Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Deal Addict
Aug 27, 2011
3047 posts
339 upvotes
Toronto
helppls wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2015 5:29 pm
I have a "driving with undo care" charge against me from back in Aug, i'm in BC. I missed my dispute period, but was approved for my affidavit and have now received a court date. Unfortunately (or fortunately, I don't know) the hearing date I received (april) is for during my pre-booked vacation (till june). I was planning to request disclosure as the case is somewhat odd (for towing a skateboarder behind my car, not observed by the officer, but reported by a witness). Any input you can provide on how to go about my appeals would be much appreciated.
Well, you are going to have to ask for an adjournment until after June. If the officer did not observe the act, the witness will most likely have to testify.
Newbie
Jan 24, 2011
3 posts
Toronto
joepoonie wrote:
Jan 22nd, 2015 6:55 pm
This was from Google: http://technology.canoe.ca/Columnists/C ... 90921.html

Basically this was tried before, but the court ruled that for computer printed tickets, as long as the name is printed and the officer can identify that it was him/her who provided the ticket the ticket will stand.

Like I said before, don't bother on that fatal flaw - you won't win based on the case law above.
Upon reading over the article in the link, it repeatedly refrences an 'e-signature' which (as far as I understand it) is a scanned image of a signature that is printed onto the ticket rather than signed after printing. In this case it isn't an 'e-signature' just a typed name... I'd hope that this is more that a technical difference but unless this particular JP is interested in splitting hairs then I'm sure you're right. Crap!

The Paralegal I spoke with either didn't know or didn't want me to know this isn't a Fatal Flaw... can anyone recommend an honest legal professional (oxy-moron, lol), rather than the Ticket-Buster places out there?

Afterward, I found a link to the ruling regarding printed tickets.... http://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/doc/20 ... c1548.html
Section 22 is that part that deals with e-signatures and from what I can translate, even a typed 'signature' is considered a signature if the method/process required to print the ticket is 'presumed reasonably secure against unauthorized use'... because they have to provide credentials to log into the machine that prints the tickets, that is good enough. What a crock! lol
Deal Addict
Aug 27, 2011
3047 posts
339 upvotes
Toronto
Orbserver wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2015 8:36 pm
Upon reading over the article in the link, it repeatedly refrences an 'e-signature' which (as far as I understand it) is a scanned image of a signature that is printed onto the ticket rather than signed after printing. In this case it isn't an 'e-signature' just a typed name... I'd hope that this is more that a technical difference but unless this particular JP is interested in splitting hairs then I'm sure you're right. Crap!

The Paralegal I spoke with either didn't know or didn't want me to know this isn't a Fatal Flaw... can anyone recommend an honest legal professional (oxy-moron, lol), rather than the Ticket-Buster places out there?

Afterward, I found a link to the ruling regarding printed tickets.... http://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/doc/20 ... c1548.html
Section 22 is that part that deals with e-signatures and from what I can translate, even a typed 'signature' is considered a signature if the method/process required to print the ticket is 'presumed reasonably secure against unauthorized use'... because they have to provide credentials to log into the machine that prints the tickets, that is good enough. What a crock! lol
As I stated before, the info I provided is correct. As long as the name is printed and the cop can identify that it was him/her who provided the ticket, you're screwed.

There is no one that will take this case on as a fatal flaw, since it very clearly isn't one.
Sr. Member
Sep 29, 2007
513 posts
105 upvotes
Port Colborne
GardinerGuy wrote:
Jan 22nd, 2015 12:16 pm
*** CHARGES WITHDRAWN ***

Djino and everyone else, thanks for your help.

I was at the court house yesterday and ready to go to trial. When I had approached the prosecutor, she said "ok, we have an 11b and charges will be withdrawn, have a seat and you'll be the first called up".

When I approached the bench, I was asked for my name, to which I replied GardinerGuy and the prosecutor said that she had an 11b and charges were to be withdrawn. The justice then mentioned to the prosecutor that the the court had no knowledge of an 11b. She advised the justice that she had just attached it and is providing it to the courts now. Justice said charges were withdrawn. I left.

