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BSc Biochemistry + lab experience = no entry level job?

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Aug 19, 2011
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BSc Biochemistry + lab experience = no entry level job?

Hey guys,

So let's start from the beginning. 4 years ago, upon entering university I decided that instead of doing a life sci major that I'd rather do a biochem major so that I would have an upper hand (compared to other BSc) when applying to jobs. 4 years later and having graduated couple months ago, I've applied to hundreds of jobs with minimal luck. I first started off applying specifically within the pharmaceutical industry (which is where I'd actually like to work) but after no call backs, started broadening my approach + fixing/tweaking my resume. Eventually I ended up getting around 5 interviews.

-2-3 interview was a phone interview for CSR position at a biotech company --> after phone interview, haven't heard anything back
-1 interview was at a pigment company --> went through 1st interview, 2nd interview and was told by the interviewee as well as HR manager that i was sure to get the job....but then was told that the company didnt have the money to hire me
-1 interview was at a small pharm development company for lab assistant position, however it was a 2 1/2 year contract with a 21G/yearly salary (which I thought was ridiculously low)

Now, I dunno how hard it is for recent BSc grads out there to get a job with a decent salary considering the economic condition, but for me it certainly isn't easy. So i've considered attending private college to get a pharmaceutical QC/QA diploma hoping that this will give me the 'hands on/practical experience' that the employers seem to be looking for. The program is 10 months, and after talking to the course coordinator at the college, she informed me that 90%+ of their graduates obtain a job within months, and that the college will continually help you to look for a job otherwise. Given my current situation, this seems like the best option for me.

I just want to get a general idea about what you all think, or those of you that are working within the pharmaceutical industry? Is this the best way to go, or is there an alternative approach that would save me money and time (15G for the course).

Btw I completed senior thesis with amazing grades, got an NSERC USRA grant, and also have work experience within a clean room laboratory/analytical lab setting...

Any thoughts, or words of advice? I don't really see any BSc job related career threads so thought I'd post and see if anyone can help.
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Oct 25, 2011
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I'll post what I replied to on a different thread, same issue:

"I haven't had the greatest luck. I graduated with a B.Sc in Biology in 2007. I was pretty lucky and got a job right away in a small private biotech company. The starting pay was quite low considering I had a degree. Worked there 3 years, not doing much work-wise and not going anywhere position-wise, but I got little raises every year. I was looking for a new job for around 1.5 years in the meantime, really difficult to find companies in Ottawa and government impossible to get into (for Biological Sciences). Finally found job in another small biotech company. No surprise, had to take pay cut and pay is still quite low anyways. So after 1 year here, not happy with pay or crazy amount of work I have decided to change careers.

At least in Ottawa, a B.Sc has done very little for me and the pay is too crappy. I'm now working towards diploma in Computer Programming from Algonquin part-time, and eventually full-time. The program has co-op too which is great to get your foot in the door in government. I know many programmers and people in Computer Science (degrees and diplomas) and the starting pay is much much higher than Biology and there are decent amount of government jobs. I know its not about making the most money, but I still think you should be paid fairly and based on your education and work load. Also, having a Computer Programmer diploma with any type of Science goes well together, so may be good to have both.

This is just my experience anyways and what I have dealt with first hand the past 4 years..."
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manogah wrote: -1 interview was at a small pharm development company for lab assistant position, however it was a 2 1/2 year contract with a 21G/yearly salary (which I thought was ridiculously low)
So much wrong with this..

First of all, 21k is minimum wage in salary form. I'm serious. Do the math.. That means that they want to pay you minimum wage, but in case they want you to work extra hours, they don't want to have to pay you minimum wage for that extra time.

I think my mind is officially blown.. Is that even legal? I mean, can a company just be like, "15,000yr salary" and get around min. wage laws by saying it's a salary position?

Second, a 2 1/2 year contract? LMAO.. Why not just a 30 year contract with no pension? I mean, 2 1/2 years working for a company with no commitment on their end? Unbelievable..

Manogah, do you have an e-mail for this company? I'd like to send a few choice words their way. Don't worry, I won't implicate you in any way. Besides, I have no idea who you are. I just want to let them know that this is not the way to treat employees.
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Syne wrote: So much wrong with this..

First of all, 21k is minimum wage in salary form. I'm serious. Do the math.. That means that they want to pay you minimum wage, but in case they want you to work extra hours, they don't want to have to pay you minimum wage for that extra time.

I think my mind is officially blown.. Is that even legal? I mean, can a company just be like, "15,000yr salary" and get around min. wage laws by saying it's a salary position?

