Home & Garden

Ask me anything about HVAC heating air conditioning air quality control

  • Last Updated:
  • Mar 18th, 2024 3:29 pm
Deal Addict
Dec 27, 2007
1074 posts
164 upvotes
Markham
Hey Raw,

this is just a place for people to post questions and have people help out with the best of their ability. Unfortunately, a lot of problems are not solvable without seeing the issues or situations. Feel free to help out where you can.
Newbie
Jun 10, 2007
4 posts
Hi,

I'm thinking about installing a new air conditioning unit and furnace shortly as my current one is nearing its end (22 years old). I've heard the pros and cons of going with either medium and high efficiency. However, the one question that all the HVAC guys I know can't answer has to do with power venting a high efficiency furnace. Can it be power vented through a chimney or is the chimney too high and the resultant motor size too big to warrant it? The reason why I'm asking is two fold: one, I just had my chimney rebuilt a couple of years back and don't want to waste it and secondly, the only logical spot in which to power vent it to the outside happens to be in an area where my children play, even during the winter months. Should I simply go with a medium efficiency furnace to help this or is there another solution?
Sr. Member
May 24, 2003
931 posts
46 upvotes
primetime1 wrote: Hi,

I'm thinking about installing a new air conditioning unit and furnace shortly as my current one is nearing its end (22 years old). I've heard the pros and cons of going with either medium and high efficiency. However, the one question that all the HVAC guys I know can't answer has to do with power venting a high efficiency furnace. Can it be power vented through a chimney or is the chimney too high and the resultant motor size too big to warrant it? The reason why I'm asking is two fold: one, I just had my chimney rebuilt a couple of years back and don't want to waste it and secondly, the only logical spot in which to power vent it to the outside happens to be in an area where my children play, even during the winter months. Should I simply go with a medium efficiency furnace to help this or is there another solution?
Venting a high effeciency furnace through a regular chimney would be almost impractical if not impossible. I can't imagine being on top of a roof with a bunch of 10 foot 636 coupled together and then trying to get it down a 6 inch chimney opening. Its hard enough getting a liner down a chimney sometimes, plus you may have an offset in the chimney, which is not uncommon. Actually the more I think of it, the more impossible the thought is.

I don't understand how where your children play would be a factor. The pipes are high enough that they wouldn't be a factor, plus you could offset them so they come into and out one side of the room. If you have drywall or the joists are running the perpendicular with the pipes, most likely it would just be an eyesore.

This is just the start of a nightmare the government has created by mandating all new furnace are to be high efficiency ones. A lot of homes with finished basements are just not suited to have one installed.
Newbie
Apr 8, 2009
8 posts
Does a builder provide to a homeowner a HVAC
certificate/permit or sticker stating that it passed
the ontario city inspection on a new residental home?

For an electrical inspection an authorized electrical contractor
places a sticker and inspection signature on the fuse box,
is this similarly done for HVAC or another method?


Any input and comments appreciated.
Sr. Member
May 28, 2007
719 posts
46 upvotes
GTA
Since I changed a moderating DC Motor high efficiency furnace, My furnace room is so hot. I am worry about all my heat has lost inside furnace room before go to other room. The other side of rooms have very weak air. Anything I can do?
Newbie
Nov 5, 2007
88 posts
11 upvotes
Woodstock
I had a new new a/c and furnace put in.
the lines to the a/c and pipes for the furnace go through the rim joist then out through the brick, the pipes going through brick are caulked. Is it normal not to seal the pipes going through the rim joist?
Sr. Member
Dec 9, 2007
541 posts
16 upvotes
Vancouver
I have tried to read through all the posts on this thread so that I don't repeat something but I haven't seen an answer for my question.

I am doing a number of energy upgrades through the eco energy program (mostly insulation related) and I am trying to decide about whether I should get and ERV/HRV and whether I should get a new furnace.