Now what happened????

Since the moment I received my trial date. I fought to get disclosure. Disclosure was never offered. 15 days before the trial, I submitted a Form 4F to the Attorney Generals of Canada and Ontario by fax. I also faxed a copy to the prosecutors office. I was going to make a motion to stay the trial due to lack of disclosure under Section 7.

Instead, I had this sprung upon me. I figure its because the prosecution doesn't want to look incompetent by not providing me with disclosure. In fact, disclosure wasn't even offered to me when I first met with her.

Either way, charges were withdrawn and thanks to this board for helping.

** Observations At Court **

I found it odd that most people came to the court house just to plea bargain for $20 reduction on their tickets.

Everyone was going to the prosecutor asking for advice on how to get off the charge..... redic!

The provincial officer who gave me my ticket *was* there and had other cases to deal with. He is one ugly mofo BTW.... I couldnt stand to look at him when he gave me the ticket let alone again today. Plus his cheap $50 International Clothiers suit made him look even more redic

The first thing the justice told the court was that there was 45 cases and he only had an hour to handle all of them, he then gave a lecture to everyone as to why parking tickets are absolute offences and that if we were to plead guilty and take ownership, he would lower peoples fines.

I was going to stay and watch everyone else, but they all looked like losers and I didn't want to waste my time because I knew all of them were going to plead guilty. What fun is there watching that?
Try being more respectful. Also, "redic" isn't a word if you're over 18 and don't live in your parents' basement.
Newbie
May 5, 2014
1 posts
Brossard, QC
Hi all,

Three months ago, I got stopped by police for not letting the pedestrian to cross the roadway. Only now I receive the statement of offence by mail.

Details:
I actually stopped for the pedestrian, who refused to cross, that's when I decided to just go ahead. Then the police from the opposite side stopped me and charged me for violating C-24.2 Art 410. "Where a pedestrian enters a pedestrian crosswalk, the driver of a road vehicle or any person riding a bicycle must stop his vehicle to allow the pedestrian to cross the roadway." I also remember there was a car in front of the police, I doubt if he could clearly see what happened.

I was wondering if it is worthy fighting, if so, how should I proceed?

Thanks,
Chun
Deal Addict
Dec 23, 2006
1213 posts
99 upvotes
hey do parking tickets follow the same format as speeding tickets?
I plan on fighitning my parking ticket the exact same way -> request trial, send lettter in to request disclosure, if 6 months pass by after infraction date excercise my right for a speedy trial?
Newbie
Jan 23, 2015
1 posts
Toronto, ON
Is anyone familiar with the Sask provincial court proceedings for fighting a stunting ticket? I would like to defend myself, but haven't the slightest idea of how to do so. I have received my disclosure files and have reviewed them. Would someone be able to walk me through the court process? I live in Saskatchewan by the way. I have my court date set for the 27th of January, so time is of the essence. Thanks
Newbie
Nov 24, 2014
2 posts
Toronto, ON
I posted here before looking for help on my red light ticket I got back in September. So I have my trial tomorrow and this is my first one. I just want to know what's going to happen. So I get to court, do I look for the officer first (is there a designated spot for them)? When I was Issued the ticket there were 2 officers. Can either one of them show up or it has to be issuing officer?

Scenario 1: No officer.

If no officer shows up, do I talk to the prosecutor at all (even to let him know I'm here or not), or talk to him no matter what. Can he let me know if the officer is here. Should I tell him that the officer is not here so im going to plea guilty.

Scenario 2: Officer shows

If the officer shows up do I talk to him or just go and talk to the prosecutor? When talking to prosecutor what would be the best deal to ask for. My most important concern is that I don't want it to show up on my record because of insurance. Can I ask for something like a course. Any suggestions. Lastly is it possible to talk to the JP.

