Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Member
Aug 26, 2005
411 posts
1323 upvotes
Toronto
I'm wondering if i can get some advise on my situation.

Yesterday my wife was issued a speeding ticket in Mississauga. Apparently the officer told her she was doing 65 in 40 km zone. The officer reduced the ticket to 10 over the speed limit. Up until that point my wife had a clean driving record (we both do). I asked my wife if it was speed trap or if the officer had some sort of radar gun and she told me the officer didn't mention anything about radar gun or showed any proof that she was doing 65 km / hour. My wife is not type that speeds, she might be 10 km over the limit if anything, but that's about it. She told me that she is confident she wasn't doing 65.

My question is does the officer need to provide evidence on the spot as to how it was determined she was doing 65 km? Is it worth fighting the ticket? Will my insurance premium increase?

I reviewed the ticket and i don't see any technical "errors". The officer was in an unmarked vehicle and the ticket was reduced because of the clean driving record.

Any feedback is appreciated.
Deal Guru
User avatar
Mar 23, 2008
13006 posts
10009 upvotes
Edmonton
4gen_accord wrote: I'm wondering if i can get some advise on my situation.

Yesterday my wife was issued a speeding ticket in Mississauga. Apparently the officer told her she was doing 65 in 40 km zone. The officer reduced the ticket to 10 over the speed limit. Up until that point my wife had a clean driving record (we both do). I asked my wife if it was speed trap or if the officer had some sort of radar gun and she told me the officer didn't mention anything about radar gun or showed any proof that she was doing 65 km / hour. My wife is not type that speeds, she might be 10 km over the limit if anything, but that's about it. She told me that she is confident she wasn't doing 65.

My question is does the officer need to provide evidence on the spot as to how it was determined she was doing 65 km? Is it worth fighting the ticket? Will my insurance premium increase?

I reviewed the ticket and i don't see any technical "errors". The officer was in an unmarked vehicle and the ticket was reduced because of the clean driving record.

Any feedback is appreciated.
Like every other ticket... If you think you want to fight it, request a trial, and get disclosure. That will tell you what evidence will be presented. But keep in mind that it you proceed to the point of an actual trial, the prosecutor can ask that the ticket be amended to 25 over instead of 10 over. But you’re a long ways from that, and can plead guilty to the 10 over anytime before that.

You can also check with your insurer to see if you have any form of ticket forgiveness. It’s possible the first ticket will have no effect on your rates, as long as you stay with your insurer.

C
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
jon_na_fun wrote: See picture of ticket attached. I asked for disclosure and notes are very good. If the HTA section is incorrect from the offence of disobey sign, should I not show up for the trial and they will throw out the ticket? Will there be a possibility they can change it without my wife showing up or charge her anyways without realizing the HTA is incorrect?

Original Ticket
Okay so it is indeed a FATAL ERROR ... there is no set fine for section 151(1) therefore they can not put a set fine on the ticket and when you read 151(1) it is simply saying minister can make regulation.

If you do not show up for trial, they can not change it. If you DO show up for trial, then they could change it.

Do not show up for trial, and there are two possible outcomes:
(i) most likely, the prosecutor or JP will see the error and throw out the ticket, or
(ii) small chance, she will be found guilty of the charge.

If she is found guilty, then you have to file an APPEAL (make sure to file for APPEAL and not a RE-OPENING). At the appeal you would show up with your original ticket and simply tell the judge that there is no set fine for section 151(1) and also the charge is incorrect so she did not show up for trial based on the information that was on the Notice of Offence received from the officer.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
4gen_accord wrote: I'm wondering if i can get some advise on my situation.

Yesterday my wife was issued a speeding ticket in Mississauga. Apparently the officer told her she was doing 65 in 40 km zone. The officer reduced the ticket to 10 over the speed limit. Up until that point my wife had a clean driving record (we both do). I asked my wife if it was speed trap or if the officer had some sort of radar gun and she told me the officer didn't mention anything about radar gun or showed any proof that she was doing 65 km / hour. My wife is not type that speeds, she might be 10 km over the limit if anything, but that's about it. She told me that she is confident she wasn't doing 65.

