CRTC proves once again that they are useless

[66xx66]

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Canadian-Regulators-Deny-Relief-For-Bell-Canada-Traffic-Shaping-94390

The CRTC has deny the application for the independent Canadian ISPs regarding Bell's throttling.

In other words, a bureaucratically dysfunctional system that generally rules for the carrier with the biggest wallet and best lobbyists.

The Canadian gov't won't do anything about the high gas prices either. Since higher gas prices = more gas taxes money for their bigger paycheck.
I hate all big corporation and gov't.

[Aske001]

That is a disappointment, but not unexpected. The CRTC has always been useless. It's really up to the politicians. Make your voice heard.

[Ogata]

That is a huge disappointment. Perhaps Bell gave them some pocket change to get them to say no.

[phucyall]

You are forgetting what while government gave a lot of funding for developing that infrastructure, it is Bell who owns the "last mile" or cabling and equipment. It is their right to do as they see fit with that equipment. If a company doesn't want to be throttled, they should put in their own equipment and run their own cables.

What is upsetting however, is that there are still far too many areas where ADSL service is < 2mbps and if you want to get your 2 you have to pay for 7. Since it's their infrastructure they should be striving to improve it and not just letting it sit there forever. Large Quebec cities had ADSL2+ for years now and at the same prices we are paying for speeds 5x slower, while in Ontario they are saying that 7mbit is too fast and they can't keep up with that much traffic.

And the biggest kicker is that the government (under the disguise of competition) allows two complete monopolies. If I want ADSL, the "last mile" is almost exclusively by bell (at least for residential service) so if I am too far from a CO my speed will never be good or even half that of the advertised. But wait, this is a competitive market, right? I can always go to the one provider that offers the best choice for me. So if I can't do ADSL what's left. Oh wait, there is only ISP left. And that's Rogers. And since they were given a monopoly on cable lines they make the rules and do as they please.

My turds are more competitive then Canadian ISPs.

[Digital_Domain]

Thank you Canadian government..... *sigh*

Who lays fiber in Toronto? I seriously want to talk to them and see what it's like to get a T1 or something - there are a bunch of people on my street that are fed up with this (Roger's loads their nodes here and thus crush any and all P2P and most people here hate Bell for one reason or another) and I'm personally willing to pitch the idea of sharing a T1 or something.

[B0000rt]

Thank you Canadian government..... *sigh*

Who lays fiber in Toronto? I seriously want to talk to them and see what it's like to get a T1 or something - there are a bunch of people on my street that are fed up with this (Roger's loads their nodes here and thus crush any and all P2P and most people here hate Bell for one reason or another) and I'm personally willing to pitch the idea of sharing a T1 or something.

Umm you realize T1 is 1.544mbit/second right?

I <3 my Comcast 16mbit download :D

[cwb27]

Thank you Canadian government..... *sigh*

Who lays fiber in Toronto? I seriously want to talk to them and see what it's like to get a T1 or something - there are a bunch of people on my street that are fed up with this (Roger's loads their nodes here and thus crush any and all P2P and most people here hate Bell for one reason or another) and I'm personally willing to pitch the idea of sharing a T1 or something.

A T1 is old school... OC-192 is where it's at. BAMMMMMMM. ;)

[cdnNick]

Share an OC3 line. :)

I've never understood why the telecom industry is so tightly guard by the government, how about we open it up and get some real competition in here. So I don't have to look at my Rogers bill go up every few months while the service goes down.

CRTC is beyond useless.

[trucanuck]

The CRTC also said it would address the larger issue of a full probe in a letter to Bell and CAIP to be sent on Thursday. Peggy Nebout, a spokesperson for the regulator, said the letter would start a process that will allow the public to comment on the issue of traffic shaping. The CRTC expects to make a decision in the fall, she said.

....

The CRTC will also on Thursday open up its framework on the regulation of new media in broadcasting for public consultation. Geist, who has seen a draft of the framework, said it contains provisions for limiting how much control ISPs have over how people use the internet.

"The issue of net neutrality will be put on the table from a broadcast perspective. This decision puts it on the table from a telecom perspective as well," he said. "It's clear that many groups were seeking to jump in on this issue, and many more will come to the fore."

Bell must also now deal with a complaint filed by CIPPIC to the Privacy Commissioner earlier this week. The Ottawa-based legal clinic said traffic shaping and use of "deep packet inspection" technology by Bell and other large ISPs is a violation of the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act.

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2008/05/14/tech-caip.html

[Icedawn]

is it just me, or did people completely miss that i) its a ruling against interim relief and ii) its only on the basis that there's no irreparable harm.

while I want Teksavvy and others to win, given I subscribe to them, personally, I find it hard to find fault in the ruling. That is, in this case, how are the ISPs being hurt other than financially... (which is not irreparable).

[Digital_Domain]

That is, in this case, how are the ISPs being hurt other than financially... (which is not irreparable).
They're not being able to serve the niche market their whole business is based upon. Many people left because they hated the throttling and other ISP's offered such a service without so they left. These are the same people willing to fork over the cash for high quality Internet that larger companies have alienated from their service due to excessive bandwidth usage. These niche companies however, have some how dealt with this increased demand (dur, upgraded their network) and are still making money. Bell has, in effect, forced every DSL ISP into the same market as itself leveling the playing field and giving the house the advantage. It's hard to swim with your hands and feet tied but it is possible and that's how Bell is able to skirt around this.

Btw, the people saying T1 is old school, I know it is, hence the "or something" clause. I grew up on T1 when that was cutting edge and yes, I'd need at least an OC-3 line but I might as well get an OC-12 so I don't have to upgrade later (apparently it's also cheaper to run than an OC-3 line??)...

