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Couch potato investing for the last 12 years - tracking my progress

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  • Nov 22nd, 2017 10:55 pm
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[OP]
Deal Addict
Oct 1, 2006
1687 posts
649 upvotes
Montreal
raptorsfans wrote:
Oct 27th, 2017 10:59 am
Thanks everyone in this thread. It's been very informative! I'm a newbie on investment, and I'm serioiusly considering the CCP portfolio, but I have a quick question:

I have a $330K mortgage (locked rate at 2.11% until June 2018), and I have $350K cash (currently sitting in a saving account with 2.5% interest rate). Should I pay off the $330K mortgage first, or should I just put the entire $350K saving into the CCP portfolio? My friend told me to pay off the mortgage first before any investment, but my thinking is, if I can easily get more than 2.11% return from my CCP investment, why would I bother paying off my mortgage in a hurry?

What do you think?

Thanks everyone!
I don't like debt, so I aim to pay down my mortgage as quickly as possible (~2.5 more years). I max RRSP/TFSA first and invest in CCP. The rest goes vs. mortgage.

Maybe max your allowed prepayment for this year and next and invest the rest in CCP?
Member
Feb 26, 2017
303 posts
86 upvotes
Through my work matching RRSP with Manulife, I'm currently contributing to a US index fund (Manulife BlackRock U.S. Equity Index Fund http://factsheets.lipperweb.com/digital ... 551_en.pdf ). Its also listed somewhere else on the site as 8322 ML BR U.S. Equity Index q8.

Anyone know if it is possible to track something like this in TD or Google Finance?
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Apr 12, 2012
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Toronto
Chance7652 wrote:
Oct 28th, 2017 1:27 pm
Through my work matching RRSP with Manulife, I'm currently contributing to a US index fund (Manulife BlackRock U.S. Equity Index Fund http://factsheets.lipperweb.com/digital ... 551_en.pdf ). Its also listed somewhere else on the site as 8322 ML BR U.S. Equity Index q8.

Anyone know if it is possible to track something like this in TD or Google Finance?
Most of these employer funds have reduced fees that are negotiated by the employer. The Google versions would not take this into account.
Member
Feb 26, 2017
303 posts
86 upvotes
zobi123 wrote:
Oct 28th, 2017 8:00 pm
Most of these employer funds have reduced fees that are negotiated by the employer. The Google versions would not take this into account.
Thanks, that makes sense. I like being able to track how I'm doing with my whole portfolio. Its an index US fund so its not a huge mystery at what the approximate returns are. I'll be alright if I'm tracking it based on the quarterly report.
Deal Addict
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Aug 1, 2007
1284 posts
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Chance7652 wrote:
Oct 28th, 2017 1:27 pm
Through my work matching RRSP with Manulife, I'm currently contributing to a US index fund (Manulife BlackRock U.S. Equity Index Fund http://factsheets.lipperweb.com/digital ... 551_en.pdf ). Its also listed somewhere else on the site as 8322 ML BR U.S. Equity Index q8.

Anyone know if it is possible to track something like this in TD or Google Finance?
That fund will have returns very close to the S&P 500 in CAD. You can use an ETF like ZSP to track your approx. performance. The fees are all different depending on the employer - likely much higher than fees on an index etf. You should be able to see the fees if you log in to the manulife site.
Deal Fanatic
Mar 24, 2008
5170 posts
1207 upvotes
Toronto
raptorsfans wrote:
Oct 27th, 2017 10:59 am
...
I have a $330K mortgage (locked rate at 2.11% until June 2018), and I have $350K cash (currently sitting in a saving account with 2.5% interest rate). Should I pay off the $330K mortgage first, or should I just put the entire $350K saving into the CCP portfolio? My friend told me to pay off the mortgage first before any investment, but my thinking is, if I can easily get more than 2.11% return from my CCP investment, why would I bother paying off my mortgage in a hurry?

What do you think?

Thanks everyone!
Some great suggestions above but I would personally split the money. I would take a 100k and start a CCP portfolio and put the rest into my mortgage upon renewal next year. There are 3 reasons for that:

1) CCP returns aren't guaranteed. High likelyhood of making more than your mortgage rate but it is certainly not guaranteed. The 2.11% actually becomes ~3% once you factor in your marginal income tax rate.

2) It's guaranteed that you wont get this rate upon renewal in June unless BOC drops interest rates instead of raising them (low likelyhood).

3) Peace of mind. You can always invest the money you pay towards your current mortgage payment.

Good luck in whatever you decide as investing/paying off debt are both good options.
Illegitimi non carborundum
Jr. Member
Feb 4, 2017
174 posts
125 upvotes
raptorsfans wrote:
Oct 27th, 2017 10:59 am
Thanks everyone in this thread. It's been very informative! I'm a newbie on investment, and I'm serioiusly considering the CCP portfolio, but I have a quick question:

I have a $330K mortgage (locked rate at 2.11% until June 2018), and I have $350K cash (currently sitting in a saving account with 2.5% interest rate). Should I pay off the $330K mortgage first, or should I just put the entire $350K saving into the CCP portfolio? My friend told me to pay off the mortgage first before any investment, but my thinking is, if I can easily get more than 2.11% return from my CCP investment, why would I bother paying off my mortgage in a hurry?

What do you think?

