Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Jr. Member
Feb 13, 2005
127 posts
13 upvotes
Hi all, I was pulled over for having a faded rear license plate a few days ago and it was written up as "Dirty Plates". The fine was $110 which isn't much and the officer told to to get it replaced in order to lower the fine.

I plan on replacing the plates (but haven't done so yet) as the officer recommended, but here I'm sort of confused on next step regarding the 3 options on the ticket.

Option 1 - Plead guilty and pay. Makes no sense to pay the full $110 since I can have it lowered
Option 2 - Plead guilty with an explanation?
Option 3 - Not Guilty with a Trial... If I get my plates replaced, does that show that I am guilty?

Just reading it seems that everyone should pick option 3 and never plead guilty... would this apply in my situation?

The fee's isn't much, just worried about the long term insurance implications even on such a small infraction. Thanks in advance!
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User avatar
May 8, 2002
4236 posts
623 upvotes
xCoeus wrote:
Jul 11th, 2017 9:11 pm
After some googling on the matter it seems in most other cases I've read regarding this charge the officer made sure to note what phone the person had for his notes. The officer did no such thing in my case and I'm wondering if he assumed I was on my phone simply because I was looking down at the red light. Would it be possibly to bring this up to get the charge dropped? Since he never made any attempt to prove I was on my phone and I never admitted to him that I was on my phone I don't see how they would have a case, but I've heard these charges are notoriously hard to get dropped as its the officers word vs yours.
As you said it would be his word versus yours. Issue would be to raise doubt that it was actually a cell phone you were holding, as opposed to a sunglasses case, notebook, other similarly sized black object.

Make/model of cell is irrelevant, officers credibility is much more important, and if you can challenge that and create doubt you may have a chance. The fact he did not record the type of phone may mean he may not have a clear recollection of the event...
Green Lantern wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 11:55 am
Hi all, I was pulled over for having a faded rear license plate a few days ago and it was written up as "Dirty Plates". The fine was $110 which isn't much and the officer told to to get it replaced in order to lower the fine.

I plan on replacing the plates (but haven't done so yet) as the officer recommended, but here I'm sort of confused on next step regarding the 3 options on the ticket.

Option 1 - Plead guilty and pay. Makes no sense to pay the full $110 since I can have it lowered
Option 2 - Plead guilty with an explanation?
Option 3 - Not Guilty with a Trial... If I get my plates replaced, does that show that I am guilty?

Just reading it seems that everyone should pick option 3 and never plead guilty... would this apply in my situation?

The fee's isn't much, just worried about the long term insurance implications even on such a small infraction. Thanks in advance!
Not sure why you assume you can have it lowered for option one?? What charge would you have it lowered to?

Option 2 is pointless

You can pick option 3, but what would be your defense if it actually does go to trial? Or you could just play the game and hope the officer doesn't show or there is enough delay for 11(b)...
Jr. Member
Feb 13, 2005
127 posts
13 upvotes
joshmxpx wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 12:40 pm
Not sure why you assume you can have it lowered for option one?? What charge would you have it lowered to?

Option 2 is pointless

You can pick option 3, but what would be your defense if it actually does go to trial? Or you could just play the game and hope the officer doesn't show or there is enough delay for 11(b)...
In total agreement that it wouldn't be lowered if I picked Opt# 1. You misread what I wrote, never assumed it would be lowered for Opt #1 and would need to pay the full amount.

I don't have a defense for Opt #3 if I do replace my plates, which is why I'm hesitant on picking 3.

Opt #2, just seems like the most fitting situation... but just wanted to hear other opinions first. Why would this be the pointless option?
Newbie
Jul 11, 2017
1 posts
Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I was involved in an accident and rear ended someone. Their car was slightly damaged but my car was a total write off. There was traffic and weather conditions were not good, in panic I pressed on the gas instead of the breaks and rear ended them.
I was given a pink ticket that says "Summons/Assignation" for Careless Driving which gives me the options of pleading guilty, setting a date for trial, or the trial may proceed written on the back. There were no witnesses besides the other party involved in the accident; the police came after.

Should I take this to trial or just try and get a plea deal from the prosecutor? I have looked up previous cases that are similar to mine, and the judge convicted them of careless driving when they tried to fight it.
The only reason I would take it to trial is if it can get thrown out/I could win, but I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it. The possibility of being convicted of careless driving (instead of taking a plea) vs the small chance it will get thrown out/I can win.

