Ask me anything about Dietary Supplements!!!

[glover78]

^ I went through that article and it mentions creatine loading ( 5 grams 4x a day for 5 days). Is this actually necessary? Some say this is the way to go, but others (experts) say it's unnecessary and just a ploy by creatine sellers to sell more of their product.

Yea concerning my calories, I really hope I'm taking in more than 3000 cals a day. I actually want to up it to 4000. *Sigh* I remember a few years ago laughing in my head when I overheard some guy mention he counts his calories, now it seems I gotta do the same.

[Tijuana]

^ I went through that article and it mentions creatine loading ( 5 grams 4x a day for 5 days). Is this actually necessary? Some say this is the way to go, but others (experts) say it's unnecessary and just a ploy by creatine sellers to sell more of their product.

Yea concerning my calories, I really hope I'm taking in more than 3000 cals a day. I actually want to up it to 4000. *Sigh* I remember a few years ago laughing in my head when I overheard some guy mention he counts his calories, now it seems I gotta do the same.

Yes, it is a ploy. Just take 5 grams a day and your good to go. No need to load OR cycle creatine.

Count your calories for a week, just so you get a feel for how much your normally eat and how many calories that is. Once you get comfortable, you won't need to count, since you will have a mental picture of how much calories are in the food you eat. Also don't up it too high to quick. You don't want to gain all the weight on your stomach. Up it by a few hundred calories and see how it goes. I would rather gain 10 pounds in 4 months then 10 pounds in 2 months.

What are the most common ingredients in a pre workout product that has an significant impact on blood flow / pump while doing reps ?

Could you please elaborate and be a bit more specific as to exactly how these ingredients work to enhance a ' pump ' ?



So, basically.............. Taurine and Caffeine.

O.K.........then, why not just bang back a Red Bull ( or 2 ) or a strong coffee ( or 2 ) before you train if it's a caffeine hit you're after to get ' focused ' to train ?

Red Bull will run you at 3 dollars a can, whereas you can get pre workout supps for as little as a dollar a serving. They are also much better in that they have less of what you don't need (sugar) and more of what you do need. 1 popular pre workout supplement is Jack3d. The ingredients are as follows(1 serving = 5.5 grams)

(Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate, Creatine Monohydrate, Beta Alanine, Caffeine, 1,3-Dimethylamylamine (Geranium [Stem], Shizandrol A)

The first ingredient gives you your pump. Creatine is self explanatory, Beta Alanine is used for endurance, and the rest are your stimulants. You would take this if you want MORE then what your getting from your pre workout meal.

And you CAN take Red Bull or a few cups of strong coffee, nothing is stopping you, and alot of people do that, but how many people like coffee? Coffee just has the stimulant part, but there is still more to get out of a pre workout supplement then just a stimulant.

I'm simply citing the GI of orange juice - and, it has a Low GI.

Whether OJ has a higher GI than water or not, if you are looking to have carbs immediately post workout to aid in nutrient absorption, most recommendations suggest you take a HI GI carb.

That's all I'm saying.

I am not disagreeing with you, but I am comparing what most people go through with creatine. They are not going to buy maltodextrin just to use it for creatine. It's either with water or juice, and juice is a much better alternative.

[baz5]

I take NO Shotgun, and as someone that is against supplements because most are scams and a waste of money, this stuff is good stuff. Not just NO Shutgun but most pre workout drinks. I really like them, and recommend them to people.

But take them before what they do to you mentally, not physically, because they really don't do anything special in that department, minus the creatine benefits.

[glover78]

oats are a good pre workout snack, id give it about an hour to an hour and a half before working out, depending on how much your eating

Yea I had some oats with coffee mixed in, also took two creatine pills. I had a damn good workout. Did chest, bis, and a little shoulders. Sadly it's my friend's bday and I'm about to get pretty wasted so I hope my solid workout doesn't go down the toilet

Oh great tip on not shooting up my calorie intake so fast. I'm starting to develop a gut and i dont want to further add to it.

[Tijuana]

Yea I had some oats with coffee mixed in, also took two creatine pills. I had a damn good workout. Did chest, bis, and a little shoulders. Sadly it's my friend's bday and I'm about to get pretty wasted so I hope my solid workout doesn't go down the toilet

Oh great tip on not shooting up my calorie intake so fast. I'm starting to develop a gut and i dont want to further add to it.

Yup, keep at it. Your always going to get fat on your stomach, it's inevitable. As long as you eat clean lean foods, you will gain the weight that you want.

[poedua]

(Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate, Creatine Monohydrate, Beta Alanine, Caffeine, 1,3-Dimethylamylamine (Geranium [Stem], Shizandrol A)

The first ingredient gives you your pump.

How does Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate give you a ' pump ' exactly ?

Why do you need a supplement to enhance a ' pump ' feeling anyway ?

Do you need to feel a ' pump ' to stimulate your muscles to grow ?

Can your muscles grow in an optimal manner if you don't feel a ' pump ' ?

[poedua]

^ I went through that article and it mentions creatine loading ( 5 grams 4x a day for 5 days).

Is this actually necessary?

