Real Estate

Mortgage Fraud to end in Canada

  • Last Updated:
  • Apr 10th, 2018 10:57 pm
Newbie
Jan 19, 2018
61 posts
121 upvotes

Mortgage Fraud to end in Canada

https://www.canadianmortgagetrends.com/ ... on-system/

A friend of mine helped develop the Artificial Intelligence for this tool.
This is a game changer, No more fake jobs with your friend's cell number and fake T4 slips.
The programs can check how often money flows in and out going back 10 years recreating your salary.
It will be rolling out in 3-6 months. Banks will be conducting audits on existing portfolio for new IFRS-9 rule changes.
All fraud should be reported to OFSI and CRA.

GTA is full of fake mortgages, Tim Horton employees with 90K incomes.
23 replies
Sr. Member
Nov 13, 2011
739 posts
323 upvotes
Vancouver, BC
Equifax can't even get their security system set up properly, do you really trust them on this "AI" system?
Deal Fanatic
Jun 3, 2009
5735 posts
1585 upvotes
Montreal
Equifax is just going to get hacked again and the fallout will be more catastrophic.
Deal Addict
Jan 17, 2006
2496 posts
2740 upvotes
Toronto
Yaay, tenant's employment verification tool.
Tool is just a database of employment records with big gaps in between, nothing intelligent about it
Deal Addict
Nov 27, 2007
3678 posts
820 upvotes
I know a lot of people with fake info who got mortgages... thhis is what drives the housing market... lol good luck if that also stops
Member
Mar 1, 2016
453 posts
442 upvotes
lydia82 wrote: https://www.canadianmortgagetrends.com/ ... on-system/

A friend of mine helped develop the Artificial Intelligence for this tool.
This is a game changer, No more fake jobs with your friend's cell number and fake T4 slips.
The programs can check how often money flows in and out going back 10 years recreating your salary.
It will be rolling out in 3-6 months. Banks will be conducting audits on existing portfolio for new IFRS-9 rule changes.
All fraud should be reported to OFSI and CRA.

GTA is full of fake mortgages, Tim Horton employees with 90K incomes.
Why should fraud be reported to OSFI?
Banned
Jul 8, 2017
628 posts
699 upvotes
NA
Engi-Nir wrote: I know a lot of people with fake info who got mortgages... thhis is what drives the housing market... lol good luck if that also stops
I also know lot of people getting their down payment in the amount of a few 100K from their mom & dad, is this what drive up the housing market too?
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Jul 19, 2003
8137 posts
770 upvotes
Silver1234 wrote: I also know lot of people getting their down payment in the amount of a few 100K from their mom & dad, is this what drive up the housing market too?
they're doing that (to meet the initial downpayment requirement and to get out of B lenders), plus falsifying income through brokers to A lenders
hi!
Jr. Member
Oct 27, 2017
129 posts
120 upvotes
This will hurt a lot of mortgage brokers
Deal Addict
Mar 20, 2017
1370 posts
1165 upvotes
lydia82 wrote: https://www.canadianmortgagetrends.com/ ... on-system/

A friend of mine helped develop the Artificial Intelligence for this tool.
This is a game changer, No more fake jobs with your friend's cell number and fake T4 slips.
The programs can check how often money flows in and out going back 10 years recreating your salary.
It will be rolling out in 3-6 months. Banks will be conducting audits on existing portfolio for new IFRS-9 rule changes.
All fraud should be reported to OFSI and CRA.

GTA is full of fake mortgages, Tim Horton employees with 90K incomes.
Fake news OP.
You cannot even read correctly - it says the system simply replaces the process of employment verification using reference letters and phone calls, just makes same and instant.

Speaking about the "fraud" that you mentioned as a way to get mortgage - unfortunately for you, it is not a fraud at all. If someone provides REAL employment with REAL paystubs and T4s, even if employer is his friend and employment lasts only 3 months - it is totally legal. If you try to report such activities as a fraud - people will immediately sue you for the fortune and you will never want to make such fake reports again.
That type of mortgage eligibility "adjustments" is not fair play, but also not a fraud. At maximum it can be just a subject for not lending. And I would say the only red flag there is employment history(number of months with real payments and paystubs) with that particular company, don't even need an AI to analyze it.

Maybe you assumed that lots of people use FAKE t4 slips and paystubs....but there is absolutely no reason to do that, since registering corporations in Canada and doing business is so easy. There is no overhead for using real accounting.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 13, 2016
4533 posts
4062 upvotes
They could use this as Credit Card application tool, no?

No more credit card crunching.
Deal Addict
Nov 27, 2007
3678 posts
820 upvotes
Silver1234 wrote: I also know lot of people getting their down payment in the amount of a few 100K from their mom & dad, is this what drive up the housing market too?
And how are these kids passing the stress test without fake incomes. You can have $200k downpayment from daddy’s Heloc, but you still need high income.
Deal Addict
Nov 27, 2007
3678 posts
820 upvotes
Silver1234 wrote: I also know lot of people getting their down payment in the amount of a few 100K from their mom & dad, is this what drive up the housing market too?
And how are these kids passing the stress test without fake incomes. You can have $200k downpayment from daddy’s Heloc, but you still need high income.

