Automotive

Ask me anything about fighting your traffic ticket (Speeding, Parking, etc.)

Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
myps wrote: Hello,

I just found this thread and am in need of advice as I am heading to court soon. Thank you in advance!!

I was caught turning right during a time that it was restricted. I received my disclosure which includes the officer's notes and a DVD.

Notes:
- The officer made errors in recording my license plate. One letter is off.
- He also used "he" and "him" although I am female.

DVD:
The dvd runs for six minutes (from 7:06am to 7:12am), including the time that the officer said that I was stopped (7:11am in his notes). During the six minutes of dvd, the recording shows the officer stopping and ticketing another vehicle, not me. I was probably stopped afterwards.

Any advice on how to fight this ticket? This is a 3 dermerit point ticket. From the errors noted above, do I have a chance?

Thank you!!
In Ontario license plate thing will not help you and he/him thing will not help you.

As far as video goes, you can make another request for DVD of your vehicle saying that the video you got is not you. But the officer does not need the video to get you convicted as they will just read from their notes anyways.
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I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
dchang8619 wrote: Shrek (or anyone else who has input...)

So Early Resolution was useless. The prosecutor didn't even understand what the "Inspection schedule" was - he made the same mistake that my driver made, which was to confuse "inspection schedule", the document that was supposed to be surrendered, with the actual "driving schedule" and/or "inspection report". Because of this, he did not lower any charges and asked us to proceed to trial. If even he, an agent of the courts, is unaware of the details, would this not be unresonable to expect the driver to understand what the police officer was asking for?

Furthermore, the ticket the officer issued said "Did commit the offence of: Fail to surrender inspection schedule contrary to HTA 107(7)". However, On the notice of Early Resolution Meeting, and on the Trial Notice itself, it says "regarding the offence of FL Surrender Inspection Report".

These are two entirely different charges. Is this a way for us to get out of this second charge? The driver did perhaps fail to surrender the inspection SCHEDULE, because of his misunderstanding of what the officer was asking. But he DID in fact surrender the inspection report to the officer. So I suppose one question is, what takes precedence - the officer's ticket, or the actual trial notice, because they are referring to two different charges? How should I go about arguing this in court? Should the driver admit to having surrendered the inspection report (which he did), and not surrendering the inspection schedule (which he did), even though it was in the vehicle at the time?

If the trial notice charges us with one offence (failure to surrender inspection report), and we prove beyond reasonable doubt that that particular offence was not committed, by admitting that he did forget to surrender the schedule, but not the report, can they just turn around and charge us with the "original" offense of "failure to surrender inspection schedule"?

I have the trial tomorrow morning, sorry for the short notice, but any input would be really helpful!
Make sure to take copies of all relevant laws and regualtions that have all the definitions of the different reports and schedules as it will be important for you to make sure the JP understands that they are different things.

Personally I would raise the issue about ticket and notice of trial having different charges on them. Since you don't have any experience in court you can argue that you are confused about this and didn't know which one to prepare to defend and that it needs to be clarified and another trial date set so you can properly prepare for the correct charge.
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I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Jan 31, 2018
2 posts
Hello. The officer gave me 4 (FOUR) tickets at one time today. Please help.

Situation: I was driving down a hill with my music loud. He told me I was going 90 in a 60 zone. I do not recall ever going 90, I possibly got to 80 but there was also ice on the ground and I did not want to break. He then said he followed me and I did not stop for him. I would NEVER not stop for a police officer. I remember looking at my rearview and thinking it was a regular black car. I did not see siren lights or hear sirens (again, my music was loud). I stopped at a red and he came and knocked at my window. I do not even know what the last two tickets mean, this is my dad's car. I may have last year's insurance papers in my car. I am insured on them and the current insurance. What is no currently validated permit? Can you tell me how many Demerit points total the following are?

He ticketed me for:

1. Speeding - 90 km/h in a 60 zone km/h
2. Fail to stop on right for an emergency vehicle.
3. Drive motor vehicle, no currently validated permit
4. Fail to have insurance card.

