Toronto won the first ballot for 2015 Pan Am

[Sammmy]

Yahhhh new gym @ UTSC!

http://www.thestar.com/breakingnews/article/722389--toronto-wins-2015-pan-am-games?bn=1

[AcidBomber]

Yahhhh new gym @ UTSC!

http://www.thestar.com/breakingnews/article/722389--toronto-wins-2015-pan-am-games?bn=1


ya but too bad current students wont be able to enjoy the new facility.

[Sammmy]

ya but too bad current students wont be able to enjoy the new facility.

well you could buy a discount alumni membership to use the gum

[flexwong]

yeah!!!!!!!! more debt for the city!!!!! on the plus side, i'll hopefully have escaped Toronto by 2015. the only other positive i think is the fact that Miller won't be around to screw it up.

[andrec2g]

Oh no, many more new taxes will be added upon torontonian before the game :mad:

[Squiggles]

Now I really do hope the legends are true and the world is ending in 2012 so I won't have to see the mess they make of this one.


On a side note: What the hell are the Pan Am games? Does anybody watch them or care?

[Paolo]

congratz toronto for winning the Panama games bid! GO Toronto!

[Hairball]

Awesome, it's nice to see that we get some semi-big event for once. Hopefully this improves a lot of the crumbling infrastructure in the city.

[ReDmAn]

why would they do this? we're all dead after 2012 anyway

[mmhassa2]

well you could buy a discount alumni membership to use the gum

PPl @ UofT need a membership to use gum :confused: :lol:

[Squiggles]

PPl @ UofT need a membership to use gum :confused: :lol:

Yep, the money's going towards financing the Pan Am games.

[skyblue12]

PPl @ UofT need a membership to use gum :confused: :lol:

obviously he meant gym. lol.

i'll have graduated from UTSC by then, but the pictures of the facilities look really nice.. if you can actually go back as an alumni and get a gym membership i would definitely consider getting one.

[corrupt123]

I'm REALLY curious how this is going to play out. Toronto pretty much needs to start it's road to recovery tomorrow to be ready by 2015. Otherwise it's going to be a big mess.

+1 to being the hell out of here by then.

[Hairball]

I'm just going over the bid book right now, it's kind of remarkable how pretty much every place in the GTA will get an event or two.

Even at Centennial Community Centre across from Markville Mall in Markham!

[flexwong]

I'm REALLY curious how this is going to play out. Toronto pretty much needs to start it's road to recovery tomorrow to be ready by 2015. Otherwise it's going to be a big mess.

+1 to being the hell out of here by then.

won't happen, miller is still in charge. funny how both miller and mcguinty will be out of office by 2015 and both were loud supporters of the bid. why wouldn't they be, it'll be "someone else's problem".

[robster77]

I'm still seething from the last property tax hike. This coming from city already $500 million in the red and had to delay over $1 billion in capital spending just the other day. What's finding another $1.4 billion amongst friends, hey?

[MarkIII]

Looks like the TST, GBT (Games Building Tax) will all be in effect.

[drb789]

ya but too bad current students wont be able to enjoy the new facility.

but maybe their kids will ..... :)

[Johan Liebert]

I would probably hear this a lot if it happens,

Attention all passengers on the TTC subway system...

due to the Pan AM Games, we are currently experiencing a 4 hour delay from Finch to Union, Union to Downsview, and Kipling to Kennedy. Thank you for using the TTC

[Frankie3s]

I'm still seething from the last property tax hike. This coming from city already $500 million in the red and had to delay over $1 billion in capital spending just the other day. What's finding another $1.4 billion amongst friends, hey?

I was pissed when I heard that Ontario had won this. If anyone watched CTV news at 6pm they asked the Premier if it will ultimately cost taxpayers in the end and he skated around the question by saying that we'll be gaining training facilities and public transportation.

Meaning = huge losses are expected, future generations enslaved to pay for it.

[chinese zzz]

Oh no, many more new taxes will be added upon torontonian before the game :mad:

TTC...

Walk for life...:idea:

everything is increase.. ! 5 cent per bag? Ontario recycle fees? :confused:....

[CSR]

Utsc!

[help_questions]

I was pissed when I heard that Ontario had won this. If anyone watched CTV news at 6pm they asked the Premier if it will ultimately cost taxpayers in the end and he skated around the question by saying that we'll be gaining training facilities and public transportation.

Meaning = huge losses are expected, future generations enslaved to pay for it.

well, we give garbage men raises instead of looking for workers who will do the job for less....so the pan-am games is not that bad.

