Shopping Discussion

It Is Law That I Have To Tell CBSA Agents My Cellphone & Laptop Password?

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  • Apr 30th, 2017 2:15 am
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Deal Addict
Nov 25, 2014
1158 posts
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Newton Brook, ON
alpha2omega wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:06 pm
I was more speaking to going out than in, but are you sure about that? I was under the impression they couldn't deny you entry as a citizen but I've heard otherwise since then.
If you're going out you'd be dealing with US border patrol, not CBSA...
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Jan 7, 2002
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Waterloo, ON
alpha2omega wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:06 pm
I was under the impression they couldn't deny you entry as a citizen but I've heard otherwise since then.
Canadian citizens have the right to enter Canada, reside in Canada, work in Canada, etc. Whoever told you otherwise is mistaken.
I'm wondering because what's stopping anyone from saying they are a citizen and trying to enter the country? If they have the "right" CBSA shouldn't be able to stop them, even if they don't have ID.
A Canadian citizen who leaves Canada is well-advised to carry a valid Canadian passport or otherwise be able to prove that they're a Canadian citizen, e.g. Nexus pass. (If you lose your passport while outside Canada you should contact the nearest embassy/consulate to get a temporary replacement.)

CBSA can't refuse Canadian citizens entry but they can search and even detain them if they're caught breaking the law, e.g. false declaration of goods imported. They can temporarily detain those who claim to be citizens but who don't have proper documentation while they check out their claim.

The issues being discussed in this thread are about what's reasonable under the circumstances. There's a balance between protecting the border and arbitrary or unreasonable searches, especially of personal documents and the like.
My simple understanding of the border has always been it's like an exclusion zone, or limbo where you don't exist as a person because you don't belong anywhere. Once you get past then you're either a visitor or resident.
Nope. Not even close.
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Mar 19, 2011
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Hamilton
nmclean wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:18 pm
If you're going out you'd be dealing with US border patrol, not CBSA...
You deal with the border services at the point of entry, whichever country that is.
Sr. Member
Mar 19, 2011
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Hamilton
bylo wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:19 pm
Canadian citizens have the right to enter Canada, reside in Canada, work in Canada, etc. Whoever told you otherwise is mistaken.
That's what I suspected.

Well you say it isn't even close but you don't have the same rights as a citizen would on the other side of the fence. You obviously have some basic rights when returning to Canada but not like other countries, in particular the US. Sure they need "cause" to search you at the border but it's no where near what the police need once you cross in. I believe it is much more close than you think, but this is of course over simplified.
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You said, "it's like an exclusion zone, or limbo where you don't exist as a person because you don't belong anywhere."
That's incorrect.
1. If you cross the CA/US border, once you leave CA you're in the US. There is no "exclusion zone." As a CA citizen the US has no obligation to let you in. If they choose (even arbitrarily) to deny you entry they will send you back to CA. They don't have to provide any explanation.
2. Under UN human rights protocols you always "exist as a person," even if you don't have a country of citizenship, e.g. because your country ceases to exist or because you've been stripped of citizenship. (That was one reason why the Cons' legislation to strip "terrorists" of CA citizenship applied only to those who held dual citizenship. A CA-only citizen cannot be stripped of citizenship because they would then become stateless. This is something that UN protocols do not allow.)
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Deal Addict
Sep 20, 2008
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Kanata
It makes no sense to compare the police va cbsa in regards to the powers of search and seizure. They have different tasks and are legally granted different powers/authority to accomplish their tasks. It really is comparing apples and oranges.
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Mar 14, 2005
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City of Vancouver
I have a perfect record as a citizen... not even one parking ticket ever in my entire life. When I am trying to go in the US, I am almost always detained for a nice long search. Probably racists.
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Jan 9, 2011
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Montreal, QC
Becks wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 9:01 pm
I have a perfect record as a citizen... not even one parking ticket ever in my entire life. When I am trying to go in the US, I am almost always detained for a nice long search. Probably racists.
How about coming into Canada?
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Apr 24, 2006
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tangerinebarbiegirl wrote:
Apr 14th, 2016 9:21 am
its the wild wild west when it comes to the CBSA. They can do anything they want, and if you protest get ready for a cavity search and further harassment and intimidation from them. Plus notes will be put on your file and shared with US border guys.

