Shopping Discussion

Can't be a 'Noob' to go Shopping in Canada

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Sep 23, 2009
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Brampton

Can't be a 'Noob' to go Shopping in Canada

I just wanted to rant and totally understand if someone doesn't agree with my opinion. I just needed to get this out there... And on to my rant...


My wife is new to the country, only about 1 year in. While I was vacation a few years ago we met, and stayed in touch and finally in 2007 we got married. Ever since she came to Canada, it seems wherever she shops I have to prepare her for a list of things to watch out for. (the first time only of course, not everytime) When she goes to TD to deposit I have to tell her to say 'no' to the teller trying to give her a credit card or LOC or whatever. When she goes to pay for gas have to say 'no' for the car wash, lottery, or candy. At a Futureshop or BestBuy no to the warranty. (but that is your option)

It seems that our society doesn't care about what you go into a store to by, its all about up selling. Now whenever my wife goes into a new store, she always asks me as a joke, is there anything I have to know before I go in? Its sad, but my commentary is not on the fact that people are out to make a living, but rather, we as Canadians have forgotten/or don't know what customer service is... Its about identifying the needs of the customer and presenting them options or knowledge about a product or service they need/require.

If I walk into to a store and know what I am going to buy, and ask a CSR, "Can you show me the Acer 12345 computer with 5 x" I would like it if the CSR took me there asked if there was anything else and proceeded the way I directed them to. I understand that after showing me this product if the CSR were to say, in this price range we have a similar item that does this better or in my opinion you would be better off with this, but the choice is yours, I would respect that.

This comes from the fact that while getting services or shopping in other countries I can't believe the difference in service levels. I know it varies from place to place, but honestly I have done tons of shopping. From buying T.V's to Cars to Homes, I would have to rate Canada at the bottom of every list when it comes to actual Customer Service. I partially blame it on the minority of consumers, due to their poor practices such as eating food in grocery stores, dropping clothing on the floor in department stores and many other things. But it seems that our culture does not nurture good customer service habits. I also believe that a small minority of consumers are hypersensitive and give CSR's a hard time for no other reason then a previous bad experience at a retail store.

I'm not really sure what can be done overnight, but I think part of the solution would be to recognize good/great customer service by speaking to a manager and letting them know what is being done right, and if poor customer service is given, to calmly talk to or write a letter/email informing a company of the same thing. Instead of the usually yelling/screaming.

Well anyways, those are my thoughts, thanks for letting me rant...
28 replies
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I'm not sure what you hope to gain by speaking to the manager. If you hope to eliminate upselling, it won't happen that way. You may actually increase it be getting those who don't do it reprimanded. CSRs don't upsell because they want to, it is being forced on them by head office. When I last worked retail, we were sent to seminars on how to upsell. Retailers offer contests and incentives to encourage staff to force cc and other things they don't want on people. They even post signs and make announcements when someone signs up for a new CC or whatever they are pushing. I call them pushers because that is what they are. No wonder so many people overextend themselves with credit. I feel bad for people who have issues with credit cards because they keep being pushed on you at certain stores.

Personally, I never upsold because I didn't believe in it especially since I worked in a liquor store. As a true RFDer, I was also trying to help customers save a buck and would point them to what was on sale. I would even talk people out of buying things, like those who thought alcohol makes the perfect gift. It is doesn't, it just gets returned.

Sometimes the upselling is completely ridiculous. I go to KFC/Taco Bell and order two tacos and get asked if I want a bucket of chicken with it. Yeah, I was just going to eat a couple of tacos but what the heck, I'll eat a whole bucket of chicken as well. :rolleyes:

Upselling is one of my pet peeves. Just say NO.
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sometimes the upselling is completely ridiculous. I go to kfc/taco bell and order two tacos and get asked if i want a bucket of chicken with it. Yeah, i was just going to eat a couple of tacos but what the heck, i'll eat a whole bucket of chicken as well.
lol!

For the record, Managers tell employees to up sell - and to be honest, some customers got quite aggitated - which is why I refuse to work retail.
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Cheap Cat wrote: I'm not sure what you hope to gain by speaking to the manager. If you hope to eliminate upselling, it won't happen that way. You may actually increase it be getting those who don't do it reprimanded. CSRs don't upsell because they want to, it is being forced on them by head office..