Also, how should I proceed? I am freaking out. :(
Last edited by gummyinmytummy on Feb 1st, 2018 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Newbie
Feb 6, 2011
1 posts
I got a speeding ticket by OPP for doing 140 km/h while on the highway (100 km/h). Should I request a trial?
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
gummyinmytummy wrote: Hello. The officer gave me 4 (FOUR) tickets at one time today. Please help.

Situation: I was driving down a hill with my music loud. He told me I was going 90 in a 60 zone. I do not recall ever going 90, I possibly got to 80 but there was also ice on the ground and I did not want to break. He then said he followed me and I did not stop for him. I would NEVER not stop for a police officer. I remember looking at my rearview and thinking it was a regular black car. I did not see siren lights or hear sirens (again, my music was loud). I stopped at a red and he came and knocked at my window. I do not even know what the last two tickets mean, this is my dad's car. I may have last year's insurance papers in my car. I am insured on them and the current insurance. What is no currently validated permit? Can you tell me how many Demerit points total the following are?

He ticketed me for:

1. Speeding - 90 km/h in a 60 zone km/h
2. Fail to stop on right for an emergency vehicle.
3. Drive motor vehicle, no currently validated permit
4. Fail to have insurance card.

Also, how should I proceed? I am freaking out. :(
Plead not guilty to all tickets and request a trial with the officer present. Once you get your Notice of Trial, request disclosure (copy of officers notes, information on speed measuring device used). Once you get the disclosure, black out personal and officer info and post it here so we can review.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
Renni_30 wrote: I got a speeding ticket by OPP for doing 140 km/h while on the highway (100 km/h). Should I request a trial?
Yes.

Plead not guilty and request a trial with the officer present. Once you get your Notice of Trial, request disclosure (copy of officers notes, information on speed measuring device used). Once you get the disclosure, black out personal and officer info and post it here so we can review.
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Jan 19, 2018
6 posts
If pedestrian gives up their right of way and signals motorist (by hand or face) who has stopped for the pedestrian, to go ahead, can the motorist be pulled over by police officer and ticketed for failing to yield to a pedestrian in a crosswalk? If ticketed, can the motorist plead not guilty and win?
Deal Guru
User avatar
Mar 23, 2008
10134 posts
6435 upvotes
Edmonton
daksh99 wrote: If pedestrian gives up their right of way and signals motorist (by hand or face) who has stopped for the pedestrian, to go ahead, can the motorist be pulled over by police officer and ticketed for failing to yield to a pedestrian in a crosswalk? If ticketed, can the motorist plead not guilty and win?
Yes, they can be ticketed, I believe. And unless you get the pedestrian as a witness, I suspect you’d lose. You might be able to bargain it down with the prosecutor, like any other ticket.

C
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
gummyinmytummy wrote: So I shouldn’t do the prosecutor (option 2) for the last 2 tickets?
You can meet with prosecutor before trial to discuss plea deal. Early resolution just means an extra day off and extra trip to their office. You can have same discussion before trial.
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I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--
Newbie
Jan 19, 2018
6 posts
CNeufeld wrote: Yes, they can be ticketed, I believe. And unless you get the pedestrian as a witness, I suspect you’d lose. You might be able to bargain it down with the prosecutor, like any other ticket.

C
Thanks for the insight. Appreciate it.
Newbie
Jan 25, 2018
28 posts
2 upvotes
Ok I called them back and got emailed the disclosure. Besides what is posted, I got the front of the ticket and also my drivers abstract for the last 7 years or so. Thoughts? Trial is in May.

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ShrekTek wrote: The only thing it will achieve at your trial is getting an adjournment to another trial date, with the delay being counted against you.

The original post is really old and caselaw has changed things in Ontario. It is now YOUR responsibility to check if disclosure is ready and to get the disclosure. The prosecutions only responsibility is to have it ready for you... they do NOT have to contact you to tell you its ready and they do NOT have to send it to you.
Newbie
Jan 29, 2018
4 posts
Been reading a bit through this thread, and so far finding it very helpful in various aspects. So, thank you to the OP and those who continue to contribute your thoughts; I can only imagine a lot more people appreciate this thread than the contributors think.

