Banned BB Bold PIN/IMEI. Not warranty-swap eligible either! Seller: oth

[Hidea]

I recently purchased a Blackberry Bold from a member here on RFD.
I agree that the cause of my problem is due to my own stupidity. I was too naive. I gave the seller the benefit of the doubt.

The reason I mentioned warraty swap, is because if a phone is carrier branded, I would fully expect that the phone will be covered under the carriers warranty. I've purchased a few Rogers phones from thirdparty sellers, and I have warranted them in the past without any issue whatsoever.

Long story short, here are the issues with the Bold:

1) Defective Volume Keys - NOT MENTIONED BY SELLER:
This is something that was never mentioned by the seller. Not through PM, not through the BST post, and was never mentioned verbally during the time of sale. Now, the seller is pointing finger at me. He said I could've been the one that cause the issue. I hardly use the phone! I noticed it when I was trying to lower the incoming call's volume, and the keys wouldn't work. I tried adjusting the volume of the ringtones (Media > Ringtones) through the volume keys, it wouldn't work. If you do a bit of Google search, the issue with the volume keys will give you a few results.

Here's one: http://forums.crackberry.com/showthread.php?t=89710. In case that's not enough, here's another: http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-9000-series-discussion-bold/154126-defective-volume-buttons-bold.html


2) Banned PIN - NOT MENTIONED BY SELLER
I wish I could've tested the PIN during the transaction, but I didn't have a Blackberry Data plan. I had an iPhone data plan. The Bold can take me to pages on the Internet (Browser works -OK-), except PIN wouldn't work. Rogers' network won't respond to HRT requests. The HRT table is empty.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3276/3047825578_2c9ca8f7f9.jpg

3) IMEI is "spotty" - NOT MENTIONED BY SELLER
Rogers won't replace the device, since the hardware "isn't registered" under their database. Even though the bootscreen, as well as the hardware says Rogers. It's clearly a Rogers device, but it might've been a very very early version of the device. This wasn't mentioned at all at the original BST thread.
I did a bit of digging around, asking people (within Rogers & RIM, the people with great knowledge), and they all suspected this is an earlier version of a Rogers device. Or it could just be simply stolen. I'm not going to make any accusation, for now.

4) Misleading Cosmetic Condition - PARTIAL MENTION
I really don't care how the phone would look, as long as there's no scratches on the screen, or the keys on the keyboard are popping out. But, since the seller sort lied to me about the condition of the phone, I thought I'll mention it. Through PM, the seller only mention that there is one "scuff" on one of the corners of the phone. But upon closer inspection, there are TWO.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3221/3046989531_6a738b97aa.jpg
He never mentioned about this one.

a closer look at that particular second "scuff"
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3177/3047825784_7469d37435.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3008/3047824512_b3db6833ae.jpg
here's the one he noted when we did the transaction. To me, that's more like a dent, than a scuff. Scuff on a plastic == minor scratches, not what seems like plastic grated against concrete.


It really irks me when he failed to mention the second scuff. Truthfully, I don't care about the second scuff, but he pissed me off, so, I thought I might as well mention it.

What's the best course of action for me? Seller refused to do a refund, claiming "It's unfair for me to have a Bold that doesn't have working volume keys", but it wasn't working to begin with!

[McLaren__F1]

whos the user/member that sold you the blackberry?

[mcg]

First thing you should do is post the member's info, then we can look into his history and the situation you are in now.

We can then better understand the circumstances, and probably arrive at a swift conclusion, considering the things you've presented already.

Your phone looks like a pre-production model... try to check somehow.
>> one thing I noticed from my experience with preproductions and retail ones.. is the screen type. The preproduction models had a much better screen and viewing angles than the retail units RIM rolls out now. If you can view the screen brightly at all angles, especially at the left and right extremities, and can spot a noticeable red "hue" on the screen, then it's most likely a preprod.

[Hidea]

Thanks for those who are trying to help! I've sent you PMs detailing the member's name.

At this moment, I'm still trying to figure out what to do, and what's the best course of action. Until then I'll send those who's itnerested to know the member's name who sold this Bold, via PM.

Once again, thank you for your interest in helping out!


EDIT: I've been calling people, and asking whether the PIN/IMEI are legit. I even managed to get another confirmation from another RIM employee (2 RIM employees now!) that this unit is banned, and have a high chance of being a stolen unit.

[McLaren__F1]

Distinguishing Pre-Production Units?

http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-9000-series-discussion-bold/150968-distinguishing-pre-production-units.html

[Hidea]

I'm about to leave the seller a negative feedback, and his username is "oth".

