Personal Finance

COLLECTIONS AND COLLECTION AGENTS: Ask me anything! (Official RFD Thread)

Newbie
Apr 22, 2009
25 posts
1 upvote
mikeymike1 wrote:
Nov 27th, 2012 5:56 pm
Your original posting(#978) was vague as to this 'service' and there was no forthcoming disclosure of any method(s) of payment, if any payments we're made or how any payments are 'to be' made.
At this point it really doesn't matter, schematics. Whether it was a CC, a billing for services rendered, net 30 or whatever else my postings is and are still relevant.
The facts are you entered into an agreement with a service provider for a billable service.
The service was provided they billed you for it and now you don't want to pay for it. You dispute it and in the meanwhile they send it to collections.
I could tell you want your next move should be but now I don't want to.
Easy champ. You are jumping to conclusions. I was just trying to get some simple answers about credit bureaus without having to delve into all the details. In short, there was never an oral or written agreement. Thanks anyway.
Deal Addict
May 1, 2003
1839 posts
50 upvotes
Toronto
So i keep getting calls from an agency called Action Collections and Receivables Management. It's for some person that i've never heard of and who as far as i know hasn't had my number since i've had the same number for years. They've called me on and off in the past but once i've called them they've stopped contacting for a while. Lately though they've been calling me everyday and leaving me annoying voice mails. when i call them back they stay "oh sorry we'll take you off the list" but then the next thing i know, they're calling me again.

Ok so what's the most effective way to get them to stop calling me. I filed a complaint with the CRTC but what else can i do?
Newbie
Dec 21, 2012
1 posts
WINDSOR
Question for the op. I recently applied for a loan and the credit report was great except for a black mark from cv collections. Ive sent them an email regarding the nature of the black mark, however in the mean time my bank said get this "cleared" up and they can proceed with the loan. Ive never borrowed money from a creditor before and this is my first loan. What exactly do they want me to do to clear this up. Ive been reading some finacial storys and disputes with collection agencys seem to travel at a very slow pace. I asked about the loan because ive been very specific in searching for a new truck. Ive found a great deal and if would like to be able to wheel and deal knowing my credit union will cut the check at the end of the day. They told me they may need a co-signer, and it would seem they are warning me in anticipation that the collector has a legitamate claim. Personally i have no knowledge of outstanding debt and is news to me. I have also read that cv collections specifically aggresive in phone conversations, and i simply will not tolerate beligerent behavior, and will contact them by email. My question is, what is my best course of action. The credit union told me it is from 2008. Ive only had one credit card and still have it, and have never fallen behind on it. If there is a legitamite debt, payment is the course of action, however this could negatively affect my credit and tank my chance at a loan. On the other hand if they have made a mistake or the collection is unlawful, disputing seems to take months to years. Any advice will be very appreciated, thank you.
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Dec 1, 2011
2427 posts
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Winnipeg
Weston19 wrote:
Dec 22nd, 2012 2:34 pm
Question for the op. I recently applied for a loan and the credit report was great except for a black mark from cv collections. Ive sent them an email regarding the nature of the black mark, however in the mean time my bank said get this "cleared" up and they can proceed with the loan. Ive never borrowed money from a creditor before and this is my first loan. What exactly do they want me to do to clear this up. Ive been reading some finacial storys and disputes with collection agencys seem to travel at a very slow pace. I asked about the loan because ive been very specific in searching for a new truck. Ive found a great deal and if would like to be able to wheel and deal knowing my credit union will cut the check at the end of the day. They told me they may need a co-signer, and it would seem they are warning me in anticipation that the collector has a legitamate claim. Personally i have no knowledge of outstanding debt and is news to me. I have also read that cv collections specifically aggresive in phone conversations, and i simply will not tolerate beligerent behavior, and will contact them by email. My question is, what is my best course of action. The credit union told me it is from 2008. Ive only had one credit card and still have it, and have never fallen behind on it. If there is a legitamite debt, payment is the course of action, however this could negatively affect my credit and tank my chance at a loan. On the other hand if they have made a mistake or the collection is unlawful, disputing seems to take months to years. Any advice will be very appreciated, thank you.
Disputes do not take months or years. It will be dealt with within 30 days by both Transunion and Equifax. The collection agency has 30 days to provide proof that the debt is legitimate and belongs to you. If they don't respond, it gets deleted. If they respond with proof, it stays on your report for 6 years from the apparent delinquency date. Paying the debt off if it is indeed yours, would be better than leaving it unpaid, but it doesn't necessarily mean you'll be approved for any credit while it's on you report, paid or not.
Can you believe it? They sent my income tax return forms back to me! In response to question # 4, "Do you have any dependants?" I replied - "2.1 million illegal immigrants, 1.1 million crack heads, 4.4 million unemployable people, 901 thousand people in over 85 prisons, and 650 idiots in Parliament.
Apparently, this was NOT an acceptable answer.

