look at Vintage Fumed Oak again (White Oak Old Oak).

[evanryan]

Hi Patrob.

Would like your opinion on this.

We would like to put down some flooring ourselves, we our looking at about 350 sq ft

I have been staying away from hardwood floors that need to be nailed done
as I do not have a nailer or compressor.
We were out and saw some engineered flooring that uses the uniclic system . What is your opinion on this
Can you recommend a certain brand to look for or place to buy

Thanks

[patrob]

Hi Patrob.

Would like your opinion on this.

We would like to put down some flooring ourselves, we our looking at about 350 sq ft

I have been staying away from hardwood floors that need to be nailed done
as I do not have a nailer or compressor.
We were out and saw some engineered flooring that uses the uniclic system . What is your opinion on this
Can you recommend a certain brand to look for or place to buy

Thanks
350 sq. ft. is more likely a weekend project for DIY'er in nail down or click. In a house with wooden sub-floors I recommend nail down & considering that transition pieces for click floors (floating) are not cheap, renting a nailer & compressor for the weekend might be cheaper. Also floating floors (click) cannot be re-finished if needed.

What colour are you looking for & what area of the house are you planning to put floors in?

[ruffturbo]

i need to buy some hardwood flooring about 1600 sq is is worth going to one of these auctions cause $4 is too much for me to spend right now? i'm looking for an oak floor to match the one i have down stairs it's a dark grainny looking strip with the board color being on the brown side not honey ??

[Easto]

The two places we can get wood from are not vintage suppliers.

The carry Mirage, but not vintage.

Now I am leaning to natural maple.... gosh I am starting to hate this.

[Pariah]

Anyone know if these cork floors (http://www.nucasa.com/Commerce.Web/productList.aspx?catID=348) from Haro are any good? Some have been made to look like wood. Example:

http://www.nucasa.com/Commerce.Web/product.aspx?id=4684&catID=348

In general, who makes the best cork floors? I've heard good things about Torlys but am unfamiliar with Haro.

[patrob]

i need to buy some hardwood flooring about 1600 sq is is worth going to one of these auctions cause $4 is too much for me to spend right now? i'm looking for an oak floor to match the one i have down stairs it's a dark grainny looking strip with the board color being on the brown side not honey ??

I am not a fan of auctions since you never know what you are getting. I suggest visiting a couple of hardwood flooring stores before, sometimes they have specials on old stock, left overs from diff. jobs, etc. But don't expect any warranty on that wood & most likely will be a lower grade product. Plus might be hard to match exactly to your current hardwood.

[patrob]

The two places we can get wood from are not vintage suppliers.

The carry Mirage, but not vintage.

Now I am leaning to natural maple.... gosh I am starting to hate this.

They do have 3 Vintage dealers in London.

[patrob]

Anyone know if these cork floors (http://www.nucasa.com/Commerce.Web/productList.aspx?catID=348) from Haro are any good? Some have been made to look like wood. Example:

http://www.nucasa.com/Commerce.Web/product.aspx?id=4684&catID=348

In general, who makes the best cork floors? I've heard good things about Torlys but am unfamiliar with Haro.

Not familiar with them. But we are familiar with Torlys & have installed it & they make an excellent cork product. They even have leather floors now :razz:

http://www.torlys.com/Portals/0/images/Leather-Plank.jpg
http://builder.torlys.com/Portals/0/vrd/images/rendered/7/leather/plank/thumbs/7-LTU47354-0-0.jpg

[Shredder59]

I'm shopping around for a good quality solid hardwood in a cherry or redish-brown stain. I need to buy about 350 square feet of it for a living/dining room. Anyone know of any good deals on right now for a 3 1/4" product?

[Easto]

They do have 3 Vintage dealers in London.

It just happens that our builder doesn't deal with any of those 3 dealers that are in London.

I am going to see if I can get a sample of the Vintage to see how we like it. If we like it enough maybe the two stores that we deal with will be able to order us some.

[DarkKnight1680]

I just purchased a home where the second floor has interesting pegged-oak floors. Here is a pic:

http://www.badongo.com/pic/7513248

The front and back rooms of this floor had carpet which i took out (smell issue) to reveal very old, partially painted wood floors. The pegged oak is 3/4" thick and would be exactly that far above the old painted floors. Do you know of anywhere that does floors like this anymore if i wanted it to match? The boards are not flush but have triangular grooves in between and the pegs do pop out (a few are missing, not just stained on). What would a floor like this cost if there was someone who could do it?

Thanks!

[xstatik]

I'm closing on a Brand New home in December, should I wait or am I ok with having someone come in to install Hardwood Floors right after closing? (I'm more concerned with issues such as house settlement, TARION warranty, 30 day Tarion Report, New Home Warranties etc)

[patrob]

I'm shopping around for a good quality solid hardwood in a cherry or redish-brown stain. I need to buy about 350 square feet of it for a living/dining room. Anyone know of any good deals on right now for a 3 1/4" product?

Try visiting a hardwood store for prices & any specials.

[patrob]

I just purchased a home where the second floor has interesting pegged-oak floors. Here is a pic:

http://www.badongo.com/pic/7513248

The front and back rooms of this floor had carpet which i took out (smell issue) to reveal very old, partially painted wood floors. The pegged oak is 3/4" thick and would be exactly that far above the old painted floors. Do you know of anywhere that does floors like this anymore if i wanted it to match? The boards are not flush but have triangular grooves in between and the pegs do pop out (a few are missing, not just stained on). What would a floor like this cost if there was someone who could do it?

Thanks!
Those floors are mainly unfinished, it's called Country V-Grove (deep v-groove) & the plugs are installed after installing the floors. It won't be cheap because it's hard to get that type of hardwood & the labour involved.

[patrob]

I'm closing on a Brand New home in December, should I wait or am I ok with having someone come in to install Hardwood Floors right after closing? (I'm more concerned with issues such as house settlement, TARION warranty, 30 day Tarion Report, New Home Warranties etc)

Your hardwood installation has nothing to do with Tarion Warranty. If any structural issue like sub-floor or similar will have to be addressed on 30 day list, then wait with your flooring installation, otherwise you have nothing to worry about. You can have the floors installed day after closing or whenever you like. Remember if you install your floors & you have trades coming into your house to fix your PDI items, etc., make sure you or they cover the floors because you are responsible for the flooring & you have to make sure the floors are covered & protected during any work.

[DarkKnight1680]

Thanks Patrob! Any idea where in the Toronto area i might find Country V-Grove flooring to match? A google or 2 didn't turn up anything.

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob! Any idea where in the Toronto area i might find Country V-Grove flooring to match? A google or 2 didn't turn up anything.

Contact any hardwood flooring store in your area & they should be able to help you. Have the pic handy to show what you are looking for.

[DarkKnight1680]

Will do. Thanks again!

[baker37075]

patrob, I live in Tennessee and our home is built over a crawlspace. We were thinking about installing Brazilian walnut solid hardwood. We love the look of American walnut, but after reading about how soft it is, we're afraid to try it. I also love the look of the fumed oak by vintage, but I am a little concerned about resale value with engineered wood. Are there potential problems with Brazilian walnut? I have read that it can dry out and crack. Thanks for all your great info.

[xstatik]

Your hardwood installation has nothing to do with Tarion Warranty. If any structural issue like sub-floor or similar will have to be addressed on 30 day list, then wait with your flooring installation, otherwise you have nothing to worry about. You can have the floors installed day after closing or whenever you like. Remember if you install your floors & you have trades coming into your house to fix your PDI items, etc., make sure you or they cover the floors because you are responsible for the flooring & you have to make sure the floors are covered & protected during any work.

Thanks for your informative answer..
Will installing the hardwood after closing void any of the warranties on the subfloor or the home???

Ideally, I'd like to get hardwood floors installed the day after closing.

[ginko123]

In terms of what wood is better? we're trying to decide b/w Oak and Maple. The maple is .50 higher than oak. But I like Maple's clean grain look.

For sturdiness, wear/tear scratch terms, which is better, Oak or Maple?

[Shredder59]

Any thoughts, opinions or reviews on threetowersflooring.com or canfloor.com?

Both seem to offer very good prices, Three Towers says they manufacture their own products in Tillsonburg, Ontario. Canadian Flooring I'm not sure, but they seem to have their own brand called 'Alegra' flooring which no one else seems to carry.

Has anyone bought a floor from either one of these retailers?

[RomanDesign]

Any thoughts, opinions or reviews on threetowersflooring.com or canfloor.com?

Both seem to offer very good prices, Three Towers says they manufacture their own products in Tillsonburg, Ontario. Canadian Flooring I'm not sure, but they seem to have their own brand called 'Alegra' flooring which no one else seems to carry.

Has anyone bought a floor from either one of these retailers?

I'm considering threetowersflooring.com as well, so I'm also intersted in any feedback on the quality and installation service...

[patrob]

patrob, I live in Tennessee and our home is built over a crawlspace. We were thinking about installing Brazilian walnut solid hardwood. We love the look of American walnut, but after reading about how soft it is, we're afraid to try it. I also love the look of the fumed oak by vintage, but I am a little concerned about resale value with engineered wood. Are there potential problems with Brazilian walnut? I have read that it can dry out and crack. Thanks for all your great info.

I don't know about climate in your area but I would not install any solid hardwood over a crawlspace. Solid Sawn is a lot better for any kind of installation & unless you tell somebody that it is an engineered product, nobody will ever know. If you are thinking about exotic wood, that in particular should be some sort of engineered to maximize the stability. Many exotics are unstable & mainly the harder the wood, the higher tendency to crack if too dry.

Solid Sawn 3/4" Structured Hardwood
http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/solidsawn-plank.jpg

[patrob]

Thanks for your informative answer..
Will installing the hardwood after closing void any of the warranties on the subfloor or the home???

Ideally, I'd like to get hardwood floors installed the day after closing.

No, it will not void the warranty.

[patrob]

In terms of what wood is better? we're trying to decide b/w Oak and Maple. The maple is .50 higher than oak. But I like Maple's clean grain look.

For sturdiness, wear/tear scratch terms, which is better, Oak or Maple?

Oak is better. But maple has a certain look that many people like, you just have to be more careful with it.

[baker37075]

So, if you go with engineered wood, do you still have to be careful of the type of wood you choose? Would American walnut in an engineered wood still be too soft? Sorry, I'm really new to this and I have a lot to learn!

[patrob]

So, if you go with engineered wood, do you still have to be careful of the type of wood you choose? Would American walnut in an engineered wood still be too soft? Sorry, I'm really new to this and I have a lot to learn!

The top layer, whether solid or engineered, will still be the same, so yes American Walnut will still be softer than other species. It's what's under the top layer that's different. If you really like the American Walnut, the Fumed Oak is the best alternative look wise & less expensive. And also because of the fuming process, it's harder than reg. white oak.

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_8160.JPG

[baker37075]

The top layer, whether solid or engineered, will still be the same, so yes American Walnut will still be softer than other species. It's what's under the top layer that's different. If you really like the American Walnut, the Fumed Oak is the best alternative look wise & less expensive. And also because of the fuming process, it's harder than reg. white oak.

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_8160.JPG

You don't come to Tennessee, do you?!!!! There isn't a Vintage here and no one else sells that beautiful floor. Thanks for your help.

[Peggy3]

Before you move in, you have to point out to the builder the new damages. It's ok to replace, plank here & plank there but if you are starting to remove larger sections & a lot of them have to be glued in, it will affect the expansion & contraction of the floor. The glued planks will stay in place, where the rest will have place to move. It should not affect the structural integrity of the floor if done correctly.


Patrob,
Following up on the my last post...
In an area of approximately 350 sq ft, there are over 150 scratches, dents and imperfections. There are also 3 boards with cracks in the surface.

The company that installed the flooring for the builder has come to look at it and wants to use a marker to color in the scratches in the finish and said they will replace the boards that have dents in the surface. The boards that have dents and scratches that penetrate the finish are probably over 30-40 boards in a 350 sq ft area. Even if it looks OK for the time being after the repair (which I doubt it will look exactly the same as the original boards), do you think that allowing them to replace so many of the boards is comproising the long term quality of the hardwood floors? Should I insist on that the floor be removed completely and replaced? I have proposed this to both the compay and the builder and they both only want to do repairs

I feel I am getting the raw end of the deal because I paid for new floors and what is supposed to be a "new" house is starting to feel like a "used" house.

very sad...:(

[nocash]

This is perhaps more of a interior design question, but looking more for a pros opinion then anything else.

Our ground floor came with solid white oak floors and our banisters are oak stained to match the ground floor hardwood. The stairs leading to second level are carpeted.

We're planning to replace the 2nd level carpet and stair carpet with hardwood (~1600 sq ft).
The question is should we try to match the ground level wood/stain?
Or maybe just match the stairs and open the 2nd level up to something different?


Many thanks

[patrob]

Patrob,
Following up on the my last post...
In an area of approximately 350 sq ft, there are over 150 scratches, dents and imperfections. There are also 3 boards with cracks in the surface.

The company that installed the flooring for the builder has come to look at it and wants to use a marker to color in the scratches in the finish and said they will replace the boards that have dents in the surface. The boards that have dents and scratches that penetrate the finish are probably over 30-40 boards in a 350 sq ft area. Even if it looks OK for the time being after the repair (which I doubt it will look exactly the same as the original boards), do you think that allowing them to replace so many of the boards is comproising the long term quality of the hardwood floors? Should I insist on that the floor be removed completely and replaced? I have proposed this to both the compay and the builder and they both only want to do repairs

I feel I am getting the raw end of the deal because I paid for new floors and what is supposed to be a "new" house is starting to feel like a "used" house.

very sad...:(

I can understand your frustration. You will always see the boards that were touched up. Even though it's unacceptable to me to have so much damage on a new floor that was done before closing, I doubt they will replace the floors. But I would certainly try to have it replaced! If done properly, you should not see which boards were replaced.

There is always a higher chance of your hardwood floors being damaged by other trades if you get it from the builder vs. having it installed after closing :idea: Many times people don't have a choice especially if the hardwood comes standard with the house but unfortunately that's the reality.

[patrob]

This is perhaps more of a interior design question, but looking more for a pros opinion then anything else.

Our ground floor came with solid white oak floors and our banisters are oak stained to match the ground floor hardwood. The stairs leading to second level are carpeted.

We're planning to replace the 2nd level carpet and stair carpet with hardwood (~1600 sq ft).
The question is should we try to match the ground level wood/stain?
Or maybe just match the stairs and open the 2nd level up to something different?

Many thanks

Yes, it should match the main floors especially if the banisters are stained to match, you just continue with the same stain colour upstairs. Unless you dislike the stain colour on your main floor.

[patrob]

You don't come to Tennessee, do you?!!!! There isn't a Vintage here and no one else sells that beautiful floor. Thanks for your help.

A bit too far for us :D Too bad there is no Vintage dealer there. Have you tried contacting them for more info?

[baker37075]

A bit too far for us :D Too bad there is no Vintage dealer there. Have you tried contacting them for more info?

Yes, I sent them an email. I'm still waiting to hear back. I wanted a price for the fumed oak.

[Jungle]

Hi Patrob

I want to install hardwood in my condo. Do you recommend I use engineering floating? If so what brand? Also, what kind of under pad do I need for this? Do you know how much this roughly costs per square foot?

Thanks!

[patrob]

Hi Patrob

I want to install hardwood in my condo. Do you recommend I use engineering floating? If so what brand? Also, what kind of under pad do I need for this? Do you know how much this roughly costs per square foot?

Thanks!

Check with your condo management for specs on flooring installation. Every condo will have diff. rules. Flooring installation in condos usually tends to be more expensive, depending on material, underlay & type of installation, etc. We highly recommend Vintage products & they just recently came out with a U-LOCK engineered 1/2" locking hardwood that is perfect for condo installation & can be glued down or floated. Or for little bit more, you can go with 3/4" Solid Sawn Engineered in 5" or 7" planks.

Once you get info on the underlay, let me know if you need more help.

[ginko123]

Patrob: how is Appalachian hardwood? I've decided to stick with either Red Oak Natural or the Oak butterscotch color to match our stairs :)

Also, since it's hardwood, we'd only need wax paper for installation underneath right?

[stealth]

Pat, we are planning on re-doing our staircase...not just putting new treads/risers, but possibly changing the shape of the stairs or maybe even the direction by adding a landing.
Do you know anyone who specializes in this sort of thing that you could recommend?

[patrob]

Patrob: how is Appalachian hardwood? I've decided to stick with either Red Oak Natural or the Oak butterscotch color to match our stairs :)

Also, since it's hardwood, we'd only need wax paper for installation underneath right?

It's medium quality hardwood, nothing too fancy. Yes, flooring underlay (wax paper) only for nail down installation.

[patrob]

Pat, we are planning on re-doing our staircase...not just putting new treads/risers, but possibly changing the shape of the stairs or maybe even the direction by adding a landing.
Do you know anyone who specializes in this sort of thing that you could recommend?

For that, it's best to contact a stair company. You have to think about walls, support, new railing, etc.

[Konowl]

Doing laminte in my house and have a few questions.

Background:
I'll be doing laminate in the entire house, all the same. I'm doing this to make the house look bigger as much as possible, as the house is only 600 square feet or so. It's a lakefront property, crawlspace underneath.

1) Should I vapour barrier the house before putting the floor down? I generally have to run a dehumidifier all winter as the windows will have water droplets form on them. I also need to vapour barrier the crawlspace floor in the spring (it's a rough concrete floor so at least it's not dirt).

2) I was worried about the floor not being level, but it's suprisingly level after pulling up the carpet today. However, the strange thing is, I think there used to be tile down at one point as I see marks typically left by a trowel. Also when I was pulling up the carpet underlay... it appears that some of it is "stuck" to the floor in this thin layer of black almost foamy substance on the subfloor. (put it this way I can barely see the subfloor). Should I try to scrape all of this off or is it something not to worry about? I thought the carpet had a musty smell, but it's definately this black crap whatever it is. Should I be adding on to the subfloor even though the space is so small?

3) The entire front of the house is ALL windows for the lake view. However, all the floor joists also run parallel to these windows. I'm assuming this is perfect as you want the flooring to run across the floor joists, correct?

[newt_101]

I move into my house in a few weeks and I'm arranging to have my master bedroom and living room re-sanded.

The 2 rooms are 300 square feet total with oak flooring.
It's dull and lifeless but doesn't seem to have any serious problems.

I've called around a few places and the lowest price I got was $1.50/sq ft for sanding, and natural finish. Is this a good price? If not, does anyone have contacts for something cheaper (but still good work)?

What are questions I can ask when searching for business to know what sort of work results and quality I will receive?

Thanks!

[patrob]

Doing laminte in my house and have a few questions.

Background:
I'll be doing laminate in the entire house, all the same. I'm doing this to make the house look bigger as much as possible, as the house is only 600 square feet or so. It's a lakefront property, crawlspace underneath.

1) Should I vapour barrier the house before putting the floor down? I generally have to run a dehumidifier all winter as the windows will have water droplets form on them. I also need to vapour barrier the crawlspace floor in the spring (it's a rough concrete floor so at least it's not dirt).

2) I was worried about the floor not being level, but it's suprisingly level after pulling up the carpet today. However, the strange thing is, I think there used to be tile down at one point as I see marks typically left by a trowel. Also when I was pulling up the carpet underlay... it appears that some of it is "stuck" to the floor in this thin layer of black almost foamy substance on the subfloor. (put it this way I can barely see the subfloor). Should I try to scrape all of this off or is it something not to worry about? I thought the carpet had a musty smell, but it's definately this black crap whatever it is. Should I be adding on to the subfloor even though the space is so small?

3) The entire front of the house is ALL windows for the lake view. However, all the floor joists also run parallel to these windows. I'm assuming this is perfect as you want the flooring to run across the floor joists, correct?
There are underlays like 3-in-1 for installation over concrete or crawlspace. It's better to spend money on better underlay than vapour barrier. Buy a hygrometer to check relative humidity levels in the house. Foggy windows might also be a diff. reason. The old underlay stuck to the concrete should be removed/scraped off if affects the installation (if too soft for new floor).
If the underlay has too much "give", it may break off the locks of the new laminate. It's better to start from zero. Yes, you want to install across the joist.

[Konowl]

There are underlays like 3-in-1 for installation over concrete or crawlspace. It's better to spend money on better underlay than vapour barrier. Buy a hygrometer to check relative humidity levels in the house. Foggy windows might also be a diff. reason. The old underlay stuck to the concrete should be removed/scraped off if affects the installation (if too soft for new floor).
If the underlay has too much "give", it may break off the locks of the new laminate. It's better to start from zero. Yes, you want to install across the joist.

Nono, I'm not putting the hardwood over the crawlspace floor, there is a 4 foot crawlspace under the house and was wondering if i should put the vapour barrier down on the plywood flooring ABOVE the crawlspace. The foam backing is "stuck" to the wood floor on the main level which is 4 feet above the crawlspace floor. If I misread you, nevermind hahah. The flooring has a pre-attached foam backing.

[patrob]

Nono, I'm not putting the hardwood over the crawlspace floor, there is a 4 foot crawlspace under the house and was wondering if i should put the vapour barrier down on the plywood flooring ABOVE the crawlspace. The foam backing is "stuck" to the wood floor on the main level which is 4 feet above the crawlspace floor. If I misread you, nevermind hahah. The flooring has a pre-attached foam backing.

Ok. The old underlay should be removed from the existing sub-floor. I am not a fan of laminate with attached underlay. Why, because when you install separate laminate underlay, you create a whole separate sheet between sub-floor & flooring. Where with the built-in underlay, doesn't go ideally from edge to edge. It does not touch together from board to board (at least from what I have seen). Where separate underlay works as a cushion, sound & some sort of barrier. I have issues with installing vapour barrier over wooden sub-floor if area underneath is not vented, it may cause problems.

[Konowl]

Ok. The old underlay should be removed from the existing sub-floor. I am not a fan of laminate with attached underlay. Why, because when you install separate laminate underlay, you create a whole separate sheet between sub-floor & flooring. Where with the built-in underlay, doesn't go ideally from edge to edge. It does not touch together from board to board (at least from what I have seen). Where separate underlay works as a cushion, sound & some sort of barrier. I have issues with installing vapour barrier over wooden sub-floor if area underneath is not vented, it may cause problems.

So you think I should do the 3-in-1 underlay as well then?

[patrob]

So you think I should do the 3-in-1 underlay as well then?

Depends how soft the built-in underlay is. You don't want both of the underlays give you too much of a spongy feel. You don't want the floor to have too much movement or it can break the locks off. Test it before you purchase it. Try to get a sample piece of the 3-in-1 & see how it works together.

[Konowl]

Depends how soft the built-in underlay is. You don't want both of the underlays give you too much of a spongy feel. You don't want the floor to have too much movement or it can break the locks off. Test it before you purchase it. Try to get a sample piece of the 3-in-1 & see how it works together.

Got the 3-in-1 that Home Depot sells today - feels quite comfortable with the flooring to be honest, not too spongy. Not the cheapest stuff in the world that's for sure. The underlay on the flooring isn't overly thick at all.

[ginko123]

It's medium quality hardwood, nothing too fancy. Yes, flooring underlay (wax paper) only for nail down installation.


Okay thanks, I know you've suggested Vintage previoulsy here, there is a shop whose offering us vintage red oak natural for $4.99/sq ft and Applachian for $3.99, should I pay the extra dollar and get it.

We only need around 200 sq ft for living room anyways...... I need opinion :confused:

[ginko123]

Ooo. Patrob on the same note, this store was recommening me Engineered Flooring because they mentioned if moisture is a concern to you, should go with engineer than solid.

Is that true? My living area is only 200 sq ft, do we need to bring in a humidier in winter and a de-humidifier in summer only for this or should we get Engineer hardwood flooing?

[patrob]

Okay thanks, I know you've suggested Vintage previoulsy here, there is a shop whose offering us vintage red oak natural for $4.99/sq ft and Applachian for $3.99, should I pay the extra dollar and get it.

We only need around 200 sq ft for living room anyways...... I need opinion :confused:
If $200 will not break your budget, then pay extra & get Vintage.

Ooo. Patrob on the same note, this store was recommening me Engineered Flooring because they mentioned if moisture is a concern to you, should go with engineer than solid.

Is that true? My living area is only 200 sq ft, do we need to bring in a humidier in winter and a de-humidifier in summer only for this or should we get Engineer hardwood flooing?

Humidifier or A/C (de-humidifier) is recommended for both types of flooring. But engineered has a wider RH level tolerance. Engineered is slightly more expensive.

[rab]

Hi, Great thread! Wish I had found it months ago.

My question is what brand of hardwood should we go with? Is it worth the extra money to go with Mirage?

Our choices are - Mirage, Model, Superior, and Seasons.

Looking at putting down about 400 sqft.

Thanks

rab

[patrob]

Hi, Great thread! Wish I had found it months ago.

My question is what brand of hardwood should we go with? Is it worth the extra money to go with Mirage?

Our choices are - Mirage, Model, Superior, and Seasons.

Looking at putting down about 400 sqft.

Thanks

rab

Don't know anything about Seasons :D I would go with either Mirage or Model depending on colour & price. They are very much equivalent.

[rab]

Thanks,

Being new to the forum, can anyone give me a hint as to what this:D symbolizes?

The guy at the store, when trying to make his pitch, said when something drops on the Mirage wood it dents, where as with some other brands the wood dents and the finish might look like shattered glass?

Prices - Mirage 7.19 Model 5.60


Will Model and Mirage last the same length of time? Or will I likely need to replace one before the other?

rab

[baxter]

I had engineered hardwood installed yesterday. The installers did a poor job of cleaning up excess adhesive that had squeezed out between the joints.

what should i use to remove these sticky spots without damaging the wood finish?
Mineral spirits?

[nabzif]

You got the right idea about the staring point. It's really hard to explain the way to cut the reducer. But I will try :D

If you're not confident you can do it, DO NOT attempt it :!:

1. Fence on the right side of the blade.
2. Set the distance from the blade to the fence to the height you need.
3. Tilt the blade to the degree that will not cut more than the thickness of the floor on top.
4. Cut your board finish side against the fence.
If your angle is sharp, you may have to change your height angle so it fits snugly against the wood.

Try first on soft wood, so you know how to handle it. Because on hardwood, it can easily close on you & pull back :idea: So please be careful & watch your fingers!

Let me know if you understand :cheesygri


I'm curious, do you use a jig to do this? Having board and fence and fingers so close to blade sounds dangerous...

[patrob]

Thanks,

Being new to the forum, can anyone give me a hint as to what this:D symbolizes?

The guy at the store, when trying to make his pitch, said when something drops on the Mirage wood it dents, where as with some other brands the wood dents and the finish might look like shattered glass?

Prices - Mirage 7.19 Model 5.60

Will Model and Mirage last the same length of time? Or will I likely need to replace one before the other?

rab
Means we have not heard of that brand "Seasons" :)

Some finishes on wood are very poor but I never heard of a term "shattered glass"... Every wood will dent & scratch, some more than others. Vintage, Mirage, Model & some other good brands will resist damages better. I think you should call around more for better pricing on Mirage. It should be closer to $6 +-. Both floors should last you for many, many years if taken care of properly. BTW, you don't replace floors, you can re-finish them numerous times (3/4" solid).

[patrob]

I had engineered hardwood installed yesterday. The installers did a poor job of cleaning up excess adhesive that had squeezed out between the joints.

what should i use to remove these sticky spots without damaging the wood finish?
Mineral spirits?

If the installer used water based T&G glue, a damp rug will take it off. If the floor was glued down with moisture cured adhesive, you should call the installer back to clean it off because nothing except urethane adhesive remover will take it off.

[patrob]

I'm curious, do you use a jig to do this? Having board and fence and fingers so close to blade sounds dangerous...

There is no jig for that because every time the reducer is diff. height. It is unsafe but anytime you use a table saw you should follow safety precautions.

[petey123]

Hey guys not sure if this should go under autos, but for you guys who do any wood construction or company work, what kind of van do you use to carry around all the equipment? My grampa and uncle actually wanted to start up a smalltime construction business and they told me to look for deals on vehicles online, only I've no clue where to begin... I wiki'd around a bit- are "GMC Savana" and "Chevy Express" good cargo vans, and is there anything particular I should be looking for in these vehicles?

[vukkusila]

Hi Patrob,

I am thinking of replacing existing hardwood floor 800 sft with new Vintage floor. Yesterday I went to one of the dealers of vintage and there were
6 models of Ash 2 1/4'' and they were on sale for $4.19.

Here are the models.

Ash Frangelico 2 1/4"
Ash Duchess 2 1/4"
Ash Carriage House 2 1/4"
Ash Chianti 2 1/4"
Ash Carleton 2 1/4"

Do you think I can go with 2 1/4" as the price is really cheap for vintage product. Really appreciate your feedback.

Thanks.

[patrob]

Hey guys not sure if this should go under autos, but for you guys who do any wood construction or company work, what kind of van do you use to carry around all the equipment? My grampa and uncle actually wanted to start up a smalltime construction business and they told me to look for deals on vehicles online, only I've no clue where to begin... I wiki'd around a bit- are "GMC Savana" and "Chevy Express" good cargo vans, and is there anything particular I should be looking for in these vehicles?

If you are looking for used van, GMC Savana or Chevy Express not older than 5 yrs. old works very well. Look for a truck with as less windows as possible, preferably no windows at all in the back/side. If it comes with a safety divider, even better. If you are thinking about hauling 10-11 ft. long, look for extended version. I recommend 2500 min. with a 6.0 V8 if you are thinking of keeping it for longer. If you need something full height, then look at the Dodge Sprinter it's a diesel & better on gas. But because of its height, you have restrictions on condos & some commercial projects. Some passes are approx. 7 ft. high & Sprinter is taller & many times your neighbours might complain if you park on the driveway :D

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I am thinking of replacing existing hardwood floor 800 sft with new Vintage floor. Yesterday I went to one of the dealers of vintage and there were
6 models of Ash 2 1/4'' and they were on sale for $4.19.

Here are the models.

Ash Frangelico 2 1/4"
Ash Duchess 2 1/4"
Ash Carriage House 2 1/4"
Ash Chianti 2 1/4"
Ash Carleton 2 1/4"

Do you think I can go with 2 1/4" as the price is really cheap for vintage product. Really appreciate your feedback.

Thanks.
Nothing from Vintage leaves at that price. Otherwise it's a great price.
Pick what you like, if you don't mind the narrow plank, then go for it.

[amz155]

Hey patrob,

I posted this as a seperate thread thinking that someone else might have been able to answer it but not yet, really.....

So I'll re-post the question here as I know you're the resident thread expert on hardwood :)

Do we really need a humidifier for hardwood in first year?

Our new house, closing in a month, will have hardwood stairs and hardwood on the main floor (oak).

I'm concerned about the wood shrinking in the dry winter.

I've heard that new homes emit enough moisture that a humidifier isn't really needed in the first year.

However, my builder has said that if pieces of the floor shrink over the winter and they find that we don't have a humidifier, I'm on the hook and they will not correct the issue.

I noticed that in the model home there were spaces between the floor boards and when I asked about it (concerned that it might have been an installation problem), they told me it was because a humidifier was not put in the home until after the winter.

I'm worried that if I don't get a humidifier right away, my floors will end up looking like those in the model home.

We aren't opposed to getting a humidifier. We just have so many things to buy/set in order prior to closing that if we can wait on that item, we will.

On that note, since we don't have much time to shop around, can anyone recommend a brand/model that is reasonably priced. Our home is 2228 sq feet. Lastly, since the hardwood is just on the main, can we get away with a portable humidifier that we place in one of the two hardwooded rooms?

[patrob]

Hey patrob,

I posted this as a seperate thread thinking that someone else might have been able to answer it but not yet, really.....

So I'll re-post the question here as I know you're the resident thread expert on hardwood :)

Do we really need a humidifier for hardwood in first year?

Our new house, closing in a month, will have hardwood stairs and hardwood on the main floor (oak).

I'm concerned about the wood shrinking in the dry winter.

I've heard that new homes emit enough moisture that a humidifier isn't really needed in the first year.

However, my builder has said that if pieces of the floor shrink over the winter and they find that we don't have a humidifier, I'm on the hook and they will not correct the issue.

I noticed that in the model home there were spaces between the floor boards and when I asked about it (concerned that it might have been an installation problem), they told me it was because a humidifier was not put in the home until after the winter.

I'm worried that if I don't get a humidifier right away, my floors will end up looking like those in the model home.

We aren't opposed to getting a humidifier. We just have so many things to buy/set in order prior to closing that if we can wait on that item, we will.

On that note, since we don't have much time to shop around, can anyone recommend a brand/model that is reasonably priced. Our home is 2228 sq feet. Lastly, since the hardwood is just on the main, can we get away with a portable humidifier that we place in one of the two hardwooded rooms?

Get a hygrometer (Home Depot $20 http://www.iallergy.com/images/med/honeywell-e10-humidistat.jpg ) & it will show you exact humidity in the house. But I strongly recommend a central humidifier. Portable humidifiers work well in smaller rooms, not large enough for main floor. We got our GeneralAire humidifier from venice_it for a very good price. You can PM him for pricing & more info on which model will work best for you :) www.generalaire.com/catalog/categories/659-Bypass_Flow_Through_Humidifiers

[amz155]

^ Thanks! Can you confirm what humidity level is ideal for hardwood (oak)?

Thanks.

[patrob]

^ Thanks! Can you confirm what humidity level is ideal for hardwood (oak)?

Thanks.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/pioneered_chart.jpg

[amz155]

Thanks again. Someone else said in another thread 50-60% is fine. Is anythign above 55% too high? Or is the problem more if it falls below 45% that it causes shrinking?

[onlineharvest]

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/pioneered_chart.jpg

Is it true that in new homes, the himidity is higher because of the new materials? If I put the dial setting to anything higher than 25%, condensation appears on ALL my windows (homes is 1.5 years old).

I know there is a machine to measure the humidity (hygrometer), but I haven't tried it out. Is that my only option to know what exactly to set it to (e.g., if the humidity is 30% with my settings set to 0%, I should set the dial to 25% to get the 55% -is that even how it works?)

[vukkusila]

Hi Patrob,

Finally I placed order for Carriage House Select v 2 1/4. Thank you so much for all the help and giudence.

Message to the board:

I am a first time buyer and was clueless about hardwood stuff, Patrob has guided me very patiently for all my stupid questions and I am proud that I bought some good Vintage stuff for cheaper price. 80% of my credit goes to patob. thanks again.



Nothing from Vintage leaves at that price. Otherwise it's a great price.
Pick what you like, if you don't mind the narrow plank, then go for it.

[Odd I/O]

Patrob what's the flooring you're using as the background images on your website? They're on the "Gallery" and "About Us" section.

Also, do you have to remove the baseboards in order to install the hardwood flooring? I have carpeting in my rooms now that I'm planning on replacing as soon as I decide on which floor to get.

[patrob]

Is it true that in new homes, the himidity is higher because of the new materials? If I put the dial setting to anything higher than 25%, condensation appears on ALL my windows (homes is 1.5 years old).

I know there is a machine to measure the humidity (hygrometer), but I haven't tried it out. Is that my only option to know what exactly to set it to (e.g., if the humidity is 30% with my settings set to 0%, I should set the dial to 25% to get the 55% -is that even how it works?)

A hygrometer will tell you everything & they are inexpensive. The dials on the humidifier are often inaccurate unless you have digital setting with sensor. If you have shutters or very thick window coverings, condensation will happen due to inadequate air circulation around the window. Try to turn on your fan more often to circulate the air.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Finally I placed order for Carriage House Select v 2 1/4. Thank you so much for all the help and giudence.

Message to the board:

I am a first time buyer and was clueless about hardwood stuff, Patrob has guided me very patiently for all my stupid questions and I am proud that I bought some good Vintage stuff for cheaper price. 80% of my credit goes to patob. thanks again.

Glad I was able to help :) A vote would be nice ;)

[patrob]

Patrob what's the flooring you're using as the background images on your website? They're on the "Gallery" and "About Us" section.

Also, do you have to remove the baseboards in order to install the hardwood flooring? I have carpeting in my rooms now that I'm planning on replacing as soon as I decide on which floor to get.

Both of the pics are Vintage Hand Scraped Solid Sawn Eng. The 'gallery' pic is 5" Buckingham & 'about us' is 7" Baroque :)

No need to remove the baseboards, you can use either quarter round or doorstop as secondary trim.

[Bandi]

I am looking to get hardwood on my main floor. I received 2 estimates at the same price. One is for in site finished Vintage red oak and the other one is for prefinished Eterna red oak. What solution will be the best?

Thanks

[James_TheVirus]

Hi Patrob,

I installed hardwood in the summer. I had to go around the peninsula in the kitchen with hardwood, so right now I have a gap between the wood and the cabinet because I don't know where to get some trim which matches the cabinets. What do you normally do when you butt up to kitchen cabinets? Is there somewhere that you would recommend in Toronto, and how do you normally match the stains?

Thanks!

PS I promise to post pics soon.

[Maymybonneliveforever]

I've been reading this thread for a couple of weeks but have been afraid to ask this question for fear of being either ridiculed or blasted but I thought I'd give it a try.

Due to budget restraints from other reno's I'm now at a point of wanting to install wood on the stairs. I finished the 3/4", 3 1/4" 1000 sq. ft wood floor install my self, (wife helped) but now need to do the 13 riser stairs. I have over 100 sq. ft left over and wanted to use some of the remaining to do this job. I was thinking of glueing two planks to make it 6 /2" long then using the proper bullnose to bring it to about. 10". I would first have to plane the first two that were glued to get rid of the bevel between the planks and then sand down the rest once it's been all glued together with clamps. Is there any write up on what I'm trying to accomplish?

Below if a picture of the stairs while the work was in progress.


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359575975.jpg


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576843.jpg


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576666.jpg

[Acadian]

Sorry if this has been asked and answered before.

I'm wondering what to put under my metal bed frame. I read about gliders and such but also read that some people still get scratches from them on their floors.

Is there a product out there to put under the wheels of this frame or is it just the cut up some carpet solution?

Thanks!

[Maymybonneliveforever]

There are actual cups that can be purchased so that the casters can sit inside the cushions/cups so that they don't move around on the wood floors. They're specifically made for this purpose and are usually brown in colour.

[patrob]

I am looking to get hardwood on my main floor. I received 2 estimates at the same price. One is for in site finished Vintage red oak and the other one is for prefinished Eterna red oak. What solution will be the best?

Thanks

Vintage does not supply on-site finished hardwood. Not familiar with Eterna brand. But generally I recommend pre-finished over site finished unless it's a re-sand of existing floors.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I installed hardwood in the summer. I had to go around the peninsula in the kitchen with hardwood, so right now I have a gap between the wood and the cabinet because I don't know where to get some trim which matches the cabinets. What do you normally do when you butt up to kitchen cabinets? Is there somewhere that you would recommend in Toronto, and how do you normally match the stains?

Thanks!

PS I promise to post pics soon.