Any help would be appreciated.
Deal Addict
Aug 27, 2011
3047 posts
339 upvotes
Toronto
aansar88 wrote:
Jan 25th, 2015 11:15 am
I posted here before looking for help on my red light ticket I got back in September. So I have my trial tomorrow and this is my first one. I just want to know what's going to happen. So I get to court, do I look for the officer first (is there a designated spot for them)? When I was Issued the ticket there were 2 officers. Can either one of them show up or it has to be issuing officer?

Scenario 1: No officer.

If no officer shows up, do I talk to the prosecutor at all (even to let him know I'm here or not), or talk to him no matter what. Can he let me know if the officer is here. Should I tell him that the officer is not here so im going to plea guilty.

Scenario 2: Officer shows

If the officer shows up do I talk to him or just go and talk to the prosecutor? When talking to prosecutor what would be the best deal to ask for. My most important concern is that I don't want it to show up on my record because of insurance. Can I ask for something like a course. Any suggestions. Lastly is it possible to talk to the JP.

Any help would be appreciated.
It is up to you to see whether the officer is present or not. If the officer is present, the prosecutor will most likely offer a plea-bargain. It's up to you to take it or not.
Newbie
Aug 30, 2011
68 posts
4 upvotes
Vancouver
Got no response last time, so let me ask this again....
Anikiri wrote:
Dec 22nd, 2014 2:39 pm
Do the whole disclosure thing.

11B has to be done about 5-6 weeks before trial. And yes you have to do 4F.
So I went to the court in Dec 2014, and ended up starting the 11B process (Charter Argument). I did not submit 4F or any other other forms/explanations - they just took my name and file number, and rescheduled my hearing date from February to May. They said on the day of the hearing, the judge will consider my Charter Argument first, and will either accept or dismiss it. In the latter case, the judge will then look into the actual violaton, then and there, and that police officer is also going to be there.

Does that sound right?

Also, I have not submitted my request for disclosure yet, should I submit it now, or closer to the hearing date (May 2015)?
Member
Nov 20, 2007
347 posts
17 upvotes
Quick question. Aware of someone receiving a fail to present insurance slip (had new older and current slip in vehicle but not able to locate it to present to officer at the time) and turn against traffic sign (ie turn left from Eglinton to Yonge where there was no turn left sign indicating buses only). Officer at scene indicated to fight it, plead guilty to insurance ticket and they will withdraw turn against sign. Looking to get both withdrawn or plead to some sort of offence equivalent to a parking ticket or bylaw vs HTA that might impact insurance. Anyone have luck with that based on the above or similar offences? if yes, what was the exact offence (section and number)? if no, any recommendations on the above?

I guess its not that quick of a question after all ;) Thanks.
Newbie
Jan 22, 2015
2 posts
Ottawa, ON
joepoonie wrote:
Jan 23rd, 2015 4:57 pm
Well, it has been two years since you got your ticket, you should be able to file an 11b, or whatever it's called in Quebec since it's taken two years to bring the ticket to trial.
After reading much of this thread I was thinking of filing for an 11b as well...

Is it possible/necessary to ask for disclosure again? Is it odd that no officer notes were included in the disclosure that I received?

Thanks for the help!
Deal Guru
Aug 26, 2002
12307 posts
4119 upvotes
Toronto, ON
aansar88 wrote:
Jan 25th, 2015 11:15 am
I posted here before looking for help on my red light ticket I got back in September. So I have my trial tomorrow and this is my first one. I just want to know what's going to happen. So I get to court, do I look for the officer first (is there a designated spot for them)? When I was Issued the ticket there were 2 officers. Can either one of them show up or it has to be issuing officer?

Scenario 1: No officer.

If no officer shows up, do I talk to the prosecutor at all (even to let him know I'm here or not), or talk to him no matter what. Can he let me know if the officer is here. Should I tell him that the officer is not here so im going to plea guilty.

Scenario 2: Officer shows

If the officer shows up do I talk to him or just go and talk to the prosecutor? When talking to prosecutor what would be the best deal to ask for. My most important concern is that I don't want it to show up on my record because of insurance. Can I ask for something like a course. Any suggestions. Lastly is it possible to talk to the JP.

