Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Deal Fanatic
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Mar 23, 2008
9012 posts
5485 upvotes
Edmonton
RichardC009780 wrote:
May 22nd, 2019 2:17 pm
My court date is in two days and I received the following letter just in the mail. This is after applying for a stay of proceedings. I am not sure how to proceed from here:

The letter says "We received your application seeking a stay of proceedings alleging that your right to a trial within a reasonable time under s 11(b) of the Charter was violated. It is our position that the time from the offence date to the trial date (11 months 24 days) is well below the 18 month ceiling as set out by the Supreme Court of Canada in R v. Jordan [2016] S.C.J No. 27, 2016 SCC 27 and R v. Cody, [2017] S.C.J. No. 31, 2017 SCC 31. In accordance with the Supreme Court’s instructions to trial justices in paragraph 63 of Jordan and paragraph 38 of Cody, we will be asking the presiding justice of the peace to summarily dismiss your application since it is frivolous. We will not be submitting "

I was wondering if anyone can give me advice on what should I do on the actual date of trial in two days. Thanks in advance,

Richard
Unless you can think of a reason why your rights to a trial within a reasonable time have been violated that will convince the JP to throw away a Supreme Court decision, I think you can throw away that line of thinking. So you'll need to focus on the facts of your case. If that was the entirety of your defense, you might as well just show up and hope the cop is a no-show.

C
Deal Addict
Jan 7, 2014
2383 posts
448 upvotes
Winnipeg
I checked MPI online calc. You go 2 points down for offence of not slowing for stopped emergency vehicle. Just a question though. Does one ticket = one offence.
The way my ticket is written , it confuses me I am.hoping Insurance will not treat this as not slowing for emergency vehicle as well as speeding

"Exceeds 60 km/hr passing a stopped emergency vehicle lights activated.
Exceeds speed limit of 60 km/hr"
These are in 2 lines in description. Am I reading too much in it? Got a ticket first time in my life. I was on.highway, the speed was 110 km/hr
Newbie
May 22, 2019
2 posts
I was doing 72 in 55 mph zone ( the speed limit suddenly lowered from 65 to 55) and by the time I realized I was caught in a flash in Tonawanda town, NY. I read some stuff online and everyone is advising to 'Plead Not Guilty. I called the court and they gave me Town Prosecutor's address to mail in the ticket and explanation letter for 'Plead Not Guilty'. This is my first ticket with nearly 15 yrs of clean driving history. I may be impacted by 3 demerit points and record in my license which will spike my insurance. Can someone advise on tips to write an explanation letter. Also since I'm an Ontario resident, will the process be dealt by mail going forward.
Newbie
Mar 8, 2013
9 posts
5 upvotes
Waterloo
We were loaned a car and in the time that we were using it the owner of the vehicle received a ticket HTA 175(19) Failure to Stop School Bus - Owner in the mail. This occurred about 6 months ago.

My understanding is that this sort of ticket is attributed to the owner because it is unclear who was driving, similar to a parking or red-light camera ticket. It appears that this ticket comes with a fine for the owner but no other consequences such as entry on a driving record due to this uncertainty of who the driver was. We are willing to pay the fine.

The owner of the car plans to instead go to traffic court and testify that the ticket should be attributed to a specific person. What would happen in this case? Is it possible that the alleged driver would be charged with the greater offence of Failure to Stop School Bus, with it's accompanying demerit points and insurance increase?

This is located in Ontario.
Deal Addict
Mar 16, 2015
1578 posts
258 upvotes
^ offer him to pay the ticket as it was you who made mistake. Court can not assign the ticket to you just because he says so. Thats not how it works and btw how will he prove that it was you who were driving. If it was a lease or rent from a rental agency I can understand that you normally have written agreement with them but if it was an individual, did you have a written agreement? If not , just tell him to take the money else f off..
Newbie
Aug 14, 2011
23 posts
1 upvote
TORONTO
Hello

This happened in Toronto.

My brother was recently served a summons to court for an accessible parking permit violation. Long story short, he dropped off my dad at the clinic then he went to work and parked on the street - forgot to remove my dad's permit. He was not ticketed at the time, but he was served to appear before the Ontario Court of Justice.