First off, my furnace is not that old, coming up on 6 years in service, it is a Carrier 58MSA which is rated as 90% AFUE. I believe this unit is only a single stage unit with only a single fan speed. What I am trying to figure out is since I already have done the energy audit (that is already a sunk cost) is there any value in taking advantage of the rebates/ tax credits to get a new furnace. Here is my math:

$1300 (ecoenergy rebate) + $100 (enbridge) + $500 home reno tax credit = $1900 towards a new furnace.

I am guessing that a new furnace of 94% efficiency or better with a variable speed DC motor is likely $3000-$3500 installed. So can I recoupe the $1100-$1600 in energy savings gas/ electricty and over what time? I can't believe it'll be more that $100-$150/ year at the high end. Also when would I start to expect repair issues on the furnace to factor into the payback formula?

Would I see any other non energy related benefits like better heat circulation in the house, noise reduction, etc.? Are 96 or 97% AFUE units significantly more than 94% units?

Secondly, I want to get an ERV/ HRV not for energy savings but general comfort in the house. HOwever given the fact the you get $750 from ecoenergy this seems like the time to buy one. Does this require a new furnace or can mine be retrofitted? Is there any advantage to doing this at the same time as a furnace? What is a good name brand and what should I expect to see in terms of installation costs?

So in a nut shell if you were in my place and planning to stay in the same place for long while would you get a new furnace because of the rebates/ tax credits above?

Thanks,
Member
Dec 2, 2003
412 posts
11 upvotes
Ottawa
Our house is a 2-storey 50's house with a forced air furnace (ICG - 1988) and an AC unit (Trane - 2004?). We have had a EcoEnergy Audit done and are awaiting the results. We are planning on taking advantage of the current incentives to replace the old furnace.

My first question is, beyond visual inspection, is there any way of knowing whether you should or shouldn't be replacing your ductwork? We have easy access to the horizontal runs in the basement (both cold air return and hot air) if that makes a difference. There are several things that have caught my attention:

- lots of ports (round plugs) and access holes (square untaped patches) for duct cleaning
- trim around main portion of plenum -- screwed into duct
- taped gaps, especially around AC heat exchanger and other joints

Second question: if duct work replaced, can the vertical lines be reused or do they need replacing as well?

Thanks!
Deal Guru
User avatar
Nov 18, 2005
11955 posts
3699 upvotes
Kingston
With all the rebates out there and statements like "if your furnace is over 10 years old you should replace it" I was thinking it might be time to replace my furnace.

It is a Carrier. It is 16 years old. It is high-efficiency. Since I've already got a high efficiency furnace is there much value in replacing it?
Member
Oct 10, 2006
423 posts
147 upvotes
Toronto
I am in a similar situation as well, my furnance is 5 years old and is mid-efficiency 80%.
My CAC was 20 years old, so I decided to replace it this year and went along with the EcoAudit.

However, looking at the rebates for High Efficiency Furnance I have decided to change my current furnance as my net cost was only around $800. An offer I could not refuse.

Here is the breakdown:

GoodMan 96% AUFE furnace GMV95704 70000BTU cost with installation and 10year parts and labour warranty -- $3065+gst = $3218
Eco Rebate -- Ontario -- $790
Eco Reabte -- Federal -- $790
OPA Rebate in Ontario -- $125
Enbridge -- $100
HRTC -- $483 (3218x0.15%)
Additional OPA rebate -- $150
(as CAC becomes 15 SEER and 12.5EER with high Efficiency Furnance)
NET COST -- $780

Average Annual House Hold energy portion of bill (Total bill - water heater) is $1500 so my savings in going from 80% to 96% translates to $240/year

So it is worth the upgrade as long as you are planning on staying in the house for 5 years.

whodaphucru wrote: I have tried to read through all the posts on this thread so that I don't repeat something but I haven't seen an answer for my question.