Thank you.
Newbie
Feb 17, 2015
68 posts
32 upvotes
Calgary, AB
Hello, from Calgary here.

Seriously made a mistake as I was rushing for an appointment and parked at a wrong spot (didn't see the signage properly) and got a 300 ticket (200 if paid within 10 days). Stupid me even paid for an hour's parking not realizing I've parked in the wrong spot. I have never made an error like this as I always notice the signs and don't park in the wrong spot. Anyhow, I was planning to appear at Traffic Court with the first appearance prosecutor for a plea bargain. However, the parking ticket (tag) did not write a court date. Does anyone know if the parking violation will only be filed and sent to me after 30 days from getting my ticket? (this should show the court date right?)

Thanks very much for any help guys
Deal Addict
Apr 23, 2014
1057 posts
184 upvotes
OntarioThrowaway wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 6:36 pm
Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I was involved in an accident and rear ended someone. Their car was slightly damaged but my car was a total write off. There was traffic and weather conditions were not good, in panic I pressed on the gas instead of the breaks and rear ended them.
I was given a pink ticket that says "Summons/Assignation" for Careless Driving which gives me the options of pleading guilty, setting a date for trial, or the trial may proceed written on the back. There were no witnesses besides the other party involved in the accident; the police came after.

Should I take this to trial or just try and get a plea deal from the prosecutor? I have looked up previous cases that are similar to mine, and the judge convicted them of careless driving when they tried to fight it.
The only reason I would take it to trial is if it can get thrown out/I could win, but I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it. The possibility of being convicted of careless driving (instead of taking a plea) vs the small chance it will get thrown out/I can win.

Thank you.
these days everyone has a dash cam not only in the front but also in the rear and some people have cameras in the sides as well, so even if there is no human witness there is still a video which recorded the whole thing. People seem to forget the dashcams take excellent video and audio and are always on.
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User avatar
May 8, 2002
4236 posts
623 upvotes
Penrose wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 11:53 pm
these days everyone has a dash cam not only in the front but also in the rear and some people have cameras in the sides as well, so even if there is no human witness there is still a video which recorded the whole thing. People seem to forget the dashcams take excellent video and audio and are always on.
Maybe in unicorn land (GTA), but where I am we investigate collisions daily and less than 0.1% of vehicles have dash cams, so usually there really are no witnesses
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Green Lantern wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 11:55 am
Hi all, I was pulled over for having a faded rear license plate a few days ago and it was written up as "Dirty Plates". The fine was $110 which isn't much and the officer told to to get it replaced in order to lower the fine.

I plan on replacing the plates (but haven't done so yet) as the officer recommended, but here I'm sort of confused on next step regarding the 3 options on the ticket.

Option 1 - Plead guilty and pay. Makes no sense to pay the full $110 since I can have it lowered
Option 2 - Plead guilty with an explanation?
Option 3 - Not Guilty with a Trial... If I get my plates replaced, does that show that I am guilty?

Just reading it seems that everyone should pick option 3 and never plead guilty... would this apply in my situation?

The fee's isn't much, just worried about the long term insurance implications even on such a small infraction. Thanks in advance!
Absolutely you should always plead not guilty, request a trial and ask to see the disclosure (officers notes). The notes are what the officer will testify, so this needs to be reviewed in order to determine if you have a defense and can beat the charge or not. If you don't think you can beat it, you can still show up for trial and talk to prosecutor about getting fine lowered.

Also if your plate was FADED and not dirty, then the charge may not be valid. What was the exact wording of the charge and the section number? Was it in Ontario?
Last edited by ShrekTek on Jul 13th, 2017 10:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
OntarioThrowaway wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 6:36 pm
Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I was involved in an accident and rear ended someone. Their car was slightly damaged but my car was a total write off. There was traffic and weather conditions were not good, in panic I pressed on the gas instead of the breaks and rear ended them.
I was given a pink ticket that says "Summons/Assignation" for Careless Driving which gives me the options of pleading guilty, setting a date for trial, or the trial may proceed written on the back. There were no witnesses besides the other party involved in the accident; the police came after.

Should I take this to trial or just try and get a plea deal from the prosecutor? I have looked up previous cases that are similar to mine, and the judge convicted them of careless driving when they tried to fight it.
The only reason I would take it to trial is if it can get thrown out/I could win, but I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it. The possibility of being convicted of careless driving (instead of taking a plea) vs the small chance it will get thrown out/I can win.