So here's my story, it's not as intense as some of the others I've read on here, so I appreciate any of the experts' thoughts. I'll try to be concise, yet effective in explanation:

Got pulled over back in early April 2017:

- received a warning on what I actually got pulled over for
- received a ticket for "drive motor vehicle, no currently validated permit" (i.e. no permit sticker on the back of my ownership papers. the actual vehicle permit was, of course, valid for the year; just didn't have sticker on back of ownership papers)
- ticket has correct date, but wrong time on it (time on ticket was about half hour before I actually got pulled over)
- officer had video of me (of course, time in video did not match ticket)
- requested disclosure (obviously). notes are pretty straight forward and accurate (except one part, but this part pertains to the warning I received for what I actually got pulled over for and not the ticket I received). other than that, maybe a spelling mistake here or there. and there is video.
- did my research, incorrect times on tickets seem to only qualify as minor errors and can be amended in court at the discretion of judge. at most, it would only question the quality of everything else recorded by the officer. even if I used the video disclosure as evidence to back my argument of discrepancy in time, it looks like it will only fire back at me, proving that I was pulled over, regardless.
- my permit at the time expired in May 2017, so it was not a case of expiry (had one month left till expiry). I also renewed for 2018 the day after I got pulled over; figured it's better to demonstrate a sense of immediate due diligence in case I need to show judge my proactive goodwill.
- already had first court trial date in Oct 2017 (officer did not show), requested adjournment, reason provided I did not feel I had appropriate knowledge to conduct a proper trial (it was my first ever trial in life, first-ever traffic offence in life, and I had no idea what I was doing), so of course, I would proceed to delay trial. adjournment granted.
- adjourned trial date coming up next week
- from what I've read online, it seems that providing proof of current permit validation at the time of alleged offence, new permit renewal, and of course, showing that the stickers are now on the back of ownership papers should be sufficient for judge to dismiss and drop charges. officer not showing up also helps.

My question is:
- do I proceed as usual and step up to the stand, wait for judge to ask how I plea, and before I even mention what I plea, share that my 2017 permit was valid, renewed for 2018, receipts / official doc for both 2017 and 2018, present ownership papers showing stickers on back, and state that I would like to request for a motion to dismiss? hope for the best?
- I expect the prosecutor to open with something like "defendant failed to have validated permit as per officer's notes stating no sticker on back" (as this is what the prosecutor opened with last time). If judge asks me whether this is true, I obviously cannot, not tell the truth
- people have said you could approach the prosecutor prior to your trial time in an attempt to have the ticket dropped, which is great, but prosecutors aren't always this accommodating and they also are usually unavailable to approach as they are attending one case after another (i.e. it's like clockwork for the prosecutor).

My initial approach was to actually take the angle of the incorrect timestamp on the ticket, but that's looking less and less favourable for me from what I'm reading. So now, I'm considering just explaining myself at trial in front of the judge (i.e. demonstrating permit renewal, etc.) which is effectively pleading guilty and hoping the judge will dismiss everything based on goodwill and immediate rectification? Technically, the ticket itself just states "Drive Motor Vehicle, No currently validated permit". Nothing about sticker on back of permit (except in officer's notes), so maybe take angle of addressing ticket offence at face value? This is almost getting too technical with language, but whatever works?

Would deeply appreciate any expert opinion and thoughts. Thanks.
Sr. Member
Jun 15, 2017
736 posts
164 upvotes
Ontario, Canada
pizdets17 wrote: Ok I called them back and got emailed the disclosure. Besides what is posted, I got the front of the ticket and also my drivers abstract for the last 7 years or so. Thoughts? Trial is in May.

Image
What are the actual charges again? In Ontario?
--
I am not a lawyer and I am not a paralegal and I do not give legal advice.
All statements made are my opinion only.
--

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