Here's what I did wrong:
I didn't test the device on the spot (although the seller did offer it), because:
1) I have an iPhone, didn't have anything with me to eject my SIM (someone make a keychain friendly tool? :P)
2) I didn't have a BB Data plan at the time. I do now.

There wasn't much I could do with those two reasons I mentioned.

[thechampion116]

I'm about to leave the seller a negative feedback, and his username is "oth".

Here's what I did wrong:
I didn't test the device on the spot (although the seller did offer it), because:
1) I have an iPhone, didn't have anything with me to eject my SIM
2) I didn't have a BB Data plan at the time. I do now.

There wasn't much I could do with those two reasons I mentioned.

please do so to make sure other members like myself are aware of him.

He sounds very fishy as he failed to mention multitude of errors that wouldn't occur overnight through a few days of adult usage. I agree that those are more like dents than scoffs.

keep trying to pm 'oth' maybe he's willing to give you back some of your money for not giving all the infor about the phone.

[Hidea]

Hrm… right. After this, I'm hoping people will learn from my mistakes:

• ALWAYS have your SIM card ready for testing. If you have an iPhone (like I do), bring something to eject your SIM out of the phone. Don't be ***** like me.
• Be sure to ask for some sort of Proof of Purchase (see it for yourself, or ask for a copy). This will grant you warranty from whomever the carrier that sold the phone. Tell the seller that in case anything happens to the phone, the seller must be willing to assist you to get a warranty replacement.
• If you don't have a Blackberry Data Plan on your account, get someone that has one, bring that person with you, and have that person's SIM card tested on the device. If the seller is kind enough to let you use a bit of his data plan, that's a sign he's a great seller. Nothing to hide.
• And for ****s sake, press every single damn keys. Open up every single ports/slots/covers. See for damages that will potentially ruining your experience with the device in the future. I didn't do this.
• Do a little bit of research on Google. See if there's known issues with the device. Reviews don't often mention this. Do a Google search of "[Device Name]" + "Defect". See if you can gather any info about the defects that you have. I didn't do this either.
• If you're like me, and you don't care about minor physical scratches (slight chips on bezel, worn leather backings) it's fine. But everyone's definition of "MINT" or "9/10" quality might be different. If you're more picky than me, then obviously, do a through check. But can't expect that from every device.


Just a few little tips I can give you based on my experience. ;P

[mcg]

Distinguishing Pre-Production Units?

http://www.blackberryforums.com/general-9000-series-discussion-bold/150968-distinguishing-pre-production-units.html

Don't know if that thread is actually true, the sticker can be ripped off the unit, which makes it perfectly the same in appearance as a retail unit.

As for the startup message... noo idea :S

[Hidea]

Don't know if that thread is actually true, the sticker can be ripped off the unit, which makes it perfectly the same in appearance as a retail unit.

As for the startup message... noo idea :S

Or just a new cover. But the cover seems pretty clean to me, to be honest.
I've had a pre-production unit, and the cover was plastic, not leather.

[Gogi]

Hidea, check the IMEI # on the back. If you want, message the IMEI to me over PM and I'll let you know whether you have a pre-production unit, as it sure seems like it (the volume keys problem is pre-dominantly a problem with pre-production units). When you take out the battery, are there any stickers saying "Property of Research In Motion" ? Those devices are usually used to perform software tests/error reports (mostly given to RIM employees) at RIM and are pre-productions.

The reason you have no service books inside your Host Routing Table is because the device has been banned from RIM's database. As far as the banned PIN, message me and I'll explain how to get it unblocked (or at least take a shot at it :) ).

[Gogi]

Actually, the first picture already answered the question. Does that trackball have a significant amount of dirt on it, or is it indeed a greenish color ? 90% of pre-production bolds came with almost identical trackballs as the one pictured above. A standard Bold's trackball should look like this :

http://ramobile.eu/gallery/BlackBerryBold.png

[Hidea]

Actually, the first picture already answered the question. Does that trackball have a significant amount of dirt on it, or is it indeed a greenish color ? 90% of pre-production bolds came with almost identical trackballs as the one pictured above. A standard Bold's trackball should look like this :

http://ramobile.eu/gallery/BlackBerryBold.png

Yea, it does have greenish hue.

[oth]

okay first of all buddy i never used my pin when i had the phone therefore when i bought it off another member off RFD i did not know that some bolds have the pin disabled. The pin is not banned, its just the pre release versions of the bold that u have. its not my fault that i didnt know the pin wasnt working? u never asked. as for the button, it was working 100%, and now after u tell me they dont work when u said u didnt wanna try it on the spot? don't make me look bad for mistakes u made. i have never ever had a negative comment about business i have made with anyone.

