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springdays wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 2:59 pm
What are you even talking about?

Trump is at a 34% approval rating - he is a war mongering moron and anyone who likes him shows what they are made of. Enough said.
Probably closer to 38% if you believe an aggregate of the polls.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/tr ... l-ratings/

Though what's a good approval rating really? Is 43% any better?
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Mar 23, 2016
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hugh_da_man wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 3:37 pm
Probably closer to 38% if you believe an aggregate of the polls.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/tr ... l-ratings/

Though what's a good approval rating really? Is 43% any better?
The range seems to be about 33-37% depending on the time of the year.

Granted, polls are just indicative and it IS true that his base (the uneducated, white lower income males, hardline conservatives and some white women) are loyal to him regardless of what he does. If he takes the world to war, so be it.

Internationally, he is seen as a joke, almost without fail.
"Obama is the quintessence of all that is wrong with America today.. people looking at the superficial which is skin color and ignoring idiotic behavior." - the poster AndySixx 😲 :facepalm:
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springdays wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 2:59 pm
What are you even talking about?

Trump is at a 34% approval rating - he is a war mongering moron and anyone who likes him shows what they are made of. Enough said.
Lol, more denial quoting polls. The same polling and sampling method that predicted a Hillary Clinton Sweep Face With Tears Of Joy. I bet any Trump supporter is even more dismissive of these traditional media polls and thus even more under represented. I predict that those who are jumping for joy at this number will get nipped twice in falling for this and assuming that this guarantees a loss in 2018/20.
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at1212b wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 5:06 pm
Lol, more denial quoting polls. The same polling and sampling method that predicted a Hillary Clinton Sweep Face With Tears Of Joy. I bet any Trump supporter is even more dismissive of these traditional media polls and thus even more under represented. I predict that those who are jumping for joy at this number will get nipped twice in falling for this and assuming that this guarantees a loss in 2018/20.
Who is jumping for joy? Did you read my earlier post? You are getting sad and projectionist in your old days, at1212b, but feel free to enjoy the hateful Trumpian politics - one day you may even see what that means.

As to the polls, most people recognize that the rural, downcast, those that feel left behind, angry (@various things - immigrants, wealth loss, politicians, black rights, rich etc), uneducated, white conservatives - they all have a fine home in the Trump base. And that is fine. That is where they choose to belong, and it's not an issue for me, that's for sure. I can't help but feel sorry for people like that :)

Cheers.
"Obama is the quintessence of all that is wrong with America today.. people looking at the superficial which is skin color and ignoring idiotic behavior." - the poster AndySixx 😲 :facepalm:
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at1212b wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 5:06 pm
Lol, more denial quoting polls. The same polling and sampling method that predicted a Hillary Clinton Sweep Face With Tears Of Joy. I bet any Trump supporter is even more dismissive of these traditional media polls and thus even more under represented. I predict that those who are jumping for joy at this number will get nipped twice in falling for this and assuming that this guarantees a loss in 2018/20.
Virginia wants to speak with you. Plus, I don't need polls to tell me Trump is losing support when you had Trump supporters burning MAGA hats and ranting/raving about DACA/immigration/ban (lack of) in the comments section of Trump bastions like Breitbart.

Trump will always have a hardcore base of folks who would vote for Hitler's corpse it it has an 'R' next to it:

Johnstown Never Believed Trump Would Help. They Still Love Him Anyway.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... ers-215800
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JustBob wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 5:58 pm
Virginia wants to speak with you. Plus, I don't need polls to tell me Trump is losing support when you had Trump supporters burning MAGA hats and ranting/raving about DACA/immigration/ban (lack of) in the comments section of Trump bastions like Breitbart.