Second, a 2 1/2 year contract? LMAO.. Why not just a 30 year contract with no pension? I mean, 2 1/2 years working for a company with no commitment on their end? Unbelievable..

Manogah, do you have an e-mail for this company? I'd like to send a few choice words their way. Don't worry, I won't implicate you in any way. Besides, I have no idea who you are. I just want to let them know that this is not the way to treat employees.

I totally disagree with you on this one. OP did not mention he had any sort of experience in the industry, in order for him to edge out high paying people. 21k is a bit low, but depends on which pharm you are working for. I am not sure how old all of you are, but if you are fresh out of school and demand a good paying job with no relevant experience (it's not going to fly). Talk about entitlement you kids have.

What he looking for is not for high pay, what he need is experience to proof to the next company that he is an asset not a liability. New grads are always viewed as liability. Why bother training somebody new, when they can find someone with a lot of experience from overseas. I know doctors overseas who immigrate here will totally take that offer.

I know in certain companies, they pay almost 2.5 for the same job title. So sucks to be in the crappy companies.
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Jun 26, 2011
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Most people I knew while pursuing a BSc went on to masters, med school or dentistry school. Even for these 'entry' positions, you are probably competing against people with a masters degree. It may sound like they're trying to low ball you and pay you a ridiculously low amount, but I promise that starting salary is actually around the average.

I was offered a Chemist position with the annual salary of 24k (also a two year contract). That was probably still an entry position but it sure had more responsibility than a lab assistant. To be honest, I made more money doing part-time work study at the lab at school than what they were offering me. So unless you are able to get into a company/organization which isn't at least semi-big, your salary will be crappy. You'll need to work in a hospital or at least a big company. And the best way to get hired in a hospital doing anything is to volunteer there first, which is another crappy option.

I then worked briefly for a private diagnostic lab at a hospital which paid the same amount. I had to travel nearly an hour and a half each way to get there, and I worked the night shift. I thought I would endure this for the time being and that afterwards I'd have my foot in the door, so to speak. I did this for a year and realized I'm not benefiting from that experience at all.

The best paying offer I came across was a lab position at a university. It was a lab with students who were pursuing their PhD and their masters, and the job would be to make sure they have enough supplies, run their tests, etc etc. Basically they did the thinking, you would do the grunt work. Which is fine, really, for a starting hourly rate of $18.50 (which is still higher than the other two offers!), except my idea of a research job was not to carry out the work of others, but to do things on my own.

I've since then abandoned this road altogether. The industry may be huge, but actual research jobs are very limited, and the turnover rate is very low. Most people with a research job stay at it for years. The labs themselves are relatively tiny, they may probably at most have a team of 20 people.

My suggestion would be to try at hospitals and universities. Gain enough experience, then try to get into a big pharmaceutical company.

Oh and also I had also considered the QA/QC courses which seems to be required for all those positions. I talked to a few people who told me it did not help their search much. Those are the kinds of courses which are simple and if a company is good they'd let you get certified while working with them. They always make it sound like that course would open up all the doors for you. Maybe it enables you to apply to those jobs which had it as a requirement, but it isn't any easier getting those jobs.

Good luck!
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Jan 1, 2007
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manogah wrote: -1 interview was at a small pharm development company for lab assistant position, however it was a 2 1/2 year contract with a 21G/yearly salary (which I thought was ridiculously low)

Lol 21K this company is the true definition of chazzers. My cumpare's nephew made more than that last year and he's only 11 years old.
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spike1128 wrote: I totally disagree with you on this one. OP did not mention he had any sort of experience in the industry, in order for him to edge out high paying people. 21k is a bit low, but depends on which pharm you are working for.
What are you talking about? A bit low!? Pay attention. It legally cannot get any lower for a FT position. It doesn't "depend" on anything. Paying less is not an option.
I am not sure how old all of you are, but if you are fresh out of school and demand a good paying job with no relevant experience (it's not going to fly). Talk about entitlement you kids have.
Oh shut up about entitlement already. Starting right now, every time I hear some self-satisfied armchair critic use the word "entitlement" I'm going to kill a gerbil.
What he looking for is not for high pay, what he need is experience to proof to the next company that he is an asset not a liability. New grads are always viewed as liability. Why bother training somebody new, when they can find someone with a lot of experience from overseas. I know doctors overseas who immigrate here will totally take that offer.

