Automotive

Chevy Bolt...383km /charge for $30k plus

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  • Jun 12th, 2017 1:22 pm
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Sep 12, 2006
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sokolov wrote:
Jan 14th, 2016 11:49 pm
Any range claim should be taken with more than a graing of salt.
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Redscott wrote:
Feb 1st, 2017 8:11 am
video on you tube where GM engineer explains the that no batteries don't work colder than -30. Wasn't sure if C or F. Not too much of a deal at home as it should be plugged in over night so the battery coolant can be heated to the proper minimum operational temp. What worries me is how much energy this will take when it's parked not at home where no plug to be found and the batteries require heat/energy from themselves.
Actual source starts at 3:11:


NO lithium ion battery works below -30 °F/-34 °C. Batteries in EVs are both insulated and (most are) actively thermally managed. It's never exposed to windchills or the actual raw temperature.

Literally the next sentence after giving specs about the Bolt's battery temperature operating range: "We do condition in both those extreme cases so we'll heat the battery in cold conditions to improve power and improve total energy capacity." As has been discussed on the EV thread and numerous other forums, in the winter, the decrease in range is anywhere from 15-40% depending on temperatures.

A big element that many don't seem to realize is that the delta is much larger in the winter, requiring more energy. e.g. taking the cabin from -10 °C to 25 °C is a 35° difference whereas in the summer, even on the hottest day, it's only going from +35 °C down to 25 °C which is only 10°.

I park outside at work and while this winter hasn't reached -30 °C, even on the coldest day in December 2016 (approximately -15 °C), it wasn't cold enough to activate my vehicle's active battery conditioning.
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Feb 29, 2008
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I've left my Volt outdoors in long term parking at the airport for a week. Not much battery drainage honestly. It takes a long time before the battery reaches ambient temperature. One overnight parking won't be an issue.
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Apr 21, 2004
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Anyone crunched the numbers on the Bolt and see how much it cost to drive per km?

Tesla Model S
39 kWh/100mi is 242Wh/km
.242/.9*$0.13= c/km

Hybrid Vehicle
35MPG is 6.7L/100km
0.067*$1.1 = 7.37

Bolt
kWh/100mi is Wh/km
./.9*$0.13= 3.5c/km

0.9 likely because of electricity charging energy losses and 0.13 being the cost of electricity in Ontario from 7pm-7am.
Last edited by alanbrenton on Feb 2nd, 2017 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Apr 20, 2011
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Bolt is rated 119MPGe combined, which is 0.176Wh/km

0.176/.9*$0.13=2.5c/km

Though it may be better as I think MPGe already includes a factor for charging losses. That would mean the Tesla number is also slightly better than that as that 242 value looks to be in line with the combined MPGe.
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Wow, if the newer EVs with bigger batteries and 200+ mile range will cost 2.5 cents/km, I am really all for it.
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aqnd wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 1:20 pm
Bolt is rated 119MPGe combined, which is 0.176Wh/km

0.176/.9*$0.13=2.5c/km

Though it may be better as I think MPGe already includes a factor for charging losses. That would mean the Tesla number is also slightly better than that as that 242 value looks to be in line with the combined MPGe.
Do these numbers even mean anything since the price of 'fuel or electricity or operating cost' is baked into the ridiculous asking price for this vehicle?
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Sep 21, 2004
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ottofly wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 1:53 pm
Do these numbers even mean anything since the price of 'fuel or electricity or operating cost' is baked into the ridiculous asking price for this vehicle?
Considering the average price of new car sold in US is $34k, Bolt at $37k is not really ridiculous.
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b166er1337 wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 4:09 pm
Considering the average price of new car sold in US is $34k, Bolt at $37k is not really ridiculous.
So in Ontario, it's only $28,895? Pretty solid deal with 0 to 96 km/h in 7 seconds. I would have though the engineers would just beef the motor up to get to 100 in 7 seconds.
http://www.chevrolet.ca/bolt-ev-electric-vehicle.html
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alanbrenton wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 4:11 pm
So in Ontario, it's only $28,895? Pretty solid deal with 0 to 96 km/h in 7 seconds. I would have though the engineers would just beef the motor up to get to 100 in 7 seconds.
The PR guys were probably too lazy to make a 0-100 kph run and just converted the stated 0-60 mph time. But C&D's test showed it to be quite a bit quicker than that.
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SLee wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 4:23 pm
The PR guys were probably too lazy to make a 0-100 kph run and just converted the stated 0-60 mph time. But C&D's test showed it to be quite a bit quicker than that.
LOL, I never thought of dividing 100 by 1.609 ever and always thought it was 60. Yeah, so at 0 to 96.54 km/h, it should be at least slightly quicker. :)
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alanbrenton wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 1:24 pm
Wow, if the newer EVs with bigger batteries and 200+ mile range will cost 2.5 cents/km, I am really all for it.
b166er1337 wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 4:09 pm
Considering the average price of new car sold in US is $34k, Bolt at $37k is not really ridiculous.
I am not really convinced between this and regular gas car, economically.
2.5c/km for this. For an average car (say civic/elantra/mazda3), it's only around 8.5c/km (my 2010 mazda 3 is doing an average 8L/100km). You are saving 6c/km. Let's assume a bigger saving 8c/km.
8c/km, $8.00 per 100km, that's $8,000 per 100,000km, roughly 4 years. (how often do the batteries need to be replaced? And how much?)

And 2.5c/km is the ideal number of these electric cars and we are not considering battery degradation over the period of 4 years.

383km is pretty long, but clearly rules out the long trips vs. the convenience of getting gas anywhere.

anything I am missing out?
How do I downvote this voting system?
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konsensei wrote:
Feb 2nd, 2017 9:10 pm
I am not really convinced between this and regular gas car, economically.
2.5c/km for this. For an average car (say civic/elantra/mazda3), it's only around 8.5c/km (my 2010 mazda 3 is doing an average 8L/100km). You are saving 6c/km. Let's assume a bigger saving 8c/km.
8c/km, $8.00 per 100km, that's $8,000 per 100,000km, roughly 4 years. (how often do the batteries need to be replaced? And how much?)

And 2.5c/km is the ideal number of these electric cars and we are not considering battery degradation over the period of 4 years.

383km is pretty long, but clearly rules out the long trips vs. the convenience of getting gas anywhere.

anything I am missing out?
What do you save by not having an engine and multigear transmission and what about the $14k rebate?

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