Scammer: Fabulouso (Selling Laptops) - I'm down $1500, what to do?

[InFeXiOn]

Ok, so I'm in a huge panic mode right now.

Last month I purchased an XPS M1710 from user "Fabulouso" after confirming through Dell that it was indeed brand new and shipped from the factory.

Apparently he had a discount and since he bought in bulk he was able to sell them at $1500 for a profit. At first I was skeptical but after confirming it was brand new and he also made a complete change in ownership on the laptop (of which I confirmed) I was a bit more open to proceeding.

Had a family friend meet him since I was away at school and pick it up for me. As promised, it was sealed and the transaction was smooth. Used it for about 2 weeks after noticing a few dead pixels and a whine from the underside.

After arranging for an exchange through Dell I shipped off the unit to the return depot in Burlington ON and this is where things go sour. Waited about a week for an update on my case (ie. - is the new unit being built yet?) with no response. Contacted a CSR just yesterday and she promised to email me details regarding what was going on this morning. And that she did.

According to her, the original owner has filed a "Fraud" claim on the computer in question and they cannot divulge any details surrounding that except that I have to speak with the original owner. Therein lies the problem.

Of course, my immediate response was to email and call the phone number that I had for the seller to try and resolve it. The phone number goes straight to the answering machine and the I have yet to receive a response via email.

Now I'm out $1500 and without my laptop. Thanks to Dell for not doing anything to assist me in resolving the manner either. Nowhere to turn at this point.

Thought I would post here asking for advice. What should I do next?
- Police report?
- Continue to make contact?

I'm so lost, and extremely depressed now - that's a whole lot of money. Oh boy, what a Christmas. :(

[Jon Lai]

Definitely contact the Police first. Also get Dell involved with the Police so that you know the Police will not just throw your case out the window.

I guess the seller bought the computer with a stolen credit card, or bought the computer with his own credit card but either charged back or canceled his/her card.

Do a reverse lookup on Canada411 with his phone number to see where he lives.

[3weddings]

I agree with Jon Lai call the police and sit down right now and document everything!

If you conversed on MSN, print those conversations.

Get the withrawal confirmation from your bank.

anything and everything that will aid you, get it.

The phone number is likely a cheapo pay as you go number that never will expire soon. I hope you get him!

[InFeXiOn]

Definitely contact the Police first. Also get Dell involved with the Police so that you know the Police will not just throw your case out the window.

I guess the seller bought the computer with a stolen credit card, or bought the computer with his own credit card but either charged back or canceled his/her card.

Do a reverse lookup on Canada411 with his phone number to see where he lives.

My guess is that he used a stolen credit card or did a charge back, but I've got no clue at this point.

Sadly, I didn't pick up the laptop from him as I was at school. However, thankfully, the person who picked it for me was smart enough to gather the following:

- A receipt stating the: Date, Time, Product and Price
- He signed and dated it
- Also wrote his Phone # and Address on it
- Wrote that it was brand new on said receipt
- Also, he recorded his license plate #

As far as bringing my case to the police, it looks like I am in good shape.

In response to involving Dell in the case, I wouldn't know how to go about doing that. I tried calling the Customer Service department to see what was going on and they continue to say "speak with the original owner, we cannot say any more than that." They apparently do not see what is going on here, and why I cannot reach the 'original owner.'

Tried asking for a manager/supervisor but the CSR I was speaking to said that she spoke with her supervisor and there was nothing customer service could do about it - I had to speak with the original owner.

Any recommendations on how I could go about involving Dell?

As per the police report and involvement - I will be doing this tonight/tomorrow and will include all email documentation where he said it wasn't stolen, because I did ask.

Hopefully I can get to the bottom of this. Any more tips/advice would be well appreciated.

[3weddings]

Are there records anywhere detailing Dell confirming warranty on the unit? They must have something to assist you

[InFeXiOn]

Are there records anywhere detailing Dell confirming warranty on the unit? They must have something to assist you

Dell confirmed the transfer of ownership via an e-mail they sent me, and it came with a standard 1-year warranty.

However, I don't understand why they would not pursue the original owner knowing that these type of 'scams' do happen and that the new owner after the transfer of ownership is clearly the one caught up in the mix - not the on in the wrong.

I'm lost with Dell, no clue what to do.

[InFeXiOn]

Update:

I now have his address, along with the license plate numbers of his car and a car of someone whom he was speaking with while the transaction was made. Signed and documented receipt along with the emails we swapped back and forth when he said it was a legal transaction, no funny business.

Perhaps this trip to Markham will be worth it. :)

[InFeXiOn]

Question:

After reporting this to the police do you think they would with the information I have come with me to the address I have and either bring the person in for questioning and/or arrest him or is this going to be a long process?

- Paul

[3weddings]

Call the OPP!
They handle all internet fraud related cases in Ontario! The laptop was sold over the internet.

[InFeXiOn]

Call the OPP!
They handle all internet fraud related cases in Ontario! The laptop was sold over the internet.

I called the York Regional Police since he resides in Markham. If that is not sufficient, I will be calling the OPP tomorrow or sometime soon.

The laptop was sold via Craigslist.org - this still qualifies as the internet; right?

Also, has anyone ever experienced this before? Do they simply just advise you, or take the person in for some sort of questioning, ect? I have yet to deal with anything of this nature, so I'm clueless.

I have begun researching how I would go about filling a case in the small claims court if the police prove to be unsuccessful in helping me come to a resolve.

Any input is greatly appreciated.

[Mark099]

Dell confirmed the transfer of ownership via an e-mail they sent me, and it came with a standard 1-year warranty.

However, I don't understand why they would not pursue the original owner knowing that these type of 'scams' do happen and that the new owner after the transfer of ownership is clearly the one caught up in the mix - not the on in the wrong.

I'm lost with Dell, no clue what to do.

If Dell legitimately transfered ownership to you, then you legally own the notebook. Play that angle too. They're easier to find at the moment.

[InFeXiOn]

If Dell legitimately transfered ownership to you, then you legally own the notebook. Play that angle too. They're easier to find at the moment.

Yeah, I told them the transfer of ownership was confirmed by the original owner and everything was legit. Yet they are still telling me I have to contact the original owner to resolve this - not them. Ugh, I don't know what to do.

Also, although the address checked out on Google Maps, I did a search on it and apparently it was one mentioned on the news for a drug grow-op. So it's quite possible he just uses it for unsuspecting people. That might explain his misspelling of it on the receipt.

However, I do have a license plate number. I'm starting to lose faith. :(

[Mark099]

Yeah, I told them the transfer of ownership was confirmed by the original owner and everything was legit. Yet they are still telling me I have to contact the original owner to resolve this - not them. Ugh, I don't know what to do.

Also, although the address checked out on Google Maps, I did a search on it and apparently it was one mentioned on the news for a drug grow-op. So it's quite possible he just uses it for unsuspecting people. That might explain his misspelling of it on the receipt.

However, I do have a license plate number. I'm starting to lose faith. :(

The RCMP may be of some help to you with your licence plate number.

Also, you can take Dell to small claims court. You did your due diligence by confirming that notebook was legitimate. You had Dell recognize you as the legal owner. They screwed up by not warning you not to buy the notebook if the legitimate ownership was in question. They, then, deliberately screwed you by 1) transfering ownership making you think everything was okay, 2) building a sub-par product, and 2) issuing a RMA for a product they had no intention of sending back to you.

Technically, they probably have a legal right to keep the notebook if it wasn't paid for by the guy that sold it to you. However, they should be held accountable for not disclosing any information they had that could have prevented you from being scammed.

If you ask me, you got scammed twice.

[Jon Lai]

The RCMP may be of some help to you with your licence plate number.

Also, you can take Dell to small claims court. You did your due diligence by confirming that notebook was legitimate. You had Dell recognize you as the legal owner. They screwed up by not warning you not to buy the notebook if the legitimate ownership was in question. They, then, deliberately screwed you by 1) transfering ownership making you think everything was okay, 2) building a sub-par product, and 2) issuing a RMA for a product they had no intention of sending back to you.

Technically, they probably have a legal right to keep the notebook if it wasn't paid for by the guy that sold it to you. However, they should be held accountable for not disclosing any information they had that could have prevented you from being scammed.

If you ask me, you got scammed twice.

+1

Lots of good advice here.

[InFeXiOn]

The RCMP may be of some help to you with your licence plate number.

Also, you can take Dell to small claims court. You did your due diligence by confirming that notebook was legitimate. You had Dell recognize you as the legal owner. They screwed up by not warning you not to buy the notebook if the legitimate ownership was in question. They, then, deliberately screwed you by 1) transfering ownership making you think everything was okay, 2) building a sub-par product, and 2) issuing a RMA for a product they had no intention of sending back to you.

Technically, they probably have a legal right to keep the notebook if it wasn't paid for by the guy that sold it to you. However, they should be held accountable for not disclosing any information they had that could have prevented you from being scammed.

If you ask me, you got scammed twice.

I'm going to sit tight on a response from the York Region Police department. If that brings no resolve I'll contact the OPP and RCMP.

Small claims court is the last thing I want to do, but I will if I must.

No clue how to deal with Dell here though, I'm so lost...

What a Christmas. :cry:

[chikori]

I don't know much about Canadian laws, but what's with Dell and their sub par laptops and computers? My friend got a XPS and on the first day, she started up with 4am battling with the rep because her keyboard needed to get replaced. THE FIRST DAY she got it. (Bought from Dell directly.)

I think it doesn't hurt to try to find a legal aid or some sort and see if something can be done toward Dell. This is bad business and they don't care right now because they think "you can't hurt them". Ask to speak to the manager and don't be soft about it, and if they insist on there's nothing can be done, then tell them that they were the one who acknowledged the transfer of ownership - they deceived you to let think you are now the rightful owner, the transaction is legit, and now they are holding your laptop without giving you an explanation, when they will return it, and you want a response as soon as possible. If not, you'll have to take other measures in order to get their attention and laptop back.