I am doing a number of energy upgrades through the eco energy program (mostly insulation related) and I am trying to decide about whether I should get and ERV/HRV and whether I should get a new furnace.

First off, my furnace is not that old, coming up on 6 years in service, it is a Carrier 58MSA which is rated as 90% AFUE. I believe this unit is only a single stage unit with only a single fan speed. What I am trying to figure out is since I already have done the energy audit (that is already a sunk cost) is there any value in taking advantage of the rebates/ tax credits to get a new furnace. Here is my math:

$1300 (ecoenergy rebate) + $100 (enbridge) + $500 home reno tax credit = $1900 towards a new furnace.

I am guessing that a new furnace of 94% efficiency or better with a variable speed DC motor is likely $3000-$3500 installed. So can I recoupe the $1100-$1600 in energy savings gas/ electricty and over what time? I can't believe it'll be more that $100-$150/ year at the high end. Also when would I start to expect repair issues on the furnace to factor into the payback formula?

Would I see any other non energy related benefits like better heat circulation in the house, noise reduction, etc.? Are 96 or 97% AFUE units significantly more than 94% units?

Secondly, I want to get an ERV/ HRV not for energy savings but general comfort in the house. HOwever given the fact the you get $750 from ecoenergy this seems like the time to buy one. Does this require a new furnace or can mine be retrofitted? Is there any advantage to doing this at the same time as a furnace? What is a good name brand and what should I expect to see in terms of installation costs?

So in a nut shell if you were in my place and planning to stay in the same place for long while would you get a new furnace because of the rebates/ tax credits above?

Thanks,
Deal Expert
User avatar
Jul 30, 2007
33234 posts
21163 upvotes
Toronto
Hey Brian,

I would like to replace my 20+year old furance (with a high eff. one , buget around $3,000 - $3,500), I had spoken to a few HVAC sales about my replacement and I find the process extremely confusing as they all talk down the other brands that they do not sell. First of all, I am looking for a reliable, durable furnace that will give me trouble free operation for the next 15-20 years. I have heard American Standard and Rheem are the leaders in the industry. One HVAC sales say the first thing to look for in a quality furnace is the type of steel used in the heat exchanger.... Look for one that is made of stainless steel, rather than aluminumized steel. Do you have any insight what should I be looking for ?
Jr. Member
Dec 30, 2006
193 posts
57 upvotes
Toronto
Question for Brian (or anyone else): I'm about to replace my backyard patio, which will require temporarily moving the AC unit out of the way. Is it easy to do the disconnection and reconnection myself, or is it something I should be getting a professional in to do? And if so, any idea of the cost? Thanks in advance.
Member
Mar 17, 2002
497 posts
69 upvotes
Vancouver
Looking to replace the furnace in my newly purchased home, however the original 1960 165,000BTU beast seems to have asbestos tape on the ducting. The first furnace that came to quote me just mentioned to wear a mask if handling it. I have another company coming to quote me and I asked him over the phone about how asbestos tape is handled but he said he wasn't quite sure and would get back to me.

I'm wondering what furnace installers do when handling asbestos? I want to make sure it's safely taken care of since the room where the furnace may be used as a bedroom occasionally.
Member
Dec 2, 2003
412 posts
11 upvotes
Ottawa
We had an old boiler implode in our rental in Halifax several years ago. Boiler was asbestos wrapped, as were most of the pipes. Asked the workers if we should move some of our stuff out of the storage room and they said "No, we'll cover it up and seal everything off." Ya right... they just draped thin plastic over everything (not even complete coverage)... and then left it there for me to clean up. Thanks... so much for asbestos abatement with them!

Just had our attic insulation removed in our newly purchased home - much different experience. Sealed environment with decent decontamination area. Negative air pressure and very clean workers. Overkill likely, but worthwhile.

From what I understand and have researched, with pipe insulation, the abatement contractors should be enclosing the area and then wetting the insulation to reduce dust. For disposal, asbestos must be double-bagged in 6mil plastic and taken to hazardous materials site within 10 days. Quite stringent.