My question is does the officer need to provide evidence on the spot as to how it was determined she was doing 65 km? Is it worth fighting the ticket? Will my insurance premium increase?

I reviewed the ticket and i don't see any technical "errors". The officer was in an unmarked vehicle and the ticket was reduced because of the clean driving record.

Any feedback is appreciated.
No the officer does not need to show you any evidence that you were speeding.

My recommendation is that you can plead not gulty and request a trial and then when you get your Notice of Trial you can request disclosure (officers notes) and the officers notes will have the details on how they determined she was speeding. This is your RIGHT to see disclosure. If the officers notes look good and chances of beating it are slim to none, then you can still just pay the original fine anytime before the trial without penalty.

In the end if it is the officers word against your wife's, who do you think they will believe?

Yes even a 10 over 0 demerit point speeding can cause your insurance to go up the same as if you had a 49 over 4 demerit point charge. Insurance does not care about demerit points. Only your insurance company can really confirm what that increase will be. Worst case would probably be 5% to 10% for three years. So consider the cost to fight it probably would be more than the insurance increase.

But I still recommend you plead not guilty and get the disclosure before just paying it. Post the officers notes here when you get them.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Member
Aug 26, 2005
411 posts
1323 upvotes
Toronto
ShrekTek wrote: No the officer does not need to show you any evidence that you were speeding.

My recommendation is that you can plead not gulty and request a trial and then when you get your Notice of Trial you can request disclosure (officers notes) and the officers notes will have the details on how they determined she was speeding. This is your RIGHT to see disclosure. If the officers notes look good and chances of beating it are slim to none, then you can still just pay the original fine anytime before the trial without penalty.

In the end if it is the officers word against your wife's, who do you think they will believe?

Yes even a 10 over 0 demerit point speeding can cause your insurance to go up the same as if you had a 49 over 4 demerit point charge. Insurance does not care about demerit points. Only your insurance company can really confirm what that increase will be. Worst case would probably be 5% to 10% for three years. So consider the cost to fight it probably would be more than the insurance increase.

But I still recommend you plead not guilty and get the disclosure before just paying it. Post the officers notes here when you get them.
Thanks for the info. So this would i mean i have to go with option 3 on the back of the ticket? When i get the trial date, how do i request the officer notes? Do i need to visit the court in person? Also, im assuming nothing goes on her record until the ticket is settled either way?

Also, say it's 10%, would it be 10% increase annually for 3 years on the premium for the car she drives or our overall premium (we have 2 cars).
Member
Aug 26, 2005
411 posts
1323 upvotes
Toronto
CNeufeld wrote: Like every other ticket... If you think you want to fight it, request a trial, and get disclosure. That will tell you what evidence will be presented. But keep in mind that it you proceed to the point of an actual trial, the prosecutor can ask that the ticket be amended to 25 over instead of 10 over. But you’re a long ways from that, and can plead guilty to the 10 over anytime before that.

You can also check with your insurer to see if you have any form of ticket forgiveness. It’s possible the first ticket will have no effect on your rates, as long as you stay with your insurer.

C
Thanks for the info. I don't think I have ticket forgiveness, I'm with TD would it be something i would have asked for or would it be a free benefit?
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
4gen_accord wrote: Thanks for the info. So this would i mean i have to go with option 3 on the back of the ticket? When i get the trial date, how do i request the officer notes? Do i need to visit the court in person? Also, im assuming nothing goes on her record until the ticket is settled either way?

Also, say it's 10%, would it be 10% increase annually for 3 years on the premium for the car she drives or our overall premium (we have 2 cars).
Yes option 3 is usually not guilty trial option.

You send a letter to the prosecutors office asking for dislclosure.

