Automotive

HELP Bought a car and got screwed

  • Last Updated:
  • Mar 9th, 2012 4:02 pm
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Deal Fanatic
Apr 20, 2011
7747 posts
2750 upvotes
ON
vaportech wrote: Why do people keep spreading around this myth that you must get permission before you record someone. In Canada as long as one party knows then the recordings are completely legal.

This is correct.

Someone asked for a source:
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... ml#docCont
S184.2 essentially states a person (including you) can record provided consent is obtained by at least one party - you consent for yourself to record, therefore legal.

If not that exact section, its somewhere around there. I'm no lawyer :p
Member
Oct 14, 2007
373 posts
47 upvotes
xjune9x wrote: Except..that you need their permission to record the conversations or i can get sued if this ever get to court.
Not true. As long as only one of the participants in the conversation is aware the call is being recorded it's okay.
Jr. Member
Sep 16, 2011
120 posts
9 upvotes
TORONTO
Very simple. You sue in small claims for the lost value.

See here's the deal. Once you prove your case in court you send the docs to the Crown stating fraud, CC your MPP. Advise all parties that a conviction will force a criminal investigation.

The dealer will now cut you check to make you go away. They will likely force you to sign an agreement.

They committed contract fraud by not disclosing. Be smart and talk to the owner of the dealership.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Nov 18, 2002
7041 posts
652 upvotes
BC Interior
I hate to rain on this parade but you may want to triple check the carfax/carproof. It's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that the reported damage may not be for your car (though evidently it shows up). Stranger things have happened.
Deal Addict
Jul 20, 2003
1006 posts
85 upvotes
Toronto
ichpen wrote: I hate to rain on this parade but you may want to triple check the carfax/carproof. It's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that the reported damage may not be for your car (though evidently it shows up). Stranger things have happened.
MitSl wrote: actually I had a similar case with a mercedes benz, bought the car fairly new , on the invoice states no accidents, was a managers demo so had 2k on it, 2 years later tried to sell it at the BMW dealership they noted it had a 11,000 accident when it was at 560km , double checked with my own carproof.

I Took the car back to the dealer with my lawyer , they took everything down and 1 week later was called back in and got all my money back and offered a new car at invoice.

had it not been for my sales rep when buying my new car mentioning that i could get my money back, I probably would have just taken the hit.

Worse case call corporate HQ and they should address you fairly quickly


Honda dealer did their investigation and found that the car was indeed in a accident. The strangest part was that the car i bought was a dealer trade. So they basically got this car for me from a different honda dealership and they never reported to the original dealership about the accident. The honda dealership manager asked me how i found out and i told him basically, i wanted to trade in my car for a new honda crv. Can anyone help me with some negotiating skills in getting a deal for a trade or should i ask for total refund, since they screwed me...How should i be compensated and how much should i ask? Any help is appreciated. I was thinking maybe a trade will be better. Any thoughts?
Deal Addict
May 18, 2005
3412 posts
361 upvotes
xjune9x wrote: Quote Originally Posted by MitSl View Post
actually I had a similar case with a mercedes benz, bought the car fairly new , on the invoice states no accidents, was a managers demo so had 2k on it, 2 years later tried to sell it at the BMW dealership they noted it had a 11,000 accident when it was at 560km , double checked with my own carproof.

I Took the car back to the dealer with my lawyer , they took everything down and 1 week later was called back in and got all my money back and offered a new car at invoice.

had it not been for my sales rep when buying my new car mentioning that i could get my money back, I probably would have just taken the hit.

Worse case call corporate HQ and they should address you fairly quickly


Honda dealer did their investigation and found that the car was indeed in a accident. The strangest part was that the car i bought was a dealer trade. So they basically got this car for me from a different honda dealership and they never reported to the original dealership about the accident. The honda dealership manager asked me how i found out and i told him basically, i wanted to trade in my car for a new honda crv. Can anyone help me with some negotiating skills in getting a deal for a trade or should i ask for total refund, since they screwed me...How should i be compensated and how much should i ask? Any help is appreciated. I was thinking maybe a trade will be better. Any thoughts?

Maybe you should talk to a lawyer and sue them.
Deal Addict
Jul 20, 2003
1006 posts
85 upvotes
Toronto
LoveRFD wrote: Maybe you should talk to a lawyer and sue them.

