HOLY CRAP! Listeriosis found at SAME Maple Leaf plant....again!

[winner2000]

Wowwwwwweeee...can't believe this. Luckily no new product was sold in the market, but honestly, they just need to blow up that plant and start over again. Unacceptable.

* * *


Listeriosis bacteria found at Toronto plant

BILL CURRY

From Thursday's Globe and Mail

October 8, 2008 at 11:37 PM EDT

OTTAWA — Four new positive tests for listeriosis have been confirmed in samples of meat at the Maple Leaf plant at the centre of the outbreak that has left 20 Canadians dead.

The plant was allowed to reopen on Sept. 17, but no product has so far been allowed to enter the market.

Late Wednesday, federal officials from the Prime Minister's Office, the Privy Council Office and the Canadian Food Inspection Agency met to discuss the new findings that the bacteria is still present in the plant.

Since the plant resumed production, there have been 2,700 product samples and four positive test results for Listeria monocytogenes.
A Maple Leaf Foods worker clad in protective clothing refills cleaner bottles while spraying down equipment on one of the suspect food processing lines at the facility in Toronto.

Paul Mayers, associate vice-president of the CFIA, confirmed the results in a telephone interview with The Globe and Mail.

“We've just received results related to these four positives,” said Mr. Mayers. “The plant is operating. The product isn't reaching the marketplace.

“We will, with Health Canada, conduct an assessment to assess what these findings might mean in terms of the ongoing activities in the plant and whether any additional measures would be necessary in relation to product from that plant. Of course, that assessment has not yet been conducted.”

He said CFIA and Health Canada will now do a full assessment and evaluation of the positive findings.

Mr. Mayers confirmed that the CFIA informed both the Privy Council Office and the Prime Minister's Office about the positive findings and said both agencies are regularly in the loop on new developments related to listeria.

The findings, which were posted last night on the CFIA's website following inquiries from The Globe, come as the public service is under orders not to create waves during the federal election campaign.

Bob Kingston, president of the Agriculture Union representing CFIA inspectors, said he was “flabbergasted” by the positive tests, given the scrutiny the plant is under. “It's mind-boggling. They're cleaning up their place with the whole world watching and they still don't get it right?”

The union leader said the findings underscore his organization's campaign to block efforts to transfer certain food safety responsibilities to industry.

Linda Smith, a spokesperson for Maple Leaf, was reached Wednesday evening. She did not comment immediately and said she would call back, however that call had yet to come at deadline.

The most recent government announcement related to listeriosis was a recall issued Tuesday by CFIA, warning the public not to eat certain Dunn's Famous brand Smoked Meat pouches that were distributed to Costco in Quebec, Ottawa and the Atlantic Provinces.

To date, there have been 20 deaths where listeriosis was the underlying or contributing cause, another three deaths where listeriosis was present and a further six deaths in Ontario that are still under investigation.

The latest development comes as the outbreak has already become an issue in the federal election campaign. Agriculture Minister Gerry Ritz was forced to apologize earlier in the campaign for joking about the issue during an internal government conference call. In that call, Mr. Ritz reportedly said the government was suffering a death by a thousand cuts, “or should I say cold cuts.”

Since the outbreak began, there have also been numerous media reports based on government documents either leaked to the media or obtained through access to information requests showing concern had been expressed internally about the quality of food safety in Canada.

On Sept. 6, Prime Minister Stephen Harper announced an independent investigation into the outbreak of listeria, which traced back to a Maple Leaf meat plant in Toronto. The government has yet to name the head of the probe, but has released terms of reference.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081008.wlisteriasb09/BNStory/National/home

[Bazooka Joe]

This is quite common with listeriosis and was anticipated. Which is why the products have not been released to market and testing is ongoing.

We're not talking about ebola here... Unfortunately though, the court of public opinion will likely force closure of the plant.

On the plus side, I should be able to buy some more cheap maple leaf products in the near future :)

[takethat200210]

I haven't had any kind of cold cut since the outbreak. I've grown used to not having cold cuts. :) Usually, I have it at least 3 - 4 times a week.

[Setz]

This is quite common with listeriosis and was anticipated. Which is why the products have not been released to market and testing is ongoing.