Who the hell did I miss? :razz:
Deal Addict
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Jul 28, 2011
1033 posts
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Vancouver
wayne74 wrote:
Dec 22nd, 2012 4:19 pm
Disputes do not take months or years. It will be dealt with within 30 days by both Transunion and Equifax. The collection agency has 30 days to provide proof that the debt is legitimate and belongs to you. If they don't respond, it gets deleted. If they respond with proof, it stays on your report for 6 years from the apparent delinquency date. Paying the debt off if it is indeed yours, would be better than leaving it unpaid, but it doesn't necessarily mean you'll be approved for any credit while it's on you report, paid or not.
+1

Yep, best course of action is dispute it, hopefully it gets removed either because its a dud, or the CRA doesn't respond. However, f it gets validated pay it, and it will get marked as paid. The creditor you are dealing with means by cleared up is he wants this collection item either removed or paid in full before they will touch you.

Nyd
Newbie
Dec 26, 2012
3 posts
Need some help here. Went through the pages but didn't see any situation like mine.

I had a fast food franchise that went out of business last March, we just closed up the doors and walked away because each month we were losing money.
The business was run under a numbered Ontario corporation so I assume that my personal credit would not be affected. We owed a few hundred dollars to TD due to some NSF charges and some how that seems to have grown to about $900 after 9 months. At first the collection agency was sending letters to my house adressed to the numbered company, but now they are adressing it to my name and not the numbered company.

Can TD make me liable for the Corporation debts on a business account under a Corporation name?
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Apr 16, 2007
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landrew1701 wrote:
Dec 27th, 2012 1:25 pm
Need some help here. Went through the pages but didn't see any situation like mine.

I had a fast food franchise that went out of business last March, we just closed up the doors and walked away because each month we were losing money.
The business was run under a numbered Ontario corporation so I assume that my personal credit would not be affected. We owed a few hundred dollars to TD due to some NSF charges and some how that seems to have grown to about $900 after 9 months. At first the collection agency was sending letters to my house adressed to the numbered company, but now they are adressing it to my name and not the numbered company.

Can TD make me liable for the Corporation debts on a business account under a Corporation name?
Sure they can. Its all predicated on how your business was originally set up and how if any of your business finances we're secured and if any business loans we're guaranteed via any personal means. You should review your Articles of Inc. and/or seek a corporate lawyer.
Considering you state it was a franchise (unless you really had deep pockets) you must have secured financing one way or another.
As a signing officer for your business account I wouldn't doubt if you signed off as a personal guarantor and don't remember doing so.
If it was a new business (under 5-8yrs) its a guarantee that a corporate/business credit check was pulled. If the summary results we're low which is normal for all new businesses then its pretty well certain that you as the principle owner would be required to sign off as a personal guarantor for the account.
Newbie
Dec 26, 2012
3 posts
Unfortunately, for me, I used the equity in my house to pay entirely for the business. So my personal mortgage is now HUGE and I am making regular payments and there is no issue there. For the bank with the business account, there is no secure or unsecure debt with them (except for the overdue NSF charges from the business account).

The business account on the other hand, I let lapse into debt, from the NSF charges.
I don't recall signing as a personal guarantor on the business account and I don't have any paperwork to show it either. The account never had any overdraft capability because, if I remember correctly, there was some extra paperwork that needed to be filled out which I didn't want to get into.
It was a new business about 6 yrs and, if there was a credit check pulled at the time of opening, I am sure the results were very low since the corporation was brand new and had no assets.

As I mentioned previously the collection agency is now sending letters to me personally instead of the corporation. I thought that the main principle behind a corporation is that, it is it's own entity, with its own credit rating etc, and officers and directors of the corporation are not liable for the debts of the corporation.

How do you recommend that I proceed?
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Apr 16, 2007
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landrew1701 wrote:
Dec 28th, 2012 9:11 am
Unfortunately, for me, I used the equity in my house to pay entirely for the business. So my personal mortgage is now HUGE and I am making regular payments and there is no issue there. For the bank with the business account, there is no secure or unsecure debt with them (except for the overdue NSF charges from the business account).

The business account on the other hand, I let lapse into debt, from the NSF charges.
I don't recall signing as a personal guarantor on the business account and I don't have any paperwork to show it either. The account never had any overdraft capability because, if I remember correctly, there was some extra paperwork that needed to be filled out which I didn't want to get into.
It was a new business about 6 yrs and, if there was a credit check pulled at the time of opening, I am sure the results were very low since the corporation was brand new and had no assets.

As I mentioned previously the collection agency is now sending letters to me personally instead of the corporation. I thought that the main principle behind a corporation is that, it is it's own entity, with its own credit rating etc, and officers and directors of the corporation are not liable for the debts of the corporation.

