Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Newbie
Mar 20, 2019
6 posts
nickel052 wrote: When parking tickets were provincial offences, an incorrect set fine was grounds to have the ticket withdrawn. Is this still the case for the new municipally enforced systems?

I received a parking ticket last night in Richmond Hill for parking on the road between 3-6am (1116.3.7o).
I noticed my ticket is now $50 instead of the previous $30.

The new fines are reflected on Richmond Hill’s list of by-laws F98DA899-E7D9-4573-9B64-6E02724AA659.jpeg
(https://www.richmondhill.ca/en/find-or- ... rking.aspx)
however, the changes are not reflected in their published Chapter 11164BCAC276-5982-460C-B2A9-3567B46E13E7.jpeg(https://www.richmondhill.ca/en/shared-c ... 8-1116.pdf), the Chapter in which the parking by-laws are defined. The document still indicates the old set fine of $30.

This isn’t some old document I went scouring the web for. It’s the hyperlink for “Chapter 1116” on their list of parking by-laws, and would otherwise be taken as the most recent and accurate version accessible to the public. 8A5B3E67-233B-4041-B48A-E7E526BDEF44.jpeg
or try (https://www.richmondhill.ca/en/our-serv ... -laws.aspx) and click parking by-laws. In fact when I called Richmond Hill, that is the link I was directed to.

The document also defines the offence as “Park on a highway between the hours of 3 am and 6 pm” instead of 6 am. I technically did still violate that, but an error worth noting.

Given the set fine on my ticket does not match the set fine defined in the document, will it be grounds for withdrawal?
I am getting ready to submit my defence as the due date is two days away. Would anyone else be willing to share their thoughts and opinions on this? Anything constructive is always appreciated.

Thanks
Newbie
Mar 21, 2008
12 posts
CNeufeld wrote: If you don't get your disclosure before your trial, you can request a continuance so you can review the disclosure that will likely be handed to you at the trial. I'd wait till you have your disclosure before you decide on hiring anyone. Keep in mind that the goal for most companies you hire is to get your ticket reduced, which still means a conviction (and possible insurance hit). They can't do anything for you that you can't do yourself.

If it does come down to a trial, you'll have to discredit the officer's testimony. Raise doubts about what he could have seen, etc. But the officer's are typically believed as a witness. Unless you have dashcam video or something, it will be hard to fight.

C
Just to be clear..If I don't get a disclosure until my court date..I could ask them to give me another date so I have time to review the evidence and then decide to hire someone ??

Ticket was 110 with 3 demerit points..First offence ever in my driving history ...
I just was hoping for a lesser charge
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Mar 23, 2008
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a109664 wrote: Just to be clear..If I don't get a disclosure until my court date..I could ask them to give me another date so I have time to review the evidence and then decide to hire someone ??

Ticket was 110 with 3 demerit points..First offence ever in my driving history ...
I just was hoping for a lesser charge
Yes, you could request another date if that happened.

And your insurance company will likely look at convictions, as mentioned many times in here and one of the other stickied threads. Unless you're talking about careless or drunk driving, one conviction will count as much as any other. So the only thing you're likely to save is the difference in the fine amount, and as someone pointed out, you're already on the low end of the fine spectrum.

It's always up to you if you want to fight it or not, but your odds of getting any significant savings are slim. IMHO

C
Sr. Member
Nov 16, 2013
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GTA
But the conviction can get overturned if disclosure is not received or the cop does not arrive
CNeufeld wrote: Yes, you could request another date if that happened.

And your insurance company will likely look at convictions, as mentioned many times in here and one of the other stickied threads. Unless you're talking about careless or drunk driving, one conviction will count as much as any other. So the only thing you're likely to save is the difference in the fine amount, and as someone pointed out, you're already on the low end of the fine spectrum.