If they don't listen - I'd say it's best to go to a small claim court - or try to find out if there are others who got crappy XPS in order to file a civil law suit.

[mcg]

Don't worry OP. For Christmas, you're gonna get your $1500 back... and do justice at the same time :D

[kuqdew]

wow, that sucks realy bad op

[cmorrison]

Call the OPP!
They handle all internet fraud related cases in Ontario! The laptop was sold over the internet.

I think 3weddings is right, if the OPP handle all internet fraud related cases in Ontario they probably have a system and/or department for this. The crime he committed has nothing to do with where he lives, or where his decoy house is located. Contacting the OPP might speed your whole situation along and have your situation resolved or on the way to being resolved in time for you to still have a Merry Christmas.

[DYJ]

I don't know much about Canadian laws, but what's with Dell and their sub par laptops and computers? My friend got a XPS and on the first day, she started up with 4am battling with the rep because her keyboard needed to get replaced. THE FIRST DAY she got it. (Bought from Dell directly.)

I think it doesn't hurt to try to find a legal aid or some sort and see if something can be done toward Dell. This is bad business and they don't care right now because they think "you can't hurt them". Ask to speak to the manager and don't be soft about it, and if they insist on there's nothing can be done, then tell them that they were the one who acknowledged the transfer of ownership - they deceived you to let think you are now the rightful owner, the transaction is legit, and now they are holding your laptop without giving you an explanation, when they will return it, and you want a response as soon as possible. If not, you'll have to take other measures in order to get their attention and laptop back.

If they don't listen - I'd say it's best to go to a small claim court - or try to find out if there are others who got crappy XPS in order to file a civil law suit.


I don't think you can take Dell to court over the fact you bought a stolen item. You can perhaps seek legal aid on the fact that Dell gave you false information on the ownership. All I know is, if someone sold you stolen goods, they didn't have "legal ownership" in the first place, thus voiding any sort of legal ownership transfers. Dell isn't going to pay you a new laptop. Keep trying with the OPP and see if they can help you. License plate number can do a lot, the police/insurance company can do a lookup and trace everything.

I had some guy hit my car and give me false information from his insurance card. I got his license plate and they caught him very easily. Now that jackass is paying a jacked premium for the next 5 years coz he wanted to save $600 worth of repairs lol. GL Brian Tiangco!! LOL

But yeah, keep trying with the police, as long as the license plate is legit, I think you have a shot. As far as taking Dell, you'd have to seek legal aid on them misleading you on the legal transfer of ownership.

PS. TIANGCO FELL OFF!!! LOL :lol:

[InFeXiOn]

Don't worry OP. For Christmas, you're gonna get your $1500 back... and do justice at the same time :D

Doubt it, but thanks for the kind words.

Worst of all is that I need the laptop for school, and now I don't have one. /Sigh

Anyways, thanks for all of the advice.

Left a message with the York Regional Police Department and I plan on calling both the RCMP and the OPP if the York Police are of no help or take too long to respond. Let's hope the license plate number is legitimate because I'm not so sure on the address.

I'm not sure what the turn-a-round time is on these type of things, but what a lousy time of year for it to happen.

[aimfox]

I betcha the scammer is reading this and is scared right now. ;)

[DYJ]

I betcha the scammer is reading this and is scared right now. ;)

I doubt it. Also, don't wait for a response from York Police.
Call the OPP and RCMP right away. DON"T wait. Even if the address is false, they'll get everything off the license plate. :cheesygri

[cloneman]

The first thing I would do at this point in time, while waiting for the police and any other enforcement you have on the case is to get on DELL's case, strong and hard.

since when is a company allowed to withhold your goods without as much as basic explanation of what is going on?

Obviously your talking to dell canada customer service - a team of idiots robotically trained to feed you mindless crap when a out-of-the-ordinary situation comes up. Hold on here before you accuse me of taking a run at dell. I spent over 9 hours on the phone and 1 month with dell regarding an issue of having a bill mailed to me.

I personally love dell, they are one of the good ones. It's just a matter of knowing how to deal with them. This is how I proceeded. I was given the address of a place in Toronto where I could make a written complaint (which I didn't have time to do or wait for a response for). I google'd this address, which lead me to a couple of phone numbers. I began dialing numbers in sequence from there... example

416-555-0001
416-555-0002
416-555-0003

After the third number I landed on someone competent. The issue was resolved immediately. Within 30 minutes I was faxed a corrected bill, and within a couple of days I received it by mail. After over a month and 9 hours of conversing with dell (which became shouting by the end of the ordeal) NOTHING had been solved. And all I needed was a bill printed. Even after speaking with supervisors, I was told that nothing could be done, as they communicated with the department that handled billing only via email, with a 48h delay, and had no telephone to reach them, and no fax machine either. Obviously this was a lie. After 9 hours of telephone calls, and at the last 15 minutes ended shouting, you would think SOMEONE there would have had the decency to do something out of the ordinary to help me out.

In summary my point is that if you're talking to the wrong person nothing will get solved, especially with a big company. Call someone in their head office in TO who's got some power, and ask him nicely for a straight answer. You have the right to know what the heck is going on!

Btw, the whining issue is a lost battle. Your repaired laptop will likely whine as well. There's a solution for it, it involves installing RMclock with the "RUN HLT COMMAND WHEN CPU IS IDLE" option. If you need more on that when this is over, let me know.

Good luck!

[InFeXiOn]

Receiving a repaired laptop at this point is what I'm worried about.

How do you recommend I go about reaching someone at Dell who isn't a trained monkey? A similar approach like you took, or what?

[lindmar]

Sorry but if you wouldnt have taken the computer into dell for servicing, you'd still have the laptop?

I'm confused.. I need to read that again, but doesnt sound like he scammed you right up front...

sounds like he tried to scam dell somehow.//

[Fishy007]

Something's not quite right here. Once you do the transfer of ownership and Dell verifies it, the previous owner has nothing to do with the laptop.

I've sold 2 of my old Dells to friends and Dell refuses to talk to me when I call in. They say they need the current owner as that's all they have on file.

To the OP: I'm pm-ing you a couple of numbers for Dell people. The numbers are old, so I don't know if they'll work, but it's much better than the 1-800 general line.

[blahblehblah]

You could also try getting the attention of the media. Bad publicity is always something a big company does not want. Whether this is exactly "news worthy" is another question to beg, but you could try that route if small claims court is your last option to take.

I feel sorry for you to land into a situation like this. I really do hope they catch this fraud and that you get reimbursed after.

[inferno_gn]

Hi there,

Read this...
http://consumerist.com/335626/reach-the-dell-customer-advocates

Ju Leon...

[tilley]

what a bad story. Unfortunately, this is another case of buyer beware! I would never give someone $1500 for something clearly worth more- there`s GOT to be a reason he is charging less (in this case, because he was ripping you off).

Thank you for telling us your story- After reading, I know I will not make the same mistake you did.

[InFeXiOn]

Thank you to everyone for helping.

I have just sent a long, detailed email to Customer_Advocate@Dell.com has detailed in that article you linked me to.

I will be contacting the HQ for Dell Canada come tomorrow and speaking with someone who can hopefully resolve this for me.

Here's for hoping I can get to the bottom of this, and hopefully have a Merry Christmas after all.

[cloneman]

Receiving a repaired laptop at this point is what I'm worried about.

How do you recommend I go about reaching someone at Dell who isn't a trained monkey? A similar approach like you took, or what?

Ok. here we go.

416 :arrowu: 758:arrowu: 2177 I *think* this is the guy I spoke too, I don't remember his name or anything, but I'm fairly certain that's his number. (I added some icons so search engines don't pick up his number...)

I started dialing in sequence from 416:arrowu: 758 :arrowu: 2175 and finally got him. You may want to try that.

416-758-2100 is the "main" dell number, I don't think it's very useful.

what I'm saying, is the numbers of interest lie in th
416-758-21xx or 416-758-22xx range probably.

anyway try the guy I spoke to, if the number still exists. Just explain your situation. Maybe he was just nice to me because of how desperate I sounded over the phone. Overall he seemed really nice. Give it a shot...

[Goober56]

So you left a message with the police? Err.. Shouldn't you be trying to get a voice line? And these posters are correct, do everything you can right now. The longer you wait, the less chance you'll get your stuff.

Also, with every conversation always ask first before you talk:
Name
Relevent Title In the Company/Police Rank
What you talked about
Time/Date

Records, records, records. Always wins the day.

[InFeXiOn]

Ok. here we go.

416 :arrowu: 758:arrowu: 2177 I *think* this is the guy I spoke too, I don't remember his name or anything, but I'm fairly certain that's his number. (I added some icons so search engines don't pick up his number...)

I started dialing in sequence from 416:arrowu: 758 :arrowu: 2175 and finally got him. You may want to try that.

416-758-2100 is the "main" dell number, I don't think it's very useful.

what I'm saying, is the numbers of interest lie in th
416-758-21xx or 416-758-22xx range probably.

anyway try the guy I spoke to, if the number still exists. Just explain your situation. Maybe he was just nice to me because of how desperate I sounded over the phone. Overall he seemed really nice. Give it a shot...

Thanks again.

Also, was your situation similar to mine? A fraud case? Or not at all?

I'll be calling Dell today to try and get in touch with someone through the numbers you've given me. Hopefully they can help me resolve this nonsense. Not even a simple explanation from then is seriously pissing me off.

[cloneman]

my situation was much simpler. I needed correction on a bill printed out. There was a business name on my bill which should not have been there (as it was a personal purchase). They kept sending me the same bill without the correction until I got in touch with the guy from the head office.