[oth]

please do so to make sure other members like myself are aware of him.

He sounds very fishy as he failed to mention multitude of errors that wouldn't occur overnight through a few days of adult usage. I agree that those are more like dents than scoffs.

keep trying to pm 'oth' maybe he's willing to give you back some of your money for not giving all the infor about the phone.

absolutely not. i told him that there was a dent on the top right and he said he doesnt care at all anyways about cosmetic condition... pft bro ur sad. dont cry because u didnt do ur research on bolds. once again, i do not have data therefore i didnt know the pin was not working as i bought it just to use it as a phone.

[Hidea]

okay first of all buddy i never used my pin when i had the phone therefore when i bought it off another member off RFD i did not know that some bolds have the pin disabled. The pin is not banned, its just the pre release versions of the bold that u have. its not my fault that i didnt know the pin wasnt working? u never asked. as for the button, it was working 100%, and now after u tell me they dont work when u said u didnt wanna try it on the spot? don't make me look bad for mistakes u made. i have never ever had a negative comment about business i have made with anyone.

Oh c'mon… i called you and told you that the buttons weren't working. And your reply was that you never really used the keys! How did you know it was 100% working?

Sure, point out my bad mistakes. I think I've already listed all the mistakes I made. I've been very transparent about it.

In fact, I've sent a copy of the PM exchange you (oth) and I made to the mod (nsx).

Your failure to mention that the Bold (oh, so NOW you know…) is a pre-release device, that's something. How do we know you're not hiding the fact it's a pre-production unit from the thread that you made?


Secondly, as mentioned here, pre-production Bolds have volume keys that often malfunction. Which explains the situation that I have.

I don't understand why the IMEI is banned. For all we know, it could be stolen!

[mcg]

Actually, the first picture already answered the question. Does that trackball have a significant amount of dirt on it, or is it indeed a greenish color ? 90% of pre-production bolds came with almost identical trackballs as the one pictured above. A standard Bold's trackball should look like this :

http://ramobile.eu/gallery/BlackBerryBold.png

I know you aren't trying to spew BS, but the trackball colour has nothing to do with it.

My new one came as pure white as you pointed out but as I used it more and more it is turning into a darker colour. Quite natural you can say from the dirt buildup... and I even clean it regularly with alcohol =/.

[Hidea]

I just don't understand, how hard is it be to give me a refund of my money? :P

1) The physical condition of the device is still the same. Still has the same scuffs. No new scuffs added. I can take more photos to show that the second scuff has similar (if not the same) consistency as the one on the top right corner.

2) As you mentioned, you know this is a pre-production unit. So, the volume keys bound to fail. Not something I did.

3) You get the same Bold that you sold me, with all the other crap that you gave me. Nothing more, nothing less.

4) If it's time that you're worried about, think about how much time I spent trying to figure out if his Bold's PIN is banned or not. Oh, and the number of calls I made to Rogers to get a warranty swap going.


Remember, I wouldn't even made this thread if I could swap the Bold in the first place. The fact that this is a Rogers device, and Rogers said they can't find the IMEI in the database, that's reallllyy dodgy. If I could've gotten the swap, none of this would be an issue.

I think you should refund my money, and then you can deal with the guy who sold this Bold to you. So you see it from my end as well.

[Gogi]

I know you aren't trying to spew BS, but the trackball colour has nothing to do with it.


I don't think you've ever seen pre-production devices. The trackball that Hidea has on his device was never white to begin with. It's got nothing to do with dirt, it's the actual colour of the trackball.

[mcg]

I actually have, but I guess I did not think of that... pretty interesting.

[JBlue]

if oth was an honest seller he should refund. However OP bare some of the blame. He should of checked if the pin was valid before the transaction. If would be different if the seller states YES it is working when it is not. Did the seller say selling "As Is"?

<fake edit> I just realize seller has ZERO feedback. Good luck getting your money back.

[Hidea]

if oth was an honest seller he should refund. However OP bare some of the blame. He should of checked if the pin was valid before the transaction. If would be different if the seller states YES it is working when it is not. Did the seller say selling "As Is"?

<fake edit> I just realize seller has ZERO feedback. Good luck getting your money back.

Oh no, I understand the mistakes I made. I totally do.

No, he never stated "as is". Not over the phone (we've only talked over the phone about where and what time we're meeting). He did mention "gimme a call if there's anything" or something like that after I handed him the money (he handed the phone to me first).

Oh well, I think it's safe to assume I've lost $475.

RFD only shows the amount of positive feedback you have. If you have 1 positive feedback, and a negative, you have 0 positive feedback. I was told by a mod to leave him a negative feedback. So, I did.