HTPC Mobo: AMD 780G vs NVIDIA 8200

[nfuz]

I already have a HTPC thread, but thought this deserved its own separate discussion rather than being in my thread because if both the popular chipsets for AMDs are....crap then kind of limits the buying options... Anyhow...

Below are very conflicting reviews from two of the best hardware review sites.

Please provide your input/thoughts on their findings:

ANANDTECH REVIEW:
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3430&p=5

24 fps Playback: Perfect on NVIDIA

The AMD 780G/790GX results were very choppy at times; even when they seemed smooth we experienced audio sync problems.

The only platform that can properly handle 24 fps output is NVIDIA's GeForce 8200/8300. It just works.

Currently the Intel G35/G45 and NVIDIA GeForce 8200/8300 chipsets support 8-channel LPCM output via HDMI. AMD continues to trail with 2-channel LPCM output on their chipsets.

And then from their conclusion...

As for the chipsets we looked at today, it is difficult to declare a true winner at this time, especially given the fact that the new NVIDIA chipsets are launching shortly. However, if we had to choose one chipset for primary HTPC usage, it would be the NVIDIA GeForce 8200.

The drawback for us is the lack of multi-channel LPCM HDMI audio output and not so great 1080P/24 fps playback capabilities. If these items are not important to you, then the 780G would probably be at the top of our list. Of course, these problems can be solved with an inexpensive HD 4550 or HD 4670 video card but that completely throws off the price advantage over the Intel platform

My conclusion based on that: AnandTech doesn't support 780G without a dedicated GPU, and they claim it provides trash playback.

Now...

TOMS HARDWARE REVIEW

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...o,2030-13.html

Our first conclusion is that if we were considering the purchase of one of these boards for an HTPC, we would strongly lean toward the AMD 780G/Radeon 3200. The board served up 1080p video without the stuttering issues we saw on the Nvidia MCP78S/GeForce 8200 motherboard playing back the demanding H.264 encoded Blu-ray disk.

By our reckoning, this is a deal-breaker. While it’s true that the GeForce 8200 has some better audio playback options, they don’t count for much when the video can’t be played back without stuttering on a dual-core Athlon X2 4800+ CPU.

Don’t get us wrong—the MCP78S is no slouch by any consideration and it’s a great value chipset with really strong graphics capabilities and compelling features like Hybrid Power not found in its 780G competition. But when buying specifically for HD video playback, the 780G is simply the better choice.

Tom's Hardware claims that 8200 does trash playback.

Clearly there's a huge conflicting response here for people looking to build a HTPC. What are your thoughts, aside from the obvious: Go Intel?

[mr_raider]

Different driver revisions, crappy software... who knows.

[Bskll]

I tend to put more weight into anand's musing than i do with tomshardware. Tomshardware is basically a big advertising site for companies to hawk their wares.

IIRC, that specific toms review was done before nvidia updated their drivers for 8200 to properly support 1080p/24. the toms one was done about half a month before the anandtech one.

[nfuz]

IIRC, that specific toms review was done before nvidia updated their drivers for 8200 to properly support 1080p/24. the toms one was done about half a month before the anandtech one.

Hmm ok, well that would help with 1 piece of the puzzle and explain why Tom's trashed Nvidia's 8200... but why praise 780G? How does Anandtech go from Tom's finding of "780G is great" (paraphrasing) to "780G is trash"

I can understand if it went from trash to great over time, but from great to trash?

[joshmxpx]

[QUOTE=nfuz;8003081if both the popular chipsets for AMDs are....crap then kind of limits the buying options... Anyhow...

What are your thoughts, aside from the obvious: Go Intel?[/QUOTE]

Looks like you've already made up your mind. We already know from your HTPC thread that you're hard for Intel, so why did you even start this thread.

I have a AMD 780g chipset in my HTPC, and so far I love it. Never has it chugged playing any 1080 or 720, lack of 8 channel audio is disappointing, but my reciever doesn't support the new formats anyway, so no biggie for me...

[nfuz]

I personally prefer Intel, precisely due to conflicting problems like these as shown in the reviews.

However, if I had already made up my mind, why would I be doing research on AMD? Both these chipsets have nothing to do with intel

Its a fairly cheap alternative, so I figured might as well give it a shot...

[rimi]

Looks like you've already made up your mind. We already know from your HTPC thread that you're hard for Intel, so why did you even start this thread.

I have a AMD 780g chipset in my HTPC, and so far I love it. Never has it chugged playing any 1080 or 720, lack of 8 channel audio is disappointing, but my reciever doesn't support the new formats anyway, so no biggie for me...

Just a question, if you only get 2 channels from the 780g mobo, and you cant get it anyways because of your receiver then how do you actually get 5.1 or 7.1 HD sound?
I dont understand all this sound probs with the 780g boards.

[mr_raider]

No. 780g can't output multi-channel LPCM over HDMI. It can process 5.1 fine over spdif or analog, and handles DTS and Dolby passthrough just fine over HDMI.

This is only an issue when playing Bluray discs with protected content.

By the way, Intel didn't build a half decent IGP until last year, and their new stuff barely has any hardware acceleration for HD to the extent that ATI and Nvidia do. Intel IGPs, other than the new 4500 would not be my choice for anything other than office work.

[rimi]

No. 780g can't output multi-channel LPCM over HDMI. It can process 5.1 fine over spdif or analog, and handles DTS and Dolby passthrough just fine over HDMI.

This is only an issue when playing Bluray discs with protected content.

By the way, Intel didn't build a half decent IGP until last year, and their new stuff barely has any hardware acceleration for HD to the extent that ATI and Nvidia do. Intel IGPs, other than the new 4500 would not be my choice for anything other than office work.