[InFeXiOn]

Second response from Customer Advocate:

Paul,

Thank you for the information. With it I was able to pull up your computer in our system.

As for the status of the account itself, that is the bad news. From what I see, it appears there is a problem with payment for the system and the account has been placed on hold because of this. Until that hold is removed (e.g., until Dell is paid for the system and the hold lifted) no one at Dell is authorized to set up any kind of services for the computer.

My recommendation, based on what I learned from the one previous case I have seen like this, is for you to contact your local police department and/or a lawyer to find out what options you have for attempting to get your money back from the person you purchased the computer from. If you need them I will be more than happy to get you the contact information for Dell's legal and/or fraud prevention departments. Unfortunately, other than that information, there isn't anything more anyone in the services department is able to do in this case.

If you have questions for me about the situation I provide any help and answers I can.


Great...

[cloneman]

What's strange in this case is that dell approved the transfer of ownership... that sort of makes them the liable party here. They should be running after the original purchaser instead of after you. Anyway that's my 2c.

[InFeXiOn]

What's strange in this case is that dell approved the transfer of ownership... that sort of makes them the liable party here. They should be running after the original purchaser instead of after you. Anyway that's my 2c.

That's exactly the point I continue to raise in my emails and what I will be addressing on the phone when I am able to get in touch with the appropriate people and/or departments.

There's no excuse for them to go after me. This is ********.

[dmdsoftware2]

interesting thread.

Dell is in the wrong. Bring it up to a media outlet and see how fast you get a brand new laptop.

[cloneman]

Yeah, keep trying on the phone. If there's one thing I've learned over the years, is that internet is a great way to waste time. Companies don't hesitate to ship you off to their website for information when you call in. Yet web sites are often useless and uninformative, and, more importantly, emails are not dealt with the amount of rigor that is due.

In summary, an email doesn't put someone in your way, so it's unlikely most people will want to help you in that manner.

Of course there are exceptions; some companies have figured out that they can save lots of money if they treat email cases with as much respect as telephone or in person service, but these are few.

[InFeXiOn]

interesting thread.

Dell is in the wrong. Bring it up to a media outlet and see how fast you get a brand new laptop.

I have no clue about how to bring it up to a media outlet - but it's something I'm interested in because I know it would get the ball rolling, sort to speak. No company wants any sort of bad heat, especially Dell.

Also, I'm going to try the numbers and what not. Trying to specifically get in touch with their fraud department first and if that doesn't work I'll be taking a trip to Toronto.

About the media though. How might I even attempt at going that route?

[dmdsoftware2]

I have no clue about how to bring it up to a media outlet - but it's something I'm interested in because I know it would get the ball rolling, sort to speak. No company wants any sort of bad heat, especially Dell.

Also, I'm going to try the numbers and what not. Trying to specifically get in touch with their fraud department first and if that doesn't work I'll be taking a trip to Toronto.

About the media though. How might I even attempt at going that route?

Check Consumers Alert on CTV.ca website for starters.

[1yellowdog]

What's strange in this case is that dell approved the transfer of ownership... that sort of makes them the liable party here. They should be running after the original purchaser instead of after you. Anyway that's my 2c.

I wonder if the original owner has an accomplice working at Dell? The Dell employee would do the ownership transfer so everything appears on the up and up to the shill. Everything would have gone smoothly and it would just be Dell out of pocket if the new owner hadn't sent the laptop in for repairs. It's the only thing that makes sense.

[CanadaBoy]

this sounds like a job for silverman

[cloneman]

I wonder if the original owner has an accomplice working at Dell? The Dell employee would do the ownership transfer so everything appears on the up and up to the shill. Everything would have gone smoothly and it would just be Dell out of pocket if the new owner hadn't sent the laptop in for repairs. It's the only thing that makes sense.

Dell doesn't need any accomplices to be incompetent. It's probably standard procedure to withhold any laptop that was sent in for repairs but has had a payment issue. Of course they are overlooking the special situation at hand, which is that the problem is out of the OP's hands and entirely at dell's collection dept.

[InFeXiOn]

Just sent a heart-felt, detailed letter to Patrick Foran in hopes of reaching the public about the incompetence and negligence on Dells behalf, and of course, to hopefully come to some resolve on this issue.

Still plan on calling the Fraud department and heading to Toronto as well.

Thanks again folks.

[HughG]

dont delay it bro trust me. Do it while everything is fresh and stuff.

I know how you feel man.

Back in the days i was the biggest victim from the infamous Trung or elitemonkey or whatever the you know what he was lol.

I feel your pain bro.

[kanechart]

owned!

Where can I subscribe to your newsletter?

[psxp]

owned!

Where can I subscribe to your newsletter?

WTF???

get a life kiddie...

[Applainmedia]

owned!

Where can I subscribe to your newsletter?

seriously...do you not have anything better to do?

@OP I honestly hope you get your laptop back as it isn't fair at all, I personally would submit something to Silverman at CityTV as it brings a lot of attention to Dell and I would think if you have all the necessary proof then it would get resolved very quickly.

[mau77on]

I really hope you get this stuff resolved. Nobody deserves to be screwed over that way before christmas and especially boxing day.

Good Luck :o

[InFeXiOn]

Thanks for all the kind words.

Submitted something to Consumer Alerts at CityTV. Who is Silverman?

Still waiting for this Customer Advocate to email me back the numbers for fraud prevention departments. He sounds like he's trying to help. :|

[bokep]

You definitely got scammed twice here. Dell made the mistake of giving you the ownership and now that mistake is covered in their system by their standard procedure. Go hard at them, this was their mistake.

Have you heard anything back from the RCMP?

Hope you get this resolved dude. Best of luck.

[Applainmedia]

Thanks for all the kind words.

Submitted something to Consumer Alerts at CityTV. Who is Silverman?

Still waiting for this Customer Advocate to email me back the numbers for fraud prevention departments. He sounds like he's trying to help. :|


http://www.citytv.com/toronto/personalities_PeterSilverman.aspx <-- Silverman
http://torontoist.com/2007/02/silverman_helps_1.php <-- Nice Watch
http://www.citynews.ca/shows/shows_656.aspx <-- How to get in touch

Hope that helps :)

[inferno_gn]

Hi there,

You should send a copy of your letter and the reply to the peoples at the Consumerist website, too (or CC a copy of it, because Dell do see all the CC). You have to mention it that you will post the letter everywhere, bad press = better solving the problem to make it go away.

Ju Leon...

[JAC]

Second response from Customer Advocate:

[I]As for the status of the account itself, that is the bad news. From what I see, it appears there is a problem with payment for the system and the account has been placed on hold because of this. Until that hold is removed (e.g., until Dell is paid for the system and the hold lifted) no one at Dell is authorized to set up any kind of services for the computer.

Translation: You bought a notebook that had been either a) paid for with a stolen CC, or b) financed under bogus credentials or defaulted on payments.

You can probably forget getting it back, and unless you can convince the cops to open a fraud investigation for $1500, you probably won't see your money either.

Sorry, and best of luck.

[mahpoaht]

That is the risk of buying something @ 50% off and unfortunately, you got owned by Dell and the seller.

Shouldnt send the laptop back to Dell when you know something might be wrong with the transaction.

I got into a similiar situation but I didnt bother to file a claim or anything because it would be 1) waste of my time 2) not seeing my money back

Take it as an expensive lesson and good luck.

[supeg93]

Hey man that sucks :( I work for Dell doing tech support, and I know for a fact you can do transfer of ownership on the web. Its just a webform and normally its instant if there is nothing wrong on the account.

This is the Canadian link

https://support.dell.com/support/topics/topic.aspx/ca/shared/support/dellcare/en/tag_transfer?c=ca&cs=CADHS1&l=en&s=dhs

Sounds like this guy knows the system and most likely runs lots of these scams.

Keep calling dell and flipping out over and over again, everytime ask to talk to a supervisor or manager.

[CSR]

Good luck, keep us updated.

[Bolo!]

So you left a message with the police? Err.. Shouldn't you be trying to get a voice line? And these posters are correct, do everything you can right now. The longer you wait, the less chance you'll get your stuff.

Also, with every conversation always ask first before you talk:
Name
Relevent Title In the Company/Police Rank
What you talked about
Time/Date

Records, records, records. Always wins the day.

There is an unspoken rule with the courts and justice: the courts don't care what happened, only what you can prove happened.

[Bolo!]

seriously...do you not have anything better to do?

@OP I honestly hope you get your laptop back as it isn't fair at all, I personally would submit something to Silverman at CityTV as it brings a lot of attention to Dell and I would think if you have all the necessary proof then it would get resolved very quickly.

First thing that comes to my mind is wtf is dell doing allowing a transfer of anything if the payment issue isn't settled in the 1st place. I would say Dell is in no position to allow warranty transfer and then 'repossess' something that has changed ownership.

[007craft]

I gotta say I think you should change your signature. I dont believe you were scammed by this individual. He sold you a laptop, you paid for it, you recieved it, it worked. As a seller I do that all the time and if a product happens to be deffective, then its like buying it from a store, use the warranty. Now it appears this guy is not scamming you. He bought a laptop from dell and sold it. We have no idea why. Perhaps he died and his credit cards were frozen, so the payment could not be made to dell? Maybe is credit card was maxed out and the charge could not be made? These dont mean he is trying to scam anyone (although the most likely scenario is he is trying to scam dell, not you)

Now your laptop was recieved by dell (RMA) and now their holding it hostage. Its actually Dell who is scamming you here since they agreed to transfer ownership to you without payment from the original owner.

Take dell to court, I gauruntee you will be awarded to have the laptop returned to you or the value of the laptop.