We're not talking about ebola here... Unfortunately though, the court of public opinion will likely force closure of the plant.

On the plus side, I should be able to buy some more cheap maple leaf products in the near future :)

That's disgusting. Why would you eat their products after listeriosis was found not once, but twice?

[Dash]

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA. Those poor bastards.

[jnfr]

lol did anyone see that commercial that the Maple Leafs president made a couple of weeks ago about measures taken to contain the bacteria?

[rfdrfd]

This obviously means the slicing machine wasn't the only machine that is spreading it.

Hope they really did Root Cause and Corrective Action (RCCA) there. They need to look at all equipment and cleaning procedures in where all meat will contact (ie. hopper, slicer, etc)

[jory29]

a spokesperson for Maple Leaf, was reached Wednesday evening. She did not comment immediately and said she would call back, however that call had yet to come at deadline.

This is all so disturbing. Both the listeria incidents, as well as the lack of communication from ML.

I haven't purchased any more cold cuts meats after the first incident, [but was still buying Maple Leaf top dogs and making sure to cook them very well.]

However, after this incident, I won't be trusting ML any time soon. If ever. ML may be cooking something in their kitchens, but I think it's their own goose.

[Blunt]

Listeriosis is much more common than people think.
They found literiosis in 2/3 of hospitals.

It probably was always there.
Now they are just looking harder to find it.

[Bazooka Joe]

That's disgusting. Why would you eat their products after listeriosis was found not once, but twice?

The reason I'll eat their products is precisely because they found listeriosis. It is a very, very hard thing to get rid of, and largely not harmful to the general population. It is clear that they are spending a lot of time and resources on this subject and I feel confident that they will not allow any product to market that would even be close to questionable. I would expect that maple leaf foods is one of the safest companies to purchase from at this exact moment.

On top of that, I'm buying food that will be frozen for long periods of time (kills listeriosis) and then cooked (kills listeriosis). This food is being purchased dirt cheap (I filled my freezer right after the last incident).


Listeriosis is much more common than people think.
They found literiosis in 2/3 of hospitals.

It probably was always there.
Now they are just looking harder to find it.

Exactly. The flu kills thousands every year, but if you had an employee with the flu at a food packaging plant would it be reasonable to boycott their products ad infinitum?

[vladislav]

a spokesperson for Maple Leaf, was reached Wednesday evening. She did not comment immediately and said she would call back, however that call had yet to come at deadline.

This is all so disturbing. Both the listeria incidents, as well as the lack of communication from ML.

I haven't purchased any more cold cuts meats after the first incident, [but was still buying Maple Leaf top dogs and making sure to cook them very well.]

However, after this incident, I won't be trusting ML any time soon. If ever. ML may be cooking something in their kitchens, but I think it's their own goose.

Are you kidding me? Lack of communication? They did more than pretty much any other company in history when it came to this. Listeriosis is not as uncommon as you think, you and me would not even notice it if we ate those meats. This time they found it and stopped it before releasing the food, what more do you want??? Just because ML finds these things and publicizes them doesn't mean that when you switch to different meat you won't be eating listeriosis. If anything you will be oblivious to the fact because nobody does as much inspection.

Why do people buy into this mass craze? Why not think for a second??? it's so simple.

[ephemera]

I feel bad for Maple Leaf Foods but I am never buying their products again.

[George W. Bush]

I have told you that this will show up again!

Some members have said, that it would be safe to start eating crap/processed food again!

I said, STOP - go and eat quality meats from European stores and STOP buying cheap, processed "meats"

It is NOT SAFE!

[JordanN]

There goes another week of no quiznos or giggling tomatoes. :evil:

[danns]

vegan ftw

[Byrns]

That's it, I'm only buying my food from China.

[JordanN]

That's it, I'm only buying my food from China.

Was that a sarcastic comment?

[chrza]

Are you kidding me? Lack of communication? They did more than pretty much any other company in history when it came to this. Listeriosis is not as uncommon as you think, you and me would not even notice it if we ate those meats. This time they found it and stopped it before releasing the food, what more do you want??? Just because ML finds these things and publicizes them doesn't mean that when you switch to different meat you won't be eating listeriosis. If anything you will be oblivious to the fact because nobody does as much inspection.