You can buy un-finished trim moulding & stain it to match the kitchen cabinets. Any HD, Rona or Lowes will carry it (maple or oak).

[patrob]

I've been reading this thread for a couple of weeks but have been afraid to ask this question for fear of being either ridiculed or blasted but I thought I'd give it a try.

Due to budget restraints from other reno's I'm now at a point of wanting to install wood on the stairs. I finished the 3/4", 3 1/4" 1000 sq. ft wood floor install my self, (wife helped) but now need to do the 13 riser stairs. I have over 100 sq. ft left over and wanted to use some of the remaining to do this job. I was thinking of glueing two planks to make it 6 /2" long then using the proper bullnose to bring it to about. 10". I would first have to plane the first two that were glued to get rid of the bevel between the planks and then sand down the rest once it's been all glued together with clamps. Is there any write up on what I'm trying to accomplish?

Below if a picture of the stairs while the work was in progress.

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359575975.jpg

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576843.jpg

http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576666.jpg

You can do the stairs with planks, just don't cut the groves off. Stain the bullnose to match the colour & make it look like this guy did http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/6358168-post72/
You have the right idea, start from bottom up & remember about the risers.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2305/2240105684_97f1bd49d5_o.jpg

[patrob]

Sorry if this has been asked and answered before.

I'm wondering what to put under my metal bed frame. I read about gliders and such but also read that some people still get scratches from them on their floors.

Is there a product out there to put under the wheels of this frame or is it just the cut up some carpet solution?

Thanks!


There are actual cups that can be purchased so that the casters can sit inside the cushions/cups so that they don't move around on the wood floors. They're specifically made for this purpose and are usually brown in colour.
Exactly what Maymybonneliveforever said :D

[Maymybonneliveforever]

You can do the stairs with planks, just don't cut the groves off. Stain the bullnose to match the colour & make it look like this guy did You have the right idea, start from bottom up & remember about the risers. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to my post that in itself deserves a thank you....Thanks.

Having done and seen so many stairs would you want your house to have the groove between the planks. I realize that the whole upper floor (bathrooms have tile) has the groves but should the stairs also? To me that makes it look like a DIY'er done it, that's why I thought about running it through the planner, or is that just me? I also saved about qty, of 40, 39" length to make the stairs one length across, in hopes of making it look more professional. I need all the help I can get.

Benjamin Moore has stated that if I bring in a sample they will match the stain colour exactly. Is there a particular finish I should be looking for or will they know to match it?

What's the best way to strip the balusters, newels? I started with a razor but my fingers were getting sore and it's hard to get into the finer areas. Man does that take a long time.

[hellrotvic]

I've been reading this thread for a couple of weeks but have been afraid to ask this question for fear of being either ridiculed or blasted but I thought I'd give it a try.

Due to budget restraints from other reno's I'm now at a point of wanting to install wood on the stairs. I finished the 3/4", 3 1/4" 1000 sq. ft wood floor install my self, (wife helped) but now need to do the 13 riser stairs. I have over 100 sq. ft left over and wanted to use some of the remaining to do this job. I was thinking of glueing two planks to make it 6 /2" long then using the proper bullnose to bring it to about. 10". I would first have to plane the first two that were glued to get rid of the bevel between the planks and then sand down the rest once it's been all glued together with clamps. Is there any write up on what I'm trying to accomplish?

Below if a picture of the stairs while the work was in progress.


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359575975.jpg


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576843.jpg


http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL733/3792904/21624270/359576666.jpg



As an option to save some bucks and time, have you considered white risers? I used 3/4" MDF, I primed painted and custom cut for each riser. Glued and nailed in place will fill nail holes and retouch up. I used it with Mirage Engineered Maple Vienna flooring. I think it looks good, just finished last weekend so I don't have any pictures to show.

[hellrotvic]

I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to my post that in itself deserves a thank you....Thanks.

Having done and seen so many stairs would you want your house to have the groove between the planks. I realize that the whole upper floor (bathrooms have tile) has the groves but should the stairs also? To me that makes it look like a DIY'er done it, that's why I thought about running it through the planner, or is that just me? I also saved about qty, of 40, 39" length to make the stairs one length across, in hopes of making it look more professional. I need all the help I can get.

Benjamin Moore has stated that if I bring in a sample they will match the stain colour exactly. Is there a particular finish I should be looking for or will they know to match it?

What's the best way to strip the balusters, newels? I started with a razor but my fingers were getting sore and it's hard to get into the finer areas. Man does that take a long time.

I sanded my balusters and newels and painted over them with white paint for the small ballusters and the hand rails were painted a custom tinted dark brown to match my flooring. It looks pretty good, not as great as stained wood but I wasn't prepared to sand and strip all my balusters and I did not want to purchase new ones.

[Maymybonneliveforever]

Yes we have considered it and my wife would seriously consider it. I however love the look of wood and prefer to have both the risers and tread match the rest of the floor.

Again I do like the white risers etc. but prefer the look of wood.

[patrob]

I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to my post that in itself deserves a thank you....Thanks.

Having done and seen so many stairs would you want your house to have the groove between the planks. I realize that the whole upper floor (bathrooms have tile) has the groves but should the stairs also? To me that makes it look like a DIY'er done it, that's why I thought about running it through the planner, or is that just me? I also saved about qty, of 40, 39" length to make the stairs one length across, in hopes of making it look more professional. I need all the help I can get.

Benjamin Moore has stated that if I bring in a sample they will match the stain colour exactly. Is there a particular finish I should be looking for or will they know to match it?

What's the best way to strip the balusters, newels? I started with a razor but my fingers were getting sore and it's hard to get into the finer areas. Man does that take a long time.
Some manufacturers make the bevel on the wood to hide the height difference in milling. If you are thinking of cutting the bevel off & putting the boards together, that might show unless you sand it down & make it look like 1 piece tread. If that's what you are thinking, it's better to do everything with un-finished wood. Because pre-finished wood is a PITA to sand. Some people don't mind the groves on the stairs & if you have full lengths, then it will only be one line so it will look pretty ok. But the cost of nosings is not that cheap either. Look into unfinished treada & compare the price to the nosings & your labour.

Best way to strip the varnish is liquid varnish remover for start & sand paper. With posts varnish remover, wire brush for the grooves, sand paper & lots of patience. Pickets will take you forever to do, that's why many people just paint them white or replace with unfinished for stain. You can do full colour staircase with stained handrail & posts but white pickets. If you don't sand it perfectly, stain will not take as well.

[Maymybonneliveforever]

Thanks again for the reply patrob, I purchase a 9' length of bullnose so as to make two sample pieces and view it's completed product. I felt I got a good price for the bullnose per foot which I don't know if I can post pricing in this thread. Since there will be three sections of wood per tread there would be two groves. I didn't realize that prefinished was time consuming to sand. I just figured if I planned at most 3/32" that would get all of the prefinished material off.

I also thought about installing the full length wood stips on the treads as I would the wood floor by nailing each piece in but I figured it may be stronger if I preassemble. Then I thought I could both nail in and glue each piece on each riser, don't know which way is better.

Too many options, but which one is the right way.

Thanks for the liquid varnish remover idea, I'll have to purchase some on the weekend. I'm hoping to have it done by the end of the year so I figure I have 4 weeks to prepare and 3 weeks to install. I'm still not convinced I'll impress my wife since after all, isn't that what life's all about? :D:lol::razz:

[waterhat]

Hi,

I currently have about 1500 sqft of maple hardwood + maple hardwood stairs. The finish is satin.

Its about 8 years old and showing lots of scratches now and I'd like to fix that.

I've heard that staining maple is a bugger and can turn out blotchy? How do I avoid this in choosing a contractor? Should I stick to the satin finish or go with a gloss? Would the satin finish hide more future scratches with the maple? Also, should I stick with the natural maple color or consider staining it dark? Prices?

[Maymybonneliveforever]

waterhat, are you considering sanding down the existing Maple and placing a stain and maybe a satin clearcoat.

The way I view scratches is the same as I would a car, dark colours show up scratches somewhat more then let's say a white finish. I will also assume that if you have a highgloss finish scratches will be more visable due to the shine effect, but then I'll leave this question to the experts and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong since I'm here to learn.

[patrob]

Thanks again for the reply patrob, I purchase a 9' length of bullnose so as to make two sample pieces and view it's completed product. I felt I got a good price for the bullnose per foot which I don't know if I can post pricing in this thread. Since there will be three sections of wood per tread there would be two groves. I didn't realize that prefinished was time consuming to sand. I just figured if I planned at most 3/32" that would get all of the prefinished material off.

I also thought about installing the full length wood stips on the treads as I would the wood floor by nailing each piece in but I figured it may be stronger if I preassemble. Then I thought I could both nail in and glue each piece on each riser, don't know which way is better.

Too many options, but which one is the right way.

Thanks for the liquid varnish remover idea, I'll have to purchase some on the weekend. I'm hoping to have it done by the end of the year so I figure I have 4 weeks to prepare and 3 weeks to install. I'm still not convinced I'll impress my wife since after all, isn't that what life's all about? :D:lol::razz:
I am sure you wife will be impressed, anything will be better than that yellow carpet :cheesygri

Gluing with PL & nailing the planks will be sufficient enough. The nosing will work better if it's tongue & groove joint with the planks. Same thing with the riser, glue & nails. Finish the exposed edge with a piece of moulding. I would not touch the finish on the pre-finished planks.

[patrob]

Hi,

I currently have about 1500 sqft of maple hardwood + maple hardwood stairs. The finish is satin.

Its about 8 years old and showing lots of scratches now and I'd like to fix that.

I've heard that staining maple is a bugger and can turn out blotchy? How do I avoid this in choosing a contractor? Should I stick to the satin finish or go with a gloss? Would the satin finish hide more future scratches with the maple? Also, should I stick with the natural maple color or consider staining it dark? Prices?

Clear maple if stained should be more uniform. But if it's off grade, may show more blotchy but the stain will bring out the grain & show more variation in colour. Yes, go with satin or lower sheen finish. Stain or natural depends on what you like. As for prices, can't help you on that. Here in GTA it's approx. $2.50 - $3 sq. ft. for stain & less for natural.

[breitzes]

Hi Patrob,

We're putting about 600 sq feet of engineered hardwood flooring in our condo. We were looking at Preverco at first but the sales guy convinced us that Torlys (Everest) would be better. The Tolys product is cheaper, which we don't mind, but we willing to pay more for a better product.

All the sales guys tell a different story. One said the Preverco could be problematic in a condo due to the very low humidity level. Another said Preverco was the best b/c of the way its manufactured.

Do you have any thoughts/suggestions?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

We're putting about 600 sq feet of engineered hardwood flooring in our condo. We were looking at Preverco at first but the sales guy convinced us that Torlys (Everest) would be better. The Tolys product is cheaper, which we don't mind, but we willing to pay more for a better product.

All the sales guys tell a different story. One said the Preverco could be problematic in a condo due to the very low humidity level. Another said Preverco was the best b/c of the way its manufactured.

Do you have any thoughts/suggestions?

I would say that Torlys is better than Preverco but now I say that Vintage is better than any of them.
Vintage offers 3/4" Solid Sawn Eng., 9/16" Crefted Eng. & now they offer 1/2" x 3 1/2" U-LOCK Eng. Hardwood which can be floated or glued down.
And the price is very attractive & comes in Red Oak, Maple, Hickory & Jatoba.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/uloc-plank.jpg

[Maymybonneliveforever]

I am sure you wife will be impressed, anything will be better than that yellow carpet :cheesygriI had to laugh at that yellow carpet coment, it's actually builders beige, but it does seem to have yellowed over the years hasn't it.

I'll show my wife the one picture of the photo you've enclosed and get her option patrob. Thanks.

[txenglan]

Hi Patrob,

I have decided to read this thread from beginning to end, carefully. So Far, I am still back in New Year, 2008 ;) As so many other have expressed, thanks for helping and for having created this thread. The information provided herein is incredible.

Today, I went to a flooring store in Ottawa who, for Vintage Solid Sawn Engineered in 5" (I think) quoted:

$9 /Sq ft for the material itself
$2.75 /Sq ft for installation (not including removal of existing flooring of anything else)


Having started to read through this thread, this seems expensive (most other thread contributors have been talking about a $2-5 /sq ft range). Is this so, or is the particular type of HW I mentioned worth the quoted price, both in terms of raw material and installation required to handle it properly.

Thanks!

[amz155]

Hi patrob,

Need your expert advice....

We went to take a look at our new home (still under construction) today and were surprised to see that the hardwood has been installed and they are working on staining the stairs!

We noticed the following that concerned us:

1. Where pieces of hardood meet the wall, and on landings of stairs (our stairs change direction twice) the lengths that the strips are cut to are different. How is this fixed? I sould imagine a quarter round aginst the trim?

2. In some areas, there is a gap from the top of the hardwood to the bottom of the trim (maybe 1/2-3/4 inch ins ome spots). It doesn't seem that if a quarter round was put on that it would cover the gap. How is this fixed? (On one wall, the floor meets trim on right side but on left side there is a gap!)

3. In quite a few spots, it seems like the wood puckers up/tents up to a peak. This is visually apparent and you can feel it too. How is this fixed? (This one really concerns us!)

I'm also upset that they didn't cover the wood and people are walking all over it! The tile is covered well but the hardwood isn't! :mad:

4. About the stairs, we noticed that they got some stain on the iron pickets. Any idea of this stain would come off the pickets?

5. We noticed that on two of the stairs, there isn't a rounded edge like on all the others, the edge is "cut off" or squared off. But its being stained as such. This is something we'd identify on the PDI but how is this type of this fixed?

I know that there are still working ont he house but the few things that we noticed today are worrisome. Any adivice is much appreciated! We took photos so if you'd like to see them in case my explanations don't make sense please PM me :)

Andrea

[rab]

We're having a house built and are putting the hardwood in after possession. Anyone able to recommend someone from the Ottawa area that does a good job putting floors in for a good price?

rab

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I have decided to read this thread from beginning to end, carefully. So Far, I am still back in New Year, 2008 ;) As so many other have expressed, thanks for helping and for having created this thread. The information provided herein is incredible.

Today, I went to a flooring store in Ottawa who, for Vintage Solid Sawn Engineered in 5" (I think) quoted:

$9 /Sq ft for the material itself
$2.75 /Sq ft for installation (not including removal of existing flooring of anything else)

Having started to read through this thread, this seems expensive (most other thread contributors have been talking about a $2-5 /sq ft range). Is this so, or is the particular type of HW I mentioned worth the quoted price, both in terms of raw material and installation required to handle it properly.

Thanks!

The price does look a bit high but that depends on what species you were quoted & does that price include tax? Vintage is a higher quality product & that's reflected in the price. Plus we also noticed prices for Vintage in Ottawa are slightly higher. GTA installation ranges from $1.50 - $3 sq. ft. so your quoted price sounds ok.

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

Need your expert advice....

We went to take a look at our new home (still under construction) today and were surprised to see that the hardwood has been installed and they are working on staining the stairs!

We noticed the following that concerned us:

1. Where pieces of hardood meet the wall, and on landings of stairs (our stairs change direction twice) the lengths that the strips are cut to are different. How is this fixed? I sould imagine a quarter round aginst the trim?
Yes
2. In some areas, there is a gap from the top of the hardwood to the bottom of the trim (maybe 1/2-3/4 inch ins ome spots). It doesn't seem that if a quarter round was put on that it would cover the gap. How is this fixed? (On one wall, the floor meets trim on right side but on left side there is a gap!)
A doorstop/quarter round should cover it
3. In quite a few spots, it seems like the wood puckers up/tents up to a peak. This is visually apparent and you can feel it too. How is this fixed? (This one really concerns us!)
More likely plywood/sub-floor seams were not sanded. Note it on PDI & they will fix it by removing part of the floor, sand the sub-floor & re-install.
I'm also upset that they didn't cover the wood and people are walking all over it! The tile is covered well but the hardwood isn't! :mad:
Maybe it was just freshly installed. Usually they try to stay on top of it & cover the floors. That's the beauty of doing hardwood floors through the builder, you have no control.
4. About the stairs, we noticed that they got some stain on the iron pickets. Any idea of this stain would come off the pickets?
Usually paint thinner/Varsol takes it off.
5. We noticed that on two of the stairs, there isn't a rounded edge like on all the others, the edge is "cut off" or squared off. But its being stained as such. This is something we'd identify on the PDI but how is this type of this fixed?
It should be fixed to make it look nice. Note everything on PDI.
I know that there are still working ont he house but the few things that we noticed today are worrisome. Any adivice is much appreciated! We took photos so if you'd like to see them in case my explanations don't make sense please PM me :)

Andrea

Answers in Bold :)

[patrob]

We're having a house built and are putting the hardwood in after possession. Anyone able to recommend someone from the Ottawa area that does a good job putting floors in for a good price?

rab

You might have better luck asking here :)
www.buildinghomes.ca/community/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=35

[rab]

Thanks

rab

[amz155]

Answers in Bold :)

Thanks patrob! Really appreciate you going through all the questions.

I went to see the super today bc I was concerned about all this. Thankfully they have covered the floor by now. But it prevented me from pointing out the blatant puckering.

I walked through the home with one of the super's men and was told:

-the floor's puckering may lessen as the wood "settles" and aclimatizes to the home's humidity and temperature. Any truth to this?

-the quarter rounds will cover the gapping. Is this true for both tile and hardwood gaps?

-I was told that the pieces of stairs that aren't rounded are the "nosing". I was told that they'd try and make it look better. Should these pieces be finished the same as the rest of the stairs i.e. rounded edges?

I know I can point all these things out on the PDI but the PDI will be three days before we close and I dont' see how they could relay the floor, if needed, prior to closing. And if they take the attitude that the floor needs to "settle", then I'm worried that we will move it and the puckering will not go away and that we will have to be after them to fix it later. What a pain in the arse it will be to move all of our furniture and wait for them to show up to fix it all. Not to mentio we have to live with it in the meantime and stew about it :evil:

I'm just wondering....what is important for me to INSIST on them fixing now vs. just dealing with it on the PDI?

Thanks!

Here are the links for pics, if they work:

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877633391947858

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877736669307810

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877763326848418

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878205579215778

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878329492723634

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878356268025298

[patrob]

Thanks patrob! Really appreciate you going through all the questions.

I went to see the super today bc I was concerned about all this. Thankfully they have covered the floor by now. But it prevented me from pointing out the blatant puckering.

I walked through the home with one of the super's men and was told:

-the floor's puckering may lessen as the wood "settles" and aclimatizes to the home's humidity and temperature. Any truth to this?
Not sure what you mean by puckering. Is it cupping or a hump??
-the quarter rounds will cover the gapping. Is this true for both tile and hardwood gaps?
Yes
-I was told that the pieces of stairs that aren't rounded are the "nosing". I was told that they'd try and make it look better. Should these pieces be finished the same as the rest of the stairs i.e. rounded edges?
Very often they are lazy & leave the nosings cut straight. Point it out & they can round it off a bit.
I know I can point all these things out on the PDI but the PDI will be three days before we close and I dont' see how they could relay the floor, if needed, prior to closing. And if they take the attitude that the floor needs to "settle", then I'm worried that we will move it and the puckering will not go away and that we will have to be after them to fix it later. What a pain in the arse it will be to move all of our furniture and wait for them to show up to fix it all. Not to mentio we have to live with it in the meantime and stew about it :evil:

I'm just wondering....what is important for me to INSIST on them fixing now vs. just dealing with it on the PDI?

Thanks!

Here are the links for pics, if they work:

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877633391947858

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877736669307810

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877763326848418

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878205579215778

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878329492723634

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401878356268025298

All or some of the repairs will be done before or sometimes even up to 1 year after closing. Builders are always putting things off & hoping that you will give up on some repairs. You just have to be pushy & not give up.

You should be happy about one thing, they raised your baseboards by quite a bit, so technically a free upgrade :D The gap around the stairs will be covered by oak quarter round matching the stairs. And the iron pickets should have a "foot" to cover the holes.

[amz155]

This is what I mean by puckering....the wood kinda comes up to a peak:

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877612424122018

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877633391947858

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877654738808914

You can see how the light hits the floor differently at the peak.

[patrob]

This is what I mean by puckering....the wood kinda comes up to a peak:

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877612424122018

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877633391947858

http://picasaweb.google.com/245sirbenson/Nov8HouseVisit#5401877654738808914

You can see how the light hits the floor differently at the peak.

I did see that pic but thought that maybe it was the reflection. Hump like this is caused by a ridge in the sub-floor (plywood seams have not been sanded)
It will not settle down & it will have to be fixed.

[amz155]

I did see that pic but thought that maybe it was the reflection. Hump like this is caused by a ridge in the sub-floor (plywood seams have not been sanded)
It will not settle down & it will have to be fixed.

Yikes, so it is a major problem. That's bad news as there are three such major puckers that we noticed. It would seem that they would need to pull up most of the floor to fix the problem.

Any advice on how we can address the issue now, prior to the PDI and moving in? I tried today and was told not to worry, that everything will be taken care of. Though the impresion I got is that they are gonna see if the floor "settles". Maybe if I go back in on the weekend and it hasn't settled I canmention it again. I want to be firm with the super but not piss him off so that he asks for the key back and doesn't let me go back into the house. I know his arguement will be for me not to worry, that I'm not viewing the finished product yet. I just don't wanna wait and THEN have to have everything redone.

[txenglan]

The price does look a bit high but that depends on what species you were quoted & does that price include tax? Vintage is a higher quality product & that's reflected in the price. Plus we also noticed prices for Vintage in Ottawa are slightly higher. GTA installation ranges from $1.50 - $3 sq. ft. so your quoted price sounds ok.

Thanks for the quick response.

If memory serves me correctly, that price was without tax. I had forgotten to provide the type which is "tigerwood". Still seem on the expensive side? Other types were more expensive than that with the most expensive being about $12-13 /sq ft.

[jingyu]

I finally completed the floor DIY project thanks to Patrob and it is my great DIY achievement so far. I now have a small question for you. I made a mistake by leaving a small gap between the side of my stair planks and side drywall. The old baseboard marks are left by old carpet floor stair when I took off baseboard for stair installation. You can see my installed stair photos in my image links.

http://cid-0388f9cfaf3eb807.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/floor^_install/entry^_stair1.jpg

or click the link below:

http://cid-0388f9cfaf3eb807.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/floor^_install/entry^_stair1.jpg

How should I fix this? Use a white baseboard or quarter round to cover the gap or is any other better way? Please let me know if you cannot see my image fro the above links and I will try to upload my images to a different host site. Thanks again.


Originally Posted by patrob
- The straightening of the sub-floor has to be resolved before installation of the floor. If it's lower, up to a 1/4" you can use self leveling compound. Anything more than that fill in with plywood, shims around, sand it smooth & if you really have to , apply self leveling compound around. Nails will go through self leveling if not too thick. But it also may crack the leveling & it will not serve any purpose.

- If you are talking about the bottom riser (rounded sides) you don't trim that square. You cut the nosing to the round part, shape of the riser. You shape the nosing with a jig saw or you can make a template to make it easier. Try with spare piece of wood before you cut the nosing.

[txenglan]

Just noticed the "clearance" section of the Westboro flooring site:

http://www.westboroflooring.com/clearance.php?id_cat=7

I wonder why the sales person I spoke to never mentioned any clearances. Anyone think the clearance prices are decent? I find it impossible to tell what the wood looks like from the poor quality pics.

[ja66]

Hello All,
A bit about myself...I live in Mississauga, and currently shopping and learning how to buy hardwood. We need 450 sq. ft. for small family room/dining room area, solid 3 1/4" red oak, Canadian product.
What we have looked at so far:
Mirage...overbudget at this time for us.
Perverco....colour: Java...a bit slick, but like the colour.
Appalachian....Mocha ...like the colour...seems to have a good reputation
Model....Victorian colour....absolutely the colour we're looking for.
Monticello....I think Gunstock or Saddle from a hardwood store at Keele and 7, northeast corner. (sorry, forgot name).
Quality: Clear, Select and Better. Although the Model is Pacific grade, but very clear all the same.

Ok, sounds like we're doing pretty good huh?! Well..not really. We keep getting conflicting information. Of course we went to Brampton Hardwood. Loved the Embassy and Continental Oak stuff...they said "oh of course made in Canada" and come to find out.....I cant verify that because absolutely nothing available online to list it as Canadian.

This is what I've been told, and is confusing and conflicting information....
The guy from Alexanian on Erin Mills Parkway...said Mirage is out of business because they have used foreign material. Also said Canadian Hardwood has a seal on the bottom of the boards and that Perverco is a sister company of Mirage. Said Perverco was a fantastic brand.
Was told by a flooring store in Mississauga, that Canadian products DO NOT have a coating on bottom and ONLY Chinese products have it. If this is true, then Perverco must dabble with foreign stock? Aye, aye, aye!!!
Was told by the same guy in Mississauga that Model hardwood is a top notch company and have very little defects and that 5% waste is true to this product as with Chinese, more like 20% waste is average rate.

Where is the cheapest place I can find Model hardwood...Pacific grade, Red Oak, Victorian colour? I see Rab in Ottawa found it for 5.60 a square foot but where in the GTA or surrounding area can I find it for that price? We only need 400 sq. ft. right now. Also looking to buy wrought iron ballisters to replace wood ones and would be great if we could find a one stop shop. If not, does anyone have a recomendation as to where we can look for iron rails for the stairwell. (gonna paint the sides and risers trim colour, stain banister and replace ballisters with iron).

Thank you kindly for your time,
Ja66.
:-)

[xstatik]

What is the proper way to install Oak Hardwood floors on OSB (OSB Installed by Fieldgate Homes)???

I've heard/read that I need Plywood Subfloors? Glue? Glue and Nails?
I'm confused by all the conflicting information about OSB and Hardwood Floors.

Thanks,

[patrob]

Yikes, so it is a major problem. That's bad news as there are three such major puckers that we noticed. It would seem that they would need to pull up most of the floor to fix the problem.

Any advice on how we can address the issue now, prior to the PDI and moving in? I tried today and was told not to worry, that everything will be taken care of. Though the impresion I got is that they are gonna see if the floor "settles". Maybe if I go back in on the weekend and it hasn't settled I canmention it again. I want to be firm with the super but not piss him off so that he asks for the key back and doesn't let me go back into the house. I know his arguement will be for me not to worry, that I'm not viewing the finished product yet. I just don't wanna wait and THEN have to have everything redone.

All the service & repairs are up to the site super & his schedule. Just remember everything has to be noted in PDI even if they say they will remember to fix it.

[patrob]

Thanks for the quick response.

If memory serves me correctly, that price was without tax. I had forgotten to provide the type which is "tigerwood". Still seem on the expensive side? Other types were more expensive than that with the most expensive being about $12-13 /sq ft.

Tigerwood Solid Sawn in 5" is a special order & more expensive but still should be below $9 sq. ft. Which one was $12-$13 sq. ft. :eek:
I think I should move to Ottawa & start selling there :D

[patrob]

I finally completed the floor DIY project thanks to Patrob and it is my great DIY achievement so far. I now have a small question for you. I made a mistake by leaving a small gap between the side of my stair planks and side drywall. The old baseboard marks are left by old carpet floor stair when I took off baseboard for stair installation. You can see my installed stair photos in my image links.

http://cid-0388f9cfaf3eb807.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/floor^_install/entry^_stair1.jpg

or click the link below:

http://cid-0388f9cfaf3eb807.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/floor^_install/entry^_stair1.jpg

How should I fix this? Use a white baseboard or quarter round to cover the gap or is any other better way? Please let me know if you cannot see my image fro the above links and I will try to upload my images to a different host site. Thanks again.
I would fix the walls first (plaster). Baseboard will finish at the edge of nosing on the upper part. On the bottom the baseboard will finish at the riser. So all you have to fix is in between. It will look little bit awkward with a baseboard on the step. Some sort of moulding in the colour of the wood will look better.
BTW looks pretty good http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/grinser/grinning-smiley-003.gif

[patrob]

What is the proper way to install Oak Hardwood floors on OSB (OSB Installed by Fieldgate Homes)???

I've heard/read that I need Plywood Subfloors? Glue? Glue and Nails?
I'm confused by all the conflicting information about OSB and Hardwood Floors.

Thanks,

3/4" OSB is equivalent to 5/8" plywood which is required by most of the manufacturers for nail down installation. As long as the sub-floor is stable (no squeaks) & dry just nail it. Glue only nosings, reducers, transitions.

[patrob]

Hello All,
A bit about myself...I live in Mississauga, and currently shopping and learning how to buy hardwood. We need 450 sq. ft. for small family room/dining room area, solid 3 1/4" red oak, Canadian product.
What we have looked at so far:
Mirage...overbudget at this time for us.
Perverco....colour: Java...a bit slick, but like the colour.
Appalachian....Mocha ...like the colour...seems to have a good reputation
Model....Victorian colour....absolutely the colour we're looking for.
Monticello....I think Gunstock or Saddle from a hardwood store at Keele and 7, northeast corner. (sorry, forgot name).
Quality: Clear, Select and Better. Although the Model is Pacific grade, but very clear all the same.

Ok, sounds like we're doing pretty good huh?! Well..not really. We keep getting conflicting information. Of course we went to Brampton Hardwood. Loved the Embassy and Continental Oak stuff...they said "oh of course made in Canada" and come to find out.....I cant verify that because absolutely nothing available online to list it as Canadian.

This is what I've been told, and is confusing and conflicting information....
The guy from Alexanian on Erin Mills Parkway...said Mirage is out of business because they have used foreign material. Also said Canadian Hardwood has a seal on the bottom of the boards and that Perverco is a sister company of Mirage. Said Perverco was a fantastic brand.
Was told by a flooring store in Mississauga, that Canadian products DO NOT have a coating on bottom and ONLY Chinese products have it. If this is true, then Perverco must dabble with foreign stock? Aye, aye, aye!!!
Was told by the same guy in Mississauga that Model hardwood is a top notch company and have very little defects and that 5% waste is true to this product as with Chinese, more like 20% waste is average rate.

Where is the cheapest place I can find Model hardwood...Pacific grade, Red Oak, Victorian colour? I see Rab in Ottawa found it for 5.60 a square foot but where in the GTA or surrounding area can I find it for that price? We only need 400 sq. ft. right now. Also looking to buy wrought iron ballisters to replace wood ones and would be great if we could find a one stop shop. If not, does anyone have a recomendation as to where we can look for iron rails for the stairwell. (gonna paint the sides and risers trim colour, stain banister and replace ballisters with iron).

Thank you kindly for your time,
Ja66.
:-)
Mirage is def. not out of business. Preverco is not a sister company of Mirage unless Mirage bought them off. Stay away from Brampton Hardwood, they don't sell quality products especially their Chinese made "Continental" brand. And yes, under coated wood is usually Chinese made:idea:
Mirage, Model, Appalachian, is cheaper in Ottawa/Quebec because it's considered local. It will be a little bit more expensive here. You don't have a lot of square footage to worry about the price.

Support your local economy & buy Vintage which is even better :)

[canuck88]

None of my friends with houses over 2,500 sq ft are able to keep their humidity above 35% in the winter... any tips on getting it to the 45% range?



A hygrometer will tell you everything & they are inexpensive. The dials on the humidifier are often inaccurate unless you have digital setting with sensor. If you have shutters or very thick window coverings, condensation will happen due to inadequate air circulation around the window. Try to turn on your fan more often to circulate the air.

[patrob]

None of my friends with houses over 2,500 sq ft are able to keep their humidity above 35% in the winter... any tips on getting it to the 45% range?

Adequate central humidifier & fan running constantly on very dry days. HRV systems work very well too.

[canuck88]

Adequate central humidifier & fan running constantly on very dry days. HRV systems work very well too.

I have a GeneralAire 1042; even when running the fan I rarely reach 40%. Same with my inlaws :(

[Maymybonneliveforever]

My home is over 2000 sq. ft. I've turned off the humidifier and can't keep the relative humidity under 46%. We just replaced our furnace and windows are going in next month.

[txenglan]

Tigerwood Solid Sawn in 5" is a special order & more expensive but still should be below $9 sq. ft. Which one was $12-$13 sq. ft. :eek:
I think I should move to Ottawa & start selling there :D

I'm not sure it was in 5" but it certainly was plank style stuff.

She rhymed off a bunch of types that were in the $12-13 range but by that point I was in saturation mode. I hate not having all the figures at my disposal. I'd like to have them, even if they are only approximate and subject to a certain amount of expected haggling. Now I am second guessing what she told me due to the fact I couldn't jot it all down at the rate she was throwing figures and statistics at me.

I am now at a critical juncture as of today as the carpet cleaning guys told me that the previous owners have essentially destroyed the carpet beyond repair/cleaning. So now I am in a difficult situation as I had intended to take my time doing hardwood on the 3rd floor at my pace, enjoying myself and learning as I go. This is no longer an option as I have ripped out all the carpet as of this afternoon. Couldn't bare to look at it LOL.

So I now need approx 430 Sq Ft of hardwood installed on the entire third floor (3 bedrooms and adjoining hallway) and about 26 stairs. I am definitely going to do all of the upstairs in hardwood but I think I may have to hold off on stairs due to sheer expense. Originally, I had wanted to do the upstairs at my own pace but that was assuming that I could get the gunk out of the carpet from previous owner. Now, I am forced to get a pro to do the install. Will probably have to do carpet on stairs for now unless I get an outstanding deal on hw. Perhaps I will just do the master bedroom in hardwood for now and still leave the hallways and other rooms for my own project this winter. That would be difficult though as I do need to store stuff in those other rooms and now there is no carpet :mad:

If anyone has any recommendations for good, yet competitively-priced installers other than Westboro Flooring in Ottawa, please let me know. If I somehow manage to find the time to immediately take this project on myself, I will no doubt have many annoying questions for you, Patrob :lol:

[patrob]

I have a GeneralAire 1042; even when running the fan I rarely reach 40%. Same with my inlaws :(

There must be something wrong. It's a good humidifier & should easily reach higher humidity. Have you checked the water flow? Filter? By-pass? Is it installed properly?

[patrob]

My home is over 2000 sq. ft. I've turned off the humidifier and can't keep the relative humidity under 46%. We just replaced our furnace and windows are going in next month.

If it's below 55% you're fine for solid hardwood.

[patrob]

I'm not sure it was in 5" but it certainly was plank style stuff.

She rhymed off a bunch of types that were in the $12-13 range but by that point I was in saturation mode. I hate not having all the figures at my disposal. I'd like to have them, even if they are only approximate and subject to a certain amount of expected haggling. Now I am second guessing what she told me due to the fact I couldn't jot it all down at the rate she was throwing figures and statistics at me.

I am now at a critical juncture as of today as the carpet cleaning guys told me that the previous owners have essentially destroyed the carpet beyond repair/cleaning. So now I am in a difficult situation as I had intended to take my time doing hardwood on the 3rd floor at my pace, enjoying myself and learning as I go. This is no longer an option as I have ripped out all the carpet as of this afternoon. Couldn't bare to look at it LOL.

So I now need approx 430 Sq Ft of hardwood installed on the entire third floor (3 bedrooms and adjoining hallway) and about 26 stairs. I am definitely going to do all of the upstairs in hardwood but I think I may have to hold off on stairs due to sheer expense. Originally, I had wanted to do the upstairs at my own pace but that was assuming that I could get the gunk out of the carpet from previous owner. Now, I am forced to get a pro to do the install. Will probably have to do carpet on stairs for now unless I get an outstanding deal on hw. Perhaps I will just do the master bedroom in hardwood for now and still leave the hallways and other rooms for my own project this winter. That would be difficult though as I do need to store stuff in those other rooms and now there is no carpet :mad:

If anyone has any recommendations for good, yet competitively-priced installers other than Westboro Flooring in Ottawa, please let me know. If I somehow manage to find the time to immediately take this project on myself, I will no doubt have many annoying questions for you, Patrob :lol:
Did you search for other hardwood installers suggested in the BuildingHomes Ottawa forum?? People there have recommend hardwood companies they used. About the stairs, if it's a straight staircase & you would be willing to do a 2 tone staircase, you might get away with re-capping treads & new risers. It can be a DIY project for the long winter snowy months :D
And regarding Westboro, some homeowners were complaining about their "quality" of installation. Do a search on Building Homes.

[txenglan]

Did you search for other hardwood installers suggested in the BuildingHomes Ottawa forum?? People there have recommend hardwood companies they used. About the stairs, if it's a straight staircase & you would be willing to do a 2 tone staircase, you might get away with re-capping treads & new risers. It can be a DIY project for the long winter snowy months :D
And regarding Westboro, some homeowners were complaining about their "quality" of installation. Do a search on Building Homes.

It is indeed a straight staircase in terms of there being no curves or winding. There are two flights of stairs with a 2 x 90 degree turns per floor. I have ripped all the carpet off them as well so I could wait until later on but it would look like absolute heck for the time being :) Also, the second floor appears to be some sort of oak that is supposed to match the banisters (which are worn and tired looking). It would be a challenge to install hw on those stairs while matching what is on the second floor and the current banisters. For the time being, I am thinking that if I limit my install to the 3rd floor, I can use carpet on the stairs as a transition from the oak on second to something more exciting on 3rd, with the intention of eventually replacing the oak on 2nd (even though it is in excellent condition) to match the 3rd floor.

Thanks for the tip on checking out Building Homes. I was on there earlier but couldn't find much discussion about hardwood retailer/installers in Ottawa but found a few dialogues on hardwood being installed with the building of the new home. I'll head over there again now and do some more searching. The reason I went to Westboro Flooring is because of one of two recommendations elsewhere on RFD. If their install quality is questionable, I want to stay well away from them, not just for obvious reasons but in particular that she was actually claiming to have the best install quality around. She kept harping on about how the prices they charge are a bit higher than some other joints but that this is because they do not use "seasonal" or part time installers....only the best professionals in the biz. I was actually put off by her rant on this and how she put down all the competition. I wish I was either living in TO (so that I could request that you to do my install or recommend me an installer) or that their was more in-depth, animated discussion going on about options in Ottawa.

Thanks again for your continued, insightful help!

[txenglan]

Holy! Found it! I just read about the nightmares some of the posters at Buildinghomes.ca had with Westboro Flooring and I am now convinced that I won't be pursuing anything else with them. Yikes. I think I'll check out Alexanian next.

[patrob]

Holy! Found it! I just read about the nightmares some of the posters at Buildinghomes.ca had with Westboro Flooring and I am now convinced that I won't be pursuing anything else with them. Yikes. I think I'll check out Alexanian next.

I knew you would find it :cheesygri

[jingyu]

Westboro is the only Vintage dealer in Ottawa area. I was quoted Vintage maple hardwood 3 1/2" as $7.5 per sf. while Mirage is only $6 per sf. How much is in Toronto area? Thanks.

Holy! Found it! I just read about the nightmares some of the posters at Buildinghomes.ca had with Westboro Flooring and I am now convinced that I won't be pursuing anything else with them. Yikes. I think I'll check out Alexanian next.