Yeah I agree 100% with you there. It is forced on them for sure. And because the consumer keeps saying yes to being 'upsold' they will keep doing it. Some people I guess confuse that for 'great customer service.'
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Stores are out to make a profit so anyway they can get you to put down more money they will. Upselling is just one of tactics they employ, and I wouldn't exactly call it useless either, as some people might need that extra warranty for a TV, need a memory card for that new camera, a belt to go with the pants. When I paid for gas today I got a carwash too after the guy mentioned it because I do need one.

As long as a simple "no" is all it takes to refuse I think it's okay. The problem is with salespeople that overdo this to the extend that it becomes truly annoying.

As for customer service, I am not sure where you go for shopping but I seldom see people eating in the grocery store or leave stuff on the floor, and that speaks more of the customers themselves than the actual staff.

If I do have a complain it is that we don't have many CSR in the stores and more often than not it takes a while to get a hold of one when I do need to talk to one. This is normal for Canada because labour cost is high so stores just staff the minimum needed to run the store. It's just difference between the society and cultures.

For example in countries where labour is abundant I go to a store I get bombared with "helpful" questions like "do you want to know about the specials" or "what style/model you looking for" when I want to do is look around. Other countries they have snobby sales staff that wouldn't even look at you because they already judged that you are not worthy of their service. I have also encounter stores that have extremely pushy/aggressive sales staff that would keep on pushing product despite refusing the same thing 20 times, and stores where the staff knows you are foreign and treat you really nicely while charging you higher than "local" prices.

So with all that experience I wouldn't say Canada has bad customer service, but yes there are bad apples. Talk to management might help but then usually they are the one instructing the employees about these selling techniques. Voting with you dollar is usually the best. Just go to the stores that treat you well.
There's a sucker born every minute.
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Oct 18, 2007
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Upselling is a technique. I did quite a bit but I'm try not to be pushy. I ask them once or twice but definitely at cash out and that's it.

I know there are people who use undermining technique like "if you get it today, i'll give you $10 off but next time, I wont" and i hate it.

as a sales, you have to be able to feel if the customer wants to be sold stuff. there's no point of selling a fancy dress to a guy knowing that he's not going to buy it to begin with.

btw, the best line is the "i dont do this often but i can give you an employee discount" lol i heard a woman trying to sell my friend a hair curler that cost $100 using that line. My friend wanted it but not at that price and even with the employee discount (20%) it still wasn't worth it.
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some people are elegant in their upsell techniques, others just read off lists. Its hard to expect every person working in retail to be there for the customer... Many are there because they can't find anything else at the moment.

Its all about perspective and understanding, when you get people on both sides of the counter with enough of each of those transactions are the best. But it is getting more and more rare these days.
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"You want fries with that?"

Upselling is as old as time, and I doubt it's any different in Canada as opposed to any other capitalist country with large chain stores.

I'm actually impressed when encountering a cashier with good upselling skills, as it shows me they're at least paying attention to their training and therefore may be more consciencious (sp?) in their work as opposed to ones that take your money without looking you in the eye, don't say anything, and look like they'll rather die than work another shift.

But yes, you have to be savvy enough to refuse the extended warranty, gas price contract and medium fries.
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Vednar wrote: Yeah I agree 100% with you there. It is forced on them for sure. And because the consumer keeps saying yes to being 'upsold' they will keep doing it. Some people I guess confuse that for 'great customer service.'
That reminds me of ordering at this Wendy's close to my work. It goes something like this:

CSR: "Can I take your Order"

Me: "Can I have a Spicy Chicken, just the sandwich"

CSR: "Would you like a Combo?"

Me: "No just the sandwich....Can I also have a Baconator w/cheese"

CSR: "Combo?"

Me: "No just the sandwhich."
Me: "Can I also have chicken wrap bah bah bah...."

CSR: "Combo?"

Me" No Thanks, Can I also have just a hamburger, no combo, thats it."

CSR: "Combo?"

**WTF?? i just told you no combo like 3 different ways, and she still asked if i wanted a combo. It's like she is programed to say combo after everything!


Dammit, if i wanted a bloody combo i'd say so, i wouldn't go out of my way to say sandwich only, or only this......