Thanks everyone!
I was in the same situation as you a couple years back. My rate was 2.5% for 2 yrs, then 2.95% for the next 2 yrs. I decided to pay off the mortgage instead because I hate having debt. Also, as another poster mentioned, your CCP returns are not guaranteed so if the market drops, your money is lost (temporarily at least). Now, I have maxed out my RSP and TFSA so everything is working out.
Deal Addict
Jul 23, 2007
3272 posts
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My wife and I are also debt averse. Sold the whole taxable portfolio in 1999 in order to have a large down payment on the house we purchased. Personally, I wasn't keen on the idea of a house. Real estate prices hadn't gone anywhere for about a decade previous, and at the time, I didn't mind renting an apartment. I relented for my wife's sake. Turns out she was a great market timer. A year later the stock market started a downward spiral, and house prices started to go up. Paid off the mortgage in about three and a half years with a minor penalty involved. In 2003 started the taxable equity portfolio all over again. Now we both like the house. So far, so good.
Member
User avatar
Oct 21, 2009
227 posts
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Stryker wrote:
Oct 29th, 2017 10:22 am
I relented for my wife's sake.
happy wife, happy life
Deal Addict
Jul 23, 2007
3272 posts
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Bart_ wrote:
Oct 29th, 2017 2:12 pm
happy wife, happy life
Yes, Bart. Since the day we met, thirty four years together and we're both very happy. I wake up every morning thankful for what I have. Can't believe how lucky I am.
Newbie
Oct 28, 2017
2 posts
Hello everyone,

A great forum with lots to read on. I am a newbie on investment and would like to learn more and hopefully enjoy a financially stable life.

I currently have a TFSA and an RRSP though I do not make as much to contribute to both. I have about 30k in my TFSA but it is making close to nothing. I have been looking at the questrade TFSA account and thinking to opening on and buying ETFs such as XIC (Canadian market), VUN (CND hedged US market), VEE (emerging markets) and ZAG (BMO bonds) etc.
My questions are,
Is there a difference of keeping the money in TFSA or RRSP?
What about holding US traded ETFs vs TSX efts that track the US market?
What about dividend and taxes of holding the money in one account vs the other?

If anyone can shed some light on these would be very helpful and much appreciated

Thank you
Deal Addict
Apr 11, 2009
2512 posts
307 upvotes
Tronno
raptorsfans wrote:
Oct 27th, 2017 10:59 am
Thanks everyone in this thread. It's been very informative! I'm a newbie on investment, and I'm serioiusly considering the CCP portfolio, but I have a quick question:

I have a $330K mortgage (locked rate at 2.11% until June 2018), and I have $350K cash (currently sitting in a saving account with 2.5% interest rate). Should I pay off the $330K mortgage first, or should I just put the entire $350K saving into the CCP portfolio? My friend told me to pay off the mortgage first before any investment, but my thinking is, if I can easily get more than 2.11% return from my CCP investment, why would I bother paying off my mortgage in a hurry?

What do you think?

Thanks everyone!
think June 2018 is too short a time horizon to put it into a CCP portfolio
i would just keep it in a tangerine savings account (~3%) and discharge it when the time comes.
Jr. Member
Jan 25, 2012
181 posts
60 upvotes
NORTH YORK
Mobhatia91 wrote:
Oct 29th, 2017 2:41 pm
Hello everyone,

A great forum with lots to read on. I am a newbie on investment and would like to learn more and hopefully enjoy a financially stable life.

I currently have a TFSA and an RRSP though I do not make as much to contribute to both. I have about 30k in my TFSA but it is making close to nothing. I have been looking at the questrade TFSA account and thinking to opening on and buying ETFs such as XIC (Canadian market), VUN (CND hedged US market), VEE (emerging markets) and ZAG (BMO bonds) etc.
My questions are,
Is there a difference of keeping the money in TFSA or RRSP?
What about holding US traded ETFs vs TSX efts that track the US market?
What about dividend and taxes of holding the money in one account vs the other?

If anyone can shed some light on these would be very helpful and much appreciated

Thank you
If you are planning to use TFSA and RRSP for retirement, meaning, you don't expect to take this money out in the foreseeable future, then I personally think it's good to contribute to RRSP, then put the tax return into the TFSA. This way you get to grow both portfolios tax free. You still get liquidity with your TFSA as a "rainy day" fund, but if outlook's 10+ years, then just CCP both and sit back + relax.

Some may argue that it depends on how much money you make now, you might want to save your tax-deferring RRSP contribution for when you get paid more... but I think time-in-market is the most important thing. Having two portfolios growing tax free can easily beat the alternative.
Member
Jun 12, 2010
339 posts
63 upvotes
YVR
Quick question for you CCP gurus regarding tax-efficiency.

Current situation: limited income, (<45k/year), still in school, may be going back to a 4-year program in the coming year(s). Currently have a maxed TFSA with a split CCP portfolio (see below for makeup), and a fair sum of money sitting in an EQbank account at 2.3% interest. Would like to know how to best maneuver some of that money in EQBank into a Margin-based Questrade account, and which ETFs to proceed with (i.e. NA equities/bonds vs int'l) in terms of maximizing tax efficiency.

Current TFSA umbrella:
60% sitting in a Tangerine Balanced Growth Mutual Fund
40% sitting in a Questrade TFSA account with the following breakdown:
  • VAB - what's going on with Canadian bonds? Has it been down across all the Canadian-bond based ETFs?
  • VCN
  • VFV
  • VUN
  • XEC
  • XEF
  • XRE
Back when I was doing quite a bit more research into CCP and ETF investing, the idea of keeping certain types of equities in tax-sheltered accounts vs non-registered came up quite often. Just wondering if there is any updated guidelines to be aware about and if anyone can point me in the right direction?

Thanks!

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