Sports & Recreation

NBA 2017-2018: congrats GSW. where do we go from here?

  • Last Updated:
  • Nov 24th, 2017 10:13 pm
Deal Addict
Apr 11, 2006
4786 posts
922 upvotes
Mississauga
Boston's going to be lethal with Kyrie/Hayward lighting it up.

But this is a definite win for the Cavs. Thomas is not as young as Kyrie, but he's not old either. He'll be cheaper than Kyrie. Crowder is cheap. Those two are the heart of the Celtics, so essentially the Cavs got the Celtics. They are still contenders for the Championship this upcoming season because Thomas is just as clutch as well and can most certainly take the scoring load off LeBron. Crowder provides additional physicality and rebounding alongside TT and KLove.

Most importantly, even when LeBron leaves, they can still be a top team in the East.

EDIT: WOW! Just learned it is Brooklyn's 2018 first round pick. That's a Top 3 lottery pick. INSANE!!!
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2006
2152 posts
593 upvotes
Global Village
Damn, Boston is now clearly better than the Wiz, Raps, they don't have to pay Isiah the crazy $ they would have had to, even giving up Crowder and the Nets pick Kyrie is totally worth it, you rarely find offensive talent like that. Boston also didn't take on any of the Cavs bad contracts!! I am shocked the Cavs just strenghened Boston like that, they must think that Lebron is out after next season to pull this move.
Deal Expert
User avatar
Dec 26, 2003
15676 posts
661 upvotes
Stouffville
^ strengthened Boston like that? Cavs totally got the better of this deal...

you talk about rare offensive talent like Kyrie but what about Thomas? Thomas had a breakout year last year... and if you compare their career stats, a lot of their numbers are pretty even over the career.. the small edge that Kyrie has in a few categories is due to him playing more MPG over their careers..

I basically put them VERY close in straight up ability and skill...if Boston woulda had to pay Thomas crazy money like you say, they have to do the same thing for Kyrie a year later..

Basically, the Cavs got 2 extra years of insanely cheap Crowder (averaged 14ppg, 6rpg, 1.5spg and 38% 3PT over the past 2 seasons)....a late first rounder from last year... and then also a potentially Top 3 pick.... All for just giving away one extra year of Kyrie irving? ill take that any and every day of the week...

not sure why people are also complaining about Thomas being 3 years older than Iriving... have people seen how fragile Irving is? 6 full seasons in the NBA... 3 of them he has played UNDER 60 games...and NEVER played more than played more than 75 games in a year.....Thomas has played 60 games more than Irving... thats an average of an extra 10 games per season...

Kyrie definitely could make me eat my words but considering this guy demanded a trade and didnt want to stay in Cleveland.. no idea how the Cavs were able to get MAX value for him...

Heck, Boston coulda got Jimmy Butler for that Brooklyn Pick straight up if they wanted to...

Cavs now easily have the ability and trade chips that if they do NOT want to do a rebuild after next year, they could do some great trades to get ppl around a re-signing Lebron..if that fails, got decent stuff to rebuild on..

EDIT: Also, dont forget that Boston has lost 4 of its top 6 scoring players from last year... yes they got Irving and Hayward.. but lots of change in one season, for a 1st overall team is never good and takes time to get the chemistry there.....lost some height/size from the Olynyk and Amir PF combo they had going on... lost a really great 3 and D in Crowder... lost a really good defensive PG/SG in Avery Bradley.. and lost their 30ppg scorer in Thomas... Just seems that Boston will have a LOT of guys that are the same size and would play the same position... Smart, Brown, Tatum, Morris, Hayward...all 5 of those guys are limited to the 3 or 4..
Deal Addict
User avatar
Jul 29, 2008
1330 posts
162 upvotes
Toronto
Makes no difference. They aren't beating GSW to me it doesnt move the needle much but I guess Kyrie had to be traded.

IT is a liability on D, GSW is going to expose that and take advantage of it. How is Cleveland going to hide him on D?

