Not sure if everyone's seen it yet, but the returns for CCP are up the high rates of returns are almost scaring me a bit. How long is this bull market going to keep going? Guess this is what my PPP is for though.
Couch potato investing for the last 18 years - tracking my progress
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- kithid
- Member
- Dec 4, 2016
- 269 posts
- 124 upvotes
- Elendil
- Member
- Sep 25, 2007
- 303 posts
- 322 upvotes
- GTA
If you're following the true CP strategy - and you've allocated correctly, based on your risk tolerance and investment horizon - then it shouldn't really matter how long the market strength continues. Just stay the course. Low is a buying opportunity.
I'd only be nervous if I was not investing correctly based on the factors mentioned above.
I'd only be nervous if I was not investing correctly based on the factors mentioned above.
- Germack [OP]
- Deal Addict
- Oct 1, 2006
- 3249 posts
- 4472 upvotes
- Montreal
I would not liquidate. The advantage of ZAG over VAB is very small.
- divx
- Deal Expert
- Oct 26, 2003
- 39343 posts
- 6342 upvotes
- Winnipeg
so i just started reading canadian couch potato 10 minutes ago, it seems they recommend quest trade and buy 50% ETF and 50% bond, seems a good start for me? i bank at rbc/cibc and have rrsp with industrial alliance. do you hold any rrsp or just purely tsfa?
i'm registering for tsfa and rrsp on questrade.
- John47
- Deal Addict
- Jan 18, 2014
- 1537 posts
- 512 upvotes
- Rouyn-Noranda
Thanks for posting the link!kithid wrote: ↑ Not sure if everyone's seen it yet, but the returns for CCP are up the high rates of returns are almost scaring me a bit. How long is this bull market going to keep going? Guess this is what my PPP is for though.
- Germack [OP]
- Deal Addict
- Oct 1, 2006
- 3249 posts
- 4472 upvotes
- Montreal
Your asset allocation depends on your risk tolerance. If you are just starting investing 50/50, 40/60, 30/70 bonds/equity sounds about right. Questrade is good because they allow to buy certain ETFs commision free. I am with TD, but service/platform has been seriously lacking in the last few months.divx wrote: ↑ so i just started reading canadian couch potato 10 minutes ago, it seems they recommend quest trade and buy 50% ETF and 50% bond, seems a good start for me? i bank at rbc/cibc and have rrsp with industrial alliance. do you hold any rrsp or just purely tsfa?
i'm registering for tsfa and rrsp on questrade.
I have my TFSA/RRSP maxed and some money invested in my non-registered accounts.
- divx
- Deal Expert
- Oct 26, 2003
- 39343 posts
- 6342 upvotes
- Winnipeg
what is MER and what do you think the upcoming rate hike will do to ETF?Germack wrote: ↑ Your asset allocation depends on your risk tolerance. If you are just starting investing 50/50, 40/60, 30/70 bonds/equity sounds about right. Questrade is good because they allow to buy certain ETFs commision free. I am with TD, but service/platform has been seriously lacking in the last few months.
I have my TFSA/RRSP maxed and some money invested in my non-registered accounts.
- Germack [OP]
- Deal Addict
- Oct 1, 2006
- 3249 posts
- 4472 upvotes
- Montreal
- Jungle
- Deal Fanatic
- May 31, 2007
- 5018 posts
- 2175 upvotes
@imclumzyDynasty12345 wrote: ↑ Go search Canadian couch potato blog on swap etf.
Tldr pro is tax efficient as above, tracks index very close
Con government might stop structure so forced to sell at time you don't want, and risk of bank (national Bank) that is in the swap agreement defaults (very low risk)
Ccp gives these funds a bad name, they have proven track record now and definitely valuable in a non reg if your concern about distributions. Now they have all the funds to make a simple cp.
I have been using Hxt many times and is probably the highlight of their total return funds. It outperforms xiu btw. The others are very cheap and minimal tracking error, what you save by not having taxable distributions is the bonus and less headache to figure out acb.
To my knowledge the gov has never made any intention to crack down on such funds. They still get capital gains likely when you sell after a long time.
- Jungle
- Deal Fanatic
- May 31, 2007
- 5018 posts
- 2175 upvotes
I wouldn't be scared but at some point, we have to understand and expect there will be a correction.kithid wrote: ↑ Not sure if everyone's seen it yet, but the returns for CCP are up the high rates of returns are almost scaring me a bit. How long is this bull market going to keep going? Guess this is what my PPP is for though.
