Automotive

Laws on crossing the road while Flashing Hand is lit with countdown ?

  • Last Updated:
  • Jul 16th, 2018 9:43 am
[OP]
Member
Jun 1, 2017
212 posts
134 upvotes

Laws on crossing the road while Flashing Hand is lit with countdown ?

Having a friendly argument with a friend about this very thing and i have provided a link to her but it doesn't state when the numbers are counting down WITH flashing hand. I am stating to her that you cannot begin to cross when the hand is flashing even with the numbers counting, she states you can legally and if a driver hits you the pedestrian has the right of way.

I would like to know if there are any fines or laws on this matter in Ontario.

Rule 27 below

https://www.toronto.ca/311/knowledgebas ... gnals.html


Discuss
12 replies
Member
Nov 16, 2011
418 posts
187 upvotes
HAMILTON
If the hand is flashing before you attempt to cross, you are not legally supposed to cross. The flashing hand is a " don't walk indictation".

"Pedestrian control signals - don't walk(27) No pedestrian approaching pedestrian control signals and facing a solid or flashing "don't walk" indication shall enter the roadway. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (27).

Pedestrian right of way(28) Every pedestrian who lawfully enters a roadway in order to cross may continue the crossing as quickly as reasonably possible despite a change in the indication he or she is facing and, for purposes of the crossing, has the right of way over vehicles. R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8, s. 144 (28).

The important nuance is that as long as a pedestrian enters the roadway during the "walk" signal there is no "ticketable offence".
Jr. Member
Mar 3, 2012
142 posts
67 upvotes
Montreal, QC
NoPistons wrote:
Jul 13th, 2018 9:20 pm
Having a friendly argument with a friend about this very thing and i have provided a link to her but it doesn't state when the numbers are counting down WITH flashing hand. I am stating to her that you cannot begin to cross when the hand is flashing even with the numbers counting, she states you can legally and if a driver hits you the pedestrian has the right of way.

I would like to know if there are any fines or laws on this matter in Ontario.

Rule 27 below

https://www.toronto.ca/311/knowledgebas ... gnals.html


Discuss
https://www.bulwarklegal.ca/blog/pedest ... rosswalks/
Member
Aug 18, 2014
466 posts
258 upvotes
Markham, ON
alanbrenton wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 7:51 am
Do these get enforced?
lol what do you think?
people don't even get ticketed for blatant jaywalking or ignoring a solid do not cross sign.

There is no chance you would get ticketed over crossing a flashing hand sign.
I am surprised at the law tho.

What if there is also a count down? I mean, if the count down say 20 seconds and I know it will take me <10sec to cross. Kinda stupid not to cross it.
Deal Fanatic
Sep 16, 2004
7528 posts
960 upvotes
Toronto
alanbrenton wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 7:51 am
Do these get enforced?
Then drivers who rush pedestrians on an obvious walk signal would have to be ticketed as well.
This adds to the confusion as it prevents the pedestrian from crossing while the signal says walk as they have to wait for the rushing driver to pass by.
The pedestrian having lost the valuable few seconds when the light said to walk, is now faced with a flashing don't walk signal and 23 seconds and are inclined to enter the roadway to catch their bus etc.
Deal Expert
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Jan 27, 2004
38540 posts
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T.O. Lotto Captain
alanbrenton wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 7:51 am
Do these get enforced?
pinkdonut wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 12:40 pm
lol what do you think?
people don't even get ticketed for blatant jaywalking or ignoring a solid do not cross sign.

There is no chance you would get ticketed over crossing a flashing hand sign.
I am surprised at the law tho.

What if there is also a count down? I mean, if the count down say 20 seconds and I know it will take me <10sec to cross. Kinda stupid not to cross it.
You can get pissed drunk and kill a handful of people with your car and only get a few years in jail.
Sr. Member
Sep 8, 2017
569 posts
411 upvotes
GTA
pinkdonut wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 12:40 pm
What if there is also a count down? I mean, if the count down say 20 seconds and I know it will take me <10sec to cross. Kinda stupid not to cross it.
What about the line of cars waiting to make left and right turns that could use that 20 seconds?
Deal Addict
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Aug 15, 2015
1070 posts
129 upvotes
Markham, ON
I find that the pedestrian light doesn't work sometimes so when it doesn't work, does that mean I am not allow to cross the street. I say this because I have waited for the pedestrian light to turn green for at least two turns. I pressed the pedestrian light button too. To make matter worse, an angry driver horned at me without knowing how long I have waited already.

I thought pedestrian lights were installed for safety reasons. Sometimes, I don't feel comfortable crossing at the pedestrian lights because the cars are so much bigger than me and I am the only pedestrian. It feels much nicer to cross when there's less traffic.
Sr. Member
Apr 10, 2009
626 posts
37 upvotes
No one follows the blinky hand even though starting to cross on it illegal. So the infrastructure is sometimes designed around it. That's why in some intersections the blinky hand will turn solid well before the traffic light actually turns red. It allows turning cars some opportunity. An Example is mccowan and hwy 7.
Deal Fanatic
Feb 9, 2006
8865 posts
2802 upvotes
Brampton
It's sad that we have to have laws like this because we have to cater to the lowest common denominator ( I just hope cops do use common sense when enforcing it, it's only a matter of time they crack down under this "Vision Zero" crap).
I mean I've seen countdowns for a 4 lane wide road that starts at 30 seconds. I can speed walk that thing in maybe 5 seconds, or leisurely stroll in 10 seconds but legally I shouldn't enter the roadway once it starts that blinking hand at 30 seconds (Dundas and Spadina is setup like this).
Deal Addict
Jan 8, 2007
2041 posts
565 upvotes
Calgary
derass wrote:
Jul 14th, 2018 3:27 pm
What about the line of cars waiting to make left and right turns that could use that 20 seconds?
Exactly, this is why lights are designed the way they are and assume that people follow the rules to allow for flow of traffic. This is a huge pet peeve of mine in downtown dirving, people starting to cross with the countdown at 5 seconds. City has changed some intersections now to have the solid hand going while the green lasts a few more seconds to allow cars to go through.

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