Why do people buy into this mass craze? Why not think for a second??? it's so simple.

They waited a MONTH before they did anything about it. And in their early reports from their PR, they pathetically tried to weasel their way of responsibility for those who died, claiming that those people at the time people didn't officially died from listeriosis, they had other health problems.

lol, i've heard of XBOX and PS3 fanboys, but never a Maple Leaf Meats fanboy.

[ferkel]

Ya.. the plant is kaput..

[Sprite_TM]

They waited a MONTH before they did anything about it. And in their early reports from their PR, they pathetically tried to weasel their way of responsibility for those who died, claiming that those people at the time people didn't officially died from listeriosis, they had other health problems.

lol, i've heard of XBOX and PS3 fanboys, but never a Maple Leaf Meats fanboy.


LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:lol: i just love RFD, its just so entertaining reading these threads

[Bazooka Joe]

They waited a MONTH before they did anything about it. And in their early reports from their PR, they pathetically tried to weasel their way of responsibility for those who died, claiming that those people at the time people didn't officially died from listeriosis, they had other health problems.

lol, i've heard of XBOX and PS3 fanboys, but never a Maple Leaf Meats fanboy.

Got a source for this? I recall the timeline very differently. I was also very impressed that the company actually went and apologized in both print and TV commercials. Most companies would be concerned about litigation and not do that.

Edit:

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2008/08/26/f-meat-recall-timeline.html

Looks like they recalled within a day of a positive test.

[tonychau]

"Listeria exists in all food plants, all supermarkets and presumably in all kitchens", said Michael McCain, President and CEO. "Our testing protocols are designed to find positive results so we can remediate them immediately. The Bartor Road team has found a very small number of positive results, not unexpectedly, and is reacting exactly according to food safety protocols. While there is no risk to the public, we are behaving in the most conservative way possible, according to the protocols in how these findings are always to be handled."

Can someone explain to me if Listeria is SO common, how come no other products, kitchens (resturants, supermarkets) reported they (CFIA) find Listeria?

[Kasakato]

Can someone explain to me if Listeria is SO common, how come no other products, kitchens (resturants, supermarkets) reported they (CFIA) find Listeria?

Maple Leaf is sampling thousands of items, far more than is ever done anywhere else.

[tonychau]

Right, so other products on the market are not tested/sampled?


Maple Leaf is sampling thousands of items, far more than is ever done anywhere else.

[Kasakato]

Right, so other products on the market are not tested/sampled?

Incorrect, they certainly are sampled, just not to the extent that Maple Leaf is doing. With a larger data set, positive results are more likely to appear.

[bubble.tea]

Thankfully 2for1 Pizza doesn't use their meats. We've been ordering pepperoni/mushroom/tomato pizzas all through this fiasco.

What a bad state of affairs.

[Emancipated]

Listeriosis is much more common than people think.
They found literiosis in 2/3 of hospitals.

It probably was always there.
Now they are just looking harder to find it.

So basically Darwin weeded out those 20 Canadiens? I've eaten some meat in between the outbreak and I haven't fallen ill. Should I worry or do as setz said and go buy some cheap meat on clearance?

[Pyro]

Incorrect, they certainly are sampled, just not to the extent that Maple Leaf is doing. With a larger data set, positive results are more likely to appear.
truth. i worked in qa at a food facility before. they were reducing the amount of sampling they were doing to save money and increase efficiency. some raw ingredients are only sampled twice a year. dont know how often the supplier sampleed and tested but yeah... food isnt handled as safely as anyone would think. cooking is what keeps most people safe

[chrza]

Got a source for this? I recall the timeline very differently. I was also very impressed that the company actually went and apologized in both print and TV commercials. Most companies would be concerned about litigation and not do that.

Edit:

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2008/08/26/f-meat-recall-timeline.html

Looks like they recalled within a day of a positive test.


Ontario health officials knew about some Listeria cases in July, but it was not until last week (Article is from August 25th) that any products were recalled.

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20080824/listeria_expansion_080825/20080825/?hub=TorontoNewHome

If the health officials knew about it and Maple Leaf somehow didn't, then my bad. None the less, at the beginning they were indeed trying to limit their responsibility for the deaths that were caused by listeriosis. I remember watching Maple Leaf's PR lady live on City TV shamefully saying that the coroner's reports didn't declare Listeriosis as the official cause of death for the cases at the time. And that those people died because they had other problems.