For this reason I too and seeing a mature bull market and would be more comfortable rebalancing bond allocation from about 20 to 30% next year.
Then if things get really bad with equity, I will rebalance back.
- jaguaar
- Banned
- Jan 20, 2017
- 584 posts
- 148 upvotes
- Jungle
- Deal Fanatic
- May 31, 2007
- 5018 posts
- 2175 upvotes
Looking back at the last few crashes, bond ETFS have actually increased as everyone floods to safety. At one point, bond etf was up 6% during last crash.
HISA today not paying much of anything, bond etf still retuning more. GIC is locking money in, unless you do ladder, to complicated just use a bond ETF for liquidity.
- retireat50
- Sr. Member
- Sep 29, 2007
- 762 posts
- 247 upvotes
That was because we were in a declining interest rate environment so lower yields = higher bond prices. So far have not seen these bond ETF's increase their distributions despite rate increases in both Canada and the US so we are getting slammed with declining NAV's and continued crappy payouts.Jungle wrote: ↑ Looking back at the last few crashes, bond ETFS have actually increased as everyone floods to safety. At one point, bond etf was up 6% during last crash.
HISA today not paying much of anything, bond etf still retuning more. GIC is locking money in, unless you do ladder, to complicated just use a bond ETF for liquidity.
- Jungle
- Deal Fanatic
- May 31, 2007
- 5018 posts
- 2175 upvotes
Actually yields have been increasing over the last year and are not controlled by the BOC, (but market influenced somewhat by them and policy), but ultimately are controlled as a result of the bond market.retireat50 wrote: ↑ That was because we were in a declining interest rate environment so lower yields = higher bond prices. So far have not seen these bond ETF's increase their distributions despite rate increases in both Canada and the US so we are getting slammed with declining NAV's and continued crappy payouts.
Bond funds hold mix bag of different durations, some long, some short. Different styles, Corp bonds (usually 30%) Gov bonds(70%) etc. So direct change in yields not going to be so relative.
Regardless, it's more about the total return of those funds and the of huge benefit it provides to asset allocation in stock market crashes and bear markets.
Check the 20 and 30 year returns of an all equity couch potato vs one with 25% bonds. Return is about the same, but with less risk! This is because stock market crashes are brutal, and bonds allow you to recover faster. And probably sleep better too.
What I like is the ammunition it gives to rebalance during market crash, and can easily boost CAGR almost risk free IMO
- Louking
- Banned
- Nov 1, 2013
- 304 posts
- 42 upvotes
OKAY, so what are your two favorite bond funds/etfs to hold for long time?
- Jungle
- Deal Fanatic
- May 31, 2007
- 5018 posts
- 2175 upvotes
- Raww
- Jr. Member
- Jul 20, 2009
- 128 posts
- 9 upvotes
- Montreal
Hi Guys,
I started investing in couch potato strategy 6 months ago. I have a couple of funds not part of the e-series but all others are. Here is the result as of today. What do you experts think I should do? Tried but could not format it better. Hope it is still readable.
FUND NO.OF SHARES PRICE VALUE PURCH PRICE PURCH VALUE $ CHANGE % CHANGE
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 901.833 $11.41 $10,289.91 23.02 $10,643.40
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 107.508 $11.41 $1,226.67 9.81 $1,267.09
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 319.068 $11.41 $3,640.57 29.68 $3,760.57
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 483.238 $11.41 $5,513.75 28.04 $5,702.23
TOTAL $20,670.90 $21,373.29 -702.39 -3.29
TD CDN Index-e** 303.467 $26.80 $8,132.92 18.19 $7,674.50
TD CDN Index-e** 149.718 $26.80 $4,012.44 32.09 $3,790.82
TD CDN Index-e** 103.675 $26.80 $2,778.49 22.65 $2,615.53
TD CDN Index-e** 228.033 $26.80 $6,111.28 31.08 $5,800.13
TOTAL $21,035.13 $19,880.98 1154.15 5.81
TD Dividend Growth** 27.398 $87.77 $2,404.72 5.38 $2,214.40
TOTAL $2,404.72 $2,214.40 190.32 8.59
TD Int'l Index-e** 1070.147 $14.68 $15,709.76 35.14 $14,824.91
TD Int'l Index-e** 92.53 $14.68 $1,358.34 10.86 $1,278.09
TD Int'l Index-e** 92.53 $14.68 $1,358.34 11.07 $1,278.09
TD Int'l Index-e** 274.383 $14.68 $4,027.94 20.48 $3,870.25
TOTAL $22,454.38 $21,251.34 1203.04 5.66
TD Science &Tech** 38.227 $81.52 $3,116.27 24.93 $2,400.00
TD Science &Tech** 38.227 $81.52 $3,116.27 25.4 $2,400.00
TOTAL $6,232.54 $4,800.00 1432.54 29.84
TD US Index-e** 133.029 $61.37 $8,163.99 18.26 $7,598.32
TD US Index-e** 45.441 $61.37 $2,788.71 22.31 $2,589.49
TD US Index-e** 22.395 $61.37 $1,374.38 11.2 $1,266.55
TD US Index-e** 65.351 $61.37 $4,010.59 20.4 $3,717.30
TOTAL $16,337.67 $15,171.66 1166.01 7.69
GRAND TOTAL $89,135.34 $84,691.67 4443.67 5.25
I started investing in couch potato strategy 6 months ago. I have a couple of funds not part of the e-series but all others are. Here is the result as of today. What do you experts think I should do? Tried but could not format it better. Hope it is still readable.
