Advantage of an EU passport? [Archive] - RedFlagDeals.com Forums

nalababe

Oct 23rd, 2009, 05:15 AM

Typically you have to apply before a certain age for the passport; otherwise, it is not as simple a process.

The advantage is that technically you are a citizen of that country. That means that travel throughout Europe is much easier, you can get a job in those countries without issue.

Now, these do not apply to you as non-citizen.

We have that scenario as my wife was born in England. Keeps here English passport. We had our kids get a British Passport...it just gives them more options later in life.

Seahawk

Oct 26th, 2009, 04:01 AM

My wife's father was a British citizen when she was born, but I have been told that she can apply for an EU passport.

Was your wife's father married to her mother? I am a British Citizen with illigitimate daughters. I was going to get my children passports but was told I only had till their 18th birthdays to apply. Their was a hefty fee involved around $1000 each so i didn't bother.

They have different rules for British mothers they can pass on their citizenship even if they aren't married.

slowpoke

Oct 26th, 2009, 07:28 AM

kostek - If I were you, I'd be pushing your wife to get moving on it. It's a very valuable thing to have. In the meantime, have your father-in-law search for any kind of official documents such as birth certificate etc.

bilibulu

Oct 26th, 2009, 01:58 PM

Get it!

I have my Portuguese passport. I pull it out every time I go to Europe. It's time-saving at the immigration!

Ebola

Oct 26th, 2009, 03:56 PM

Yay!

Citizenship of convenience!

Tijuana

Oct 27th, 2009, 12:12 AM

You can work there also

Pavel

Oct 27th, 2009, 10:55 PM

Have a look here on the myths of of a EU passport:

http://www.euimmigration.org/eu_passport.html

Myth I: It is a common misperception to believe that there is an "EU Passport" which cover all EU member countries. An "EU Passport" is only a term used to describe a passport from any EU country and does not exists in reality. Any citizen from any EU member country have same rights to travel visa free within EU / Schengen and to work in any EU country of their choice.

Myth II: Being and "EU citizen" and "EU resident" is the same. This is not the case. An EU citizen is an individual who has a passport from one of the EU countries. An EU resident can be an individual who has obtained the right to work and live in one of the EU countries, but who still holds the citizenship of his or her home country.

In order for an individual to take advantage of all the benefits of EU, he or she would want to become a citizen of any EU country by obtaining a second passport. The process of obtaining citizenship with an EU country is a formal process. Individuals most frequently obtain a second citizenship, also called "Dual Nationality", based upon family relationships, marriage, or investment. However, obtaining legal residency through work or studying can also make the citizenship process easier at a later stage. The advantage is that you are residing in the country you want to live in.

In summary. There is no EU passport. Each country within the EU issues its own passports to its own citizens, it is just that they are all the same colour and allow movement within the EU.

Pete_Coach

Oct 28th, 2009, 07:25 AM

Yay!

Citizenship of convenience!
:!: Exactly:!:

Have a look here on the myths of of a EU passport:

http://www.euimmigration.org/eu_passport.html

In summary. There is no EU passport. Each country within the EU issues its own passports to its own citizens, it is just that they are all the same colour and allow movement within the EU.
I have been traveling to EU Countries for work (and pleasure) regularily for the past 15 years. I see no benefit to having a passport from a EU Country other than when first entering the EU. After that, I pass through airports and Countries like everyone else.
Yes, if you want to work there or stay longer you do not need a visa but, will you really be doing that? Even if the Wife gets a passport from her native Country, you don't have one so, what's the advantage? She can stay and you can't?
As for getting through immigration quicker, I find getting through immigration in EU Countries quite fast. Nothing like Toronto :lol:

bilibulu

Oct 28th, 2009, 10:12 AM

Yay!

Citizenship of convenience!
There is more to it than simply citizenship of convenience.

A lot of the usefulness of a second or third or, in my case, fourth passport lies in the fact that the user can be relatively free from the grip from the Big Brothers. I am not going to elaborate too much in a public internet forum because a lot of the usefulness of multiple citizenship are viewed as illegal by some authorities. But getting another citizenship opens the door to the possibilities of reaping some of these benefits, financially or not.

Ebola

Oct 28th, 2009, 11:07 AM

There is more to it than simply citizenship of convenience.