[txenglan]

Westboro is the only Vintage dealer in Ottawa area. I was quoted Vintage maple hardwood 3 1/2" as $7.5 per sf. while Mirage is only $6 per sf. How much is in Toronto area? Thanks.

Seems that a new website is in order: www.ottawatorontohardwoodprices.com :) I'd love to be able to see a list of dealers along with their prices/specials, materials, sizes - updated on a weekly, monthly, daily basis. If I can find the time, I might start such a thing but I have no idea how I will get a steady flow of accurate, updated data to populate such a site.

[txenglan]

Westboro is the only Vintage dealer in Ottawa area. I was quoted Vintage maple hardwood 3 1/2" as $7.5 per sf. while Mirage is only $6 per sf. How much is in Toronto area? Thanks.

Btw, Westboro is not the only dealer in Ottawa. Rome Flooring and Allied Flooring are on the list.

[patrob]

Westboro is the only Vintage dealer in Ottawa area. I was quoted Vintage maple hardwood 3 1/2" as $7.5 per sf. while Mirage is only $6 per sf. How much is in Toronto area? Thanks.

Huntclub Flooring & Rome Flooring sell Vintage hardwood in Ottawa www.huntclubhardwood.com & www.romeflooring.com
Here in GTA should be around $6.60 or so depending on grade, colour, width, etc.

[txenglan]

I called around Ottawa today and got the following general quotes:

Rome Flooring ltd.

Vintage
both solid & solid sawn Tigerwood
3.25" = $9.60 sq ft installed w/ pst (gst is extra)
supply (no install) = $7.06 sq ft

Handscraped solid sawn white oak buckingham
5" planks = $10.96 sq ft installed w/pst + gst
@ 7" $12.30 sq ft + gst

Oak natural prefinish
3.25" = $9.19 sq ft
supply = $7.06 sq ft

Black walnut - Natural
3.25" = $12.75 sq ft
w/ monarch $13.02

Maple
3.25" = $9.60 + up

Mont royal (all prices per sq ft - I think it was all for 3.25"):

red oak natural = $7 installed

Maple = $7

Birch = $6.40
w/stain $7.30

American Cherry = $6.60

__________________________________

Barwood

Mirage

$2.50 sq ft install + screwing sub floor = 65 cents per sq ft + extras = up to $13-14 sq ft total if carpet removal, baseboards etc are required to be removed

All prices are by sq ft + install rate (see above):

brazillian cherry = $7.75

Birch = $5 - $6

Maple = $6 - $7

Walnut = $8

American Cherry = $7.75

_________________________________

Alexanian

Muskoka (ontario)

Comments on quality/reputation of all the following producers welcome. Oddly, he claimed that, despite what their website says, they do not carry Lauzon.

$2.75 sq ft install on all:

tigerwood engineered = $7.79
tigerwood natural exotic = $7.42

maple stain 3.5" = $7.79

red oak 3.25" = $6.49

maple stain 3.25" = $6.79

brazillian cherry natural 3.25" = $6.99
or 4" $7.39

preverco

I didn't ask for any quotes on this. No idea about quality.

Northern

Again, no idea about reputation or quality

red oak stain = $6.55

maple stain = $6.50


Sooooooo....I am now leaning in the direction of going with Rome Flooring as they had excellent over-the-phone mannerisms and professionalism. Also, they are one of the only retailers/installers that have good feedback (or any feedback LOL) in this forum and @ buildinghomes.ca

Comments/recommendation and suggestions as per above-provided pricing are very much welcome! Also, I still need to put carpet on stairs. Thus, if anyone can recommend an installer in Ottawa, would much appreciate!

[rab]

My wife likes the look of birch/maple floors over oak - doesn't like the grainy look.

Birch is cheaper than maple and oak. What are the disadvantages of birch?

thanks

rab

[patrob]

My wife likes the look of birch/maple floors over oak - doesn't like the grainy look.

Birch is cheaper than maple and oak. What are the disadvantages of birch?

thanks

rab

It's softer than maple or oak. It has the "look" of maple but it will show defects & damages more than maple. If looking for lighter colours, will show more variation in colour & streaks/knots. That's why it's cheaper than Maple. Beware when you are choosing maple or birch when you have kids or pets in the house. Because of its smooth finish, it shows everything.

[patrob]

Sooooooo....I am now leaning in the direction of going with Rome Flooring as they had excellent over-the-phone mannerisms and professionalism. Also, they are one of the only retailers/installers that have good feedback (or any feedback LOL) in this forum and @ buildinghomes.ca

Comments/recommendation and suggestions as per above-provided pricing are very much welcome! Also, I still need to put carpet on stairs. Thus, if anyone can recommend an installer in Ottawa, would much appreciate!
Looks like you have been very busy :D

Hire those that you feel the most comfortable with. Ask for references or pics of previous jobs if you can't find any reviews online. Always follow your gut feeling.

[txenglan]

Looks like you have been very busy :D

Today, I have been :) Made use of staying at home so as to not breathe my cold germs all over everyone at work.


Hire those that you feel the most comfortable with...

Well then, you and your husband are hereby commissioned to install my floor! :)

[Odd I/O]

Today, I have been :) Made use of staying at home so as to not breathe my cold germs all over everyone at work.



Well then, you and your husband are hereby commissioned to install my floor! :)

Do flooring stores actually give you their best price over the phone? Did you try negotiating over the phone?

I'm just wondering if you can get a better price if you talked to them in person face to face. Otherwise phoning around for price quotes would be pretty convenient.

[txenglan]

Do flooring stores actually give you their best price over the phone? Did you try negotiating over the phone?

I'm just wondering if you can get a better price if you talked to them in person face to face. Otherwise phoning around for price quotes would be pretty convenient.

My cunning plan is to get a rough idea of how competitive they are over the phone. If they are morons on the phone, I won't bother to see them in person. Clever, eh? :cheesygri

[zodieman]

Can anyone who's an expert tell me if I can get something very close in colour to Satin Finish Regency Plank in Oak Mocha?

The house I'm moving into in early December has main floors from Satin Finish in this colour and we'd like to do the master bedroom and upper hallway to match as best as possible. Short of actually buying the same brand and finish of course!

Speaking of which, who would have the best price on the same flooring I have? I should mention the width of the planks is 2 1/4" and we need about 260 square feet. We live in Aurora but we can go anywhere in the GTA to get it.

Thanks

[patrob]

Well then, you and your husband are hereby commissioned to install my floor! :)
Sorry a bit too far :cheesygri

[patrob]

Can anyone who's an expert tell me if I can get something very close in colour to Satin Finish Regency Plank in Oak Mocha?

The house I'm moving into in early December has main floors from Satin Finish in this colour and we'd like to do the master bedroom and upper hallway to match as best as possible. Short of actually buying the same brand and finish of course!

Speaking of which, who would have the best price on the same flooring I have? I should mention the width of the planks is 2 1/4" and we need about 260 square feet. We live in Aurora but we can go anywhere in the GTA to get it.

Thanks

If you want the exact match, then I would go with the same brand & colour. You will have to call around for best pricing if you want to buy the wood yourself.

[txenglan]

Sorry a bit too far :cheesygri

D'oh! Free cheese and wine!!??? :lol:

I am getting closer to making a final call on what I will have installed (yet kicking myself that I won't be doing it, as I would love to do so) and I have just about decided that Vintage is the way for me to go. I am leaning in the direction of:

3.25" Solid Sawn Tigerwood - But I am concerned about many of the cautioning statements you have made wrt exotic species, be they solid sawn or not

3.25" Solid Sawn Jatoba (natural or stained)

3.25" Solid Sawn Macaranduba (natural or stained)

5" Solid Sawn Maple (which I can't find on the Vintage site but Rome Flooring says does exist) (natural or stained)

3.25" Pioneered Oak in "white oak/old oak"

I'm fairly flexible and would like to pick one of these, based on the best deal/quality and humidity tolerance. From what I gather, the oak is the champion of humidity tolerance so I know that is #1 in that category. As far as pricing goes, notwithstanding the quotes I get tomorrow from Hunt Club Flooring, here are the best prices per sq ft for all of the above (all of which are from Rome Flooring) including install cost and PST but without GST :


3.25" Solid Sawn Tigerwood - $9.60

3.25" Solid Sawn Jatoba - natural - $9.19

3.25" Solid Sawn Macaranduba - $9.60

5" Solid Sawn Maple - $10.40

3.25" Pioneered red oak in "white oak/old oak" -$9.19 to $9.60 (forgot to ask about the exact price for aforementioned stain)

3.25" Pioneered white oak in "white oak/old oak" - $8.38 to $8.85 (again, forgot to ask about the stain but somewhere in that range)


Seeing as I obviously like some variation and character and would prefer not to worry about humidity (although I think my house will be fine in terms of variation), what would you recommend out of all those? For reference sake, I have no kids, pets of anything else that will ruin floors (other than my own stupidity). I am guessing you will tell me to go for the red oak with a stain right? :cheesygri:confused:

Thanks again for the incredible help you have provided to us all. Your work here is a specimen of cyber-enabled philanthropy and is a testament to the incalculable, ever-increasing value of RFD to the deal-hunting, home-improvement and Staples-bashing community :lol:

[kingfencer]

where is the cheapest place to get hardwood floor?
rona, home depot?

[zodieman]

If you want the exact match, then I would go with the same brand & colour. You will have to call around for best pricing if you want to buy the wood yourself.

Thanks, duly noted but can you give me some suggestions on who I should call to start? There are so many companies that sell hardwood flooring! Are there any that are good to deal with and known to give good deals without calling around and trying to price match etc?

[netcbc]

anyone have any experience with markham flooring?

[Weber]

Hi Patrob,

I currently live in a condo and I have my engineered hardwood floor installed about a year ago with cork underlay (on concrete floor). Now it seems that various areas has become "unglued" such that when you step on these areas, you can see the boards going up and down; you also hear the sound of the glue coming undone. My question is what do you think caused this and what could be done to fix it? (These "unglued" areas are expanding and I am encountering more and more of them month after month)

I am also considering installing pure hardwood (not engineered) in my condo and would prefer the nailed down solution given my bad experiences with glue. What do you think of this option?

Thanks

[kingfencer]

where is the cheapest place to get hardwood floor?
rona, home depot?

[patrob]

D'oh! Free cheese and wine!!??? :lol:

I am getting closer to making a final call on what I will have installed (yet kicking myself that I won't be doing it, as I would love to do so) and I have just about decided that Vintage is the way for me to go. I am leaning in the direction of:

3.25" Solid Sawn Tigerwood - But I am concerned about many of the cautioning statements you have made wrt exotic species, be they solid sawn or not

3.25" Solid Sawn Jatoba (natural or stained)

3.25" Solid Sawn Macaranduba (natural or stained)

5" Solid Sawn Maple (which I can't find on the Vintage site but Rome Flooring says does exist) (natural or stained)

3.25" Pioneered Oak in "white oak/old oak"

I'm fairly flexible and would like to pick one of these, based on the best deal/quality and humidity tolerance. From what I gather, the oak is the champion of humidity tolerance so I know that is #1 in that category. As far as pricing goes, notwithstanding the quotes I get tomorrow from Hunt Club Flooring, here are the best prices per sq ft for all of the above (all of which are from Rome Flooring) including install cost and PST but without GST :


3.25" Solid Sawn Tigerwood - $9.60

3.25" Solid Sawn Jatoba - natural - $9.19

3.25" Solid Sawn Macaranduba - $9.60

5" Solid Sawn Maple - $10.40

3.25" Pioneered red oak in "white oak/old oak" -$9.19 to $9.60 (forgot to ask about the exact price for aforementioned stain)

3.25" Pioneered white oak in "white oak/old oak" - $8.38 to $8.85 (again, forgot to ask about the stain but somewhere in that range)

Seeing as I obviously like some variation and character and would prefer not to worry about humidity (although I think my house will be fine in terms of variation), what would you recommend out of all those? For reference sake, I have no kids, pets of anything else that will ruin floors (other than my own stupidity). I am guessing you will tell me to go for the red oak with a stain right? :cheesygri:confused:

Thanks again for the incredible help you have provided to us all. Your work here is a specimen of cyber-enabled philanthropy and is a testament to the incalculable, ever-increasing value of RFD to the deal-hunting, home-improvement and Staples-bashing community :lol:
Thank you, I am flattered http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/grinser/grinning-smiley-003.gif

Oak & Maple are your traditional floors. There is no 3 1/4" Old Oak only comes in 5" or 7". Stained oak or maple have less variation & natural is too "clean".

Tigerwood, Jatoba & Macaranduba - from those I would take Tigerwood. The most stable & most variation. For any of those species you still have to watch your RH levels but it helps because it's Solid Sawn not solid. Be aware all exotics change colour over time so it will not be exactly as shown on sample.

[patrob]

where is the cheapest place to get hardwood floor?
rona, home depot?

Auction but I personally would not buy anything from there including HD or Rona. Look for sales or specials at hardwood flooring stores.

[patrob]

Thanks, duly noted but can you give me some suggestions on who I should call to start? There are so many companies that sell hardwood flooring! Are there any that are good to deal with and known to give good deals without calling around and trying to price match etc?

Use "Dealer Locator" www.satinfinish.com We don't deal with SF.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I currently live in a condo and I have my engineered hardwood floor installed about a year ago with cork underlay (on concrete floor). Now it seems that various areas has become "unglued" such that when you step on these areas, you can see the boards going up and down; you also hear the sound of the glue coming undone. My question is what do you think caused this and what could be done to fix it? (These "unglued" areas are expanding and I am encountering more and more of them month after month)

I am also considering installing pure hardwood (not engineered) in my condo and would prefer the nailed down solution given my bad experiences with glue. What do you think of this option?

Thanks
This sounds more like improper installation. Possibly not enough or wrong glue used. Did you contact the company that installed it? Who is the hardwood manufacturer?

Not every condo will allow you to install solid hardwood (nail down). Check with the condo management for specs.

[txenglan]

Thank you, I am flattered http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/grinser/grinning-smiley-003.gif


You are welcome! :D



...There is no 3 1/4" Old Oak only comes in 5" or 7". Stained oak or maple have less variation & natural is too "clean".

Ahhhh...now I see. Ouch, that is a disappointment. Maybe it is just me but I find the Vintage website to be confusing. The idea seems to be that you choose a top-level category (pioneered, engineered, solid sawn or solid sawn handscraped) and for each one, you get a listing of available stains and colours. I had thought the "white oak/old oak" colour was available in the pioneered (hence my assumption of availability in 3.25") category as I see no domestic species listed at all in the solid sawn category! :confused: In fact, it confused me even more when I realized that I could not find the type and sizes of "fumed oak" you had been referring to earlier in this thread. To make things even more confusing, despite the fact the website doesn't seem to show any domestics (yet shows "domestic colours") in the solid swan category, the brochure Rome Flooring gave me today clearly shows that it does exist but that it is a "new product". If I am missing something here, please let me know. It just seems to me that the Vintage web page is missing information or is incredibly counter-intuitive.

Incidentally, the guy who came from Rome Flooring to do measurements gently pushed me to consider buying the Goodfellow product, which sells for approx $1 less per sq ft across the board but for which he claims has almost "exactly" the same quality as Vintage. I assume he means the Vintage pioneered line. I ran into the same attitude elsewhere when I went to another store to get a quotation on carpet for my stairs. They scoffed at Vintage and said that you are paying for a name, "much as one would for the prestige of owning a BMW", one guy said. I couldn't help wondering what you would have said to such things :)



Tigerwood, Jatoba & Macaranduba - from those I would take Tigerwood. The most stable & most variation. For any of those species you still have to watch your RH levels but it helps because it's Solid Sawn not solid. Be aware all exotics change colour over time so it will not be exactly as shown on sample.

Hmmmm....thanks for the advice. I asked about RH today when I mentioned my interest in exotics and the guy from Rome Flooring sort of gave me a look of disapproval and said that I have nothing to worry about in "this house", suggesting, I suppose, that he either feels that issues due to humidity are overblown and/or are exaggerated or that my house is not the sort that causes problems (which doesn't make sense to me).

He thought I was nuts for thinking of Tigerwood, since I already have an oak on second floor. He feels strongly that there should be continuity in the house and that by installing anything other than oak (or something that has a similar character) upstairs would infringe upon said continuity. Although this is a terrible generalization, after walking through the house this evening, he does have a bit of a point but I think it would be possible to get away with a transition from 2nd to 3rd floor....but I am beginning to doubt the Tigerwood scenario, though I love how it looks. In any case, I had miscalculated the sq footage on 3rd floor and as a result, the $9.60/sq ft for install was putting me into the $6000 zone for a 560 sq ft total (including 6% waste). I really wasn't counting on paying that type of cash as a first time home buyer and if I had counted on it, I would have wanted to build it into my mortgage, (which my lender discouraged - I still don't know why) rather than paying for it out of my own pocket.....oh well..

Sorry for the apparent stream of consciousness post. I haven't had anything to eat all day and the glass of wine I just gulped down is encouraging my fingers to type with reckless abandon as would inebriated gums flap :lol:

[Weber]

This sounds more like improper installation. Possibly not enough or wrong glue used. Did you contact the company that installed it? Who is the hardwood manufacturer?

Not every condo will allow you to install solid hardwood (nail down). Check with the condo management for specs.

The hardwood came from Quickstyle...paid like 4700 incl installation for around 550 SF of engineered walnut. Do you think that was too much?

I did contact the contractor and they said they will try to fix it by screwing the loose boards to the concrete straight from the surface... I don't think this will be a feasible option as there will be A LOT of screws all over the surface of the floor. The thing is that he cannot even guarantee that this will fix my problem.

Do you have any suggestions as to how to fix it? Also, have you seen any problems similar to mine in the past?

Hypothetically, if condo management allows nail down solution, would you recommend it? Or would you still recommend the glue solution?

Thanks

[sluggy]

Hi,

I was at my folk's house over the weekend and realized that they have a crap load of unfinished hardwood in their aluminum shed. I'm thinking about using it, but since it's been in there for quite some time (probably 8 years+) I'm concerned that it's no good. It's not in any boxes, but the wood is stacked one on top of the other (not leaning against any walls). I think a mouse may have lived in the shed for a bit too while it was in there :)

What can I do to determine if it is still good? Is this a lost cause or can I salvage the flooring?

[haranzo]

Auction but I personally would not buy anything from there including HD or Rona. Look for sales or specials at hardwood flooring stores.

hi Patrob

I am shopping for engineered flooring for my Condo and since I am tight on budget can you recommend on some of the store that you suggest? I am Newbie on this. Most likely I need to hire someone to remove my old carpet and install the new flooring. my condo is around 550 SQ/feet.

My budget is under $4500. and I am looking for hard wood engineered floors that is dark dark ash brown, mid gloss/sheen( I hope I know my colors)...
I saw some at home depot but they are expensive and the Cheap one that I kinda like was call Serenata Oak for 3.79 /SQ feet.

I was looking for Bamboo, but non of them are engineered.

Any suggestion is greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[patrob]

You are welcome! :D

Ahhhh...now I see. Ouch, that is a disappointment. Maybe it is just me but I find the Vintage website to be confusing. The idea seems to be that you choose a top-level category (pioneered, engineered, solid sawn or solid sawn handscraped) and for each one, you get a listing of available stains and colours. I had thought the "white oak/old oak" colour was available in the pioneered (hence my assumption of availability in 3.25") category as I see no domestic species listed at all in the solid sawn category! :confused: In fact, it confused me even more when I realized that I could not find the type and sizes of "fumed oak" you had been referring to earlier in this thread. To make things even more confusing, despite the fact the website doesn't seem to show any domestics (yet shows "domestic colours") in the solid swan category, the brochure Rome Flooring gave me today clearly shows that it does exist but that it is a "new product". If I am missing something here, please let me know. It just seems to me that the Vintage web page is missing information or is incredibly counter-intuitive.

Incidentally, the guy who came from Rome Flooring to do measurements gently pushed me to consider buying the Goodfellow product, which sells for approx $1 less per sq ft across the board but for which he claims has almost "exactly" the same quality as Vintage. I assume he means the Vintage pioneered line. I ran into the same attitude elsewhere when I went to another store to get a quotation on carpet for my stairs. They scoffed at Vintage and said that you are paying for a name, "much as one would for the prestige of owning a BMW", one guy said. I couldn't help wondering what you would have said to such things :)

Hmmmm....thanks for the advice. I asked about RH today when I mentioned my interest in exotics and the guy from Rome Flooring sort of gave me a look of disapproval and said that I have nothing to worry about in "this house", suggesting, I suppose, that he either feels that issues due to humidity are overblown and/or are exaggerated or that my house is not the sort that causes problems (which doesn't make sense to me).

He thought I was nuts for thinking of Tigerwood, since I already have an oak on second floor. He feels strongly that there should be continuity in the house and that by installing anything other than oak (or something that has a similar character) upstairs would infringe upon said continuity. Although this is a terrible generalization, after walking through the house this evening, he does have a bit of a point but I think it would be possible to get away with a transition from 2nd to 3rd floor....but I am beginning to doubt the Tigerwood scenario, though I love how it looks. In any case, I had miscalculated the sq footage on 3rd floor and as a result, the $9.60/sq ft for install was putting me into the $6000 zone for a 560 sq ft total (including 6% waste). I really wasn't counting on paying that type of cash as a first time home buyer and if I had counted on it, I would have wanted to build it into my mortgage, (which my lender discouraged - I still don't know why) rather than paying for it out of my own pocket.....oh well..

Sorry for the apparent stream of consciousness post. I haven't had anything to eat all day and the glass of wine I just gulped down is encouraging my fingers to type with reckless abandon as would inebriated gums flap :lol:

I realize the Vintage website might be confusing. I will gladly forward your comment to them :)

I do agree that Vintage is the BMW or Mercedes of hardwood & Goodfellow is the exact opposite. And all Goodfellow products are made in China!!! Even though it's $1 less they still have a huge mark up on it so no wonder they are pushing a product that they can make more $$ on :rolleyes: I always talk about Vintage because the quality is top notch.

In this country you have two seasons, humid & dry & any hardwood will be affected by changes in humidity. So you have to control it with humidifier or de-humidifier. Perhaps that guy should concentrate on selling carpet not hardwood :|

I do agree on continuity of same or similar species especially if it's an open space. But if it's a totally separate floor, you can get away with it especially if you really like Tigerwood. Domestic is cheaper than exotic so if budget is an issue maybe go with oak. But don't settle for something you will not be happy with, follow your instincts ;)

BTW cheers http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ernaehrung/food-smiley-004.gif

[patrob]

The hardwood came from Quickstyle...paid like 4700 incl installation for around 550 SF of engineered walnut. Do you think that was too much?

I did contact the contractor and they said they will try to fix it by screwing the loose boards to the concrete straight from the surface... I don't think this will be a feasible option as there will be A LOT of screws all over the surface of the floor. The thing is that he cannot even guarantee that this will fix my problem.

Do you have any suggestions as to how to fix it? Also, have you seen any problems similar to mine in the past?

Hypothetically, if condo management allows nail down solution, would you recommend it? Or would you still recommend the glue solution?

Thanks

Sounds like improper installation. Tell the contractor to screw himself & have him replace the floors! Was it done through a store?
We have seen similar problems when wrong glue trowel or glue was used. It's not as simple to fix if even possible. I would not do a nail down in a condo. I would probably float or glue down 3/4" Solid Sawn Eng. Condos are dry & I don't recommend anything than engineered hardwood.

[patrob]

Hi,

I was at my folk's house over the weekend and realized that they have a crap load of unfinished hardwood in their aluminum shed. I'm thinking about using it, but since it's been in there for quite some time (probably 8 years+) I'm concerned that it's no good. It's not in any boxes, but the wood is stacked one on top of the other (not leaning against any walls). I think a mouse may have lived in the shed for a bit too while it was in there :)

What can I do to determine if it is still good? Is this a lost cause or can I salvage the flooring?

That wood is probably good as fire wood only. Even if you bring it inside the house to acclimatize, you will have extremely hard time to fit the boards together. Open a bundle or two & try if it fits together if it does, you may be in luck.

[patrob]

hi Patrob

I am shopping for engineered flooring for my Condo and since I am tight on budget can you recommend on some of the store that you suggest? I am Newbie on this. Most likely I need to hire someone to remove my old carpet and install the new flooring. my condo is around 550 SQ/feet.

My budget is under $4500. and I am looking for hard wood engineered floors that is dark dark ash brown, mid gloss/sheen( I hope I know my colors)...
I saw some at home depot but they are expensive and the Cheap one that I kinda like was call Serenata Oak for 3.79 /SQ feet.

I was looking for Bamboo, but non of them are engineered.

Any suggestion is greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
Any good eng. product will be around $5 plus. Plus installation & carpet removal. Don't forget about quarter round, underlay & possible transition pieces. So $4,500 might not be enough. How about single plank laminate, some of them look pretty realistic & will be much cheaper.

[Weber]

Sounds like improper installation. Tell the contractor to screw himself & have him replace the floors! Was it done through a store?
We have seen similar problems when wrong glue trowel or glue was used. It's not as simple to fix if even possible. I would not do a nail down in a condo. I would probably float or glue down 3/4" Solid Sawn Eng. Condos are dry & I don't recommend anything than engineered hardwood.

Hi Patrob,

My floor was done through an independent contractor, I don't know whether they have a store or not.

What is floating? Is it cheaper than the glue down solution?
What is solid sawn? Is it more expensive?

Thanks

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

My floor was done through an independent contractor, I don't know whether they have a store or not.

What is floating? Is it cheaper than the glue down solution?
What is solid sawn? Is it more expensive?

Thanks

Floating floor is not attached to concrete. It's glued or clicked together plank to plank over some sort of underlay. It's cheaper than glue down. Solid Sawn is an eng. hardwood (3/4" from Vintage) which has the thickest wood veneer on the market & the base is made out of solid wood vs. multi layer ply which gives you extreme rigidity. It's so solid & heavy you can't even feel it's floated. It's slightly more expensive but you spend your money only once. If you need more info let me know.

[taylyn]

I bought an older townhome (approx 35 years old), ripped up the old, disgusting carpeting and low and behold it had hardwood floors. However, there are areas where there is paint splatter. Other than paying thousands to refinish the floors, is there a way to remove the paint splatter?

Also, there are a few areas which have noticeable scratches - can you spot treat areas, or do you have to refinish the entire floor?

Lastly, if I wanted to change the color of the stain, can I do it if I have to refinish anyways?

As you can tell I have zero experience in hardwood floors so be gentle with your reply :) No such thing as a stupid question and all that....

[patrob]

I bought an older townhome (approx 35 years old), ripped up the old, disgusting carpeting and low and behold it had hardwood floors. However, there are areas where there is paint splatter. Other than paying thousands to refinish the floors, is there a way to remove the paint splatter?

Also, there are a few areas which have noticeable scratches - can you spot treat areas, or do you have to refinish the entire floor?

Lastly, if I wanted to change the color of the stain, can I do it if I have to refinish anyways?

As you can tell I have zero experience in hardwood floors so be gentle with your reply :) No such thing as a stupid question and all that....
Don't worry, we're very gentle ;)

Sounds like you will need to have the floors re-sanded, the paint most likely will not come off easily plus you will get rid off all the dents & scratches. Once finished you will have brand new floors for fraction of the cost. Depending how many times the floor has been re-sanded, you can re-stain the floors to any colour most of the time. A floor re-finisher will be better able to tell you what can be done.

[slaman]

I have 5” Vintage Orinoco Solid Sawn hardwood that is about a year old. Unfortunately, due to my ineptitude, the top layer has been scratched by hard plastic chairs... the scratches aren't deep, but there is a significant colour differentiation.

It's almost as though the varnish has come off.

My question is how I can fix this or at least minimize the colour differences in the most cost-effective manner. Do I have to sand/re-finish the whole floor?

[txenglan]

I realize the Vintage website might be confusing. I will gladly forward your comment to them :)

Thanks! :) I'm sure they will be impressed and will offer me a 50 cent/sq ft rebate?!!!?? :lol:




I do agree that Vintage is the BMW or Mercedes of hardwood & Goodfellow is the exact opposite. And all Goodfellow products are made in China!!! Even though it's $1 less they still have a huge mark up on it so no wonder they are pushing a product that they can make more $$ on :rolleyes: I always talk about Vintage because the quality is top notch.

In this country you have two seasons, humid & dry & any hardwood will be affected by changes in humidity. So you have to control it with humidifier or de-humidifier. Perhaps that guy should concentrate on selling carpet not hardwood :|

You are right, of course. I just wished you had been there to respond intelligently to his musings. I am too green to do so, although I pretended to be very knowledgeable :cheesygri



I do agree on continuity of same or similar species especially if it's an open space. But if it's a totally separate floor, you can get away with it especially if you really like Tigerwood. Domestic is cheaper than exotic so if budget is an issue maybe go with oak. But don't settle for something you will not be happy with, follow your instincts ;)

BTW cheers http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ernaehrung/food-smiley-004.gif

I still do like Tigerwood but in order to avoid issues with imperfect humidity, I have been looking for alternatives. Something with character, preferably hard (but that is not entirely necessary) and domestic. I think I've found it; in fact you have mentioned it on a number of occasions throughout this thread:

Hickory

Not only do I like it as a practical alternative, I think I am actually falling in love with it. Perhaps it just the pictures you have provided as examples but I find it to be exotic it its own right and although the available stains are beautiful, from what I am seeing, natural hickory is stunning! Do you happen to have any pics of completed installs in Vintage natural hickory?

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ernaehrung/food-smiley-004.gif

[patrob]

I have 5” Vintage Orinoco Solid Sawn hardwood that is about a year old. Unfortunately, due to my ineptitude, the top layer has been scratched by hard plastic chairs... the scratches aren't deep, but there is a significant colour differentiation.

It's almost as though the varnish has come off.

My question is how I can fix this or at least minimize the colour differences in the most cost-effective manner. Do I have to sand/re-finish the whole floor?

Your installer should have advised you about getting felt protectors under all furniture pieces that go on the floor :idea:

There is really no way to fix it without removing those damaged boards. You can get a touch up kit in the matching colour & try to hide it with that. If your floor is floated you cannot re-finish it.

[patrob]

Thanks! :) I'm sure they will be impressed and will offer me a 50 cent/sq ft rebate?!!!?? :lol:

You are right, of course. I just wished you had been there to respond intelligently to his musings. I am too green to do so, although I pretended to be very knowledgeable :cheesygri

I still do like Tigerwood but in order to avoid issues with imperfect humidity, I have been looking for alternatives. Something with character, preferably hard (but that is not entirely necessary) and domestic. I think I've found it; in fact you have mentioned it on a number of occasions throughout this thread:

Hickory

Not only do I like it as a practical alternative, I think I am actually falling in love with it. Perhaps it just the pictures you have provided as examples but I find it to be exotic it its own right and although the available stains are beautiful, from what I am seeing, natural hickory is stunning! Do you happen to have any pics of completed installs in Vintage natural hickory?

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/ernaehrung/food-smiley-004.gif

Unfortunately I don't have any pics but you are right, Hickory in Character grade will have a lot of variation & it's something that you are looking for. Plus the grain of Hickory is similar to oak.

Here is one pic I found on their website Natural Hickory Select-V grade

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/roomlarge/sde_nathickoryvintage.jpg

[txenglan]

Unfortunately I don't have any pics but you are right, Hickory in Character grade will have a lot of variation & it's something that you are looking for. Plus the grain of Hickory is similar to oak.

Here is one pic I found on their website Natural Hickory Select-V grade

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/roomlarge/sde_nathickoryvintage.jpg

Thanks. I've seen that one but in fact, it was one of the ones that initiated my starting to give serious consideration to hickory.

Tomorrow will be the big day for my decision. It is time for me to make up my ever-changing mind before the inevitable happens and I begin to lust after something weird like an astro-turf or groovy, engineered peanut shell floor :)

[txenglan]

Today, I made up my mind and ordered an install of Vintage 4" Hickory Winchester from Rome Flooring. I'll of course report back on the results of the installation (hopefully with pictures) but for now, let me say that, once again, I am impressed by Rome Flooring. They gave me the best price BY FAR of all the businesses I tried to get quotes from in Ottawa for the Vintage product. Thanks again to Patrob for the tireless & cheerful provision of information, much of which is no doubt annoying rehashes of info that has already been provided, earlier in this thread. With no exception, this thread has been the most useful, informative and interesting thread of all RFD threads I have ever set eyes upon.

[patrob]

Today, I made up my mind and ordered an install of Vintage 4" Hickory Winchester from Rome Flooring. I'll of course report back on the results of the installation (hopefully with pictures) but for now, let me say that, once again, I am impressed by Rome Flooring. They gave me the best price BY FAR of all the businesses I tried to get quotes from in Ottawa for the Vintage product. Thanks again to Patrob for the tireless & cheerful provision of information, much of which is no doubt annoying rehashes of info that has already been provided, earlier in this thread. With no exception, this thread has been the most useful, informative and interesting thread of all RFD threads I have ever set eyes upon.

Great choice ;)

Your floors should look something like this :)

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_7878-sharp.jpg

When they come & install it, make sure they "rake" the floors very well (joints further apart)

[txenglan]

Great choice ;)

Your floors should look something like this :)

Hopefully :) That picture was actually one of the deciding factors for me. I saw it earlier in the thread and thought it would look good in my environment and would be easy to match to the existing oak stair railings/banisters (and future oak stain on them and the floor downstairs).



When they come & install it, make sure they "rake" the floors very well (joints further apart)

Can you elaborate on that point? I assume this means the initial phase in which you lay out the first few rows, cutting a number of different length starter pieces to ensure that the end joints are offset 4 to 6 inches apart for strength and randomness (for appearance)?

[patrob]

Hopefully :) That picture was actually one of the deciding factors for me. I saw it earlier in the thread and thought it would look good in my environment and would be easy to match to the existing oak stair railings/banisters (and future oak stain on them and the floor downstairs).

Can you elaborate on that point? I assume this means the initial phase in which you lay out the first few rows, cutting a number of different length starter pieces to ensure that the end joints are offset 4 to 6 inches apart for strength and randomness (for appearance)?
Yes but in case of 4" or wider planks, you want to keep as far apart as possible.

Here is a good article (http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/5273/1badrackingfloorscp4.jpg) about racking.

[emituofuo]

Patrob,

Thanks for your help on my previous question about vintage fumed oak. Actually, I've made up my mind to go with Mirage red oak since vintage fumed oak is out of my budget. The stain I'll choose is charcoal. And I'm gonna choose Mirage's low sheen finish which they call Cashmere. Oh forgot to mention, this is for my new townhome, and I decided to let the builder to do the HW floor. Now, for the spindle and the handrail of the stairs (I won't install HW on the steps), the builder can match with whatever stain I choose for the floor. But, they can't match the finish, which means the spindle and the railing would be a standard semi-gloss finish. I'm really not confident about the end result of using different finish on the floor and the spindle/handrail. Based on your experience, do you think it's gonna look bad?

[seven_of_nine]

Hello

We're on a budget and looking at paying around $6 per foot. We had decided on hard maple [natural] when I saw a comment about dogs and scratching. We have two dogs and I was wondering if there is another wood we should be looking at? Also, which is a good hardwood company to go with?

Thanks

[MaxwellMcGee]

We are looking at getting Vintage Lock engineered flooring (floating floor install in a condo).

The store/installer has suggested that because it's an engineered with only a very thin amount of actual hardwood, having the wood pre-delivered to acclimate to the condo temperature/humidity is not really necessary and that this can be delivered and installed on the same day.

In your opinion, is this true? Or should we insist they pre-deliver the wood?

Thanks!

[patrob]

Patrob,

Thanks for your help on my previous question about vintage fumed oak. Actually, I've made up my mind to go with Mirage red oak since vintage fumed oak is out of my budget. The stain I'll choose is charcoal. And I'm gonna choose Mirage's low sheen finish which they call Cashmere. Oh forgot to mention, this is for my new townhome, and I decided to let the builder to do the HW floor. Now, for the spindle and the handrail of the stairs (I won't install HW on the steps), the builder can match with whatever stain I choose for the floor. But, they can't match the finish, which means the spindle and the railing would be a standard semi-gloss finish. I'm really not confident about the end result of using different finish on the floor and the spindle/handrail. Based on your experience, do you think it's gonna look bad?

If you are upgrading to Fumed Oak from the builder of course it will be expensive! BTW, how much are you paying for Mirage from the builder (you can PM with the price if you prefer)?

Builders usually offer one type of finish on the stairs, so I am not surprised they can't match it. Builder's semi-gloss is not that shiny anyways as they usually cheap out & apply only 1 coat. Regardless it will not match anyways even if you go with a satin finish. I would not really worry about that.

[patrob]

Hello

We're on a budget and looking at paying around $6 per foot. We had decided on hard maple [natural] when I saw a comment about dogs and scratching. We have two dogs and I was wondering if there is another wood we should be looking at? Also, which is a good hardwood company to go with?

Thanks

I don't recommend maple with pets. Unless you go with hand scraped maple which has more character & more colour variation which will hide scratches & damages better.

Something like this :)

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/278/img8070.jpg

[patrob]

We are looking at getting Vintage Lock engineered flooring (floating floor install in a condo).

The store/installer has suggested that because it's an engineered with only a very thin amount of actual hardwood, having the wood pre-delivered to acclimate to the condo temperature/humidity is not really necessary and that this can be delivered and installed on the same day.

In your opinion, is this true? Or should we insist they pre-deliver the wood?

Thanks!

If it's coming straight from the manufacturer or reputable store, yes it can be delivered & installed on the same day.

[haranzo]

We are looking at getting Vintage Lock engineered flooring (floating floor install in a condo).

The store/installer has suggested that because it's an engineered with only a very thin amount of actual hardwood, having the wood pre-delivered to acclimate to the condo temperature/humidity is not really necessary and that this can be delivered and installed on the same day.

In your opinion, is this true? Or should we insist they pre-deliver the wood?

Thanks!

I am having the same issue, so engineered hardwood floor I don't need to be set in the room temperature.

hi MaxwellMcGee, where are you getting your woods tiles, I am looking for a good quality floors in dark ash color but I have only budget of $4000 (with installation) for 550 Sq feet. Hope yoy know a reputable place were i can get a good deal.

Thanks,

[MaxwellMcGee]

I am having the same issue, so engineered hardwood floor I don't need to be set in the room temperature.

hi MaxwellMcGee, where are you getting your woods tiles, I am looking for a good quality floors in dark ash color but I have only budget of $4000 (with installation) for 550 Sq feet. Hope yoy know a reputable place were i can get a good deal.

Thanks,

Assuming you're in the GTA, we're actually planning on ordering from Value Wood Floors. They have good reviews on Homestars.ca and have the vintage lock engineered in Chariot stain available for $3.50 / sq. ft.

http://www.valuewoodfloors.ca/specials.html

We obviously haven't had anything installed yet, so can't comment on the experience, but we'll report back once we get it delivered/installed.

[Tudval]

What is your opinion on Yellow birch? I was told birch is soft, but it seems to have the same Janka rating as oak. It has beautiful grain pattern, so I was wondering why it'd not as popular? I found a product from Mercier that I really like (in Galliano color) .