Dont waste your time with the police. I was scammed $1375 back in 2004 from a laptop I bought of some guy (No companies involved here, actualy person, who I had a name and address for). I contacted the local police here, the fbi, fraud center, and florida police (where the guy lived who scammed me). In the end, nothing was done. They just didnt take it seriously at all. and it took about 3 months for them to finish it all up and say they cant do anything for me. My only option would be to sue (in which case I would surly win since I have documents and everything). However seeing as my deal involved another country and a location too far away for me to visit (cost effectivly anyway), I was basically screwed :(. All I know is If Im ever in florida, I know exactly who Im going to be visiting with a baseball bat :cheesygri

[gn22]

I gotta say I think you should change your signature. I dont believe you were scammed by this individual. He sold you a laptop, you paid for it, you recieved it, it worked. As a seller I do that all the time and if a product happens to be deffective, then its like buying it from a store, use the warranty. Now it appears this guy is not scamming you. He bought a laptop from dell and sold it. We have no idea why. Perhaps he died and his credit cards were frozen, so the payment could not be made to dell? Maybe is credit card was maxed out and the charge could not be made? These dont mean he is trying to scam anyone (although the most likely scenario is he is trying to scam dell, not you)

Now your laptop was recieved by dell (RMA) and now their holding it hostage. Its actually Dell who is scamming you here since they agreed to transfer ownership to you without payment from the original owner.

Take dell to court, I gauruntee you will be awarded to have the laptop returned to you or the value of the laptop.

Dont waste your time with the police. I was scammed $1375 back in 2004 from a laptop I bought of some guy (No companies involved here, actualy person, who I had a name and address for). I contacted the local police here, the fbi, fraud center, and florida police (where the guy lived who scammed me). In the end, nothing was done. They just didnt take it seriously at all. and it took about 3 months for them to finish it all up and say they cant do anything for me. My only option would be to sue (in which case I would surly win since I have documents and everything). However seeing as my deal involved another country and a location too far away for me to visit (cost effectivly anyway), I was basically screwed :(. All I know is If Im ever in florida, I know exactly who Im going to be visiting with a baseball bat :cheesygri
What he said.
Everything is right.
File a small claims action against Dell IMMEDIATELY.
YOUR ownership of the laptop is NOT in question. Dell has an obligation to honour YOUR ownership of the laptop. Recovering anything from the "original" owner is Dell's responsibility, NOT yours. They have no right to hold YOUR laptop as ransom for the "original" owners unpaid bill.
If there was no "hold" on the account when YOU received the ownership transfer, then they can't retro-actively seize a piece of property that is now rightfully, and demonstrably yours.
Which is why you file the claim in small claims court.
For instance. If I sell my present car, and dutifully transfer ownership, then buy furniture at The Brick using my sold car as collateral, it would be The Brick's fault for accepting that as collateral when I didn't own it any more, if I defaulted on payment. They would have no right to put a lien on the car for the new owner to pay my bill...

But, if there was anything wrong with the account BEFORE they transferred ownership to you, and Dell can SHOW that, you're likely screwed.

This is a good example of the old phrase "possession is 9/10's of the law"....

Needless to say, you'd have been golden if you hadn't used the warranty and provided Dell with the means to "possess" the laptop...

[Vinman]

Come on, some *guy* buys a quantity of laptops using a 'discount", reselling them for cost, then suddenly doesn't pay for them all, and you're absolving him of guilt?

LOL, that's the oldest scam in the book, and is even outlined in several old movies - buy on credit, sell for cash, and then declare fraud or bankruptcy, and pocket the cash.

Sure, Dell was wrong to transfer ownership and then not notify current owners of the fraud, but this type of scam can take months or even years to come clean, and if Dell was a creditor on a business purchase, they have every right in the world to withhold the items.

It sucks for the OP, but his beef is with the scammer who fraudulently "sold" him the laptops, then skipped out on Dell.

[cakeman]

yup, you got scammed.

First rule of the internets: If it seems too good to be true, it IS.

You don't get a new laptop that, after tax, is worth a minimum of $2300 for $1500... I dont care HOW many someone buys, they're not going to get enough of a discount to sell said laptop at $1500 and make a reasonable profit.

Dell will not help you. Dell is a large soulless corporation who, if someone has actually paid them, will go to some lengths to make sure that person is taken care of. Dell, the corporation, however does not give a flying hump about you when you, basically, have a laptop that has been stolen from them. You, albeit indirectly, have hurt their bottom line, they don't care, they want their money or laptop back.

The Police -will not help you- for $1500. You will be placed in this giant list of people who have been scammed for "small" amounts of money and they will continue to work on that long list of people who have lost 10's of thousands.

You mention that this persons address was listed as a grow-op at some point.. you seem to think that "he must just be using that address to scam people" .. yup, thats a possibility .. or perhaps he runs a grow op, and happens to steal credit card #'s as well and makes a good amount of money scamming people for laptops.

I wouldnt recommend dropping by this address and accusing them of doing this.. They may take it poorly and beat your naive self down.

Anyone who thinks they can take Dell to small claims and get something out of this is dreaming. You will waste your months of time and fees and then find out that Dell has very high priced lawyers write up their sales agreements that, like it or not, you probably fall under by extension, that states if Dell doesn't get paid, they can go to whatever legal means necessary to recover THEIR goods.

You've learned a lesson. You've notified the community, now stop wasting time, go get a second job or work some overtime to make up the money and get on with life.

.. besides.. who needs a $2000+ gaming laptop for school.. NCIX just had some functional HP's for 500ish.. you can get a perfectly reasonable Dell new from Dell directly for $1000ish.

Im not without sympathy, but seriously..

cakes..

ps.. Guy steals CC#, Guy buys laptops from dell. Oblivious actual CC owner takes a week or two to clue in, finally calls CC company, CC company calls dell, dell shuts the door on ya.. happens every single day of the year.

[MkmBandit]

You don't get a new laptop that, after tax, is worth a minimum of $2300 for $1500... I dont care HOW many someone buys, they're not going to get enough of a discount to sell said laptop at $1500 and make a reasonable profit.



Thats not necessarily true in this situation. Up until a few weeks ago, dell was offering an 8600GT 256mb video card in a base setup @ $2000. Now dell has scrapped the 8600 all together in the m1710, and are offering the beefed up 7950gtx 512 in the base unit @ $2000. I'm not sure of the exact specs of the OP's laptop, but if he picked up a base unit with the 8600gt, those aren't worth a penny over $1500.

Dell dropped the 8600gt for the 7950gtx right around the time the OP created this thread.

[cloneman]

I'd be willing to get rid of my Inspiron 9400 w/ 7900GS :cheesygri

Leave it to dell to have a 2000$ product lose value overnight when they decide to change product lines...

[woof]

I fully agree with cakeman.

However I would still try to take this to small claims court. Go after Dell first since they have the computer. The fact that they have a lot of "very high priced lawyers" works in your favor. How many billable hours does it take to get to $1500? I've seen many companies write checks because the cost of fighting an issue was higher. Companies make business decisions like this all the time when they find out that the fight is going to be dragged out.

Small claims might want you to go after the seller rather than Dell, but you can argue that you have no reason to believe that the seller has done anything wrong - use Dell's refusal to discuss the matter with you against them. That and the fact that they are the ones currently in possession of the goods.

If you can't file or lose against Dell then turn your small claims attention on the seller.

[woof]

Dell confirmed the transfer of ownership via an e-mail they sent me .... However, I don't understand why they would not pursue the original owner knowing that these type of 'scams' do happen and that the new owner after the transfer of ownership is clearly the one caught up in the mix - not the on in the wrong.


One final comment. The Dell transfer of ownership is completely useless as a form of protection for people who buy through resellers like this. Example: Your TV set gets stolen. The thief takes it to a pawn shop. It gets resold to somebody. Then to somebody else. Then to somebody else. In each case there is a legitimate sale. All meaningless since if the police find it they will seize the TV and return it to the original legitimate owner. Whoever had the TV set at the time it is found will lose it and not receive any compensation.

In all honesty your odds of getting a small claims judgment against Dell are probably not good if there was fraud in the original purchase. Against the seller good, but probably not collectible. For $1500 though, worth a shot.

[cloneman]

One final comment. The Dell transfer of ownership is completely useless as a form of protection for people who buy through resellers like this. Example: Your TV set gets stolen. The thief takes it to a pawn shop. It gets resold to somebody. Then to somebody else. Then to somebody else. In each case there is a legitimate sale. All meaningless since if the police find it they will seize the TV and return it to the original legitimate owner. Whoever had the TV set at the time it is found will lose it and not receive any compensation.



Yes, you are correct, but dell is not the police.

[woof]

Well, they didn't need the police to recover their stolen property. The end buyer handed it over to them.

[Z]

Sorry to hear OP!

I believe this case is similar to a piece of property that has a lien on it.

The laptop may change hands/owners.

However if the original bill was never fully paid for; Dell is still the legal owner of the laptop, until payment is complete.

The fault here lies with the original purchaser; however the blame can lie with Dell, as they didn't bother to explain to you why they can't/won't return the laptop being serviced. OP, you're the innocent victim here.

OP, since you have evidence proving the seller took $1500 from you; I would try to persue it in small claims court. You have important information, such as the license plate and phone number; these bits and pieces can all help you in contacting the seller.

[dmdsoftware2]

Sorry to hear OP!

I believe this case is similar to a piece of property that has a lien on it.

The laptop may change hands/owners.

However if the original bill was never fully paid for; Dell is still the legal owner of the laptop, until payment is complete.

The fault here lies with the original purchaser; however the blame can lie with Dell, as they didn't bother to explain to you why they can't/won't return the laptop being serviced. OP, you're the innocent victim here.