FYI: That was lunch for a few ppl at work, not only me.
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Customer service has indeed declined over the years.

It will only get worse as more consumers look harder for bargains. In some businesses upselling is what is keeping them employed.
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No Frills wrote: Customer service has indeed declined over the years.

It will only get worse as more consumers look harder for bargains. In some businesses upselling is what is keeping them employed.
It's the fact that employees see no benefits from providing good service or upselling. Most everybody is paid hourly and their paycheque doesn't change if the store is doing good or bad. Even if the store is doing very badly, chances are the clerk will be long gone before it closes.

Commissioned employees aren't much better off. Gave great service, but the customer didn't take the PSP, or didn't tell anybody that they were helped by you? No Commission. They came back later and somebody else complete the sale? No Commission.

In smaller stores you are being served by the owner (or at least somebody with an interest in the success of the store). But since Wal-mart et al have slowly killed smaller stores, good service has gone with them.
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tdott wrote: Dammit, if i wanted a bloody combo i'd say so, i wouldn't go out of my way to say sandwich only, or only this......
This drives me nuts too. I never order combos and have tried various different ways to say, I don't want the combo and don't want anything else and always get asked. I have noticed though that most other people just mention the sandwich when ordering, when in fact they want the combo. So I can see why the cashier needs to confirm. I think it just becomes automatic to them but it still bugs me.
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Jun 26, 2005
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The fact that stores try to upsell does not equate they have poor customer service. In fact, one can argue, it actually means they "care" about you and ask if you have any other needs.

The fact that your wife needs "rules" before walking into a store or else she may get taken advantage of, does not equate that customer service is bad. It means something else (that I will not say, because I do not want to insult anyone)

Customer service is different for everyone. Some people want their waiters to come and chat with them throughout the dinner. Some people just wanna have a nice, peaceful dinner with their friends without being bugged every now and then.

As someone says, all companies exist to make a profit. Or else, they would go bankrupt. So, how can we blame them for doing their jobs?
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FYI this is nothing special about Canada. It is the exact same (actually more so) in the US, and also similar in the EU.

And while people in Asia and SA may not up-sell you on things, it is a totally different buyer-beware situation there, as I am sure most know what I am talking about.

So really - IMO you can't be a "noob" and go shopping ANYWHERE in the world. Well you can, but you may be fleeced.
To be nobody but yourself - in a world which is doing its best, night and day, to make you everybody else - means to fight the hardest battle which any human being can fight; and never stop fighting. -- E. E. Cummings
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mabba18 wrote: In smaller stores you are being served by the owner (or at least somebody with an interest in the success of the store). But since Wal-mart et al have slowly killed smaller stores, good service has gone with them.
Thats true, we can only hope in the future that CS will come back to an extent. Someone's making the money nevertheless.
brunes wrote:
And while people in Asia and SA may not up-sell you on things, it is a totally different buyer-beware situation there, as I am sure most know what I am talking about.
Absolutely.
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No Frills wrote: Thats true, we can only hope in the future that CS will come back to an extent. Someone's making the money nevertheless.
i think it will be automated in the future. lol or from those movie where it's the computer interaction and detecting your facial expression (that exist already) whether you like it or not.

if that's the case, a lot of people will be out of jobs.

can't win them all.
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"upselling" can be good customer service.

If you don't want that warranty, that's great, that's your choice. What if it WAS your choice and I didn't offer it?
Would you be happy if your headphones ripped in half in 3 months and you had to pay full price for another pair, because you didn't know we offered a warranty that covered damaged headphones?

Or how about a brand new HD T.V.?
I didn't offer you anything to go with it, so you take it home and plug in your old rabbit ears and get the worst picture you could possible get on your new $1000 HD T.V. Are you going to be happy with your new purchase?

Digital camera, take it home, the AAs in the box last for 30 pictures, but you can't even take 30 pictures because the internal memory only holds 5, and you are with the family opening presents on Christmas day.

and department store cards can be very useful for people. do you do financing on your house? car? why not your home theater system? why not a pc/laptop so you and your family can be on the internet. even a few years ago, a laptop or a pc could easily push $1000 for a mid range. There are a lot of people/families out there that can't drop $1000 in one go. So why not $100 over 10 months with no interest? I'll give you a discount off the item, and you'll get a $20 gift card with your first bill, so you can come back and buy a better mouse?
Is that bad customer service?