[patrob]

What is your opinion on Yellow birch? I was told birch is soft, but it seems to have the same Janka rating as oak. It has beautiful grain pattern, so I was wondering why it'd not as popular? I found a product from Mercier that I really like (in Galliano color) .

It's rated just below red oak. Birch has a smooth finish just like maple & it "shows" damage faster than oak because of the grain.
That's why birch is slightly cheaper because it is softer, shows damage faster & just not as popular as other species.

Try Vintage Maple Yorkshire, very similar in colour to Mercier :) Plus maple is harder.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/builder-selected-maple-yorkshire.jpg

[haranzo]

Assuming you're in the GTA, we're actually planning on ordering from Value Wood Floors. They have good reviews on Homestars.ca and have the vintage lock engineered in Chariot stain available for $3.50 / sq. ft.

http://www.valuewoodfloors.ca/specials.html

We obviously haven't had anything installed yet, so can't comment on the experience, but we'll report back once we get it delivered/installed.

Thanks for the reply, can't wait to see tour results!!

[joshuacat]

Hello.

After doing the bathroom in my house in ceramic tile, my wife thought I would be up to the challenge of installing hardwood. With my limited experience, I think I am up to the challenge of installing Engineered lock hardwood. I looked around at a few stores in my city in Eastern Ontario, and I found our one and only Mirage dealer. After a couple of trips back and forth, we have decided to go with Mirage Red Oak Sierra Lock flooring with a Cashmere finish. The price is about where I wanted to be. Of course, always a little higher, but I found that's what you should expect. I am covering 550 sq ft of floors, so I will be purchasing 600+ sqft. The rooms include a Great room(open concept with our kitchen), and a front living room. The dealer knocked the price down from $6.55 sq ft to $6.24 sqft. Seem fair? -- I haven't signed anything, or paid yet, so I can change my mind. She also mentioned that Mirage has a rebate right now that knocks an additional $10 off per box. Fair deal? As far as the installation goes, do I need an underlayment? What quality, how much per sqft should I expect to pay for the underlayment? As far as the transition pieces, should I get these later after I do the install? --no harm in waiting I would assume. I have vinyl in the kitchen now, and want to go to tile after doing the hardwood(in 6+ months), should I put something temporary, and level the tile with the hardwood later? I don't want to buy transitions that won't work later.

Thanks for you reply in advance.

[aegean]

I don't recommend maple with pets. Unless you go with hand scraped maple which has more character & more colour variation which will hide scratches & damages better.

Something like this :)

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/278/img8070.jpg

Check out My Website for more info ;)

So what do you recommend for pets (70lb dog), Ipe? Tigerwood? Walnut?

I am doing an auto construction in the Montreal area and looking at 3 1/4 inch Mirage Stylish Collection Maple Toffee in the Cashmere finish. I have not take sandpaper to the wood to test it, but unlike other samples I can't get a scratch on it with my nails. So far the best I have found for a 2200sqft order is around $5. I would love to get it at $4.25 but will probably have to wait for the Home Show to score a deal like that.... and since the flooring is not going down till March or so, I have time unless I find a deal now and store it. What do you think?

[CuRaving]

Hi patrob,
I just recently bought some of the exotico hardwood at an auction. I didn't do the proper research. I looked back at your other forums about the same company. Is there anything I can do that will prevent the wood from shrinking and expanding too drastically ? Thank you.

[patrob]

Hello.

After doing the bathroom in my house in ceramic tile, my wife thought I would be up to the challenge of installing hardwood. With my limited experience, I think I am up to the challenge of installing Engineered lock hardwood. I looked around at a few stores in my city in Eastern Ontario, and I found our one and only Mirage dealer. After a couple of trips back and forth, we have decided to go with Mirage Red Oak Sierra Lock flooring with a Cashmere finish. The price is about where I wanted to be. Of course, always a little higher, but I found that's what you should expect. I am covering 550 sq ft of floors, so I will be purchasing 600+ sqft. The rooms include a Great room(open concept with our kitchen), and a front living room. The dealer knocked the price down from $6.55 sq ft to $6.24 sqft. Seem fair? -- I haven't signed anything, or paid yet, so I can change my mind. She also mentioned that Mirage has a rebate right now that knocks an additional $10 off per box. Fair deal? As far as the installation goes, do I need an underlayment? What quality, how much per sqft should I expect to pay for the underlayment? As far as the transition pieces, should I get these later after I do the install? --no harm in waiting I would assume. I have vinyl in the kitchen now, and want to go to tile after doing the hardwood(in 6+ months), should I put something temporary, and level the tile with the hardwood later? I don't want to buy transitions that won't work later.

Thanks for you reply in advance.
Not sure where you're located but that price is on the higher side for GTA. As for underlay use what is specified by the manufacturer. The dealer should be able to tell you what to use. Most of the transitions need similar space between the floors to be attached. Leave about 3/4" or 7/8" space for the T-mold. You should def. put something temporary so you don't damage the edge. If your tiles will be level with hardwood, the T-mold will be most likely the piece to use.

[patrob]

So what do you recommend for pets (70lb dog), Ipe? Tigerwood? Walnut?

I am doing an auto construction in the Montreal area and looking at 3 1/4 inch Mirage Stylish Collection Maple Toffee in the Cashmere finish. I have not take sandpaper to the wood to test it, but unlike other samples I can't get a scratch on it with my nails. So far the best I have found for a 2200sqft order is around $5. I would love to get it at $4.25 but will probably have to wait for the Home Show to score a deal like that.... and since the flooring is not going down till March or so, I have time unless I find a deal now and store it. What do you think?

I don't recommend any smooth finishes with dogs (especially if its active). Def. not Black American Walnut. Ipe Brazilian Walnut is a lot harder & Tigerwood is in the middle. Anything distressed like handscraped would be a lot better choice but Mirage does not offer anything like that. Doesn't matter what kind of finish you have on it, cashmere or not, it will still scratch. The price you were quoted is very good already.

[patrob]

Hi patrob,
I just recently bought some of the exotico hardwood at an auction. I didn't do the proper research. I looked back at your other forums about the same company. Is there anything I can do that will prevent the wood from shrinking and expanding too drastically ? Thank you.

Maintain your humidity right on 45-55%. Keep it in the house for sometime before installation. Make sure the moisture of the wood is not too high before installation. When the wood is installed with higher moisture & then it dries, gaps or cracking shows.

[CuRaving]

Thank you I will try that, but is Walnut ok for the Canadian Climate? Or is it something i should avoid in the future?

[patrob]

Thank you I will try that, but is Walnut ok for the Canadian Climate? Or is it something i should avoid in the future?

Which walnut American or Brazilian? Either one should be fine as long as you maintain your humidity.

[aegean]

I don't recommend any smooth finishes with dogs (especially if its active). Def. not Black American Walnut. Ipe Brazilian Walnut is a lot harder & Tigerwood is in the middle. Anything distressed like handscraped would be a lot better choice but Mirage does not offer anything like that. Doesn't matter what kind of finish you have on it, cashmere or not, it will still scratch. The price you were quoted is very good already.

Not really sure if I like handscraped. The price was due to a Blowout Sale that Mirage had with Barwood Pilon here... and much negotiation... regular contractor price was a buck more. They have agreed to hold the price for a little while, even though the sale will return in 4 to 6 months.

The dog is modestly active but fairly docile in the house and at 3 she has passed the destructive puppy stage. Although Ipe is harder than Maple, would not the quality of the coating make a huge difference? I was shown one Maple (do not remember the brand) but it would not scratch with fine sand paper, try as I might.... it was not Mirage.

[romsan04]

What is the most durable hardwood on the market??
I have two small kids, and dropping, hitting, dragging is very common :)

I had laminate installed in my condo, and it held very well all the abuse you can try.

Thank you.

[amalhi]

I have to install hardwood flooring for my condo living room. I went to one of the Home depot and checked different options for me - Engineered wood and Bamboo.

There is a lot of information about Engineered floor but nothing much about Bamboo wood. Please let me know how good is this wood and where can I buy it. Also if its worth it ?

Other than for personal use, I also want Hardwood flooring to upgrade value of my appartment. From that point of view, which wood out of Engineered and Bamboo is better ?

Thanks for your help.

[patrob]

Not really sure if I like handscraped. The price was due to a Blowout Sale that Mirage had with Barwood Pilon here... and much negotiation... regular contractor price was a buck more. They have agreed to hold the price for a little while, even though the sale will return in 4 to 6 months.

The dog is modestly active but fairly docile in the house and at 3 she has passed the destructive puppy stage. Although Ipe is harder than Maple, would not the quality of the coating make a huge difference? I was shown one Maple (do not remember the brand) but it would not scratch with fine sand paper, try as I might.... it was not Mirage.

Yes the finish plays the biggest role in durability of hardwood. And sand paper is not a proper test. It takes something tiny like a grain of sand or a dull object & some weight on it to make a huge scratch or indentation. But sounds like you already made up your mind on maple :D But when you have hard wood & good finish, that's even better.

[patrob]

What is the most durable hardwood on the market??
I have two small kids, and dropping, hitting, dragging is very common :)

I had laminate installed in my condo, and it held very well all the abuse you can try.

Thank you.

If you are worried about damages, a single plank laminate which looks the closest to hardwood is your best bet. All hardwood will get damaged but like previous mentioned, handscraped hardwood will "hide" some of that damage.

[patrob]

I have to install hardwood flooring for my condo living room. I went to one of the Home depot and checked different options for me - Engineered wood and Bamboo.

There is a lot of information about Engineered floor but nothing much about Bamboo wood. Please let me know how good is this wood and where can I buy it. Also if its worth it ?

Other than for personal use, I also want Hardwood flooring to upgrade value of my appartment. From that point of view, which wood out of Engineered and Bamboo is better ?

Thanks for your help.

You have to treat bamboo same as hardwood, it will get scratched & damaged. As for re-sale value, not everyone likes bamboo. It might be harder to sell with that type of flooring. If you are looking for engineered hardwood or engineered bamboo, always buy from reputable manufacturer, not HD or Rona. Good quality bamboo will run you same if not higher than regular hardwood. Take a look at Vintage, they carry many diff. species, incl. bamboo & it is not sold at HD or Rona. www.vintageflooring.com

[rxdruggist]

Hi patrob

I am looking to have hardwood installed in all 4 bedrooms. I have red oak in the hallway already, so I am limited in my choices, as I have to match stain. Since this is in the rooms I do not want to overspend. Any suggestions. So far I was quoted $4/sq ft for red oak cordovan. Is this reasonably priced?thx

[romsan04]

If you are worried about damages, a single plank laminate which looks the closest to hardwood is your best bet. All hardwood will get damaged but like previous mentioned, handscraped hardwood will "hide" some of that damage.

Ok.
Thank you.

[patrob]

Hi patrob

I am looking to have hardwood installed in all 4 bedrooms. I have red oak in the hallway already, so I am limited in my choices, as I have to match stain. Since this is in the rooms I do not want to overspend. Any suggestions. So far I was quoted $4/sq ft for red oak cordovan. Is this reasonably priced?thx

$4 sq. ft. is a low price for hardwood but depends how good the quality of the wood is? If "Cordovan" refers to Pergo lock, then there is better out there.

[slaman]

Your installer should have advised you about getting felt protectors under all furniture pieces that go on the floor :idea:

There is really no way to fix it without removing those damaged boards. You can get a touch up kit in the matching colour & try to hide it with that. If your floor is floated you cannot re-finish it.

I did have felt protectors but they fell off because the ends were rounded... I've since replaced my chairs so the scratching has stopped.

My boards are floating, but I went with a thicker top-layer specifically for the ability to sand them down as needed!

Where can I get a touch-up kit? Maybe I'll go home and take pictures so you can see what I mean - they are superficial scratches, but there is a significant difference in colour...

How easy is it to replace the damaged boards? I have a few extra ones, so that might actually be an option.

[patrob]

I did have felt protectors but they fell off because the ends were rounded... I've since replaced my chairs so the scratching has stopped.

My boards are floating, but I went with a thicker top-layer specifically for the ability to sand them down as needed!

Where can I get a touch-up kit? Maybe I'll go home and take pictures so you can see what I mean - they are superficial scratches, but there is a significant difference in colour...

How easy is it to replace the damaged boards? I have a few extra ones, so that might actually be an option.

Yes it is possible to re-finish floating floor but most re-finishers don't want to touch it. They don't want to cause themselves any problems. If your floors have any movement (bounce) & you start sanding the floors with the big sanding machine it will cause vibration & the sanding machine will or may leave sanding marks on the floor. Any Vintage dealer will have a touch up kit & regarding the repair, contact the contractor that installed the floor for more info.

[crosser]

Hi Patrob, Thank you first off for all your help in this thread!

I am moving into a house in Jan (brrrr)
We need to replace the carpet in the house: boxed staircase, upper hallway and 3 bedrooms. We cannot afford hardwood througout and the wife likes carpet in bedrooms so we were thinking hardwood on stairs and upper hallway.
There already is hardwood in the living room (pic shown) although its not my first choice. I am trying to either match the one in that room, OR, get one that may be different, but at least compliment it for a year or two until we then replace the living room hardwood AND tile.
So...
- any idea what colour/style this would resemble? I was certain it's maple :s
- any suggestions on a complimenting natural/true brown style (maple)
- any advice/suggestions in picking hardwood for stairs?

Thanks again, any advice is welcome.


http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/members/crosser-albums-misc-picture850-hardwood.jpg

[Odd I/O]

Patrob, can you recommend any store in the GTA that has a large display of Vintage or Mirage Hardwood flooring? I'd especially like to look at some of the exotic's (Tigerwood/Cumaru/etc...). How's Darmaga?

[jingyu]

Good price. I wish I can get the price of Mirage here too.


Not really sure if I like handscraped. The price was due to a Blowout Sale that Mirage had with Barwood Pilon here... and much negotiation... regular contractor price was a buck more. They have agreed to hold the price for a little while, even though the sale will return in 4 to 6 months.

The dog is modestly active but fairly docile in the house and at 3 she has passed the destructive puppy stage. Although Ipe is harder than Maple, would not the quality of the coating make a huge difference? I was shown one Maple (do not remember the brand) but it would not scratch with fine sand paper, try as I might.... it was not Mirage.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob, Thank you first off for all your help in this thread!

I am moving into a house in Jan (brrrr)
We need to replace the carpet in the house: boxed staircase, upper hallway and 3 bedrooms. We cannot afford hardwood througout and the wife likes carpet in bedrooms so we were thinking hardwood on stairs and upper hallway.
There already is hardwood in the living room (pic shown) although its not my first choice. I am trying to either match the one in that room, OR, get one that may be different, but at least compliment it for a year or two until we then replace the living room hardwood AND tile.
So...
- any idea what colour/style this would resemble? I was certain it's maple :s
- any suggestions on a complimenting natural/true brown style (maple)
- any advice/suggestions in picking hardwood for stairs?

Thanks again, any advice is welcome.

http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/members/crosser-albums-misc-picture850-hardwood.jpg

That looks more like natural hard pine. Does not look like maple. Honestly if you don't really like the floors in the living room & you are thinking about removing it in the future, no point in getting anything complimentary if it's not truly what you like. Live with it for a while until you are ready to do all in one shot. It will be easier & you will not have the mess twice. Stairs should be re-faced with full solid treads. I assume it's not a freshly built house. If the stairs are carpeted, have you checked if hardwood staircase is not covered with carpet?? We have seen that many times.

[patrob]

Patrob, can you recommend any store in the GTA that has a large display of Vintage or Mirage Hardwood flooring? I'd especially like to look at some of the exotic's (Tigerwood/Cumaru/etc...). How's Darmaga?

Looks like you already have the answer ;)

[joshuacat]

I understand leaving space around the walls for expansion. What about objects like the carpeted stairs. Bring the hardwood to fit without any space between my bottom stair and the hardwood? Or, leave space, and put down quarter-round? I have a row of single tiles around my fireplace, do I leave space there too, or run it as close as I can to the tile? --I don't want another transition there too.

[patrob]

I understand leaving space around the walls for expansion. What about objects like the carpeted stairs. Bring the hardwood to fit without any space between my bottom stair and the hardwood? Or, leave space, and put down quarter-round? I have a row of single tiles around my fireplace, do I leave space there too, or run it as close as I can to the tile? --I don't want another transition there too.

No expansion gaps around stairs, nosings, tiles/fireplaces. Glue it with PL & nail it in these areas.

[joshuacat]

No expansion gaps around stairs, nosings, tiles/fireplaces. Glue it with PL & nail it in these areas.

Sorry for the questions. Even with the Mirage Lock floating floors you glue and nail it in these areas.

Thanks for your help. Great Thread.

[patrob]

Sorry for the questions. Even with the Mirage Lock floating floors you glue and nail it in these areas.

Thanks for your help. Great Thread.

Oh no, that's only with nail down installation. With floating installation there should be some sort of transition piece between floor & tile.

[Portwest]

Hey, Patrob,

I’ve managed to read through 90% of this thread. Impressive and informative. Patrob, you should get an award for all the work you’ve put into this unique sort of “public service”.

If you don’t mind yet another question, I could use some advice: I’m in a freehold townhome and the entire main floor --- about 600 square feet --- is floored with ceramic tile. In the shared living-dining area, I’m tearing out about 130 square feet of tile in order to have wall-to-wall carpet installed. So the room will be one-half carpet (living) and one-half tile (dining).

I’m suddenly considering replacing all the remaining tile with engineered hardwood. Dining area, kitchen, powder room and hallway, maybe using something like the Vintage Natural Jatoba Estate.

Since I’ve torn out the living area, the drop from the tiled area to the newly-bared subfloor is now nearly one-half inch. The floors themselves seem quite solid. No cracks in the grout or tiles, despite the previous owner having been wheelchair-bound and now my own family foot-traffic. I’m thinking that I might be able to install engineered hardwood right over the tile, but can’t figure out how the differences in floor height would jive with the floor height of the new carpeted area.

Should I add a new subfloor to the area being carpeted, in order to bring it up to the level of the existing tile floor, so that the engineered hardwood would then be the same height? Or will there not be so much of a difference between the carpeted area and the tile/future-hardwood floor? I guess my question is really, do I have to make a final decision on whether or not to go with the engineered hardwood BEFORE I finish carpeting the living area? Or could I carpet my living area, collapse with a sigh of dusty exhaustion and then leisurely start thinking about hardwood after the holidays?

More questions: The main floor powder room is, of course, ceramic tile, and that’s one room where it might be nice to keep it that way. But again, there would be a difference in floor height, if I were to have engineered hardwood installed on top of the existing tile in the adjoining hallway.

How do people deal with this kind of situation? Do most folks simply get the old tile removed? I’d appreciate any advice you might have.

Portwest

[c_ca]

I have two rooms and stairs that I want to do with engineered hardwood. It's carpeted right now, but under the carpet is plywood.

I feel like I could tackle putting hardwood in the rooms, but the stairs are curved and I don't know if I could pull that off.

Can I buy the materials, do the rooms, and then ask an installer to do the stairs?

Thanks!

[lorca]

Hi Patrob,

I've just moved into a really old house with original hardwood that creaks quite a bit. I'd like to replace the hardwood with a floating clic hardwood as I am familiar and most comfortable with this installation process vs gluing or nailing. I would also like to soundproof the first and 2nd floor from airborne and impact noise (I have a tenant on the main floor and I occupy the second).

I've seen the clic products at HD, they seem okay but the selection is not very good. What other clic products do you recommend? I'd looking for a lighter hardwood such as red oak or maple-are they sturdy woods?

Also, what type of underlay would you recommend? Would cork offer the most in terms of sound protection?

How do I go about addressing the creakiness of the floors-should I remove the original hardwood and screw the subfloor down or just lay the new clic and cork on the existing hardwood?

I have a conservative budget but will spend more for better quality and durability.

Any help would be much appreciated,
Lorca

[dcor]

By the "book" 3/4" OSB is required but I don't see much diff. between 5/8" & 3/4". Many builders don't install 3/4" OSB when they install hardwood, so you be the judge ;)

Any additional sub-floor will increase your height at tile & nosings.

Hi Patrob,
My builder has 5/8 OSB as their standard. They are offering to upgrade to plywood for $0.75/sqft. Another thread has suggested that 5/8 will void manufacturer's warranty.. So I am torn.. I don't really have extra $$ for the upgrade, but I don't want to regret not doing this as we plan to live in the house for a long time... Advice will be much appreciated.

[patrob]

Hey, Patrob,

I’ve managed to read through 90% of this thread. Impressive and informative. Patrob, you should get an award for all the work you’ve put into this unique sort of “public service”.

If you don’t mind yet another question, I could use some advice: I’m in a freehold townhome and the entire main floor --- about 600 square feet --- is floored with ceramic tile. In the shared living-dining area, I’m tearing out about 130 square feet of tile in order to have wall-to-wall carpet installed. So the room will be one-half carpet (living) and one-half tile (dining).

I’m suddenly considering replacing all the remaining tile with engineered hardwood. Dining area, kitchen, powder room and hallway, maybe using something like the Vintage Natural Jatoba Estate.

Since I’ve torn out the living area, the drop from the tiled area to the newly-bared subfloor is now nearly one-half inch. The floors themselves seem quite solid. No cracks in the grout or tiles, despite the previous owner having been wheelchair-bound and now my own family foot-traffic. I’m thinking that I might be able to install engineered hardwood right over the tile, but can’t figure out how the differences in floor height would jive with the floor height of the new carpeted area.

Should I add a new subfloor to the area being carpeted, in order to bring it up to the level of the existing tile floor, so that the engineered hardwood would then be the same height? Or will there not be so much of a difference between the carpeted area and the tile/future-hardwood floor? I guess my question is really, do I have to make a final decision on whether or not to go with the engineered hardwood BEFORE I finish carpeting the living area? Or could I carpet my living area, collapse with a sigh of dusty exhaustion and then leisurely start thinking about hardwood after the holidays?

More questions: The main floor powder room is, of course, ceramic tile, and that’s one room where it might be nice to keep it that way. But again, there would be a difference in floor height, if I were to have engineered hardwood installed on top of the existing tile in the adjoining hallway.

How do people deal with this kind of situation? Do most folks simply get the old tile removed? I’d appreciate any advice you might have.

Portwest

Honestly I would remove all the tiles to avoid the big height difference. And then start all over with the flooring of your choice. Or why don't you install the carpet over the existing tile & the only diff. in height will be in the powder room, which you can get a reducer for. And again most folks would remove all the tiles & start fresh.

[patrob]

I have two rooms and stairs that I want to do with engineered hardwood. It's carpeted right now, but under the carpet is plywood.

I feel like I could tackle putting hardwood in the rooms, but the stairs are curved and I don't know if I could pull that off.

Can I buy the materials, do the rooms, and then ask an installer to do the stairs?

Thanks!

If you find the right installer, then yes.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I've just moved into a really old house with original hardwood that creaks quite a bit. I'd like to replace the hardwood with a floating clic hardwood as I am familiar and most comfortable with this installation process vs gluing or nailing. I would also like to soundproof the first and 2nd floor from airborne and impact noise (I have a tenant on the main floor and I occupy the second).

I've seen the clic products at HD, they seem okay but the selection is not very good. What other clic products do you recommend? I'd looking for a lighter hardwood such as red oak or maple-are they sturdy woods?

Also, what type of underlay would you recommend? Would cork offer the most in terms of sound protection?

How do I go about addressing the creakiness of the floors-should I remove the original hardwood and screw the subfloor down or just lay the new clic and cork on the existing hardwood?

I have a conservative budget but will spend more for better quality and durability.

Any help would be much appreciated,
Lorca
Vintage & Torlys make an excellent click eng. hardwood. 6 mm cork will be the best option for sound protection but it's not cheap. Regarding the creaks, I guess it's an old 3/8" strip hardwood. Pretty much impossible to get rid of the creaks without removing the floors.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,
My builder has 5/8 OSB as their standard. They are offering to upgrade to plywood for $0.75/sqft. Another thread has suggested that 5/8 will void manufacturer's warranty.. So I am torn.. I don't really have extra $$ for the upgrade, but I don't want to regret not doing this as we plan to live in the house for a long time... Advice will be much appreciated.

If you are doing the hardwood through the builder & they install hardwood on the 5/8", they have to cover the warranty. $0.75 sq. ft. is the lowest price I have heard so far & it's not that much.

[skywalker]

Hi Patrob,
We bought new house and free upgrades free to choose from Oak to Maple hardwood.
Try try to get best of it. Is Maple (I picked 3 1/4" Godiva estate by Vintage hardwood) expensive than red oaks? Thanks.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,
We bought new house and free upgrades free to choose from Oak to Maple hardwood.
Try try to get best of it. Is Maple (I picked 3 1/4" Godiva estate by Vintage hardwood) expensive than red oaks? Thanks.

Maple is more expensive than oak. But on maple scratches/dents will show faster than on oak. So you have to be more careful with maple.
You're lucky that you can pick your standard hardwood floors from Vintage line, most builders usually offer the lower end hardwood as their "standard".
Plus Godiva is a beautiful colour.

[Portwest]

Honestly I would remove all the tiles to avoid the big height difference. And then start all over with the flooring of your choice. Or why don't you install the carpet over the existing tile & the only diff. in height will be in the powder room, which you can get a reducer for. And again most folks would remove all the tiles & start fresh.

Thanks for the response, Patrob. It’s taken me more than a month to remove the living area tile in my spare time, so I doubt I could get through removing the remaining tile on my own. Carpet would not be a sensible option for the remainder of the main floor (front hallway, kitchen and dining), either.

So I take it by your response that you would not recommend installing engineered hardwood over ceramic tile --- if I were to hire someone to demo the remaining 470 SF of tile, how huge of a job is that? (Beneath the floor is a finished basement, so I wouldn’t want someone to simply jackhammer it out.) Is it ridiculously expensive for such work?

Portwest

[patrob]

Thanks for the response, Patrob. It’s taken me more than a month to remove the living area tile in my spare time, so I doubt I could get through removing the remaining tile on my own. Carpet would not be a sensible option for the remainder of the main floor (front hallway, kitchen and dining), either.

So I take it by your response that you would not recommend installing engineered hardwood over ceramic tile --- if I were to hire someone to demo the remaining 470 SF of tile, how huge of a job is that? (Beneath the floor is a finished basement, so I wouldn’t want someone to simply jackhammer it out.) Is it ridiculously expensive for such work?

Portwest
Technically it's doable to install eng. hardwood over tile but them you get the big height difference. How about your trim, will the doors fit? What is the height diff. on the stairs? What will be the height of your kitchen cabinets (is your kitchen installed on the tiles?) It should not have taken you that long to remove those tiles. It's a messy & dirty job & with some help should be removed in two weekends. Whoever you hire, it will not be cheap.

[Portwest]

It should not have taken you that long to remove those tiles. It's a messy & dirty job & with some help should be removed in two weekends. Whoever you hire, it will not be cheap.

Maybe it “shouldn’t have taken so long”, but geez, I’m just a single working mom in my mid-fifties who’s never done this sort of thing before. I’ve been doing it on my own in my (very tight) spare time with a pry bar and a hammer.

Regardless, I appreciate the info you’ve provided. I'll have to think about how I might remove the remaining tile before going any further.

Portwest

[patrob]

Maybe it “shouldn’t have taken so long”, but geez, I’m just a single working mom in my mid-fifties who’s never done this sort of thing before. I’ve been doing it on my own in my (very tight) spare time with a pry bar and a hammer.

Regardless, I appreciate the info you’ve provided. I'll have to think about how I might remove the remaining tile before going any further.

Portwest

Wow, sorry I did not realize :o :) You are very brave & I am impressed that you have taken on that kind of a challenge upon yourself because it is very hard work. A pry bar & a hammer is pretty much the only thing you can work with. If you don't have much spare time, maybe it's better to leave the rest of the project until spring, days are longer & you can open doors/windows to get rid of the dust faster.

[Portwest]

Wow, sorry I did not realize :o :) You are very brave & I am impressed that you have taken on that kind of a challenge upon yourself because it is very hard work. A pry bar & a hammer is pretty much the only thing you can work with. If you don't have much spare time, maybe it's better to leave the rest of the project until spring, days are longer & you can open doors/windows to get rid of the dust faster.

Thanks. I know I look much younger and stronger on the web. ;) I suspect you're right about leaving it until spring. Maybe I'll be posting in this thread again next year sometime.

Thanks again.

[Angry-Lemming]

Hi Patrob,

I'm looking into replacing the carpet in my suite with flooring. I have been recommended to use laminate due to costs, temperature and moisture concerns.

My suite is on ground level and has no subfloor (concrete below carpet). What width of laminate would you recommend I use. Other than costs and visual appeal, is there anything I should consider?

Thanks.

[dakapelu]

I purchased a 3/4" x 5" solid walnut floor which I'll be (DIY) installing on the the main floor of my house over a 4' (dry) crawl space to 3/4" plywood. The manufacturer (Perverco) indicates a 15lb felt underlay and 2" nails. Some "installers" have indicated I should, omit the felt, glue (PL 400) and nail the floor down to minimize any cupping which I don't mind doing but can anyone help me out with the pros an cons of gluing the floor without felt. I live in Vancouver, BC so humidity isn't much of a concern.

My previous house had 3/4" x 5" solid maple that was professional installed over a 4' crawl space without felt and only nailed which I didn't have any problems with.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I'm looking into replacing the carpet in my suite with flooring. I have been recommended to use laminate due to costs, temperature and moisture concerns.

My suite is on ground level and has no subfloor (concrete below carpet). What width of laminate would you recommend I use. Other than costs and visual appeal, is there anything I should consider?

Thanks.

Single plank 4 side bevel 3 1/2" or wider looks the nicest. Not sure about Vancouver but here in GTA Costco has decent laminate for around $2 sq. ft. or so (depending if it's on sale).

[patrob]

I purchased a 3/4" x 5" solid walnut floor which I'll be (DIY) installing on the the main floor of my house over a 4' (dry) crawl space to 3/4" plywood. The manufacturer (Perverco) indicates a 15lb felt underlay and 2" nails. Some "installers" have indicated I should, omit the felt, glue (PL 400) and nail the floor down to minimize any cupping which I don't mind doing but can anyone help me out with the pros an cons of gluing the floor without felt. I live in Vancouver, BC so humidity isn't much of a concern.

My previous house had 3/4" x 5" solid maple that was professional installed over a 4' crawl space without felt and only nailed which I didn't have any problems with.

Use regular flooring underlay (wax paper) & nail it. Gluing does not help. Wood is extremely strong & will cup if it wants to especially that width.
We usually don't recommend solid wider than 4" & crawlspace wet or dry is always a concern. If you really want to glue it, use trowel on moisture cured adhesive which works a lot better.

[James_TheVirus]

Maybe it “shouldn’t have taken so long”, but geez, I’m just a single working mom in my mid-fifties who’s never done this sort of thing before. I’ve been doing it on my own in my (very tight) spare time with a pry bar and a hammer.

Regardless, I appreciate the info you’ve provided. I'll have to think about how I might remove the remaining tile before going any further.

Portwest

What about renting one of those small handheld jackhammers? They seem to pull up the tiles really quickly and then you would just have to scoop them up and remove them. It might make things a lot faster and you could likely do the whole thing in a weekend. Do you know what I mean?

[dakapelu]

Use regular flooring underlay (wax paper) & nail it. Gluing does not help. Wood is extremely strong & will cup if it wants to especially that width.
We usually don't recommend solid wider than 4" & crawlspace wet or dry is always a concern. If you really want to glue it, use trowel on moisture cured adhesive which works a lot better.

Thanks and how much seasonal expansion would you recommend leaving? The manufacturer indicates 3/4" but that seems like too much and I don't want that thick of baseboard either.

[patrob]

Thanks and how much seasonal expansion would you recommend leaving? The manufacturer indicates 3/4" but that seems like too much and I don't want that thick of baseboard either.

If humidity or moisture is not a concern, 1/2" is more than enough.

[Portwest]

What about renting one of those small handheld jackhammers? They seem to pull up the tiles really quickly and then you would just have to scoop them up and remove them. It might make things a lot faster and you could likely do the whole thing in a weekend. Do you know what I mean?

I know what you mean, and I appreciate the suggestion. I have two concerns: one, the ceiling below is finished and I don’t want to make a mess of it by jackhammering the floor above; and two, the jackhammer would help break up the tile, but it’s the heavy metal mesh set into the cement/mortar that’s the real pain in the gozitza. I don’t think a jackhammer would effectively deal with the mesh.

Again, I appreciate the suggestion, though.
Portwest

[txenglan]

Hi Patrob,

I have finally had the Vintage hickory installed and although there are a few issues (a few gouges, gunk and one or two cracks) I guess they did a decent job. Perhaps I am just too picky. In any case, one outstanding issue is wrt what I do next as in, what is the best way of getting the fine layer of dust off the new floor and out of the cracks. I have used a soft bristle broom to sweep the whole place but of course, there is that smokey layer of non-broomable dust that remains attached to the wood. I could go around with a soft rag but I would still need to get it out of the cracks between the planks (I mean fissures/spaces and not the "cracks I referred to earlier). I used a Swiffer (without liquid) to go over it once but after 40 seconds, it is clogged with fine dust and just pushes the rest of it around on the floor. I am concerned about using a vacuum on the crevices (or at all) as I do not want to scuff the new floor.

What is your professional opinion of the next step in looking after this floor? Would much appreciate the feedback. I also know that Vintage sells the cleaners for future use but I'm guessing I need to get this gunk off first before using the cleaners.

I'll get some pictures taken to attach ASAP but it might be a few weeks before I am able to do so.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I have finally had the Vintage hickory installed and although there are a few issues (a few gouges, gunk and one or two cracks) I guess they did a decent job. Perhaps I am just too picky. In any case, one outstanding issue is wrt what I do next as in, what is the best way of getting the fine layer of dust off the new floor and out of the cracks. I have used a soft bristle broom to sweep the whole place but of course, there is that smokey layer of non-broomable dust that remains attached to the wood. I could go around with a soft rag but I would still need to get it out of the cracks between the planks (I mean fissures/spaces and not the "cracks I referred to earlier). I used a Swiffer (without liquid) to go over it once but after 40 seconds, it is clogged with fine dust and just pushes the rest of it around on the floor. I am concerned about using a vacuum on the crevices (or at all) as I do not want to scuff the new floor.

What is your professional opinion of the next step in looking after this floor? Would much appreciate the feedback. I also know that Vintage sells the cleaners for future use but I'm guessing I need to get this gunk off first before using the cleaners.

I'll get some pictures taken to attach ASAP but it might be a few weeks before I am able to do so.

Glad to hear it's done & def. post some pics :) Vacuum is your best friend. Use a brush attachment specifically made for hardwood floors, that's how we clean our hardwood. Once you are finished, use the spray solution but spray on the cloth not directly on the floor.

[evanryan]

HI Patrob,

Just want to ask your opinion on this.

First of all we will be moving very shortly, so we are trying to get our house
ready for sell within the next few months.

We currently have carpet down, which has to be replaced. I know a lot of people really like harwood floors, but we cannot afford the cost of installing hardwood just for resale.
So that would leave either enginered, or laminate.
Without costing us a lot, we have around 400 sq ft to do, can you recommend a good laminate or enginered flooring to put down,
Torleys, seems to have a good name, but is there a certain selection
we should be looking at, or can we recommend anything else.

Thanks
Paul

[txenglan]

Glad to hear it's done & def. post some pics :) Vacuum is your best friend. Use a brush attachment specifically made for hardwood floors, that's how we clean our hardwood. Once you are finished, use the spray solution but spray on the cloth not directly on the floor.

Thanks again Patrob!

Am I not justified in being worried about scuffing the floor with my vacuum though? It is the old style Phantom Fury and is a little heavy to be dragged across hardwood I think. I'll check if the rollers are rubberized at least before using it. Unfortunately, I have no other attachments with it but I'm sure I can get them off E-Bay.

[patrob]

HI Patrob,

Just want to ask your opinion on this.

First of all we will be moving very shortly, so we are trying to get our house
ready for sell within the next few months.

We currently have carpet down, which has to be replaced. I know a lot of people really like harwood floors, but we cannot afford the cost of installing hardwood just for resale.
So that would leave either enginered, or laminate.
Without costing us a lot, we have around 400 sq ft to do, can you recommend a good laminate or enginered flooring to put down,
Torleys, seems to have a good name, but is there a certain selection
we should be looking at, or can we recommend anything else.

Thanks
Paul
Engineered will still have a wood veneer which will be more expensive than laminate. What colour is the carpet? Is it in good condition?
Not sure what to tell you, some people might be turned off by seeing laminate & the first thing they will do is offer you less money because they now have to rip it out & install hardwood after you just spent all that money on it. It also depends what other houses in the area are selling for & what they have to offer? Yes hardwood will def. help you sell faster but will you get your money back? Unless you find some decent hardwood for a low price & install it yourself, that might work. I personally would not recommend laminate on the main floor.

[patrob]

Thanks again Patrob!

Am I not justified in being worried about scuffing the floor with my vacuum though? It is the old style Phantom Fury and is a little heavy to be dragged across hardwood I think. I'll check if the rollers are rubberized at least before using it. Unfortunately, I have no other attachments with it but I'm sure I can get them off E-Bay.

I see what you mean. See if you can get an attachment for it but you will still have to drag it on the hardwood, that's why I love our central vac, all you are dragging is the hose in a sock :D Or maybe get a small light stick vac with bristles. Those should not damage the hardwood.

[txenglan]

I see what you mean. See if you can get an attachment for it but you will still have to drag it on the hardwood, that's why I love our central vac, all you are dragging is the hose in a sock :D Or maybe get a small light stick vac with bristles. Those should not damage the hardwood.

Ahhhhh...central vac, yes, I can see that. My house is set up for it but I haven't installed one. I'll look around and see what is on the market. Thanks!

[evanryan]

Hi Patrob,

The carpet has to be replaced, no questions asked.
We have been redoing our house as we had planned on staying, but due to
circumstances, we will be selliing over the next few months.

I do agree with your thoughts on the laminate. If we went the Engineered route, what should we expect to pay. I know youo have recommend
Torleys and Vintage in the past, but feel these will do out of our price range.
Is there another brand you could recommend.

We were thinking about going to the Hardwood Flooring store in Burlington to take a look, your thoughts on them.
Even though we live in Brampton, we will not be going to local Hardwood Place with Brampton name in it.


Thanks again
Paul

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

The carpet has to be replaced, no questions asked.
We have been redoing our house as we had planned on staying, but due to
circumstances, we will be selliing over the next few months.

I do agree with your thoughts on the laminate. If we went the Engineered route, what should we expect to pay. I know youo have recommend
Torleys and Vintage in the past, but feel these will do out of our price range.
Is there another brand you could recommend.

We were thinking about going to the Hardwood Flooring store in Burlington to take a look, your thoughts on them.
Even though we live in Brampton, we will not be going to local Hardwood Place with Brampton name in it.