You kinda lost me there...isnt DTS supposed to have multi channels?

[torseller07]

If I am to buy a HTPC motherboard now, I would get nVidia 8200. 780G is crippled by design because it can only output 2 channels LPCM over HDMI. However, if you don't have a TrueHD capable receiver, 780G is cheaper and enough for your need (just need a Toslink to passthrough DTS 5.1).

P.S. I believe AMD still hasn't gotten hardware accelerated VC1 decoding working yet. H.264 seems to be working fine though.

[rimi]

I am kinda leaning towards the 780G chipset because of the edge gaming. Im also more inclined towards the review from AnandTech.

But considering my situation ATM, I should be fine with any of the two chipsets because the HTPC will be connected to my LCD HDTV directly. I dont own a receiver or any speaker setup.

The only reason im planning so much is because I plan on upgrading my setup and the HTPC later this year so I dont want to deal with any issues at that time.

BTW 8200 is cheaper than 780G.

[terrybear]

simply put BOTH nvidia's 8200 & ati's 780G can output audio directly thru the hdmi, cept in ati's case you would get the more advanced sound & up to 7.1 channel surround & effects vs nvidia which is limited to 5.1 based.

So all that ultimatly matters is what your hdmi's sound is going to like if you have a sound system that can do up to 7.1 surround or the sound technoligies that the ati sound supports you should be going for that.

If you don't give a rats azz about the sound itself & ya just want a cheap solution your going to buy the nvidia 9 times out of 10 unless ya plan to use it to game some then your going to want to use the 780g or maybe even the 790gx based amd boards.

Intel has never designed there stuff for more then just general pc usage or business ergo thats why they sell so much of there garbage intergated igp's in systems cause there mainly for buisiness class builds or peaple whom just " surf the net/chat ".

[mr_raider]

You kinda lost me there...isnt DTS supposed to have multi channels?

The audio is encoded in various formats on DVDs and Blurays. Your player can do two things, it can decode it, or it can not decode it.

If it doesn't decode it, the signal gets passed on to your receiver and the receiver will decode.

If does decode it, it can send the audio as analog to your speakers, or as uncompressed LPCM (think of it as a .wav stream instead of the mp3 file) to your receiver.

DVDs use DTS or Dolby Digital which can go up to 5.1 sound. These can be passed through compressed or uncompressed at will be any system.

Blurays and HD-DVDs use newer codecs that have 7.1 channel sound. These CAN NOT be passed through by computers due to content protection issues. The only choice is to decode them and pass the raw PCM data.

Here is my understanding of the current status:

Both 780g/8200g can decode multi-channel audio and send it via analog or optical. Optical is limited to 5.1. Analog is limited to however many holes are on the back your motherboard.

Both can pass through DTS/DD over optical or HDMI to your receiver so it can decode it.

Neither can pass throught the 7.1 codecs to your receiver.

The 8200 can send 7.1 LPCM over HDMI, the 780g can only send 2 channel.

Your TV will not be able to anything with any single more than 2 channels anyway. Unless you have a receiver and a surround sound setup, the issue is moot.

More info:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3411

[terrybear]

The audio is encoded in various formats on DVDs and Blurays. Your player can do two things, it can decode it, or it can not decode it.

If it doesn't decode it, the signal gets passed on to your receiver and the receiver will decode.

If does decode it, it can send the audio as analog to your speakers, or as uncompressed LPCM (think of it as a .wav stream instead of the mp3 file) to your receiver.

DVDs use DTS or Dolby Digital which can go up to 5.1 sound. These can be passed through compressed or uncompressed at will be any system.

Blurays and HD-DVDs use newer codecs that have 7.1 channel sound. These CAN NOT be passed through by computers due to content protection issues. The only choice is to decode them and pass the raw PCM data.

Here is my understanding of the current status:

Both 780g/8200g can decode multi-channel audio and send it via analog or optical. Optical is limited to 5.1. Analog is limited to however many holes are on the back your motherboard.

Both can pass through DTS/DD over optical or HDMI to your receiver so it can decode it.

Neither can pass throught the 7.1 codecs to your receiver.

The 8200 can send 7.1 LPCM over HDMI, the 780g can only send 2 channel.

Your TV will not be able to anything with any single more than 2 channels anyway. Unless you have a receiver and a surround sound setup, the issue is moot.

More info:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3411

I think you got that backwards the ati products can do the 7.1 & nvidia the 2 channel if I read correctly before. If not it might be the Radeon 3300 on the 790GX boards that might be what I'm thinkin is, but I just know that the few reviews I ready have never mentioned nvidia being able to do 7.1 at all.

[ppl4golf]

I think you got that backwards the ati products can do the 7.1 & nvidia the 2 channel if I read correctly before. If not it might be the Radeon 3300 on the 790GX boards that might be what I'm thinkin is, but I just know that the few reviews I ready have never mentioned nvidia being able to do 7.1 at all.

You are wrong sir. Plus, all along, this is about onboard all-in-one and this has been beaten to death.

If 7.1 Lossless PCM sound is important, go Nvidia onboard 8/9s. This is totally moot for many since we don't have the newest HDMI receivers that decodes and not just passthrough.

If price is important, go Nvidia 8's for AMD CPU though it looks like there is no more $30 rebate so it is moot too LOL.

If you want no fuzz good track record that just plain works , go Gigabyte 780G with at least a 2.8GHz dual core in case the hardware acceleration doesn't play nice.

If buying pre-built, go Intel X4500 like the ones from Dell.