And moving away from retail to food. most people want a drink (and fries) with their meal, so they might forget the specifically say "and I want a drink with that!"
or about a hostess saying what kind of drinks they can get started for you, etc.
I've never had someone offer me a bucket of chicken when I ordered two tacos, that seems a bit made up.

I'll be honest, in my store I try to get my assocaites to upsell with batteries to most customers. (ones we have on sale for a pretty low price) and it takes less than 30 seconds to ask and if a customer doesn't need them, they will say no thanks, I already have lots, just bought a bunch, I use rechargables, etc. But often enough I get people who say "Oh yeah! I need these for _____" or "yeah, I'm almost out, i could use some more" possibly saving them a trip back in to the store a week from now when they run out, or them seeing them somewhere else for a higher price and buying them there, etc.
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tomthegreat wrote: "upselling" can be good customer service.
It is but it depends what you think is worth what. Offering some warranty isnt worth it in the end. Instead of viewing it as "upselling" you can view it was cross selling or cross merchandising. Amazon does it well.

For a fast food combo, I am lead to believe more people get combos that single items. Especially when the combo is "only" so much more.
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tomthegreat wrote: "upselling" can be good customer service.
There's a differance bettwen "CROSS-selling" and "UP-selling". You are right that it's a great idea to remind people that they will need certain accessories to get the most out of their purchases. However it quickly crosses a line when you start suggesting incorrect or overpriced accessories. Or lying about the necessity of those accessories. Monster cables?
tomthegreat wrote: If you don't want that warranty, that's great, that's your choice. What if it WAS your choice and I didn't offer it?
Would you be happy if your headphones ripped in half in 3 months and you had to pay full price for another pair, because you didn't know we offered a warranty that covered damaged headphones?
Well, I'd be upset that I was sold a pair of headphones that only lasted 3 months with normal wear. I'd be even more upset when I was told that the warranty I paid for didn't cover half of what the salesman promised me. Show me one warranty that covers deliberate (or even accidental) damage.
tomthegreat wrote: Or how about a brand new HD T.V.?
I didn't offer you anything to go with it, so you take it home and plug in your old rabbit ears and get the worst picture you could possible get on your new $1000 HD T.V. Are you going to be happy with your new purchase?
If you knew anything about HDTVs, you'd know that you could get a perfectly fine HD picture with "old rabbit ears".
tomthegreat wrote: Digital camera, take it home, the AAs in the box last for 30 pictures, but you can't even take 30 pictures because the internal memory only holds 5, and you are with the family opening presents on Christmas day.
And would you sell them the no-name 4GB card they need, or the 16GB brand name card that they'd never fill in 100 years?
tomthegreat wrote: and department store cards can be very useful for people. do you do financing on your house? car? why not your home theater system? why not a pc/laptop so you and your family can be on the internet. even a few years ago, a laptop or a pc could easily push $1000 for a mid range. There are a lot of people/families out there that can't drop $1000 in one go. So why not $100 over 10 months with no interest? I'll give you a discount off the item, and you'll get a $20 gift card with your first bill, so you can come back and buy a better mouse?
Is that bad customer service?
Yes, it is BAD customer service. I cannot believe that anyone would be foolish enough to think that store credit cards are a good thing.

First, let's see whats wrong: Extremely high interest rates (after 10 months), repayment penalties, and hidden services fees. Do you really think that a $20 gift card is worth paying 40-50% more for an item?

Second, if a person needs to finance a $1000 purchase, then they shouldn't be making that purchase. Even $5-10k for a home theatre should be something that is saved up for, or at the very least paid with a BANK credit card or line of credit/loan with tremendously better rates.

Third, Why do people finace a home or car? Because they can get credit with less then 5% interest. Show me a store credit card with that low a rate.

