Careers

I am in a mess. Need career advice

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  • Sep 4th, 2019 6:03 pm
Newbie
Aug 29, 2019
3 posts
2 upvotes

I am in a mess. Need career advice

Hello:

I need Career Advice. I have changed 4 jobs in 3 years or so.

1) 2 year FT job. Was put on PIP but I survived it. It was a small company and rude managers and I did some good stuff there. After PIP was over I wasnt in fear of my job, boss assured me that I improved.

2) 1-Year Mat Leave contract Job. $10K higher Pay. Massive Multinational company. Made few errors in reporting and it took a hit on my reputation. Took yhis job because of name of the company, title, more analytical. Mgr also wanted to extend my contract.

3) FT job. $15K higher pay. Massive Multinational company. Was fired within 3 months probation period because of poor performance and “Not the right fit.” Loved the job but my boss was a sales manager and he was in the analytics dept. He didnt know crap. Not even know basic excel but he was a 30-year lifer there.

4) 6-Month Mat-leave contract at a Massive Multinational company. $17K lower pay. Love my boss (really analytical). But I hate my pay and travel time. I dont get enough work has been given to me. I sit all day and practice my comp programming. But my boss has “Promised” me he will take care of me. Meaning contract extention. Several people started as contract employees and now are perm.

I am getting an FT offer from a massive multinational company. Back to the same pay I was when I was fired but I am scared to death to quieting and being fired again. What excusing will I have now? I have a wife and kid to take care of. I am seriously doubting my skills now. I have damaged my resume.

Maybe I am just a sub-standard employee with red flags all over my resume.

I am afraid to fail again. Wife is absolutely sick of me changing jobs. And I think I am seriously depressed.

Any career advice?
17 replies
Newbie
Aug 29, 2019
3 posts
2 upvotes
No. it was a contract position. Someone was on mat-leave and I was replacing her.
Deal Expert
User avatar
Jun 9, 2003
25310 posts
2536 upvotes
Markham, ON
SamYe123 wrote: Hello:

I need Career Advice. I have changed 4 jobs in 3 years or so.

1) 2 year FT job. Was put on PIP but I survived it. It was a small company and rude managers and I did some good stuff there. After PIP was over I wasnt in fear of my job, boss assured me that I improved.

2) 1-Year Mat Leave contract Job. $10K higher Pay. Massive Multinational company. Made few errors in reporting and it took a hit on my reputation. Took yhis job because of name of the company, title, more analytical. Mgr also wanted to extend my contract.

3) FT job. $15K higher pay. Massive Multinational company. Was fired within 3 months probation period because of poor performance and “Not the right fit.” Loved the job but my boss was a sales manager and he was in the analytics dept. He didnt know crap. Not even know basic excel but he was a 30-year lifer there.

4) 6-Month Mat-leave contract at a Massive Multinational company. $17K lower pay. Love my boss (really analytical). But I hate my pay and travel time. I dont get enough work has been given to me. I sit all day and practice my comp programming. But my boss has “Promised” me he will take care of me. Meaning contract extention. Several people started as contract employees and now are perm.

I am getting an FT offer from a massive multinational company. Back to the same pay I was when I was fired but I am scared to death to quieting and being fired again. What excusing will I have now? I have a wife and kid to take care of. I am seriously doubting my skills now. I have damaged my resume.

Maybe I am just a sub-standard employee with red flags all over my resume.

I am afraid to fail again. Wife is absolutely sick of me changing jobs. And I think I am seriously depressed.

Any career advice?
#3 ...dont include on your resume.

I dont see anything wrong now.

#4 was temp to pay the bills. Just stick to the new job...done.
Newbie
Aug 29, 2019
3 posts
2 upvotes
I guess I am reaching out because I have been fired twice in my life. one was my first Analyst job (8 years ago). Fired for poor performance during probation period.

And now its happened again. Fired during probation period. A senior role due to poor performance. I dont understand why this keeps on happening to me.

And now I am self doubting my abilities. I am very afraid to change jobs. What if I am fired during probation again really hard to explain future employers why I keep on changing jobs. Looks like I am an unstable employee.

Its also embarrassing keep on asking friends for references.
Newbie
Aug 7, 2019
7 posts
10 upvotes
First, congratulations for your job offer, it's really up to you, take it or leave it. Since your current job seems to be a waste of your time and the FT offer is better pay, I will say TAKE IT!
You did nothing wrong, what you have encountered happened to a lot people too, sometimes it's your "fault", sometimes it's just sheer bad luck.

BUT, I will suggest you be more careful with your next career, keep really quiet in the first year, spend time learning, not talking, even if you think you know better, trust me, you don't, keep a low profile and learn from your seniors, be really respectful and professional, lastly, don't stress out!!!

