Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Deal Addict
Jul 28, 2003
1879 posts
55 upvotes
Toronto
It's my pleasure to share my experiences, and I am glad to know you were able to draw from them to assist you in some way.

I am still trying to figure out if the Justice of the Peace that I had when my trial was adjourned will be the same Justice when I go back on June 26. If that is the case, I will have to just plead guilty to a lesser fine (if at all possible at this point).

Make sure you submit your disclosure request immediately, and then fax your Form 4F for a Stay Application by next Monday so that you fulfill the 15 day requirement (not including the day it is sent, and the date of your trial).

Also ensure that you go back to the Court house and provide them with a copy of your Form 4F and the fax receipts to the Attorneys General of Canada, Ontario and the Prosecutor's Office.

Good luck!
villaseea wrote:
Jun 4th, 2014 4:03 pm
Hi MadCow,

For what it's worth, I appreciate the posts you've been making on this thread as it helped me prepare for my trial today.

My situation is similar to what you've described
- I received disclosure items the day of the trial;
- The supplied information looked incomplete, specifically: certificate of Parking Infraction (not really sure what this looks like as they only provided a photocopy of the Parking Infraction Notice) & evidence of ownership;
- My request for a stay based on incomplete disclosure was not entertained, as the court felt it was 'just a parking ticket';
- I was granted an adjournment to June 25th.

My argument was based on the fact that I never received the ticket as I only responded to the notice of impending conviction, so I think the above missing disclosure items is consistent with that argument.

I think my chances of getting a stay is low - both the court & the officer did not seem to think what I requested was necessary but I've been given some more time now.
So my plan is to submit the disclosure request again for the missing items and depending on what I receive, ask for a stay again.
I was caught off guard when they asked what date I would like to adjourn the trial to, since I thought I was going to go back in the system again and potentially argue for a Section 11 unreasonable delay. The chances the officer will show up is high since the prosecutor basically confirmed the dates with him on the spot...
Newbie
Aug 15, 2012
10 posts
2 upvotes
Hello Everyone,

I received a speeding ticket on February 1st "2013" in Gatineau (Quebec) for driving 126km/r in a 100km/h zone. I was given 30 days to either pay the fine or submit a request for trial.

Since the Notice of Infraction was in French, On February 21st 2013, I request an English copy of the ticket.

2 Months later (April 9 2013), I was mailed an English copy of the ticket.

On April 10 2013, I submitted my request for an English Trial and also requested the police officer's presents (since its not required in Quebec) so that I may question him.

Over 10 months later (February 24th 2014), I received my Notice of Trial which is scheduled to take place June 26, 2014.

As per djino's instructions on the first post, on February 25th, 2014, I contacted the court to obtain the Prosecutor's contact/fax info. I then immediately submitted the waiver letter asking that they reschedule my trial since I am experiencing an unreasonable delay. On the same day, I also submitted my First Disclosure Request.

Since I had received nothing in the two and a half months following, on May 5th, 2014, I submitted a second Disclosure Request.

-------

It is now 3 weeks until my Trial. I have not received anything from the prosecutor and it will be almost 17 months between the date the offense occurred and my trial date. Djino's Form 4F as shown on the second post is specific to Ontario's regulations concerning seeking a remedy for a violation of a Charter Right. I have spent several hours online trying to find something similar to submit for Quebec, but I am not able too. Can anyone help?

I plan to make two motions to stay based on unreasonable delay and my right to disclosure. I have reviewed Quebec's Charter of human rights and Freedoms. I do see Section 32.1 states the following, which is reflective of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms Section 11b..

[QUOTE]32.1. Every accused person has a right to be tried within a reasonable time.[/QUOTE]

Though I cannot find a section in the Quebec Charter that is reflective of Section 7 of the Canadian Charter, but I assume regardless, I can still invoke my Canadian Charter Right even here in Quebec.

Section 24(1) of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states

[QUOTE]24. (1) Anyone whose rights or freedoms, as guaranteed by this Charter, have been infringed or denied may apply to a court of competent jurisdiction to obtain such remedy as the court considers appropriate and just in the circumstances.[/QUOTE]

This implies that I should seek remedy of a stay of my trial through the Courts of Quebec. I have reviewed Quebec's Charter of Human rights and freedoms, Quebec's Courts of Justice Act, Quebec's Penal Code and Procedure, Quebec's Highway Safety Code, and no section in any of these documents contain any discussion/process for how one is to claim a remedy of a violation of my rights from either Canadian/Quebec charter as it does in Ontario's Courts of Justice Act for Section 109.