He's also looking to get paid...is Gilbert gonna fork out money for both LBJ and IT?? At least they have the Nets pick to build on if those two decide to walk or Gilbert doesnt pay up.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Jul 29, 2008
1330 posts
162 upvotes
Toronto
grappos13 wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 1:31 am
EDIT: Also, dont forget that Boston has lost 4 of its top 6 scoring players from last year... yes they got Irving and Hayward.. but lots of change in one season, for a 1st overall team is never good and takes time to get the chemistry there.....lost some height/size from the Olynyk and Amir PF combo they had going on... lost a really great 3 and D in Crowder... lost a really good defensive PG/SG in Avery Bradley.. and lost their 30ppg scorer in Thomas... Just seems that Boston will have a LOT of guys that are the same size and would play the same position... Smart, Brown, Tatum, Morris, Hayward...all 5 of those guys are limited to the 3 or 4..
I agree..losing a good chunk of that core is huge. There is going to be some growing pains and people are going to criticize Kyrie on D more now that he's on his own in Boston. If this trade was made before Bradley was dealt to Detroit I dont think they would do that trade for Morris.
Sr. Member
Apr 4, 2009
598 posts
73 upvotes
What the heck is Boston doing? If they wanted a PG for the future, why not just keep Markelle Fultz instead of trading down for another forward???

IT may have an injury history but Kyrie isn't exactly a model of being healthy himself. Boston gave up ALOT for Kyrie and they no longer have Avery Bradley to cover up their perimeter weakness. IT and Kyrie defensively is a wash

Cleveland killed the deal with the Brooklyn pick
Deal Addict
Jul 29, 2006
3468 posts
399 upvotes
Kyrie for IT is a wash. Cleveland won this deal by getting Brooklyn's unprotected 1st round pick and Crowder who will only add to Cleveland's defense. Oh and yeah Cleveland just saved a ton of money from luxury tax payments.
Deal Addict
Apr 11, 2006
4786 posts
922 upvotes
Mississauga
Fabfive wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 8:11 am
Makes no difference. They aren't beating GSW to me it doesnt move the needle much but I guess Kyrie had to be traded.

IT is a liability on D, GSW is going to expose that and take advantage of it. How is Cleveland going to hide him on D?

He's also looking to get paid...is Gilbert gonna fork out money for both LBJ and IT?? At least they have the Nets pick to build on if those two decide to walk or Gilbert doesnt pay up.
This wasn't a trade focused on catching up with GSW, rather just to get the most value for Kyrie. And that, they most definitely did.

Does it move the needle much, not immensely, but still improves them that much more. Isaiah has shown he can carry a team and is clutch in fourth quarter, so him and Kyrie are essentially a wash at this point (Kyrie still has upside of course as he's still so young), but in the prior season, when LeBron's sat out, Kyrie failed to carry the team, so there's that.

Defense is also a wash between Isaiah and Kyrie - non-existent. But throwing Crowder into the starting lineup improves the defense a lot by comparison and frees up LeBron that much more defensively to roam. Would it change the dynamics against a GSW? I think so.

As for the money, they are under the assumption LeBron is leaving, it was the worst kept secret. If anything, maybe this trade gives them at least a very long shot to keep him, but still insignificant. The whole "Kyrie just wants to have his own team" rationale can be legitimate, but a partial coverup to the fact that he probably knows LeBron is leaving, so wanted out.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Jul 29, 2008
1330 posts
162 upvotes
Toronto
kenchau wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 11:22 am
This wasn't a trade focused on catching up with GSW, rather just to get the most value for Kyrie. And that, they most definitely did.

Does it move the needle much, not immensely, but still improves them that much more. Isaiah has shown he can carry a team and is clutch in fourth quarter, so him and Kyrie are essentially a wash at this point (Kyrie still has upside of course as he's still so young), but in the prior season, when LeBron's sat out, Kyrie failed to carry the team, so there's that.

Defense is also a wash between Isaiah and Kyrie - non-existent. But throwing Crowder into the starting lineup improves the defense a lot by comparison and frees up LeBron that much more defensively to roam. Would it change the dynamics against a GSW? I think so.

As for the money, they are under the assumption LeBron is leaving, it was the worst kept secret. If anything, maybe this trade gives them at least a very long shot to keep him, but still insignificant. The whole "Kyrie just wants to have his own team" rationale can be legitimate, but a partial coverup to the fact that he probably knows LeBron is leaving, so wanted out.
But isnt the point of making moves to appease Lebron so they can compete with the GSW's and Houston super teams out west? The end goal is still to win a chip considering that window is slowly closing with Kyrie wanting out and LBJ eventually bolting.