Not sure how increase to insurance will work ... you need to specifically ask your insurance company about how increases affect premiums and about ticket forgiveness.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Mar 22, 2007
70 posts
25 upvotes
Scarborough
ShrekTek wrote: Okay so it is indeed a FATAL ERROR ... there is no set fine for section 151(1) therefore they can not put a set fine on the ticket and when you read 151(1) it is simply saying minister can make regulation.

If you do not show up for trial, they can not change it. If you DO show up for trial, then they could change it.

Do not show up for trial, and there are two possible outcomes:
(i) most likely, the prosecutor or JP will see the error and throw out the ticket, or
(ii) small chance, she will be found guilty of the charge.

If she is found guilty, then you have to file an APPEAL (make sure to file for APPEAL and not a RE-OPENING). At the appeal you would show up with your original ticket and simply tell the judge that there is no set fine for section 151(1) and also the charge is incorrect so she did not show up for trial based on the information that was on the Notice of Offence received from the officer.
Thanks. I got 2 tickets as well. One is drive motor vehicle, no permit 7(1)(A) and Park/Stand on HWY - Interferre (170(12). If I bring my valid permit to the prosecutor, do they normally throw that one out? The other one park/stand on hwy was because I was in the intersection at the time and the light turn red. They probably should've charged me with blocking intersection but charged me with park/stand on hwy, which refers to parking or standing on a road that interferes with traffic or snow removal. It was a sunny warm day in september so I'm not blocking any snow removal and there's traffic in front of me so can I argue I wasn't actually parking or standing on the highway but I was just stuck at the intersection? They can't charge me with blocking intersection with 170(12) right?
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
jon_na_fun wrote: Thanks. I got 2 tickets as well. One is drive motor vehicle, no permit 7(1)(A) and Park/Stand on HWY - Interferre (170(12). If I bring my valid permit to the prosecutor, do they normally throw that one out? The other one park/stand on hwy was because I was in the intersection at the time and the light turn red. They probably should've charged me with blocking intersection but charged me with park/stand on hwy, which refers to parking or standing on a road that interferes with traffic or snow removal. It was a sunny warm day in september so I'm not blocking any snow removal and there's traffic in front of me so can I argue I wasn't actually parking or standing on the highway but I was just stuck at the intersection? They can't charge me with blocking intersection with 170(12) right?
Okay so you got 3 tickets total?

Did you plead not guilty to all 3 and request a trial for all 3?

Is the trial date for all 3 on the same date?
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Mar 22, 2007
70 posts
25 upvotes
Scarborough
ShrekTek wrote: Okay so you got 3 tickets total?

Did you plead not guilty to all 3 and request a trial for all 3?

Is the trial date for all 3 on the same date?
2 for me, 1 for my wife. Plead not guilty for all 3 and request trial for all 3. The 2 I got for no permit and park/stand on hwy is on a different date as my wife's.
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
jon_na_fun wrote: 2 for me, 1 for my wife. Plead not guilty for all 3 and request trial for all 3. The 2 I got for no permit and park/stand on hwy is on a different date as my wife's.
Ok then, so for your wife do not show up for her trial and it should pass as fatal error.

For you, bring proof of your vehicle permit and you will probably get an plea deal offer to drop one ticket for a guilty plea to the other.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Sr. Member
Jan 24, 2008
817 posts
68 upvotes
Good morning RFDers!

A couple of months ago I got a ticket for turning right on a street that apparently I wasn't supposed to turn right on on a weekend. This is on St. Pauls Square in Toronto, just east of Yonge and Bloor, a supposed notorious place for officers to ratchet up their tickets and meet their quotas! I was on the left lane when I decided the traffic was too much, so I signalled to the truck next to me that I'm going to come in front of him to make a right on St. Pauls Square. I maybe have had about 5m. I completely missed the sign since the truck was blocking my view, though someone did keep honking at me, which later I understood was a warning that I shouldn't be doing this.

Sure enough, there were about 6 cars lined up and I became the 7th. And right after I got tagged, the officer went to his car while all the other cars who kept making a right passed by unscathed. Bad luck, I suppose.