Trump will always have a hardcore base of folks who would vote for Hitler's corpse it it has an 'R' next to it:

Johnstown Never Believed Trump Would Help. They Still Love Him Anyway.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... ers-215800
That is true - many people supported Hitler and his campaign of hate and propaganda.
"Obama is the quintessence of all that is wrong with America today.. people looking at the superficial which is skin color and ignoring idiotic behavior." - the poster AndySixx 😲 :facepalm:
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JustBob wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 5:58 pm
Virginia wants to speak with you. Plus, I don't need polls to tell me Trump is losing support when you had Trump supporters burning MAGA hats and ranting/raving about DACA/immigration/ban (lack of) in the comments section of Trump bastions like Breitbart.

Trump will always have a hardcore base of folks who would vote for Hitler's corpse it it has an 'R' next to it:

Johnstown Never Believed Trump Would Help. They Still Love Him Anyway.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story ... ers-215800
Keep on dreaming haha this is exactly why Trump will win yet again haha
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at1212b wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 5:06 pm
Lol, more denial quoting polls. The same polling and sampling method that predicted a Hillary Clinton Sweep Face With Tears Of Joy. I bet any Trump supporter is even more dismissive of these traditional media polls and thus even more under represented. I predict that those who are jumping for joy at this number will get nipped twice in falling for this and assuming that this guarantees a loss in 2018/20.
They really are grasping at any straws they can to make themselves seem logical.

Hence why Hitler has made the umpteenth appearance in a Trump discussion.

The difficulty of handling reality really is present in these people. And it'll only get worse as people increasingly go to their corner of social media and the internet and shut out dissenting voices. I'm no Ben Shapiro (in fact he's a hell of a lot less liberal than I am) but I've noted as well the increasing difficulty people of all political backgrounds have with other opinions and things they don't want to see/hear/read, but in 2017 leftists stand out by far as the biggest babies. They're become a very serious threat to liberal values of freedom all because they think the world needs to adjust to their self-imposed sensitivities and not vice versa.
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Nov 8, 2017
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Somewhere in Ontario
Syne wrote:
Nov 8th, 2017 7:28 pm
we have the most powerful country in the world fetishizing the past.
So, let me get this straight, China has a new-found nostalgia for the days of Mao?
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AndySixx wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 11:22 pm
They really are grasping at any straws they can to make themselves seem logical.

Hence why Hitler has made the umpteenth appearance in a Trump discussion.

The difficulty of handling reality really is present in these people. And it'll only get worse as people increasingly go to their corner of social media and the internet and shut out dissenting voices. I'm no Ben Shapiro (in fact he's a hell of a lot less liberal than I am) but I've noted as well the increasing difficulty people of all political backgrounds have with other opinions and things they don't want to see/hear/read, but in 2017 leftists stand out by far as the biggest babies. They're become a very serious threat to liberal values of freedom all because they think the world needs to adjust to their self-imposed sensitivities and not vice versa.
Quite agreed. I mean I was actually more left in my younger days, and definitely understand it. Heck, I'm a minority immigrant that benefited hugely from progressive policies. I did one of those tests and I'm actually more left as well as Libertarian than 'right' and 'conservative'. But there is definitely a certain maniacal pitbull approach and attitude by certain 'Leftists' that are just unending in their anger and spite. I mean if Hillary won, I wouldn't be in a thread taking it all personal. But vice versa.. it is that intolerant dictatorial 'strike and bite' like a snake scorn that is just too prevalent. You're right.. I learned in Philosophy that "Liberal" is intended to be progressive and therefore open in their views. This is hardly the case today in today's "Liberals". And of course, it's always Hitler that has to be brought up.
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Somewhere in Ontario
^I think it is important to remember far left is not liberal. There's a lot of difference there. Black Lives Matter Toronto absolutely loathes and hates the Liberal party, they're interested in revolution and overthrow of capitalism, and they don't even represent a majority of black people in Canada so far as I can tell (maybe the name could be properly referred to as Some Black Lives in Toronto but not most that All Matter But Do Not Represent Most Black Folks, but this new SBLTAMBDNRMBF is pretty wordy). But how many people refer to them as 'liberals' in dialogue? Too many times I've found people throwing around projections and confusing language. How could a group be liberal if said group being discussed hates liberals with a seething passion?