Thanks again
Paul

Prices will vary from place to place. You can even find some eng. for around $2 from auctions which I don't really recommend it but if you want something cheap...

[Bullseye]

We're thinking about redoing our stairs in hardwood (currently carpet), but really have no idea yet what it would cost. Patrob, can you give me a rough price range to help me budget for it? It's 18 stairs and 90 sq ft of landing/hallway. We have tile on the main floor, and plan to leave the bedrooms carpeted. No curves on stairway, all are standard steps.

We'd be looking at a decent quality wood, something dent-resistant.

Do people usually replace their spindles at the same time? Current spindles are builder-standard, and probably would not look good with new wood. Maybe they just need refinishing, not sure.

Appreciate any help!

[crosser]

We're thinking about redoing our stairs in hardwood (currently carpet), but really have no idea yet what it would cost. Patrob, can you give me a rough price range to help me budget for it? It's 18 stairs and 90 sq ft of landing/hallway. We have tile on the main floor, and plan to leave the bedrooms carpeted. No curves on stairway, all are standard steps.

We'd be looking at a decent quality wood, something dent-resistant.

Do people usually replace their spindles at the same time? Current spindles are builder-standard, and probably would not look good with new wood. Maybe they just need refinishing, not sure.

Appreciate any help!

We are looking at doing the same also.
Patrob, you have some good pics on your website of stairs you did? http://floorwood.webs.com/apps/photos/photo/next?photoid=24822817
How did you do these? Did you put down solid treads or is it strips? Especially the wrapped sides of the tread, very thick, what material?
You answered some questions I had earlier, thank you. Still wondering when we rip the carpet off if we should rip off the overhang and glue down oak false tread like these (http://stairtek.com/retread.htm) stain them dark brown along with the main posts and bannister while painting the ballusters and risers white. Ohhh the decisions....

[johnredcorn1]

Hello Patrob. Great forum. I was looking at Muskoka in Ash 3 1/4. The guy quoted me at 5.29 sq foot and install at 2.25.I haven't looked at Vintage yet.Your thoughts about the flooring and price would be a great help. Thanks

[patrob]

We're thinking about redoing our stairs in hardwood (currently carpet), but really have no idea yet what it would cost. Patrob, can you give me a rough price range to help me budget for it? It's 18 stairs and 90 sq ft of landing/hallway. We have tile on the main floor, and plan to leave the bedrooms carpeted. No curves on stairway, all are standard steps.

We'd be looking at a decent quality wood, something dent-resistant.

Do people usually replace their spindles at the same time? Current spindles are builder-standard, and probably would not look good with new wood. Maybe they just need refinishing, not sure.

Appreciate any help!

It costs approx. $150 - $200 per step not including new pickets/spindles. If your current spindles are natural & you are thinking about stain steps, they cannot be re-finished (you can but it takes too long & it's expensive so not worth it IMO). You can paint them white or replace them. The handrail & posts can be re-finished. Most common wood is red oak, you can also go with maple or exotics but price will go up. No hardwood is dent resistant.

[patrob]

We are looking at doing the same also.
Patrob, you have some good pics on your website of stairs you did? http://floorwood.webs.com/apps/photos/photo/next?photoid=24822817
How did you do these? Did you put down solid treads or is it strips? Especially the wrapped sides of the tread, very thick, what material?
You answered some questions I had earlier, thank you. Still wondering when we rip the carpet off if we should rip off the overhang and glue down oak false tread like these (http://stairtek.com/retread.htm) stain them dark brown along with the main posts and bannister while painting the ballusters and risers white. Ohhh the decisions....
Those treads on the pics are caps (full 3/4" solid oak treads) with double thickness front & side. You have the right idea. The Stairtek is pretty much the same thing.

[patrob]

Hello Patrob. Great forum. I was looking at Muskoka in Ash 3 1/4. The guy quoted me at 5.29 sq foot and install at 2.25.I haven't looked at Vintage yet.Your thoughts about the flooring and price would be a great help. Thanks

Muskoka is a good wood with good quality finish. Price looks ok.
What colour are you looking for in Ash & how many sq. ft.?

[johnredcorn1]

Thanks for the fast reply patrob.The color is up to the wife lol but since we have an oak railing stained in golden oak it will have to be close to that color. I saw a pic of the vintage oak gallieano [not the right spelling] it looks good but have not price it yet might be to costly for me. I have about 500 sq feet with waste another 25 I guess.If you can give me quote for the vintage that would be great. Thanks

[patrob]

Thanks for the fast reply patrob.The color is up to the wife lol but since we have an oak railing stained in golden oak it will have to be close to that color. I saw a pic of the vintage oak gallieano [not the right spelling] it looks good but have not price it yet might be to costly for me. I have about 500 sq feet with waste another 25 I guess.If you can give me quote for the vintage that would be great. Thanks

Here is 3" Vintage Red Oak Galliano we recently installed :)

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo-Gallery/IMG_9434.JPG

[Mayoo]

Hi . So mine is a new built house and do u know what temperature setting we should set in our house to safe guard the hardwood floor ? currently we have 21deg in the day and 19 in the night .. our humidity level range between 40-45%

[Bullseye]

It costs approx. $150 - $200 per step not including new pickets/spindles. If your current spindles are natural & you are thinking about stain steps, they cannot be re-finished (you can but it takes too long & it's expensive so not worth it IMO). You can paint them white or replace them. The handrail & posts can be re-finished. Most common wood is red oak, you can also go with maple or exotics but price will go up. No hardwood is dent resistant.

Very helpful, thank you.

Do you service Burlington, or recommend someone that does?

[johnredcorn1]

Hi patrob. Thanks for the pm. After seeing the galleano the wife would like somethig a bit darker the ash looks a bit darker but its hard to tell from a picture.Would there be some way to see some samples. Thanks again

[txenglan]

Patrob,

In ref to my question about acceptable vacuums for hardwood, I have discovered (pleasantly) that I actually have a central vac system that is ready to go. I just need a vacuum (which I have just ordered - a Canavac) and I am laughing. Previously, I had thought that the place had been roughed in or only 1/2-roughed in but I see that this is not the case. Once I have secured the vac and set it up properly, I'll be able to get rid of that fine layer of gunk that is still on my floors. Then I will be able to post pics LOL :)

[patrob]

Hi . So mine is a new built house and do u know what temperature setting we should set in our house to safe guard the hardwood floor ? currently we have 21deg in the day and 19 in the night .. our humidity level range between 40-45%

Temperature does not matter as much as proper humidity. 45-55% humidity is better.

[patrob]

Hi patrob. Thanks for the pm. After seeing the galleano the wife would like somethig a bit darker the ash looks a bit darker but its hard to tell from a picture.Would there be some way to see some samples. Thanks again

This one is 2 1/4" Ash Chianti a bit darker.

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo%20Gallery/IMG_8107-2.JPG

[patrob]

Patrob,

In ref to my question about acceptable vacuums for hardwood, I have discovered (pleasantly) that I actually have a central vac system that is ready to go. I just need a vacuum (which I have just ordered - a Canavac) and I am laughing. Previously, I had thought that the place had been roughed in or only 1/2-roughed in but I see that this is not the case. Once I have secured the vac and set it up properly, I'll be able to get rid of that fine layer of gunk that is still on my floors. Then I will be able to post pics LOL :)

Glad to hear, waiting for the pics :cheesygri

[Maymybonneliveforever]

Patrob, I luv the colour of the wood floor in your last photo as well as the window trim, it adds alot to the room.

[patrob]

Patrob, I luv the colour of the wood floor in your last photo as well as the window trim, it adds alot to the room.

Thanks :)

[garsonk]

Apologies if this has been asked - does anyone know where I can buy good value laminate in Vancouver?

I'm looking for something 12mm, dark walnut color, around 700-800 sq ft.

Thanks!

[crosser]

Here is 3" Vintage Red Oak Galliano we recently installed :)

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/Photo-Gallery/IMG_9434.JPG

Also PM sent with a quote.

Patrob, I like this look very much but in a true brown colour.
Thinking 3" Red Oak Mocha or Chariot - That way we could match closest to the Red Oak False Treads to put on.
1. Which grade is this pic? Select V etc? Do you always quote or recommend 1 type??
2. I am not looking for installation costs only supply, any idea what would be a ballbark cost based on sq ft? (would be about 1000sq/ft) - and with what grade?
3. What is the price premium (ballpark estimate only) for Ash/Hickory? Just to give me an idea.

Seriously, this must be the most useful thread on RFD. thanks for all your valuable info and effort.

[patrob]

Apologies if this has been asked - does anyone know where I can buy good value laminate in Vancouver?

I'm looking for something 12mm, dark walnut color, around 700-800 sq ft.

Thanks!

Try Costco.

[patrob]

Patrob, I like this look very much but in a true brown colour.
Thinking 3" Red Oak Mocha or Chariot - That way we could match closest to the Red Oak False Treads to put on.
1. Which grade is this pic? Select V etc? Do you always quote or recommend 1 type??
2. I am not looking for installation costs only supply, any idea what would be a ballbark cost based on sq ft? (would be about 1000sq/ft) - and with what grade?
3. What is the price premium (ballpark estimate only) for Ash/Hickory? Just to give me an idea.

Seriously, this must be the most useful thread on RFD. thanks for all your valuable info and effort.
The wood in that pic is 1st grade red oak. I will PM you the prices.

You can rate this thread http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/images/rating/rating_5.gif if you find it helpful :)

[francois.legare]

Hello all, thanks for your advice and help.

We had our main floor redone by a contractor. 800 sq ft, old sub-floor removed, redone and leveled w/ OSB 5/8", glued and nailed to the joists.
Wood: Engineered, 'uni-clic' type, 3.5" x 5/8", called 'Imperial Walnut' and made by Trillium, bought at Home Depot.

The contractor installed it as a floating floor w/ an underlay.

The floor cracks a little bit on every step, I think it's not the sub-floor b/c it wasn't cracking at all before the hardwood was installed. In some places, usually b/w two planks, we can feel the planks go down by about 1-2 mm.

I believe the cracking is not normal and the contractor says it is. I'm I wrong?

What can be done about the cracking? What can be done about the planks moving down under our weight?

This is not my cup of tea and I lost confidence in the contractor. Your feedback is appreciated.

Frank

[txenglan]

Hi Patrob,

I'm still trying preparing to make sure I look after my floors properly. I started looking for chair mats (for my office chair) but they are insanely expensive, given that most of them are just big chunks of plastic. Then I started seeing rubber casters for office chairs and got intrigued. What is your take on those vice the mats? I fear that rubber could still wear off the finish over time when rolling in one spot over and over again.

As usual, thanks for your tireless responses! :o

[patrob]

Hello all, thanks for your advice and help.

We had our main floor redone by a contractor. 800 sq ft, old sub-floor removed, redone and leveled w/ OSB 5/8", glued and nailed to the joists.
Wood: Engineered, 'uni-clic' type, 3.5" x 5/8", called 'Imperial Walnut' and made by Trillium, bought at Home Depot.

The contractor installed it as a floating floor w/ an underlay.

The floor cracks a little bit on every step, I think it's not the sub-floor b/c it wasn't cracking at all before the hardwood was installed. In some places, usually b/w two planks, we can feel the planks go down by about 1-2 mm.

I believe the cracking is not normal and the contractor says it is. I'm I wrong?

What can be done about the cracking? What can be done about the planks moving down under our weight?

This is not my cup of tea and I lost confidence in the contractor. Your feedback is appreciated.

Frank
A floating floor will always have some movement. If there is any deflection in the sub-floor (not straight) the floor will move visibly. In some cases you can't get rid of the creaking/crackling sound. It could be the type of flooring or maybe it's installed too tight to the wall or also RH levels will have an affect on it. What is the actual humidity in the house?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I'm still trying preparing to make sure I look after my floors properly. I started looking for chair mats (for my office chair) but they are insanely expensive, given that most of them are just big chunks of plastic. Then I started seeing rubber casters for office chairs and got intrigued. What is your take on those vice the mats? I fear that rubber could still wear off the finish over time when rolling in one spot over and over again.

As usual, thanks for your tireless responses! :o

So called hardwood flooring "friendly wheels" (two tone polyurethane) are good but not that friendly. If there is any debris on the floor & you roll over it with the wheels back & forth, it will eventually damage your finish. Simple area rug is the best solution or a proper chair mat. You spent so much money on the floors, extra $100 or so is nothing for more protection :)

[txenglan]

So called hardwood flooring "friendly wheels" (two tone polyurethane) are good but not that friendly. If there is any debris on the floor & you roll over it with the wheels back & forth, it will eventually damage your finish. Simple area rug is the best solution or a proper chair mat. You spent so much money on the floors, extra $100 or so is nothing for more protection :)

You speak the truth. I wouldn't mind spending that much for protection but not when it is an ugly piece of plastic. Perhaps I will search for a nice rug then :)

Thanks again.

[orispanerai]

Can anyone provide feedback on the quality of Paragon engineered hardwood? I saw 5" black oak for cheap and want to make sure it doesn't fall apart in 5 years. It's cheap so I guess I'm getting what I pay for but hopefully it's better than stuff at Home Depot.

Thanks.

[francois.legare]

A floating floor will always have some movement. If there is any deflection in the sub-floor (not straight) the floor will move visibly. In some cases you can't get rid of the creaking/crackling sound. It could be the type of flooring or maybe it's installed too tight to the wall or also RH levels will have an affect on it. What is the actual humidity in the house?

Humidity, oscillating b/w 35% RH to 50% RH these days, higher in the summer.

There's about .5"-.75" of room b/w the wall and the floor all around.

Can the floor be uninstalled and re-installed using a 'nail down' method?
Can it be nailed down in place i.e. without an uninstall/reinstall?

Thanks for your help
F

[patrob]

Can anyone provide feedback on the quality of Paragon engineered hardwood? I saw 5" black oak for cheap and want to make sure it doesn't fall apart in 5 years. It's cheap so I guess I'm getting what I pay for but hopefully it's better than stuff at Home Depot.

Thanks.

Never heard of them. If it's plywood based engineered, buy only from reputable manufacturer, you don't want it to de-laminate.

[patrob]

Humidity, oscillating b/w 35% RH to 50% RH these days, higher in the summer.

There's about .5"-.75" of room b/w the wall and the floor all around.

Can the floor be uninstalled and re-installed using a 'nail down' method?
Can it be nailed down in place i.e. without an uninstall/reinstall?

Thanks for your help
F
Some click floors can be removed & re-installed. Click flooring cannot be nailed down! Some, depending on the base, can be glued down. But before anything, contact the manufacturer & see what they say.

[Portwest]

Hi Patrob,

Again, great thread.

I finished tearing out the tile in my living room area, and it’s down to a clean, bare subfloor. I’ve got some questions about possibly getting hardwood --- have PM’d you with details. (Hope that’s okay)

Portwest

[mugs_64]

Hey i need some input on the layout of the floor plan on what to do.

all the of the floor on the main level is vinyl except for the carpeted area in the living room. I don't know if I should put hardwood throughout the main floor and just have area rugs in the foyer, livingroom, and small mat in kitchen.
or put ceramic in some areas like in the kitchen or powder room. I want to know peoples thoughts on either way. its not a huge area. however I understand situations with hardwood in the bathroom with water and in the kitchen with the possibility of crumbs and such.

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8672/layoutfloor.th.png (http://img109.imageshack.us/i/layoutfloor.png/)

give me your thoughts

[orispanerai]

Never heard of them. If it's plywood based engineered, buy only from reputable manufacturer, you don't want it to de-laminate.

I think it is plywood. Is that bad? There is a 25 year warranty though. Should I be looking at 3-ply or 5-ply instead?

Thanks.

[tommcl]

I bought some left over kempas (Red hues) from a local ad and really love the looks and contacted the store it was purchased from in London and they no longer carry it. I would love to get some more to do another room. Any suggestions on where to get it in southwestern Ontario? Thanks Tom

[Sweeta]

Hi everyone,
Our builder is offering us parquet or carpet in LR, DR, FR. Eventually we do plan on getting hardwood floors (maybe in 1 year) so would you recommend getting the carpet or going with the parquet?

Thanks for your help!

Also I've read conflicting information on installing hardwood over parquet. Is that recommended or should we pull up all the parquet. How much work is it?

[patrob]

Hey i need some input on the layout of the floor plan on what to do.

all the of the floor on the main level is vinyl except for the carpeted area in the living room. I don't know if I should put hardwood throughout the main floor and just have area rugs in the foyer, livingroom, and small mat in kitchen.
or put ceramic in some areas like in the kitchen or powder room. I want to know peoples thoughts on either way. its not a huge area. however I understand situations with hardwood in the bathroom with water and in the kitchen with the possibility of crumbs and such.

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8672/layoutfloor.th.png (http://img109.imageshack.us/i/layoutfloor.png/)

give me your thoughts
Hardwood throughout main floor incl. kitchen & foyer is very trendy & popular these days. If your front door is your main & only entrance to the house, then the foyer will take a lot of abuse. And same thing goes for the kitchen as you already know. Area rugs/mats will help & you will have to take greater care. Or otherwise do a nice stone tile in the foyer/hall/powder/kitchen. And then install hardwood in living room but dinette would also look nice with hardwood.

[patrob]

I think it is plywood. Is that bad? There is a 25 year warranty though. Should I be looking at 3-ply or 5-ply instead?

Thanks.

I have never seen that product, so can't really comment & no info when you Google. So what kind of warranty can they offer if the company does not really exist?? The multiply (5 layer) is more structurally sound because the layers are thinner & pressed together with more glue.

[patrob]

I bought some left over kempas (Red hues) from a local ad and really love the looks and contacted the store it was purchased from in London and they no longer carry it. I would love to get some more to do another room. Any suggestions on where to get it in southwestern Ontario? Thanks Tom

Goodfellow makes Kempas. So look for their dealers including Lowes.

[patrob]

Hi everyone,
Our builder is offering us parquet or carpet in LR, DR, FR. Eventually we do plan on getting hardwood floors (maybe in 1 year) so would you recommend getting the carpet or going with the parquet?

Thanks for your help!

Also I've read conflicting information on installing hardwood over parquet. Is that recommended or should we pull up all the parquet. How much work is it?

Take carpet! Easy to remove, still usable in the basement & you will reduce your height between hardwood & tile. You can install over parquet but your height between hardwood & tile will be dramatically higher & if you have any squeaks before hardwood installation over parquet, it's harder to fix.

[txenglan]

Hi Patrob,

My central vac is up and running now and it works quite well on the hardwood. It will be a few extra passes before all that fine dust from the install is totally gone but I'll get there. In the meantime, I was reading your comments about the vintage floor cleaner and I see that it can be ordered directly off their site. Is the full kit worth getting? Seems pricey for what you receive. 3 bottles for $29 vs 1 bottle with a couple of cheap-looking plasticky accessories. The mop can't be worth that much can it? Would a regular dry Swiffer head do the trick (or any other mop head for that matter)?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

My central vac is up and running now and it works quite well on the hardwood. It will be a few extra passes before all that fine dust from the install is totally gone but I'll get there. In the meantime, I was reading your comments about the vintage floor cleaner and I see that it can be ordered directly off their site. Is the full kit worth getting? Seems pricey for what you receive. 3 bottles for $29 vs 1 bottle with a couple of cheap-looking plasticky accessories. The mop can't be worth that much can it? Would a regular dry Swiffer head do the trick (or any other mop head for that matter)?

As long as you already have a plastic swivel head with a terry cloth, then just order the spray solution. You wet the cloth, ring it out as much as you can & spray the solution on the damp cloth. Don't spray directly on the floor. Do not use any Vim/OrangeGlo/Murphy'sOil/Pledge/Wet Swiffer hardwood cleaners, etc. The Vintage spray solution works the best.

I guess now you can post some pics :cheesygri

[txenglan]

As long as you already have a plastic swivel head with a terry cloth, then just order the spray solution. You wet the cloth, ring it out as much as you can & spray the solution on the damp cloth. Don't spray directly on the floor. Do not use any Vim/OrangeGlo/Murphy'sOil/Pledge/Wet Swiffer hardwood cleaners, etc. The Vintage spray solution works the best.

Thanks! The guys at Rome Flooring are recommending "Polycare". They will order the Vintage stuff if I want it but they swear by this stuff. Any experience with it?


I guess now you can post some pics :cheesygri

I will soon be able to post some pics as I took advantage of the deal as posted at http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/fs-olympus-e-520-10-0mp-dslr-camera-17-45mm-lens-40mm-150mm-lens-499-98-a-825795/. Been so busy that I haven't even opened the box yet though ;)

[azn_pnoy]

Hi guys! We are changing the carpet in our 2nd floor (approx. 440 sqft.) to hard wood. We were quoted by Alliance $5700 + taxes installed for maple engineered. They also said we have to pay $100 for disposal of the carpet, etc.. so around $300 dollars of bs i think.

Do you guys think it's better to buy the materials ourselves and get an installer? if so, can you guys recommend someone?

Thanks!

[patrob]

Thanks! The guys at Rome Flooring are recommending "Polycare". They will order the Vintage stuff if I want it but they swear by this stuff. Any experience with it?

I will soon be able to post some pics as I took advantage of the deal as posted at http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/fs-olympus-e-520-10-0mp-dslr-camera-17-45mm-lens-40mm-150mm-lens-499-98-a-825795/. Been so busy that I haven't even opened the box yet though ;)
Never used Polycare, only Vintage cleaning solution. They are probably making more money on it, that's why they are "recommending" it :D

[patrob]

Hi guys! We are changing the carpet in our 2nd floor (approx. 440 sqft.) to hard wood. We were quoted by Alliance $5700 + taxes installed for maple engineered. They also said we have to pay $100 for disposal of the carpet, etc.. so around $300 dollars of bs i think.

Do you guys think it's better to buy the materials ourselves and get an installer? if so, can you guys recommend someone?

Thanks!

A bit on the high side. If you want, I can give you a quote :) PM me with more details, wood colour, plank width, etc.

[txenglan]

Never used Polycare, only Vintage cleaning solution. They are probably making more money on it, that's why they are "recommending" it :D

That may be true. Oh well. I'll try it out and order in a bottle of the Vintage stuff to try on a different section of the floor to compare.

Merry X-Mas!

[patrob]

That may be true. Oh well. I'll try it out and order in a bottle of the Vintage stuff to try on a different section of the floor to compare.

Merry X-Mas!

Try both & then decide which one you like better. It might also be good, we just never never used it.

http://www.clicksmilies.com/s1106/weihnachten/xmas-smiley-001.gif

[Mayoo]

Temperature does not matter as much as proper humidity. 45-55% humidity is better.

Sorry .. forgot to thank u :razz:

[canuck88]

Pat I have a question; I'm getting some mild buckling at the edge of a couple of rooms (solid ash, 4.25" boards) on both the main and upper floors of my house. Not enough to be visually noticeable, but when you step on the area there's about 1/8" of movement up and down. Humidity in the house is about 30-35% currently. If anything, shouldn't the boards be shrinking a bit?? The boards were installed in June, and they were acclimated to the house for about 10-12 days before install. House is 20 years old (so subfloor - plywood - was nice and dry).

Any suggestions on why this would be happening in these fairly dry conditions?? In the humidity of July/August there were no problems. Should I face nail them down at the perimeter?

[noodlesoup]

Hi Patrob,

Awesome thread! We recently bought a house that has hardwood throughout (approx 4 yr old house). From an overall perspective the floors look fine, but you can notice scratches here and there. When you bend down and really look at it, you can see that there are actually quite a few knicks and scratches.

We're ok with the way the floors are now but in the future, if we wanted to refinish the floors, would that remove all these knicks and scratches?

We also noticed that some dings go beyond the surface and there's this one in particular that is pretty deep (images below). This one happens to be in a high traffic area and we're afraid that it will only get worse if we don't do something about it. What would you recommend we do to patch this up? We were thinking wood filler - would that work? How would we go about applying something like that without making things worse?

Also, if we were to use a damp mop (or say the swiffer wet jet) over these damaged areas of the hardwood, would water get into the wood and ruin it more? How would you recommend we clean the floors? Strictly dry vac and sweep/swiffer?

Sorry for the long post - we're really worried about the floors getting worse...

Thanks!

chip around middle of image
http://img212.imagevenue.com/loc997/th_49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG (http://img212.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc997&image=49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG)

chip enlarged
http://img241.imagevenue.com/loc527/th_51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG (http://img241.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG)

[canuck88]

Hi Patrob,

Awesome thread! We recently bought a house that has hardwood throughout (approx 4 yr old house). From an overall perspective the floors look fine, but you can notice scratches here and there. When you bend down and really look at it, you can see that there are actually quite a few knicks and scratches.

We're ok with the way the floors are now but in the future, if we wanted to refinish the floors, would that remove all these knicks and scratches?

We also noticed that some dings go beyond the surface and there's this one in particular that is pretty deep (images below). This one happens to be in a high traffic area and we're afraid that it will only get worse if we don't do something about it. What would you recommend we do to patch this up? We were thinking wood filler - would that work? How would we go about applying something like that without making things worse?

Also, if we were to use a damp mop (or say the swiffer wet jet) over these damaged areas of the hardwood, would water get into the wood and ruin it more? How would you recommend we clean the floors? Strictly dry vac and sweep/swiffer?

Sorry for the long post - we're really worried about the floors getting worse...

Thanks!

chip around middle of image
http://img212.imagevenue.com/loc997/th_49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG (http://img212.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc997&image=49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG)

chip enlarged
http://img241.imagevenue.com/loc527/th_51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG (http://img241.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG)


Noodlesoup, just my 2 cents, but this is the nature of hardwood floors. They dent, scratch, and chip. You can buy a colour-matched putty that will fill in those nicks. Refinishing will be probably around $4+/sq ft... not worth it for some minor imperfections.

[patrob]

Pat I have a question; I'm getting some mild buckling at the edge of a couple of rooms (solid ash, 4.25" boards) on both the main and upper floors of my house. Not enough to be visually noticeable, but when you step on the area there's about 1/8" of movement up and down. Humidity in the house is about 30-35% currently. If anything, shouldn't the boards be shrinking a bit?? The boards were installed in June, and they were acclimated to the house for about 10-12 days before install. House is 20 years old (so subfloor - plywood - was nice and dry).

Any suggestions on why this would be happening in these fairly dry conditions?? In the humidity of July/August there were no problems. Should I face nail them down at the perimeter?

If it's along the outside walls, could be some moisture penetration (same as the condensation on the windows) from outside underneath the wall. You can still remove the quarter/baseboard & spray some insulation along the perimeter. Just remember about your RH levels, 4 1/4" will show a lot of gapping if too dry.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Awesome thread! We recently bought a house that has hardwood throughout (approx 4 yr old house). From an overall perspective the floors look fine, but you can notice scratches here and there. When you bend down and really look at it, you can see that there are actually quite a few knicks and scratches.

We're ok with the way the floors are now but in the future, if we wanted to refinish the floors, would that remove all these knicks and scratches?

We also noticed that some dings go beyond the surface and there's this one in particular that is pretty deep (images below). This one happens to be in a high traffic area and we're afraid that it will only get worse if we don't do something about it. What would you recommend we do to patch this up? We were thinking wood filler - would that work? How would we go about applying something like that without making things worse?

Also, if we were to use a damp mop (or say the swiffer wet jet) over these damaged areas of the hardwood, would water get into the wood and ruin it more? How would you recommend we clean the floors? Strictly dry vac and sweep/swiffer?

Sorry for the long post - we're really worried about the floors getting worse...

Thanks!

chip around middle of image
http://img212.imagevenue.com/loc997/th_49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG (http://img212.imagevenue.com/img.php?loc=loc997&image=49360_IMG_6689_122_997lo.JPG)

chip enlarged
http://img241.imagevenue.com/loc527/th_51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG (http://img241.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=51827_IMG_6684_122_527lo.JPG)
For that you can use coloured putty sticks (wax sticks). HD or Rona will carry it or any hardwood flooring store. Just make sure you get the right colour. Don't use a mop or even wet swiffer is too wet. Hardwood flooring cleaning kit (read back couple of posts for more info). Hardwood will scratch & ding & I would not re-finish it just for that unless it's really damaged.

[canuck88]

If it's along the outside walls, could be some moisture penetration (same as the condensation on the windows) from outside underneath the wall. You can still remove the quarter/baseboard & spray some insulation along the perimeter. Just remember about your RH levels, 4 1/4" will show a lot of gapping if too dry.

It's actually fine along the exterior walls; it's happening on interior walls where the final boards were facenailed (and cut to about 2.5-3" in size to fit)...

I can't figure out why it would be lifting like this when it's so dry... seems like the opposite of what should be happening... RH is 26% right now and I have no gapping. ?!

Going to be investing in a steam humidifier, but I still can't figure out why i'm getting this buckling... any other ideas??

[patrob]

It's actually fine along the exterior walls; it's happening on interior walls where the final boards were facenailed (and cut to about 2.5-3" in size to fit)...

I can't figure out why it would be lifting like this when it's so dry... seems like the opposite of what should be happening... RH is 26% right now and I have no gapping. ?!

Going to be investing in a steam humidifier, but I still can't figure out why i'm getting this buckling... any other ideas??

Do you know if the installer glued the last pieces? Sometimes glue holds the boards from expansion/contraction & causes capping of that last piece. Also is the last full row nailed? We find very often that some installers leave it un-nailed & only nail the last piece under the baseboard/quarter round.

Gapping does not show right away with low humidity. It takes some time & it may show in couple of weeks when the wood becomes dry, not the air in the house but both go together.

[t3359]

Hi Patrob...

Me again, from 6 months ago. I finally got to the stage where I'm about to lay the hardwood. However, the heat's been on and I'm worried about the humidity in the house.

I have 3 readings - one from the dehumidifier that says 44%, two from different temperature/humidity meters (that look like this (http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/browse/2/OutdoorLiving/GardenDecor/ClocksThermometers/PRD~0429117P/Humidiguide%252C%2BCelsius.jsp)) saying 70% and 80%.

What should I do? I'm not sure which is accurate. If the humidity is low, what are my options for installing?

thanks...
bjl

[patrob]

Hi Patrob...

Me again, from 6 months ago. I finally got to the stage where I'm about to lay the hardwood. However, the heat's been on and I'm worried about the humidity in the house.

I have 3 readings - one from the dehumidifier that says 44%, two from different temperature/humidity meters (that look like this (http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/browse/2/OutdoorLiving/GardenDecor/ClocksThermometers/PRD~0429117P/Humidiguide%252C%2BCelsius.jsp)) saying 70% and 80%.

What should I do? I'm not sure which is accurate. If the humidity is low, what are my options for installing?

thanks...
bjl
Do you have a humidifier installed? At this time of the year, the 70-80% reading is def. not accurate.
Buy a small digital hygrometer at HD for $20 for a more accurate reading. This is the one we have
http://images.google.ca/url?source=imgres&ct=tbn&q=http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41HXJ8SZ17L._SL500_AA280_.jpg&usg=AFQjCNHIbNH0WhwNcIz29vvzchk8E86k3A

For best results, bring up the humidity of the house to approx. 45% for couple of days & have the wood acclimatize at the same :idea:

[t3359]

Do you have a humidifier installed? At this time of the year, the 70-80% reading is def. not accurate.
Buy a small digital hygrometer at HD for $20 for a more accurate reading. This is the one we have
http://images.google.ca/url?source=imgres&ct=tbn&q=http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41HXJ8SZ17L._SL500_AA280_.jpg&usg=AFQjCNHIbNH0WhwNcIz29vvzchk8E86k3A

For best results, bring up the humidity of the house to approx. 45% for couple of days & have the wood acclimatize at the same :idea:

Ahhh, I'll pick one up. We don't have a humidifier right now - any pointers on getting the humidity up?

thanks!
bjl

[canuck88]

Do you know if the installer glued the last pieces? Sometimes glue holds the boards from expansion/contraction & causes capping of that last piece. Also is the last full row nailed? We find very often that some installers leave it un-nailed & only nail the last piece under the baseboard/quarter round.

Gapping does not show right away with low humidity. It takes some time & it may show in couple of weeks when the wood becomes dry, not the air in the house but both go together.

No glue used... I watched them install; what they did was face nail the last 2 rows of boards (16ga nails) every 3 or 4 inches; on the second-to-last board they nailed on tongue side (they did them on a 45-degree angle so that the next board would fit) and then the last board was face nailed all along the wall side. Any other ideas? Is it because the last board was face nailed with so many nails that it's unable to move? the weird thing is this facenailing for the last rows was done everywhere but it only seems to be affecting a few areas.

What can I do to solve it?

[patrob]

Ahhh, I'll pick one up. We don't have a humidifier right now - any pointers on getting the humidity up?

thanks!
bjl

Except a humidifier, nothing unless you cook a lot :)

[patrob]

No glue used... I watched them install; what they did was face nail the last 2 rows of boards (16ga nails) every 3 or 4 inches; on the second-to-last board they nailed on tongue side (they did them on a 45-degree angle so that the next board would fit) and then the last board was face nailed all along the wall side. Any other ideas? Is it because the last board was face nailed with so many nails that it's unable to move? the weird thing is this facenailing for the last rows was done everywhere but it only seems to be affecting a few areas.

What can I do to solve it?

The nailing just on the side does not work. The before last board should be top nailed (face nailed) All boards up to 3"-4" away from the wall should be nailed on tongue (the regular way with finishing nailer). If you can, remove the quarter round, pry the boards tight & face nail the last two rows.

[pr@j]

Hi Patrob,

I stumbled across this page and was pleased to see the info I was looking for instead of going through pages and pages of useless marketing fluff on other sites.

I've read through quite a bit of the 188+ pages of postings and probably got most of the info I was needing. I have some questions - hopefully none that are already posted and answered ( I wish there was an FAQ for this thread, or a sub-forum instead of 1 long thread).

So here is my situation and thoughts that we want your opinion and direction on.

Thank you.


OVERVIEW:

We bought a semi that is 7yrs old in the Oak Ridges area of Richmond Hill, Ontario, that has oak parquet flooring (ewww) that we cannot stand since we lived in an apartment with the same flooring and it's just a really dated look IMO. We want hardwood, but here are some challenges that we want some opinions from yourself and anyone else reading this and have experience with getting floors installed. We have a 2.5 year old toddler so that limits us in terms of DIY; I am a DIYer, but TIME is key here - we can't afford not to have that space unavailable for a few weeks.

NB: We live near a lake so my initial concern is around humidity in the higher range - we do not have central AC currently - but have a central humidifier set to about 40%-50%, with central forced air gas heating

FLOOR PLAN:

1. Open concept Living room, dining room, breakfast nook (whatever that is?!)
2. Total SQ FT is ~ 500 - 525
3. Standard baseboards all around
4. Stairways & Banister are all solid OAK - we will keep these and re-stain to match flooring
5. Small landing that is about 25 SQ FT of parquet -we will do that as well.

HARDWOOD PREFERENCES:

NB: We will be checking out vintage flooring for some better quality stuff.

1. Interested in Bamboo - but need to see some good samples - Home Depot and Rona didn't cut it for us from what we saw. Not enough market history on bamboo either.

2. Not keen on laminate - I'm not convinced about it's durability - IKEA quality scared the daylights out of us that people would pay for such poor quality.

3. Engineered - like the idea behind it - not sure about durability - in the end all we see is the top layer - but it may be a mental/pyschological thing to want 100% pure wood.


TOTAL BUDGET: Between 3500 -5000 to include the following:

- rip out old parquet and have it removed from site
- repair some squeaky floorboards with deck screws and not nails
- install new hardwood
- re-install old baseboards (for now) and repaint


ACTION PLAN:

NB: We do not plan on living in this house forever, but at least for the next 5-7 years so we want to install somthing that is TIMELESS and that will become a selling point down the road.


1. Rip out old oak parquet - how much would be an approximate charge to have someone do this as part of the overall install? Can this be done easily as a DIY project over a weekend?

2. Squeaky Floors - the plan is to identify all the spots and drill down the floor boards - we noticed the floor has some bulging in places but its very gradual over a large area but noticeable if you walk in the right spot. We will keep the old boards, but just have them screwed down with deck screws (or whatever the right type of screws are) Again that is something I see as a DIY activity with little experience needed.


3. Install new flooring (would prefer to contract this part out since I don't have the experience and can't afford to spend a week or more when I can pay someone to do it in a day or two.

4. Moulding - we will keep the old one's for now (budget reasons) and then install new ones when we repaint the walls. But if it will only cost me $100-$250 more for new might as well do it now

[t3359]

Except a humidifier, nothing unless you cook a lot :)

:) Thanks - got a room humidifier today - steaming up the room as we speak. The little portable hygrometer was showing 35%... I figure I should slowly bring it up to avoid warping the wood. Hopefully everything will be ready for boxing-day install!

bjl

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

I stumbled across this page and was pleased to see the info I was looking for instead of going through pages and pages of useless marketing fluff on other sites.

I've read through quite a bit of the 188+ pages of postings and probably got most of the info I was needing. I have some questions - hopefully none that are already posted and answered ( I wish there was an FAQ for this thread, or a sub-forum instead of 1 long thread).

So here is my situation and thoughts that we want your opinion and direction on.

Thank you.


OVERVIEW:

We bought a semi that is 7yrs old in the Oak Ridges area of Richmond Hill, Ontario, that has oak parquet flooring (ewww) that we cannot stand since we lived in an apartment with the same flooring and it's just a really dated look IMO. We want hardwood, but here are some challenges that we want some opinions from yourself and anyone else reading this and have experience with getting floors installed. We have a 2.5 year old toddler so that limits us in terms of DIY; I am a DIYer, but TIME is key here - we can't afford not to have that space unavailable for a few weeks.

NB: We live near a lake so my initial concern is around humidity in the higher range - we do not have central AC currently - but have a central humidifier set to about 40%-50%, with central forced air gas heating

FLOOR PLAN:

1. Open concept Living room, dining room, breakfast nook (whatever that is?!)
2. Total SQ FT is ~ 500 - 525
3. Standard baseboards all around
4. Stairways & Banister are all solid OAK - we will keep these and re-stain to match flooring
5. Small landing that is about 25 SQ FT of parquet -we will do that as well.

HARDWOOD PREFERENCES:

NB: We will be checking out vintage flooring for some better quality stuff.

1. Interested in Bamboo - but need to see some good samples - Home Depot and Rona didn't cut it for us from what we saw. Not enough market history on bamboo either.

2. Not keen on laminate - I'm not convinced about it's durability - IKEA quality scared the daylights out of us that people would pay for such poor quality.

3. Engineered - like the idea behind it - not sure about durability - in the end all we see is the top layer - but it may be a mental/pyschological thing to want 100% pure wood.


TOTAL BUDGET: Between 3500 -5000 to include the following:

- rip out old parquet and have it removed from site
- repair some squeaky floorboards with deck screws and not nails
- install new hardwood
- re-install old baseboards (for now) and repaint

ACTION PLAN:

NB: We do not plan on living in this house forever, but at least for the next 5-7 years so we want to install somthing that is TIMELESS and that will become a selling point down the road.