It's always up to you if you want to fight it or not, but your odds of getting any significant savings are slim. IMHO

C
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May 8, 2002
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vivmk20 wrote: But the conviction can get overturned if disclosure is not received or the cop does not arrive
There will be no conviction in that case, or likely an adjournment. You can't overturn something that doesn't exist....
Newbie
Aug 22, 2019
12 posts
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Today, I parked at an Impark underground parking lot. There was no power, and the machine wasn't functioning because of the lack of power. I decided to take a quick peak upstairs to see if the shop was also without power and then returned to my car. In the matter of minutes I got the ticket from impark which is totally unreasonable. Power outage plus machine malfunction. I called and they gave me BS runaround saying i should have called them about the machine being down and can't pay or that i should never have left my car and gone upstairs. Well the fact was there is no reception in the parkade and maybe I should have left instead of taking an extra minute to check if the store was open.

Anyway, how should I go about this to get this ticket waived? Any help would be appreciated.
Jr. Member
May 16, 2012
199 posts
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Toronto
CNeufeld wrote: Convictions can affect your insurance, even if she doesn't get demerits. No idea if the effect will be less due to her being the fourth driver listed.

You'll be fighting an uphill battle if you chose to go the "calibration" route. In general, the police officer's statement that the device was working properly is "proof" enough for the JP. It will be up to you to discredit the police officer's testimony, which will involve you knowing what the correct process is, and then getting the cop to testify that they didn't follow it. They won't just dismiss it; you'll have to take it to court and argue your case. Maybe the cop won't show up, maybe you won't get disclosure; there's still hope so get an out other ways too. Odds are slim, but still there.

And if you're going to fight it on her behalf, you'll need written authorization, I believe.

C
Hi @CNeufeld I got the disclosure finally and I had specifically requested for the following among other things:
  1. Full copy of the police officer's notes
  2. A copy of both sides of the officer’s copy of the ticket (Notice of Offence)
  3. A typed version of any hand written notes
All I got was the officer's hand written notes and it is not at all legible. Just looks like scribbles. See P.1 and P.2. Can my disclosure request letter stating my request for a typed version of his notes along with his illegible notes be enough to ask for a rescheduling to get typed notes and to prepare for another court date?
Any idea how or where I can find out the correct process to calibrate the LIDAR?
What are the other "ways" or "outs" you were talking about on winning the case?

Thanks again for your time, insight and help.
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Mar 23, 2008
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RitchES wrote: Hi @CNeufeld I got the disclosure finally and I had specifically requested for the following among other things:
  1. Full copy of the police officer's notes
  2. A copy of both sides of the officer’s copy of the ticket (Notice of Offence)
  3. A typed version of any hand written notes
All I got was the officer's hand written notes and it is not at all legible. Just looks like scribbles. See P.1 and P.2. Can my disclosure request letter stating my request for a typed version of his notes along with his illegible notes be enough to ask for a rescheduling to get typed notes and to prepare for another court date?
Any idea how or where I can find out the correct process to calibrate the LIDAR?
What are the other "ways" or "outs" you were talking about on winning the case?

Thanks again for your time, insight and help.
Yes, you should be able to get your trial rescheduled based on his notes not being legible. Even if you hadn't asked for it specifically. They're useless as is.

Don't know about getting a copy of the LIDAR calibration process. In general, it's accepted that if the officer thinks the unit is working correctly, then that's good enough for the JP. It would be tough to win your case based on those grounds. I did post back in here a few months ago the transcript that one of the ticket fighters produced when they fought on those grounds (might have been radar, though). You could dig through there and try to find it, or google something like "ticket fighter Ontario transcript calibration".

You can try reading through here:
http://www.motorists.org/wp-content/upl ... bookA1.pdf
No idea how correct this book is, but it might give you some ideas.

The "outs" are try to outlast the system. You show up at your first trial, hopefully the cop doesn't show, and the prosecutor drops the case. If the cop does show, you say that the notes provided are illegible, and you need a typed copy, along with a new trial date. On your next trial date, maybe the cop doesn't show that time. Be prepared to argue why your ticket should be tossed instead of rescheduled if the officer doesn't show, as the prosecutor will likely try that trick.