If you're talking about American politics instead of politics here in Canada, then I would say Americans don't actually know political terms that well. They very much have a bubble in political thinking and they try and fit everything into a liberal-conservative dichotomy when there's more complexity to politics. I rarely meet an American who understands that liberalism is actually closer to centrism, but instead they use socialism and liberalism as synonyms. For example: the American concept of suggesting that universal health insurance is somehow a leftist plot is a joke (yet I hear the meme over and over from yanks), I've always thought our health care system wasn't just good for people, it is much less expensive for our businesses big and small, it frees up individuals to explore entrepreneurship, it frees us as individuals to seek out self employment and contracts in where we don't have to feel obligated to only look to government jobs and/or big business corporate jobs just to have decent health coverage. I see our single payer heath system as making capitalism work more effectively, Americans see it as the coming of Lenin and Stalin.

Perspectives are different depending on who you ask.
Last edited by ConsumerBran on Nov 10th, 2017 1:07 am, edited 3 times in total.
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at1212b wrote:
Nov 10th, 2017 12:49 am
Quite agreed. I mean I was actually more left in my younger days, and definitely understand it. Heck, I'm a minority immigrant that benefited hugely from progressive policies. I did one of those tests and I'm actually more left as well as Libertarian than 'right' and 'conservative'. But there is definitely a certain maniacal pitbull approach and attitude by certain 'Leftists' that are just unending in their anger and spite. I mean if Hillary won, I wouldn't be in a thread taking it all personal. But vice versa.. it is that intolerant dictatorial 'strike and bite' like a snake scorn that is just too prevalent. You're right.. I learned in Philosophy that "Liberal" is intended to be progressive and therefore open in their views. This is hardly the case today in today's "Liberals". And of course, it's always Hitler that has to be brought up.
Even though I think you got leftist and liberal mixed up, I totally get what you're saying and I agree.

I'm a liberal myself and am just in utter amazement as to how leftists have ditched liberal philosophy and are embracing archaic regressive/conservative philosophies of silencing others freedoms because someone they disagree with uses it in a way others don't like.

And rather than engage in reasonable discourse they go from zero to Hitler in an instant. Of course, one would think, oh, this is only online.. problem is, it's actually quite rampant in the US in the cities and especially universities. This is a movement utterly destructive to social progress and if other liberals were smart they'd disassociate themselves from it.

This movement is a modern version of Marxism and radical environmentalism/animal rights that justified bombing test facilities, attacking loggers, attacking people they perceived as wealthy or intellectual. They used to try guerrilla tactics that associated with religion when religion was the primary "trusted" method of reasoning. Now that it's science, they've latched onto this and done their best to associate themselves with science. If you notice, they are doing a great job at screwing over the trust science built up too. The modern groups like Antifa and BLM clearly have nothing to do with what they alleged to be fighting. Physically attacking and trying to ruin the lives of others because they disagree with you is the very definition of fascist, from the same "anti-fascist" group. BLM is like Al Sharpton on crack, nothing to do about black rights.. they already have them. It's simply a way of trying to force a social movement through coercive tactics, in this case, utilization of white guilt so prevalent in liberal circles. They often cite MLK when attempting victimization of blacks but MLK was about judging people by their character. MLK and activists in his circles were well dressed men who clearly made good choices and advocated such. BLM uses these people yet advocates bad choices and attacking people you disagree with. Pretty insulting way to use a genuinely amazing person and movement.

