NBA 2011-2012: Miami Champs (OLD THREAD, SEE NEW THREAD)

[7jai]

Kobe is as Kobe does. It will be painful to watch him a couple years from now when he's in decline to keep jacking up shots.

If Kobe was so GOAT like everyone claims him to be, then he should be able to still put up 34+mins, 20+ pts, 5+ rebounds, 5+ assists on an average game when he's in his late 30's, early 40's (similar to what jordan did when he came back from retirement for a season or two)

[Psubs]

We're already there.

Pau and Bynum are 17 for 25 (68%) while Kobe is chucking at 7 for 23 and choking in the 4th quarter against the Rockets without Lowrie after losing to the Jazz without Al Jefferson, Raja Bell and Earl Watson.

He hasn't shot this poorly since his 2nd season in the league and shooting under 30% from behind the arc for the first time in a decade.

Hit a few shots late to get them tied but failed. At least he kept his scoring average up.

[kennyhohoho]

Pau and Bynum are 17 for 25 (68%) while Kobe is chucking at 7 for 23 and choking in the 4th quarter against the Rockets without Lowrie after losing to the Jazz without Al Jefferson, Raja Bell and Earl Watson.

He hasn't shot this poorly since his 2nd season in the league and shooting under 30% from behind the arc for the first time in a decade.

Hit a few shots late to get them tied but failed. At least he kept his scoring average up.

This whole "last shot" mentality is ret@rded.

Why would you go away from what's been working all night and give it to Kobe who's been terrible the entire game simply based on reputation?

The "last shot" mentality is antiquated and simply doesn't work anymore. Give it to the guy who's been hot all night. Not to the guy with the most jerseys in the stands.

So happy with the Rockets win. Seems like they had something to prove after getting ripped off with the Fisher-Hill deal.

F*** Fisher. Guy is classless.

[Psubs]

This whole "last shot" mentality is ret@rded.

Why would you go away from what's been working all night and give it to Kobe who's been terrible the entire game simply based on reputation?

The "last shot" mentality is antiquated and simply doesn't work anymore. Give it to the guy who's been hot all night. Not to the guy with the most jerseys in the stands.

So happy with the Rockets win. Seems like they had something to prove after getting ripped off with the Fisher-Hill deal.

F*** Fisher. Guy is classless.

The Rockets got a 1st round pick (Dallas or Lakers), which was the most important piece of the trade. Hill is like Kwame Brown; you can pickup a FA in the summer for the LLE that will be equivalent.

Jordan did it right by taking over in the 3rd quarter if the game was close.

[darklord700]

To be Da Man mentality could be inferred as a sign of over confident or insecurity. Kobe's twilight years won't be pretty. His wife took half of what he's got now and his highest earning years are behind him. His characters never made him a good product salesman like Jordan. He'll still have a lot of money but what will he do when he couldn't play ball anymore?

[x-factor]

Kobe's already past his physical prime but is still at the top of the sport. Not everyone will like his off-court personality, and on the court he makes some selfish decisions at times (shooting fade away 3s with 3 defenders on him, and wide open teammates) but everyone has to admire his skill, determination, and work ethic.

The likes of Carter, McGrady, Iverson, Arenas are about the same age and have fallen off to role player status. Although they had more serious injuries than Kobe ever endured.

Steve Nash is approaching 40 and seemed to play better with age, but Nash stopped making sense a long time ago.

To be Da Man mentality could be inferred as a sign of over confident or insecurity. Kobe's twilight years won't be pretty. His wife took half of what he's got now and his highest earning years are behind him. His characters never made him a good product salesman like Jordan. He'll still have a lot of money but what will he do when he couldn't play ball anymore?

[kennyhohoho]

Kobe's already past his physical prime but is still at the top of the sport. Not everyone will like his off-court personality, and on the court he makes some selfish decisions at times (shooting fade away 3s with 3 defenders on him, and wide open teammates) but everyone has to admire his skill, determination, and work ethic.

The likes of Carter, McGrady, Iverson, Arenas are about the same age and have fallen off to role player status. Although they had more serious injuries than Kobe ever endured.

Steve Nash is approaching 40 and seemed to play better with age, but Nash stopped making sense a long time ago.