I know in certain companies, they pay almost 2.5 for the same job title. So sucks to be in the crappy companies.
So much for equal work for equal pay, right boss? So you're telling me that certain companies will never retain any experienced employees.. ever? Because they're happy being launching points for their employees to pursue bigger and better things?
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kmarcie wrote: Most people I knew while pursuing a BSc went on to masters, med school or dentistry school.
Maybe most people 'you know' but most people with a B.Sc. by definition, cannot do those things due to grade cutoffs. That's like saying that most people 'I know' went to university, knowing full well that only 20% of Canadians end up graduating university.

And of those 20%, some can't even find minimum wage jobs in their field upon graduating.. What do you think the other 80% of Canadians are doing right now?
Even for these 'entry' positions, you are probably competing against people with a masters degree. It may sound like they're trying to low ball you and pay you a ridiculously low amount, but I promise that starting salary is actually around the average.
Which starting salary? 21k? Please don't make me say it again.. It's not the average of anything. It is *sigh* .. the lowest possible salary that can be paid in the province of Ontario without breaking the law.
pupazzo wrote: Lol 21K this company is the true definition of chazzers. My cumpare's nephew made more than that last year and he's only 11 years old.
It's pretty sad when Pupazzo is the only one to actually get it.
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Wow, times have really changed. When I graduated in 2002 (BSc. Biochemistry), my lowest entry-level offer was $45k; I had no industry experience. I turned it down though because it was only a 3-year contract and I had a better offer elsewhere.

However, the reality of Biology is that you really need a Ph.D. to advance, otherwise you'll hit the salary/promotion ceiling pretty quick. Don't waste your time on an M.Sc. I'm in the same position as people with an M.Sc., but they lost 3-4 years due to grad school.
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Syne wrote: Maybe most people 'you know' but most people with a B.Sc. by definition, cannot do those things due to grade cutoffs. That's like saying that most people 'I know' went to university, knowing full well that only 20% of Canadians end up graduating university.

And of those 20%, some can't even find minimum wage jobs in their field upon graduating.. What do you think the other 80% of Canadians are doing right now?
Let me correct that - When I was in school almost everyone were in fact trying to get into med school or dentistry school. The ones who did not pursued a masters and then some went on to a PhD. Out of the ones who could not do any of the above, maybe only 2-3 people are actually working in the field. Everyone else has moved on to another field.
Syne wrote: Which starting salary? 21k? Please don't make me say it again.. It's not the average of anything. It is *sigh* ..the lowest possible salary that can be paid in the province of Ontario without breaking the law.

It's pretty sad when Pupazzo is the only one to actually get it.
You can say whatever you want, that is actually the average of the entry level jobs I've been able to come in contact with. And yes, obviously we 'get it' and realize that is low. But that doesn't change the fact that that is what is being offered and that someone, in the end, ends up doing it. This is the same scenario as all those unpaid internships everyone is talking about - It's absolutely ridiculous and a child can make more money selling lemonade off the streets, but that's the norm for that field.

Like I said, I've since then abandoned that route altogether anyway.
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Jul 13, 2009
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Syne wrote: First of all, 21k is minimum wage in salary form. I'm serious. Do the math.. That means that they want to pay you minimum wage, but in case they want you to work extra hours, they don't want to have to pay you minimum wage for that extra time.

I think my mind is officially blown.. Is that even legal? I mean, can a company just be like, "15,000yr salary" and get around min. wage laws by saying it's a salary position?

No, they can't. Even if you're salaried, or do piece work, your total pay divided by your total number of hours still has to be above minimum wage.
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So assuming the 21k job was full-time, it is, in fact, a minimum wage salaried job. One that they could not legally make you work overtime at.

Yeah, come on guys.. That's not the average of anything. An average is the difference between highest and lowest. This job cannot go lower, therefore it is not average.
Let me correct that - When I was in school almost everyone were in fact trying to get into med school or dentistry school. The ones who did not pursued a masters and then some went on to a PhD. Out of the ones who could not do any of the above, maybe only 2-3 people are actually working in the field. Everyone else has moved on to another field.
That's fine, but take me for example. I went from graduating a college diploma program, and moved to another field (astronomy) in university. If I get my undergraduate in astronomy, and start looking for work, then by your logic I won't be able to find a job doing anything.. unless I'm somehow able to continue to a master's program. In theory, couldn't this go on forever, back n' forth between fields until you die jobless?
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How does someone have "entitlement problem" for wanting to dismiss a lab job paying $21K (minimum wage) with a bachelor's degree in biochemistry?

$21K is ridiculously low and insulting.
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^ Because "entitlement" has become a misappropriated buzzword to describe anyone who wants anything out of life that they don't already have. It's like how the word "fascist" got ruined in the 90s.

