Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Sr. Member
Apr 23, 2014
657 posts
96 upvotes
OntarioThrowaway wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 6:36 pm
Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I was involved in an accident and rear ended someone. Their car was slightly damaged but my car was a total write off. There was traffic and weather conditions were not good, in panic I pressed on the gas instead of the breaks and rear ended them.
I was given a pink ticket that says "Summons/Assignation" for Careless Driving which gives me the options of pleading guilty, setting a date for trial, or the trial may proceed written on the back. There were no witnesses besides the other party involved in the accident; the police came after.

Should I take this to trial or just try and get a plea deal from the prosecutor? I have looked up previous cases that are similar to mine, and the judge convicted them of careless driving when they tried to fight it.
The only reason I would take it to trial is if it can get thrown out/I could win, but I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it. The possibility of being convicted of careless driving (instead of taking a plea) vs the small chance it will get thrown out/I can win.

Thank you.
these days everyone has a dash cam not only in the front but also in the rear and some people have cameras in the sides as well, so even if there is no human witness there is still a video which recorded the whole thing. People seem to forget the dashcams take excellent video and audio and are always on.
Deal Addict
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May 8, 2002
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Penrose wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 11:53 pm
these days everyone has a dash cam not only in the front but also in the rear and some people have cameras in the sides as well, so even if there is no human witness there is still a video which recorded the whole thing. People seem to forget the dashcams take excellent video and audio and are always on.
Maybe in unicorn land (GTA), but where I am we investigate collisions daily and less than 0.1% of vehicles have dash cams, so usually there really are no witnesses
Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Green Lantern wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 11:55 am
Hi all, I was pulled over for having a faded rear license plate a few days ago and it was written up as "Dirty Plates". The fine was $110 which isn't much and the officer told to to get it replaced in order to lower the fine.

I plan on replacing the plates (but haven't done so yet) as the officer recommended, but here I'm sort of confused on next step regarding the 3 options on the ticket.

Option 1 - Plead guilty and pay. Makes no sense to pay the full $110 since I can have it lowered
Option 2 - Plead guilty with an explanation?
Option 3 - Not Guilty with a Trial... If I get my plates replaced, does that show that I am guilty?

Just reading it seems that everyone should pick option 3 and never plead guilty... would this apply in my situation?

The fee's isn't much, just worried about the long term insurance implications even on such a small infraction. Thanks in advance!
Absolutely you should always plead not guilty, request a trial and ask to see the disclosure (officers notes). The notes are what the officer will testify, so this needs to be reviewed in order to determine if you have a defense and can beat the charge or not. If you don't think you can beat it, you can still show up for trial and talk to prosecutor about getting fine lowered.

Also if your plate was FADED and not dirty, then the charge may not be valid. What was the exact wording of the charge and the section number? Was it in Ontario?
Last edited by ShrekTek on Jul 13th, 2017 10:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
ShrekTek.ca
Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
OntarioThrowaway wrote:
Jul 12th, 2017 6:36 pm
Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I was involved in an accident and rear ended someone. Their car was slightly damaged but my car was a total write off. There was traffic and weather conditions were not good, in panic I pressed on the gas instead of the breaks and rear ended them.
I was given a pink ticket that says "Summons/Assignation" for Careless Driving which gives me the options of pleading guilty, setting a date for trial, or the trial may proceed written on the back. There were no witnesses besides the other party involved in the accident; the police came after.

Should I take this to trial or just try and get a plea deal from the prosecutor? I have looked up previous cases that are similar to mine, and the judge convicted them of careless driving when they tried to fight it.
The only reason I would take it to trial is if it can get thrown out/I could win, but I'm not sure if the risk reward is worth it. The possibility of being convicted of careless driving (instead of taking a plea) vs the small chance it will get thrown out/I can win.

Thank you.
Careless driving charge is very serious and will cause your insurance to skyrocket the same as a DUI charge, so you want to do everything you can to try and avoid this charge.