1. Rip out old oak parquet - how much would be an approximate charge to have someone do this as part of the overall install? Can this be done easily as a DIY project over a weekend?

2. Squeaky Floors - the plan is to identify all the spots and drill down the floor boards - we noticed the floor has some bulging in places but its very gradual over a large area but noticeable if you walk in the right spot. We will keep the old boards, but just have them screwed down with deck screws (or whatever the right type of screws are) Again that is something I see as a DIY activity with little experience needed.

3. Install new flooring (would prefer to contract this part out since I don't have the experience and can't afford to spend a week or more when I can pay someone to do it in a day or two.

4. Moulding - we will keep the old one's for now (budget reasons) and then install new ones when we repaint the walls. But if it will only cost me $100-$250 more for new might as well do it now
Wow, long post :D And welcome to RFD :)

You have a good action plan. I know there will be contractors out that will probably do all that work within your budget but if you want somebody reputable/professional & you want a good quality product, you will have to perform many of those DIY activities yourself to fit within the budget but that still will be tight depending on the product you choose. There is no need to remove baseboards unless you want to replace them. I think you are referring to quarter round, which has to be removed & re-installed which you can do yourself to save on additional labour costs. Yes removing existing parquet can be done DIY over the weekend.

[patrob]

:) Thanks - got a room humidifier today - steaming up the room as we speak. The little portable hygrometer was showing 35%... I figure I should slowly bring it up to avoid warping the wood. Hopefully everything will be ready for boxing-day install!

bjl

Can you not install a central humidifier?

[pr@j]

Wow, long post :D And welcome to RFD :)

You have a good action plan. I know there will be contractors out that will probably do all that work within your budget but if you want somebody reputable/professional & you want a good quality product, you will have to perform many of those DIY activities yourself to fit within the budget but that still will be tight depending on the product you choose. There is no need to remove baseboards unless you want to replace them. I think you are referring to quarter round, which has to be removed & re-installed which you can do yourself to save on additional labour costs. Yes removing existing parquet can be done DIY over the weekend.

Hi Patricia,

Thank you for your response. I sent a detailed message to you earlier today - but for the benefit of others I will reply to your questions above:

Our overall preference is quality in the product but also workmanship. I don't mind doing some DIY work to save money - as long as it is significant savings.

I'll think about how much TIME I can save as well - an experienced person could demolish the floor in 1 day with the right tools - perhaps I need more, but it is an option. Quarter Rounds should be easy with a prying tool and some patience. If I don't need to remove the baseboard moulding that's a plus for me!

Thank you!

[jingyu]

Is Vintage cleaner good for any hardwood flooring product (mine is different brand in maple wood,may be from China)or is it for Vintage products only? I went to Canadian tire and one hardwood flloring product label says only for sealed hardwood floor. What does sealed haddwood floor means? Thanks.


Never used Polycare, only Vintage cleaning solution. They are probably making more money on it, that's why they are "recommending" it :D

[patrob]

Is Vintage cleaner good for any hardwood flooring product (mine is different brand in maple wood,may be from China)or is it for Vintage products only? I went to Canadian tire and one hardwood flloring product label says only for sealed hardwood floor. What does sealed haddwood floor means? Thanks.

Sealed hardwood means pre-finished/varnished. You can use the Vintage cleaning kit on any brand hardwood.

[trellaine201]

I am ONLY renting but would like to take care of the floor. What do you use to keep your floor clean from dust/lint/objects etc? What is the best? I used a bucket of water and mop once.

Thanks

[patrob]

I am ONLY renting but would like to take care of the floor. What do you use to keep your floor clean from dust/lint/objects etc? What is the best? I used a bucket of water and mop once.

Thanks

Dry swiffer, vacuum & a hardwood flooring cleaning kit. NO buckets of water with mop :!:

[trellaine201]

Dry swiffer, vacuum & a hardwood flooring cleaning kit. NO buckets of water with mop :!:

Ooops with the water and bucket. I only used a damp mop not soaking wet etc oops.

Thanks

Soo I am assuming using both correct? Swiffer to pick up stuff? Do they work well? And their expensive. And the cleaner kit to keep hardwood treated?

[amz155]

I bought one of those portable hygrometers from Lowes to keep an eye on the humidity in our home, which is a new home. We have Vintage red oak on the main floor. Over the past 24 hours, the min/max humidity have been 32% and 36%, respsectively. Is this too low? THe indoor temp is usually around 20C when we are home during the day and 18C when we are not home or asleep at night. The hygrometer says the humidity level is "OK" right now and its at 32% and 20C. I could swear that on other occasions it lists this humidity level as "LOW". I can imagine these little cheap devices are not entirely accurate.

In a new home, what humidity level should I aim for? (I thought it was 45%)

Is this device reliable?

[patrob]

Ooops with the water and bucket. I only used a damp mop not soaking wet etc oops.

Thanks

Soo I am assuming using both correct? Swiffer to pick up stuff? Do they work well? And their expensive. And the cleaner kit to keep hardwood treated?
You don't necessarily need swiffer but the cleaning kit is essential.

[patrob]

I bought one of those portable hygrometers from Lowes to keep an eye on the humidity in our home, which is a new home. We have Vintage red oak on the main floor. Over the past 24 hours, the min/max humidity have been 32% and 36%, respsectively. Is this too low? THe indoor temp is usually around 20C when we are home during the day and 18C when we are not home or asleep at night. The hygrometer says the humidity level is "OK" right now and its at 32% and 20C. I could swear that on other occasions it lists this humidity level as "LOW". I can imagine these little cheap devices are not entirely accurate.

In a new home, what humidity level should I aim for? (I thought it was 45%)

Is this device reliable?

30's are on the low side. Closer to 45% is recommended for solid hardwood. Those little devices are pretty accurate.

[patrob]

Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays to everyone :)

http://www.ohmygoodness.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/200411151923250.babborennedancing1.gif

[hoob]

Merry Christmas to you, and thanks for this entire thread.

I've been at my condo for 5 years and have no plans on moving/reselling any time soon. The default carpetting is already showing significant wear and age, so this year I've decided I want to replace all the flooring in the unit (except the tiled areas, which are fine.) I would welcome your input on my thoughts for what I can do with this space:

http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-S.jpg (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-O.jpg)

1. I plan on putting a high-quality laminate in the living area and the smaller bedroom (master bedroom will probably get a good berber carpet redo.)
2. The walls (which are still builder's white) will also be repainted. Presumable it would be better to do that before doing the flooring, since I know I'll be tossing the carpet anyway?
3. The smaller bedroom has lots of natural light, and lots of yellow pine already (desk, blinds, bookshelf, closet doors, etc) on a blood/autumn red wall. I have a feeling it will be tough to coordinate a good flooring colour here -- is it best to bring in a design consultant since I'm totally right-brain?
4. For the main living area I was thinking the Torlys "Lexington" (TL40044) for a high-quality look and finish.
5. Underlay will be in accordance with whatever the condo corporation specifies.
6. I expect to be putting in new baseboard after the walls are painted and flooring installed (want to look into running networking/HT cabling around as needed)
7. I have pointy cats -- any particular concerns in choosing a laminate to survive this onslaught or do I not need to worry?

If I am willing to pull the existing carpetting and baseboard, leave the entire area ready to go by moving all my crap into the master bedroom. That given, I would want a pro to do the actual installation of the flooring (including the separate type of laminate in the smaller bedroom.)

What would you expect to be a reasonably budget (all-inclusive) amount for this? I am thinking around $4500-$5500 ($9 to $12/sf installed.) How long do you think it would take for professional installers to complete the work? Do you think there's a better time of the year to do this?

Overall I plan on getting someone with more design sense than me to help with this (picking out colours, and other stuff I plan on doing like new countertop, wall tiling in the kitchen, etc.) Overall I want to make my condo a better "living space" for me and have decided that this is the year to do it :D

[patrob]

Merry Christmas to you, and thanks for this entire thread.

I've been at my condo for 5 years and have no plans on moving/reselling any time soon. The default carpetting is already showing significant wear and age, so this year I've decided I want to replace all the flooring in the unit (except the tiled areas, which are fine.) I would welcome your input on my thoughts for what I can do with this space:

http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-S.jpg (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-O.jpg)

1. I plan on putting a high-quality laminate in the living area and the smaller bedroom (master bedroom will probably get a good berber carpet redo.)
2. The walls (which are still builder's white) will also be repainted. Presumable it would be better to do that before doing the flooring, since I know I'll be tossing the carpet anyway?
3. The smaller bedroom has lots of natural light, and lots of yellow pine already (desk, blinds, bookshelf, closet doors, etc) on a blood/autumn red wall. I have a feeling it will be tough to coordinate a good flooring colour here -- is it best to bring in a design consultant since I'm totally right-brain?
4. For the main living area I was thinking the Torlys "Lexington" (TL40044) for a high-quality look and finish.
5. Underlay will be in accordance with whatever the condo corporation specifies.
6. I expect to be putting in new baseboard after the walls are painted and flooring installed (want to look into running networking/HT cabling around as needed)
7. I have pointy cats -- any particular concerns in choosing a laminate to survive this onslaught or do I not need to worry?

If I am willing to pull the existing carpetting and baseboard, leave the entire area ready to go by moving all my crap into the master bedroom. That given, I would want a pro to do the actual installation of the flooring (including the separate type of laminate in the smaller bedroom.)

What would you expect to be a reasonably budget (all-inclusive) amount for this? I am thinking around $4500-$5500 ($9 to $12/sf installed.) How long do you think it would take for professional installers to complete the work? Do you think there's a better time of the year to do this?

Overall I plan on getting someone with more design sense than me to help with this (picking out colours, and other stuff I plan on doing like new countertop, wall tiling in the kitchen, etc.) Overall I want to make my condo a better "living space" for me and have decided that this is the year to do it :D
Anything in a light/med. brown colour will do. As long as the colour is not the same as most of the furniture. In that price range you can get good quality engineered hardwood installed vs. laminate. Some laminates do look nice & are very realistic but it's not the same as hardwood. Since you have no plans to move, I would def. install something nicer. A job like this would take around 2 days. If you want, I can give you a more detailed quote :)

[Portwest]

Merry Christmas, Patrob! Thanks again for all your info!

Portwest

[jonthanstan]

Can anyone recommend where in the GTA to get 3/4" Oak hardwood floor to match my main floor. I have on main floor now is 3/4 x 3-1/2 Oak, colour is kind of white or off white, manufactured by Satin Finish company, I think they located in Vaughan Ontario. I was told they discountinue that colour long time ago, which I purchased in 2005. Anyway, I'm looking to get something that is close in colour and it is about 1200 SF for my 2nd floor, because to get them to do custom colour is way too expensive. Thanks

[patrob]

Can anyone recommend where in the GTA to get 3/4" Oak hardwood floor to match my main floor. I have on main floor now is 3/4 x 3-1/2 Oak, colour is kind of white or off white, manufactured by Satin Finish company, I think they located in Vaughan Ontario. I was told they discountinue that colour long time ago, which I purchased in 2005. Anyway, I'm looking to get something that is close in colour and it is about 1200 SF for my 2nd floor, because to get them to do custom colour is way too expensive. Thanks

I know the colour you are talking about. But there is an alternative from Vintage called White Oak Oracle but it only comes in 5" size.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/WhiteOak_Oracle.jpg

[jonthanstan]

I know the colour you are talking about. But there is an alternative from Vintage called White Oak Oracle but it only comes in 5" size.

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/WhiteOak_Oracle.jpg

It is close enought I think and don't mind the 5". I like to see the actual sample though. But I can't find it on their website, are they discountinue this colour too. Do you know which retail store have them in stock.

[jonthanstan]

Merry Christmas to you, and thanks for this entire thread.

I've been at my condo for 5 years and have no plans on moving/reselling any time soon. The default carpetting is already showing significant wear and age, so this year I've decided I want to replace all the flooring in the unit (except the tiled areas, which are fine.) I would welcome your input on my thoughts for what I can do with this space:

http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-S.jpg (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-O.jpg)

1. I plan on putting a high-quality laminate in the living area and the smaller bedroom (master bedroom will probably get a good berber carpet redo.)
2. The walls (which are still builder's white) will also be repainted. Presumable it would be better to do that before doing the flooring, since I know I'll be tossing the carpet anyway?
3. The smaller bedroom has lots of natural light, and lots of yellow pine already (desk, blinds, bookshelf, closet doors, etc) on a blood/autumn red wall. I have a feeling it will be tough to coordinate a good flooring colour here -- is it best to bring in a design consultant since I'm totally right-brain?
4. For the main living area I was thinking the Torlys "Lexington" (TL40044) for a high-quality look and finish.
5. Underlay will be in accordance with whatever the condo corporation specifies.
6. I expect to be putting in new baseboard after the walls are painted and flooring installed (want to look into running networking/HT cabling around as needed)
7. I have pointy cats -- any particular concerns in choosing a laminate to survive this onslaught or do I not need to worry?

If I am willing to pull the existing carpetting and baseboard, leave the entire area ready to go by moving all my crap into the master bedroom. That given, I would want a pro to do the actual installation of the flooring (including the separate type of laminate in the smaller bedroom.)

What would you expect to be a reasonably budget (all-inclusive) amount for this? I am thinking around $4500-$5500 ($9 to $12/sf installed.) How long do you think it would take for professional installers to complete the work? Do you think there's a better time of the year to do this?

Overall I plan on getting someone with more design sense than me to help with this (picking out colours, and other stuff I plan on doing like new countertop, wall tiling in the kitchen, etc.) Overall I want to make my condo a better "living space" for me and have decided that this is the year to do it :D

For marble & granite try this place it was recommended by someone in this website. Heard they are very good and friendly people.

Redstone Marble & Granite Ltd.
100 Fernstaff Court Unit #2
Vaughan, Ontario L4K 3L9
Tel: (905) 660-8811

[patrob]

It is close enought I think and don't mind the 5". I like to see the actual sample though. But I can't find it on their website, are they discountinue this colour too. Do you know which retail store have them in stock.

It's a new colour & it's listed under Solid Sawn section. For samples, you will have to call the dealer in your area.

[jonthanstan]

It's a new colour & it's listed under Solid Sawn section. For samples, you will have to call the dealer in your area.

Yes I saw it on the website-thanks. I called one of the retail, OMG their price is rediculous like over $1+ psf more than if I get it custom paint thru original supplier. May be I don't understand much about hardwood, why retailer is selling these hardwood so expensive in this time (are we in recession?), I was thinking of getting the material for about $4-$5.25 psf. May be no luck for this price.

[patrob]

Yes I saw it on the website-thanks. I called one of the retail, OMG their price is rediculous like over $1+ psf more than if I get it custom paint thru original supplier. May be I don't understand much about hardwood, why retailer is selling these hardwood so expensive in this time (are we in recession?), I was thinking of getting the material for about $4-$5.25 psf. May be no luck for this price.

Vintage is a higher quality product than Satin Finish & will be slightly more expensive. If you can get it matched at that price, then go ahead. And some stores/contractors might struggle with so called "recession" but others do not ;)

[hoob]

Anything in a light/med. brown colour will do. As long as the colour is not the same as most of the furniture. In that price range you can get good quality engineered hardwood installed vs. laminate. Some laminates do look nice & are very realistic but it's not the same as hardwood. Since you have no plans to move, I would def. install something nicer. A job like this would take around 2 days. If you want, I can give you a more detailed quote :)

Thanks... I dropped by Darmaga this afternoon to check out the Torlys products and you're right, the engineered hardwood is quite a bit nicer than the lamiate (which almost seems waxy.) Plus after reviewing the installation videos there I'm pretty sure I can be trusted with a jigsaw and do my own install!

In the end I should be able to get it all done for under $4000, unless the condo corp has strict/explicit requirements to use a particularly expensive underlayment.

I grabbed a couple of samples and so far the one that I prefer is the American Walnut (http://www.torlys.com/Portals/0/images/product/Everest_Swatches/HCU53621_Wal.jpg). It seems to have the least colour drift depending on fl vs halogen vs natural light, and is dark enough to contrast with my main furniture. The Darmaga guy was great and said before ordering I could bring home the full display sample (1' x 4') to verify my colour choice.

Edit: You've recommended Vintage U-LOC (http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_uloc_2.php) over the Torlys Everest stuff previously in this thread. Since I like the American Walnut browne, for durability reasons would something like the Red Oak Mocha (http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakmocha.jpg) or Red Oak Chariot (http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakchariot.jpg) be better? How does the pricing compare (I was quoted $5/sf for the Torlys Everest.) Is durability even really an issue, given that I don't have kids or dogs (just cats), and walk around in socks or bare feet all the time?


One comment he made -- saying dips in the concrete pad could be filled in with loose fill (kitty litter!) and that would be sufficient since all you're trying to do is prevent flex. Sounds reasonable I guess; your thoughts?

[-=phelan=-]

patrob,

i've got a couple of steps i need to sand down to refinish. I'm wondering after sanding it down and applying the 1st coat of varathane, how many applications should i apply to it after it's dryed once?

[t3359]

Hi Patrob...

Any advice on how to do this? How should the border be attached since there won't be a tongue/groove connection on some sides. I was thinking of ripping off the tongue where not needed, doing the border first, then countersinking/plugging or gluing.

http://www.fhfloors.com/gallery/bw1/bw1/fullimages/12_f.jpg

As for types of wood, as long as they're like species I should be okay?

I might be over my head, but it'll be fun. thanks!

bjl


Do the border first, make sure it's nice & square & nail the boards on the angle like with regular nailer even if there is no tongue & groove joint. Glue, glue & glue. It sure will be fun if you have never done this before :cheesygri

This border looks like regular red oak with walnut & maple insert. Looks not bad except for that little mis-measurement right at the corner :D

Hi Patrob...

I finally gave in to the wife's nagging and started this border project. Any pointers on how to get the boards of the fill area cut to precise lengths? Right now I'm thinking to nail them all down, then take a circular saw or router to trim the lengths down but it would be a costly mistake if I were to screw that up :)

thanks...
bjl

[patrob]

Thanks... I dropped by Darmaga this afternoon to check out the Torlys products and you're right, the engineered hardwood is quite a bit nicer than the lamiate (which almost seems waxy.) Plus after reviewing the installation videos there I'm pretty sure I can be trusted with a jigsaw and do my own install!

In the end I should be able to get it all done for under $4000, unless the condo corp has strict/explicit requirements to use a particularly expensive underlayment.

I grabbed a couple of samples and so far the one that I prefer is the American Walnut (http://www.torlys.com/Portals/0/images/product/Everest_Swatches/HCU53621_Wal.jpg). It seems to have the least colour drift depending on fl vs halogen vs natural light, and is dark enough to contrast with my main furniture. The Darmaga guy was great and said before ordering I could bring home the full display sample (1' x 4') to verify my colour choice.

Edit: You've recommended Vintage U-LOC (http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_uloc_2.php) over the Torlys Everest stuff previously in this thread. Since I like the American Walnut browne, for durability reasons would something like the Red Oak Mocha (http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakmocha.jpg) or Red Oak Chariot (http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/redoakchariot.jpg) be better? How does the pricing compare (I was quoted $5/sf for the Torlys Everest.) Is durability even really an issue, given that I don't have kids or dogs (just cats), and walk around in socks or bare feet all the time?

One comment he made -- saying dips in the concrete pad could be filled in with loose fill (kitty litter!) and that would be sufficient since all you're trying to do is prevent flex. Sounds reasonable I guess; your thoughts?
Sorry for the delay in answering, just got back from a short retreat :D

And of course hardwood looks nicer than laminate :)

Torlys has a good locking system but I find Vintage G5 locking system better/easier to work with (no need to tap from side, easier to work around casings or tight spaces). Walnut has a specific look where nothing else can imitate that look. But it is a softer species than oak or maple & it will show damages faster. The grain in the oak will "hide" damages a bit better. Mocha Oak or Maple Godiva would be my first choice & then Walnut. Chariot has more red undertone in the stain. Either way all of those products are pretty much the same price +-.

I don't like the idea of loose fill. Self leveling compound for low spots is a lot better, easy to work with & stays hard.

[patrob]

patrob,

i've got a couple of steps i need to sand down to refinish. I'm wondering after sanding it down and applying the 1st coat of varathane, how many applications should i apply to it after it's dryed once?

If using water based finish, 3-5 coats. If using polyurethane 2-3 coats is fine. Wait to dry & sand between coats with very fine paper for best results.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob...

I finally gave in to the wife's nagging and started this border project. Any pointers on how to get the boards of the fill area cut to precise lengths? Right now I'm thinking to nail them all down, then take a circular saw or router to trim the lengths down but it would be a costly mistake if I were to screw that up :)

thanks...
bjl

If installing un-finished wood, yes you can install & then cut the sides with circular saw (worm drive highly recommended!). But there is always a possibility of chipping the edges. Regardless if pre-finished or un-finished, we do the border first & then cut each piece individually to fit precisely. Glue it in & nail it.

[hoob]

Sorry for the delay in answering, just got back from a short retreat :D

Alright... Next question then since you're back and refreshed and ready for the new year! What would you recommend for alignment for my floorplan (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-X3.jpg) (see previous post.) I am planning to to east-to-west in both rooms, and have the transition in the bedroom doorway (as required? recommended? by the click install instructions.)

In the bedroom it's obvious to just start in the north-west corner and fill the room. But how about the large common area, which has the diagonals? I was thinking: draw a line from the main kitchen half-wall (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Initial-Condo-Move-In/IMG0590/97234154_Ynaf2-L.jpg) and use that as my reference -- because that will of course be the most visible alignment. Then do some sanity checking to see if the other walls are roughly parallel to reference line. Then, if all is well, start in the lower far-right corner above the bathroom and shimming so ensure I'm parallel to my reference line? Should I rip the starting boards so that my first full east/west run doesn't need to be notched to fit against the kitchen?

Or is trying to start at the south end of the common area (where the diagonals are) asking for too much trouble? Should I really just start in the north-east corner of the living room and hope things line up?

[patrob]

Alright... Next question then since you're back and refreshed and ready for the new year! What would you recommend for alignment for my floorplan (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Construction-and-Pre/floorplan/97232848_tBiC5-X3.jpg) (see previous post.) I am planning to to east-to-west in both rooms, and have the transition in the bedroom doorway (as required? recommended? by the click install instructions.)

In the bedroom it's obvious to just start in the north-west corner and fill the room. But how about the large common area, which has the diagonals? I was thinking: draw a line from the main kitchen half-wall (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Initial-Condo-Move-In/IMG0590/97234154_Ynaf2-L.jpg) and use that as my reference -- because that will of course be the most visible alignment. Then do some sanity checking to see if the other walls are roughly parallel to reference line. Then, if all is well, start in the lower far-right corner above the bathroom and shimming so ensure I'm parallel to my reference line? Should I rip the starting boards so that my first full east/west run doesn't need to be notched to fit against the kitchen?

Or is trying to start at the south end of the common area (where the diagonals are) asking for too much trouble? Should I really just start in the north-east corner of the living room and hope things line up?
Looking at your floorplan, I would do the floors north/south direction. Start at the master bed./living room wall & do living/dining/smaller bedroom in one direction. There is no need for transitions to bedrooms unless you are changing directions. Transitions are sort of tripping hazard but you will need them at the tiles. But if you can avoid them in the bedrooms, install everything in one direction. Incl. the master bedroom but if you start from the dividing wall, you will have to install the master bed. backwards, which is a bit harder. The floors will look a lot better with no transitions & going towards the balcony doors IMO.

[xiaoxiong0607]

Patrob,

Thank you very much for answering hardwood floor related questions. I bought a new house and plan to install hardwood on second floor.

1) Builder say they use engineered floor joists and all subfloor sheathing to be screwed to floor joists. What does this mean? Can I install hardwood my on it myself?

2) Do I have to use quarter round after installation? Is it better to ask builder not to install baseboard? is baseboard thick enough to cover 1/2 inch gap?

many thanks

[hoob]

Don't forget to enter the contest (http://www.miragefloors.com/ENG/contest-celebrate-quality.php) Mirage currently has on to win $10,000 of flooring (http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/10-000-mirage-hardwood-engineered-flooring-mar-01-2010-a-835151/)!

[samadperformance]

I am just starting a proj in my family room. I need 210 sq ft of hardwood.
Oak or Maple?? and can anyone recomend a good shop to buy from in the Scarborough Pickering Ajax areas?

Looking for something durable with 2 kids 3/5 years old.
Thanks in advance.

[patrob]

Patrob,

Thank you very much for answering hardwood floor related questions. I bought a new house and plan to install hardwood on second floor.

1) Builder say they use engineered floor joists and all subfloor sheathing to be screwed to floor joists. What does this mean? Can I install hardwood my on it myself?

2) Do I have to use quarter round after installation? Is it better to ask builder not to install baseboard? is baseboard thick enough to cover 1/2 inch gap?

many thanks
It means the builder uses either OSB or plywood sheets nailed & screwed as a sub-floor over engineered joists not solid 2x8 or 2x10 joists. Yes you can install hardwood over it. Do you know what type of baseboard they install? It's easier to install quarter round.

[vurukov]

Hi,

Happy 2010.

We just bought a townhouse that had existing red oak hardwood flooring on all stairs and one of the three floors. We have since installed new untreated red oak to match the other floor. We are looking for someone to sand and finish the whole house to get a uniform look.

Our problem/issue is that we like the raw red oak look and colour.
From what I gather, and what I can see on the existing old flooring, if we treat is with a polyurethane finish, it will look yellower right away. Even worse, over time the floor will get darker and even more orange/yellow.

What should we do to finish the floor and yet keep the look and colour of the wood as close to the raw look as possible?

We have been reading about new epoxy finishes that are clear to start and maintain the look of the wood over time.

I was hoping someone can direct us or comment on the epoxy vs urethane dilemma.

Thank you in advance.

Regards,
Vlad

[patrob]

I am just starting a proj in my family room. I need 210 sq ft of hardwood.
Oak or Maple?? and can anyone recomend a good shop to buy from in the Scarborough Pickering Ajax areas?

Looking for something durable with 2 kids 3/5 years old.
Thanks in advance.

For that square footage, open the yellow pages & call any hardwood store in your area for any specials. They usually have that much in stock. Unless you want something very specific from a particular manufacturer. Just stay away from Chinese made hardwood. With kids, oak is more forgiving.

[patrob]

Hi,

Happy 2010.

We just bought a townhouse that had existing red oak hardwood flooring on all stairs and one of the three floors. We have since installed new untreated red oak to match the other floor. We are looking for someone to sand and finish the whole house to get a uniform look.

Our problem/issue is that we like the raw red oak look and colour.
From what I gather, and what I can see on the existing old flooring, if we treat is with a polyurethane finish, it will look yellower right away. Even worse, over time the floor will get darker and even more orange/yellow.

What should we do to finish the floor and yet keep the look and colour of the wood as close to the raw look as possible?

We have been reading about new epoxy finishes that are clear to start and maintain the look of the wood over time.

I was hoping someone can direct us or comment on the epoxy vs urethane dilemma.

Thank you in advance.

Regards,
Vlad
Yes, some people do like the look of raw wood. Applying of any kind of finish in natural, is like "wetting" the wood. Pretty much every finish will give you some yellow in red oak, polyurethane, tongue oil or even epoxy finish. Water based is pretty much your best choice. A professional re-finisher will be able to provide you with more info on what finish to use. I will send you his contact info.

[Faircraft]

Do yourself a favour - DON'T BUY EXOTICORP HARDWOOD. I don't care how cheap you can get it for - it is garbage wood. We bought 800 square feet of peruvian walnut (which is referring to the colour not the species of wood) at probably the same auction you were at and just finished our 600 square foot great room with it. It is extremely fussy - 5/8 thickness doesn't fit the gun well, it breaks off when you overhit the gun (pnuematic) and doesn't sink the heads when you underhit, and most importantly of all - it HATES WATER! Our Christmas tree stand barely spilt a handfull of water on it and 50 square feet of floor are ruined. Two days later, my one year old son's spiderman toy leaked a small amount of water, and I'm talking miniscule here, and another patch the same size as the first surfaced. I've laid thousands of board feet of maple floor in the same house and it get drenched in water and never had this much trouble with it. So my advice is simple - If it costs you another two bucks a square foot to buy something from a reputable dealer that will back up their product - do it. It will still be a lot cheaper and less work in the end than having to pay twice and lay twice. One more thing - stick to local woods like maple, oak, cherry, etc. They're tried and true.

[Faircraft]

I have posted a reply on this same product, and now I'm asking for help. Our Brand new floor has severe water damage from the Christmas tree and I'm not so sure I want to do board replacements since we're really not happy with the product in the first place. Does anyone know anything about these exotic woods - ie, if I refinish them, will the problem persist, or is it a finish problem in the first place? Is there some kind of flexible urethane that will move with the floor and therefore seal out any moisture from actually swelling the wood? Or should I just rip it up and replace it altogether? We really don't have the time or money for a full replacement now but I can't have my one year old getting slivers in his feet every time he walks across the floor with his cute little bear feet either. Any ideas?

[Ruepen]

Hello, I'm looking to get hardwood floors installed in my living/dining room (330 sq feet incl 10% extra), and I would also like to get stairs done (7 steps).
I don't know of any hardwood installers. Can you recommend a few hardwood installers that do quality work for a good price? I know the old saying "you get what you pay for", but we're on a budget and would like to get the best value for what we are paying for.

By the way, is there a website that provides a review of hardwood installation companies other than this site?

Thanks in advance for your help.

[patrob]

Do yourself a favour - DON'T BUY EXOTICORP HARDWOOD. I don't care how cheap you can get it for - it is garbage wood. We bought 800 square feet of peruvian walnut (which is referring to the colour not the species of wood) at probably the same auction you were at and just finished our 600 square foot great room with it. It is extremely fussy - 5/8 thickness doesn't fit the gun well, it breaks off when you overhit the gun (pnuematic) and doesn't sink the heads when you underhit, and most importantly of all - it HATES WATER! Our Christmas tree stand barely spilt a handfull of water on it and 50 square feet of floor are ruined. Two days later, my one year old son's spiderman toy leaked a small amount of water, and I'm talking miniscule here, and another patch the same size as the first surfaced. I've laid thousands of board feet of maple floor in the same house and it get drenched in water and never had this much trouble with it. So my advice is simple - If it costs you another two bucks a square foot to buy something from a reputable dealer that will back up their product - do it. It will still be a lot cheaper and less work in the end than having to pay twice and lay twice. One more thing - stick to local woods like maple, oak, cherry, etc. They're tried and true.
Sorry to hear that you had such a bad experience. Your nailer was not set for 5/8" product. There are nailers with adjustable foot for diff. heights.

I have posted a reply on this same product, and now I'm asking for help. Our Brand new floor has severe water damage from the Christmas tree and I'm not so sure I want to do board replacements since we're really not happy with the product in the first place. Does anyone know anything about these exotic woods - ie, if I refinish them, will the problem persist, or is it a finish problem in the first place? Is there some kind of flexible urethane that will move with the floor and therefore seal out any moisture from actually swelling the wood? Or should I just rip it up and replace it altogether? We really don't have the time or money for a full replacement now but I can't have my one year old getting slivers in his feet every time he walks across the floor with his cute little bear feet either. Any ideas?

If you have enough wood to repair it, do the repair first before anything else. Even if you sand it & re-finish it, it will still move. If the wood shrinks & expands, the finish will crack between boards & gapping will show. With exotic wood of any kind, you have to be very careful with RH levels. You have to maintain it right on throughout the year 45%-55%. What are the slivers from, is the wood cracking or just such poor quality? Replacing it will be too expensive.

[patrob]

Hello, I'm looking to get hardwood floors installed in my living/dining room (330 sq feet incl 10% extra), and I would also like to get stairs done (7 steps).
I don't know of any hardwood installers. Can you recommend a few hardwood installers that do quality work for a good price? I know the old saying "you get what you pay for", but we're on a budget and would like to get the best value for what we are paying for.

By the way, is there a website that provides a review of hardwood installation companies other than this site?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Not only do we provide hardwood advice but we also install & more :)
If you are thinking of getting it done before the tax credit ends, you might have a hard time finding a good installer.
For reviews on diff. companies/contractors, check out HomeStars (http://homestars.com/on/mississauga/floor-laying-refinishing)

[moocho]

Hello, I have surface sealed hardwood floors, any advice on how to get rid of the minor scratches? :?: Also , what kind of maintenance is recommended? any wax or polish? thxs in advance!

[patrob]

Hello, I have surface sealed hardwood floors, any advice on how to get rid of the minor scratches? :?: Also , what kind of maintenance is recommended? any wax or polish? thxs in advance!

If it's varnished floors, don't use any waxes or polishes. For maintenance, vacuum or dry swiffer & occasionally use a hardwood floor cleaner. If you want your hardwood to look clean & refreshed, you have to screen & coat.

[randp]

Planning to install a exotic hardwood Jatoba - Vintage Solid Sawn - Venatian Brown in the house about 600 sq feet... wondering if you have heard about this product and its quality etc...it costs a fair bit $6++ so wanted to know more about the product..spoke to 2 -3 retailers..all spoke highly about the manufacturer , however i am concerned as the Solid Sawn seems like a a new concept...

[patrob]

Planning to install a exotic hardwood Jatoba - Vintage Solid Sawn - Venatian Brown in the house about 600 sq feet... wondering if you have heard about this product and its quality etc...it costs a fair bit $6++ so wanted to know more about the product..spoke to 2 -3 retailers..all spoke highly about the manufacturer , however i am concerned as the Solid Sawn seems like a a new concept...

We are quite familiar with that product :D

Vintage 3/4" Solid Sawn Eng. wood is the best you can get! It is almost worry free in terms of RH issues especially for exotic species. We have installed tons of various Solid Sawn products & haven't encountered any issues yet. We actually recommend this over reg. solid hardwood & in the near future most of hardwood flooring products will be engineered :idea: This is also what we have installed in our house :) (but in hand scraped oak)

Here is a read on actual Venetian Brown we installed http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/8030564-post1281/

[clarke1866x2]

Hi Patrob and friends,

I recently bought a house that has a completely tiled first floor. The tiling job is solid, but hideous (it was done in the 80s). Assuming the floor is level, what would you recommend:

ripping out the tile and installing traditional hardwood, or;
putting down engineered hardwood over the tile.


Any thoughts one way or the other? I haven't moved in yet and I'm not sure what is under the tile. Could be anything, but the floor is very solid now.

Thanks in advance for any advice!

[Brandon]

For reviews on diff. companies/contractors, check out HomeStars (http://homestars.com/on/mississauga/floor-laying-refinishing)

Are there any other review sites like this? I tried looking at their Ottawa section, but no reviews for flooring.

[adamm]

We just bought a house and it's got dark hard-wood flooring on the main floor. We're painting the entire house and we've managed to add a couple minor scratches to the floor with our shoes which look like white lines in the light and I also found a couple existing minor scratches.

How can I fix/repair them?

[patrob]

Hi Patrob and friends,

I recently bought a house that has a completely tiled first floor. The tiling job is solid, but hideous (it was done in the 80s). Assuming the floor is level, what would you recommend:

ripping out the tile and installing traditional hardwood, or;
putting down engineered hardwood over the tile.


Any thoughts one way or the other? I haven't moved in yet and I'm not sure what is under the tile. Could be anything, but the floor is very solid now.

Thanks in advance for any advice!

If you are not planning to go through a messy & costly tile removal, you can install engineered hardwood over the tile (floated). But if you have time & you will remove the tile yourself, then remove everything to bare sub-floor & star over with the desired floor covering.

[patrob]

Are there any other review sites like this? I tried looking at their Ottawa section, but no reviews for flooring.

No idea, sorry.

[patrob]

We just bought a house and it's got dark hard-wood flooring on the main floor. We're painting the entire house and we've managed to add a couple minor scratches to the floor with our shoes which look like white lines in the light and I also found a couple existing minor scratches.

How can I fix/repair them?

Hardwood touch up kit in the closest matching colour available at your local hardwood store.
Try to get the touch up kit a bit darker than actual stain (for browns only).

[bolton_gal]

Just a question if anyone knows how to. Looking to install 220sqft of hardwood in my living room but not sure how to transition the hardwood to the ceramics in 3 different areas. The hardwood is higher then the ceramic but I would like it to look like the hardwood and ceramic butt next to each other and avoid having to use a transition strip in between the two....I have seen in some homes where the ceramic meets the hardwood, the installer sloped the hardwood down a bit to butt next to the ceramic. I have no idea how this is done and am sure that it involves some experience in doing and i'm not going to begin to take a stab at it and screw things up....Any suggestions???

[adamm]

Hardwood touch up kit in the closest matching colour available at your local hardwood store.
Try to get the touch up kit a bit darker than actual stain (for browns only).

how good will it look? Will it be noticeable?

[patrob]

Just a question if anyone knows how to. Looking to install 220sqft of hardwood in my living room but not sure how to transition the hardwood to the ceramics in 3 different areas. The hardwood is higher then the ceramic but I would like it to look like the hardwood and ceramic butt next to each other and avoid having to use a transition strip in between the two....I have seen in some homes where the ceramic meets the hardwood, the installer sloped the hardwood down a bit to butt next to the ceramic. I have no idea how this is done and am sure that it involves some experience in doing and i'm not going to begin to take a stab at it and screw things up....Any suggestions???

Here I posted how to make an actual reducer http://www.redflagdeals.com/forums/8461453-post1534/
Here is a pic of how it looks from the side when cut http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/486/img8172.jpg
And here is a pic of how it looks when installed http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2919/waseem1tm5.jpg
But in this particular pic, the tiles were much lower than usually & the diff. was almost 1/2". You can see at the baseboard how it slopes down.

[patrob]

how good will it look? Will it be noticeable?

To you it will probably always be visible since you know it's there especially against the sun. To others it might not be. It will also depend on how close of a colour match you get. The only other way to fix it is to replace the actual damaged/scratched plank.

[pepper3245]

Patrob,

Thanks for helping all of us out!

Few questions on laminate:
1. I see E0.5 on the Costco Golden Select, is the E number related to VOC? How good is E0.5?
2. Plan on laying radiant cables in the basement (basement is below gnd level). cables/thinset/laminate. Do I need a vapour barrier? The cables would dry out the concrete (?)

[patrob]

Patrob,

Thanks for helping all of us out!

Few questions on laminate:
1. I see E0.5 on the Costco Golden Select, is the E number related to VOC? How good is E0.5?
2. Plan on laying radiant cables in the basement (basement is below gnd level). cables/thinset/laminate. Do I need a vapour barrier? The cables would dry out the concrete (?)

I am not exactly sure about the E0 & VOC but I will try to find out more. No you don't need a vapour barrier but underlay is required, specified by the flooring manufacturer.

[txenglan]

Patrob,

Happy New Year and thanks for the best thread on all of RFD!

