Food & Drink

Can we have a mature discussion re vegetarianism/veganism?

  • Last Updated:
  • May 31st, 2017 11:42 pm
Jr. Member
Jan 7, 2017
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Hamilton
JustMe2016 wrote:
May 18th, 2017 11:51 pm
There are two types of vegetarians; those who do it out of concern for their own selves and those who do it out of concern for the life of innocent creatures.
But I like animals AND I like being healthy by eating less animal fat...
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Jun 21, 2016
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differing wrote:
May 18th, 2017 11:07 pm
If you don't think our culture links meat-eating with masculinity, then you must watch zero advertising.

Regardless, American men eat twice the meat products that women do despite requiring only 17% more calories. When you plot average meat consumption for men and women with the recommended intake, the evidence from the US government speaks for itself: Image
Unfortunately that chart has NOTHING to do with masculinity.

Men eat more protein because they REQUIRE MORE. RDA is the MINIMUM amount of nutrients you need to stay alive and be healthy. Athletes, bodybuilders, heck even the average male requires way more protein than the average female. Have you ever seen a female the size of an amateur bodybuilder/athelete?

Also, females avoid meat because they're afraid to 'get fat', it has nothing to do with men thinking eating meat is masculine. Ignorance is a shame...
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Jan 7, 2017
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Hamilton
toronto19850 wrote:
May 19th, 2017 10:18 am
Men eat more protein because they REQUIRE MORE. RDA is the MINIMUM amount of nutrients you need to stay alive and be healthy. Have you ever seen a female the size of an amateur bodybuilder/athelete?
The RDA is the blue range on that chart, read my comment again a bit more carefully next time.
Have you ever seen a female the size of an amateur bodybuilder/athelete?
Muscle growth is a consequence of gene expression and calorie surplus; it has nothing to do with men eating more meat than women, that's just basic biology. Excess protein beyond the RDA is quite literally pissed out after your body has converted the protein's carbon skeleton to fat (it's called nitrogen balance if you'd like to learn some basic kinesiology). The BMR for men is marginally higher 2400 calories vs 2000, so you're looking at about 120 extra calories from protein if you're a male (based on a high protein diet of 30% protein calories)... thats the equivalent of drinking two glasses of milk and two tablespoons of peanut butter; pretty insignificant and doesn't justify the massive increase in meat consumption you describe.
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Jun 21, 2016
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differing wrote:
May 19th, 2017 12:01 pm
The RDA is the blue range on that chart, read my comment again a bit more carefully next time.


Muscle growth is a consequence of gene expression and calorie surplus; it has nothing to do with men eating more meat than women, that's just basic biology. Excess protein beyond the RDA is quite literally pissed out after your body has converted the protein's carbon skeleton to fat (it's called nitrogen balance if you'd like to learn some basic kinesiology). The BMR for men is marginally higher 2400 calories vs 2000, so you're looking at about 120 extra calories from protein if you're a male (based on a high protein diet of 30% protein calories)... thats the equivalent of drinking two glasses of milk and two tablespoons of peanut butter; pretty insignificant and doesn't justify the massive increase in meat consumption you describe.
The RDA is only what you eat to survive and be healthy for the average human. Of course no one actually eats this if they're an athlete, training, workout, labour jobs, more lean body mass, fast metabolisms etc. Males have to consume more, if not they will lose weight/muscle, not gain it. It's simple science as you said. Just like how a cow has to eat more than a chicken, size difference = food requirement difference.