Thank you.
Careless driving charge is very serious and will cause your insurance to skyrocket the same as a DUI charge, so you want to do everything you can to try and avoid this charge.

The summons date is NOT your trial date. You will have a chance to meet with prosecutor, and if they offer you a plea deal you most likely should take it as anything is pretty much better than a careless charge. If they do not offer you a plea deal (or you do not like the plea deal they offer) then you can tell them you would llike to set a trial date and get disclosure (officers notes, witness statements, accident reports). If you decide to go all the way to trial, you should then probably consider hiring a lawyer, but you do not need to hire anybody for the summons date.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Jr. Member
Feb 13, 2005
127 posts
13 upvotes
ShrekTek wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 10:03 am
Also if your plate was FADED and not dirty, then the charge may not be valid. What was the exact wording of the charge and the section number? Was it in Ontario?
Yup, this took place in Toronto, Ontario. Below is what was printed on my ticket. Thanks for your help.

Did commit the offense of: Dirty Plate
Contrary to: Highway Traffic Act
Sect.: 13(2)
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Green Lantern wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 3:01 pm
Yup, this took place in Toronto, Ontario. Below is what was printed on my ticket. Thanks for your help.

Did commit the offense of: Dirty Plate
Contrary to: Highway Traffic Act
Sect.: 13(2)
So section 13(2) of the HTA says this:
Number plate to be kept clean
(2) Every number plate shall be kept free from dirt and obstruction and shall be affixed so that the entire number plate, including the numbers, is plainly visible at all times, and the view of the number plate shall not be obscured or obstructed by spare tires, bumper bars, any part of the vehicle, any attachments to the vehicle or the load carried.


So you need to plead Not Guilty and request a trial with the officer present and then once you get the Notice of Trial then you need to request disclosure (copy of officers notes). You will need to see the officers notes before you can decide if you have good chance to beat it, but if the officers notes say it was "faded" then that is NOT "dirty" and that is NOT "obstructed".

Here is the only caselaw I can find on it:
R. v. Hoffner, 2013 ONCJ 510 http://canlii.ca/t/g0npl
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Jul 12, 2017
1 posts
Hey guys, im only 18, this is my second speeding ticket, previous being a minor 15kmh over. I recieved a ticket for speeding on the 401 a couple days ago, the officer said he clocked me at 132kmh but dropped the speed to 121kmh on the ticket. I'm very new to this (my previous ticket i paid the day of out of fear), I'm wondering what my next step should be and if i have any chance of fighting/lowering the ticket so my insurance doesn't take another hit?
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
chmielboi wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 10:38 pm
Hey guys, im only 18, this is my second speeding ticket, previous being a minor 15kmh over. I recieved a ticket for speeding on the 401 a couple days ago, the officer said he clocked me at 132kmh but dropped the speed to 121kmh on the ticket. I'm very new to this (my previous ticket i paid the day of out of fear), I'm wondering what my next step should be and if i have any chance of fighting/lowering the ticket so my insurance doesn't take another hit?
If the officer has already reduced the ticket then the prosecutor most likely won't lower it further. Even a 0 demerit (15 over) ticket can still affect your insurance. If you do not want it to affect insurance then you will have to fight it and beat it in court to get it dropped completely. However if you fight it and lose, they will raise it back up to the higher speed that the officer clocked you at.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Member
User avatar
Jun 14, 2011
330 posts
141 upvotes
Ottawa
Hi guys!
I got a speeding ticket on March 8, 2017 in Quinte West Belleville ON then I filed for trial on April 19, 2017 and requested with separate form for disclosure. Today I got notice of trial letter dated July 7, 2017 without disclosure. So now I have to send a letter for disclosure request or what is the next step? Thanks in advance.
Deal Fanatic
May 1, 2012
8638 posts
6280 upvotes
Markham
varshan wrote:
Jul 14th, 2017 2:02 pm
Hi guys!
I got a speeding ticket on March 8, 2017 in Quinte West Belleville ON then I filed for trial on April 19, 2017 and requested with separate form for disclosure. Today I got notice of trial letter dated July 7, 2017 without disclosure. So now I have to send a letter for disclosure request or what is the next step? Thanks in advance.
Disclosure is issued by the Prosecution office. Contact them for disclosure.

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