Should we hire a paralegal? I believe the maximum fine is $5000.
Member
Jul 17, 2018
364 posts
103 upvotes
I was overtaking a vehicle in a 60 zone on a two lane road. I have dash cam footage that I overtook and slowed down. Got pulled over and the officer said I was doing 100. I disagree and he wrote me a ticket for 30 over. I am obviously wanting to take it to court. Should I get a paralegal?
Deal Fanatic
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Mar 23, 2008
9012 posts
5485 upvotes
Edmonton
Iamashill wrote:
May 25th, 2019 9:32 pm
I was overtaking a vehicle in a 60 zone on a two lane road. I have dash cam footage that I overtook and slowed down. Got pulled over and the officer said I was doing 100. I disagree and he wrote me a ticket for 30 over. I am obviously wanting to take it to court. Should I get a paralegal?
Nothing you’ve said is any kind of defence. And paralegal can’t do anything for you that you can’t do yourself. Most likely, they just negotiate it down and send you a bill, and you’d still get the insurance hit later. So go ahead, register for a trial, request your disclosure, and post back if you have questions.

And post your location if you post back later.

C
Member
Jul 17, 2018
364 posts
103 upvotes
CNeufeld wrote:
May 26th, 2019 12:03 am
Nothing you’ve said is any kind of defence. And paralegal can’t do anything for you that you can’t do yourself. Most likely, they just negotiate it down and send you a bill, and you’d still get the insurance hit later. So go ahead, register for a trial, request your disclosure, and post back if you have questions.

And post your location if you post back later.

C
Yes, I am aware I don't have a defence unless the officer doesn't show up or the calibration of the laser isn't up to standards.

I ideally would like a negotiation to a lower offence. Insurance and traffic history will take less of a hit than 30 over and 4 demerit points.

I am aware I could have been charged with 40 over and the officer did me a "favour".

I'm in Richmond Hill.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Mar 23, 2008
9012 posts
5485 upvotes
Edmonton
Iamashill wrote:
May 26th, 2019 12:23 am
Yes, I am aware I don't have a defence unless the officer doesn't show up or the calibration of the laser isn't up to standards.

I ideally would like a negotiation to a lower offence. Insurance and traffic history will take less of a hit than 30 over and 4 demerit points.

I am aware I could have been charged with 40 over and the officer did me a "favour".

I'm in Richmond Hill.
Keep in mind that if your ticket is marked as “Reduced”, the prosecution can request it be amended back up to the actual amount. But that’s only at the actual trial, so you’ll have a chance to plead guilty to the reduced amount before that, if it comes down to it.

Like I said, the paralegal can’t do anything for you that you can’t do yourself, so there’s not much point to hiring one unless you feel unsure about your negotiating skills or you’re not in the area.

Good luck!

C
Member
Jul 17, 2018
364 posts
103 upvotes
CNeufeld wrote:
May 26th, 2019 12:29 am
Keep in mind that if your ticket is marked as “Reduced”, the prosecution can request it be amended back up to the actual amount. But that’s only at the actual trial, so you’ll have a chance to plead guilty to the reduced amount before that, if it comes down to it.

Like I said, the paralegal can’t do anything for you that you can’t do yourself, so there’s not much point to hiring one unless you feel unsure about your negotiating skills or you’re not in the area.

Good luck!

C
Yes, it's not marked as reduced.

The speed on my dashcam and what he told me I was going is extremely contradicting.

I obviously dont expect an acquittal or withdrawn but I'd like to drop from 30 to 15 based upon the circumstances (e.g. what happened and dashcam)

I'm guessing unlike NY, you can't get it turned into a non-moving violation?
Newbie
May 25, 2019
2 posts
This is a great thread with a lot of valuable information.

I'm hoping I can get some help.

My son, 18 with a G license totalled his car last week. The officer charged him with careless driving with a summons to court. The accident occurred on a newly loosely gravelled road, and he was doing the speed limit. The car lost traction and he over-corrected which caused him to lose control. That is what he told the officers. I do believe he should be facing the consequences for his actions, but a full CD conviction will affect his choice of post-secondary schools he can attend and his career opportunities when he finishes school.

I have never been in this type of situation, and I'm not sure what the best next steps are.