FUND NO.OF SHARES PRICE VALUE PURCH PRICE PURCH VALUE $ CHANGE % CHANGE
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 901.833 $11.41 $10,289.91 23.02 $10,643.40
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 107.508 $11.41 $1,226.67 9.81 $1,267.09
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 319.068 $11.41 $3,640.57 29.68 $3,760.57
TD CDN Bond Index-e** 483.238 $11.41 $5,513.75 28.04 $5,702.23
TOTAL $20,670.90 $21,373.29 -702.39 -3.29
TD CDN Index-e** 303.467 $26.80 $8,132.92 18.19 $7,674.50
TD CDN Index-e** 149.718 $26.80 $4,012.44 32.09 $3,790.82
TD CDN Index-e** 103.675 $26.80 $2,778.49 22.65 $2,615.53
TD CDN Index-e** 228.033 $26.80 $6,111.28 31.08 $5,800.13
TOTAL $21,035.13 $19,880.98 1154.15 5.81
TD Dividend Growth** 27.398 $87.77 $2,404.72 5.38 $2,214.40
TOTAL $2,404.72 $2,214.40 190.32 8.59
TD Int'l Index-e** 1070.147 $14.68 $15,709.76 35.14 $14,824.91
TD Int'l Index-e** 92.53 $14.68 $1,358.34 10.86 $1,278.09
TD Int'l Index-e** 92.53 $14.68 $1,358.34 11.07 $1,278.09
TD Int'l Index-e** 274.383 $14.68 $4,027.94 20.48 $3,870.25
TOTAL $22,454.38 $21,251.34 1203.04 5.66
TD Science &Tech** 38.227 $81.52 $3,116.27 24.93 $2,400.00
TD Science &Tech** 38.227 $81.52 $3,116.27 25.4 $2,400.00
TOTAL $6,232.54 $4,800.00 1432.54 29.84
TD US Index-e** 133.029 $61.37 $8,163.99 18.26 $7,598.32
TD US Index-e** 45.441 $61.37 $2,788.71 22.31 $2,589.49
TD US Index-e** 22.395 $61.37 $1,374.38 11.2 $1,266.55
TD US Index-e** 65.351 $61.37 $4,010.59 20.4 $3,717.30
TOTAL $16,337.67 $15,171.66 1166.01 7.69
GRAND TOTAL $89,135.34 $84,691.67 4443.67 5.25
- nickwa
- Deal Addict
- Nov 8, 2011
- 1876 posts
- 1154 upvotes
- Not NEPEAN
Good morning Everyone,
I am thinking about moving my Sunlife RRSP to Questrade and taking a CCP approach with ETFs (which are free to buy on QT). I am 30 years old, pay into a defined-benefit pension, and think of my RRSP as a "bonus" fund for when my wife and I retire. I plan to live comfortably off my pension and use the RRSP for extra income. I make bi-weekly contributions to my RRSP all year.
Right now I am paying 1.45% management fee for holding (1) fund - Sunlife Granite Growth. At the same time I am hesitant as I have had good returns so starting my RRSP a few years ago.
1YR: 9.2%
2YR: 6.4%
3YR: 5.9%
The breakdown of the fund I hold is:
30% Fixed Income
19% Canadian Equity
18.5% US Equity
22.5% International Equity
10% Other
I was considering moving to Questrade and going with the Assertive ETF option:
25% ZAG
25% VCN
50% XAW
My questions I hope you can help me with are:
1. In the event of a slow down or down turn in the market, how much would I be impacted moving from 60% securities (current SLF fund) to 70% securities (CCP Assertive)?