Of course, in the end, it depends on the amount of asbestos and your risk threshold. Full out abatement is $$$.

Good luck!
badkarma wrote: Looking to replace the furnace in my newly purchased home, however the original 1960 165,000BTU beast seems to have asbestos tape on the ducting. The first furnace that came to quote me just mentioned to wear a mask if handling it. I have another company coming to quote me and I asked him over the phone about how asbestos tape is handled but he said he wasn't quite sure and would get back to me.

I'm wondering what furnace installers do when handling asbestos? I want to make sure it's safely taken care of since the room where the furnace may be used as a bedroom occasionally.
Deal Addict
Nov 27, 2005
3579 posts
610 upvotes
I'm looking into getting an A/C unit for my new home in Milton. Is getting a 14 seer unit really worth it over a 13?

Also, I've been told that it's better to install the unit on the ground. Unfortunately I don't have and grass yet. So I was told it would need to be mounted with a bracket on the side of the house. What are the pros/cons of the two types of installation?

Thanks.
Deal Addict
Jul 20, 2005
1407 posts
6 upvotes
hi. looking to install an central air conditioner.

for a 3300 sq. foot house (never had air-con installed), should I get a 3 ton or a 3.5 ton unit?

what's the best time to buy a central air conditioning unit (with installation)? when do the new models come out? is it better to wait for the new models to come out? is it better to buy last year's model?
Newbie
Apr 1, 2009
13 posts
14 upvotes
I'm looking into installing an ERV system but my house is on a slab (no basement). The furnace and the hot water tank are both installed on the main level and they are already pretty noisy and I don't want to install another source of noise.
Can someone tell me how much noise an ERV produces? Right now I'm looking at a vanEE product. I could ask directly the manufacturer but I will probably receive an answer that fits their interests and it will be in decibels which doesn't tell me a lot.

Thank you,
Dragos
Member
Nov 14, 2007
332 posts
2 upvotes
Hi,
We want to move the current furnace location in the basement to a corner when we install a new furnace. Currently it is in a central location in the basement. I got few quotes for the duct rework, but the last one scared me. Not sure if he is the only honest HVAC guy or just does not want to do the duct work.
He recommend that we keep everything the way it is, if we change the duct work, the airflow will suffer no matter how large the ducts will be since the distance will be further.
He also said that chaning the duct work will cost >15K even if we move things less than 10 feet.

Anyway, does this make sense? Is moving duct work a big no-no? can all these other contractors be missing this problem?
Thanks...
PS basement is unfinished.
Deal Guru
User avatar
Nov 18, 2005
11955 posts
3699 upvotes
Kingston
bdragos wrote: I'm looking into installing an ERV system but my house is on a slab (no basement). The furnace and the hot water tank are both installed on the main level and they are already pretty noisy and I don't want to install another source of noise.
Can someone tell me how much noise an ERV produces? Right now I'm looking at a vanEE product. I could ask directly the manufacturer but I will probably receive an answer that fits their interests and it will be in decibels which doesn't tell me a lot.

Thank you,
Dragos
I have a vanEE HRV and it is practically silent. You have to get very very close to it to hear if it is running. As well, to install it they suspend it by heavy rubber straps so no sound is transmitted to the building.
Deal Guru
User avatar
Nov 18, 2005
11955 posts
3699 upvotes
Kingston
digdoug wrote: hi. looking to install an central air conditioner.

for a 3300 sq. foot house (never had air-con installed), should I get a 3 ton or a 3.5 ton unit?

what's the best time to buy a central air conditioning unit (with installation)? when do the new models come out? is it better to wait for the new models to come out? is it better to buy last year's model?
Could be either and no one can tell you reliably unless they see your house and preferably do a heat gain/loss calculation.

Top

Thread Information

There is currently 1 user viewing this thread. (0 members and 1 guest)