Utterly regressive leftist movements. Up until recently the MSM publicly supported Antifa, who are effectively national terrorists. They still for some reason support BLM. I guess because they're more worried about the knee-jerk reaction from lefties of not supporting a group with the name "Black Lives Matter" as if by not supporting it you're saying black lives don't matter because you don't support the groups idiocy and complete hypocrisy that doesn't help blacks whatsoever. It's clear the thought process of leftists is very superficial (e.g. "the name of Black Lives Matters means more than what they actually do") and very facade. They only care about feeling good rather than doing good which is why they reach to such depths to try and maintain a very overtly religious-like attitude toward situations like this where they don't get their way.
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Somewhere in Ontario
The far left and the far right are too similar in many ways. I grew up in an era where social conservatives had a judgment for everyone, and if you didn't follow the up tight church principles they believed in, then you were considered trash in their eyes. They have since lost a lot of power in North America, more so in Canada than the US, but I don't forget the past that easily.

The left today thinks they are morally righteous. They want to tell everyone their version of rape, their version of racism, their version of this or that. If you don't agree, you're considered trash in their eyes.

The problem is moralizing in general. We don't need people moralizing in public positions. We need people to be free to make their own choices and own mistakes. We don't need every political sentence to begin with racism and end with rape. These moralists are all the same, whether they come from the extreme right or extreme left. How many times has a leftist come up to you and tried to argue with a straight face, albeit with nostrils snorting with anger and facial expressions covering deep seeded hatred, but still with a straight face try and argue that white people can be racist but people of colour cannot be racist because a, b, c.

Does that mean that I am automatically racist in Canada for merely being white because we're still a majority, but if I were to relocate to South Africa where I would be a minority that it would be impossible for me to be racist at that point? The logic these far leftists use is beyond insane. It would be laughable if it weren't so pervasive.

Toronto is probably the least racist major urban centre I've ever been in. Yet, if you listen to leftist garbage in certain circles here you'd think its the most racist place on earth. These people clearly have no connection to reality. I think Toronto's diversity is a good thing, but listening to a leftist speak about how racist this city is when all the management I work under is non-white and clearly making much more money than me? Priceless.

I think the world needs a little less anger and a little more understanding. And that starts with ending all this damn moralizing where people on extreme sides try to tell everyone else why their moral beliefs are superior. Whether its left or right, up or down I don't care. Its none of their business to moralize to me.
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AndySixx wrote:
Nov 10th, 2017 1:09 am
The modern groups like Antifa and BLM clearly have nothing to do with what they alleged to be fighting. Physically attacking and trying to ruin the lives of others because they disagree with you is the very definition of fascist, from the same "anti-fascist" group. BLM is like Al Sharpton on crack, nothing to do about black rights..
I'm not convinced Antifa is actually any organized group, that sounds like something the right has tried to project to gain political points. However, with regard to BLM, here in Toronto I think most people woke up to how insane some of the BLM movements are when they protested gay pride. It is my understanding BLM Toronto wasn't protesting police (that is just the lame cover story so they can inject racial politics into pride), but rather they were protesting pride itself for being a racist organization. That's clear in the coverage I've read on this topic. Pride Toronto has for years been a vanguard of inclusivity, its literally right in the rainbow flag - equality for all colours - and its *always* included black voices. Didn't they even give BLM front of the line honoured status when they held that silly protest for 'racism'?!

BLM Toronto said that Pride was racist because apparently TD Bank paid lots of $$$ to the pride organization to get a preferred booth at the pride festival, while Blockorama (the event catering to queer people of colour) apparently was given a park location.

That's kind of a lame reason to shut down pride and target an organization that has been committed to equality for the past 30-40 years and has actually achieved success and dialogue and inclusivity. That's when I think practical progressives realized the nutbags were insane. Protesting peaceful pride organizations isn't gaining BLM any brownie points.
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ConsumerBran wrote:
Nov 10th, 2017 1:23 am
The far left and the far right are too similar in many ways. I grew up in an era where social conservatives had a judgment for everyone, and if you didn't follow the up tight church principles they believed in, then you were considered trash in their eyes. They have since lost a lot of power in North America, more so in Canada than the US, but I don't forget the past that easily.

The left today thinks they are morally righteous. They want to tell everyone their version of rape, their version of racism, their version of this or that. If you don't agree, you're considered trash in their eyes.