A lot of the usefulness of a second or third or, in my case, fourth passport lies in the fact that the user can be relatively free from the grip from the Big Brothers. I am not going to elaborate too much in a public internet forum because a lot of the usefulness of multiple citizenship are viewed as illegal by some authorities. But getting another citizenship opens the door to the possibilities of reaping some of these benefits, financially or not.

And how is that not using the citizenship that most advantages you to your convenience?

I see it all the time, someone states the live abroad, and presents a Canadian passport so that they enter by right and avoid immigration questions, but their passport has no travel history in it whatsoever. Suspicion raised. Upon further questioning another passport (or two or three) are produced , not only heightening suspicions, but showing that they never use their Canadian passport except to enter Canada.

It's just as you said, a use of any given citizenship to enable minimal scrutiny by authorities. Which means in effect you are a citizen of whatever country you are legally able to feel like , whenever it suits you best.

It's garbage.

bilibulu

Oct 28th, 2009, 01:11 PM

And how is that not using the citizenship that most advantages you to your convenience?

It is very true that I'm using the citizenship to my convenience. But I said there is MORE to it, didn't I.

I see it all the time, someone states the live abroad, and presents a Canadian passport so that they enter by right and avoid immigration questions, but their passport has no travel history in it whatsoever. Suspicion raised. Upon further questioning another passport (or two or three) are produced , not only heightening suspicions, but showing that they never use their Canadian passport except to enter Canada.

Why is suspicion raised? If the person rarely travels, the passport would have no stamps in it.:confused: Why would holding 3 passports raise suspicion? There are a lot of immigrants in Canada and they mostly hold more than just the Canadian passport. And Canada allows this. And what's wrong with only using the Canadian passport to enter Canada? I'm not very proud of being a Canadian and I don't always use my Canadian passport when I travel.

It's garbage.

Yes, this border crossing thing is garbage. Just another excuse for the Big Brothers and customs trolls to invade the privacy of innocent civilians in the name of protecting the country.:rolleyes::eek::mad:

petaling108

Oct 28th, 2009, 08:12 PM

You can work there also

Your children can study in universities there for almost free or few euros per year.
Canadian pays 25000$ per yr for UK university education.
I know a former Kosovo refugee naturalised in Sweden studying for free and given grant by the swedish govt to study in the UK.
The same Kosovo refugee in Canada even though naturalised would not fare as well.

heymikey

Oct 28th, 2009, 08:26 PM

I know a former Kosovo refugee naturalised in Sweden studying for free and given grant by the swedish govt to study in the UK.
The same Kosovo refugee in Canada even though naturalised would not fare as well.
But compared to the US, paying $2000 per semester is better than nothing. Europe just happens to be more socialist than we are. Maybe we need to fully socialize higher education as well.

IceBlueShoes12

Oct 28th, 2009, 11:05 PM

:!: Exactly:!:

I have been traveling to EU Countries for work (and pleasure) regularily for the past 15 years. I see no benefit to having a passport from a EU Country other than when first entering the EU. After that, I pass through airports and Countries like everyone else.
Yes, if you want to work there or stay longer you do not need a visa but, will you really be doing that? Even if the Wife gets a passport from her native Country, you don't have one so, what's the advantage? She can stay and you can't?
As for getting through immigration quicker, I find getting through immigration in EU Countries quite fast. Nothing like Toronto :lol:

You nailed it.

Man the stupid "general" group in immigration that we have here is stupid. No where else do you get treated like a 2nd class citizen.
Although in Europe the "foreigner" line was shorter and quicker. :D

IMO, dual passports shouldn't be allowed. It's 1 or the other. It's a loophole that people exploit and COULD be used for something illegal. Not saying everyone does but never know.
You travel on 1 passport, that's it.

But that would mean govts. would have to do work to make sure it works. :lol:

Hairball

Oct 29th, 2009, 10:25 PM

It is very true that I'm using the citizenship to my convenience. But I said there is MORE to it, didn't I.

Why is suspicion raised? If the person rarely travels, the passport would have no stamps in it.:confused: Why would holding 3 passports raise suspicion? There are a lot of immigrants in Canada and they mostly hold more than just the Canadian passport. And Canada allows this. And what's wrong with only using the Canadian passport to enter Canada? I'm not very proud of being a Canadian and I don't always use my Canadian passport when I travel.