You don't have to show all your careers on your resume, just keep those that you know you could get okay reference, leave the rest out, you are still young, still a long way to go.
At least try to stay at a good place for a good few years, learn some really good skill.

My last job was 10 years, everyone likes me, before that, my average employment were like 6 months to 1 year, I was fired in one of them, unfairly fired, but life continues as usual, you are in much better condition now, so do not worry, take the new offer and start your day with some good learnt lessons, it is never to late.
Member
User avatar
Jul 24, 2014
342 posts
132 upvotes
Toronto, ON
Wow remind me, I was terminated very unfairly in my third job, it's over one year employment and.... I could not find any good reference! I was considered by a few good employer but once they knew I was fired, they never contacted me! So... don't mention it if you can. It took me almost 6 more months before the next job, I was applying for jobs full-time, 12hours a day, spending hours and hours on each application. I was fired because they decided I was the one that caused the team to fail, which I knew was a lie, everyone knew it's a lie but I was let go
So others can stay, life is not fair but you take what you could manage. It took me a while to get over the bitterness though, if I could do it again, I should have quit earlier.

Long story short, I finally got a contract, very bad pay but in my field! I took it and... Right before Christmas they laid all new contractors off! That contract only lasted 4 months! It's the coldest winter for me ever, I felt so sad then, I had a new born baby and jobless again, with all the good work ethic and skills.... Again I was well respected by my immediate manager, she was a very good person and I was contributing almost since day one, I cracked dome really tricky technical parts and was really more capable than a lot that stayed, I was let go because I was too new( no connection at all) , also because I was not the eloquent type that could give them trouble. Looking back, I realized they always recall people like me, laying people off is their way of saving costs.

But I could not wait, I couldn't even afford my bills by then.

I started applying jobs like crazy, shockingly, many employers were also doing last minute recruitment!
I got a two offers, one government contracts long term and, surprisingly top pay, but in Ottawa. The agency paid for all my screening , security clearance and was expecting me joining after the new year, I am forever grateful to them.

Another is an American company FT job, with all benefits, OK pay and close to home

I started working for the American company right after new year, I was out of work for 2 weeks.

.The manager interviewed me was very technical, and he made a technical mistake during the interview, I being real as I was, pointed it out, he was a bit embarrassed, but he offered me the FT position right there, he was not an easy boss, a workaholic, but we had the best relationship right after I joined his team. That was 2008, my company was hit by the financial crisis HARD, a lot people were let go, and I stayed, because I really contributed in the first few months! I am not bragging, I cleaned up their messest system, in the first three months, working like crazy with my job addicted manager, we had a lot of fun together.

It's my best employment so far.

Don't ever give up, giving up is for losers, I was one before, never again
Last edited by tigerdemi on Aug 30th, 2019 10:40 pm, edited 5 times in total.
Index Fund vs Individual Stock..."tigerdemi is a great man" tigerdemi said to himself in his dream.
Moderator
User avatar
Sep 21, 2004
11412 posts
7182 upvotes
Calgary
SamYe123 wrote: I guess I am reaching out because I have been fired twice in my life. one was my first Analyst job (8 years ago). Fired for poor performance during probation period.

And now its happened again. Fired during probation period. A senior role due to poor performance. I dont understand why this keeps on happening to me.

And now I am self doubting my abilities. I am very afraid to change jobs. What if I am fired during probation again really hard to explain future employers why I keep on changing jobs. Looks like I am an unstable employee.

Its also embarrassing keep on asking friends for references.
If you want some assurance, many people were let go during probation period at least once in their life, myself included. I worked in EI so you have no idea how many people were dismissed during probation period. It's very common so don't overthink it.
Member
User avatar
Jul 24, 2014
342 posts
132 upvotes
Toronto, ON
Looking at your last four jobs some observation

1) the small firm used PIP to squeeze out all your labor, it's a bad place
2) nothing wrong on your side, they made a big issue out of nothing since you were so new and the punching bag.
3) you apparently didn't know the politics, your manager is a politician, the fact he know shxt and was there 30 years in a technical role said it all.
4) waste of your time, but you can get something done if you were patient enough, there are always good internal opportunities, once you proved yourself.

Best of luck, I will take the job offer if it's a good fit.
Take sometime to talk to your new boss, see how it goes, do it professionally but don't overdo it. Be sincere and be yourself.
Index Fund vs Individual Stock..."tigerdemi is a great man" tigerdemi said to himself in his dream.
Deal Expert
Feb 7, 2017
27765 posts
27801 upvotes
Eastern Ontario
tigerdemi wrote: Looking at your last four jobs some observation

1) the small firm used PIP to squeeze out all your labor, it's a bad place
2) nothing wrong on your side, they made a big issue out of nothing since you were so new and the punching bag.
3) you apparently didn't know the politics, your manager is a politician, the fact he know shxt and was there 30 years in a technical role said it all.
4) waste of your time, but you can get something done if you were patient enough, there are always good internal opportunities, once you proved yourself.