OP, since you have evidence proving the seller took $1500 from you; I would try to persue it in small claims court. You have important information, such as the license plate and phone number; these bits and pieces can all help you in contacting the seller.

Right.

A stolen good is a stolen good. Dell or the police have the rights under the law to confiscate and hold stolen merchandise as evidence.

Problem with this case, the transfer of ownership was confirmed. So, the issue is, does the transfer of ownership waive Dell's right to renege on the transfer and still hold the new owner responsible.

I'm sure if the OP could get a media outlet to follow this story and create a buzz about Dell's policies regarding transfer of ownership, then he'd get a new laptop from Dell without hesitation.

[anabioz]

Reading this and I feel your pain man. I got scammed several times on howardforums. But when some thing is being taken away that is yours, that is just ridiculous. The worst thing they could have done is take away your warranty, but go through with confirmations and RMA. And then tell you in your face basically: "FU, you got screwed..."

Fight for your right of ownership, I believe you can even take dell to court. As they fraud YOU. They told you "Oh, yes. This laptop is clear, we will transfer warranty and ownership to you." But at the end they take it away, they lied to you? This is not right.
Providing false information by companies can be punished.
DO SOMETHING!!!
Get the main number of dell, do NOT talk to any agents. Talk to alteast 3 managers and if you can, struggle your way up to CEO!!! That is the person to discuss policies and fraud. Do not deal with fraud department yet, they will talk to you as if you are some dirt, no respect no chance of proving anything. Talk to somebody higher!

Good luck man.

[earthman]

Reading this and I feel your pain man. I got scammed several times on howardforums. But when some thing is being taken away that is yours, that is just ridiculous. The worst thing they could have done is take away your warranty, but go through with confirmations and RMA. And then tell you in your face basically: "FU, you got screwed..."

Fight for your right of ownership, I believe you can even take dell to court. As they fraud YOU. They told you "Oh, yes. This laptop is clear, we will transfer warranty and ownership to you." But at the end they take it away, they lied to you? This is not right.
Providing false information by companies can be punished.
DO SOMETHING!!!
Get the main number of dell, do NOT talk to any agents. Talk to alteast 3 managers and if you can, struggle your way up to CEO!!! That is the person to discuss policies and fraud. Do not deal with fraud department yet, they will talk to you as if you are some dirt, no respect no chance of proving anything. Talk to somebody higher!

Good luck man.

:lol: :lol:

[coaxial]

I've mainly just skimmed this thread but you might have better luck with dell using more than just the consumer advocates address.
A few years ago I had a very expensive dell laptop with more than 12 separate hardware component failures over it's 3 year life, it was running out of warranty. I'd been arguing with support, support managers, and their managers to get the whole thing replaced for the 3 years and gotten nowhere.
I wrote a long detailed history and basically a 10 page epic complaint e-mail to the addresses below. Within an hour a customer advocate or something called me for my address as they were shipping me the best laptop they make, right away, free.


Michael_Dell@dell.com, kevin_rollins@dell.com,
William_amelio@dell.com, paul_bell@dell.com, jeff_clark@dell.com,
Martin_garvin@dell.com, Michael_George@dell.com, John_hamlin@dell.com,
joseph_marengi@dell.com, paul_mckinnon@dell.com, John_medica@dell.com,
randall_mott@dell.com, glenn_neland@dell.com, rosendo_parra@dell.com,
james_schneider@dell.com, lynn_tyson@dell.com, lawrence_tu@dell.com,
thurmond_woodard@dell.com

It doesn't sound right to me they are retaining your laptop. Especially with the legit transfer of ownership confirmed by them. I would try e-mailing the above your whole story, mention you are in touch with the authorities and the media, and hopefully they can compensate you somehow.

[dmdsoftware2]

I've mainly just skimmed this thread but you might have better luck with dell using more than just the consumer advocates address.
A few years ago I had a very expensive dell laptop with more than 12 separate hardware component failures over it's 3 year life, it was running out of warranty. I'd been arguing with support, support managers, and their managers to get the whole thing replaced for the 3 years and gotten nowhere.
I wrote a long detailed history and basically a 10 page epic complaint e-mail to the addresses below. Within an hour a customer advocate or something called me for my address as they were shipping me the best laptop they make, right away, free.


Michael_Dell@dell.com, kevin_rollins@dell.com,
William_amelio@dell.com, paul_bell@dell.com, jeff_clark@dell.com,
Martin_garvin@dell.com, Michael_George@dell.com, John_hamlin@dell.com,
joseph_marengi@dell.com, paul_mckinnon@dell.com, John_medica@dell.com,
randall_mott@dell.com, glenn_neland@dell.com, rosendo_parra@dell.com,
james_schneider@dell.com, lynn_tyson@dell.com, lawrence_tu@dell.com,
thurmond_woodard@dell.com

It doesn't sound right to me they are retaining your laptop. Especially with the legit transfer of ownership confirmed by them. I would try e-mailing the above your whole story, mention you are in touch with the authorities and the media, and hopefully they can compensate you somehow.

Good advice.

[InFeXiOn]

I've mainly just skimmed this thread but you might have better luck with dell using more than just the consumer advocates address.
A few years ago I had a very expensive dell laptop with more than 12 separate hardware component failures over it's 3 year life, it was running out of warranty. I'd been arguing with support, support managers, and their managers to get the whole thing replaced for the 3 years and gotten nowhere.
I wrote a long detailed history and basically a 10 page epic complaint e-mail to the addresses below. Within an hour a customer advocate or something called me for my address as they were shipping me the best laptop they make, right away, free.


Michael_Dell@dell.com, kevin_rollins@dell.com,
William_amelio@dell.com, paul_bell@dell.com, jeff_clark@dell.com,
Martin_garvin@dell.com, Michael_George@dell.com, John_hamlin@dell.com,
joseph_marengi@dell.com, paul_mckinnon@dell.com, John_medica@dell.com,
randall_mott@dell.com, glenn_neland@dell.com, rosendo_parra@dell.com,
james_schneider@dell.com, lynn_tyson@dell.com, lawrence_tu@dell.com,
thurmond_woodard@dell.com

It doesn't sound right to me they are retaining your laptop. Especially with the legit transfer of ownership confirmed by them. I would try e-mailing the above your whole story, mention you are in touch with the authorities and the media, and hopefully they can compensate you somehow.

Thank you for the advice, as well as everyone thus far in the thread.

However, half of those e-mail addresses at least were not working. I got the auto-email saying they failed.

Perhaps a change of email or something? :(

[InFeXiOn]

Upon emailing that list within ~15 minutes I have received an email stating something along the lines of:

"Your case has been escalated. You will be contacted either today or Monday at the latest in regards to this case."

This sounds like good news.

I dunno though.

[anabioz]

I told you :) :arrowu:

[InFeXiOn]

Had someone call me today and he said he's going to look into it the best he can and see what he can do.

This doesn't mean that I'll be receiving my laptop by any means but he's going to see what he can do regarding my case and he will be calling me on Monday with some result. Worst case scenario he says he can offer me a "screaming deal" if I wanted to buy from Dell directly.

However, I don't have the money to do that so I'm sincerely hoping he can find it in him to send me the replacement unit that I was promised.

[anabioz]

I hope you can get a refund!

We are here with you man! :)

[phiLLy11]

Good luck!

I'm sure Dell can spare a computer or two over solving an escalating debate like this.

[sidshock]

What's strange in this case is that dell approved the transfer of ownership... that sort of makes them the liable party here. They should be running after the original purchaser instead of after you. Anyway that's my 2c.

yeah, they should have said this CANNOT be transfered until the payment is completed or whatever...
so I think they are liable to give you the laptop back, and go after the ORIGINAL purchaser...
it clearly sounds like their fault for not doing a complete check and doing a transfer...
In a way, thanks.. Because next time I do a purchase and a warranty/ownership needs transfering, that is one of the new questions I will ask.. IS IT PAID IN FULL?!! and my phone has RECORD so it will be on record..

[sidshock]

yeah, but take a car lien for example..
if you go to do a transfer of ownership, it will NOT happen until the
lien is paid off!
so in this case, DELL did a transfer of ownership when they shouldn't have.
HOWEVER, if it was paid in full, which I am guessing it was.. with a STOLEN credit card, and later, there is a reversal of charges, then, technically, DELL can take it, and keep it no matter who has it/paid for it...
so COURT and the police charging this guy with fraud is the ONLY way.

ie: if police visited a pawn shop, found a bunch of stolen stuff (with proof ofcourse) they can confiscate it all, and the owner is out the $$ he paid for the stuff....

So, I'd hate to say it.. but..
if DELL, at the time, had NO FLAGS on the system.. ie: payment cleared with the BAD CC, then transfer would be fine..
however, if LATER, it did come up as stolen CC, funds revoked, etc... they can hold/keep your laptop...
Police can take it as evidence too I believe...
but in the end, DELL gets it..
ie: stolen goods from pawn shop, after police are done with them, goes back to original owners if they are found!


Sorry to hear OP!

I believe this case is similar to a piece of property that has a lien on it.

The laptop may change hands/owners.

However if the original bill was never fully paid for; Dell is still the legal owner of the laptop, until payment is complete.

The fault here lies with the original purchaser; however the blame can lie with Dell, as they didn't bother to explain to you why they can't/won't return the laptop being serviced. OP, you're the innocent victim here.

OP, since you have evidence proving the seller took $1500 from you; I would try to persue it in small claims court. You have important information, such as the license plate and phone number; these bits and pieces can all help you in contacting the seller.

[InFeXiOn]

Update:

Received another call today and he is still pursuing my case. I forwarded some hard evidence to the Dell rep and if he can prove the owner bought it with malicious intent (ie. - to cancel the payment later after selling) then his credit card company will go after him for the amount and they can hopefully end up sending me a replacement unit.