It will be a great idea if all wage letters be sent to CRA for review before banks approve mortgage. Good news is, a lot of fakers and private business owners will have to pay a lot of back taxes haha
Deal Expert
Feb 29, 2008
21739 posts
21359 upvotes
Tarrana & The Ri…
Engi-Nir wrote: And how are these kids passing the stress test without fake incomes. You can have $200k downpayment from daddy’s Heloc, but you still need high income.
Their parents go on the application as guarantors.
Newbie
Jan 19, 2018
61 posts
121 upvotes
GalvToronto wrote:

Speaking about the "fraud" that you mentioned as a way to get mortgage - unfortunately for you, it is not a fraud at all. If someone provides REAL employment with REAL paystubs and T4s, even if employer is his friend and employment lasts only 3 months - it is totally legal. If you try to report such activities as a fraud - people will immediately sue you for the fortune and you will never want to make such fake reports again.

Maybe you assumed that lots of people use FAKE t4 slips and paystubs....but there is absolutely no reason to do that, since registering corporations in Canada and doing business is so easy. There is no overhead for using real accounting.
No Cost?
You have CPP, EI, Taxes?
When you issue a 100K salary you have to source deduct 40% of the total.
For 3 months or $25k that is 10K in source deductions to get an employment letter for 3 months.

Sue people if they report this? I think both CRA and OSFI have un-named tip lines.
Deal Addict
Mar 20, 2017
1370 posts
1165 upvotes
lydia82 wrote: No Cost?
You have CPP, EI, Taxes?
When you issue a 100K salary you have to source deduct 40% of the total.
For 3 months or $25k that is 10K in source deductions to get an employment letter for 3 months.

Sue people if they report this? I think both CRA and OSFI have un-named tip lines.
People earn 100k salaries anyway, so they will pay similar taxes, CPP, EIs in any case, its just matter of how you want to redirect the flow of money for your needs.
For example, if you pay that salary from your corp to your wife, lender does not count it for 2 years at all, but if you do same for your friend's wife - lender counts it from month #3, completely different case.

People will definitely sue you, it cannot be done unnamed. Because mortgage fraud is something that is detected at the time of mortgage application. If mortgage fraud is marked by lender or CMHC, it prevents a borrower to get any mortgage for next 5 years. So the borrower for sure is entitled to ask: "WTF? Who put this into fraud mark into my file without proving anything? Damage must be covered by that person who did it and since he cannot prove any illegal activity, he will lose in court.". I don't think CRA or OSFI are in the game, just lenders and mortgage default insurers. And both of them MUST support fraud claims with REAL proofs, not suspicions that some guys "are friends". And of cause not AI-based conclusions that lender can't explain in clear words as 100% guarantee of fraud. Being friends with your employer is not a fraud, just to be on the same page, its legal:)

Of cause , some super greedy people may say "I count every dime and I don't even wanna pay that extra $200/month EI" and stick to completely fake paystubs and reference letters. But it has always been too much risk to do it, almost noone is doing it except "black market brokers". And those brokers have good connections with lenders, they know in advance that their application will not be checked too much by lender.
Deal Addict
Sep 12, 2006
1503 posts
438 upvotes
Engi-Nir wrote: And how are these kids passing the stress test without fake incomes. You can have $200k downpayment from daddy’s Heloc, but you still need high income.

It will be a great idea if all wage letters be sent to CRA for review before banks approve mortgage. Good news is, a lot of fakers and private business owners will have to pay a lot of back taxes haha
I have a friend-of-a-friend who had a fake statement of account printed on official CRA paper, showing he makes 160k a year. Got his mortgage from a big 4 bank, no issues. Guy hasn't been employed in Canada since 2015. Payments being funded by semi-legitimate foreign money. lol
Jr. Member
Oct 27, 2017
129 posts
120 upvotes
This system cannot work without Consumer's Consent according to Equifax's Website. Otherwise it's a breach of law to peoples' personal information
Deal Expert
Feb 22, 2011
16523 posts
21880 upvotes
Toronto
alex_d10 wrote: I have a friend-of-a-friend who had a fake statement of account printed on official CRA paper, showing he makes 160k a year. Got his mortgage from a big 4 bank, no issues. Guy hasn't been employed in Canada since 2015. Payments being funded by semi-legitimate foreign money. lol
That's because banks DGAF. Even the government doesn't, they need to grow this economy to try and out grow their own obscene debt.
Deal Addict
Sep 18, 2008
1064 posts
355 upvotes
Woodbridge
alex_d10 wrote: I have a friend-of-a-friend who had a fake statement of account printed on official CRA paper, showing he makes 160k a year. Got his mortgage from a big 4 bank, no issues. Guy hasn't been employed in Canada since 2015. Payments being funded by semi-legitimate foreign money. lol
So you are saying you knew of a crime happening and did not report it to authorities?

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