Best of luck, I will take the job offer if it's a good fit.
Take sometime to talk to your new boss, see how it goes, do it professionally but don't overdo it. Be sincere and be yourself.
Good advice.

I will add to # 3 and # 4

# 3 - This is a mistake most of us make when we are young.
We assume the OLD FARTS are just old & don’t know anything ... especially so in regards to modern ways of doing things / tech
(Lol... I am over 60 now... but I thought the same way in my 20s ... when computers were first introduced and the old time employees did not have a clue).

But if you voice those opinions you are BEYOND FOOLISH ... you become disposable. And are a GONER.
Truth is ... you have NO IDEA what they did in the past for the Company 10, 20 or 30 years ago
How they got into Management ... or how the Co regards them
Or the LOYALTY THAT THEY HAVE for the Co
That says a lot about WHY they are still around

He may not know Excel ... cuz quite frankly he doesn’t need to

Someone else can do it for him

Same reason some Execs in some Cos still don’t write much of their own correspondence / emails
They probably could hen peck thru it on the keyboard
But they don’t have to
Their time (and the Co money) is spent better doing something far more valuable

And as a newbie ... you have no idea how much clout they might have (by themselves or with their peers)
So until you truly understand all the company politics... just keep your mouth shut on criticism
And try to learn from others ... about their role, and where everyone fits in

Even the guy who gets sidelined in a company at the end of his career
May have a role (past or present) you don’t understand
Afterall he’s still there ... not been let go

Observation is a very important skill as a newbie
LISTEN MORE THAN YOU TALK

# 4 - This is a fine line. Between being under utilized, and appearing not necessary
Ya don’t want to WASTE TIME while at work
A better way to think of it
Is say to yourself, they are paying me to be here
I am on THEIR DIME
So I owe them something

Then have a chat with your boss on how your time can be better spent
You don’t mind the task
Even if it’s not “your domain”
Can you help elsewhere in the dept ?
Can you help someone else in the Co...
another Mgr, another dept, whatever

Explain ... I AM KEEN TO WORK
I NEED TO WORK
PLS FIND ME SOMETHING TO DO

And then... don’t complain at whatever you are given
Even if it’s not what you were hired to do
In quiet times in my own career ... I got crazy tasks like cleaning out an office storage area, to doing data entry for another dept
But they all taught me something about the Co
And showed my bosses I wasn’t afraid of work
Plus even the most menial jobs meant I met new people in the Co
Which in turn brought me more contacts
Contacts that proved invaluable in my continued employment

The more people you know
And the more you seemingly know about the Co
The more invaluable an employee you appear to be
The less likely you are to get laid off
Or if you are laid off ... the sooner someone will call you to come back in and look at a job they might have in their area

Eventually ... stuff sticks.
And you are considered part of the team
And not someone just auditioning for a role
You have a role

* Corporate History - Not given enough credit in its value. Executives like having folks around who retain info of things that have happened ... or how things were done in the past. HOW DID WE GET HERE ? So the guy sidelined may very well be THAT DUDE. He’s still around cuz he has an incredible finger in every pie knowledge about the Co that isn’t written down. He remembers the XYZ job in 1992, and still has contacts at the largest Customer cuz the current CEO Son of the Founder, and him both cut their teeth in the Partnership at the same time.

Companies are like family trees ... there’s just a lot of stuff going on you may not be privy to if you are the youngest / newest member. Takes time to get your feet on the floor under the Dining Room table.
Member
User avatar
Jul 24, 2014
342 posts
132 upvotes
Toronto, ON
The guy above is the real deal, I agree with him 100%, as an employee, always stay humble, don't fake it, be genuinely humble, doors will open for you. There are too many things to learn in a big company, having the right attitude is the most important one.

Been working like this for me all these years, I never play politics, once they knew me, they will keep politics away from me, that's win win for me, for them too. So far it served me really good.

Of course, it worked for me since I don't want any managerial role, I only want to do technical work.
Index Fund vs Individual Stock..."tigerdemi is a great man" tigerdemi said to himself in his dream.
Deal Expert
Feb 7, 2017
27765 posts
27801 upvotes
Eastern Ontario
tigerdemi wrote: The guy above is the real deal, I agree with him 100%, as an employee, always stay humble, don't fake it, be genuinely humble, doors will open for you. There are too many things to learn in a big company, having the right attitude is the most important one.

Been working like this for me all these years, I never play politics, once they knew me, they will keep politics away from me, that's win win for me, for them too. So far it served me really good.