Today's my court date. Actually, I'm not sure what it is, because it was an appointment I made online, which is something new. It's a resolution meeting? Anyways, I wanted to ask for disclosure prior to this date but had been away until last week, and work has been non-stop. Can I ask for disclosure at this resolution meeting or whatever it is? Any other advice?
Member
Feb 4, 2017
464 posts
377 upvotes
Toronto
Hello,

Stupid me, I didnt read the signs and got a Stopped-signed highway during rush hour "no stopping monday - friday 4pm - 6pm rush hour route"
I parked my motorcycle at 3PM and went for a walk around the neighborhood, went for lunch, stopped at the local MPP office and then returned to find a ticket wrapped around my handlebars with a elastic.

There is an Administrative Penalty Amount of $150.

I dont remember every seeing this description before on a parking ticket. admin Penalty Amount.

If I choose to fight this, what can I really argue? That I was not parked there? The sign wasnt clear enough? I dont really have a strong defense...

Can someone shed some light on how I can proceed?
Newbie
Mar 22, 2007
70 posts
25 upvotes
Scarborough
ShrekTek wrote: Ok then, so for your wife do not show up for her trial and it should pass as fatal error.

For you, bring proof of your vehicle permit and you will probably get an plea deal offer to drop one ticket for a guilty plea to the other.
If I was in the intersection and I got 170 (12) Vehicle Interfering with traffic. What are my odds of arguing that I wasn't interferring with traffic but was just stuck in the intersection and made reasonable attempt to clear the intersection? The provision does mention park or stand which I was not doing since I was moving with traffic.

Vehicles interfering with traffic
(12) Despite the other provisions of this section, no person shall park or stand a vehicle on a highway in such a manner as to interfere with the movement of traffic or the clearing of snow from the highway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 170 (12).
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
jon_na_fun wrote: If I was in the intersection and I got 170 (12) Vehicle Interfering with traffic. What are my odds of arguing that I wasn't interferring with traffic but was just stuck in the intersection and made reasonable attempt to clear the intersection? The provision does mention park or stand which I was not doing since I was moving with traffic.

Vehicles interfering with traffic
(12) Despite the other provisions of this section, no person shall park or stand a vehicle on a highway in such a manner as to interfere with the movement of traffic or the clearing of snow from the highway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 170 (12).
My opinion is that it is not the correct charge and it could probably be beaten at trial. However if you take it to trial then you will not be offered a deal and would also have to fight the permit charge. You will not beat the permit charge at trial, and you may or may not beat the other one at trial, so you would be better to take a plea deal up front. I would discuss this with prosecutor and see if you can just plead guilty to permit charge and get the other one dropped.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
May 29, 2018
7 posts
Hello please i got a ticket last year for speeding and carseat but i just found out there was a mistake in the filing i was filed for no plate and speeding and court is due on monday. Please what do i do?? And can dis be dismissed ?
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
OlasumboO63824 wrote: Hello please i got a ticket last year for speeding and carseat but i just found out there was a mistake in the filing i was filed for no plate and speeding and court is due on monday. Please what do i do?? And can dis be dismissed ?
What province?

What are exact charges (wording and section numbers)?

Did you request disclosure yet? If so, then please scan and post.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
May 29, 2018
7 posts
Province is ON
Excert ticket is speeding 15km over speedlimit and Failure to Secure told Toodler properly in a car seat. Also what is disclosure?????
Newbie
May 29, 2018
7 posts
Province is ON
Excert ticket is speeding 15km over speedlimit and Failure to Secure told Toodler properly in a car seat. Also what is disclosure?????
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
165 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
OlasumboO63824 wrote: Province is ON
Excert ticket is speeding 15km over speedlimit and Failure to Secure told Toodler properly in a car seat. Also what is disclosure?????
What are section numbers of the charges? Speeding would be 128. Other one is what section?

Disclosure is the officers notes, which is what he wiil testify, which you have the right to review in order to know their case against you. You should ask for this at trial and ask for another trial date so you have time to review it.

What do you mean by mistake in filing? Where does it say this? How do you know there was mistake?
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--

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