The summons date is NOT your trial date. You will have a chance to meet with prosecutor, and if they offer you a plea deal you most likely should take it as anything is pretty much better than a careless charge. If they do not offer you a plea deal (or you do not like the plea deal they offer) then you can tell them you would llike to set a trial date and get disclosure (officers notes, witness statements, accident reports). If you decide to go all the way to trial, you should then probably consider hiring a lawyer, but you do not need to hire anybody for the summons date.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
ShrekTek.ca
Jr. Member
Feb 13, 2005
117 posts
6 upvotes
ShrekTek wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 10:03 am
Also if your plate was FADED and not dirty, then the charge may not be valid. What was the exact wording of the charge and the section number? Was it in Ontario?
Yup, this took place in Toronto, Ontario. Below is what was printed on my ticket. Thanks for your help.

Did commit the offense of: Dirty Plate
Contrary to: Highway Traffic Act
Sect.: 13(2)
Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Green Lantern wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 3:01 pm
Yup, this took place in Toronto, Ontario. Below is what was printed on my ticket. Thanks for your help.

Did commit the offense of: Dirty Plate
Contrary to: Highway Traffic Act
Sect.: 13(2)
So section 13(2) of the HTA says this:
Number plate to be kept clean
(2) Every number plate shall be kept free from dirt and obstruction and shall be affixed so that the entire number plate, including the numbers, is plainly visible at all times, and the view of the number plate shall not be obscured or obstructed by spare tires, bumper bars, any part of the vehicle, any attachments to the vehicle or the load carried.


So you need to plead Not Guilty and request a trial with the officer present and then once you get the Notice of Trial then you need to request disclosure (copy of officers notes). You will need to see the officers notes before you can decide if you have good chance to beat it, but if the officers notes say it was "faded" then that is NOT "dirty" and that is NOT "obstructed".

Here is the only caselaw I can find on it:
R. v. Hoffner, 2013 ONCJ 510 http://canlii.ca/t/g0npl
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
ShrekTek.ca
Newbie
Jul 12, 2017
1 posts
Hey guys, im only 18, this is my second speeding ticket, previous being a minor 15kmh over. I recieved a ticket for speeding on the 401 a couple days ago, the officer said he clocked me at 132kmh but dropped the speed to 121kmh on the ticket. I'm very new to this (my previous ticket i paid the day of out of fear), I'm wondering what my next step should be and if i have any chance of fighting/lowering the ticket so my insurance doesn't take another hit?
Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
chmielboi wrote:
Jul 13th, 2017 10:38 pm
Hey guys, im only 18, this is my second speeding ticket, previous being a minor 15kmh over. I recieved a ticket for speeding on the 401 a couple days ago, the officer said he clocked me at 132kmh but dropped the speed to 121kmh on the ticket. I'm very new to this (my previous ticket i paid the day of out of fear), I'm wondering what my next step should be and if i have any chance of fighting/lowering the ticket so my insurance doesn't take another hit?
If the officer has already reduced the ticket then the prosecutor most likely won't lower it further. Even a 0 demerit (15 over) ticket can still affect your insurance. If you do not want it to affect insurance then you will have to fight it and beat it in court to get it dropped completely. However if you fight it and lose, they will raise it back up to the higher speed that the officer clocked you at.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
ShrekTek.ca
Jr. Member
User avatar
Jun 14, 2011
175 posts
52 upvotes
Ottawa
Hi guys!
I got a speeding ticket on March 8, 2017 in Quinte West Belleville ON then I filed for trial on April 19, 2017 and requested with separate form for disclosure. Today I got notice of trial letter dated July 7, 2017 without disclosure. So now I have to send a letter for disclosure request or what is the next step? Thanks in advance.
Penalty Box
May 1, 2012
6364 posts
2699 upvotes
Markham
varshan wrote:
Jul 14th, 2017 2:02 pm
Hi guys!
I got a speeding ticket on March 8, 2017 in Quinte West Belleville ON then I filed for trial on April 19, 2017 and requested with separate form for disclosure. Today I got notice of trial letter dated July 7, 2017 without disclosure. So now I have to send a letter for disclosure request or what is the next step? Thanks in advance.
Disclosure is issued by the Prosecution office. Contact them for disclosure.
Jr. Member
User avatar
Jun 14, 2011
175 posts
52 upvotes
Ottawa
I already requested the disclosure when I filed for trial time. They just send me only notice of trial letter. I have to request again disclosure or not?
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Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
varshan wrote:
Jul 14th, 2017 2:02 pm
Hi guys!
I got a speeding ticket on March 8, 2017 in Quinte West Belleville ON then I filed for trial on April 19, 2017 and requested with separate form for disclosure. Today I got notice of trial letter dated July 7, 2017 without disclosure. So now I have to send a letter for disclosure request or what is the next step? Thanks in advance.
Yes send another request letter to prosecutor for disclosure. Usually you don't ask for disclosure until you get the trial date anyways.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
ShrekTek.ca
Jr. Member
User avatar
Jun 14, 2011
175 posts
52 upvotes
Ottawa
ShrekTek wrote:
Jul 15th, 2017 9:43 am
Yes send another request letter to prosecutor for disclosure. Usually you don't ask for disclosure until you get the trial date anyways.
I got the notice of trial letter last Friday and my trial date is September 11, 2017.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 21, 2012
5028 posts
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Mississauga
Well I just got my first speeding ticket.