Nothing is for sure yet but I should hear back in the next few days now that I have given the rep all the information they need. Hopefully he gets back to me with good news this time.

[InFeXiOn]

Update:

Got a call back already.

They can't do anything. He spoke with the fraud department and a lawyer about it and since the laptop is actually in the hands of Dell they would have virtually no case at all in their pursuit of the original buyer.

Much like has been mentioned here in this thread already, until the laptop is paid for (since he did a chargeback) it is still legally property of Dell, and no one else.

The only thing he could offer is that if I pursue this person by way of the police, Dell will provide all of the case notes to the police in helping with charing/apprehending this person.

Ugh.

[anabioz]

That's all you got. Don't hesitate and follow through! :arrow:

[patlo]

since the laptop is actually in the hands of Dell they would have virtually no case at all in their pursuit of the original buyer.


Yes this is true. If dell were to go after this guy they would have absolutely no case against him. The laptop in question is already in dell's possession. You have to look at it through the eyes of Dell's lawyers. They're fighting for Dell, NOT you! Since they already have the laptop in hand, what could they possibly gain from going after this guy? At this point Dell doesn't have to do anything at all.



Much like has been mentioned here in this thread already, until the laptop is paid for (since he did a chargeback) it is still legally property of Dell, and no one else.


This is not entirely true. Dell transferred the ownership to you. If you had the laptop sitting in your home, at this very moment, I would just love to see them try and take legal action to get it back. Even if they knew you had it, and where you had it, they would have a FAT CHANCE in hell getting it back. Their beef is with the original purchaser.

Your beef is with Dell. Dell is definitely wrong here. They transferred full ownership of the laptop to you. They assumed the laptop would be paid for, in full, by the original purchaser - if he defaults on those payments then it's up to Dell to go after him to collect those payments. Whatever debts the original purchaser has/had with Dell is between Dell and the original purchaser - it has nothing to do with you.

In a perfect world Dell would give you the laptop back and go after the guy that owes them the money. Since we don't live in a perfect world, dell doesn't HAVE to do anything.

Your fight is with Dell. They transferred full ownership to you. They honored the warranty they gave you. They even issued an RMA for the laptop, giving no indication that the laptop didn't belong to you.

They have no right keeping the laptop. You have to take action! Fight them! At the end of the day, no one's going to fight for you except you.

[samhoque]

This thread is very interesting.. but that would be a crude way of putting it.. I really feel for the guy here and I hope you get your laptop back.. Try pursuing some of the local free media to publish your story.. I don't know what's available in Toronto but there should be quite a few free newspapers that people check out.. Try 'em out and see how many publish your story..

Good luck getting your money back..

[Blitzo]

It seems to me this fraud is between you and the seller. Dell is almost a 3rd party or outsider at this point. Any success with RCMP? Can they track his identity with the plate numbers? Can you find any personal info about him with the internet and dialogue you had with him? Don't give up you have a many hundreds of people behind you here. If anything, go public and let this fraud be known. Something good will come out of it for you and others.

[sidshock]

I remember reading somewhere, you have his address...
phone number..
full name..
Plates...
goto courts, and file a small claims court case against him for $1500 plus time/money wasted in figuring out what to do, etc...
and spend like $30-90 I forget how much it is now to file..
and also, you have enough to file fraud charges too I believe..
well, you gotta get on it, so the police files fraud on him..
basically, at this point, your only option is to try and get your money back..
this guys plan was simple.. buy the laptop, and then sell it for cheap.
and get a charge back for instant profit scam...
BUT.. how did he file a CHARGE BACK?!?! Doesn't dell ask for signature upon 'delivery?? I mean, tracking doesn't matter, since it can be left on your door step... but I would figure they would need a signature to drop a lappy off??? And then dell can show that to the CC company, and charge-back wouldn't go thru....

dude, you should be knocking on this guys door if you know where he lives, demanding your $$ back ASAP!

[InFeXiOn]

Other than leaving a message with the local York Regional police (whom have yet to call me back) I have not had contact with any other police departments in an attempt to track his identity. On top of being sickly busy I was dealing with Dell in hopes of a quick resolve but to no avail.

However, they did tell me that if the police need the sellers information that Dell would happily pass the documents on to them for an investigation but they cannot divulge that information to me for obvious privacy protection reasons.

Sometime soon I plan on trying to get in touch with the appropriate department at the RCMP in hopes that they might be able to do something about this. I am considering the small claims court option at this point, and will look further into it in the coming days.

[dmdsoftware2]

I remember reading somewhere, you have his address...
phone number..
full name..
Plates...
goto courts, and file a small claims court case against him for $1500 plus time/money wasted in figuring out what to do, etc...
and spend like $30-90 I forget how much it is now to file..
and also, you have enough to file fraud charges too I believe..
well, you gotta get on it, so the police files fraud on him..
basically, at this point, your only option is to try and get your money back..
this guys plan was simple.. buy the laptop, and then sell it for cheap.
and get a charge back for instant profit scam...
BUT.. how did he file a CHARGE BACK?!?! Doesn't dell ask for signature upon 'delivery?? I mean, tracking doesn't matter, since it can be left on your door step... but I would figure they would need a signature to drop a lappy off??? And then dell can show that to the CC company, and charge-back wouldn't go thru....

dude, you should be knocking on this guys door if you know where he lives, demanding your $$ back ASAP!

The credit card was probably stolen so chargeback would go through.

[bobbings]

Other than leaving a message with the local York Regional police (whom have yet to call me back) I have not had contact with any other police departments in an attempt to track his identity. On top of being sickly busy I was dealing with Dell in hopes of a quick resolve but to no avail.

However, they did tell me that if the police need the sellers information that Dell would happily pass the documents on to them for an investigation but they cannot divulge that information to me for obvious privacy protection reasons.

Sometime soon I plan on trying to get in touch with the appropriate department at the RCMP in hopes that they might be able to do something about this. I am considering the small claims court option at this point, and will look further into it in the coming days.

Why are you still waiting and not going to the RCMP? It's better to have more people, more groups, more departments and more hands helping you out than to go through one thing at a time.

[Shampoo.kr]

OMG, this is horrible.

I've heard about a lot of RFD meetings for sales where the buyer would get jumped and robbed in the downtown area.

This is more for cellphones and such, not so much with computer parts.

Kinda pisses me off.

Increase in criminal activity since RFD got more public attention with all the ads in local papers and the TTC.

You see so many more for sale threads with sellers who have 1 post, but seem to have experience in the way the threads are made.

Sorry to hear of your misfortune.

Since everything was done correctly on your part, I'm sure things will work out somehow.

Lots of thefts lately, so be careful out there people.

Also don't go out alone on deals, even though you believe you're safe in a public area.

My sister's friend got robbed of her purse, which had her cellphone, digicam, etc. at Bloor subway station while waiting in line to pay the fare and enter during rush hour.

How many people do you think were in the ticket area?

Ridiculous. Also messed up how no one helped her as she was getting to her feet from being knocked over.

Watch your backs people, I know I do all the time.

Cheers,
Mike

[trixR4kids]

OMG, this is horrible.

I've heard about a lot of RFD meetings for sales where the buyer would get jumped and robbed in the downtown area.

This is more for cellphones and such, not so much with computer parts.

Kinda pisses me off.

Increase in criminal activity since RFD got more public attention with all the ads in local papers and the TTC.

You see so many more for sale threads with sellers who have 1 post, but seem to have experience in the way the threads are made.

Sorry to hear of your misfortune.

Since everything was done correctly on your part, I'm sure things will work out somehow.

Lots of thefts lately, so be careful out there people.

Also don't go out alone on deals, even though you believe you're safe in a public area.

My sister's friend got robbed of her purse, which had her cellphone, digicam, etc. at Bloor subway station while waiting in line to pay the fare and enter during rush hour.

How many people do you think were in the ticket area?

Ridiculous. Also messed up how no one helped her as she was getting to her feet from being knocked over.

Watch your backs people, I know I do all the time.

Cheers,
Mike

uh, that isnt really the same case as this, a legit transaction took place, only that op got scammed later on. He wasnt robbed on spot or sth

[cloneman]

The important think is you don't get hurt. A mild mugging can really wake a person up for the future to prevent potentially serious altercations

[DYJ]

The important think is you don't get hurt. A mild mugging can really wake a person up for the future to prevent potentially serious altercations

What in the world?? What does mild muggings have to do with this thread? LOL, stop with the muggings people, this guy is facing some tough times. No one got mugged lol, so stop with the muggings.

[cloneman]

dammit, why does everyone blame me when something goes off topic! Look a few posts up, someone else wrote a whole paragraph about it!

[Allstarplaya546]

Try Silverman Helps:
It might take 6-8 weeks to have it checked out but what can you really do at this point? I hope you get your laptop back!

HOW TO GET IN TOUCH WITH SILVERMAN HELPS

EMAIL:

helps@citynews.ca

FAX:

416-591-0292

SNAIL MAIL:

Silverman Helps

299 Queen Street W.

Toronto, Ont

M5V 2Z5

Please send us a detailed letter outlining your case, and any COPIES of supporting documentation that you may have. (Do not send original documents as documentation will not be returned.) Please ensure that you include a return mailing address and daytime phone numbers with your correspondence. If we interested in your case, we will contact you as soon as possible.

Due to the volume of inquiries we receive, your correspondence will be responded to within approximately 6-8 weeks (via email or mail).

[DYJ]

dammit, why does everyone blame me when something goes off topic! Look a few posts up, someone else wrote a whole paragraph about it!

Relax man! lol, some guy already addressed that guy's mugging paragraph.

Anyway, back to this guy.
What's the word? People have been posting left and right trying to help you out. How are things going? Any news?