Every time I see the 'E' word, I feel like throwing myself off a cliff.
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Jul 14, 2009
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All I can say is hang in there... You'll find something. I'm in a similar boat but with an MSc.
AND we might have been interviewed for the same 21K position. Don't worry about that. The president of that company got a not-so-pretty email from me explaining how she wasted the time of that many professionals, without confiding crucial information such as pay rate to us beforehand (I had asked about it and they said it will be worth my time). I also mentioned we would be better off salary-wise and experience-wise working as cashiers. If this is the same job, we waited over 2 hrs to get for getting interviewed.
But, there's light at the end of the tunnel. Many recent grads are in the same boat. Don't think it's just for the bio people and good luck.
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kasianman wrote: How does someone have "entitlement problem" for wanting to dismiss a lab job paying $21K (minimum wage) with a bachelor's degree in biochemistry?

$21K is ridiculously low and insulting.

Well, it's not insulting to everyone. Some people might want it.
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Aug 19, 2011
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Pota85 - thanks for your input, really appreciated. It is really frustrating to complete a degree in something you enjoy, spend thousands of dollars for post-secondary education (which everyone throughout your life including the government tells you is neccessary), graduate with more debt than salary your being offered..only to find out that you might have to switch career cause u can't even land a job. Times are tough these days :(

Syne - ye tell me bout it! I'm not going to bust my ass off to make less than minimum wage. Funny thing is, during the interview they were demanding that I will have to work overtime and if i was fine with it, which i was....until they told me the salary. Btw the company is called Impopharma. Let em have it syne! From my knowledge, they interviewed over 20 people and many of them were recent graduates like myself. It's very discouraging to see people being taken advantage of. Also, during the interview i was informed that after my 3 month probation period i would get a pay increase of $300-500....is that supposed to entice me :facepalm:

Mefromparadise - Hmm maybe we were interviewed for the same position. However, in the case we were..I did have similar experiences. I went to the interview about 10 mins early. Was put in a room with the other 5 people who were also being interviewed. I then thought it was going to end up being a group interview. I was so wrong. Some of them had been apparently waiting for 30 minutes because the manager couldn't find a room to hold the interview in and had to wait till a room cleared out. After that we were called in one by one. 45min-1hr later i was called in. Manager asked me why i wanted to work in pharmaceuticals, asked what the health regulatory body was for Canada, and told me about the job and salary and conditions. All in all, I waited over 1hr for a 5 min interview. WASTE OF MY LIFE!
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Aug 19, 2011
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kmarcie - thanks for the info. Your experience seems like there's no future in this industry :( . Or at least if you don't get into one of the big pharm companies. I'll try to get in contact with hospitals and see what they offer. But from what I know most of their lab positions require that you have MLT license, which is another 3 years of schooling. Also, I did apply for lab positions at universities, however, I think in that case I am competing with MSc students with far better credentials compared to me.

kitty - thank the stars you haven't graduated within the last couple years cuase job prospects SUCK! (in the science field at least) and doing MSc or PhD is def not an option for me because I am not interested in wasting more time to end up in the same predicament. Think my best option right now is to look at other careers. Thanks for your input!
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Jun 5, 2010
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Here are a few rules regarding these type of degrees. Unless you are willing to go into a Masters/PhD program, professional programs (medicine, dentistry, Pharmacy, medical radiation sciences, etc), NEVER EVER EVER EVER GO NEAR THEM!!!!!!

Stay clear of any Biology, life science, biochemistry, chemistry, zoology, etc degrees!!!

You will have sleepless nights memorizing and understanding complex systems only to graduate with no prospects. NOT WORTH IT!!! ANY KIDS READING THIS, UNDERSTAND, NOT WORTH IT!!!!!

Take it from someone who has a degree in one of those and couldn't even find a minimal wage job. I eventually continued my education and got a job right out of school making 3x more than what the OP was offered.
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gulmoh wrote: Here are a few rules regarding these type of degrees. Unless you are willing to go into a Masters/PhD program, professional programs (medicine, dentistry, Pharmacy, medical radiation sciences, etc), NEVER EVER EVER EVER GO NEAR THEM!!!!!!

Stay clear of any Biology, life science, biochemistry, chemistry, zoology, etc degrees!!!

You will have sleepless nights memorizing and understanding complex systems only to graduate with no prospects. NOT WORTH IT!!! ANY KIDS READING THIS, UNDERSTAND, NOT WORTH IT!!!!!

Take it from someone who has a degree in one of those and couldn't even find a minimal wage job. I eventually continued my education and got a job right out of school making 3x more than what the OP was offered.

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