If it actually comes to trial, you'll likely lose. Frankly, for a $52.50 ticket, personally I'd just pay it and be done with it, but everyone's tolerance for doing that is different.

Found this article on CBC as well...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatch ... -1.4771995

It's Saskatchewan based, but likely still relevant.

C
Last edited by CNeufeld on Dec 12th, 2019 8:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jr. Member
May 16, 2012
199 posts
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Toronto
CNeufeld wrote: Yes, you should be able to get your trial rescheduled based on his notes not being legible. Even if you hadn't asked for it specifically. They're useless as is.

Don't know about getting a copy of the LIDAR calibration process. In general, it's accepted that if the officer thinks the unit is working correctly, then that's good enough for the JP. It would be tough to win your case based on those grounds. I did post back in here a few months ago the transcript that one of the ticket fighters produced when they fought on those grounds (might have been radar, though). You could dig through there and try to find it, or google something like "ticket fighter Ontario transcript calibration".

You can try reading through here:
http://www.motorists.org/wp-content/upl ... bookA1.pdf
No idea how correct this book is, but it might give you some ideas.

The "outs" are try to outlast the system. You show up at your first trial, hopefully the cop doesn't show, and the prosecutor drops the case. If the cop does show, you say that the notes provided are illegible, and you need a typed copy, along with a new trial date. On your next trial date, maybe the cop doesn't show that time. Be prepared to argue why your ticket should be tossed instead of rescheduled if the officer doesn't show, as the prosecutor will likely try that trick.

If it actually comes to trial, you'll likely lose. Frankly, for a $52.50 ticket, personally I'd just pay it and be done with it, but everyone's tolerance for doing that is different.

Found this article on CBC as well...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatch ... -1.4771995

It's Saskatchewan based, but likely still relevant.

C
Thank you so much for the insight my friend. Is there any way we can show you some appreciation for all the beneficial information you give us?
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Mar 23, 2008
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RitchES wrote: Thank you so much for the insight my friend. Is there any way we can show you some appreciation for all the beneficial information you give us?
Just post back with the results. Not enough people do that, and it would help give more data points for other people in the same situations.

C
Newbie
Dec 11, 2019
1 posts
Long story short, a year and a half ago I got caught coming off the highway into the service road, 90km/h in a 50 zone which puts me right into excessive speeding bracket. Contested the ticket, lost it, the fines are all the same, over 500$, 6 points but what bugs me the most is the excessive speeding itself, which stays on file for 10 years as far as know. The consequences are known. Just got the judgment by mail, confirming the fine, fault, etc. Now the question is, and forgive me if it's a stupid question, whether there are ways to still get it reduced? Or that's it? Pay the fine and suck it up for the next 10 years? I'm kicking myself for not paying attention to speed that evening, but it is what it is.. Any advice?
Planning on calling the ticket911 tomorrow to see what they say
Jr. Member
May 16, 2012
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Toronto
CNeufeld wrote: Just post back with the results. Not enough people do that, and it would help give more data points for other people in the same situations.

C
I most certainly will do, buddy. Thanks again for your help.
Deal Guru
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Mar 23, 2008
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ArtiomN21641 wrote: Long story short, a year and a half ago I got caught coming off the highway into the service road, 90km/h in a 50 zone which puts me right into excessive speeding bracket. Contested the ticket, lost it, the fines are all the same, over 500$, 6 points but what bugs me the most is the excessive speeding itself, which stays on file for 10 years as far as know. The consequences are known. Just got the judgment by mail, confirming the fine, fault, etc. Now the question is, and forgive me if it's a stupid question, whether there are ways to still get it reduced? Or that's it? Pay the fine and suck it up for the next 10 years? I'm kicking myself for not paying attention to speed that evening, but it is what it is.. Any advice?
Planning on calling the ticket911 tomorrow to see what they say
Post back with the results of your discussion with them, but AFAIK, once you've lost the trial, your only option is to appeal. But you have to have some basis for the appeal, like the JP made an error or something. If you try to appeal just because you don't like the decision, you'll get shut down quickly.