[zgenius]

Online scams are running rampid on alot of local sites, and what bothers me the most is that I my self could probably pick out 8 out of 10 of these guys with little or no effort but what are the police doing about it? If they were scamming the government or an insurrance company, they would be top priority but taking our hard earned money is ok?

Not that I'm recomending or endorsding this in any way but if I were scamed by one of these online lowlifes I would pose as a potential buyer and arrange a personal meeting to pay for their item and well, lets just end the story there before I get my self in trouble.

There is one thing I'm sure of, if it sounds too good to be true, it usually is. Dont rush into a deal because you think its so great and you dont want to miss out. Take a step back do some reasearch ans see if what they are offering is even possible. Example if every one else is selling xbox 360 for $300 and the scammer is selling it for $150 than chances are its just a scam.

Bottom line if your not sure of something or you get a bad feeling about a deal, do some research, ask some questions and if you happen to miss out on that deal, oh well, on this site there is always another great deal around the corner.

Ps I think that we need to put some pressure on law enforcement to start acting on these internet scams, call them about every scam you have encountered and keep calling them, dont let them brush you off.

[Acuratl]

Let me give you my input into this week old thread. Basically there was a guy here in calgary selling dell laptops pretty cheap 1/2 price..People paid him and they got the laptops brand new from DELL!

The problem was that about 6 months later they got collection notices from Dell. Apparently the guy ordered the laptops from dell using a stolen credit card, and shipped them express. After the money was reclaimed dell put collection services after the guys who got the laptop..

Eventually everything was settled and the scammer ended up paying dell out of his own pocket and was spared any jail time..they all knew were the scammer lived too..i think this case is pretty similar..

Your problem was that you sent the laptop in for repair, if you had kept it you would probably be good..unless DELL sent collection agencies to you

[Gee]

I have just read thru the entire thread. First let me state, I do not work for Dell and I have no love for Dell. In fact I hate Dell Computers.

If you use common sense. It is clearly not the fault of Dell.

I buy a Dell computer online using a stolen credit card. Dell contacts the credit card company and the payment is authorized. Dell ships. I receive the notebook and quickly sell it, and I transfer the warranty to the new owner.

Keep in mind, Dell has received payment from the bank, the original owner of the credit card will see a statment within 30 days, at which point they file a claim for a fradulant charge. The credit company does a charge back for the funds. Dell will not find out until their next statement from the bank.

This turn around time can take up to 60 days.

How can you blame Dell? Imagine you were Dell?

It is plain and simple, you were scammed by an individual, Dell has done nothing wrong. They don't care who the registered owner of the notebook is. They were not paid for product. So they are with holding it until payment is made. You would do no different as a merchant.

I wouldn't waste my time with the Police. If you have the sellers information, file for small claims. Get a summons sent out to him for $1500.

The police are too busy giving out parking tickets and setting up radar traps. Real crime takes a back seat to lining their pockets.

Do I sound bitter?

[cloneman]

Do I sound bitter?

Yes.

Dell is not at fault, but it's not their right to withhold property that is sent for repair.

[patlo]

I have just read thru the entire thread. First let me state, I do not work for Dell and I have no love for Dell. In fact I hate Dell Computers.

If you use common sense. It is clearly not the fault of Dell.

I buy a Dell computer online using a stolen credit card. Dell contacts the credit card company and the payment is authorized. Dell ships. I receive the notebook and quickly sell it, and I transfer the warranty to the new owner.

Keep in mind, Dell has received payment from the bank, the original owner of the credit card will see a statment within 30 days, at which point they file a claim for a fradulant charge. The credit company does a charge back for the funds. Dell will not find out until their next statement from the bank.

This turn around time can take up to 60 days.

How can you blame Dell? Imagine you were Dell?

It is plain and simple, you were scammed by an individual, Dell has done nothing wrong. They don't care who the registered owner of the notebook is. They were not paid for product. So they are with holding it until payment is made. You would do no different as a merchant.

I wouldn't waste my time with the Police. If you have the sellers information, file for small claims. Get a summons sent out to him for $1500.

The police are too busy giving out parking tickets and setting up radar traps. Real crime takes a back seat to lining their pockets.

Do I sound bitter?

So you're saying anyone can use a credit card to buy all the laptops they want from dell, sell the laptops for x amount of money, do a charge-back on their credit card and dell can't touch them? Eventhough dell has already transferred the ownerships of the laptops to all the new owners, dell takes no responsibility for getting the money back from the real criminal? That's bs.

The scammer owes dell x amount of money. It's dell's responsibility to go after the scammer.

What if i bought a laptop from dell and i didn't pay them? They sure as hell will be coming after me. What if I transferred the ownership of the laptop to my brother? Am i off the hook? Are they now after my brother?? That makes no sense.

What if futureshop buys a crap load of laptops from dell... futureshop then sells one of those laptops to me... futureshop doesn't end up paying dell for the laptops... who does dell go after? In this situation I think it's dell's responsibility to go after futureshop, and NOT me, right?

[Acuratl]

So you're saying anyone can use a credit card to buy all the laptops they want from dell, sell the laptops for x amount of money, do a charge-back on their credit card and dell can't touch them? Eventhough dell has already transferred the ownerships of the laptops to all the new owners, dell takes no responsibility for getting the money back from the real criminal? That's bs.

The scammer owes dell x amount of money. It's dell's responsibility to go after the scammer.

What if i bought a laptop from dell and i didn't pay them? They sure as hell will be coming after me. What if I transferred the ownership of the laptop to my brother? Am i off the hook? Are they now after my brother?? That makes no sense.

What if futureshop buys a crap load of laptops from dell... futureshop then sells one of those laptops to me... futureshop doesn't end up paying dell for the laptops... who does dell go after? In this situation I think it's dell's responsibility to go after futureshop, and NOT me, right?

Ok Dude your taking it illogically ,i agree COMPLETELY with Gee. And so will any courts/law enforcement.

What you are saying is TRUE Dells beef is with the scammer not the laptop purchaser..thats fine IF they guy didn't send his laptop in for repairs, dell can't do anything.

But i mean he sent it in for REPAIRS! in good conscience can dell send back a laptop that THEY KNOW they weren't paid for? If this was your company and you received back goods that were stolen, what would you do?

As i said before there were cases were dell sent collectors after those who received the said laptops, and were gracious enough to work with the police to go after the real scammers.

I feel sorry for dell whenever i buy a product from them i have to jump HOOPS to get the credit to go through, and i guess scammers have an easier time than me lol

[patlo]

I guess it comes down to whoever has possession of the laptop. I mean if this poor guy didn't send it in he'd be ok. Dell wouldn't have a right to take it back. Even if they took it court, everyone would see that he paid for it and dell transferred ownership. Dell would HAVE to go after the original scammer.

I still think the right thing to do is for dell to send the laptop back to him.
Dell's the one that got scammed in the first place. They sold a laptop to someone that didn't pay for it. They should go after him. To even things out, Dell is going to scam this kid for his laptop.

poor kid.

[Acuratl]

I guess it comes down to whoever has possession of the laptop. I mean if this poor guy didn't send it in he'd be ok. Dell wouldn't have a right to take it back. Even if they took it court, everyone would see that he paid for it and dell transferred ownership. Dell would HAVE to go after the original scammer.

I still think the right thing to do is for dell to send the laptop back to him.
Dell's the one that got scammed in the first place. They sold a laptop to someone that didn't pay for it. They should go after him. To even things out, Dell is going to scam this kid for his laptop.

poor kid.

it could just be me, but i find it laughable that you want dell to send the laptop back lol..

[patlo]

it could just be me, but i find it laughable that you want dell to send the laptop back lol..

why is it laughable? he owns the laptop. He bought it.

[patlo]

it could just be me, but i find it laughable that you want dell to send the laptop back lol..

I'm not saying dell has to send the laptop back.. it just would be nice if they did. That's all i'm saying. Doesn't matter to me one way or the other.

[Acuratl]

I'm not saying dell has to send the laptop back.. it just would be nice if they did. That's all i'm saying. Doesn't matter to me one way or the other.

i understand, but what way would Dell know that this guy bought the laptop, or did the fraud? they would really have no clue!

[davidcfs]

Just saw this: http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2231934197&topic=6928

Name to the seller?

[Acuratl]

Just saw this: http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=2231934197&topic=6928

Name to the seller?

could be, could be another scammer all together..Where is our resident hacker when we need him :o

[davidcfs]

could be, could be another scammer all together..Where is our resident hacker when we need him :o

Scammed can always message this guy with a friends account and ask to buy one, if its him then he can book him and try to get your cash back, if its not the guy can say nevermind not interested in the laptop anymore.

Just my 2 cents.

[flamez1000]

wow dat sucks! juss went thru the whole convo, ne new developments? this is like a great soap opera :P.

[dealdiggerMississauga]

*bump*

Seriously, I think you might be out of luck. It's BS, and Dell is not being air, it's their fault this is happening, as such, they should be going after the person that scammed them.

If you can somehow get this guys address, send him a demand letter from a para-legal, with a limited number of days to respond. If he doesn't respond, open a small claims case, and (i think) he'll have 20 days to respond. if he doesn't then you get a default judgement!

This is assuming someone (RCMP, Dell rep) will disclose this imformation to you. I'm sure the RCMP could help if you wanted to file a claim.

I just finished with a claim against Spence Diamonds, and basically, they ignored my demand letter, but responded very well to the plaintiff's claim, and I got interest as well as filing fees!

Good luck... and I'm pretty sure you can still do something about this, as long as you can get a registered letter to the scammer. And you may want to copy Dell on the demand letter. Maybe state how its their fault, and they transferred the ownership, and they'reholding your laptop without reason.