Of course, it worked for me since I don't want any managerial role, I only want to do technical work.
Agree

Company Politics ...
Like Gossip (talking smack about others ... be it work related, or personal)
Are minefields best avoided

When Gossip about people / coworkers comes up... best policy is to
(A) NEVER participate
(B) IF YOU CAN excuse yourself from the room / situation

Of course these are both more difficult IF the one mouthing off is your boss
Then my best advice is still don’t get sucked in
And ... begin the hunt for a far more ethical Boss (or new job)
Cuz someday THE SH!T WILL HIT THE FAN
And you don’t want to be anywhere near them when it happens
Cuz sometimes those who were complicit / don’t speak up get splattered as well

Sometimes it’s just easier to get out ahead of the Sh!t Storm
Deal Expert
Dec 5, 2006
16787 posts
12570 upvotes
Markham
OP, feel like either you complain about companies such as manager is bad, travel time or companies don't think you are a good fit or performance. Wondering whether you are in a wrong type of job or you only focus on something but forget others. I think you need figure out what went wrong, otherwise this will happen again and again

Not saying it's your fault, but you need figure out root cause

Good luck!
Deal Addict
Dec 27, 2007
4867 posts
2067 upvotes
Edmonton
OP, how about a trades job?

It will give you a fresh start, you will be in good shape.

Also how would you like to make 100g and only work 4-6 months of the year?

And best of it all, there's no office politics or anything.
warming up the earth 1 gas fill-up at a time...
You only live once, get a v8
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Mar 7, 2007
5347 posts
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I don't see anything particularly wrong.

More and more people "hop" constantly to better jobs, because of contract opportunities and other circumstances. It is the new "normal" for a large portion of the workforce.

I hear you, changing jobs like that is also exhausting. So it could be helpful to stay longer at your next position.
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Jan 31, 2007
12875 posts
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what is PIP? is it some sort or probation?
One Man's Trash Is Another Man's Treasure
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Nov 20, 2016
175 posts
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Aznkid2000 wrote: what is PIP? is it some sort or probation?
Performance Improvement Plan. It's a formal process given to employees who are under-performing. If you don't meet the perform targets set out under the plan, the company would have grounds to let you go.
Deal Fanatic
Sep 23, 2007
5654 posts
2168 upvotes
Mistakes happen to everyone. It's easy to tell someone to sharpen up. But when sending reports, the biggest risk are the things you don't know but people expected. Like you base a calculation on certain assumptions. It is important to validate assumptions, and save important documents like emails to support that what you did is valid. And if the source of the assumption came from someone else, then you have the paper trail to save your butt.

Anyways, reading your post, I think you got some self improvement to work on. I'm not going to sugar coat it. It sounds like you consistently made mistakes and probably did under perform. You held multiple jobs and this happened a lot. Try reading some self-help books and see if that helps. Or try working "slower" but with greater focus. I find that physical health is often tied to office work performance as well. If you go to work in a focused and with adequate energy, you will naturally perform better.

You are obviously able to land gigs, even if temporary ones. So your experience is obviously landing interviews. You can always just find creative reasons for leaving the job as others suggested in this thread.

As for your wife being unhappy, good luck. Nobody can help you with that. Solve the root of the problem. That's about all you can do.
Deal Addict
Feb 19, 2017
1145 posts
879 upvotes
BananaHunter wrote: Mistakes happen to everyone. It's easy to tell someone to sharpen up. But when sending reports, the biggest risk are the things you don't know but people expected. Like you base a calculation on certain assumptions. It is important to validate assumptions, and save important documents like emails to support that what you did is valid. And if the source of the assumption came from someone else, then you have the paper trail to save your butt.

Anyways, reading your post, I think you got some self improvement to work on. I'm not going to sugar coat it. It sounds like you consistently made mistakes and probably did under perform. You held multiple jobs and this happened a lot. Try reading some self-help books and see if that helps. Or try working "slower" but with greater focus. I find that physical health is often tied to office work performance as well. If you go to work in a focused and with adequate energy, you will naturally perform better.

You are obviously able to land gigs, even if temporary ones. So your experience is obviously landing interviews. You can always just find creative reasons for leaving the job as others suggested in this thread.

As for your wife being unhappy, good luck. Nobody can help you with that. Solve the root of the problem. That's about all you can do.
Agree with the above. Own your mistakes and work on addressing your weaknesses, whether it's the actual work itself or your communication skills. No matter where you go, impressions matter. Be thoughtful in your correspondence. Think about how your words in an email or internal messaging system will be perceived by the person receiving it without the tone of an in-person conversation to clarify meaning.

As for switching jobs constantly, your wife isn't as concerned with you switching as to your lack of stability. If you aren't a superstar, you should find a good, stable job and then stick with it. You never know how a new boss at a new job will assess performance.

If you get to a point where you can be confident that you can go into the new job and kick *ss from day 1, then do it. Until my most recent role, I've switch jobs every year, each time for more pay. I've had zero problems with the wife. She doesn't care as long as I'm making more than before, but it's also because she doesn't have to worry about me not passing probation or getting fired.
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