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Extend Electrical Wiring of Junction box - options?

  • Last Updated:
  • Nov 19th, 2019 11:44 am
[OP]
Jr. Member
Jul 31, 2008
163 posts
19 upvotes
Toronto

Extend Electrical Wiring of Junction box - options?

I decided to move a ceiling light fixture about 12 inches over, but there isn't enough slack in the electrical wire. Other than having to find some way to pull a new cable, do I have any options that are to electrical code to get the extra 12 inches that I need?
14 replies
Newbie
Mar 15, 2012
15 posts
6 upvotes
TORONTO
You can wire from the existing junction box and pull it to the new light fixture location but will have to keep that junction accessible with a cover
Deal Addict
User avatar
Jun 21, 2003
2873 posts
627 upvotes
Stoney Creek, ON
If this is on a floor with attic access above you can flip the box upwards and move it from the ceiling to seal that hole. As long as the existing junction box you need to extend from is accessible you are meeting code. If attic access isn't an option then you'll have to do as jriggz said. The box will need to remain in place with a cover over it.
[OP]
Jr. Member
Jul 31, 2008
163 posts
19 upvotes
Toronto
Thanks Jriggz.

Sorry please confirm if I understood correct

I purchase the same AWG grade wire, and using twist on connectors, I would connect the black and white wire from the original box to the new wire, which will feed into the new ceiling junction box, but I would need to cover the original ceiling box with an accessible cover yes?

Thank you.
jriggz wrote:
Nov 14th, 2019 2:43 pm
You can wire from the existing junction box and pull it to the new light fixture location but will have to keep that junction accessible with a cover
Deal Addict
Nov 18, 2005
4745 posts
1121 upvotes
Kitchener
There are decent looking white box covers at Home Depot, dont use the standard galvanized ones
Newbie
Mar 15, 2012
15 posts
6 upvotes
TORONTO
Zebraman wrote:
Nov 14th, 2019 9:07 pm
Thanks Jriggz.

Sorry please confirm if I understood correct

I purchase the same AWG grade wire, and using twist on connectors, I would connect the black and white wire from the original box to the new wire, which will feed into the new ceiling junction box, but I would need to cover the original ceiling box with an accessible cover yes?

Thank you.
In its simplest form yes. Without seeing whats in the junction box now I can't say for sure. But you would connect your new wire to the wire coming from the switch. The wire should be 14/2
[OP]
Jr. Member
Jul 31, 2008
163 posts
19 upvotes
Toronto
Thanks jriggz,

The junction box now is quite simple...a single 14 AWG wire with black, white and ground wire connected to the light fixture. I thought that I was to connect the new wire to this old junction box, and then the new wire would connect to a new junction box in the ceiling - that's not correct? I would not be touching the switch as it's a challenge to feed any new cable to the switch directly.
jriggz wrote:
Nov 15th, 2019 9:09 am
In its simplest form yes. Without seeing whats in the junction box now I can't say for sure. But you would connect your new wire to the wire coming from the switch. The wire should be 14/2
Newbie
Mar 15, 2012
15 posts
6 upvotes
TORONTO
Zebraman wrote:
Nov 15th, 2019 9:29 am
Thanks jriggz,

The junction box now is quite simple...a single 14 AWG wire with black, white and ground wire connected to the light fixture. I thought that I was to connect the new wire to this old junction box, and then the new wire would connect to a new junction box in the ceiling - that's not correct? I would not be touching the switch as it's a challenge to feed any new cable to the switch directly.
If its just that single 14/2 in the existing junction box then yes you can do just as you said. That existing wire goes to the switch. Use the correct size wire connectors and you should be good. You can get a white jb cover as someone else mentioned.
Deal Addict
Mar 14, 2004
3000 posts
379 upvotes
North Etobicoke
Zebraman wrote:
Nov 14th, 2019 9:07 pm
Thanks Jriggz.

Sorry please confirm if I understood correct

I purchase the same AWG grade wire, and using twist on connectors, I would connect the black and white wire from the original box to the new wire, which will feed into the new ceiling junction box, but I would need to cover the original ceiling box with an accessible cover yes?