Easy as said, eh..How much time and money is it worth going through a lawyer and trying to sue them out of what? $4000 :( should i work out a deal with the manager instead of trying to sue them...Like being compensated and getting a new car at whole sale cost?
Deal Addict
Oct 29, 2010
4475 posts
811 upvotes
LoveRFD wrote: Maybe you should talk to a lawyer and sue them.

Sue them? A lawyer costs $400 an hour. Just to hear what happened will cost you a grand.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Oct 9, 2004
1453 posts
295 upvotes
I'm no lawyer, but I'd imagine one would be more apt to work on a contingency-fee, especially if the case is fairly "slam-dunk". Also isn't Ontario one of those "loser-pay" (I forget the legal term), but potentially it could be win-win for you as a plaintiff. Contingency allows you to only owe if you win, and loser-pays mean the dealership may be coughing up at least a portion of your legal fees.

Again, I'm no lawyer but it's fairly common practice for civil litigators to offer 30 minutes to an hour of free consultation, usually in which time they can tell if you have a case or not and explain the "terms" of their fee arrangement.

That said, if you opt to work it out privately, I personally would be going for a refund of your entire purchase price towards the purchase of a new vehicle, and I would expect the new vehicle at invoice price. Likely the most "amicable" resolution, given that you are in the market for a new vehicle anyways. The dealership is going to be taking a loss, but you can point out they are likely to lose a lot more than depreciation in a successful lawsuit, not to mention the subsequent media attention.


According to MVDA 30 (1)
[QUOTE]Motor vehicle dealers shall disclose in writing to customers and to motor vehicle dealers such information as may be prescribed and shall make the disclosure at such time as may be prescribed[/QUOTE]

Relates back to MVDAR 42 (10) & (19) & (25)

[QUOTE]
42. For the purposes of section 30 (1) of the Act, the information mentioned in paragraph 22 of subsection 39 (2) and paragraph 11 of subsection 41 (1) of this Regulation is the following:

(10) If there has been structural damage to the motor vehicle or any repairs, replacements or alterations to the structure of the vehicle, a statement to that effect.

(19) If the total costs of repairs to fix the damage caused to the motor vehicle by an incident exceed $3,000, a statement to that effect and if the registered motor vehicle dealer knew the total costs, a statement of the total costs.

(25) Any other fact about the motor vehicle that, if disclosed, could reasonably be expected to influence the decision of a reasonable purchaser or lessee to buy or lease the vehicle on the terms of the purchase or lease. [/QUOTE]

Here's the rub, I couldn't come up with anything related to a penalty regarding this - however it doesn't appear to be something that you can claim from the OMVIC compensation fun, as those specific sections were not listed. It also was not SPECIFICALLY listed as available to cancel the contract within 90 days (which may actually be a good thing, because you could argue this omission allows you to cancel for an indefinite period of time?)

Anyways, that is the relevant law I could find, hopefully it helps you.
Member
Oct 30, 2005
312 posts
14 upvotes
Victoria, BC
xjune9x wrote: Honda dealer did their investigation and found that the car was indeed in a accident. The strangest part was that the car i bought was a dealer trade. So they basically got this car for me from a different honda dealership and they never reported to the original dealership about the accident. The honda dealership manager asked me how i found out and i told him basically, i wanted to trade in my car for a new honda crv. Can anyone help me with some negotiating skills in getting a deal for a trade or should i ask for total refund, since they screwed me...How should i be compensated and how much should i ask? Any help is appreciated. I was thinking maybe a trade will be better. Any thoughts?

They are full of it. No dealership in their right mind would take possession of a car without doing their own due diligence. They are trying to pass it on so you don't think they were being shady. You need to report this to OMVIC immediately, regardless of the outcome, so that they don't pull this with anyone else.
Member
Dec 27, 2006
207 posts
12 upvotes
London
This whole thread is kinda pointless!!! I can understand your feelings... but how much less is the car actually worth now on trade in?

that is the real issue.

a $4000 accident these days is nothing serious.

When you took it for trade in- what were they offering you before you knew about the accident?... and after?