Some say this is the way to go, but others (experts) say it's unnecessary and just a ploy by creatine sellers to sell more of their product.

Creatine works.

But, I think creatine has it's proper time and place....IMO.

I would say creatine fits more for the intermediate to advanced lifter who already had adequate central nervous system adaptation and has gone through the process of gradually recruiting most muscle fibers in training. In other words, they have already learned how to train properly - and train hard - and seem to have hit a plateau despite making all kinds of training adjustments to try and circumvent these sorts of plateaus . So, creatine is a temporary fix in the short term only - at best .....IMO of course.

An energy boost is one of THE main benefits you get from creatine - more energy is provided for your muscles. From a weight training perspective, more energy means that our muscles can work a bit harder - you can push yourself harder and longer in the gym.

And as we've mentioned in many threads in this forum, intensity is what it's all about if you're serious about building muscle mass. A harder and more intense workout will lead to increases in muscle mass...and the increase in weight ( due to more muscle ) that you're looking for.

I could also see someone using creatine if one was involved in some pre-season training for a sport and mass gains over specified time was an important goal, so, maximum intensity and power was a key to training.

That said, people also take creatine for the wrong reasons. They think you actually need creatine to build muscle. The more creatine you consume , more big muscles you'll get ( same misplaced logic people use to justify scarfing down huge amounts of protein as well btw ).

It's a myth ...creatine doesn't do that.

[Tijuana]

How does Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate give you a ' pump ' exactly ?

Here are a few studies, read them over if you want.

http://health.med.umich.edu/healthco...eID=hn-4452006

Nutrition. 2006 Sep;22(9):872-81.

Pharmacokinetics, safety, and effects on exercise performance of l-arginine alpha-ketoglutarate in trained adult men.

Campbell B, Roberts M, Kerksick C, Wilborn C, Marcello B, Taylor L, Nassar E, Leutholtz B, Bowden R, Rasmussen C, Greenwood M, Kreider R.

Exercise and Sport Nutrition Laboratory at the Center for Exercise, Nutrition, and Preventative Health Research, Department of Health, Human Performance, and Recreation, Baylor University, Waco, Texas, USA.

OBJECTIVE: We evaluated the pharmacokinetics, safety, and efficacy of l-arginine alpha-ketoglutarate (AAKG) in trained adult men. METHODS: Subjects participated in two studies that employed a randomized, double-blind, controlled design. In study 1, 10 healthy men (30-50 y old) fasted for 8 h and then ingested 4 g of time-released or non-timed-released AAKG. Blood samples were taken for 8 h after AAKG ingestion to assess the pharmacokinetic profile of l-arginine. After 1 wk the alternative supplement was ingested. In study 2, which was placebo controlled, 35 resistance-trained adult men (30-50 y old) were randomly assigned to ingest 4 g of AAKG (three times a day, i.e., 12 g daily, n = 20) or placebo (n = 15). Participants performed 4 d of periodized resistance training per week for 8 wk. At 0, 4, and 8 wk of supplementation the following tests were performed: clinical blood markers, one repetition maximum bench press, isokinetic quadriceps muscle endurance, anaerobic power, aerobic capacity, total body water, body composition, and psychometric parameters tests. Data were analyzed by repeated measures analysis of variance. RESULTS: In study 1, significant differences were observed in plasma arginine levels in subjects taking non-timed-release and timed-release AAKG. In study 2, significant differences were observed in the AAKG group (P < 0.05) for 1RM bench press, Wingate peak power, blood glucose, and plasma arginine. No significant differences were observed between groups in body composition, total body water, isokinetic quadriceps muscle endurance, or aerobic capacity. CONCLUSION: AAKG supplementation appeared to be safe and well tolerated, and positively influenced 1RM bench press and Wingate peak power performance. AAKG did not influence body composition or aerobic capacity.

AAKG is not the best pump product on the market. Creatine is essentially referred to as a pump product. I am not saying AAKG is a good pump ingredient, but for this product, that's why its in there.

Why do you need a supplement to enhance a ' pump ' feeling anyway ?

As I've said before, some people like that fact that their arms stay bigger for a few hours after taking it, and the more blood going to your muscle the stronger you can lift(marginally)

Do you need to feel a ' pump ' to stimulate your muscles to grow ?

Obviously not. It was never implied that you do.

Can your muscles grow in an optimal manner if you don't feel a ' pump ' ?

Once again, obviously you can. Pre-workout's supplements do not imply that you NEED to take them. There are still alot of people that don't like using them. Your muscles grow due to how you exercise them. Improper technique will result in your muscles growing *badly*. These types of products dont state you will gain ANY muscle, all they state is the energy, drive and focus it gives you. You just need to try it for yourself, to understand what it does.

As I've said before, I don't really like pre workout supplements due to the fact I am not sensitive to caffeine at all, and the other stimulants, mainly 1,3 di-meth I seem to have a bad reaction to. With pre workouts, it works for some and for some it doesn't. As too does creatine, because there are non-responders.

[glover78]

Creatine works.

But, I think creatine has it's proper time and place....IMO.