[bubble.tea]

Traffic Shaping: A very interesting reality that we are being strong armed (broadband users) into accepting. On my last call into why my 'promised' Retention credit of $30 for the overuse wasn't properly processed (FOR THE THIRD MONTH IN A ROW)...the agent had the GALL to ask me "For what do you use the internet for"? I said the usual., webcamming with family overseas, streaming videos on youtbue., and downloading various software and files. He told me 'because you use it like that you are not meeting the useage criteria' and you shouldn't be getting the credit. But he did end up giving it...just had to do it with a spoon full of salt to buut. :twisted:. WTF, traffic shaping my ASS.

[JAC]

All this talk of dedicated lines is very amusing, given the cost. Keep in mind the following are US prices, and likely cheaper than here.

Dedicated line broadband speeds and prices
T-1 - 1.544 megabits per second (24 DS0 lines) Ave. cost $250.-$500./mo.
T-3 - 43.232 megabits per second (28 T-1s) Ave. cost $4,000.-$16,000./mo.
OC-3 - 155 megabits per second (100 T-1s) Ave. cost $20,000.-$45,000./mo.
OC-12 - 622 megabits per second (4 OC3s) no estimated price available
OC-48 - 2.5 gigabits per seconds (4 OC12s) no estimated price available
OC-192 - 9.6 gigabits per second (4 OC48s) no estimated price available

A T-1 line is a high speed digital connection capable of transmitting data at a
rate of approximately 1.544 million bits per second. A T-1 line is typically used
by small and medium sized companies with heavy network traffic. It is large
enough to send and receive very large text files, graphics, sounds, and
databases instantaneously, and is the fastest speed commonly used to
connect networks to the Internet. Sometimes referred to as a leased line, a
T-1 is basically too large and too expensive for individual home use.

A T-3 line is a super high speed connection capable of transmitting data at
a rate of 45 million bps (bits per second). A T-3 line represents a bandwidth
equal to about 672 regular voice grade telephone lines, which is wide enough
to transmit full motion, real-time video, and very large databases over a busy
network. A T-3 line is typically installed as a major networking artery for large
corporations and universities with high volume network traffic. For example,
the backbones of the major Internet service providers are comprised of T-3 lines.

[IoannI]

The Canadian gov't won't do anything about the high gas prices either. Since higher gas prices = more gas taxes money for their bigger paycheck.
I hate all big corporation and gov't.

What do you want the government to do about the gas prices? The price of gas reflects the price it costs for one barrel of crude oil. As long as; crude oil costs a lot per barrel then gas is going to cost a lot. Do you want the government to magically lower the price of the barrel?

[CodecX81]

Well, theres another form of relief if you are willing to acquire the hardware for it:

http://digg.com/mods/Modified_Tomato_Firmware_breaks_BT_Throttle_on_DSL

If the Gov't doesn't make our lives easier, we just gotta digg in and do our own thing to make it happen for us!

[Octavius]

Well, theres another form of relief if you are willing to acquire the hardware for it:

http://digg.com/mods/Modified_Tomato_Firmware_breaks_BT_Throttle_on_DSL

If the Gov't doesn't make our lives easier, we just gotta digg in and do our own thing to make it happen for us!

Neat.

For those of you in Ottawa, there's a protest Rally on the 27th of May at 1:30PM. I'll be there showing my support.

Doubt it'll do anything, but it's better than doing nothing at all I suppose.

[66xx66]

What do you want the government to do about the gas prices? The price of gas reflects the price it costs for one barrel of crude oil. As long as; crude oil costs a lot per barrel then gas is going to cost a lot. Do you want the government to magically lower the price of the barrel?

The price you pay for gas. 1/3 of it goes is the taxes that goes the gov't. 50% of the gas taxes collected is used for the roads.

[gordholio]

The price you pay for gas. 1/3 of it goes is the taxes that goes the gov't. 50% of the gas taxes collected is used for the roads.

That's the theory alright. I don't know how much is really spent on roads though. Seems to be a lot of derelict roads.

[ah802]

The CRTC did, however, again raise the issue of regulating access to the internet. The regulator also opened another separate consultation on Thursday on the traffic-shaping practices of some service providers.

[S_G]

A T1 is old school... OC-192 is where it's at. BAMMMMMMM. ;)
Pfft. OC-768, biatches!

Seriously, though. How the HELL could the CRTC claim CAIP didn't provide sufficient evidence? Bell didn't provide any at all.

[LeeBear]

Pfft. OC-768, biatches!

Seriously, though. How the HELL could the CRTC claim CAIP didn't provide sufficient evidence? Bell didn't provide any at all.

While I'm against Bell the CRTC ruling was correct on this particular matter. Bell doesn't have to prove anything they are the defendant so its up to the plaintiff to prove there case. The 3rd party ISP throttling hasn't gone on long enough to provide any meaningful stats on financial loses and there wasn't an exodus of customers canceling there DSL service so its hard to argue irreparable damage has been done. The only real financial lost the 3rd party ISP has suffered is by buying extra bandwidth they now don't need because of the throttling, which isn't really a lost but an unneeded expense right now.

-LeeBear

[ah802]

CRTC orders Bell to provide numbers and evidence to prove net shaping needed.. and in the meantime I'm hitting 430mB/s on my torrent downloads! Thanks Teksavvy.

Looks like some of this is catching the ears of our southern neighbours, Slash has picked up the this...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080516.wrthrottle16/BNStory/Technology/home