Any help would be appreciated.
Why would you plea guilty if the officer doesn't show? You plea *not guilty* if the officer doesn't show. The justice will hear your case. The prosecutor will not be able to produce a witness (ie. the officer) so he/she will have to withdraw the charge against you. Justice will tell you "you're free to go." If you plea guilty you will have to pay the fine and the conviction goes on your record.

You main contact regardless of which scenario is the prosecutor. You have to check in with him/her when you arrive and you have to enter a plea with him/her. You don't need to talk to the officer and he/she probably won't talk to you. The officer is there to be called up as witness in cases where the defendant wants to plea not guilty to the charge. And no, you cannot talk to the JP unless he/she addresses you.
Newbie
Jan 25, 2015
5 posts
Toronto, ON
Hey guys, I need your help. I got a $730, 10 point ticket for speeding at 105km/h on the highway (caught on laser though the cop didn't show me) because it was actually a construction zone. Its usually a 4-lane highway but there were cones that were merging the lanes into one. I got onto the highway when there was already 2 lanes merging into one and there was absolutely no one there, no construction going on just a bunch of cones. I got pulled over maybe 200meters after having gotten onto the highway, not realizing that its a construction zone and starting to slow down, but it was too late. The cops (Surete Quebec, provincial not municipal) were practically just waiting for me. It was at around 1:15am, I had finished work at midnight, gone home and was going back to a friend's.

I got the ticket in mid-July, 2013 and obviously contested it to win me time. My first court hearing was in October of 2014, postponed it and now my next hearing is on the 13th of February. Now I can get a lawyer and pay another $750 and not get the points but I'm thinking of just changing my plea and paying it so that i don't pay double. Could I call the prosecutor in advance and ask for a plea bargain saying that I had an emergency and hadn't realized that its a construction zone as there was no actual construction going on? I don't mind paying the fine (i'll just take payment arrangments and pay $50 a month), but the points are too much! Also, I do have my full points at the moment which could work in my favor and I had a friend in the car with me at the time. I actually didn't have my insurance papers either but he let it go as he was content with giving me a 10point ticket which probably filled his quota for the month. What's my best way to go about this to minimize the fees and points? Do I call the prosecutor and if so what do I tell him!?

Help would be very much appreciated!!
Deal Guru
Aug 26, 2002
12307 posts
4119 upvotes
Toronto, ON
optimusone8 wrote:
Jan 26th, 2015 4:19 pm
Hey guys, I need your help. I got a $730, 10 point ticket for speeding at 105km/h on the highway (caught on laser though the cop didn't show me) because it was actually a construction zone. Its usually a 4-lane highway but there were cones that were merging the lanes into one. I got onto the highway when there was already 2 lanes merging into one and there was absolutely no one there, no construction going on just a bunch of cones. I got pulled over maybe 200meters after having gotten onto the highway, not realizing that its a construction zone and starting to slow down, but it was too late. The cops (Surete Quebec, provincial not municipal) were practically just waiting for me. It was at around 1:15am, I had finished work at midnight, gone home and was going back to a friend's.

I got the ticket in mid-July, 2013 and obviously contested it to win me time. My first court hearing was in October of 2014, postponed it and now my next hearing is on the 13th of February. Now I can get a lawyer and pay another $750 and not get the points but I'm thinking of just changing my plea and paying it so that i don't pay double. Could I call the prosecutor in advance and ask for a plea bargain saying that I had an emergency and hadn't realized that its a construction zone as there was no actual construction going on? I don't mind paying the fine (i'll just take payment arrangments and pay $50 a month), but the points are too much! Also, I do have my full points at the moment which could work in my favor and I had a friend in the car with me at the time. I actually didn't have my insurance papers either but he let it go as he was content with giving me a 10point ticket which probably filled his quota for the month. What's my best way to go about this to minimize the fees and points? Do I call the prosecutor and if so what do I tell him!?

Help would be very much appreciated!!
What was the actual posted speed limit?

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