Does it make sense to set-up an appointment with the prosecutor to try to reduce the charge? Or should he attend the summons and plead not guilty. Then at trail argue that the charge has no merit based on the fact that road was freshly gravelled, the signage indicated rough road, not loose gravel, the speed limit is 60 and the road transitions from paved to lose right before he lost control?

Thanks for helping.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Mar 23, 2008
9012 posts
5485 upvotes
Edmonton
SharonB7065 wrote:
May 26th, 2019 8:14 pm
This is a great thread with a lot of valuable information.

I'm hoping I can get some help.

My son, 18 with a G license totalled his car last week. The officer charged him with careless driving with a summons to court. The accident occurred on a newly loosely gravelled road, and he was doing the speed limit. The car lost traction and he over-corrected which caused him to lose control. That is what he told the officers. I do believe he should be facing the consequences for his actions, but a full CD conviction will affect his choice of post-secondary schools he can attend and his career opportunities when he finishes school.

I have never been in this type of situation, and I'm not sure what the best next steps are.

Does it make sense to set-up an appointment with the prosecutor to try to reduce the charge? Or should he attend the summons and plead not guilty. Then at trail argue that the charge has no merit based on the fact that road was freshly gravelled, the signage indicated rough road, not loose gravel, the speed limit is 60 and the road transitions from paved to lose right before he lost control?

Thanks for helping.
Not sure how a careless driving conviction will have the impact you say it will have on his life, but that's probably a subject for another thread... You may want to consider hiring a paralegal or lawyer for this, due to the risk of a high impact conviction. If you're going to hire representation, you might want to bring them in from the start to nip it in the bud and maybe avoid a trial altogether. I don't think they have much of a case against him, unless there's some evidence that you're not aware of yet (tire marks indicating high rates of acceleration?).

Are you basing his speed on what he told you, or were you there with him? Because, no offense intended to your son, kids have a tendency to say what they need to say to avoid trouble (speaking as the father of two ~20 year old kids). Especially to authority figures.

C
Newbie
May 25, 2019
2 posts
CNeufeld wrote:
May 27th, 2019 10:46 am
Not sure how a careless driving conviction will have the impact you say it will have on his life, but that's probably a subject for another thread... You may want to consider hiring a paralegal or lawyer for this, due to the risk of a high impact conviction. If you're going to hire representation, you might want to bring them in from the start to nip it in the bud and maybe avoid a trial altogether. I don't think they have much of a case against him, unless there's some evidence that you're not aware of yet (tire marks indicating high rates of acceleration?).

Are you basing his speed on what he told you, or were you there with him? Because, no offense intended to your son, kids have a tendency to say what they need to say to avoid trouble (speaking as the father of two ~20 year old kids). Especially to authority figures.

C
Thanks for your response.

As for the speed, he states he was not speeding, and I believe the passengers said that in their statements as well. I'm hoping that is the case. I arrived after the accident and didn't see the officers recording anything like tire marks or measuring distances. That may have been done before I arrived. My son indicates that he didn't witness anything like that either.

We are going to find out from the county the date the road was last gravelled or grated. I know it was in the last 3-4 weeks because the road was closed until spring maintenance because of the conditions of the road and flooding.

This road has seen several accidents over the last several years (including a fatality) due to its poor conditions. I have a city report from 2005 that recommends the road be paved because of the state of the road.

The decision to hire a lawyer will be his. I'm just providing guidance and options.

Again, thanks for your time and input. I really do appreciate it.
Newbie
May 26, 2019
3 posts
So I have a trial set for tomorrow morning (just came across this thread this afternoon), and I have not been provided disclosure. I did request it a couple months ago, and have an email record stating that disclosure would be emailed to me once it's available.

After reading some earlier posts in this thread, I learned that I should have made multiple requests and should have filed for a stay at least 15 days before the trial date. I did not know to do this.

The charge is for operating a handheld device while driving (Ontario; under the new laws). I am not that person, and without disclosure, I have no idea what the officer saw. Dialogue with the officer was kept to a minimum.

Due to the nature of my work, an adjournment could potentially be more financially burdensome than just paying the fine and subsequent insurance rate increases, which is itself not insignificant.

What would be my best course of action? Advice is much appreciated.

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