I can't understand how you think females are the same size as males and require the same nutrients. And then your excuse is that men eat more meat for masculinity reason LOL
Tell that to the canadian/american army...only 2400 calories or you're being masculine :facepalm:
Last edited by toronto19850 on May 19th, 2017 12:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jr. Member
Jan 7, 2017
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Hamilton
toronto19850 wrote:
May 19th, 2017 12:33 pm
The RDA is only what you eat to survive and be healthy for the average human. Of course no one actually eats this if they're an athlete or training. Males have to consume more, if not they will lose weight, not gain it. It's simple science as you said. Just like how a cow has to eat more than a chicken, size difference = food requirement difference.
So males between 14 and 70 are all high-performance athletes? Dude I showed you a survey of the general population! Men eat too much meat, I don't know why you're talking about with this athlete stuff. People don't need to adjust their diet because they work out a few times a week.
Last edited by differing on May 19th, 2017 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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differing wrote:
May 18th, 2017 11:07 pm
If you don't think our culture links meat-eating with masculinity, then you must watch zero advertising.
...and also haven't checked out the BBQ thread ;)
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Jun 21, 2016
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differing wrote:
May 19th, 2017 12:39 pm
So males between 14 and 70 are all high-performance athletes? Dude I showed you a survey of the general population! Men eat too much meat, I don't know why you're talking about with this athlete stuff. People don't need to adjust their diet because they work out a few times a week.
Doesn't matter if men eat too much meat or don't that's not what I am debating. You said men eat meat for masculinity reasons...NOPE.
Sr. Member
Jul 7, 2005
765 posts
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North York
differing wrote:
May 18th, 2017 10:46 pm
What's your issue? Defining your value as a man because you whip out your wallet for a slab of meat instead of a salad is pretty pathetic. We'd be stronger men instead of childish losers if we moved past perverted twists on ancient gender roles. I work in healthcare; there's nothing manly about dying early from a stroke or a heart attack because a real man eats meat and vegetables are for sissies.
I don't know what type of people you associate with or how you conjured up this absurd notion that eating meat is manly and associated with some masculine attribute. It is quite disturbing that you think this way and then proceed to project this absurdity to the wider world.

CVD and stroke are the leading cause of death for both men and women in Canada and world wide. Would you like to provide the death stats for men vs women in Canada due to CVD and stroke? It kills more Women then Men in total numbers. You're in healthcare, give us the numbers! While you at it, seek mental help.
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linsook wrote:
May 19th, 2017 7:32 pm
I don't know what type of people you associate with or how you conjured up this absurd notion that eating meat is manly and associated with some masculine attribute. It is quite disturbing that you think this way and then proceed to project this absurdity to the wider world.

CVD and stroke are the leading cause of death for both men and women in Canada and world wide. Would you like to provide the death stats for men vs women in Canada due to CVD and stroke? It kills more Women then Men in total numbers. You're in healthcare, give us the numbers! While you at it, seek mental help.
Wow I thought I was the only one who thought he had something wrong in the brain...sounds like one of those wanna be 'feminists' who is actually just a sociopath
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Jul 23, 2007
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In most cases CVD is entirely preventable. The problem is the majority of people totally refuse to go on the diet and lifestyle change that can either halt the progression or in some cases reverse heart disease.
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Stryker wrote:
May 20th, 2017 4:55 am
In most cases CVD is entirely preventable. The problem is the majority of people totally refuse to go on the diet and lifestyle change that can either halt the progression or in some cases reverse heart disease.
yea this is true, you get lots of signs ahead, even type 2 diabetics is reversible in most cases, as well as kidney failure, liver damage etc.
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Mar 14, 2005
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City of Vancouver
I don't know who designed this, but I find it repulsive:

Image
Jr. Member
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Apr 1, 2015
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Oakville
went vegetarian last December... vegan for the most part while i train (i run a lot) and i've found it really helps with my recovery.


dieting isn't for everyone and certainly isn't easy because we are creatures of comfort as well as habit...but being cognizant of what you eat is the important part. i wouldn't ever suggest for someone to go vegan or not to consume animal protein, but i'll always suggest cutting down on processed junk. the unnecessary sugar that gets thrown into 80% of whats on store shelves... even in the marketed 'healthy/low fat/organic' products is criminal and what is killing the population. you can stick to the suggested typical 'healthy' diet yet still intake 50-60+grams of sugar easily. any diet or food plan that gets you further away from that is a good one imo.
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Jul 7, 2005
765 posts
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North York
MattSF wrote:
May 22nd, 2017 12:52 am
went vegetarian last December... vegan for the most part while i train (i run a lot) and i've found it really helps with my recovery.


dieting isn't for everyone and certainly isn't easy because we are creatures of comfort as well as habit...but being cognizant of what you eat is the important part. i wouldn't ever suggest for someone to go vegan or not to consume animal protein, but i'll always suggest cutting down on processed junk. the unnecessary sugar that gets thrown into 80% of whats on store shelves... even in the marketed 'healthy/low fat/organic' products is criminal and what is killing the population. you can stick to the suggested typical 'healthy' diet yet still intake 50-60+grams of sugar easily. any diet or food plan that gets you further away from that is a good one imo.
anything above 20g carbs a day is criminal!!!

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