Fourth, if you think that a basic PC for internet use needs to cost somebody $1000, then you are a real crook. I could point to a dozen PC under $500 (at BB and FS even) that would be more then enough to get someone on the net or thorough school.
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mabba18 wrote: There's a differance bettwen "CROSS-selling" and "UP-selling". You are right that it's a great idea to remind people that they will need certain accessories to get the most out of their purchases. However it quickly crosses a line when you start suggesting incorrect or overpriced accessories. Or lying about the necessity of those accessories. Monster cables?
it CAN be good customer service, I've never recommended something I knew someone did not need. I could have sold monster cables and almost talk them out of the monster cables to buy cheaper ones. As for overpriced? what you consider overpriced might not be overpriced for other people. Some people consider drinks at starbucks overpriced, yet I go there 3+ times a week, and some go everyday.

Well, I'd be upset that I was sold a pair of headphones that only lasted 3 months with normal wear. I'd be even more upset when I was told that the warranty I paid for didn't cover half of what the salesman promised me. Show me one warranty that covers deliberate (or even accidental) damage.
I said ripped in half, normal wear and tear does not rip headphones in half. Getting them caught in the car door, does. And my store's warranty covers anything as long as you can bring the pieces back. (out west anyways, not sure what they do in the center of the universe) Every month or so I have a box full of broken stuff that is sent to the warranty department so they can scrap it, and since they scrap it I don't care what the headphones look like when they come back.
We also offer warrant on batteries, which some people can't wrap their head around. "You mean, if the battery dies within 3 years I can bring it back and get a new one? Yes.."
And even wear and tear, some people like to wrap the headphones around their players, and that can end up damaging the wire on the inside after x months, or even after a year or two. I spend $120 on earbuds, and one side stopped working after a year and 2 months, if I knew I could have spent an extra $15-$25 when I bought them and been able to just come in and get new ones, I would have. (but I bought them at london drugs, and I don't think they offer a warranty on ear buds.. but I was never told, so I don't know)

If you knew anything about HDTVs, you'd know that you could get a perfectly fine HD picture with "old rabbit ears".
You're right, I don't know anything about HD T.V.s, I only sell them for a living... I live a block away from one of the t.v. stations in town and I get that channel blurry, and one other channel even blurrier. You CAN get HD over the air, but not everyone lives in the centre of the universe where I'm assuming there is actually HD broadcast over the air.

And would you sell them the no-name 4GB card they need, or the 16GB brand name card that they'd never fill in 100 years?
All my associates, including myself usually go straight for which over one is the best deal (on sale), if an 8 gig no-name is on sale, I may suggest that depending on the user. But usually the 2gb/4gb ones that are lower price are what people walk away with.

Yes, it is BAD customer service. I cannot believe that anyone would be foolish enough to think that store credit cards are a good thing.

First, let's see whats wrong: Extremely high interest rates (after 10 months), repayment penalties, and hidden services fees. Do you really think that a $20 gift card is worth paying 40-50% more for an item?
I've used department store cards to buy my t.v. and home theatre system and I did NOT pay 40-50% more for the item. I think for the t.v. +stand and speakers I paid about $60 for the 12 month payment plan, and I tought it was worth it. If I put it on my Visa, I would have paid a lot more in interest over the year, and my visa would be filled up that I couldn't use anything else with it.
Second, if a person needs to finance a $1000 purchase, then they shouldn't be making that purchase. Even $5-10k for a home theatre should be something that is saved up for, or at the very least paid with a BANK credit card or line of credit/loan with tremendously better rates.
Like I said before, most department store cards with payment plans have no interest, just one flat fee for the longer time periods. And why save up, when you can get it now and pay it off? What if your kid's computer breaks and they need it for school, or just so they can have something to do? My mom wouldn't be able to drop $1000 out of the blue to buy a new computer, and it would take her a while to save it up.
Third, Why do people finace a home or car? Because they can get credit with less then 5% interest. Show me a store credit card with that low a rate.
How about payment plans? I've done the 3 months of no interest, no payments a bunch of times, and haven't paid a penny in interest. Yet, I was able to take advantage of a sale because I didn't have the cash on hand yet, and I didn't fill up my normal bank visa card since I use that for my normal purchases.
Fourth, if you think that a basic PC for internet use needs to cost somebody $1000, then you are a real crook. I could point to a dozen PC under $500 (at BB and FS even) that would be more then enough to get someone on the net or thorough school.
If you only read the part where I said "a couple years ago, a PC/laptop could cost easily cost $1000"
Netbooks are very popular and they are around $300.

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