Automotive

"The eye-opening truth about dealer invoice prices"

[OP]
Deal Addict
Jun 9, 2003
4449 posts
588 upvotes

"The eye-opening truth about dealer invoice prices"

http://clark.com/cars/eye-opening-truth ... ice-price/
Today “the dealer invoice price minus holdback” is only a distant third cousin of the true cost of any new car. And, like the hundreds of other things you buy every year, no one, on or off the Internet, can tell you the seller’s true cost.
Not an endorsement from me, but I think it's an interesting take. Thoughts?
65 replies
[OP]
Deal Addict
Jun 9, 2003
4449 posts
588 upvotes
Another interesting quote from the same series:

http://clark.com/cars/beat-the-pricing-from-online-c/
At a market research luncheon meeting in the mid-1980s, I sat next to J.D. Power himself, the key speaker. I asked him, “David, who’s buying Saturns, the GM car for which everyone pays the full MSRP?” He answered, “The Caspar Milquetoasts of the world, the timid souls who can’t stand any kind of confrontation, no matter how mild.”

The Saturn option is dead, but the “timid souls” sales concept isn’t. Most consumers still turn into milquetoasts when they enter the car-buying mode. They’d rather take a long walk off a short pier than walk into a car store. So they go to the current “milquetoast option,” an online buying service, where they’re told what all the milquetoasts who preceded them paid, and they end up pleased to pay a similar price. They even buy into those sites’ overblown claims of “the dollars they saved vs. the MSRP” (which almost no one pays) — a number which often includes cash rebates that everyone gets, no matter where they purchase a car. If that’s not world-class hype, what is?
Deal Expert
Aug 22, 2011
15202 posts
4265 upvotes
Ottawa
Not to thread crap, most informative buyer already knows this.
[OP]
Deal Addict
Jun 9, 2003
4449 posts
588 upvotes
vkizzle wrote:
Oct 12th, 2017 4:52 pm
Not to thread crap, most informative buyer already knows this.
Not a thread crap at all - I'm eager to learn more. "Informed" buyers may already know, but I still see the vast majority of people talking about invoice.

I'm in the market for a minivan (still looking at new or used options), but for example, this is from the Unhaggle thread:

2017 Honda Odyssey EX
Base MSRP: $36,190
Invoice Price: $33,295

And currently there is a $4000 rebate incentive on that model. Most people would assume I should look to pay (invoice + small markup - rebate + other expenses), right? But you're saying I should look to pay even less than that? If you have any resources to point me toward, that would be much appreciated.
Deal Expert
Aug 22, 2011
15202 posts
4265 upvotes
Ottawa
Kohanz wrote:
Oct 12th, 2017 4:56 pm
Not a thread crap at all - I'm eager to learn more. "Informed" buyers may already know, but I still see the vast majority of people talking about invoice.

I'm in the market for a minivan (still looking at new or used options), but for example, this is from the Unhaggle thread:

2017 Honda Odyssey EX
Base MSRP: $36,190
Invoice Price: $33,295

And currently there is a $4000 rebate incentive on that model. Most people would assume I should look to pay (invoice + small markup - rebate + other expenses), right? But you're saying I should look to pay even less than that? If you have any resources to point me toward, that would be much appreciated.
That's correct, as the $4000 rebate is from the factory and you should squeeze the dealership to provide some discount also.
Deal Fanatic
Jan 15, 2006
8102 posts
2242 upvotes
Richmond Hill
It's a known fact that invoice prices isn't the true cost as dealers receive incentives as well. Invoice pricing is merely a general number to work with.
Sr. Member
Oct 17, 2010
891 posts
262 upvotes
Newmarket, Ontario
I just bought a car for 2k under "invoice"
Member
Dec 28, 2015
411 posts
117 upvotes
Westmount, QC
vkizzle wrote:
Oct 12th, 2017 4:59 pm
That's correct, as the $4000 rebate is from the factory and you should squeeze the dealership to provide some discount also.
I think almost everybody who knows "invoice" prices knows incentives and rebates are in addition to dealer discount as they come from manufacture and not dealer
Member
Dec 28, 2015
411 posts
117 upvotes
Westmount, QC
KingPhoenix wrote:
Oct 13th, 2017 2:53 am
I just bought a car for 2k under "invoice"
How much under invoice plus incentives?

Invoice price does not include incentives. Luckily incentives are generally captured by sites like unhaggle and etc
Deal Expert
User avatar
May 10, 2005
27946 posts
3966 upvotes
Ottawa
I have been saying this all along. Each time it comes up on this forum I have tried to explain the pricing structure of vehicles at dealerships. Invoice pricing is only a marketing tool and has nothing to do with what dealers pay for their vehicles.
Sites like Unhhaggle, CarCostCanada et al try to convince you that their "invoice price" is what you should strive for but in reality, dealers love it and are more than willing to give you that deal.
'Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional minority, and rabidly promoted by unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds the proposition that it is possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.' Anonymous
Deal Addict
User avatar
Jan 31, 2006
3328 posts
220 upvotes
Toronto
no one in their right mind will tell your their invoice price. i think ppl know this already.
My Heatware no posting contact info in your sig
Deal Fanatic
Sep 6, 2007
5490 posts
1215 upvotes
I use unhaggle as it's easier to negotiate with that vs. just telling them a number. Having that said, I don't allow much for "dealer profit" (which they typically suggest 3-7%).
Sr. Member
Jul 24, 2009
583 posts
376 upvotes
kitchener
Kohanz wrote:
Oct 12th, 2017 4:48 pm
Another interesting quote from the same series:

http://clark.com/cars/beat-the-pricing-from-online-c/
The "timid soul" concept is alive and well.
Some dealers even hold "haggle free" events, trying to create an impression that they are actually doing you a big favour, since you "don't have to haggle and feel uncomfortable".
In reality these events should be called "Come and pay the sticker price" and the dealer is laughing all the way to the bank.

A customer who won't try to haggle down the price is every dealers wet dream...in dealers circles also reffered to as "the sucker".

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