Anyways, it's still funny seeing people proudly stating that they will fearlessly continue to eat cheap meat. I guess everyone needs something to believe in.

[serathe]

Darn it. Now the GF won't get deli meat again for a while. :(

I'm still taking my chances lol.

[Kasakato]

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20080824/listeria_expansion_080825/20080825/?hub=TorontoNewHome

If the health officials knew about it and Maple Leaf somehow didn't, then my bad. None the less, at the beginning they were indeed trying to limit their responsibility for the deaths that were caused by listeriosis. I remember watching Maple Leaf's PR lady live on City TV shamefully saying that the coroner's reports didn't declare Listeriosis as the official cause of death for the cases at the time. And that those people died because they had other problems.

Anyways, it's still funny seeing people proudly stating that they will fearlessly continue to eat cheap meat. I guess everyone needs something to believe in.

Listeria monocytogenes will rarely kill people with an average immune system. Most deaths will be caused by a preexisting condition (weakened immune system due to old age, newborns, etc). In cases where the deceased had a preexisting condition, it is likely to take precedence over listeria monocytogenes as the official cause of death (a/k/a a "contributing factor").

[chrza]

Listeria monocytogenes will rarely kill people with an average immune system. Most deaths will be caused by a preexisting condition (weakened immune system due to old age, newborns, etc). In cases where the deceased had a preexisting condition, it is likely to take precedence over listeria monocytogenes as the official cause of death (a/k/a a "contributing factor").

My issue isn't with the coroner's report, rather them trying to weasel out of responsibility, at the time. Not sure what their stance is on those deaths now since they're apologizing all over the place. But, without that contributing factor those people wouldn't have died. So to try to use the coroner's reports in a way to relieve yourself of any responsibility is rather cheap.

[Kasakato]

My issue isn't with the coroner's report, rather them trying to weasel out of responsibility, at the time. Not sure what their stance is on those deaths now since they're apologizing all over the place. But, without that contributing factor those people wouldn't have died. So to try to use the coroner's reports in a way to relieve yourself of any responsibility is rather cheap.

I have not seen that report, would you happen to have a link? Out of context, it was not always clear where the bacteria had come from, perhaps it was very early on?

[chrza]

I have not seen that report, would you happen to have a link? Out of context, it was not always clear where the bacteria had come from, perhaps it was very early on?

Sorry, I don't. I saw it on CityTV when it was broadcast. This was around late August.

[majesus]

The reason I'll eat their products is precisely because they found listeriosis. It is a very, very hard thing to get rid of, and largely not harmful to the general population. It is clear that they are spending a lot of time and resources on this subject and I feel confident that they will not allow any product to market that would even be close to questionable. I would expect that maple leaf foods is one of the safest companies to purchase from at this exact moment.

On top of that, I'm buying food that will be frozen for long periods of time (kills listeriosis) and then cooked (kills listeriosis). This food is being purchased dirt cheap (I filled my freezer right after the last incident).



Exactly. The flu kills thousands every year, but if you had an employee with the flu at a food packaging plant would it be reasonable to boycott their products ad infinitum?
I like your attitude and I agree with you. I am sure it is around more then the general public thinks. Plus, ML probably has the most cleanest, most safest processed food products after this outbreak.



Are you kidding me? Lack of communication? They did more than pretty much any other company in history when it came to this. Listeriosis is not as uncommon as you think, you and me would not even notice it if we ate those meats. This time they found it and stopped it before releasing the food, what more do you want??? Just because ML finds these things and publicizes them doesn't mean that when you switch to different meat you won't be eating listeriosis. If anything you will be oblivious to the fact because nobody does as much inspection.

Why do people buy into this mass craze? Why not think for a second??? it's so simple. +1, well said!


That's it, I'm only buying my food from China. LOL...



truth. i worked in qa at a food facility before. they were reducing the amount of sampling they were doing to save money and increase efficiency. some raw ingredients are only sampled twice a year. dont know how often the supplier sampleed and tested but yeah... food isnt handled as safely as anyone would think. cooking is what keeps most people safe I bet if I saw "the behind the scenes" on how my food is handled/prepared/processed. I would loose my appetite.