Thank you.
You can add electrical tape around the marettes for extra protection.
Sr. Member
Nov 26, 2008
639 posts
195 upvotes
GTA
They also sell quick connects at Home Depot and other stores. They are ideal brand. Just strip wire and plug it in. Super easy, same concept black and black in one, white and white in the other and ground to ground.
Deal Fanatic
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Oct 19, 2008
6214 posts
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Whitby
Zebraman wrote:
Nov 14th, 2019 1:52 pm
I decided to move a ceiling light fixture about 12 inches over, but there isn't enough slack in the electrical wire. Other than having to find some way to pull a new cable, do I have any options that are to electrical code to get the extra 12 inches that I need?
Have you removed the old device box in the ceiling? Once that's out and you can look into the ceiling there's a staple holding the wire closeby, often a loop of extra wire for relocating fixtures etc. The wire might even be coming from direction of the new fixtures location.

I recently discovered many ceiling steel device boxes are 2 parts held together with rivet. One part is flat bar that is screwed to joist, the other part the octagonal box the wire runs into (clamped and ground screwed into). The two parts are easily separated with a small chisel or old flat head screw driver hammered between them, the rivets easily peels back releasing the octagonal box. No large mess for drywall guys, I should make a youtube vid of this as I don't see it posted anywhere.

Of course not necessary if there is an attic above ceiling, if the octagonal box is held by screws inside it, if its a plastic box or if the new box location is in same joist bay so wire can be accessed thru the new hole before that box is installed. This is the most common octagonal device box I found easy to remove by splitting the 2 parts at rivets
Image
Deal Fanatic
May 29, 2006
9684 posts
2337 upvotes
you are not allowed to splice a wire outside of a junction box, so if you are 12 inchs short, you are either adding a second junction box, or running a new wire, or scabbing an illegal splice in the wall.
[OP]
Jr. Member
Jul 31, 2008
163 posts
19 upvotes
Toronto
I could not remove the junction box after all....it is exactly like the one in the picture. The ceiling is not below an attic, so no access is possible. The junction box is held by 2 screws going into a joist, which I've loosen easily, but those spikes/teeth were likely hammered into the wood joist, so I can't wedge the box out.

Scrapping this idea - I can cut a large square into the ceiling to gain access, but not worth the effort because where I want the new box is across the other side of the joist, and I'd need to get in there and drill a hole to run the wire through needs a lot of space for me to work.


Zamboni wrote:
Nov 16th, 2019 9:05 am
Have you removed the old device box in the ceiling? Once that's out and you can look into the ceiling there's a staple holding the wire closeby, often a loop of extra wire for relocating fixtures etc. The wire might even be coming from direction of the new fixtures location.

I recently discovered many ceiling steel device boxes are 2 parts held together with rivet. One part is flat bar that is screwed to joist, the other part the octagonal box the wire runs into (clamped and ground screwed into). The two parts are easily separated with a small chisel or old flat head screw driver hammered between them, the rivets easily peels back releasing the octagonal box. No large mess for drywall guys, I should make a youtube vid of this as I don't see it posted anywhere.

Of course not necessary if there is an attic above ceiling, if the octagonal box is held by screws inside it, if its a plastic box or if the new box location is in same joist bay so wire can be accessed thru the new hole before that box is installed. This is the most common octagonal device box I found easy to remove by splitting the 2 parts at rivets
Image
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Oct 19, 2008
6214 posts
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Whitby
Zebraman wrote:
Nov 19th, 2019 8:40 am
I could not remove the junction box after all....it is exactly like the one in the picture. The ceiling is not below an attic, so no access is possible. The junction box is held by 2 screws going into a joist, which I've loosen easily, but those spikes/teeth were likely hammered into the wood joist, so I can't wedge the box out.
The "spikes" wouldn't be holding the box securely, there is likely a screw or nail above/outside the box on the flat bar (btw spikes) attached to joist. Try what I said, split the device box from that flat bar by hammering a small chisel or flat head screwdriver in. Then you might have enough wire to feed box at new location, the wire might be coming from that direction or a loop of extra wire at the first staple.
[OP]
Jr. Member
Jul 31, 2008
163 posts
19 upvotes
Toronto
Thanks...the issue is is that I don't have clear access to visually see and confirm that there's a screw that's secured to the part where the spikes are - I'd have to cut into the ceiling and be able to see. I wished whoever installed it didn't use the type of junction box as you had posted, which they did.

As per your suggestion, you are saying to separate the octagon box from the metal bar with the spikes correct? And this is done by driving a flat head screwdriver into the rivets? See diagram below where circled in red.

https://ibb.co/LRC0D7c

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