An OPP officer merged onto the highway I while I was driving.

He was going pretty fast, at least 160km/h at one point, so I figured someone going 160 wasn't going to give out speeding tickets, so I followed him to a degree.

Turns out no, he was baiting me to go faster. When I gave up on following him, he braked hard and pulled me over for driving at "113 and 137 at one point"; my ticket shows 137.

Like the Son of Daedalus, I went too close to the sun; I should have stayed in the left lane doing 100.

Are there people on RFD that I could hire to fight this?

Currently I'm reading through the OP in case I represent myself.

It looks like they changed some of the procedures though.

Ie. Disclosure: https://www7.mississauga.ca/cityforms/l ... ve/Default asp - - looks like they email it now?

My ticket also says not to mail in, so I guess I need to bring it into the court room to tell them I'm fighting it?
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Newbie
Jun 15, 2017
50 posts
7 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Dinujan wrote:
Jul 16th, 2017 9:54 am
Well I just got my first speeding ticket.

An OPP officer merged onto the highway I while I was driving.

He was going pretty fast, at least 160km/h at one point, so I figured someone going 160 wasn't going to give out speeding tickets, so I followed him to a degree.

Turns out no, he was baiting me to go faster. When I gave up on following him, he braked hard and pulled me over for driving at "113 and 137 at one point"; my ticket shows 137.

Like the Son of Daedalus, I went too close to the sun; I should have stayed in the left lane doing 100.

Are there people on RFD that I could hire to fight this?

Currently I'm reading through the OP in case I represent myself.

It looks like they changed some of the procedures though.

Ie. Disclosure: https://www7.mississauga.ca/cityforms/l ... ve/Default asp - - looks like they email it now?

My ticket also says not to mail in, so I guess I need to bring it into the court room to tell them I'm fighting it?
Police are allowed to speed all they want while on duty, so no, as you have discovered, you should not try to keep up with a speeding police officer.

Yes you need to go into address listed to request a trial. You do not need to hire anybody for the first parts of this, which will save you some money.

Choose the Not Guilty option and request a trial with the officer present. Once you receive your Notice of Trial in the mail, then you can request disclosure (officers notes, make/model/serial# of speed measuring device used). Once you get the disclosure, post it here so we can review and see if you have a chance at beating it or not.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
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