On a 3 year old used car, a minor accident that was repaired properly doesn't really affect the value...

so quit whining.. and talking lawsuits, and move on! haha its not worth the stress to yourself to be battling it out with the dealer over this. I could understand if it was 2 weeks ago you bought a "brand new car" but this is 3 years on...

so dry your tears honey ;) and move on
Newbie
User avatar
Apr 12, 2009
68 posts
4 upvotes
Schlampah wrote: This whole thread is kinda pointless!!! I can understand your feelings... but how much less is the car actually worth now on trade in?

that is the real issue.

a $4000 accident these days is nothing serious.

When you took it for trade in- what were they offering you before you knew about the accident?... and after?

On a 3 year old used car, a minor accident that was repaired properly doesn't really affect the value...

so quit whining.. and talking lawsuits, and move on! haha its not worth the stress to yourself to be battling it out with the dealer over this. I could understand if it was 2 weeks ago you bought a "brand new car" but this is 3 years on...

so dry your tears honey ;) and move on
LOL you must work a car dealership.....let the lady do her thing here. She just asking for advice.
Deal Addict
Nov 1, 2009
2646 posts
81 upvotes
Schlampah wrote: so quit whining.. and talking lawsuits, and move on! haha its not worth the stress to yourself to be battling it out with the dealer over this. I could understand if it was 2 weeks ago you bought a "brand new car" but this is 3 years on...

so dry your tears honey ;) and move on

LOL.. You must work for a dealer. Buzz off.

OP, threaten to go to the media with this. I do agree with the dealer guy above that going to a lawyer might not be worth your while. But calling a journalist (or a few) would only cost 1/2 hour of your time :) . The damage to these idiots at the dealership on the other hand would be quite severe.
Banned
Sep 22, 2008
8322 posts
548 upvotes
just ask for a full refund of the car and buy another new one. :facepalm:
Deal Addict
User avatar
Nov 10, 2003
1608 posts
144 upvotes
Hampton
packardbell wrote: just ask for a full refund of the car and buy another new one. :facepalm:
Agreed - if it were the other way around, the dealership would have no qualms about screwing as much as they could out of you - consider this to be your lucky day and squeeze every last cent that is owed to you out of this - you won't get this opportunity again ! When you consider you paid full retail for a used car in the first place (yes 200km is used - try returning a brand new car after 200km and see how far you get), you owe them no favours. Get yourself a dealer invoice quote as well and shop around. Whatever you do, make sure the settlement does not tie you to buying a replacement from the same dealer - this eliminates your bargaining position on the new car and you can be sure they will be aiming to recoup as much as they can from that sale (expect to spend many hours with the prick that wants to sell you rust proofing etc)
Member
Jan 9, 2009
382 posts
45 upvotes
Toronto
Schlampah wrote: This whole thread is kinda pointless!!! I can understand your feelings... but how much less is the car actually worth now on trade in?

that is the real issue.

a $4000 accident these days is nothing serious.

When you took it for trade in- what were they offering you before you knew about the accident?... and after?

On a 3 year old used car, a minor accident that was repaired properly doesn't really affect the value...

so quit whining.. and talking lawsuits, and move on! haha its not worth the stress to yourself to be battling it out with the dealer over this. I could understand if it was 2 weeks ago you bought a "brand new car" but this is 3 years on...

so dry your tears honey ;) and move on

This is by far the poorest attempt at trying to play devil's advocate.

I wholeheartedly hope that you're being sarcastic or at the very least, just trolling the OP.
Deal Addict
Nov 26, 2005
3214 posts
387 upvotes
Vancouver
Phoenix3434 wrote: LOL.. You must work for a dealer. Buzz off.

OP, threaten to go to the media with this. I do agree with the dealer guy above that going to a lawyer might not be worth your while. But calling a journalist (or a few) would only cost 1/2 hour of your time :) . The damage to these idiots at the dealership on the other hand would be quite severe.

agree.
Deal Addict
Aug 13, 2008
3401 posts
426 upvotes
Mississauga
im thinking back to when i bought my car (<50 kms on it).

in the event that later down the road (pun intended) i discover an accident at 6 km, where in the paperwork would it even mention something like "accident free" "clean title" etc when the car was bought? bill-of-sale?

couldn't dealership just claim "invoice deosn't say anything about accidents or no accidents". i'm sure not. which is why i want to know if its explicitly stated in writing somewhere.

i just assumed that it was brand spanking new. i.e. no accidents, etc.

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