So expect bullying, intimidation and harassment each and every time you cross the border both ways.
Haven't had a good troll for awhile on RFD, welcome!
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Becks wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 9:01 pm
I have a perfect record as a citizen... not even one parking ticket ever in my entire life. When I am trying to go in the US, I am almost always detained for a nice long search. Probably racists.
It's possible your name or a name with close spelling to it is on some sort of watch list.
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Sr. Member
Mar 19, 2011
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Hamilton
bylo wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:52 pm
You said, "it's like an exclusion zone, or limbo where you don't exist as a person because you don't belong anywhere."
That's incorrect.
1. If you cross the CA/US border, once you leave CA you're in the US. There is no "exclusion zone." As a CA citizen the US has no obligation to let you in. If they choose (even arbitrarily) to deny you entry they will send you back to CA. They don't have to provide any explanation.
Again, this is a very oversimplified version of what you should expect.
After leaving Canada and before entering say the US you don't have the rights of an American, nor do you have the rights of a Canadian citizen. You're at the mercy of US Customs, but you do have some basic rights as a human being. US Customs can't execute you on the spot but they can detain you and incarcerate you indefinitely without anywhere near the jurisprudence you would expect as a Canadian citizen in Canada. You are not in the US until you are out of Customs and that goes with any country I am aware of. Once you enter the country you are at the mercy of the police in most cases. Then you can expect to be afforded the rights similar to that of a resident, presuming you've entered the country legally.

At the border your "rights" are very much in limbo, although that interpretation is based on what Customs can and can't do and what the Police can and can't do. In fact your rights are clearly defined, they just don't exist as many people seem to think they do when they are a legal citizen in a country.
bylo wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:52 pm
2. Under UN human rights protocols you always "exist as a person," even if you don't have a country of citizenship, e.g. because your country ceases to exist or because you've been stripped of citizenship. (That was one reason why the Cons' legislation to strip "terrorists" of CA citizenship applied only to those who held dual citizenship. A CA-only citizen cannot be stripped of citizenship because they would then become stateless. This is something that UN protocols do not allow.)
True. I agree with you entirely. My point was entering another country you don't have the same "rights" as a citizen or a visitor until you pass Customs. Again, many of the rights and freedoms most people expect as a citizen just don't exist at the border. I know a lot of people who feel rights are equal and given to every person regardless of where they are or which country they are a citizen of. That tends to cause problems when crossing borders.
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Mar 19, 2011
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Dark Phoenix wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 4:48 pm
It makes no sense to compare the police va cbsa in regards to the powers of search and seizure. They have different tasks and are legally granted different powers/authority to accomplish their tasks. It really is comparing apples and oranges.
This is very true, although I would disagree that they are legally granted the powers. You really give them the power when you choose to cross borders. Their "powers" only exist in that little booth and fenced in yard they inhabit. I know I'm probably splitting hairs telling you this but I think it's an interesting distinction other posters just don't understand and one that gets a lot of people detained at the border. But yah, apples and oranges for sure.
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Oct 19, 2014
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In fact, it depends on different countries.
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Feb 1, 2015
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tangerinebarbiegirl wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 1:07 pm
That's bcoz they are being recorded..LOL. Do you honestly think they behave the same way, when the cameras are NOT on them ? Did you expect them to embarrass themselves on National TV ? Its just a show they put on for the cameras, plus most of the show is staged, only some is real.

Did you know you are NOT even allowed to audio or video record CBSA ? Not talking about TV shows ( which take special permission ), but individual travellers.

You are legally allowed to record cops and RCMP , but NOT CBSA officers. ALL border crossings and airports and even the CBSA building has signs that you CAN'T record them, so basically its your word against theirs. When cops are abusing you, you can at least legally record them ( not that they allow you and take kindly to it ), but with CBSA its against the law to even record them.

Cops need a search warrant to go through your camera, CBSA no such thing.
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Feb 1, 2015
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nmclean wrote:
Apr 15th, 2016 2:13 pm
My thought was she's probably one of those people who record themselves baiting cops (like this guy) ... then I scroll down and her next post is complaining about how you can't record CBSA. Hmm.
Lmao OP the kind of person to take a pizza back to the pizza store because it's too round

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