How do you recommend that I proceed?
Its not unusual that new business owners use the equity in their homes to secure financing for their business ventures. From what I'm gathering the funder of the franchise and your businesses bank account are with two different financial institutions correct?
Usually new business owners use the same financial institution for their daily business account activities because of the added flexible account options such as overdraft protection etc.
Because you don't have overdraft for a business account I can surely say you as the principle signing officer are more than likely signed on as a personal guarantor and are liable for any of the business accounts debts. Its one of the areas you initialed when opening the account. Again, something you don't remember because at the time you're probably more preoccupied with the account opening and all the money you think you will be depositing.
If you had your business account with the funder for the franchise a personal guarantee would not be needed on your daily business chequing account but of course they have your house so it doesn't really matter.

On the subject of the corporation yes its main purpose is indeed to operate as a separate legal entity to its principle owners, signing officers and/or share holders. But when it comes to financial matters such as a business loan or daily bank accounts almost all accounts will contain clauses, waivers and exemptions.
A lot of the financial institutions these days have their documents drafted up as an opt out vs an opt in. This is so they don't have to ask you to be a personal guarantor to the new business account which almost always causes a pause from the account holder. less awkward for the asking of the requirement. At any rate, its certain a personal guarantee is mandatory unless the corporations financial background and credit is solid enough that a personal guarantee is not needed.
The fact that they are now chasing you tells me you are indeed signed on as a guarantor to the account.

You have 2 choices. File for bankruptcy for your Ont numbered company so that they stop chasing you. But you have your homes equity intertwined between you personally and the numbered company right? That may cause some issues. Legal fees alone will exceed what you owe to collections.
Or second, pay the 900 and get on with life.
Id choose the latter.
Newbie
Dec 26, 2012
3 posts
I don't see how my personal homes' equity could be intertwined with my numbered company. When I opened the franchise, I used a personal line of credit to pay the Franchisor in cash. I have always kept the two separate. I then opened the business account at a different institution with no reference to my personal finances.

If as you say, the bank has indeed made me a personal guarantor to the business account without informing me and without any paperwork on my side to show it then this an abuse of their oligopoly.

How much does it cost to file for bankruptcy? and how much does it cost?
After losing over $300K I don't feel like waisting any more money on a lost cause.
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Jun 29, 2012
572 posts
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Vancouver
landrew1701 wrote:
Dec 28th, 2012 7:11 pm
I don't see how my personal homes' equity could be intertwined with my numbered company. When I opened the franchise, I used a personal line of credit to pay the Franchisor in cash. I have always kept the two separate. I then opened the business account at a different institution with no reference to my personal finances.

If as you say, the bank has indeed made me a personal guarantor to the business account without informing me and without any paperwork on my side to show it then this an abuse of their oligopoly.

How much does it cost to file for bankruptcy? and how much does it cost?
After losing over $300K I don't feel like waisting any more money on a lost cause.
Admittedly I'm exhausted so I may be reading this incorrectly........but you want to file bankruptcy for a debt of $900.00?
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Dec 12, 2006
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TheDogAteMyName wrote:
Dec 28th, 2012 9:15 pm
Admittedly I'm exhausted so I may be reading this incorrectly........but you want to file bankruptcy for a debt of $900.00?
Filing bankruptcy must be for all debts totalling over $1000. SO @ $900 he needs another $100+ debt somewhere else.

As well he will be paying trustee a minum of 190 for 9 months so 1710 paid for a 900 debt would could be settled by a phoen call and negotiated to a % owed paid.
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May 17, 2006
5014 posts
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GTA
What do people recommend here for a collections service? Someone i know needs to collect past debts...

Also what are the costs usually involved in collections... does it make sense to go via collections for amounts < $1000?
.

We Shall Never Forget 7/08 '14
We Shall Never Forget 8/19 '11

Toilet Paper Calculations Thread
Deal Guru
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Aug 6, 2001
11748 posts
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Mississauga
nyder74 wrote:
Dec 22nd, 2012 10:36 pm
+1

Yep, best course of action is dispute it, hopefully it gets removed either because its a dud, or the CRA doesn't respond. However, f it gets validated pay it, and it will get marked as paid. The creditor you are dealing with means by cleared up is he wants this collection item either removed or paid in full before they will touch you.

Nyd
Similar Q, I had request for debt validation which was ignored by the agency. It was sent by registered letter as well. When I reached out to Equifax, apparently, they mailed me back saying that agency provided them with a statement that it's mine. Although, I have not yet seen any proof nor any further documentation from the agency nor equifax.

Who can I speak with Equifax to get this resolved?

It is not on my Transunion file. I have all my documentation available with date stamps. After googling, it seems that the particular agency has a habit of acting unprofessionally.

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