Can anyone provide any help? What am I missing?
Newbie
Aug 9, 2014
1 posts
Hello. I have a speeding ticket dated october 29th 2013. I requested early resolution, hoping they would drop the charges, they did not. I then submitted 2 requests for disclosure without any answer. Three weeks ago I faxed and mailed 4F for violation of section 7. Yesterday, the prosecutor's office left me a voicemail saying my disclosure is ready for pick-up. I never left them my number anywhere. The trial date is June 18th, so they called 12 calender days (8 business days) before the trial to tell me i can pick-up my disclosure. What do I do? My plan is to not pick it up and continue with my pre-trial motion to stay the trial. How should I fight their attempts at saying the disclosure was ready? I feel like they called me because they finally discovered my 4F submission. Thank you in advance.
Banned
User avatar
Jun 22, 2012
4737 posts
683 upvotes
Shhanada
speakerring wrote:
Jun 4th, 2014 12:14 pm
should I request it through mail, pretending not knowing that they won't send through mail
and say that during the trial that I did not receive and disclosures so ask for Stay?
If you want to follow the tips of the "ticket busters" that dominate RFD, then yes, pretend, lie, and commit perjury as often as you can. But if you want to be a law abiding citizen and decent human being, don't do that. It's your call!
Banned
User avatar
Jun 22, 2012
4737 posts
683 upvotes
Shhanada
WindMobileCSR wrote:
Jun 4th, 2014 6:37 pm
Hello Everyone,

I received a speeding ticket on February 1st "2013" in Gatineau (Quebec) for driving 126km/r in a 100km/h zone. I was given 30 days to either pay the fine or submit a request for trial.

Since the Notice of Infraction was in French, On February 21st 2013, I request an English copy of the ticket.

2 Months later (April 9 2013), I was mailed an English copy of the ticket.

On April 10 2013, I submitted my request for an English Trial and also requested the police officer's presents (since its not required in Quebec) so that I may question him.

Over 10 months later (February 24th 2014), I received my Notice of Trial which is scheduled to take place June 26, 2014.

As per djino's instructions on the first post, on February 25th, 2014, I contacted the court to obtain the Prosecutor's contact/fax info. I then immediately submitted the waiver letter asking that they reschedule my trial since I am experiencing an unreasonable delay. On the same day, I also submitted my First Disclosure Request.

Since I had received nothing in the two and a half months following, on May 5th, 2014, I submitted a second Disclosure Request.

-------

It is now 3 weeks until my Trial. I have not received anything from the prosecutor and it will be almost 17 months between the date the offense occurred and my trial date. Djino's Form 4F as shown on the second post is specific to Ontario's regulations concerning seeking a remedy for a violation of a Charter Right. I have spent several hours online trying to find something similar to submit for Quebec, but I am not able too. Can anyone help?

I plan to make two motions to stay based on unreasonable delay and my right to disclosure. I have reviewed Quebec's Charter of human rights and Freedoms. I do see Section 32.1 states the following, which is reflective of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms Section 11b..



Though I cannot find a section in the Quebec Charter that is reflective of Section 7 of the Canadian Charter, but I assume regardless, I can still invoke my Canadian Charter Right even here in Quebec.

Section 24(1) of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states



This implies that I should seek remedy of a stay of my trial through the Courts of Quebec. I have reviewed Quebec's Charter of Human rights and freedoms, Quebec's Courts of Justice Act, Quebec's Penal Code and Procedure, Quebec's Highway Safety Code, and no section in any of these documents contain any discussion/process for how one is to claim a remedy of a violation of my rights from either Canadian/Quebec charter as it does in Ontario's Courts of Justice Act for Section 109.

Can anyone provide any help? What am I missing?
By requesting trial on April 10 for a Feb 1 offense, perhaps you violated the 30 day deadline?

Question: did you commit the offense? If so, why not just pay and take the lesson from it? You've already expended a lot of time and money.
Banned
User avatar
Jun 22, 2012
4737 posts
683 upvotes
Shhanada
blitzforce wrote:
Jun 3rd, 2014 3:08 pm
This is what perplexes me but what evidence does the speeding ticket officer have to convict someone? I mean during trial, they don't have a picture of him pointing the laser at your car, all they say is "my laser was pointed at your car" which they can easily lie. However the justice will ask whether I have evidence to prove my innocence?

I feel that the justice will almost always side with the officer and that the only way to win speeding tickets is through "technicalities" such as them forgetting to input the data within reasonable time, or that the trail date is way past reasonable time frame so you can file for a motion to stay and not really based on evidence during cross-examinations.
Actually you are seeing this situation fairly clearly. This internet board is a weird microcosm where most of the people think police and law enforcement are all cartoon villains, and they promote using technicalities and loopholes to try to avoid consequences of offenses. This is a skewed perspective, and the ticket busting philosophy attracts a small group of people with a shared viewpoint that doesn't reflect real society as a whole.