I beg to differ. Most casual fans will look at his PPG and think that he's still playing at an elite level. But what most fans gloss over is the FGA/FGM. Kobe has always been a volume shooter because his team needed him to be, but with 2 of the best big men in the game by his side, his missed shots hurt his team a lot more than they used to.

Replace Kobe with a more willing passer and I have no doubt that the Lakers would be in a much better position in the standings than they are now. He no longer makes his team better. And that to me is the very definition of an elite level player in the NBA.

Nash and Kobe aren't even in the same category. Nash makes his team better tenfold. Take Nash off the current Suns squad and you have a team playing for a lottery pick. Take Kobe off the Lakers and you have a team fighting OKC for the top spot in the West.

[shaolinmonk]

the only real knock on kobe is he's chucking too much.. he is still a great player.. in the top 15 for sure imo. If he toned it down a bit he'd easily still be able to put up 20-5-5 nights with better fg%. Problem is he's too fixated on chasing stats.. You can tell he wants that scoring title lol His defence is still solid and he's in amazing shape. (at least he doesn't lack the ups like melo who doesn't seem to have any lift at all lol)

Nash and Kobe aren't even in the same category. Nash makes his team better tenfold. Take Nash off the current Suns squad and you have a team playing for a lottery pick. Take Kobe off the Lakers and you have a team fighting OKC for the top spot in the West.

That i don't agree...take kobe off the team right now and you have a team that struggles to win despite having an amazing front court. (As much as i don't like kobe i think he does put the drive in his team to win)

without a decent backcourt you can't win in the NBA...kobe's chucking has cost a few games but the real issue has been the lack of a point guard. (we'll see if Sessions can eventually get the job done.)

As much as a i like OKC they really aren't that great. They lack a front court and Westbrook is a horrible point guard. (great player but acts like an idiot) OKC is really chuck happy too, they don't work in the paint and it might hurt them in the playoffs.

[Psubs]

the only real knock on kobe is he's chucking too much.. he is still a great player.. in the top 15 for sure imo. If he toned it down a bit he'd easily still be able to put up 20-5-5 nights with better fg%. Problem is he's too fixated on chasing stats.. You can tell he wants that scoring title lol His defence is still solid and he's in amazing shape. (at least he doesn't lack the ups like melo who doesn't seem to have any lift at all lol)

That i don't agree...take kobe off the team right now and you have a team that struggles to win despite having an amazing front court. (As much as i don't like kobe i think he does put the drive in his team to win)

without a decent backcourt you can't win in the NBA...kobe's chucking has cost a few games but the real issue has been the lack of a point guard. (we'll see if Sessions can eventually get the job done.)

As much as a i like OKC they really aren't that great. They lack a front court and Westbrook is a horrible point guard. (great player but acts like an idiot) OKC is really chuck happy too, they don't work in the paint and it might hurt them in the playoffs.

They are still starting Blake.

PG Sessions - Blake - Morris
SG Barnes - Goudelock
SF Artest - Eyenga / Ebanks
PF Gasol - Murphy
C Bynum - McRoberts

An unselfish team that would still be around the 5th or 6th seed in the West (on par with Dallas).

Can you believe that the Suns are hanging around .500 and within reach of the 7th and 8th seed!?!?!? Taking away Nash would be like taking away Peyton from the Colts. I think that that they may only be better than Bobcats (FU MJ).

[kennyhohoho]

That i don't agree...take kobe off the team right now and you have a team that struggles to win despite having an amazing front court. (As much as i don't like kobe i think he does put the drive in his team to win)

without a decent backcourt you can't win in the NBA...kobe's chucking has cost a few games but the real issue has been the lack of a point guard. (we'll see if Sessions can eventually get the job done.)

As much as a i like OKC they really aren't that great. They lack a front court and Westbrook is a horrible point guard. (great player but acts like an idiot) OKC is really chuck happy too, they don't work in the paint and it might hurt them in the playoffs.

Orlando has been doing it for years with Dwight.

If Bynum and Gasol got the bulk of the touches instead of Kobe I have no doubt that very few teams could contain the front court combo of Bynum and Gasol. Granted, "Borelando" has the best 3 point shooting in the league to spread the floor, but if you take even just a third of Kobe's possessions and give them to Bynum in the low post, those close losses suddenly turn into wins IMHO. I'm not suggesting this would happen if you took Kobe out completely and replaced him with nobody. I'm suggesting this only if you replace Kobe with a more willing passer who takes shots when he should be taking shots.