2. Is CCP Assertive a risky play if the market sours over the next year or two?
3. Any better allocation of ZAG, VCN, and XAW I should consider?
Thanks for any advice.
I am thinking about moving my Sunlife RRSP to Questrade and taking a CCP approach with ETFs (which are free to buy on QT). I am 30 years old, pay into a defined-benefit pension, and think of my RRSP as a "bonus" fund for when my wife and I retire. I plan to live comfortably off my pension and use the RRSP for extra income. I make bi-weekly contributions to my RRSP all year.
Right now I am paying 1.45% management fee for holding (1) fund - Sunlife Granite Growth. At the same time I am hesitant as I have had good returns so starting my RRSP a few years ago.
1YR: 9.2%
2YR: 6.4%
3YR: 5.9%
The breakdown of the fund I hold is:
30% Fixed Income
19% Canadian Equity
18.5% US Equity
22.5% International Equity
10% Other
I was considering moving to Questrade and going with the Assertive ETF option:
25% ZAG
25% VCN
50% XAW
My questions I hope you can help me with are:
1. In the event of a slow down or down turn in the market, how much would I be impacted moving from 60% securities (current SLF fund) to 70% securities (CCP Assertive)?
2. Is CCP Assertive a risky play if the market sours over the next year or two?
3. Any better allocation of ZAG, VCN, and XAW I should consider?
Thanks for any advice.
- Deepwater
- Deal Addict
- Feb 1, 2012
- 2214 posts
- 3798 upvotes
- Thunder Bay, ON
Those are good returns, but the CCP returns were better.nickwa wrote: ↑ Good morning Everyone,
I am thinking about moving my Sunlife RRSP to Questrade and taking a CCP approach with ETFs (which are free to buy on QT). I am 30 years old, pay into a defined-benefit pension, and think of my RRSP as a "bonus" fund for when my wife and I retire. I plan to live comfortably off my pension and use the RRSP for extra income. I make bi-weekly contributions to my RRSP all year.
Right now I am paying 1.45% management fee for holding (1) fund - Sunlife Granite Growth. At the same time I am hesitant as I have had good returns so starting my RRSP a few years ago.
1YR: 9.2%
2YR: 6.4%
3YR: 5.9%
Bonds are also securities. When you say securities you mean stocks or equities.The breakdown of the fund I hold is:
30% Fixed Income
19% Canadian Equity
18.5% US Equity
22.5% International Equity
10% Other
I was considering moving to Questrade and going with the Assertive ETF option:
25% ZAG
25% VCN
50% XAW
My questions I hope you can help me with are:
1. In the event of a slow down or down turn in the market, how much would I be impacted moving from 60% securities (current SLF fund) to 70% securities (CCP Assertive)?
Say your stocks dropped 20% and bonds stayed flat. With 60% stocks your portfolio would drop 12%. With 70% stocks your portfolio would drop 14%. Not much of a difference.
It could have significant volatility. Check this link: http://canadiancouchpotato.com/wp-conte ... s-2017.pdf. Look at the Lowest 12 Month Return. How would you feel if your portfolio dropped that much? Have you felt anxious about your current portfolio? As per above 60% vs 70% is not that much different. Stocks have demonstrated a long-term upward trend with a lot of volatility. If this is retirement money you won't touch for decades then the next year or two is not a relevant time period to evaluate performance.2. Is CCP Assertive a risky play if the market sours over the next year or two?
Those are all good funds. Since you are asking the question, you don't have the knowledge you need to select other funds, so for now at least, just go with CCP recommendations.3. Any better allocation of ZAG, VCN, and XAW I should consider?
When I was young, I was poor. Now, after years of hard work, I'm no longer young.
- nickwa
- Deal Addict
- Nov 8, 2011
- 1876 posts
- 1154 upvotes
- Not NEPEAN
Thank you for the reply. This is retirement money so I am really concerned with long-term growth. I would like to move from Sunlife to CCP, keep making bi-weekly contributions (free ETF purchases through QT), and re-balance 2 or 3 times a year, that's it.
I guess my question should have read, how close does the assertive CCP portfolio match with my current SLF Granite Fund holdings? I'd hate to move right now, see another 10% increase in the SLF fund this year, and not see something similar or better in the CCP assertive holdings. I know it's impossible to predict but if the allocations are similar, at least I can save on the fees and still hold a similar 'type' of portfolio.
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