Leafs Talk: Painful...but proud of the team of youngsters

[don242]

I'm guessing you mean the next CBA. Luongo's contract is Grandfathered, so any new changes in the new CBA won't affect the average Cap hit. Every contract signed prior to the next CBA will most likely be Grandfathered anyhow, since changing the rules in this manner will be more trouble than it's worth.

I don't know. Anything I have heard or read suggests this will not be the case. There may be some provisions to buy out contracts or make some changes due to the change, but many, including Burke, have commented on the changes in the new CBA and what that may mean on long term contracts and the impact on cap hit. I don't think you are going see any grandfathering.

[scv]

Where are you getting that info from?

In the last CBA, they were quite heavy handed in changing old contracts. They even lowered everyone's salary by 24%.

Precedent demonstrates that they don't grandfather this stuff in, they would likely offer an amnesty buyout period where teams could buy out contracts that they don't think are a good idea any more under the new CBA, and not have the buyout count against the cap.

It was reputedly done after the Kovalchuk contract situation. Various 'circumvention' contracts such as Kovalchuk's, Luongo's, Hossa's, amongst others were allowed, but any similar future contracts were blocked.

Granted, it isn't clear whether these contracts in their current form will go through the next CBA, but the NHL did modify the Cap rules afterwards preventing future circumventions while leaving the previous ones intact.

I do agree that if they do change the Cap Rules, then an amnesty period might need to be put in place, and it really is just speculation on my part.

To me it's something quite difficult to put into practice, although I'm sure that teams are already planning in the event that it happens.

[Chookman]

Hey fellas...Burkie for sure is going to bring his buddy Luongo to Toronto to finally end our playoff drought.

But my question is...since Luongo proved himself to be a great Captain for the Canuks, do you think Burke should give the "C" to Roberto and demote Phaneuf to an "A"?

It's obvious Phaneuf doesn't have what it takes to show leadership so I think they should give it to Roberto.

C-Luongo
A-Phaneuf
A-Komisarek

I have to take issue with this. Ever since he was named captain, the decline started. Even by making it to the finals last year and winning in the Olympics, it was more like they overcame his shakiness instead of him leading them to victory. He was far from a great Captain. In fact, how many Captains give it up (let alone after only 2 years)? Luongo did.

In the Olympics he let in 2 goals in the last nine minutes of the game after being spotted a 3-0 lead in the semifinal game. In the final game he let in the tying goal with 25 seconds to play to blow a 2-0 lead handed to him half way through the second period. Luongo is the present day Curtis Joseph. He's great playing for an overachieving team that gives him a lot of rubber and will steal some games because the team isn't expected to seriously contend. Put him on a favourite team with a good defense with reduced action and he rarely steals a game. In other words, he'd be great for the Leafs. They'd probably make the playoffs with him and even do some damage. He'd probably get them into the playoffs and into the second round. Once they became a serious contender, he'd choke somewhere along the way.

Making a goalie a captain is stupid. They have to represent the team to the media and be the liaison to the team to and from management. Goalies have enough pressure to handle let alone issues like the Toronto hockey media or GMs like Brian Burke. The only goalie I can think of in my lifetime that might be able to handle it would be Patrick Roy.

[Haz]

He is a bad choice for the future of our organization. He is another Owen Nolan, Eric Lindros, Michael Peca, etc etc etc.

At least the Leafs didn't sign Mark Messier, rip out the core, dump the popular captain and then proceeded to miss the playoffs for years. Messier got his money (though apparently not all of it) and laughed his way back to New York.

[GP Legend]

I have to take issue with this. Ever since he was named captain, the decline started. Even by making it to the finals last year and winning in the Olympics, it was more like they overcame his shakiness instead of him leading them to victory. He was far from a great Captain. In fact, how many Captains give it up (let alone after only 2 years)? Luongo did.

In the Olympics he let in 2 goals in the last nine minutes of the game after being spotted a 3-0 lead in the semifinal game. In the final game he let in the tying goal with 25 seconds to play to blow a 2-0 lead handed to him half way through the second period. Luongo is the present day Curtis Joseph. He's great playing for an overachieving team that gives him a lot of rubber and will steal some games because the team isn't expected to seriously contend. Put him on a favourite team with a good defense with reduced action and he rarely steals a game. In other words, he'd be great for the Leafs. They'd probably make the playoffs with him and even do some damage. He'd probably get them into the playoffs and into the second round. Once they became a serious contender, he'd choke somewhere along the way.