I would say creatine fits more for the intermediate to advanced lifter who already had adequate central nervous system adaptation and has gone through the process of gradually recruiting most muscle fibers in training. In other words, they have already learned how to train properly - and train hard - and seem to have hit a plateau despite making all kinds of training adjustments to try and circumvent these sorts of plateaus . So, creatine is a temporary fix in the short term only - at best .....IMO of course.

An energy boost is one of THE main benefits you get from creatine - more energy is provided for your muscles. From a weight training perspective, more energy means that our muscles can work a bit harder - you can push yourself harder and longer in the gym.

And as we've mentioned in many threads in this forum, intensity is what it's all about if you're serious about building muscle mass. A harder and more intense workout will lead to increases in muscle mass...and the increase in weight ( due to more muscle ) that you're looking for.

I could also see someone using creatine if one was involved in some pre-season training for a sport and mass gains over specified time was an important goal, so, maximum intensity and power was a key to training.

That said, people also take creatine for the wrong reasons. They think you actually need creatine to build muscle. The more creatine you consume , more big muscles you'll get ( same misplaced logic people use to justify scarfing down huge amounts of protein as well btw ).

It's a myth ...creatine doesn't do that.

OH I know creatine works. Creatine was one of the factors that allowed me to gain 30lbs in one year (not all muscle of course, but I looked built which is what counted) and one of the few supps that I actually have no doubts about.
My concern was that whole loading phase bit. Many of the directions how to take creatine state that you should do this loading phase, when in reality it's not necessary and just a ploy to sell more creatine.

[glover78]

anywho I was hoping one of you kind folks an lead me to a form of supps that will give me steroid like effects (without it actually being steroids) which is sold over the counter

[Tijuana]

anywho I was hoping one of you kind folks an lead me to a form of supps that will give me steroid like effects (without it actually being steroids) which is sold over the counter

No supplement can give you steroid like results. There are certain supplements that you can take the can certainly give you better gains, but diet and your workout ethic will determine how much of your gains you will keep after you stop taking them. How old are you again?

[poedua]

Here are a few studies, read them over if you want.

http://health.med.umich.edu/healthco...eID=hn-4452006

AAKG is not the best pump product on the market. Creatine is essentially referred to as a pump product. I am not saying AAKG is a good pump ingredient, but for this product, that's why its in there.

That study is interesting, but it really didn't address my - much simpler - question to you....." How does Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate give you a ' pump ' exactly ? "

Actually, since you know a great deal about supplements, I simply wanted you to explain to me how AAKG and creatine have an impact on blood flow and blood volume in your muscles - how they actually improve a pump / blood flow.

Could you elaborate on that a bit more - the causation effect of AAKG and creatine and enhanced ' pump ' / blood flow ?

As I've said before, some people like that fact that their arms stay bigger for a few hours after taking it, and the more blood going to your muscle the stronger you can lift(marginally)

So, you're saying that if you improve your ' pump ' by means of supplements like AAKG, it is the ' pump ' that allows you to actually lift more weight ?

Obviously not. It was never implied that you do.

I agree with you.

Once again, obviously you can. Pre-workout's supplements do not imply that you NEED to take them. There are still alot of people that don't like using them. Your muscles grow due to how you exercise them. Improper technique will result in your muscles growing *badly*. These types of products dont state you will gain ANY muscle, all they state is the energy, drive and focus it gives you. You just need to try it for yourself, to understand what it does.

How does a muscle grow " badly " exactly ?

[poedua]

OH I know creatine works. Creatine was one of the factors that allowed me to gain 30lbs in one year (not all muscle of course, but I looked built which is what counted) and one of the few supps that I actually have no doubts about.

My concern was that whole loading phase bit. Many of the directions how to take creatine state that you should do this loading phase, when in reality it's not necessary and just a ploy to sell more creatine.

I'm not a creatine user myself, but of those people I know who have used creatine in any sort of serious and committed manner, almost all of them adhere to some sort of loading regimen...usually over the span of a week or a month's time.

Creatine loading is perfectly legit protocol IMO....farthest thing from a scam IMO.

[glover78]

[QUOTE=Tijuana;10857673] As long as you don't go for the walmart brand stuff, you should be okay. QUOTE]

I just finished a 2lb tub from walmart. I'm on a tight budget right now so I gotta go to walmart as oppose to popeyes. Stuff doesn't taste that great and turns out retardedly thick when using a blender to mix.

Arginine Alpha-Ketoglutarate

Does this stuff actually make your muscles still appear full and jacked well after a workout? If so, I wouldn't mind investing in this since I like to show off my guns when I'm at the clubs or in other situations when I'm in the presence of lovely ladies

No supplement can give you steroid like results. There are certain supplements that you can take the can certainly give you better gains, but diet and your workout ethic will determine how much of your gains you will keep after you stop taking them. How old are you again?

26

[poedua]

Does this stuff actually make your muscles still appear full and jacked well after a workout? If so, I wouldn't mind investing in this since I like to show off my guns when I'm at the clubs or in other situations when I'm in the presence of lovely ladies

26 years old eh.