Yes, this border crossing thing is garbage. Just another excuse for the Big Brothers and customs trolls to invade the privacy of innocent civilians in the name of protecting the country.:rolleyes::eek::mad:

How would there not be suspicion? Of course dual citizenship is legal in Canada, and indeed fairly common. But if you have multiple passports it makes it harder for the border officer to know where you have been, and know possible threats or what you might be bringing into the country.

I've never had any major issues with Canadian border officials though, they seem to do their job professionally and effectively.

bilibulu

Oct 29th, 2009, 11:09 PM

How would there not be suspicion? Of course dual citizenship is legal in Canada, and indeed fairly common. But if you have multiple passports it makes it harder for the border officer to know where you have been, and know possible threats or what you might be bringing into the country.
It's actually none of their business where I have been if I'm coming back to Canada with a Canadian passport. I have every right to enter this country as a citizen. As for customs, they just have to take my words for it and if they don't, they can do a secondary search. That's it.

And, knowing where I have been doesn't mean they know what I have brought back. Again, this customs thing is just a tool that Big Brother governments use to invade the privacy of innocent civilians in the name of protection of the country.

I usually travel with the Canadian passport only, if I'm going on a short weekend trip to one or two countries. But if I'm going on a longer trip, I'd travel with more than one passport because Canadian passport don't give me visa-free travel to Russia, Burkina Faso, Togo, Ghana (My Hong Kong passport does), Iran, Kiribati (My Australian passport does), Brazil (My Portuguese passport does)

I've never had any major issues with Canadian border officials though, they seem to do their job professionally and effectively.

I wonder how often you travel. My experience is that the Canadian CBSAs are mostly quite dumb. If you're within their "low-risk" stereotype, they won't even take a glance at you. But if you're not, like me, going to Europe or Asai for a weekend for fun, they would think that I'm a drug mule... And they would exercise the biggest power trip and search everything, or ask very invasive questions. It is totally unnecessary. On the other hand, customs officials in Europe and Asia are a lot more courteous and polite. Even if they want to search you, they say please and thank you and sorry for inconvenience.

One time, I lied and used my Portuguese passport to enter and pretended to be a tourist when I came back from Portugal, holding a return ticket from Lisbon (because I would be going there again in 2 weeks). No questions asked. Hehe, got my GST refunds as a tourist (I've a Portuguese address).

IceBlueShoes12

Oct 30th, 2009, 03:01 AM

It's actually none of their business where I have been if I'm coming back to Canada with a Canadian passport. I have every right to enter this country as a citizen. As for customs, they just have to take my words for it and if they don't, they can do a secondary search. That's it.

And, knowing where I have been doesn't mean they know what I have brought back. Again, this customs thing is just a tool that Big Brother governments use to invade the privacy of innocent civilians in the name of protection of the country.

I usually travel with the Canadian passport only, if I'm going on a short weekend trip to one or two countries. But if I'm going on a longer trip, I'd travel with more than one passport because Canadian passport don't give me visa-free travel to Russia, Burkina Faso, Togo, Ghana (My Hong Kong passport does), Iran, Kiribati (My Australian passport does), Brazil (My Portuguese passport does)

I wonder how often you travel. My experience is that the Canadian CBSAs are mostly quite dumb. If you're within their "low-risk" stereotype, they won't even take a glance at you. But if you're not, like me, going to Europe or Asai for a weekend for fun, they would think that I'm a drug mule... And they would exercise the biggest power trip and search everything, or ask very invasive questions. It is totally unnecessary. On the other hand, customs officials in Europe and Asia are a lot more courteous and polite. Even if they want to search you, they say please and thank you and sorry for inconvenience.

One time, I lied and used my Portuguese passport to enter and pretended to be a tourist when I came back from Portugal, holding a return ticket from Lisbon (because I would be going there again in 2 weeks). No questions asked. Hehe, got my GST refunds as a tourist (I've a Portuguese address).

Fair enough. It makes sense, but its obvious why the flags go up.

How many passports do you have? Sounds like you have a whole pack like trading cards :lol:

You want crazy border officials? Try passing through Miami as a Hispanic. US border agents thing EVERYONE wants to stay...
That is 1 airport I will NEVER set foot in... The stories I hear...

Hairball

Oct 30th, 2009, 09:05 AM

It's actually none of their business where I have been if I'm coming back to Canada with a Canadian passport. I have every right to enter this country as a citizen. As for customs, they just have to take my words for it and if they don't, they can do a secondary search. That's it.