They got flexibility financially if LBJ leaves and they dont resign IT and a draft pick to boot. I'm not saying its not a good haul for Kyrie but I still dont think they are beating GS.

Regardless this offseason has been A+++ so many moves, so many new players on new teams. Cant wait for it to start
Penalty Box
Apr 8, 2013
7217 posts
239 upvotes
Its a great deal for both sides. They both won.

Cavs got rid of Kyrie since he doesnt want to play with Lelbron and got IT, Crowder + pick for the future. They just got deeper.

Boston got a young name brand superstar that they can truly build around. Kyrie could be like Paul Pierce. Celtics has a legit fanbase unlike Cavs. Kyrie went to a great home. They dont fool around.

They both have different goals. I think they achieved it. Next season will be amazing to watch.
Diversity Is Our Strength 😎
Deal Addict
Apr 11, 2006
4786 posts
922 upvotes
Mississauga
kevindurant1 wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 1:29 pm
Its a great deal for both sides. They both won.

Cavs got rid of Kyrie since he doesnt want to play with Lelbron and got IT, Crowder + pick for the future. They just got deeper.

Boston got a young name brand superstar that they can truly build around. Kyrie could be like Paul Pierce. Celtics has a legit fanbase unlike Cavs. Kyrie went to a great home. They dont fool around.

They both have different goals. I think they achieved it. Next season will be amazing to watch.
You just hope for Boston's sake, they can re-sign him when the time comes. He preferred/wanted to go to NY because that's where his dad is.

With that said, at least Boston is much closer to NY than Cleveland at a short 4hr drive, so it at least, wouldn't be a dealbreaker.
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2006
2152 posts
593 upvotes
Global Village
I agree, Bradley would have been a great complement to Kyrie. Kyrie and Hayward improve your scoring but losing Avery, Crowder make you worse defensively, softer. They need a scoring wing who can defend, somebody like Gerald Henderson would be a good fit if he can get healthy.
What if Paul George tells OKC he is not resigning there, they will have to trade him mid season and Boston would be in a great position to get him too.
In 2 years, 3 years Boston could be the superpower team just as Lebron and the Warriors decline, even if they don't have a good season in 17/18.
Penalty Box
Apr 8, 2013
7217 posts
239 upvotes
kenchau wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 1:58 pm
You just hope for Boston's sake, they can re-sign him when the time comes. He preferred/wanted to go to NY because that's where his dad is.

With that said, at least Boston is much closer to NY than Cleveland at a short 4hr drive, so it at least, wouldn't be a dealbreaker.
No one really knows the future but Boston would be stupid to say no to this trade. All they had to give up was really IT(3 years older) . Crowder is quite replaceable. They also hoarded enough picks, they can afford to get rid of one.

IT have tons of heart and is a great player but he is 28. Kyrie is 25.

At the end of the day, the east is easy if you have the stars. Kyrie + superstar = 1st or 2nd seed.
Diversity Is Our Strength 😎
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2006
2152 posts
593 upvotes
Global Village
kevindurant1 wrote:
Aug 23rd, 2017 8:09 pm
No one really knows the future but Boston would be stupid to say no to this trade. All they had to give up was really IT(3 years older) . Crowder is quite replaceable. They also hoarded enough picks, they can afford to get rid of one.

IT have tons of heart and is a great player but he is 28. Kyrie is 25.

At the end of the day, the east is easy if you have the stars. Kyrie + superstar = 1st or 2nd seed.
Agreed about thinking it from Boston's side, if your decision is not to pay IT the big $ to keep him could you have gotten a bigger return for him than as a key part of a package for Kyrie freaking Irving? I don't think so. IT needs an offensive system built around him to thrive and that just doesn't work in a Lebron-centred team. The Cavs will undoubtedly try to trade IT mid-season rather than pay him the big $ necessary to keep him (he is the worst PG in the league defensively), we'll see if they can get more than a 2nd round pick for him.

Top