I agree, OKC has shown their flaws after the all-star break. Most noteably their loss to the much older and slower Spurs. Which is why I believe if the Lakers/Kobe made a few internal adjustments they'd be right there, battling for first place instead of where they are right now.

[kennyhohoho]

Can you believe that the Suns are hanging around .500 and within reach of the 7th and 8th seed!?!?!? Taking away Nash would be like taking away Peyton from the Colts. I think that that they may only be better than Bobcats (FU MJ).

The Suns have impressed me a lot this season. I honestly expected them to be getting blown out every game and fighting for a lottery pick but Nash seems to always keep them in games, even if they don't win.

Nash has been one of my favourite players for a long time so it pains me to see him spending his twilight years on a struggling team, yet also happy he doesn't show the same classlessness as Fisher.

I was rooting for OKC to make the finals this year, and as much as I love Durant, I really don't want to see Fisher potentially get another ring.

[ji2o0k]

(at least he doesn't lack the ups like melo who doesn't seem to have any lift at all lol)

is it just me or does melo look like he can lose a few pounds to help in the lift department...

[Psubs]

If you take out Derrick Rose and Richard Hamilton off the Bulls, you have a team that struggles to win.... wait a minute, no they don't.

The Knicks showed that you can win without guys like Carmelo and Amare if you play defense. The Bulls play great team defense that rebounds. Pau and Bynum rebound and guard the bucket. Kobe's defense is over-rated he is slightly above average defender. Matt Barnes would fill in fine and put up like 14 ppg. Bynum and Pau would average around 22 ppg and they'd be fine. When have there been twin towers that are as good offensively and defensively balanced as Pau and Bynum? Robinson and Duncan?

[Psubs]

The Suns have impressed me a lot this season. I honestly expected them to be getting blown out every game and fighting for a lottery pick but Nash seems to always keep them in games, even if they don't win.

Nash has been one of my favourite players for a long time so it pains me to see him spending his twilight years on a struggling team, yet also happy he doesn't show the same classlessness as Fisher.

I was rooting for OKC to make the finals this year, and as much as I love Durant, I really don't want to see Fisher potentially get another ring.

I wouldn't mind him getting one more ring than Kboobie. He's the new Horry. Fook that shot against the Spurs with 0.4s left.

Kboobie may have rings but MVP awards are what's up. With Derrick Rose being hurt so much, he will not win the award as the Bulls are doing well without him. Durant will win it this year with the best record in the West. That being said, they may get upset first round.

Miami signed Turiaf for more offense at the C position off the bench and should take the title this year.

PG Chalmers - Cole - Lebron
SG Wade - Miller - Lebron
SF Lebron - Batier - Jones
PF Bosh - Haslem - Lebron
C Anthony - Turiaf - Lebron

lol, Lebron guarding Pau was awesome to watch. What strength and hustle!

[kennyhohoho]

If you take out Derrick Rose and Richard Hamilton off the Bulls, you have a team that struggles to win.... wait a minute, no they don't.

The Knicks showed that you can win without guys like Carmelo and Amare if you play defense. The Bulls play great team defense that rebounds. Pau and Bynum rebound and guard the bucket. Kobe's defense is over-rated he is slightly above average defender. Matt Barnes would fill in fine and put up like 14 ppg. Bynum and Pau would average around 22 ppg and they'd be fine. When have there been twin towers that are as good offensively and defensively balanced as Pau and Bynum? Robinson and Duncan?

Agreed. The number of touches and shots that Kobe puts up at this stage of his career only hurts that team. Bynum is unguardable in the low post and Gasol is one of the most skilled PFs in the league. If Kobe was a more willing passer he'd be an assist machine. Penetrate and draw double teams and dish to Pau or Bynum in the paint. Instead, he pulls out and takes the fadeway jumper with a hand in his face time and time again.

I'm sure Mike Brown would love to cut back on Kobe's minutes and give him a more reduced role but I can see where it would be tough for him to do, being in his first year.