It is like Toronto doesn't make an effort to save money or cut costs.

"Sure, every city employee can have a raise"
"Sure, the increases in city worker wages is more important than the people who live in the city"

I am really glad I no longer live in Toronto.

[tkl]

[QUOTE=Frankie3s;9713744]I was pissed when I heard that Ontario had won this. If anyone watched CTV news at 6pm they asked the Premier if it will ultimately cost taxpayers in the end and he skated around the question by saying that we'll be gaining training facilities and public transportation.

Meaning = huge losses are expected, future generations enslaved to pay for it.

He skates around all questions quite well, that's why he's the teflon premier. All politician asked will give the same answer... training facilities, roads, etc, and not provide one specific way to deal with overcosts.

We're screwed...

[smolek]

I really wonder how the hell the muppets in charge plan to even keep the lights on in the next few years...

[stealth]

I'd be more excited if Toronto won a 2015 Trans Am. At least it would be more practical.

[Becks]

We need some uber-perky office workers to post in this thread. Too much grumbling!

[Takami]

I'd be more excited if Toronto won a 2015 Trans Am. At least it would be more practical.

And return it back to the dealership as a lemon in 2013?

[mbg]

Glad to see we can still compete with South American cities on the world stage...

I mean, if it's being held in Guadalajara in 2011 then it's only fair that Toronto gets it next.

[YYZFA]

http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2009/1/30/128778240195792816.jpg

So much negativity about this and everything else. I'm betting that most of the complainers are simply very uninspired individuals who don't do anything noteworthy themselves. That is why they are constantly complaining about everything under the sun.

[7jaii]

Don't know why we pursued this. With Olympics there's lots of promo and consultation but this was just lowkey.

More importantly, the Pan AM games doesn't earn money. The allure of Olympics is allowing host countries an opportunity to improve and access advertising & "outside" cash.

Pan AM costs a ton of money to buid up, no discussions on who benefits, what is the true cost, what is the debt load, how to deal with asylum seekers, and so on and so on...It's shocking when you compare the discussiosn/objections Jack Layton's team brought against 2008 Olympics (which offered real benefits), but nobody questioned this bid? This ain't politics, this just plain stinks. Torontonians total debt load and increased fees during Miller Years make Montreal's look small.

[kidflash23]

I can only hope that we as taxpayers don't get burned because of these games. I can only pray that the final bill will not be higher than what they have predicted so far.

[7jaii]

I can only hope that we as taxpayers don't get burned because of these games. I can only pray that the final bill will not be higher than what they have predicted so far.

Having grown up in this city, Toronto has NEVER brought anything at or under budget. Toronto offers services without metrics to measure effectiveness and increases spending expecting the goose to lay more gold eggs...while everyone is contracting services & spending & renegotiating contracts for actual savings, our city hands themselves an undeserved raise and increases debt & fees.

We will pay. Our kids will pay. And that's a shame.

[gizmo8]

I can only hope that we as taxpayers don't get burned because of these games. I can only pray that the final bill will not be higher than what they have predicted so far.

name one game that actually made money.Games are to get big business to build or help finance building projects,any bills that is not covered will be passed onto the tax payers.It took Montreal over 35 years to pay off their games and BC will be deep red ink when their games are over.The traffic nightmare in the city will be horrible,thanks heavens I be moving to the west coast in about the time the Pan Am games be completed.:cheesygri

[corrupt123]

I'd be more excited if Toronto won a 2015 Trans Am. At least it would be more practical.

Best Reply Yet.
Win

[ferkel]

Great.. now every household in Ontario will have to pay $1,000 to pay off the inevitable debt the Pan Am games will bring..

[Longobongo]

So Toronto won the "B" games? Did any of the Canadian networks even cover the previous pan-am games? After wasting millions on failed Olympic bids, settling for this? Sure it'll bring some new facilities but it at the cost of A LOT of tax payers money, no wonder the politicians are excited, they can boast how they brought the games here and avoid any future responsibility as it'll be somebody else problem once the games are over.

Checked the planned venues in Mississauga, they'll be using two ice arenas and a Classic Bowl? Bowling is in the pan-am games??

[Lulz]

Well, hopwfully I will be living in another city. Honestly, do they actually earn money from these games? I mean do people actually go from 1 province to another (yet alone to different country) just to cheer for their country?

[gordholio]

The good things about this event is that it will create jobs with the construction of facilities and they can be used for the Olympics if Toronto (and Southern Ontario) ever gets it.

[goob3r]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_American_Games

How many people out there even knew Winnipeg has hosted this event twice? It sure put them on the map...