[Ac3]

This thread has convinced me to never buy a dell!

OP, good luck getting the laptop back from dell I would suggest taking them to small claims court.

[AngeLLB]

I'm not certain how this transfer of ownership with Dell works...but is there a possibility that instead of transferring ownership, you got a confirmation that the agreement to purchase (let's say, if there was some sort of payment plan) was assigned to you and with this assignment came all the obligations/rights associated with the laptop?

If this is the case, then I can see why Dell is being a jerk and holding the laptop hostage - it would essentially mean that the debt is now yours. But still...I'm pretty certain this was not the case judging from some of your posts.

I'm really sorry to hear that this happened to you.

Any news on whether your story will be picked up by Silverman?

[ahsalloum]

Any updates OP? :|

[Sprite_TM]

the first mistake was to send the laptop in for repair. u expect full warranty for something you bought so cheap?

[CupOfCats]

Did anything ever come of this?

[wellysm]

I know that i'm resurrecting a dead thread... but I didn't just spend the damn last half an hour reading thru the 9 pages to never find out what happened...

OP???

[InFeXiOn]

Nothing ever happened, unfortunately.

I left messages with two different police departments and never got call back within the first 6-8 weeks. Tried calling in and was just told there wasn't much they can do, it was mostly a waiting game.
Spoke to one individual who told me likely nothing would come of it anyway.

They were probably right since I never did get a phone call, ever.
Still out $1500.

Still sucks just as much.

[wellysm]

so why not spend the 90 something $ for a smalls claim court.

Im pretty sure dell would rather refund you than spend 1000s on lawyers

[limpid]

I read the first 5 pages then jumped to the last page because I could not take it anymore.

You need to call Dell and demand that they send your laptop back. If you have the ownership transferred to you and you have some proof or even a reference number of the call/transaction then you should get your laptop back. Dell has an issue with the credit card holder. Not you, the person who paid an amount, transferred ownership and used his warranty as one would be permitted to.

I think you are being way too soft. You may feel like you lost and I understand because I was scammed before like many here. I think you got a few good rounds with Dell left to get your laptop back. Why not press charges with the police on Dell for withholding your $1500 purchase.

Don't give up, man. Step it up. Don't tell us you did everything. Either remove this whole thread or keep fighting. Flopping around on the floor like a fish out of water is not helping you. Sorry if that sounds harsh. I am just trying to be honest with you.

[dmdsoftware2]

I read the first 5 pages then jumped to the last page because I could not take it anymore.

You need to call Dell and demand that they send your laptop back. If you have the ownership transferred to you and you have some proof or even a reference number of the call/transaction then you should get your laptop back. Dell has an issue with the credit card holder. Not you, the person who paid an amount, transferred ownership and used his warranty as one would be permitted to.

I think you are being way too soft. You may feel like you lost and I understand because I was scammed before like many here. I think you got a few good rounds with Dell left to get your laptop back. Why not press charges with the police on Dell for withholding your $1500 purchase.

Don't give up, man. Step it up. Don't tell us you did everything. Either remove this whole thread or keep fighting. Flopping around on the floor like a fish out of water is not helping you. Sorry if that sounds harsh. I am just trying to be honest with you.

It's like going to a store, stealing something, and then selling it on the street. If the item is stolen and ownership of the stolen item is transferred to another person, the item is still stolen. If it is recovered by Dell or the police, you lose ownership of the item. You have no right to a stolen item. That's why police warn people from buying stolen or 'too good to be true' items, and only purchase used items from reputable people.

[limpid]

It's like going to a store, stealing something, and then selling it on the street. If the item is stolen and ownership of the stolen item is transferred to another person, the item is still stolen. If it is recovered by Dell or the police, you lose ownership of the item. You have no right to a stolen item. That's why police warn people from buying stolen or 'too good to be true' items, and only purchase used items from reputable people.

Then let it go and let the healing begin. Not worth the torture. You win some. You lose some. Keep your chin up.

[giggidytoronto]

OP stop delaying. Your next bet is taking this to small claims court. Its not about winning or losing, its about the principle that you were NOT in the wrong here. Good luck op and keep us updated.

[trick91]

OP stop delaying. Your next bet is taking this to small claims court. Its not about winning or losing, its about the principle that you were NOT in the wrong here. Good luck op and keep us updated.

its been 3 years i think its pretty much over now

[chickibum]

its been 3 years i think its pretty much over now

That really sucks. OP you have the guys address, you could have sent this to small claims for $75. You had a solid case, and if he didn't pay you could have had his wages garnisheed :( this whole thing really sucks, I hate knowing this scammer got away with this :mad: pretty sure you're out of time, but still think you should check it out...

[CJ TXB]

You need to tell Dell that they're in the wrong and that they MUST give you your property back.

There has to be repercussions for a company willingly giving you false information (safe transfer of ownership).

To me that is the equivalent of going to the registry, running a VIN and getting a report stating that there are no liens on a vehicle only to find out a day after buying that there is.

I hate to say it, but you need to grow a spine and start busting some balls. *edit* You know why they're offering you to buy stuff at a screaming deal? Because you're letting them! This shouldn't be a 'What can I do Mr. Dell?' This should be a 'Give me my goddamn computer back, and you should fix it for pulling this ****'.

Call your police department, tell them you want to report a company holding your property without cause. Tell them that you have legal transfer of ownership, and that they're holding YOUR property that you have a receipt for.

If the police brush you off, GET ON THE PHONE WITH DELL. Don't talk to the first person who answers. Ask for a manager right away, don't play the victim here, play the pissed off consumer who's product is being with held illegally and demand that they give you an answer. Tell them that you LEGALLY own that product and that you have a receipt, and proof of ownership FROM THEIR COMPANY. If the repair/service area is near you, then go there, and demand for your laptop back. The main thing you want right now is to have this computer back in your possession. Then you can work on getting it fixed properly with Dell and preventing them from holding it.


Had someone call me today and he said he's going to look into it the best he can and see what he can do.

This doesn't mean that I'll be receiving my laptop by any means but he's going to see what he can do regarding my case and he will be calling me on Monday with some result. Worst case scenario he says he can offer me a "screaming deal" if I wanted to buy from Dell directly.

However, I don't have the money to do that so I'm sincerely hoping he can find it in him to send me the replacement unit that I was promised.

LOL.

Are you shitting me dude?

You might even want to seek free legal aide (check forums) I don't think a company can legally hold a product from someone like that. It's their responsibility to collect funds and how are you to prove that they haven't received those funds and are now just selling your computer? What if this guy paid for this computer but now has monies owing? DEMAND that they tell you why they're holding your property.

It's different if you bought a stolen computer, but Dell gave you clear and free ownership. If I go to Futureshop, buy a **** ton of electronics, put them on a 'don't pay for a year' sell it all (with warranties) and someone returns do you really think Futureshop is going to say "Oh I am sorry sir but we have to keep this because the original buyer didn't pay" They wouldn't!

They have an agreement with the buyer and only the buyer. The goods have been transferred and it's simply their problem to sort out (through collections) with the buyer.

EDIT! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOoo!!!!

Why didn't I see the '2007'!!!!!! LOL What a waste of time.

[supeg93]

Wow, you got scammed 1500 bucks and have the guys name and address and did not actually do anything in person to the guy? Man up....

[rsasp]

Sorry but if you wouldnt have taken the computer into dell for servicing, you'd still have the laptop?

I'm confused.. I need to read that again, but doesnt sound like he scammed you right up front...

sounds like he tried to scam dell somehow.//

wow you need to work on your reading.

Good idea to read the whole thread. hope you will understand OP's frustration.

[InFeXiOn]

It's like going to a store, stealing something, and then selling it on the street. If the item is stolen and ownership of the stolen item is transferred to another person, the item is still stolen. If it is recovered by Dell or the police, you lose ownership of the item. You have no right to a stolen item. That's why police warn people from buying stolen or 'too good to be true' items, and only purchase used items from reputable people.

Pretty much what this guy said.

And why does everyone assume I even have the guys name?
Our correspondence was through e-mail, which was obviously setup under a fake name and ect. Sadly, I never even picked up the laptop. I was at university at the time and had a family member pick it up on my behalf. They inspected it and everything was good -- so there was no reason to think of the person as a scammer, they bought it and left. Had it been me I probably would have got a photo of their drivers license or something in hindsight, but what'cha gonna do.

It's been 3 years now, not sure there's any restitution for me at this point.

[lollerskatez]

Its a very expensive lesson but take solace in the fact that once he gets caught and jailed (which is inevitable), that he'll be the one getting screwed. :lol:

[jan_db]

Example: Your TV set gets stolen. The thief takes it to a pawn shop. It gets resold to somebody. Then to somebody else. Then to somebody else. In each case there is a legitimate sale. All meaningless since if the police find it they will seize the TV and return it to the original legitimate owner. Whoever had the TV set at the time it is found will lose it and not receive any compensation..

BALONEY! As long as the Pawn Shop follows the law by entering the transaction and a VERY brief description of the seller in their logbook, they can legally sell stolen goods, and keep the money, and the original owner is S.O.L.
Should the Police find said stolen property, the original owner isn't getting it back, unless he BUYS it back.
You don't REALLY think the law is on the side of the average schmuck, do you?

[Jamie]

BALONEY! As long as the Pawn Shop follows the law by entering the transaction and a VERY brief description of the seller in their logbook, they can legally sell stolen goods, and keep the money, and the original owner is S.O.L.
Should the Police find said stolen property, the original owner isn't getting it back, unless he BUYS it back.
You don't REALLY think the law is on the side of the average schmuck, do you?

That only applies if the Original Owner has not filed a stolen merchandice with the Police, as long as they have done that the Pawn shop will lose claim over a stolen item..