One thing you say that's incorrect though is about the evidence from law enforcement. Actually it does matter as it's the foundation of our justice system. Having logs or reports from equipment is a way of proving and confirming the details of the offense. It would be very hard to fake this kind of evidence, and there's really no rational reason why they would when it would be a million times easier to just take 3 minutes and catch the next speeder rather than spend hours "framing" some innocent driver.

You also say it's easy for a ticket officer to "just lie". Actually it's not. Lies have a tendency to unravel. Someone who has to testify thousands of times in the course of doing their job would almost certainly reveal problems if they were lying. They might get away with it several times, maybe even several dozen times. But it would eventually happen that a lie about giving a ticket at some day/time would be contradicted by a video, or a witness, or a circumstance... and their habit would be exposed.

On the other hand, for RFD ticket buster who only goes to court on a rare basis, it's easy to lie (aka commit perjury) and get away with it. That's why it seems to be one of the main tactics endorsed here.
Newbie
Oct 6, 2006
21 posts
Hi everyone,

So I got my first speeding ticket in 7 years in Mississauga, and have a trial date set for July. There is no fault in the disclosure or the trial date filing. I am more concerned about the increase in my insurance than the fine itself (especially being a male under 25), I was hoping to see if I can get a not guilty verdict/have the ticket thrown out in exchange for contributing 2x of the fine to a charity? Would a prosecutor be willing to go for it, or would I have to ask this to the judge in court?
Deal Addict
Aug 27, 2011
3047 posts
337 upvotes
Toronto
rijet wrote:
Jun 6th, 2014 5:23 pm
Hi everyone,

So I got my first speeding ticket in 7 years in Mississauga, and have a trial date set for July. There is no fault in the disclosure or the trial date filing. I am more concerned about the increase in my insurance than the fine itself (especially being a male under 25), I was hoping to see if I can get a not guilty verdict/have the ticket thrown out in exchange for contributing 2x of the fine to a charity? Would a prosecutor be willing to go for it, or would I have to ask this to the judge in court?
No chance on the ticket thrown out for charity scheme.
Sr. Member
Sep 29, 2007
509 posts
102 upvotes
Port Colborne
MadCow wrote:
Jun 4th, 2014 5:09 pm
It's my pleasure to share my experiences, and I am glad to know you were able to draw from them to assist you in some way.

I am still trying to figure out if the Justice of the Peace that I had when my trial was adjourned will be the same Justice when I go back on June 26. If that is the case, I will have to just plead guilty to a lesser fine (if at all possible at this point).

Make sure you submit your disclosure request immediately, and then fax your Form 4F for a Stay Application by next Monday so that you fulfill the 15 day requirement (not including the day it is sent, and the date of your trial).

Also ensure that you go back to the Court house and provide them with a copy of your Form 4F and the fax receipts to the Attorneys General of Canada, Ontario and the Prosecutor's Office.

Good luck!
How come over at ontariohighwaytrafficact.com forums they tell you to put together this whole booklet for a stay application and say to not use a Form 4F, saying it was wrong all along and to be used for civil cases?
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 26, 2007
1162 posts
109 upvotes
what if I received the letter for trial for parking ticket, can I still fight....
Member
Apr 20, 2011
460 posts
16 upvotes
Scarborough
I have requested disclosure by mail for a speeding ticket I received in Owen Sound. 20 km/hr over the posted limit. I have not received a response yet, but I have a trial date close to the end of month. Should I send another request e-mail? When it comes to date of the trial, and I have not received any disclosure, how will the court verify I mailed out X number of disclosure requests, if I state that I did and have not received anything...

Thanks.
Deal Guru
User avatar
Feb 24, 2007
13123 posts
1660 upvotes
dainfamous41 wrote:
Jun 7th, 2014 6:42 pm
I have requested disclosure by mail for a speeding ticket I received in Owen Sound. 20 km/hr over the posted limit. I have not received a response yet, but I have a trial date close to the end of month. Should I send another request e-mail? When it comes to date of the trial, and I have not received any disclosure, how will the court verify I mailed out X number of disclosure requests, if I state that I did and have not received anything...

Thanks.
Everytime, I had made a request for a disclosure it was done in person. I was told that only in-person visits, will the the prosecutor/crown fulfill these requests?
Sr. Member
Sep 29, 2007
509 posts
102 upvotes
Port Colborne
sounds like you need to be in the speeding ticket thread to stop screwing this up

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