The problem is moralizing in general. We don't need people moralizing in public positions. We need people to be free to make their own choices and own mistakes. We don't need every political sentence to begin with racism and end with rape. These moralists are all the same, whether they come from the extreme right or extreme left. How many times has a leftist come up to you and tried to argue with a straight face, albeit with nostrils snorting with anger and facial expressions covering deep seeded hatred, but still with a straight face try and argue that white people can be racist but people of colour cannot be racist because a, b, c.

Does that mean that I am automatically racist in Canada for merely being white because we're still a majority, but if I were to relocate to South Africa where I would be a minority that it would be impossible for me to be racist at that point? The logic these far leftists use is beyond insane. It would be laughable if it weren't so pervasive.

Toronto is probably the least racist major urban centre I've ever been in. Yet, if you listen to leftist garbage in certain circles here you'd think its the most racist place on earth. These people clearly have no connection to reality. I think Toronto's diversity is a good thing, but listening to a leftist speak about how racist this city is when all the management I work under is non-white and clearly making much more money than me? Priceless.

I think the world needs a little less anger and a little more understanding. And that starts with ending all this damn moralizing where people on extreme sides try to tell everyone else why their moral beliefs are superior. Whether its left or right, up or down I don't care. Its none of their business to moralize to me.
So true. I'm born in 1982 so I'm among the older millennials. I spent much of my early life combating the repressive moral conservatives. It took so many battles just to get them away from the idiocy about interracial relationships, educating on AIDS, to not actively try and use government to be their moral police and stop gays from marrying despite their earlier attempts in using government to single out gays and discriminate. Then the left of today are trying to turn us back to that era of moral superiority and fascism under-any-other-name and emotion over logic and freedom.

I also agree and second your wishes for more understanding. However, we're now in an era where people can instantly shut out voices they disagree with (often times with structural support from people who, with the best of intentions, want to avoid the chaos leftists cause), and it's even easier to find your own social media circle of opinion-validating yes-men. People have to actually put out the effort to be around opposing views, and even then, in cases of mixed political views like this site, you can see how well the leftists of this forum tolerate opposing views. While I've lurked the HD subforum for years I've only been a member of this forum for a few months and already I've had people trying to get me banned because I dared oppose their views. I think we've given too much a platform for extreme sides to dictate things, and I think it's time for independents (<- me) and moderates to take back western civilization from these nut jobs.
ConsumerBran wrote:
Nov 10th, 2017 1:36 am
I'm not convinced Antifa is actually any organized group, that sounds like something the right has tried to project to gain political points. However, with regard to BLM, here in Toronto I think most people woke up to how insane some of the BLM movements are when they protested gay pride. It is my understanding BLM Toronto wasn't protesting police (that is just the lame cover story so they can inject racial politics into pride), but rather they were protesting pride itself for being a racist organization. That's clear in the coverage I've read on this topic. Pride Toronto has for years been a vanguard of inclusivity, its literally right in the rainbow flag - equality for all colours - and its *always* included black voices. Didn't they even give BLM front of the line honoured status when they held that silly protest for 'racism'?!

BLM Toronto said that Pride was racist because apparently TD Bank paid lots of $$$ to the pride organization to get a preferred booth at the pride festival, while Blockorama (the event catering to queer people of colour) apparently was given a park location.

That's kind of a lame reason to shut down pride and target an organization that has been committed to equality for the past 30-40 years and has actually achieved success and dialogue and inclusivity. That's when I think practical progressives realized the nutbags were insane. Protesting peaceful pride organizations isn't gaining BLM any brownie points.
More than anything else, I think this group in Canada was simply doing what many fledgling groups do when given a sudden burst of approval -- see how far they can go.

They've now seen the limits. We'll see if they stay within them or try to push them some more.

I will point out that as an American myself (only been in Canada since 2011, and recently naturalized Canadian citizen) most of this discussion surrounds the US.

In many ways when it comes to Canadian politics, far more often than not I read and listen. Still learning.

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