Forgot to post this closer to X-Mas and/or NY day :)

[xiaoxiong0607]

It means the builder uses either OSB or plywood sheets nailed & screwed as a sub-floor over engineered joists not solid 2x8 or 2x10 joists. Yes you can install hardwood over it. Do you know what type of baseboard they install? It's easier to install quarter round.
Patrob, thanks for answering my previous question. My new house will have main floor and stairs stained by builder and we will pick up color very soon from decor center. We decide to lay hardwood floor ourselves on second floor (1200 sqf) and we really like oak stained floor from Vintage. The question is HOW CAN WE ENSURE THE COLOR OF HARDWOOD FLOOR ON 2ND FLOOR MATCHES STAIRS, RAILING AND NOSING?

[patrob]

Patrob,

Happy New Year and thanks for the best thread on all of RFD!

Forgot to post this closer to X-Mas and/or NY day :)

Thanks for the support :) And Happy New Year to you too :cheesygri

Still waiting for those pics ;)

[patrob]

Patrob, thanks for answering my previous question. My new house will have main floor and stairs stained by builder and we will pick up color very soon from decor center. We decide to lay hardwood floor ourselves on second floor (1200 sqf) and we really like oak stained floor from Vintage. The question is HOW CAN WE ENSURE THE COLOR OF HARDWOOD FLOOR ON 2ND FLOOR MATCHES STAIRS, RAILING AND NOSING?

If the builder is supplying Vintage hardwood on the main floor & you choose a particular colour stain, lets say Mocha, then after closing you just order the same type of wood with the same name, simple :) Stairs will never perfectly match pre-finished hardwood anyways because they are stained & finished on site but will be colour matched to the floors very close. You have nothing to worry about as long as you get the same wood after. If you need help with that after closing, let me know & I might be able to help ;)

[mmcgowen]

I have a maple hardwood floor that's about 5 years old that has been heavly scratched by children and a golden retreiver. I would like to get it sanded and refinished. Is there anyway to add some additional protection to keep the refinished floor from being as easily damaged?

[patrob]

I have a maple hardwood floor that's about 5 years old that has been heavly scratched by children and a golden retreiver. I would like to get it sanded and refinished. Is there anyway to add some additional protection to keep the refinished floor from being as easily damaged?
Except using a good quality finish, there is really nothing else you can add. You can ask the re-finisher to use an epoxy finish which will be harder & use a low gloss/satin finish. An area rug will help. That's the beauty of maple, it's not very forgiving with kids & dogs.

[xiaoxiong0607]

Patrob,
thanks for answering previous questions. You are very helpful.
1) how many nails ( i assume 2 inch) do i need to install 1200 sqf?
2) do i buy L head or T head? which brand you recommend?
3) Where do you buy and what type do you think is the best?
4) I only have 18 gauge nailer. Do i need some glue for first 2 rows?

many thanks

[kneal]

You can buy filler at any hardware store for those holes and do it yourself.

I just wanted to pop in and warn everyone to stay far, far away from Mr. Sandless. They destroyed the oak floors in my loft. Now I have woodrot and cracks from their water-based treatment.
Now that I'm house poor, I did alot of research and I can apply a base which will take care of rot, mould, fungus and wood critter, then apply a modern poly urythane high gloss base, resulting in this!

http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/sf/inspiration/inspiration-high-gloss-black-floors-069826

It's the cheapest solution.

Hi DeVilla,
The Mr.Sandless water based treatment isnt why your floor has wood rot. It is because your floor already had water damage. If the wood floor is worn down and the wood is open water can get into the wood causing water damage. People should have their wood floors refinished regularly so there is always a coat of protection. You would either have to sand or do board replacement to get rid of water damage. Nothing else gets rid of water damage or pet stains. You could also replace your floors at a high cost. Also cracks would not be caused by the water based treatment which is a poly urethane. Cracks are caused by the wood expanding and shrinking caused by hot and cold weather. Again if they are not protected there is this issue as well.
The floors were already damaged and with the process it shows up. Sometimes water damage and pet stains are visible before the treatment. And sometimes like in your case it shows up during or after the floors are completed. The water products dry very fast. In order for water damage to happen it has to be exposed to water for a long period of time. Typically what happens when windows are left open when it is raining outside. Mr.Sandless is an alternative to sanding and is cheaper. So therefore if the floor is damaged because they don't sand taking off 1/8th of an inch the damage shows up. People like Mr.Sandless because the process is quick and non toxic.
I think before you post something about a business you should find out more info.
P.S Just a thought-if water based poly urethane products caused water damage they wouldn't be on the market.

[joshuacat]

Hello, Patrob. I have most of the Mirage Lock floating floor installed in my front living room. I left the baseboards on for the installation. I wondering what the widest shoe molding that you can buy? The thing is, when I installed the wood, I left 1/2" in most areas, but for some stupid reason I left 3/4"(and slightly more) in a couple of small areas. These areas will likely be hidden by furniture, but still it would be nice not to see the space. Thanks in advance.

[dwalker]

Looking to put hardwood through out our whole main floor. Which will mean also having it in the kitchen. Looking for something durable and would like to get a wider (5" or so ) plank. Since it is going in the kitchen as well should we be looking at engineered or should we stick with hardwood. I find that the engineered almost looks like laminate but I do like the thought of the hand scrapped so it will hide any scratches. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Hoping to find something nice for $5 a square foot, is this even possible?

Thanks.

[dwalker]

wondering if anyone has any experience with KULTUR flooring. I visited there show room today in Stoney Creek. They had great prices but not sure if the quality is there. It looked like there engineered hardwood is MDF with a thin layer of wood on top. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[yuppy]

Has anyone tried buying hardwood from the US? Is there a significant price difference?

Looking to get Brazilian Cherry by Mirage. Got a quote of - 7.35/sqft in Ottawa. Mirage has plenty of dealers in the US. Will call them on monday, just curious if anyone has looked into that before.

thanks,
pidrilo

[patrob]

Patrob,
thanks for answering previous questions. You are very helpful.
1) how many nails ( i assume 2 inch) do i need to install 1200 sqf?
2) do i buy L head or T head? which brand you recommend?
3) Where do you buy and what type do you think is the best?
4) I only have 18 gauge nailer. Do i need some glue for first 2 rows?

many thanks

You will need approx. 10,000 nails depending on the width of the plank. What type of nailer do you have L or T? You buy what you need but they are both equivalent. L might be a little bit cheaper. For the pricing you have to call around. I highly recommend 16 gauge nailer for start & finish. Glue only around thresholds, nosings, reducers.

[patrob]

Hello, Patrob. I have most of the Mirage Lock floating floor installed in my front living room. I left the baseboards on for the installation. I wondering what the widest shoe molding that you can buy? The thing is, when I installed the wood, I left 1/2" in most areas, but for some stupid reason I left 3/4"(and slightly more) in a couple of small areas. These areas will likely be hidden by furniture, but still it would be nice not to see the space. Thanks in advance.

If you have a few gaps that require wider moulding, just cut a small piece of hardwood & glue it in to reduce the gap. You can buy 3/4" moulding available pretty much everywhere. If anything wider is required, you might have to go to a trim & moulding place. If you install larger quarter round remember that some of the furniture may stick out more from the wall.

[patrob]

Looking to put hardwood through out our whole main floor. Which will mean also having it in the kitchen. Looking for something durable and would like to get a wider (5" or so ) plank. Since it is going in the kitchen as well should we be looking at engineered or should we stick with hardwood. I find that the engineered almost looks like laminate but I do like the thought of the hand scrapped so it will hide any scratches. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Hoping to find something nice for $5 a square foot, is this even possible?

Thanks.


wondering if anyone has any experience with KULTUR flooring. I visited there show room today in Stoney Creek. They had great prices but not sure if the quality is there. It looked like there engineered hardwood is MDF with a thin layer of wood on top. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Engineered & solid hardwood once installed you should not see any difference. Top layers are identical. Not sure what you mean by "looks like laminate"? There are diff. types of engineered. HDF core (Kultur), plywood based appro. 3/8" 1/2" thick & the best is 3/4" Solid Sawn from Vintage.
Everything depends on type of installation. Durability of a smooth surface on eng. or solid is the same. Kitchen takes the most abuse so I would recommend something distressed (Vintage hand scraped). But for $5 sq. ft. will be impossible to find. Kultur is a lower quality product (their milling is not there) & that is reflected in their pricing. Some people refer to them as "Lumber Liquidators".

[patrob]

Has anyone tried buying hardwood from the US? Is there a significant price difference?

Looking to get Brazilian Cherry by Mirage. Got a quote of - 7.35/sqft in Ottawa. Mirage has plenty of dealers in the US. Will call them on monday, just curious if anyone has looked into that before.

thanks,
pidrilo

I doubt it will be cheaper when you add shipping charges, duty, etc. It maybe be cheaper to buy it in GTA & have it shipped there. If you look into Vintage, 3 1/4" Solid Sawn it will be way below $7 here in GTA & it's better than Mirage. You can get up 5" wide planks. How many sq. ft. are you looking for & what colour?

[yuppy]

I doubt it will be cheaper when you add shipping charges, duty, etc. It maybe be cheaper to buy it in GTA & have it shipped there. If you look into Vintage, 3 1/4" Solid Sawn it will be way below $7 here in GTA & it's better than Mirage. You can get up 5" wide planks. How many sq. ft. are you looking for & what colour?

Hi Patrob,

thank you for your response. GTA is a good option for me, as i travel there fairly often myself (by car). The area i'm looking to install hardwood in is just under 500 sqft. I don't remember the exact name of the color of the Brazilian Cherry wood (i will get that tomorrow), it didn't come out on the picture i took.

Can you recommend (PM if you prefer) a place in GTA to get the Vintage at a good price?

thanks in advance,
yuppy.

[wcoastmom]

Hello,
What do you think of Pergo flooring? I saw some of their Pestige at HD. It has the foam already attached. Currently have engineered, but 3 kids & a dog has caused havoc......so going to laminate, but don't want that "plasticy" look.

Is it fairly easy to install?

[andreifs]

Hello Patrob,

We are researching hardwood flooring options (and have gone through your forum's hundreds of pages!) for our new home and would appreciate your advice.

We have narrowed down the colour to something like Valencia from Vintage Hardwood but have not decided on the manufacturer yet. Of course, we are trying to balance quality with the budget.

What is your opinion of Three Towers Flooring? One of their sales reps told me they have their woods stained by Vintage.

Also, you have mentioned that Appalachian is "medium quality hardwood". What is the comprise in terms of quality? What are major issues with "medium" quality wood?

Finally, what should we be expecting to pay for Vintage (select and better) for about 800-1600 sq ft in the Mississauga / GTA area?

Thanks so much for all your help!

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

thank you for your response. GTA is a good option for me, as i travel there fairly often myself (by car). The area i'm looking to install hardwood in is just under 500 sqft. I don't remember the exact name of the color of the Brazilian Cherry wood (i will get that tomorrow), it didn't come out on the picture i took.

Can you recommend (PM if you prefer) a place in GTA to get the Vintage at a good price?

thanks in advance,
yuppy.

Sent you PM with more info :)

[patrob]

Hello,
What do you think of Pergo flooring? I saw some of their Pestige at HD. It has the foam already attached. Currently have engineered, but 3 kids & a dog has caused havoc......so going to laminate, but don't want that "plasticy" look.

Is it fairly easy to install?

I would consider the Costco Laminate especially if you want something less expensive. Many people here have been happy with the overall quality. Plus if you are not happy with it, I am sure you can take it back :D Fairly easy to install in open areas & more tricky around trim & casings.

[wcoastmom]

Oh, and another thing.......:o

We currently have light maple flooring (to go with the kitchen cabinets & the stairway railing & banister). In a perfect world, we'd like to change it up - put in something darker. The kitchen cabinets could be changed by changing the doors & I believe the kitchen island is covered by laminate which I am assuming could be fairly easily replaced (isn't it basically just ironed on?).

The roadblock, in my mind however, is the stairway. Replacing the railing & banister seems like a huge & expensive ordeal. Some have suggested staining it. Is it possible to stain is darker without it looking awful? It also seems like a fussy job - especially with all the spindles, etc. Makes me wonder if it's really worth it. I assume you'd have to strip the old finish off & stain it the new colour?

What would you suggest?

[patrob]

Oh, and another thing.......:o

We currently have light maple flooring (to go with the kitchen cabinets & the stairway railing & banister). In a perfect world, we'd like to change it up - put in something darker. The kitchen cabinets could be changed by changing the doors & I believe the kitchen island is covered by laminate which I am assuming could be fairly easily replaced (isn't it basically just ironed on?).

The roadblock, in my mind however, is the stairway. Replacing the railing & banister seems like a huge & expensive ordeal. Some have suggested staining it. Is it possible to stain is darker without it looking awful? It also seems like a fussy job - especially with all the spindles, etc. Makes me wonder if it's really worth it. I assume you'd have to strip the old finish off & stain it the new colour?

What would you suggest?

Replacing the doors, yes but the veneer? iron on? You can probably buy new panels or cover with "false" doors. The stairs will be a PITA to re-stain & messy. It will be cheaper to just replace the pickets unless you paint them white. You can also do a two tone staircase with just the treads stained & the risers white. You would have to strip the varnish off the stairs, get it to raw wood & then start from the beginning. Unless you do this work yourself, it will be more costly than the new laminate floors.

[wcoastmom]

Replacing the doors, yes but the veneer? iron on? You can probably buy new panels or cover with "false" doors. The stairs will be a PITA to re-stain & messy. It will be cheaper to just replace the pickets unless you paint them white. You can also do a two tone staircase with just the treads stained & the risers white. You would have to strip the varnish off the stairs, get it to raw wood & then start from the beginning. Unless you do this work yourself, it will be more costly than the new laminate floors.

I say iron on because right now I can see that it's peeling off :o

The stairs are carpeted (& yes in a perfect world, I'd like to rip out all the carpeting, but that's not going to happen any time soon....). The stairs are split (going up half a level, turning 180 & going up another half level). The first half has a railing/banister that is stuck to the wall. The upper half is a railing with the spindles. Still seems fussy to me.....*sigh*

[patrob]

I say iron on because right now I can see that it's peeling off :o

The stairs are carpeted (& yes in a perfect world, I'd like to rip out all the carpeting, but that's not going to happen any time soon....). The stairs are split (going up half a level, turning 180 & going up another half level). The first half has a railing/banister that is stuck to the wall. The upper half is a railing with the spindles. Still seems fussy to me.....*sigh*

I assumed the stairs were all wood :D In this case all you have to do is paint the pickets white or try sanding them but it will be a PITA to get in the groves & re-finish/stain the handrail with post/s.

[jonmar]

We had hardwood floors installed in our dining room and breakfast area about 5 years ago. The finish was high gloss and the scuffs are really becoming noticeable. We are talking about 300 sq feet or so. Can these be sanded down, refinished with something more durable? What is the usual cost for this?

[patrob]

We had hardwood floors installed in our dining room and breakfast area about 5 years ago. The finish was high gloss and the scuffs are really becoming noticeable. We are talking about 300 sq feet or so. Can these be sanded down, refinished with something more durable? What is the usual cost for this?

Yes it can be re-finished but it will depend on the type of floor. High gloss shows more damage so for that reason I would recommend semi or low gloss finish. Cost will vary from approx. $2 sq. ft. plus.

[jonmar]

Yes it can be re-finished but it will depend on the type of floor. High gloss shows more damage so for that reason I would recommend semi or low gloss finish. Cost will vary from approx. $2 sq. ft. plus.

Can you PM with someone good at this?

[patrob]

Can you PM with someone good at this?

PM sent :)

[Shad0w]

Hey Patrob :)

My hardwood floor that was installed the other day was looking good.. until the other day when I heard a bang... i go into the other room and one of the hardwood planks has developed a nice crack in it.. not sure why.. there's plenty of an expansion space left... im guessing just a bad board?

Humidity in the home is between 25 - 30%.

So now I guess I have a choice.. put a throw down rug over it in the room :(
OR get the board replaced. (I probably want it replaced even if I decide to use a carpet)


Anyhow, Im looking for someone that you might know and trust that could cut this board out and replace it. I have plenty of wood left from the install so material is not an issue :)

ANY help is appreciated.. its really hard these days to find good people that know what they're doing :)

Below are pics of the board that cracked, some are hard to see it, one really shows what happens....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831337/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831293/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831245/

[xiaoxiong0607]

Patrob,

Thanks for you previous reply. I bought a 16 gauge nailer to finish last severl rows of hardwood floor. but I found it cannot drive 2'' nails deep enough through tones. Face nailing is deep enough. Is this common? Thanks

[patrob]

Patrob,

Thanks for you previous reply. I bought a 16 gauge nailer to finish last severl rows of hardwood floor. but I found it cannot drive 2'' nails deep enough through tones. Face nailing is deep enough. Is this common? Thanks

Most of the nailers have depth adjustment. That might help or try to change the angle you shoot the nails at.

[Sweeta]

Is $2800 a ridiculous price for staining stairs, risers, picket a darker color? Seems like a big hassel to try to do this after closing since it will be standard oak. Any thoughts?

It's 1.5 stair cases (splits from landing into two directions)

[patrob]

Hey Patrob :)

My hardwood floor that was installed the other day was looking good.. until the other day when I heard a bang... i go into the other room and one of the hardwood planks has developed a nice crack in it.. not sure why.. there's plenty of an expansion space left... im guessing just a bad board?

Humidity in the home is between 25 - 30%.

So now I guess I have a choice.. put a throw down rug over it in the room :(
OR get the board replaced. (I probably want it replaced even if I decide to use a carpet)

Anyhow, Im looking for someone that you might know and trust that could cut this board out and replace it. I have plenty of wood left from the install so material is not an issue :)

ANY help is appreciated.. its really hard these days to find good people that know what they're doing :)

Below are pics of the board that cracked, some are hard to see it, one really shows what happens....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831337/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831293/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/12279563@N02/4273831245/

It's fixable but if you want us to do it you have to wait a little as we are very busy :D

[patrob]

Is $2800 a ridiculous price for staining stairs, risers, picket a darker color? Seems like a big hassel to try to do this after closing since it will be standard oak. Any thoughts?

It's 1.5 stair cases (splits from landing into two directions)

If it's from the builder, it's their typical inflated price & very common among all builders. Have you tried to have the builder leave the stairs un-finished? But either way, unless you do the labour yourself, you will not save much money doing it after. Labour costs.

[Shad0w]

It's fixable but if you want us to do it you have to wait a little as we are very busy :D

Honestly Patrob :)
Im very very patient for good people :)
Id be more than happy to wait till you guys had some time to do this job!

Any ideas on what would cause a piece of wood to do this 4 or so months after being installed?

[Sweeta]

Replacing the doors, yes but the veneer? iron on? You can probably buy new panels or cover with "false" doors.

We ended up peeling off the veneer and painting the doors with melamine paint as a quick fix to match the floors until we can afford new cabinets :) I don't think you can buy the iron on/ laminate (that I think you are talking about). Also looks like it would be difficult to get it to go on smoothly unless you've done it before or are a prof?

[Sweeta]

If it's from the builder, it's their typical inflated price & very common among all builders. Have you tried to have the builder leave the stairs un-finished? But either way, unless you do the labour yourself, you will not save much money doing it after. Labour costs.

Thanks Patrob! I got the same feedback from some of the others. I will try to leave it unfinished and get it shortly after we move in.

[pepper3245]

Patrob,

Thanks for helping all of us out!

Few questions on laminate:
1. I see E0.5 on the Costco Golden Select, is the E number related to VOC? How good is E0.5?
2. Plan on laying radiant cables in the basement (basement is below gnd level). cables/thinset/laminate. (?)

Hi Patrob,

Another option I'm looking at is:

concrete/Delta FL/foam/cables/thinset/laminate.

By doing this I'm hoping to warm the laminate directly instead of heating the concrete. Do you think would be better? If so what foam (or whatever) would you recommend? Delta FL does not recommend direct contact with it's product to cables.

Thanks Again!

[patrob]

Honestly Patrob :)
Im very very patient for good people :)
Id be more than happy to wait till you guys had some time to do this job!

Any ideas on what would cause a piece of wood to do this 4 or so months after being installed?

Sometimes changes in humidity (expansion & contraction of the wood) will cause the board to crack. But often lower quality wood is not selected properly & is stained/coated already partially cracked. So slight changes in humidity will cause that defective board to finally crack/split.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Another option I'm looking at is:

concrete/Delta FL/foam/cables/thinset/laminate.

By doing this I'm hoping to warm the laminate directly instead of heating the concrete. Do you think would be better? If so what foam (or whatever) would you recommend? Delta FL does not recommend direct contact with it's product to cables.

Thanks Again!

Not every floor can be installed over heated surface. So you have to check with the flooring manufacturer to see what is recommended & if possible. Some flooring can dry out, fall apart or de-laminate.

[vasc]

Which stain would you recommend to use for oak to "match" the look of jatoba? (natural color semigloss finish)

I m replaced the floors with jatoba and I m planning to stain the stairs (oak)

Thanks

[Shad0w]

Sometimes changes in humidity (expansion & contraction of the wood) will cause the board to crack. But often lower quality wood is not selected properly & is stained/coated already partially cracked. So slight changes in humidity will cause that defective board to finally crack/split.

Amen to that.... Im going for lower quality wood as the excuse here...
Just one more reason for people here to stay FAR away from Brampton Hardwood :)

It didnt even crack on the tonge side, its the groove side that split!!!

Ah well, I think Ill live with it for now as I rather like the look of the throw down rug in that area anyhow....

Later on down the road (couple of years from now), ill tear this crap out and put in some good vintage hardwood. Lesson learned... cheaper option usually costs you more in the long run :)

[devilla]

You have alot of nerve responding to me here when you ignored all my phone calls after redoing my floors. My floors were inspected by both a flooring company I considered to do a light sanding and polyurethane (oil based) and also by your "EXPERT" prior to my spending over $1,300.00 to have you do my floors.
1) the first contractor saw no wood rot
2) your service people assured me it was an appropriate treatment. Since the polyurethane had worn down, I just wanted a new coat of shine. Woodrot would have been evident then.
3) My floors started cracking and woodrot developed AFTER your treatment.

You take NO responsibility. That is why I reported you to the BBB at the time. You didn't even respond to them, and they ruled in my favour and you received a negative entry at the BBB. I will continue to warn others about your service.

BTW, yours is not just any water based solution. It's a "secret".

After chemically treating my floors for woodrot, mould, fungus, fumigating for wood bugs, filling the cracks with woodfiller, I used a water based acrylic enamel wood stain to cover the mess and tiled over other areas. It is not causing problems.

I have had to do all this work myself. As a new home owner, I don't have money to flush down the toilet like I did when I hired you.

I stand by my opinion. Mr Sandless is a scam. If it sounds too good to be true..... well you know!!!

[patrob]

Which stain would you recommend to use for oak to "match" the look of jatoba? (natural color semigloss finish)

I m replaced the floors with jatoba and I m planning to stain the stairs (oak)

Thanks

Freshly installed natural Jatoba is yellowish/orange tone. With time it changes to a med. darker brown (with red undertone) with high variation of colours. Look for a stain that will match the aged Jatoba. I can't tell you an exact name because every manufacturer has a diff. name for their stain. But something like this

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/hickoryoldmission.jpg

Or go to a paint store that colour matches stains & they will be able to help you www.steelespaint.com They are pretty good with this stuff.

[patrob]

Amen to that.... Im going for lower quality wood as the excuse here...
Just one more reason for people here to stay FAR away from Brampton Hardwood :)

It didnt even crack on the tonge side, its the groove side that split!!!

Ah well, I think Ill live with it for now as I rather like the look of the throw down rug in that area anyhow....

Later on down the road (couple of years from now), ill tear this crap out and put in some good Vintage Hardwood. Lesson learned... cheaper option usually costs you more in the long run :)

Hopefully people will listen :) Unfortunately you had to learn the hard way >:(

Area rugs always help in these situations :cheesygri

[vasc]

Freshly installed natural Jatoba is yellowish/orange tone. With time it changes to a med. darker brown (with red undertone) with high variation of colours. Look for a stain that will match the aged Jatoba. I can't tell you an exact name because every manufacturer has a diff. name for their stain. But something like this

http://www.vintageflooring.com/images/colorlarge/hickoryoldmission.jpg

Or go to a paint store that colour matches stains & they will be able to help you www.steelespaint.com They are pretty good with this stuff.


Ty for your input. I did call them today but they wont "recommend" me a stain. They want me to bring in a piece of wood but then it s not aged :( . I was really hopping for a stain recommendation based on "previous experience" otherwise is pretty much going to store and "eye match" the color.

Based on that I did try (Light Cherry from HD) on the "hand rail" I ll post a picture later (need to take one) .

[samab]

Hi Patrob,

Another option I'm looking at is:

concrete/Delta FL/foam/cables/thinset/laminate.

By doing this I'm hoping to warm the laminate directly instead of heating the concrete. Do you think would be better? If so what foam (or whatever) would you recommend? Delta FL does not recommend direct contact with it's product to cables.

Thanks Again!

Read the DeltaFL FAQ on radiant floor heating.

http://www.cosella-dorken.com/bvf-ca-en/products/foundation_residential/floor/products/fl.php

[patrob]

Ty for your input. I did call them today but they wont "recommend" me a stain. They want me to bring in a piece of wood but then it s not aged :( . I was really hopping for a stain recommendation based on "previous experience" otherwise is pretty much going to store and "eye match" the color.

Based on that I did try (Light Cherry from HD) on the "hand rail" I ll post a picture later (need to take one) .

Sorry to hear they were not able to help you more :| As long as you pick similar colour tone or slightly darker, then you will be fine. Plus with oak stairs you will always see the dff. in the grain. I hope you bought the mini can to test it out.

[Free Willy]

We have to place our order today to meet our reno timeline. This is urgent, so I'm hoping someone can comment ASAP.

What are the pros and cons of 3 1/4" versus 4 1/4" planks? We've come across some Vintage 4 1/4" maple in Walnut on sale (is $4.60 for select and better a good deal?), however we've heard that the wider planks aren't as stable. Also, our rooms are fairly small, around 10'x15'. Will the wider planks not look as nice in smaller rooms?

If 4 1/4" planks are no good, then we'll have to pick another manufacturer. Would really appreciate any thoughts, thanks!

[patrob]

We have to place our order today to meet our reno timeline. This is urgent, so I'm hoping someone can comment ASAP.

What are the pros and cons of 3 1/4" versus 4 1/4" planks? We've come across some Vintage 4 1/4" in Walnut on sale (is $4.60 for select and better a good deal?), however we've heard that the wider planks aren't as stable. Also, our rooms are fairly small, around 10'x15'. Will the wider planks not look as nice in smaller rooms?

If 4 1/4" planks are no good, then we'll have to pick another manufacturer. Would really appreciate any thoughts, thanks!

Vintage does not make 4 1/4" size but 4". Are you talking about Black Walnut or Brazilian Walnut? With Black Walnut you have to be more careful because it's very soft & will damage/dent faster than oak or maple. So if you have kids/pets good luck :cheesygri

Depending on the species, yes wider planks are less stable & we usually don't recommend anything wider than 4" for solid wood. Regarding the plank widths, many people have this perception that wider planks are not appropriate for smaller spaces which is totally not true. Wider planks will make a smaller space feel larger "visually" & will open up the space. And looks less busy/choppy as your eyes follow the lines of the boards.
Here are some examples of 5" wide planks used in a very narrow townhouse :)

http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8736.JPG
http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8737.JPG
http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8743.JPG
http://floorwood.webs.com/photos/-Photo-Gallery/IMG_8740.JPG

Hope this helps :D

[Free Willy]

Thanks for the fast response, Patrob! I really appreciate it. :) The floors in those pics look beautiful and it makes me feel a lot better about going wider aesthetically.

I realized that I forgot to mention that the wood is maple. It's the stain that's walnut. :) We asked the sales person about the width of the planks because we were aware that Vintage didn't produce any maple planks in 4 1/4". We were told that they special ordered them from Vintage in bulk, which is why they're going for the price they are.

So would you recommend going with the 4 1/4" Vintage versus a standard 3 1/4" Mercier or Satin Finish then? I guess I'm just trying to weigh the disadvantages of a wider plank against Vintage's good rep.

[patrob]

Thanks for the fast response, Patrob! I really appreciate it. :) The floors in those pics look beautiful and it makes me feel a lot better about going wider aesthetically.

I realized that I forgot to mention that the wood is maple. It's the stain that's walnut. :) We asked the sales person about the width of the planks because we were aware that Vintage didn't produce any maple planks in 4 1/4". We were told that they special ordered them from Vintage in bulk, which is why they're going for the price they are.

So would you recommend going with the 4 1/4" Vintage versus a standard 3 1/4" Mercier or Satin Finish then? I guess I'm just trying to weigh the disadvantages of a wider plank against Vintage's good rep.

But the wood that they offered you is def. not Vintage (confirmed it with my sources ;)). They never make that size, not even on special order. So whoever is telling you it's Vintage is not telling you the truth. Plus the price is just too low for Black Walnut especially for Vintage. Ask them to show you the box of the wood :idea: Out of the two, I rather go with Mercier than Satin Finish.

[Free Willy]

But the wood that they offered you is def. not Vintage (confirmed it with my sources ;)). They never make that size, not even on special order. So whoever is telling you it's Vintage is not telling you the truth. Plus the price is just too low for Black Walnut especially for Vintage. Ask them to show you the box of the wood :idea: Out of the two, I rather go with Mercier than Satin Finish.
Oh, no, we already placed the order. D:

We thought they were telling the truth because they're listed as an authorized dealer on the Vintage website. I tried calling the Vintage offices to inquire about this but was prompted to enter an extension. :(

Now I'm worried we got lied to and ripped off...

[patrob]

Oh, no, we already placed the order. D:

We thought they were telling the truth because they're listed as an authorized dealer on the Vintage website. I tried calling the Vintage offices to inquire about this but was prompted to enter an extension. :(

Now I'm worried we got lied to and ripped off...

Hmmm....interesting. PM me with more info on who was the dealer, exact colour name, etc. Maybe it is Vintage but in 4" & the sales rep just made a mistake?

[Free Willy]

Hmmm....interesting. PM me with more info on who was the dealer, exact colour name, etc. Maybe it is Vintage but in 4" & the sales rep just made a mistake?
Actually, after a few more calls I think I've figured out what went wrong. My mother came home with a bunch of samples and said that they were Vintage, but for some reason didn't realize what the sales rep meant when he said that they were Vintage products branded with the store brand. This sort of confirms what I gathered from the Vintage rep I spoke with who said that they sometimes manufacture products for others to use rebranded. Next time I really should tag along to make sure there aren't any miscommunications. :o

[bakin]

Hi patrob,

We’re (my fiancée and I) going to be purchasing new hardwood for our house in the next little while (we take possession Apr 30). I know most people go for “standard oak” but we were just wondering what other types of wood flooring we could use that would be at least equal to the durability of oak. Any suggestions? I think the hardest part is going to be to pick a colour we both like!!! We’re looking for approximately 800 sq ft of material and we’ll be doing the installation ourselves (actually my brother in-law will be)!!! Size wise I think we’re looking at 3 ¼” or 3 ½” width planks.

[patrob]

Hi patrob,

We’re (my fiancée and I) going to be purchasing new hardwood for our house in the next little while (we take possession Apr 30). I know most people go for “standard oak” but we were just wondering what other types of wood flooring we could use that would be at least equal to the durability of oak. Any suggestions? I think the hardest part is going to be to pick a colour we both like!!! We’re looking for approximately 800 sq ft of material and we’ll be doing the installation ourselves (actually my brother in-law will be)!!! Size wise I think we’re looking at 3 ¼” or 3 ½” width planks.

Ash & Hickory have similar grain to oak. Ash is a little bit softer & Hickory is harder than oak. All of them are similarly priced. So now it's only up to you & what colour you prefer.

[Luciegagnon]

We hired them to install hardwood flooring throughout our condo in July 2008 - what a mistake! Tony Hellman gave us a written contract that stated he would be installing wood milled in Quebec and charged us $7.25/sqft (just for the wood).

What he really installed was Continental Designs Cumaru which he purchased from Brampton Hardwood (BH has never sold this wood for more than $4.99/sqft). Neither Tony nor BH will give us written confirmation where this wood is milled and BH claims they aren't sure!?! but will confirm it's definitely not Quebec...

We have had nothing but problems with this wood and HDB Interiors Inc. Flooring Brokers is refusing to deal with us any further - instead he is replying to my emails on homestars and continues to lie about the wood he installed.

I wish I had seen this http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:3Taq_mGSUZ8J:www.complaintsboard.co m/complaints/hdb-interiors-inc-c148897.html+homestars+hdb&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca before I hired HDB.

Also the reason his homestars reviews are so high is because he writes them himself using his customers email addresses (and some fake ones I'm sure). He did using my email address so I had it removed (after taking screen shots of course!).

1 year after installing new hardwood throughout our entire condo we are on the market again to have the job redone - this time we're going to use someone reputable and get it done right.

[patrob]

We hired them to install hardwood flooring throughout our condo in July 2008 - what a mistake! Tony Hellman gave us a written contract that stated he would be installing wood milled in Quebec and charged us $7.25/sqft (just for the wood).

What he really installed was Continental Designs Cumaru which he purchased from Brampton Hardwood (BH has never sold this wood for more than $4.99/sqft). Neither Tony nor BH will give us written confirmation where this wood is milled and BH claims they aren't sure!?! but will confirm it's definitely not Quebec...

We have had nothing but problems with this wood and HDB Interiors is refusing to deal with us any further - instead he is replying to my emails on homestars and continues to lie about the wood he installed.

I wish I had seen this http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:3Taq_mGSUZ8J:www.complaintsboard.co m/complaints/hdb-interiors-inc-c148897.html+homestars+hdb&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca before I hired HDB.

Also the reason his homestars reviews are so high is because he writes them himself using his customers email addresses (and some fake ones I'm sure). He did using my email address so I had it removed (aftertaking screenshots of course!).

1 year after installing new hardwood throughout our entire condo we are on the market again to have the job redone - this time we're going to use someone reputable and get it done right.
Thank you for posting your experience. I can only imagine how frustrated you must be with HDB Interiors for selling you such poor quality product.
I always tried to warn others to stay away from Brampton Hardwood in general because they sell low quality products & this is just another example of that. Hopefully others will see your experience & will stay away from Continental Designs hardwood.

Hopefully who ever you hire now will get the job done right with a quality product so you can enjoy your hardwood floors for many, many years to come problem free :)

[Luciegagnon]

Thanks Patrob, I hope people can learn from my very expensive lesson. Stay away from HDB Interiors Inc. Floor Brokers (save yourself the 50% premium and go directly to his supplier - Brampton Hardwood if that's the route you choose) and if you're going to get Continental Designs be prepared to live with cracks and many other issues.

This time I've done a lot more reading and research and I know what I want and where I want to get it from :cheesygri

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob, I hope people can learn from my very expensive lesson. Stay away from HDB Interiors Inc. Floor Brokers (save yourself the 50% premium and go directly to his supplier - Brampton Hardwood if that's the route you choose) and if you're going to get Continental Designs be prepared to live with cracks and many other issues.

This time I've done a lot more reading and research and I know what I want and where I want to get it from :cheesygri

I still say stay away from Brampton Hardwood :razz: Not worth the headaches that so many people have encountered :rolleyes:

Glad to hear you already found your new installers :D ;)

[dwalker]

Hi,
Wondering if anyone has any experience with Estate Hardwood Floors out in Stoney Creek. They seemed to have nice product at good prices and wondering if they are using good quality products and if they are capable in their installation. Thanks

[patrob]

Hi,
Wondering if anyone has any experience with Estate Hardwood Floors out in Stoney Creek. They seemed to have nice product at good prices and wondering if they are using good quality products and if they are capable in their installation. Thanks

I don't know if it's the same company but there used to be a company called Estate "Definity Hardwood". That hardwood caused a lot of people a lot of problems; very inconsistant milling & bad colour matching (stain). Hopefully it's not the same company.

[jb183]

hi, we are looking to have our floors refinished. They are a soft maple (not our choice of wood) and have taken a really bad beating over the past three years. Having a large dog has not helped but these floors seem extremely soft and mark very easily. What would the approximate cost of refinishing roughly 800 sq feet be and is there a finish that could be put on them that would be more durable? Thanks

[patrob]

hi, we are looking to have our floors refinished. They are a soft maple (not our choice of wood) and have taken a really bad beating over the past three years. Having a large dog has not helped but these floors seem extremely soft and mark very easily. What would the approximate cost of refinishing roughly 800 sq feet be and is there a finish that could be put on them that would be more durable? Thanks

There is no finish that you can use that will make the soft maple harder unfortunately. Re-finishing will help get rid of scratches/damages but eventually it will happen again. Prices will vary from anywhere of $2 sq. ft. up to $3.50 sq. ft. depending were you are located.

[zebrabek]

Hi Patrob,
I have been reading alot about hardwood flooring and stairs from this thread. I am having a big confussion and would to discuss it.
So here is my situation. I am buying a new condo townhouse (closing in August 2010). The stairs (around 15 steps) are carpetted and the living room (200 square feet) is laminated. They are providing me an upgrade where they will give me better quality laminate in the living room and will also laminate the stairs. The total cost for this upgrade is like $7500. Sounds like a ridiculious price. They don't have any upgrade for hardwood. Even if I request for one, they can't provide it. I think the price that they are charging me for laminate upgrade is too too much.
Now I am thinking of not going for laminate upgrade, and going for what ever the builder is providing, and after closing, get a floor specialist (maybe you if you are available) to put engineered hardwood on the living room and hardwood on the stairs. Is this a good idea? I have heard you mentioning that you should always get the stairs done by the builder cause the floor specialist will never be able build the stairs that will look perfect. I would like to hear your comments on why it would not look perfect, what are the challenges that cannot be addressed? Any other suggestion? Also if you can provide an average pricing for the stairs (material & labour), that would be very helpful.
Thanks alot

[flying.colours]

Hi guys,
I'm new to this forum and this will be my first post. I'm planning on getting hardwood installed in my home and my wife and I have more or less zeroed in on Ipe (brazilian walnut) hardwood. Anybody knows which retailer would be a good place to buy it from? We were thinking of getting it from a liquidator called Celebrity Flooring in Etobicoke. Any suggestions would be more than welcome.
Thanks
Satish
:)

[evanx]

Would also like reviews of F & L Hardwood Flooring Ltd in Mississauga. I can't seem to find any and would like to know if they are reputable.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,
I have been reading alot about hardwood flooring and stairs from this thread. I am having a big confussion and would to discuss it.
So here is my situation. I am buying a new condo townhouse (closing in August 2010). The stairs (around 15 steps) are carpetted and the living room (200 square feet) is laminated. They are providing me an upgrade where they will give me better quality laminate in the living room and will also laminate the stairs. The total cost for this upgrade is like $7500. Sounds like a ridiculious price. They don't have any upgrade for hardwood. Even if I request for one, they can't provide it. I think the price that they are charging me for laminate upgrade is too too much.
Now I am thinking of not going for laminate upgrade, and going for what ever the builder is providing, and after closing, get a floor specialist (maybe you if you are available) to put engineered hardwood on the living room and hardwood on the stairs. Is this a good idea? I have heard you mentioning that you should always get the stairs done by the builder cause the floor specialist will never be able build the stairs that will look perfect. I would like to hear your comments on why it would not look perfect, what are the challenges that cannot be addressed? Any other suggestion? Also if you can provide an average pricing for the stairs (material & labour), that would be very helpful.
Thanks alot
Def. do not take the upgraded laminate & laminate stairs for that price! But laminate stairs :rolleyes: Are you saying they don't even offer hardwood stairs? (that's a first :|) I usually recommend getting the stairs done by the builder because you will not save much if anything by hiring a professional after closing, plus the mess & inconvenience that goes with it. Unless the price the builder quotes you is really ridiculous. Also when you re-cap the treads in hardwood, it looks slightly diff. But I never said they will not look perfect.
I actually have seen prices quoted after closing to be sometimes higher than what the builder quoted for the stairs. The only time it's a good idea is when you plan to do all the labour yourself, then yes you can save some money. If you need more help let me know.