C
Jr. Member
Oct 16, 2012
131 posts
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Toronto
Good evening,

I picked up 3 tickets two weeks back in Scarborough.

1) 27 over posted speed of 50..thought it was 60. I was in the wrong either way
2) failure to produce updated insurance card.. i was insured just could not find it on my email. They sent a new one within minutes later that day.
3) tinted windows.

From what i have read, should i request an Early resolution for #2? show them proof of insurance on the date of my infractions? Any input or experience with this one being dropped?

Should i request a trial for #1? or also, take a plea with Early resolution? Hopefully there is one that is. 27 over is alot after all.

ill be going tomorrow morning to file, hoping to hear back from someone here..
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Mar 23, 2008
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luked3 wrote: Good evening,

I picked up 3 tickets two weeks back in Scarborough.

1) 27 over posted speed of 50..thought it was 60. I was in the wrong either way
2) failure to produce updated insurance card.. i was insured just could not find it on my email. They sent a new one within minutes later that day.
3) tinted windows.

From what i have read, should i request an Early resolution for #2? show them proof of insurance on the date of my infractions? Any input or experience with this one being dropped?

Should i request a trial for #1? or also, take a plea with Early resolution? Hopefully there is one that is. 27 over is alot after all.

ill be going tomorrow morning to file, hoping to hear back from someone here..
Keep in mind you weren't charged with not HAVING insurance; that's a much more serious charge. You were charged with failing to produce your insurance card. Being able to produce it now doesn't change anything.

If you're lucky, you'll get one or two of the charges dropped in exchange for pleading guilty on the other. You could try to do an early resolution on all three and see how the negotiation goes. You've got nothing to lose but your time. Keep in mind that demerits don't mean anything; convictions do.

C
Jr. Member
Oct 16, 2012
131 posts
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Toronto
CNeufeld wrote: Keep in mind you weren't charged with not HAVING insurance; that's a much more serious charge. You were charged with failing to produce your insurance card. Being able to produce it now doesn't change anything.

If you're lucky, you'll get one or two of the charges dropped in exchange for pleading guilty on the other. You could try to do an early resolution on all three and see how the negotiation goes. You've got nothing to lose but your time. Keep in mind that demerits don't mean anything; convictions do.

C

Thanks for the quick response

Im going to eat the tint fine, its 65$. Not sure if will show on insurance.

The speed, id be happy to have it cut in half. The insurance slip issue I am really hoping they will drop it completely.
I guess I will go for the ER and see what they say. I dont even want to bring up the tint charge, i feel like ill have a better chance lessening two tickets than all 3. The cop did mention that if I showed up with my proof of in-date insurance theres a good chance they would drop that one completely.. Wondering if anyone else has had that, i understand its pretty common
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Jan 16, 2011
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luked3 wrote: Thanks for the quick response

Im going to eat the tint fine, its 65$. Not sure if will show on insurance.

The speed, id be happy to have it cut in half. The insurance slip issue I am really hoping they will drop it completely.
I guess I will go for the ER and see what they say. I dont even want to bring up the tint charge, i feel like ill have a better chance lessening two tickets than all 3. The cop did mention that if I showed up with my proof of in-date insurance theres a good chance they would drop that one completely.. Wondering if anyone else has had that, i understand its pretty common
Are your windows illegally tinted?
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Oct 16, 2012
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yeah. Im not fighting that ticket though. I will pay the fine
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luked3 wrote: yeah. Im not fighting that ticket though. I will pay the fine
Can I ask how dark your tints are? I imagine that cops would have a problem with < 15%.
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Jr. Member
Oct 16, 2012
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Toronto
ds2chan wrote: Can I ask how dark your tints are? I imagine that cops would have a problem with < 15%.
20%. Ive been pulled over in the past with no issues

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