Making a goalie a captain is stupid. They have to represent the team to the media and be the liaison to the team to and from management. Goalies have enough pressure to handle let alone issues like the Toronto hockey media or GMs like Brian Burke. The only goalie I can think of in my lifetime that might be able to handle it would be Patrick Roy.

Give me a break. He wasn't the reason that happened, especially in the gold medal game. Blame the defense for leaving Parise alone in front of the net. He was actually great in that game and made lots of stops. Are you blaming Miller or Halak for letting in three goals, then?

[Haz]

In the Olympics he let in 2 goals in the last nine minutes of the game after being spotted a 3-0 lead in the semifinal game. In the final game he let in the tying goal with 25 seconds to play to blow a 2-0 lead handed to him half way through the second period. Luongo is the present day Curtis Joseph. He's great playing for an overachieving team that gives him a lot of rubber and will steal some games because the team isn't expected to seriously contend. Put him on a favourite team with a good defense with reduced action and he rarely steals a game. In other words, he'd be great for the Leafs. They'd probably make the playoffs with him and even do some damage. He'd probably get them into the playoffs and into the second round. Once they became a serious contender, he'd choke somewhere along the way.

You can't compare the Olympics when you're playing completely different styles with a mixed group. Brodeur let a number of goals in during the Olympics because the Devils' system was completely different.

Making a goalie a captain is stupid. They have to represent the team to the media and be the liaison to the team to and from management. Goalies have enough pressure to handle let alone issues like the Toronto hockey media or GMs like Brian Burke. The only goalie I can think of in my lifetime that might be able to handle it would be Patrick Roy.

Yes, Luongo as Captain was silly seeing him being a goalie he's limited in what he can do like talking to officials regarding calls.

[MaximDude]

45 years to the day that the Leafs last won the Stanley Cup. Man that's so damn depressing.

[krash322]

Not a huge fan of Luongo, but I don't know which top end goaltender we can get. Certainly goalies like Rinne, Lundqvist, Quick aren't going to be traded. If our own salary cap situation wasn't so messed up by Burke, I'd say take a chance on Luongo. Either way, it'll just backfire on Burke. I think we still need a lot more than just a capable goalie, the defense really needs a lot of help. I hope this is the last chance MLSE gives Burke. I don't think I can handle another year of talk about a "plan".

[VCR]

Not a huge fan of Luongo, but I don't know which top end goaltender we can get. Certainly goalies like Rinne, Lundqvist, Quick aren't going to be traded. If our own salary cap situation wasn't so messed up by Burke, I'd say take a chance on Luongo. Either way, it'll just backfire on Burke. I think we still need a lot more than just a capable goalie, the defense really needs a lot of help. I hope this is the last chance MLSE gives Burke. I don't think I can handle another year of talk about a "plan".

Unless Kipper or Thomas is made available, Luongo might be the only proven starter available this offseason. Some would argue that Vokoun is another one to consider but I don't think he's played in a pressure packed hockey market in his career. I think the Leafs could fit Luongo's cap hit if they send a couple of unwanted contracts on waivers and then to their minor league if they aren't (likely) claimed.

[bobcat99]

Poni can play for the Devils but not for the Leafs. Burkie you screwed up here too.

[Mr.Sea]

Poni can play for the Devils but not for the Leafs. Burkie you screwed up here too.

Poni has done nothing. Glad to get rid of him.

[mcg]

Lol, well, glad he's in a better place now.

[nineiron]

45 years to the day that the Leafs last won the Stanley Cup. Man that's so damn depressing.

also, the last time the Leafs won the cup there were 6 teams in the ENTIRE LEAGUE. does that even count as a championship?

[bobcat99]

Poni has done nothing. Glad to get rid of him.

Did a bit more for TO than Luca Caputi and Martin Skoula.

[VCR]

Unless Kipper or Thomas is made available, Luongo might be the only proven starter available this offseason. Some would argue that Vokoun is another one to consider but I don't think he's played in a pressure packed hockey market in his career. I think the Leafs could fit Luongo's cap hit if they send a couple of unwanted contracts on waivers and then to their minor league if they aren't (likely) claimed.

Thomas apparently is taking a year off so he's unavailable. Vokoun signs with the Penguins, therefore the pool of available and proven starting goalies has shrunk significantly. I'm not sure how Calgary will deal with Kipper but Luongo is right now the best available proven veteran starting goalie that is available for trade.

So Leafs fans, what would be the most you'd offer for Luongo if you were Burke or would you rather take a pass and pursue a younger and unproven starter like Bernier or Harding?