[Bazooka Joe]

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20080824/listeria_expansion_080825/20080825/?hub=TorontoNewHome

If the health officials knew about it and Maple Leaf somehow didn't, then my bad.

This is precisely how it would have happened. You would have had people going to doctors/hospitals showing symptoms, then the hospitals would report it to health officials. They would have then started the investigation, which would have lead them to the common thread (maple leaf foods). At that point they inform maple leaf foods, and run tests. Test results come back positive, and products get pulled.


None the less, at the beginning they were indeed trying to limit their responsibility for the deaths that were caused by listeriosis. I remember watching Maple Leaf's PR lady live on City TV shamefully saying that the coroner's reports didn't declare Listeriosis as the official cause of death for the cases at the time. And that those people died because they had other problems.

I didn't see that but I could see how that would impact your thinking. At the time it was probably the best information they had. It's also very true, even in the article you linked they never say that listeriosis killed anyone, they make statements like:

"Of the 11 deaths in Ontario, Listeria has been definitively linked to six of them while five cases are still under investigation to determine the extent the bacteria had on the death."


Anyways, it's still funny seeing people proudly stating that they will fearlessly continue to eat cheap meat. I guess everyone needs something to believe in.

People (me in this case) are saying this because they have looked at the facts and consider the risk to be so low that they move forward. Before you jump on this statement I ask you to consider that risk exists with everything you eat. As long as these particular products are lower in risk than anything else you're eating, there is no benefit to not eating them.

This isn't being done on faith, this is looking at it rationally and deciding that the risk is no higher than buying the same products from any other source.

How would buying something like chicken breast from Maple Leaf foods(not processed in the affected plant), putting it in your freezer for long periods of time and using it to cook and eat with expose someone to risk?

[ragin_pyro]

Can someone explain to me if Listeria is SO common, how come no other products, kitchens (resturants, supermarkets) reported they (CFIA) find Listeria?


Listeria monocytogenes, an aerobic and facultatively anaerobic gram-positive bacillus, can be readily isolated from soil, dust, fertilizer, sewage, stream water, plants, and even processed foods stored at 4°c. This organism is also carried within the intestinal tract of numerous mammals, birds, fish, and crustaceans. Recent epidemiological studies provide strong evidence that both sporadic and common-source outbreaks of listeriosis are food-borne. Despite this pathogen's pervasiveness in the environment, the annual incidence of listeriosis is only 0.7 cases per 100,000.

http://www.med.ufl.edu/biochem/DLPURICH/morelist.html

Lots of bacteria from the soil cause disease. Even the bacteria that live in us, can cause problems if you were to move some of them to a new area on your body.

[Emancipated]

Darn it. Now the GF won't get deli meat again for a while. :(

I'm still taking my chances lol.

You have Maple Leafs in the US? I thought they would have their own plant there.

[vladislav]

Just found out that media did the usual thing.

The samples found are during routine check, apparently it was thousands of samples tested and very a few found, below the average expected! Finding tainted samples means that the system works vs if they didn't find anything it would be more likely that they missed something and not that there is no tainted product.

You know what, I never liked media but this whole incident really makes me upset. They make tools out of people and that's just terrible.

[kiasu]

Notes: I am not trying to start the 'politics', just my own opinion

For those ignorant ppl who bias and against China, how come I dont see them here to start barking like what they did before? LOL. If this happens in China, those ppl will start commenting how bad and worse China is. LOL.

Anyway, this Maple Leaf brand product is MIC too but
MIC = Made In Canada :lol:

Conclusion, this kind of indicent happens everywhere around the word and not just China.

[Chrispy]

Just found out that media did the usual thing.

The samples found are during routine check, apparently it was thousands of samples tested and very a few found, below the average expected! Finding tainted samples means that the system works vs if they didn't find anything it would be more likely that they missed something and not that there is no tainted product.

You know what, I never liked media but this whole incident really makes me upset. They make tools out of people and that's just terrible.

+1....bloody media.

[serathe]

You have Maple Leafs in the US? I thought they would have their own plant there.

No. GF is in Canada. I will also be shortly. For a little while anyways.