And, knowing where I have been doesn't mean they know what I have brought back. Again, this customs thing is just a tool that Big Brother governments use to invade the privacy of innocent civilians in the name of protection of the country.

I usually travel with the Canadian passport only, if I'm going on a short weekend trip to one or two countries. But if I'm going on a longer trip, I'd travel with more than one passport because Canadian passport don't give me visa-free travel to Russia, Burkina Faso, Togo, Ghana (My Hong Kong passport does), Iran, Kiribati (My Australian passport does), Brazil (My Portuguese passport does)

I wonder how often you travel. My experience is that the Canadian CBSAs are mostly quite dumb. If you're within their "low-risk" stereotype, they won't even take a glance at you. But if you're not, like me, going to Europe or Asai for a weekend for fun, they would think that I'm a drug mule... And they would exercise the biggest power trip and search everything, or ask very invasive questions. It is totally unnecessary. On the other hand, customs officials in Europe and Asia are a lot more courteous and polite. Even if they want to search you, they say please and thank you and sorry for inconvenience.

One time, I lied and used my Portuguese passport to enter and pretended to be a tourist when I came back from Portugal, holding a return ticket from Lisbon (because I would be going there again in 2 weeks). No questions asked. Hehe, got my GST refunds as a tourist (I've a Portuguese address).

So you have 4 passports? Now that is sure convenient, how much as a citizen of each do you feel? ;) Keep in mind I am not against the concept of multiple citizenship, but I'm just not surprised that there are sometimes issues if you have many.

You must have had an interesting family history in order to get that many passports.

bilibulu

Oct 30th, 2009, 09:21 AM

So you have 4 passports? Now that is sure convenient, how much as a citizen of each do you feel? ;) Keep in mind I am not against the concept of multiple citizenship, but I'm just not surprised that there are sometimes issues if you have many.

You must have had an interesting family history in order to get that many passports.

Yes, I could have 5 if I want to. I let my British National Overseas passport expire without renewing.

No. I don't feel I belong to any country. Patriotism is a scam that politicians use to control their citizens. I travel about 2-3 times each month and these passports come in handy. And as I said before, there are some things that I do with my multi-citizenship that is kind of illegal in some countries (eg Canada) but legal in some. Won't elaborate here because it's against the T&C of RFD to discuss or encourage illegal activities.;)

bilibulu

Oct 30th, 2009, 09:24 AM

You want crazy border officials? Try passing through Miami as a Hispanic. US border agents thing EVERYONE wants to stay...
That is 1 airport I will NEVER set foot in... The stories I hear...

The US only cares about who you are, whether you're a terrorist etc.
Canada only cares about what you bought overseas. They are so petty that they want to collect every dime of taxes.

Both countries have rude immigration/customs trolls who love powertrips.

Ebola

Oct 31st, 2009, 06:04 PM

The US only cares about who you are, whether you're a terrorist etc.
Canada only cares about what you bought overseas. They are so petty that they want to collect every dime of taxes.

Both countries have rude immigration/customs trolls who love powertrips.

Again another nice broad stroke of generalization, crafted to sound impressive and demean as many groups as possible at once.

For anyone who cares to read on:

All border agencies have two streams to be concerned with:

The movement of people.
The movement of goods.

Often the two intermingle.

If you are entering Canada as a Canadian citizen (i guess that depends how you feel like that day for some people), then as has been so gleefully pointed out, CBSA cannot deny you entry to Canada (meaning your movement as a person , ie immigration) You can be detained etc, but at the end of the day, under the Constitution/Charter/IRPA you are entering Canada, be it on your own free movement, or in handcuffs being transported somewhere.

So yes, all the questions will as a result revolve around any goods in your possession.

If you are going to be arrested under the customs act,or have some sort of seizure or fine, it has to do with the goods you have, unless you have a warrant from somewhere, or you've comitted some sort of criminal code offence and you will be arrested and charged by under the CC by CBSA accordingly.

If you were entering Canada as a non-Canadian, you get much the same questions as you would entering the US for immigration reasons. Such as employment status, ties to your home country, exact purpose and details of your trip to Canada etc.