What an epic waste of money.

[flexwong]

Well, hopwfully I will be living in another city. Honestly, do they actually earn money from these games? I mean do people actually go from 1 province to another (yet alone to different country) just to cheer for their country?

doesn't matter where you move, you will pay for it. unless you move out of the country of course.

all 3 levels of government WILL be helping to finance the games.

[Cheap Cat]

"Sure, every city employee can have a raise"
"Sure, the increases in city worker wages is more important than the people who live in the city"

I am really glad I no longer live in Toronto.

What makes you think city workers don't live in Toronto? They are tax payers like everyone else. I'd be more concerned about the money the city has wasted on this bid and the other unsuccessful bids and the money that will be wasted hosting games that nobody other than the athletes care about. I was really disappointed to hear that Toronto won (er lost).

[flexwong]

What makes you think city workers don't live in Toronto? They are tax payers like everyone else. I'd be more concerned about the money the city has wasted on this bid and the other unsuccessful bids and the money that will be wasted hosting games that nobody other than the athletes care about. I was really disappointed to hear that Toronto won (er lost).

actually, during the garbage strike, it was revealed that a significant amount of the public workers do not live in toronto.

[Shimso]

So Toronto won the "B" games? Did any of the Canadian networks even cover the previous pan-am games? After wasting millions on failed Olympic bids, settling for this? Sure it'll bring some new facilities but it at the cost of A LOT of tax payers money, no wonder the politicians are excited, they can boast how they brought the games here and avoid any future responsibility as it'll be somebody else problem once the games are over.

Checked the planned venues in Mississauga, they'll be using two ice arenas and a Classic Bowl? Bowling is in the pan-am games??

The B games? I'd be shocked if this was considered as high as a "C"...

[Frankie3s]

http://media.thestar.topscms.com/images/28/e3/f9996e1948e3b512b56900bf1fd5.jpeg

[Hairball]

I'm sure a lot of people question these kind of things. I also think it's a waste of money, but if we don't have some sort of event, we'll never get crap built in this city.

At least this gives us some athletic facilities so our athletes can train here. Hardly any of our Olympic medalists come from Ontario. Of course people also complain when we don't win.

[Tomato_1]

^

Who cares.. I'm paying up the nose for taxes. And what a cluster**** waste of money this is going to be for some two bit games. And getting stuff built in this city will be cost over runs left, right and center.

Just look at the stupid consulting fees for having people bring their own cups for coffee. Every consulting company was hired and still nothing came out of it.

I for one cheer when we lose. Less taxes, less congestion, less stupid politicians wasting my money.

[nhui06]

It is pretty sad that we settle for the 'silver medal' when we cannot score the Olympics, BUT I do not think Toronto will ever win the Olympics anyways so might as well settle. Whatever it takes to get the city's infrastructure up to par is what I say.

[danman227460]

One way I look at it is this.

Without this, a lot of traffic and transit projects would get delayed or even canceled. This would expedite the transit process with lines going all across the GTA, possbily linking Mississauga, Oakville to Scarborough.

This might even start the process on burying the Gardiner which has been talked about so many years but nothing has been done. This would get the docks done too with housing for later use.

I mean all these projects would have been done anyways, regardless of Toronto won the Pam Am games or not but this just speeds up everything and not having every project in limbo.

[Broseph]

You can only support this now that Toronto has won. There is no point in bitching and complaining because it will not help what so ever. I'm not happy that Toronto won but it's going to be here and there is nothing we can do about it other than support it and hope it is a success.

[kingfencer]

where are the jobs!!!!

[BornRuff]

Most of you people are just joyless robots programed to grumble at any mention of government spending.

These kinds of events are beneficial to cities, that is why so many cities fight for them. Sure, they cost money as the cities are forced to get off their ass and fix all the things they have been talking about fixing for years, but many of those things will provide a long term benefit to the city.

[MrDisco]

Most of you people are just joyless robots programed to grumble at any mention of government spending.

I disagree. I'm all for gov't spending. We should be spending on a regular basis in order to keep this city modern and in top working condition.

What I object to are third-rate circuses where the budgets are always over-run, deals are seemingly tendered without due process, things are done with little long-term planning, and we're left with such dubious facilities like a velodrome.

It's a sad state of affairs that the only way we can hope to improve the city is by relying on these ridiculous events which are aimed at the rich. We should be able to have the will and capital to invest in infrastructure without the side show.