[patrob]

Hi guys,
I'm new to this forum and this will be my first post. I'm planning on getting hardwood installed in my home and my wife and I have more or less zeroed in on Ipe (brazilian walnut) hardwood. Anybody knows which retailer would be a good place to buy it from? We were thinking of getting it from a liquidator called Celebrity Flooring in Etobicoke. Any suggestions would be more than welcome.
Thanks
Satish
:)

First of all, I don't recommend any solid exotics. If you want exotic wood, look towards engineered hardwood. Same thing about liquidators, many times there are improper storing conditions, origin of wood may be un-known, non-existent warranty, etc. I suggest you buy hardwood from reputable manufacturer if you want to avoid potential problems. And exotics are harder than most other woods especially Ipe. The harder the wood, the more possibility of cracking.

[patrob]

Would also like reviews of F & L Hardwood Flooring Ltd in Mississauga. I can't seem to find any and would like to know if they are reputable.

Not familiar with that company, sorry. Ask them directly for a list of references.
With reputable companies, you will always find something about them on the internet, especially Homestars ;)

[flying.colours]

First of all, I don't recommend any solid exotics. If you want exotic wood, look towards engineered hardwood. Same thing about liquidators, many times there are improper storing conditions, origin of wood may be un-known, non-existent warranty, etc. I suggest you buy hardwood from reputable manufacturer if you want to avoid potential problems. And exotics are harder than most other woods especially Ipe. The harder the wood, the more possibility of cracking.

First of all Patrob, thanks for your prompt reply.
Is there a reputable manufacturer/shop that you like to recommend for purchasing Ipe? Would like to make the purchase by Wed/Thurs to take benefit of the HRTC ;)
Thanks
Satish

[Free Willy]

So we got our main floor done yesterday. The wood looks good, but here are a couple of the problem areas we had with the install. Are these typical? The nosing looks really dark (not to mention unevenly applied and covered in dust) and all our q-rounds have the nails showing through. My mother's pretty upset also because them put a couple of small dents/chips in our piano when moving it. We didn't notice until last night. >:(

http://i49.tinypic.com/2ntgxv8.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/x5e4ie.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2dkbeq1.jpg

[patrob]

So we got our main floor done yesterday. The wood looks good, but here are a couple of the problem areas we had with the install. Are these typical? The nosing looks really dark (not to mention unevenly applied and covered in dust) and all our q-rounds have the nails showing through. My mother's pretty upset also because them put a couple of small dents/chips in our piano when moving it. We didn't notice until last night. >:(

http://i49.tinypic.com/2ntgxv8.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/x5e4ie.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2dkbeq1.jpg

The nosing is def. too dark on the pic. Why wasn't a pre-finished nosing installed?? It would then match pretty much perfect.
Some installers don't dap or fill the holes in quarter round, that should have been in the contract. If nothing was mentioned, then they should have done it.

But dents in the piano, they were obviously not very careful. Make a complaint to the store manager.

[Free Willy]

The nosing is def. too dark on the pic. Why wasn't a pre-finished nosing installed?? It would then match pretty much perfect.
Some installers don't dap or fill the holes in quarter round, that should have been in the contract. If nothing was mentioned, then they should have done it.

But dents in the piano, they were obviously not very careful. Make a complaint to the store manager.
We actually thought that all nosings came pre-finished since they didn't mention anything about it either way. We were a bit surprised when they came in with the unfinished wood and stain. Didn't know it would turn out so dark though. And the contract didn't mention anything about filling the holes. We didn't really think anything about it since we thought it was up to us to paint everything, but then we noticed that the holes in quarter rounds in the rest of the house weren't simply painted over.

The piano's going to cost over $100 to fix. We're heading over to the store in a bit to let them know about the issues. :(

Well, at least the floors look okay. :|

[imnew]

Can someone tell me what the going price is for hardwood flr installation per sq ft?

We want to install hardwood upstairs in the hallway, it's about 100 sq ft....

Also installing hardwood down to the basement, just a small area... We would like to get oak railing installed and stairs installed with oak instead of just capping....

Wants to know approx $...:lol:

thanks..

[patrob]

We actually thought that all nosings came pre-finished since they didn't mention anything about it either way. We were a bit surprised when they came in with the unfinished wood and stain. Didn't know it would turn out so dark though. And the contract didn't mention anything about filling the holes. We didn't really think anything about it since we thought it was up to us to paint everything, but then we noticed that the holes in quarter rounds in the rest of the house weren't simply painted over.

The piano's going to cost over $100 to fix. We're heading over to the store in a bit to let them know about the issues. :(

Well, at least the floors look okay. :|

A tube of Dap & painter's putty will do for the quarter round. Hope they pay to fix the piano, good luck.

[patrob]

Can someone tell me what the going price is for hardwood flr installation per sq ft?

We want to install hardwood upstairs in the hallway, it's about 100 sq ft....

Also installing hardwood down to the basement, just a small area... We would like to get oak railing installed and stairs installed with oak instead of just capping....

Wants to know approx $...:lol:

thanks..

Most contractors have their min. fee. Job this size will not be charged by sq. ft. Many companies have min. 200-300 sq. ft. charge at min. $2 sq. ft. plus.
For prices on stairs, contact your local stair & railing company (Miss. Stair & Railing for example)

[Luciegagnon]

Here are some pictures of the issues we have been having with our hardwood (Continental Designs brand from Brampton Hardwood).

We would have never bought from Brampton Hardwood but we used a shady Flooring Broker (HDB Interiors Inc.) and they installed a much lower quality product than what was agreed upon and now refuse to speak with us.

There are cracks on over 25% of the planks. Some of the cracks are so bad the finish is starting to peel.
http://img46.imageshack.us/i/december09pics006.jpg/

Here is another picture of more cracks and lack of transition to front door step.
http://img46.imageshack.us/i/december09pics005.jpg/

Picture of the milky finish, this is especially visible in high traffic areas but found throughout the entire floor.
http://img194.imageshack.us/i/december09pics003.jpg/

Brampton Hardwood claims these issues are "normal" issues found with all hardwood. HDB Interiors who sold us this horrible product for a huge premium still insist it is a premium quality wood milled in Quebec...:twisted:

My opinion would be to stay away from both companies....it has been a very expensive lesson for me.

[patrob]

Here are some pictures of the issues we have been having with our hardwood (Continental Designs brand from Brampton Hardwood).

We would have never bought from Brampton Hardwood but we used a shady Flooring Broker (HDB Interiors Inc.) and they installed a much lower quality product than what was agreed upon and now refuse to speak with us.

There are cracks on over 25% of the planks. Some of the cracks are so bad the finish is starting to peel.
http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/7307/december09pics006.jpg

Here is another picture of more cracks and lack of transition to front door step.
http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/4840/december09pics005.jpg

Picture of the milky finish, this is especially visible in high traffic areas but found throughout the entire floor.
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/6899/december09pics003.jpg

Brampton Hardwood claims these issues are "normal" issues found with all hardwood. HDB Interiors who sold us this horrible product for a huge premium still insist it is a premium quality wood milled in Quebec...:twisted:

My opinion would be to stay away from both companies....it has been a very expensive lesson for me.

Thank for sharing your pics. This is def. not acceptable :mad:
Hopefully others will read your experience & stay far away from Continental Designs hardwood :!:

[hoob]

This past weekend I spent pulling up the existing carpet and tack strips -- all I have to say is that the carpet installed in a new condo building can be messy -- it's like they don't care how much plaster or other dust and random crap is under the pad! ugh..

Anyway, my flooring is getting delivered tomorrow (Tuesday) morning and I should have it all installed by the end of next weekend. A few questions:

1. You've already stated in this thread that I don't need to full in all the concrete nail divots from the tack strips. Yay, because there are a lot of them!

2. The condo concrete pad is beautifully flat, polished, and free of bumps and knobs and similar defects. All except on corner of the second bedroom, where the corner is high where it joins a structural concrete building wall -- it looks like something was manually trowelled in. My guess it's about 8mm over 40cm.

http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Renovation-2010/IMG4368/773993342_dHhu4-S.jpg (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Renovation-2010/IMG4368/773993342_dHhu4-X1.jpg)

For (2), how would you recommend installing over it? It's in a corner that won't see any traffic so I'm thinking I could get away with shaving down some of the planks to mitigate the lift a bit. Should I extend the ramp area with fill so the lift is more gradual and just sorta force the flooring in place and hope it settles? In the end this part will be under a wooden cabinet so I'm not too concerned even if it has some flex in it.

[Caz666]

Hi Patrob,

Thank you for this thread, I tried to search and to read large chunks of it before asking my questions, but I am running out of time.

We own an older (around 1910) Duplex in Montreal and live on the ground floor.

Our current floor is VERY old and most likely needs replacing for around 500-600 sq.ft. The current floor look like birch (<2").

Below this floor is a crawl space (dirt floor). We are in the process of adding a dehumidifier to the space and covering the floor with vapor barrier, but I am still worried about humidity. We have AC in the summer, but the crawl space currently never wet, but always humid.

The various sales rep said that in our situation, we should either go with the Engineered wood or at least smaller size hardwood (2 1/4). He mentioned that at smaller planks widths, the amount of movement will be similar.

We went to look at various Mirage flooring options and my wife fell in love with their non-select grade line (she loves the knots, she says it add character to the floor).

My wife PREFERS the cheaper, real wood to the more expensive (double the price) engineered wood).

Now for the questions:

a) I know you mentioned in the thread that you do not recommend hardwood above crawlspaces. Does this recommendation hold even if smaller strips are used? Even if hardwood is currently in place? Even if we add humidity control measures?

b) Is the sub-select Mirage product the same quality in other respects (besides for the knots and imperfections, which we want) then their best grade? I can live with knots, but I won't pay for an inferior product (grooves, finish, etc)

Thanks

Caz

[patrob]

This past weekend I spent pulling up the existing carpet and tack strips -- all I have to say is that the carpet installed in a new condo building can be messy -- it's like they don't care how much plaster or other dust and random crap is under the pad! ugh..

Anyway, my flooring is getting delivered tomorrow (Tuesday) morning and I should have it all installed by the end of next weekend. A few questions:

1. You've already stated in this thread that I don't need to full in all the concrete nail divots from the tack strips. Yay, because there are a lot of them!

2. The condo concrete bad is beautifully flat, polished, and free of bumps and knobs and similar defects. All except on corner of the second bedroom, where the corner is high where it joins a structural concrete building wall -- it looks like something was manually trowelled in. My guess it's about 8mm over 40cm.

For (2), how would you recommend installing over it? It's in a corner that won't see any traffic so I'm thinking I could get away with shaving down some of the planks to mitigate the lift a bit. If should I extend the ramp area so the lift is more gradual and just sorta force the flooring in place and hope it settles? In the end this part will be under a wooden cabinet so I'm not too concernt even if it has some flex in it.
8mm over 40 cm is a bit too much. Is there any possibility you can shave off the concrete a little bit? You cannot shave the planks too much or there will be no tongue & grove joint & it will make the joint a lot weaker which could break apart. In the worst case, make the diff. more gradual. You can throw some self leveling compound (make it thicker & trowel it on). If you have any compound left over, you can fill the chipped concrete but you don't really have to.

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

Thank you for this thread, I tried to search and to read large chunks of it before asking my questions, but I am running out of time.

We own an older (around 1910) Duplex in Montreal and live on the ground floor.

Our current floor is VERY old and most likely needs replacing for around 500-600 sq.ft. The current floor look like birch (<2").

Below this floor is a crawl space (dirt floor). We are in the process of adding a dehumidifier to the space and covering the floor with vapor barrier, but I am still worried about humidity. We have AC in the summer, but the crawl space currently never wet, but always humid.

The various sales rep said that in our situation, we should either go with the Engineered wood or at least smaller size hardwood (2 1/4). He mentioned that at smaller planks widths, the amount of movement will be similar.

We went to look at various Mirage flooring options and my wife fell in love with their non-select grade line (she loves the knots, she says it add character to the floor).

My wife PREFERS the cheaper, real wood to the more expensive (double the price) engineered wood).

Now for the questions:

a) I know you mentioned in the thread that you do not recommend hardwood above crawlspaces. Does this recommendation hold even if smaller strips are used? Even if hardwood is currently in place? Even if we add humidity control measures?

b) Is the sub-select Mirage product the same quality in other respects (besides for the knots and imperfections, which we want) then their best grade? I can live with knots, but I won't pay for an inferior product (grooves, finish, etc)

Thanks

Caz

Is the existing flooring also a sub-floor or you have a sub-floor underneath the flooring? Even if you install 2 1/4" solid wood, you still might have some movement. If the crawl space is properly vented with no moisture going towards the wood, then the movement will be minimal. Therefore I recommend engineered to be safer. The finish & milling should be the same on most of the grades. The grading will differ with variations of colours, knots, streaks, etc. Usually the lowest grade will have some minor wood defects & you have to account for more waste.

[jenna2]

Hi all, I appreciate you thoughts!!!

My question is about engineered wood and laminate flooring!
For new construction condo the builder offers 2 choices for the floors:-

Engineered hardwood floor (maple) Goodfellow riverside collection - I found the web page but not much info. I called the company they said you can not sand it but you can buff it once, the Maple is the hardest wood they have.
http://www.goodfellowinc.com/index.p...88&Itemid=1152

OR laminated floors by Armstrong Grand Illusions laminate Premium quality
http://www.armstrong.com/flooring/la...loors-4911.asp

Which one will you suggest as to keep the resale value of condo after 4-5 years. I'm kind of worried for the scratches. I brought a sample of Armstrong home "American Apple", it is a little slippery than engineered wood.

I was going for the engineered wood 100%. But I met someone at the site he said the laminate is the best. As they are trying to sell their condo people are not buying it because of the scratches?

Is laminate popular these days?
The builder does not want to install hardwood on concrete, so this is not an option.

[Caz666]

Is the existing flooring also a sub-floor or you have a sub-floor underneath the flooring? Even if you install 2 1/4" solid wood, you still might have some movement. If the crawl space is properly vented with no moisture going towards the wood, then the movement will be minimal. Therefore I recommend engineered to be safer. The finish & milling should be the same on most of the grades. The grading will differ with variations of colours, knots, streaks, etc. Usually the lowest grade will have some minor wood defects & you have to account for more waste.

Thankyou for the Reply.

1) Why the question about the subfloor? Is a subfloor better or worse? We were thinking of adding a layer of ply as the current "subfloor" seem to be a layer of wood "strips" across the joists. The would lay down plywood of appropriate thickness to match the hight of the kitchen floor (once we knock down the wall in-between.

Does this make it better for solid wood? Is there better subfloor than standard ply for cutting out and remaining humidity?

2) What would you recommend for Engineered wood if Mirage does not find our budget? I cannot find it locally below 6-7$ Is this the normal range? To this we need to add the glue and 3 in 1 mat...The cost rapidly good up to 9$ before install. Is the the normal range? The hardwood we had chosen is in the 3 $ range, but even a non-mirage "select or better" can be found in the 5-6$...

I may just bite the bullet and get the engineered wood, but then I would be saying goodbye to my heater ceramic :)

[bakin]

Patrob,

Who are some of the better quality manufacturers to consider when purchasing hardwood flooring ? Satin Finish, Bruce, etc? Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

[Toukolou]

Patrob,

Who are some of the better quality manufacturers to consider when purchasing hardwood flooring ? Satin Finish, Bruce, etc? Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

How about Muskoka? Are they decent? Thanks Patrob.

[BaDkO]

Hello Patrob,
I have been looking for hardwood for a few weeks now and I found this thread very very useful. I have brought down the list of my options to 2:
- Maple in Rembrandt colour, SelectV, 3 1/4 solid from Vintage for 6.30 per sq. ft.
- Maple in Cappucino colour, Select & Better, 4 1/4 solid from Preverco, on sale for 4.75 per sq. ft.

I am pretty happy with the price of Preverco but I am worried that the wider plank will cause issues with shrinkage/expansion.
What do you think about the price for Vintage - does it sound reasonable to you? I need about 450 sq. ft. so I don't expect to get any quantity discounts from vendors.

Thanks!

[jtkv]

Sorry to ask again if it's already been answered, but this thread is just too long to read through the whole thing!

I wanted to know what the difference is between a 7mm and thicker 10/12mm laminate... is it more durable? more comfortable?
Rona currently has a 7mm on sale for 0.84c and Lowe's has 7mm for 0.99c, and I wanted to understand the 2x or more price difference for thicker laminates. I plan to put the laminate in the basement, on top of rigid foam/OSB sub-flooring.

As well, the 7mm laminates above have a smooth surface, which I like, whereas the other laminates have a fake grain, which I really dislike. The gains makes the flooring feel slippery and cheap, whereas the smooth finish feels more like hardwood flooring. Does anyone feel the same?


regards,
jtkv

[patrob]

Hi all, I appreciate you thoughts!!!

My question is about engineered wood and laminate flooring!
For new construction condo the builder offers 2 choices for the floors:-

Engineered hardwood floor (maple) Goodfellow riverside collection - I found the web page but not much info. I called the company they said you can not sand it but you can buff it once, the Maple is the hardest wood they have.
http://www.goodfellowinc.com/index.p...88&Itemid=1152

OR laminated floors by Armstrong Grand Illusions laminate Premium quality
http://www.armstrong.com/flooring/la...loors-4911.asp

Which one will you suggest as to keep the resale value of condo after 4-5 years. I'm kind of worried for the scratches. I brought a sample of Armstrong home "American Apple", it is a little slippery than engineered wood.

I was going for the engineered wood 100%. But I met someone at the site he said the laminate is the best. As they are trying to sell their condo people are not buying it because of the scratches?

Is laminate popular these days?
The builder does not want to install hardwood on concrete, so this is not an option.
Not sure about the laminate, but the Goodfellow eng. wood is most likely made in China. Goodfellow & Armstrong are related. If you are thinking about selling, laminate will look better than the Goodfellow eng. It's more resistant to scratches but some people don't like laminate.

[patrob]

Thankyou for the Reply.

1) Why the question about the subfloor? Is a subfloor better or worse? We were thinking of adding a layer of ply as the current "subfloor" seem to be a layer of wood "strips" across the joists. The would lay down plywood of appropriate thickness to match the hight of the kitchen floor (once we knock down the wall in-between.

Does this make it better for solid wood? Is there better subfloor than standard ply for cutting out and remaining humidity?

2) What would you recommend for Engineered wood if Mirage does not find our budget? I cannot find it locally below 6-7$ Is this the normal range? To this we need to add the glue and 3 in 1 mat...The cost rapidly good up to 9$ before install. Is the the normal range? The hardwood we had chosen is in the 3 $ range, but even a non-mirage "select or better" can be found in the 5-6$...

I may just bite the bullet and get the engineered wood, but then I would be saying goodbye to my heater ceramic :)

1) Back in the days, the sub-floor was also the flooring (plank). Your new floor should be installed across the joists. And if your current floor is not perfectly smooth, it will show the same on the new floor. So sometimes it is better to install additional sub-floor for added strength & true flat surface. You can use Delta membrane plus plywood & then your floor. But I am not exactly sure how it works on a wooden sub-floor.

2) I am surprised that Mirage eng. is that expensive there, after all it is made in Quebec so should be cheaper than here in GTA (less than $6 sq. ft.)
Call few more places, maybe you canget it for cheaper.

[patrob]

Patrob,

Who are some of the better quality manufacturers to consider when purchasing hardwood flooring ? Satin Finish, Bruce, etc? Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.


How about Muskoka? Are they decent? Thanks Patrob.

Vintage, Mirage, Muskoka, Mercier, then maybe Satin Finish, Bruce & St. Lawrence def. last IMO.

[patrob]

Hello Patrob,
I have been looking for hardwood for a few weeks now and I found this thread very very useful. I have brought down the list of my options to 2:
- Maple in Rembrandt colour, SelectV, 3 1/4 solid from Vintage for 6.30 per sq. ft.
- Maple in Cappucino colour, Select & Better, 4 1/4 solid from Preverco, on sale for 4.75 per sq. ft.

I am pretty happy with the price of Preverco but I am worried that the wider plank will cause issues with shrinkage/expansion.
What do you think about the price for Vintage - does it sound reasonable to you? I need about 450 sq. ft. so I don't expect to get any quantity discounts from vendors.

Thanks!

There is no Rembrandt in Select-V from what I know. I am not a fan of Preverco but if you consider wider planks, you have to be aware of the potential issues. From experience in dealing with many diff. manufacturers, I say go with Vintage.

[patrob]

Sorry to ask again if it's already been answered, but this thread is just too long to read through the whole thing!

I wanted to know what the difference is between a 7mm and thicker 10/12mm laminate... is it more durable? more comfortable?
Rona currently has a 7mm on sale for 0.84c and Lowe's has 7mm for 0.99c, and I wanted to understand the 2x or more price difference for thicker laminates. I plan to put the laminate in the basement, on top of rigid foam/OSB sub-flooring.

As well, the 7mm laminates above have a smooth surface, which I like, whereas the other laminates have a fake grain, which I really dislike. The gains makes the flooring feel slippery and cheap, whereas the smooth finish feels more like hardwood flooring. Does anyone feel the same?

regards,
jtkv

Really? I always thought that the single beveled plank textured laminate looks more realistic vs. the smooth plasticky feel laminate :cheesygri The thinner laminates will have more flex if sub-floor is un-even. In some cases, depending on the manufacturer, it's easier to break/damage. Try to stay away from laminate that has no bevel on all sides. If you have any movement in the flooring, the edges may eventually chip. The Costco laminate for the price & what you get, is pretty good.

[patrob]

http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Renovation-2010/IMG4368/773993342_dHhu4-S.jpg (http://hoob.smugmug.com/Home-Living/Condo-Renovation-2010/IMG4368/773993342_dHhu4-X1.jpg)



It's a very small area to be fixed. Just chip the concrete in the corner to make it more straight.

[hoob]

Anyway, my flooring is getting delivered tomorrow (Tuesday) morning and I should have it all installed by the end of next weekend.

Stupid question... Is Vintage U-Loc supposed to come with instructions, spacers, etc? It seems all I get is boxes of planks and a little plastic thing that's like a large cocktail swizzle stick. I have no clue what the swizzle stick is for, except that it's NOT a children's toy!

The website isn't really much help: http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_uloc_6.php#

I took the top planks from the box, separated them, and tried to "loc" them back together. It doesn't seem as "easy" as I would expect -- in fact, I can't seem to get them to lock anywhere near like they were when they came out of the box. But it seems if I use any more pressure I'll damage the tabs. So hmm....

I don't want to go back to Darmaga and ask and look like a noob (but oh wait, I am!) :D

Edit: OK I figured out the lock thing but I still want the "layment instructions" so figure things out (like how to trim the edges/tabs if at the edge of the flooring surface, etc.) I will call Darmaga tomorrow, and have also emailed Vintage.

[t3359]

Hey Patrob...

Almost done my project... quick question - the hardwood flooring runs to the backyard door. The door is an older one with a crappy storm door on it... Currently the threshold is concrete. I've noticed some condensation there.

What do you recommend in terms of this area? It can even be temporary as we plan to change the door into a sliding patio door next year.

Right now I'm thinking of fixing the door jam, just stuffing the bottom of the door with foam or foam tape (like this (http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=905956&Ntt=905956&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=112022&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber)).

I had to cut the bottom of the door because I raised the floor, so I'll also have to raise the concrete threshold...

thanks!
bjl

[jenna2]

laminate will look better than the Goodfellow eng. It's more resistant to scratches but some people don't like laminate.

Thank you Patrob.
Yes laminate looks good.
Since some people won't like laminate then I'll go with engineered wood.

Can you help me with the color choice.
I have 3 color choices:
- very light Maple (almost cream)
- bronze/cherry (like orange/red)
- walnut (brown)

The kitchen cabinets either Dark brown OR Black/brownish gray
I like dark floors!!! Scratches will show too.

Do you think bronze/cherry will look nice?
I appreciate your help. Thank you.

[Luciegagnon]

One more reason to stay away from HDB Interiors Inc. & Flooring Brokers - we just had our condo measured to replace the cheap hardwood Tony Hellman installed 16 months ago and found out that not only did he swap in Continental Designs last minute and claim that the wood we purchased was sold to another customer but he also charged us for 1100sqft when the new installer only calculated 864sqft WITH WASTE and an extra powder room which we only decide to do this time around.:evil:

[jtkv]

Really? I always thought that the single beveled plank textured laminate looks more realistic vs. the smooth plasticky feel laminate :cheesygri The thinner laminates will have more flex if sub-floor is un-even. In some cases, depending on the manufacturer, it's easier to break/damage. Try to stay away from laminate that has no bevel on all sides. If you have any movement in the flooring, the edges may eventually chip. The Costco laminate for the price & what you get, is pretty good.

Thanks for your reply... yeah, I will take a look at Costco when I get the chance, hopefully by this weekend as the deadline for the home reno rebate is due...

jtkv

[flying.colours]

First of all, I don't recommend any solid exotics. If you want exotic wood, look towards engineered hardwood. Same thing about liquidators, many times there are improper storing conditions, origin of wood may be un-known, non-existent warranty, etc. I suggest you buy hardwood from reputable manufacturer if you want to avoid potential problems. And exotics are harder than most other woods especially Ipe. The harder the wood, the more possibility of cracking.

Can anyone on this forum recommend a retailer to buy Ipe solid hardwood from? Any help would be appreciated. What are your views about AA Floors in Etobicoke on Evans Ave.? They carry the Appalachian product line.
Thanks guys.

[varunr]

Hey patrob,

I am considering installing hardwood and consulted an installer he insist in using staples for the installation.

The wood I will use is oak and I read in your thread it's better to use nails could you clarify.

Also one more questions the installer suggest I screw down the entire sub floor before going ahead with the install since it is a 15 year old house we might be using OCB hence the suggestion.

Anyone in the forum have experience with seasons hardwood floors quality?
http://www.seasonsflooring.com/main.html

Please let me know your thoughts

[t3359]

Hey patrob,

I am considering installing hardwood and consulted an installer he insist in using staples for the installation.

The wood I will use is oak and I read in your thread it's better to use nails could you clarify.

I'm just a newbie, but I just finished installing a room of hard maple. I took Patrob's advice and used L-cleats. It was pretty difficult to remove boards if I screwed it up, so I figure they're pretty secure. On the other hand, the Home Depot guy basically worships staples. To each his own, but I would assume staples are easier to remove, and cleats are probably more secure. I think Patrob said something about staples for exotic woods(?)


Also one more questions the installer suggest I screw down the entire sub floor before going ahead with the install since it is a 15 year old house we might be using OCB hence the suggestion.

OSB? I glue/screwed down 3/4" OSB on top of the existing plywood subfloor to raise it to the same level as the tile in the adjacent room. If it weren't for the hassle of renting another van and returning it, I would have changed to plywood. The OSB was from HD, made by Norbord... Even though it was 23/32", I found pieces that were close to 1/2" on the edges! Luckily I bought a spare piece and was able to toss that one.

Also, (reading online), I found that OSB is really bad with moisture... I ended up painting all cuts and sanded areas with Killz oil primer to seal it.

Finally, I used the longest cleats I could fit into my nailer (2")... I would prefer that the nail went through the OSB through the plywood (figuring plywood holds nails better than OSB), but none of them went through when I checked in the basement. Oh well... maybe I overdesigned everything, but I think alot of people do that when working on their own home.

bjl

[patrob]

Stupid question... Is Vintage U-Loc supposed to come with instructions, spacers, etc? It seems all I get is boxes of planks and a little plastic thing that's like a large cocktail swizzle stick. I have no clue what the swizzle stick is for, except that it's NOT a children's toy!

The website isn't really much help: http://www.vintageflooring.com/product_uloc_6.php#

I took the top planks from the box, separated them, and tried to "loc" them back together. It doesn't seem as "easy" as I would expect -- in fact, I can't seem to get them to lock anywhere near like they were when they came out of the box. But it seems if I use any more pressure I'll damage the tabs. So hmm....

I don't want to go back to Darmaga and ask and look like a noob (but oh wait, I am!) :D

Edit: OK I figured out the lock thing but I still want the "layment instructions" so figure things out (like how to trim the edges/tabs if at the edge of the flooring surface, etc.) I will call Darmaga tomorrow, and have also emailed Vintage.
Sorry took so long to answer, we're on 24 hr shift, HRTC is ending soon & everybody wants hardwood floors last minute :cheesygri

The U-Lock is a fairly new product & honestly had no idea there were no instructions in the box. It's hard to put planks together in hand but it's fairly easy when placed on the floor. The "cocktail swizzle stick" :lol: is to unlock the side lock. Hopefully Vintage will send you some more instructions & don't be afraid to ask. Men also need to read instructions sometimes ;)

[wishflo]

Hi Patrob,

We recently started shopping around for hardwood floor, we started looking into a few brands, and because the builder used Vintage for our staircase, we decided to look into this brand some more. While we were quoting around, we learnt of the four grade levels from Vintage... when we visited one of the hardwood stores, they mentioned they have Vintage maple, "select and better" grade, but for a relatively lower price than all others...

have you heard of this before? I just want to make sure this grade does exist as it is not on the vintage website nor is it on any of the brochures we saw...

if anyone had ever had experience with this, please let us knowwww, we're trying to make a decision within these few days before the 31st... thanks!

[patrob]

Hey Patrob...

Almost done my project... quick question - the hardwood flooring runs to the backyard door. The door is an older one with a crappy storm door on it... Currently the threshold is concrete. I've noticed some condensation there.

What do you recommend in terms of this area? It can even be temporary as we plan to change the door into a sliding patio door next year.

Right now I'm thinking of fixing the door jam, just stuffing the bottom of the door with foam or foam tape (like this (http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CatalogSearchResultView?D=905956&Ntt=905956&catalogId=10051&langId=-15&storeId=10051&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntx=mode+matchall&recN=112022&N=0&Ntk=P_PartNumber)).

I had to cut the bottom of the door because I raised the floor, so I'll also have to raise the concrete threshold...

thanks!
bjl

You can use insulation tape or sealing foam as long as there is no moisture going through. If you are thinking about replacing with new doors, the new door might come with a frame & new threshold as one piece so don't worry abut the threshold until you have a new door. Sometimes a door seal or sweep might do the trick on the bottom of the door.

[patrob]

Thank you Patrob.
Yes laminate looks good.
Since some people won't like laminate then I'll go with engineered wood.

Can you help me with the color choice.
I have 3 color choices:
- very light Maple (almost cream)
- bronze/cherry (like orange/red)
- walnut (brown)

The kitchen cabinets either Dark brown OR Black/brownish gray
I like dark floors!!! Scratches will show too.

Do you think bronze/cherry will look nice?
I appreciate your help. Thank you.
I personally would go with walnut brown. I think it will satisfy most buyers. It goes pretty well with everything.

[patrob]

Can anyone on this forum recommend a retailer to buy Ipe solid hardwood from? Any help would be appreciated. What are your views about AA Floors in Etobicoke on Evans Ave.? They carry the Appalachian product line.
Thanks guys.

As I mentioned earlier, I don't recommend solid exotic products. The best product that they sell is probably Lauzon.

[patrob]

Hey patrob,

I am considering installing hardwood and consulted an installer he insist in using staples for the installation.

The wood I will use is oak and I read in your thread it's better to use nails could you clarify.

Also one more questions the installer suggest I screw down the entire sub floor before going ahead with the install since it is a 15 year old house we might be using OCB hence the suggestion.

Anyone in the forum have experience with seasons hardwood floors quality?
http://www.seasonsflooring.com/main.html

Please let me know your thoughts

Staples are fine on oak. I recommend taking his advice & re-screw the sub-floors. Not familiar with that brand.

[patrob]

I'm just a newbie, but I just finished installing a room of hard maple. I took Patrob's advice and used L-cleats. It was pretty difficult to remove boards if I screwed it up, so I figure they're pretty secure. On the other hand, the Home Depot guy basically worships staples. To each his own, but I would assume staples are easier to remove, and cleats are probably more secure. I think Patrob said something about staples for exotic woods(?)


You can use cleats on any species but I would not use staples on exotics.
There are better & worse staples, some of them are glue coated & it's a PITA to remove a board :D

[t3359]

You can use insulation tape or sealing foam as long as there is no moisture going through. If you are thinking about replacing with new doors, the new door might come with a frame & new threshold as one piece so don't worry abut the threshold until you have a new door. Sometimes a door seal or sweep might do the trick on the bottom of the door.

Thanks... would you say run the floor within 1/2" of the door, fill it with caulking, then stick a threshold on it or stick a quarter round on it? would that work?

bjl

[patrob]

Hi Patrob,

We recently started shopping around for hardwood floor, we started looking into a few brands, and because the builder used Vintage for our staircase, we decided to look into this brand some more. While we were quoting around, we learnt of the four grade levels from Vintage... when we visited one of the hardwood stores, they mentioned they have Vintage maple, "select and better" grade, but for a relatively lower price than all others...

have you heard of this before? I just want to make sure this grade does exist as it is not on the vintage website nor is it on any of the brochures we saw...

if anyone had ever had experience with this, please let us knowwww, we're trying to make a decision within these few days before the 31st... thanks!
No, Vintage does not have "Select & Better" grade. What store told you that? Plus what colour & species are you looking for?

[patrob]

Thanks... would you say run the floor within 1/2" of the door, fill it with caulking, then stick a threshold on it or stick a quarter round on it? would that work?

bjl

This might work better
http://www.thehardwarehut.com/images/door_bottoms/pem-p249dv.jpg

[t3359]

This might work better
http://www.thehardwarehut.com/images/door_bottoms/pem-p249dv.jpg

Thanks... I'll try it out...

bjl

[wishflo]

No, Vintage does not have "Select & Better" grade. What store told you that? Plus what colour & species are you looking for?

hi patrob, the store we went to is called Amazon Hardwood Centre, we found them from the Vintage website, so they should be legit? But we thought it was rather strange that we've never heard of such grade, but they said its a bulk deal that they get with Vintage? They said that "select and better" means that the grade = estate grade... but for the wood was under $5, and the color is called chocolate brown (when compared to other Vintage colors, this chocolate brown is equivalent "rembrant") and we're looking at maple...

just on a side note, we're just replacing the carpet on our main floor which is baout 500 sqft, would 3 1/4 be ok? the one they were selling is 4 1/4... would using this size make our space look smaller? should we stick with 3 1/4? what size would u suggest?

Thanks for getting back so quickly!!

[patrob]

hi patrob, the store we went to is called Amazon Hardwood Centre, we found them from the Vintage website, so they should be legit? But we thought it was rather strange that we've never heard of such grade, but they said its a bulk deal that they get with Vintage? They said that "select and better" means that the grade = estate grade... but for the wood was under $5, and the color is called chocolate brown (when compared to other Vintage colors, this chocolate brown is equivalent "rembrant") and we're looking at maple...

just on a side note, we're just replacing the carpet on our main floor which is baout 500 sqft, would 3 1/4 be ok? the one they were selling is 4 1/4... would using this size make our space look smaller? should we stick with 3 1/4? what size would u suggest?

Thanks for getting back so quickly!!
That is def. not Vintage especially that size, colour name & at that price. Whether you go with 3 1/4" or 4", it will be very similar looking & neither will make the space feel smaller.

[jaibalaji]

Hi

Does any manufacturer other than Vintage makes Maple Godiva Solid Sawn ?

Thanks

[patrob]

Hi

Does any manufacturer other than Vintage makes Maple Godiva Solid Sawn ?

Thanks

Nope. Only Vintage makes Solid Sawn :)

[tylerc]

Has anyone had experience with Prevcor Truewood line? I am looking at birch with a satin finish (a dark brown colour) and have 2 pugs that run around like crazy. The price Is $4.75 a sq ft + PST (GST is incl as a special) - does that seem like a fair price for this product? More specifically, what are your thoughts on the product?

[patrob]

Has anyone had experience with Prevcor Truewood line? I am looking at birch with a satin finish (a dark brown colour) and have 2 pugs that run around like crazy. The price Is $4.75 a sq ft + PST (GST is incl as a special) - does that seem like a fair price for this product? More specifically, what are your thoughts on the product?

Birch does not go well with pets or kids. It's a little bit softer & has a very smooth finish & will show every mark & damage.

[mushkilla]

Hi,

I am from the Milton area - can anyone suggest a retailer which will sell the 7" Vintage Hand Scraped hardwood at a discounted price? I have sent out a few emails and am waiting for a response.

Thanks.

[patrob]

Hi,

I am from the Milton area - can anyone suggest a retailer which will sell the 7" Vintage Hand Scraped hardwood at a discounted price? I have sent out a few emails and am waiting for a response.

Thanks.

Good luck. That's a premium product & not much discount if any will be offered.

[BaDkO]

There is no Rembrandt in Select-V from what I know. I am not a fan of Preverco but if you consider wider planks, you have to be aware of the potential issues. From experience in dealing with many diff. manufacturers, I say go with Vintage.
Thanks Patrob! We decided not go with the nice-priced Preverco because of the width.
You were right about Maple Rembrandt - when asked for confirmation, the salesperson told me it's only available in Estate and price is 7.10.
In the meantime my spouse developed an affection for oak instead and she didn't like Vintage's colours... So today we bought Mirage Oak Umbria, 3 1/4 in Exclusive grade from Markham flooring for 6.39 per sq. ft. I'm looking forward to starting the installation at the end of February! And I will be back with questions :)

[patrob]

Thanks Patrob! We decided not go with the nice-priced Preverco because of the width.
You were right about Maple Rembrandt - when asked for confirmation, the salesperson told me it's only available in Estate and price is 7.10.
In the meantime my spouse developed an affection for oak instead and she didn't like Vintage's colours... So today we bought Mirage Oak Umbria, 3 1/4 in Exclusive grade from Markham flooring for 6.39 per sq. ft. I'm looking forward to starting the installation at the end of February! And I will be back with questions :)

Actually Vintage Red Oak Berkshire is equivalent to Mirage Umbria ;) Looks like the dealer you bought from does not have all the "new" colour samples from Vintage because Berkshire is a fairly new colour :)