Sgt_Strider

Oct 31st, 2009, 10:51 PM

This is kind of the same situation that my two younger brothers were in. My mom had US citizenship when she married my father. About 15 years ago, my parents filed some paperwork to help my two younger brothers acquire their US citizenships. Both of them now have dual US-Canadian citizenships. Supposedly this was done to give them more options further down the line. Both of them are now in their early 20s and who knows where they'll end up in 3-5 years' time.

Sgt_Strider

Oct 31st, 2009, 10:59 PM

So you have 4 passports? Now that is sure convenient, how much as a citizen of each do you feel? ;) Keep in mind I am not against the concept of multiple citizenship, but I'm just not surprised that there are sometimes issues if you have many.

You must have had an interesting family history in order to get that many passports.

My two younger brothers have dual US-Canadian citizenships and they still identify themselves as Canadians. Trust me, I know, because I travel with them whenever we go to Boston or NYC and people ask us where we're from. You'd be surprised at how jealous some people can get over the fact that they both have dual US-Canadian citizenships. It's a convenience I'm sure most people would take if they have the chance to get it.

bilibulu

Nov 1st, 2009, 06:14 AM

My two younger brothers have dual US-Canadian citizenships and they still identify themselves as Canadians. Trust me, I know, because I travel with them whenever we go to Boston or NYC and people ask us where we're from. You'd be surprised at how jealous some people can get over the fact that they both have dual US-Canadian citizenships. It's a convenience I'm sure most people would take if they have the chance to get it.

But if I had both Canadian and US citizenships, I would renounce my US citizenship and only keep the Canadian one!!!

The US citizenship is not only useless, it carries such a heavy tax liability! Even if a US citizen (or even Green Card holder) doesn't live in the US, doesn't work in the US, have nothing generating income from the US, s/he still has US tax liabilities. This is extremely unfair.

US and Philippines citizenships are the two I would avoid like plague.

nauru

Nov 1st, 2009, 06:42 PM

Indeed, the US passport is a horrible thing to have -- basically as long as you have it the US government claims the right to forcibly confiscate your wealth no matter where in the world you choose to live or work. Unreal.

Bilibulu it's refreshing to see someone else who shares my views on the inherent folly of patriotism/nationalism, and the immense benefits from holding multiple passports. I was born in Canada and I only have two passports (1 Canadian 1 EU) but I've already experienced substantial benefits to my personal liberty, professional mobility, and psychological sovereignty from any state or coercive public collective.

When I received that second passport my views on the Canadian government, the role of the state and the rights of the individual changed dramatically. Now I am always on the lookout for opportunities to obtain a third (and fourth) passport at relatively low cost and with minimal long term liabilities attached.

afzan

Nov 1st, 2009, 09:17 PM

I think your wife had to apply for a British citizenship/passport before she turned 18..

cannon_fodder

Nov 3rd, 2009, 05:49 PM

My curiosity was piqued when someone mentioned children attending university in Europe at a very low cost.

I was born in the UK and have a British passport. My daughter was born in Canada - is she entitled to study in the EU at a rate similar to those born there?

nauru

Nov 24th, 2009, 12:18 PM

If you get her a British passport (which shouldn't be a huge problem since you were born there) then she will be able to study anywhere in the EU and be treated as a local student -- ie no international fees, eligible for all local government scholarships, etc.

The exception is studying in Britain. British universities decide on the amount of fees you pay based on where you have been habitually resident for the prior three years; citizenship/passport is not considered. So one has to reside in an EU country for 3 years immediately preceding for reasons other than education in order to get local student treatment in the UK, regardless of nationality.

Of course, it is in theory possible to lie about your address and where you've been living, in order to save many thousands of dollars. Just find a friend or relative who's been living in Europe for some time. British universities do not generally check into this. But it's up to you how you want to use this information.

wirebound

Nov 24th, 2009, 04:12 PM

I was born in the UK but am not a resident there. I would have needed to have paid international student fees if I went to school there.

I've also studied in Sweden, I was on an exchange so I'm not sure what the fees would have been otherwise (they don't really have tuition fees but its complicated..) but I did have to apply for a residence permit there, as does anyone from inside the EU. Canadian citizens just need to get it before they study there, I needed to apply for it within three months of my arrival.

In my experience, the only real benefit is that I could work in the EU and I often get through the line faster at customs. My kids will be getting one when they hit their teens.

Cost wise though, the passports are expensive so right now I just have my Canadian passport. I can't remember the exact price, but my kids' Canadian passports were under $50 and a British one that would have been valid for the same time period were more than double that.