[Draff]

Yes, these games will cost taxpayers money which is unfortunate but for Torontonians paying taxes, most of the money leaves the city anyway. Thus, with the games, some of that money will finally be re-invested into the city via infrastructure development. Without these games or any other major event, all of the major projects will never progress (e.g. waterfront).

[Draff]

I disagree. I'm all for gov't spending. We should be spending on a regular basis in order to keep this city modern and in top working condition.

What I object to are third-rate circuses where the budgets are always over-run, deals are seemingly tendered without due process, things are done with little long-term planning, and we're left with such dubious facilities like a velodrome.

It's a sad state of affairs that the only way we can hope to improve the city is by relying on these ridiculous events which are aimed at the rich. We should be able to have the will and capital to invest in infrastructure without the side show.

I agree wholeheartedly with what you're saying but the reality is that it simply wouldn't happen.

[ferkel]

One way I look at it is this.

Without this, a lot of traffic and transit projects would get delayed or even canceled. This would expedite the transit process with lines going all across the GTA, possbily linking Mississauga, Oakville to Scarborough.
.

Ya.. this is what we need.. These dum asses are building a Sheppard LRT.
Who's going to take this silly Sheppard LRT? Backwards thinking

[BornRuff]

I disagree. I'm all for gov't spending. We should be spending on a regular basis in order to keep this city modern and in top working condition.

What I object to are third-rate circuses where the budgets are always over-run, deals are seemingly tendered without due process, things are done with little long-term planning, and we're left with such dubious facilities like a velodrome.

It's a sad state of affairs that the only way we can hope to improve the city is by relying on these ridiculous events which are aimed at the rich. We should be able to have the will and capital to invest in infrastructure without the side show.

Well, has that ever happened?

This is actually a practical way to have improvements done. Those sports facilities are actually helpful to the community, even velodromes. Things like Velodromes are relatively rare, so they attract teams and athletes to where they are when they want to train.

[williamsauga]

will it lower my taxes?

[robster77]

http://media.thestar.topscms.com/images/28/e3/f9996e1948e3b512b56900bf1fd5.jpeg

You know, when I saw this picture in the Star, it pretty much says all you need to know, doesn't it?

[MrDisco]

Well, has that ever happened?


exactly my point. citizens should be demanding that our taxes be used for infrastructure upkeep and upgrades. relying on circuses (especially no-name ones like the pan-am games or the commonwealth games) is a dangerous precedent we've fallen into.

are you going to be satisfied with big dollar projects only occurring every 20 years based on the whims of a sports selection committee and politician bribes/donations?



This is actually a practical way to have improvements done. Those sports facilities are actually helpful to the community, even velodromes. Things like Velodromes are relatively rare, so they attract teams and athletes to where they are when they want to train.

Things like velodromes are only of use for the wealthy. Who amongst the masses can afford $10k bike frames to compete? Why not use that money for something with bigger impact like community centers or sports programs at the school level. how many news stories have their been about pool closures in schools?

If elite athletes want highly specialized facilities they should build it them selves. How much use has the bobsled track in Calgary received? Is it open to the public
Relying on the private sector is the clarion call of the right-wing, here's a great example where they can put their beliefs into action.

[BornRuff]

exactly my point. citizens should be demanding that our taxes be used for infrastructure upkeep and upgrades. relying on circuses (especially no-name ones like the pan-am games or the commonwealth games) is a dangerous precedent we've fallen into.

are you going to be satisfied with big dollar projects only occurring every 20 years based on the whims of a sports selection committee and politician bribes/donations?

Smaller scale events are still beneficial to the community. It's not an all or nothing type thing. This event will bring 10's of thousands of additional people to the city, which will be a huge boost for businesses in the area, especially hospitality/tourism. This boost will be sustained over time because the new facilities will allow us to host more events after the games as well.


Things like velodromes are only of use for the wealthy. Who amongst the masses can afford $10k bike frames to compete? Why not use that money for something with bigger impact like community centers or sports programs at the school level. how many news stories have their been about pool closures in schools?

If elite athletes want highly specialized facilities they should build it them selves. How much use has the bobsled track in Calgary received? Is it open to the public
Relying on the private sector is the clarion call of the right-wing, here's a great example where they can put their beliefs into action.

Most world class armature athletes are generally not wealthy at all(actually quite poor). The benefits from these facilities are not just for the people who use them though. The main benefit is the increased business activity from the teams that come to train at the facility and the competitions held at the facility.

The Olympic Park Bobsled track in Calgary has held numerous world class competitions since the Olympics, and a constant stream of smaller scale events, and teams coming there to train. They do offer public programs as well.